The path from Beta to Alpha after 30

[Alamo657]

Hello,

 

So, i'm a Beta-Zeta male (socially undesirable man)

 

The point of this post is : can a man turn the tables in his mid-30, and how ?

 

Problematic :

 

I'm nice enough that women are friendly with me, not good enough that they throw themselves at me.

 

"How did you get laid for all this time then ?".

 

I'm good looking, and when i was in the right state of mind, i could pass for an alpha, because being young and ignorant makes you careless enough to just go with the flow.

Looking back, my "real" relationships have been mutual crushes, instant infatuation, and long-lasting affection.

 

The others were, in hindsight, lustful females thinking : "why not, he is good looking, fit, and a decent guy".

 

Problem : i'm now 34, beginning to bald, career is blocked, and rampant anxiety and depression about not having settled, and last relationship a disaster (cheating, lying etc), have left my self-esteem in ruins.

 

Basically, i'm entering the middle age of man with a suspect résumé.

"Are you an orbiter?"

 

Surprisingly, not. I don't orbit women, i don't hit on them perpetually thinking they'll eventually succumb to my "charms". If a woman doesn't seem interested in me (which is most nowadays) i just give up and don't enter the game of them seeking validation from a new orbiter.

 

This doens't make me popular in established communities because i'm neither an alpha, neither an orbiter, thus i have no use for either males (who are looking for near-alpha wingmen) and females (who either want to bed alphas, or put betas into orbit for ego-validation).

 

In other words, i'm a loner.

 

"Uh, what do you want then?"

 

Let's put it bluntly : i have no interest in a sexless life of loneliness. I want a family of my own.

 

But objectively i can't get it with my current life and state of mind.

 

Factually, i'm on the road to suicide.

Therapy won't fix unhappiness, i know because i've tried.

My only therapy is to turn my life around, or die not trying.

 

 

So, really i'm not asking for feel-good banalities like "do a therapy, fake it till you make it, join meetups, suscribe on OLD". Those don't work for me, i know because i've tried. If anything, it all made me feel worse.

 

I'm looking for people who in the same situation as me, or knowing someone who were in a similar situation as me, and saw the end of the tunnel, and how.

 

Thanks

[amaysngrace]

So having a girlfriend/SO is the only thing that makes your life worth living? Did I read that right?

 

Maybe you should tell your problems to Jesus.

[Alamo657]

So having a girlfriend/SO is the only thing that makes your life worth living? Did I read that right?

 

Maybe you should tell your problems to Jesus.

 

Thinking about it !

 

But the point was having a family, and for that its better to be in love with a woman

[amaysngrace]

So you want to have children and a family? Would you be okay with being a step-dad because there are many single moms in your age bracket.

[todreaminblue]

i think you should stop looking at beta alpha nuances and just be you ..what amay said is true you want a family of your own...would you consider being a step dad....

 

maybe you have been looking too hard in all the wrong places

been seeking validation from all the wrong faces,

 

you have sought and listened to wrong advice,

been following the alpha beta come hither lies,

there is only only one alpha and omega ,

he is the first and the last the beginning and the end,

the rest of us...we are just human....male or female,

we all want love.....family...respect...and sometimes we have to wait,

many of us struggle me...you...others too...

 

you just cant give up for who or what is right for you...is on the other side of what you have to go through...i will send some prayers up for you......deb

[NTV]

All relationships begin as a negotiation. How much does she value you and how much do you value her, etc. etc.

 

 

You've already given yourself a handicap to this negotiation--untreated depression.

 

 

Even if you're the type of person who abhors medication, there are other ways of fighting it. Exercise, journaling, not drinking, etc.

 

 

I think that what you will find is that once you combat this, you'll be in a better position to improve yourself in lasting and meaningful ways that will attract someone.

 

 

The alpha/beta mentality is only useful to you if you can use it to improve yourself. If thinking of yourself as a beta-zeta sucks away your self-confidence and motivation, then toss the concept or put it on a shelf and come back to it. Find something else that works for motivation.

 

 

my 2 cents anyway

[GorillaTheater]

I don't know that I put a lot of stock in this Alpha-Beta business, but to the extent it's legit, I think a man has to have a healthy balance of both to be a good partner to a woman, and to be a good dad. You have to be okay with stepping up and taking care of sh*t that comes up, in whatever form, but at the same time have a nurturing side. And to do most of both with a dose of humor and grace.

 

 

The problem at this point is your depression; you really can't do a good job at either role until you tackle it and get it under control. Relationships are no cure; you just wind up feeling worse about the fact and/or perception that it's just another thing that you're screwing up. I speak from experience. A decade or so ago I became very ill, and wound up with a grand case of clinical depression, and felt like I was sucking at everything, both at home and at work. I tackled it through a combination of meds (for less than a year), talk therapy, and exercise. I can't recommend that route enough, it saved my life.

 

 

I'd say forget the alphabet stuff for now. Do what you need to do to get healthy and comfortable in your own skin. Once you get there, the rest of what you seek is just a matter of relatively minor tweaks.

[Imajerk17]

I agree w GorillaTheater (all 3 paragraphs), this alphabet soup of yours isn't helping. You need to take care of both your depression AND your perspective. A few points:

 

1. When I first opened this, I was expecting to read about a guy who had NO success with women whatsoever. That's not true as you have had relationships, either you didn't do a great job picking the woman or managing the relationship i.e., ending things when they started to go bad. There is indeed always improving yourself but to call yourself "socially undesirable" and then talk about how often you get laid reeks of self-pity (wrong perspective). Or maybe humblebrag...

 

2. OP, are you a PUA? I mean, so much jargon in your post (Greek letters to designate male social status, "orbiter"). Also, where did you get the below (which is not really true btw):

 

This doens't make me popular in established communities because i'm neither an alpha, neither an orbiter, thus i have no use for either males (who are looking for near-alpha wingmen) and females (who either want to bed alphas, or put betas into orbit for ego-validation).

 

In other words, i'm a loner.

3. It overall sounds that you want us to find a way for you to become happy even though therapy didn't do it. It's quite a tall order. There is no Magic Pill that I am aware of. You CAN change your perspective (see 1. and 2. above), and the things in life that you are now unhappy about that you have a bit more control over, such as your physical fitness and your career. That might make you happier and ultimately more attractive to women. Edited May 25, 2016 by Imajerk17

[dichotomy]

Meh - I have had it worse... and at an older age too.

 

Yes you can change or improve your life. Yes you can have a family.

 

What will work for YOU I don't know...but for me therapy, some bad ass fitness involvement, and frankly just getting angry enough to top the depression and working (and working and working) on my attitude. Also to stop putting women on some sort of pedestal. They age, put on some pounds, have self esteem, and face the same issues as as guys when aging. Your not 20 anymore and neither are they.

[Alamo657]

to call yourself "socially undesirable" and then talk about how often you get laid reeks of self-pity (wrong perspective). Or maybe humblebrag...

I wasn't very clear : in the past i did ok with women, because i was young. Nowadays and during/after my last relationship, i'm not doing ok with women, in general.

 

2. OP, are you a PUA? I mean, so much jargon in your post (Greek letters to designate male social status, "orbiter"). Also, where did you get the below (which is not really true btw):

I'm not a PUA. However i find many terms of their vocabulary are spot on regarding social desirability (alphas), averages guys who have trouble charming women (betas), and guys who will approach women they like under the guise of friendship with hopes of scoring (orbiters).

 

3. It overall sounds that you want us to find a way for you to become happy even though therapy didn't do it. It's quite a tall order. There is no Magic Pill that I am aware of. You CAN change your perspective (see 1. and 2. above)

I'm not looking for a magic pill, rather, encouraging stories, and new perspectives, since i feel i have exhausted all the "usual" solutions.

 

and the things in life that you are now unhappy about that you have a bit more control over, such as your physical fitness and your career. That might make you happier and ultimately more attractive to women.

My career is a real problem, i earn moderatly well. If i try to switch now it means starting over from zero at 35, thus cutting me from my current social activities due to lack of funds. ALso, i know i will sound like a broken record, but i tried a career switch in 2013 and i couldn't adapt to the new work environment so i'm a bit jaded here.

[TheBathWater]

From my perspective, you're right in assuming that mindset is everything. When you were young and believed in limitless possibilities, women found that attractive (given the right time and place for them as well). I see no reason why this premise can't carry forward with you.

 

Of course, now you're older and wiser, and so the question you seem to be asking is how to regain that sensibility but from a place that is congruent with you are authentically.

 

I have no simple answers for you. But I do feel that if you're not happy with some aspect of your life (e.g. job) then that needs to change. You need to evolve into something higher than who you are now if you're unhappy. Whatever direction that takes can't depend on getting women though. You need to do it for you. Ironically, when you do that, you instantly become more attractive in your aura and women notice you more. Who cares if it means not earning the money you are now or going back to school (dude, college girls!).

 

I know you're sold on a wife/kids arrangement right now, but talk to guys who are married and most will tell you don't do do it. I like the idea of wife/kids too, but I question it more and more every day. Like you, I am in my early thirties and have had my fair share of women. For a time (and even to some degree still) I hope for a wife and family. But one thing I've realized is more important than that (but could also include that) is my relationship to the world. I treat every interaction, every day, every person I encounter, as if they were my lover and family. I live to love life and this works for me so far.

 

The answer we seek as men can never be found in a woman.

Edited June 1, 2016 by TunaInTheBrine

[Buddhist]

But objectively i can't get it with my current life and state of mind.

 

Yes this is true. Your use of colloquial terms like alpha, beta, orbiter, ego validation etc tells me at least that you still have the mindset of a 25yr old. That pretty much sums up the whole crux of the issue given you are now 34. Best of luck in your quest.

Edited June 1, 2016 by Buddhist