People are saying our marriage is a sham

[Rylie]

We have been together for 6 years and married for 1 year. Our marriage isn't a conventional marriage. We both have people telling us that our marriage (and previously, our relationship) is a sham. My parents called the police saying I was being held hostage and had Stockholm Syndrome (they don't know the meaning of that).

 

I'm in my mid-20's, my husband is late 20's. We both suffer from severe PTSD. Mine is from sexual assualt, my husbands is from his time spent in the military. We have both been in treatment since the onset of our condition and while it has helped immensely it will never be cured. He is the only person who truly understands me, and vise versa.

 

Before we began dating we were very close friends and supported each other fully. My husband's brother introduced us because he thought we would be good support for each other. It blossomed into a romantic relationship.

 

We love each other immensely and to us, we have the perfect relationship. We love each other, understand each other, support each other, have many shared interests, motivate each other.

 

1. We are not sexually intimate. It is something that we are BOTH working towards and making progress.

 

2. We didn't have a traditional wedding because it's not something that either of us wanted. Being singled out in front of many people or even a few people is not a fun time for us. Our families and friends didn't see us marry and they have been livid since, mostly our families.

 

3. We don't have children because no sex = no babies. Two parents who both have PTSD would never get approved for adoption. And my husband does not trust himself fully to be around a child.

 

Add these 3 things up and my family is adamant that I'm being held against my will in a sham of a marriage. They have called the police 4 times which is very upsetting and debilitating for my husband and causes flashbacks for myself. They claim we are "attached at the hip", which is true but we don't see a problem with it. We are each others rock.

 

We live in our own little bubble and we are happy there. We talk to family and friends, and we see them. We have not isolated ourselves. But everyone in our lives (for the most part) seems to think we are in a terrible relationship and holding each other back. We both firmly believe that you CAN have a marriage without sex and it is no less of a marriage.

 

Who is in the wrong here? Are we right that they need to back off and leave us alone? Or would you feel the same way about a friend or family member?

Edited June 15, 2016 by Rylie

[Cablebandit]

We have been together for 6 years and married for 1 year. Our marriage isn't a conventional marriage. We both have people telling us that our marriage (and previously, our relationship) is a sham. My parents called the police saying I was being held hostage and had Stockholm Syndrome (they don't know the meaning of that).

 

I'm in my mid-20's, my husband is late 20's. We both suffer from severe PTSD. Mine is from sexual assualt, my husbands is from his time spent in the military. We have both been in treatment since the onset of our condition and while it has helped immensely it will never be cured. He is the only person who truly understands me, and vise versa.

 

Before we began dating we were very close friends and supported each other fully. My husband's brother introduced us because he thought we would be good support for each other. It blossomed into a romantic relationship.

 

We love each other immensely and to us, we have the perfect relationship. We love each other, understand each other, support each other, have many shared interests, motivate each other.

 

1. We are not sexually intimate. It is something that we are BOTH working towards and making progress.

 

2. We didn't have a traditional wedding because it's not something that either of us wanted. Being singled out in front of many people or even a few people is not a fun time for us. Our families and friends didn't see us marry and they have been livid since, mostly our families.

 

3. We don't have children because no sex = no babies. Two parents who both have PTSD would never get approved for adoption. And my husband does not trust himself fully to be around a child.

 

Add these 3 things up and my family is adamant that I'm being held against my will in a sham of a marriage. They have called the police 4 times which is very upsetting and debilitating for my husband and causes flashbacks for myself. They claim we are "attached at the hip", which is true but we don't see a problem with it. We are each others rock.

 

We live in our own little bubble and we are happy there. We talk to family and friends, and we see them. We have not isolated ourselves. But everyone in our lives (for the most part) seems to think we are in a terrible relationship and holding each other back. We both firmly believe that you CAN have a marriage without sex and it is no less of a marriage.

 

Who is in the wrong here? Are we right that they need to back off and leave us alone? Or would you feel the same way about a friend or family member?

 

From what you have said, it appears that you are both fully aware and consenting to this type of relationship. I don't see the problem. Your marriage is very unlike my marriage but i don't get to define what marriage is to you. Keep on trucking baby!

[grays]

I'm wondering why your families have to be so aware that you're not having sex. It seems like that's the main thing that makes your marriage "abnormal," tho many marriages end up that way, of course. But really, I think many people don't talk to their parents about sex w their spouse.

 

Just out of curiosity, do you guys kiss, make out, cuddle, touch? Have you ever had sex w each other? Are you attracted to each other? Do you feel romantic about each other? I don't think any of those things make your marriage any more or less legitimate. I'm just being nosy.

[RecentChange]

I have a feeling we are not seeing the whole picture here. If so many people are raising red flags about your situation - well, that is a cause for concern.

 

Are either of you currently in therapy or counseling? If so, what does your counselor say about your situation?

 

Read up about Stockholm Syndrome - its when someone identifies with / protects etc their abuser.

 

What prompted your parents to call the police? No reason? Just a sunday night and they think, ahh, lets call the cops on our daughter....

 

Thats not rational or normal in the slightest.

[ChocolateRain]

We have been together for 6 years and married for 1 year. Our marriage isn't a conventional marriage. We both have people telling us that our marriage (and previously, our relationship) is a sham. My parents called the police saying I was being held hostage and had Stockholm Syndrome (they don't know the meaning of that).

 

I'm in my mid-20's, my husband is late 20's. We both suffer from severe PTSD. Mine is from sexual assualt, my husbands is from his time spent in the military. We have both been in treatment since the onset of our condition and while it has helped immensely it will never be cured. He is the only person who truly understands me, and vise versa.

 

Before we began dating we were very close friends and supported each other fully. My husband's brother introduced us because he thought we would be good support for each other. It blossomed into a romantic relationship.

 

We love each other immensely and to us, we have the perfect relationship. We love each other, understand each other, support each other, have many shared interests, motivate each other.

 

1. We are not sexually intimate. It is something that we are BOTH working towards and making progress.

 

2. We didn't have a traditional wedding because it's not something that either of us wanted. Being singled out in front of many people or even a few people is not a fun time for us. Our families and friends didn't see us marry and they have been livid since, mostly our families.

 

3. We don't have children because no sex = no babies. Two parents who both have PTSD would never get approved for adoption. And my husband does not trust himself fully to be around a child.

 

Add these 3 things up and my family is adamant that I'm being held against my will in a sham of a marriage. They have called the police 4 times which is very upsetting and debilitating for my husband and causes flashbacks for myself. They claim we are "attached at the hip", which is true but we don't see a problem with it. We are each others rock.

 

We live in our own little bubble and we are happy there. We talk to family and friends, and we see them. We have not isolated ourselves. But everyone in our lives (for the most part) seems to think we are in a terrible relationship and holding each other back. We both firmly believe that you CAN have a marriage without sex and it is no less of a marriage.

 

Who is in the wrong here? Are we right that they need to back off and leave us alone? Or would you feel the same way about a friend or family member?

 

You mentioned that you are happy with each other , so that is all the should matter . You dont have to live up to other people expectations ... it's your life ... you both suffer from PTSD and both of you are dealing with it , looks like two people who needed each other and found each other ... good luck to both of you and stay strong ...

[oldshirt]

Why have people called the police?

 

People don't call cops when they don't like a spouse or disapprove of a marriage. They call police when they believe there is an imminent and immediate threat to someone's safety.

 

Why did they think that at the time that they called? What was happening at that exact moment?

[ShatteredLady]

Do your family & friends believe that you are being abused by your husband? Has he ever physically or verbally hurt you?

 

I'm sorry. I'm NOT a no smoke without fire believer! I know that some families can be a bit strange. It worries me that your family would call the police. As another member asked...What prompted that? I find it hard to comprehend people sitting around on a Sunday afternoon & deciding that they should call 911.

 

If there's no abuse & your marriage has mutual respect & support no-one should be telling you that it's not a real marriage. You guys can make your own rules. It sounds like you have lots of love & compassion in your bubble. That's more than many can say.

[Moxie Lady]

And my husband does not trust himself fully to be around a child.

 

Why?

 

This jumped out at me.

[basil67]

Does his PTSD manifest itself in aggressive or violent behaviours? Has he ever frightened you?

[MJJean]

A marriage can be legally invalidated if it hasn't been consummated.

 

The Catholic Church will automatically annul a marriage that hasn't been consummated. And the Church will not marry anyone incapable of sex.

 

Society assumes that married couples have sex.

 

So, society, the law, and at least one major religious organization all agree that marriage requires sex.

 

Basically, I have to agree with your families. I wouldn't consider your relationship with your legal husband a marriage. Marriage is a sexual relationship. If one does not wish to engage in a sexual relationship, one is free to be friends/roommates without pretending a marriage.

[RecentChange]

I wonder if the OP will ever return. I see she started a thread years ago and never responded.

 

Calling the police seems extreme, and most likely your parents are WORRIED about you.

[Ana-Iva]

You guys sound like emotional support and a therapy for each other.

That might really not be a good definition of a marriage, so people around you might be right.

You do get what you need from each other because you think nobody else would understand you.

[Els]

No, you aren't wrong. A relationship is whatever the two (or more...) people in it want it to be - nothing more and nothing less. As long as you're not breaking any laws (which, to the best of my knowledge, you aren't), it isn't anyone else's business what the two of you choose to do.

 

That being said, it does seem strange that your parents are calling the cops just because the two of you aren't having sex. What was their cited reason for that?

[Rylie]

I'm wondering why your families have to be so aware that you're not having sex. It seems like that's the main thing that makes your marriage "abnormal," tho many marriages end up that way, of course. But really, I think many people don't talk to their parents about sex w their spouse.

 

Just out of curiosity, do you guys kiss, make out, cuddle, touch? Have you ever had sex w each other? Are you attracted to each other? Do you feel romantic about each other? I don't think any of those things make your marriage any more or less legitimate. I'm just being nosy.

 

The only reason my parents are aware that we are not sexual intimate is because my sister told them. I use to be very close with my sister and we talked about our relationships. And they have asked if he forces me to have sex.

 

It's fine. People get curious when things are out of the "norm". We are both attracted to each other, we both get turned on, get the urge to have sex, we kiss and make out, cuddle. We have not had sex with each other. The extent of our sexual relationship [as of right now] is seeing each other naked and being comfortable laying naked together and very light touching. We're taking it slow and we're happy with that.

 

I have a feeling we are not seeing the whole picture here. If so many people are raising red flags about your situation - well, that is a cause for concern.

 

Are either of you currently in therapy or counseling? If so, what does your counselor say about your situation?

 

Read up about Stockholm Syndrome - its when someone identifies with / protects etc their abuser.

 

What prompted your parents to call the police? No reason? Just a sunday night and they think, ahh, lets call the cops on our daughter....

 

Thats not rational or normal in the slightest.

 

We are both in treatment, separate and together as a couple. Without writing a novel... both have said that in our situation it works. That it could go one way and be really great or the other way and be really bad. Either we could bring each other down or one could hold the other back, or we can learn, develop and heal together in unison. Our PTSD's came from different sources and they present in different ways. For us, it works. For many it may not.

 

I know what Stockholm Syndrome is.

 

Why have people called the police?

 

People don't call cops when they don't like a spouse or disapprove of a marriage. They call police when they believe there is an imminent and immediate threat to someone's safety.

 

Why did they think that at the time that they called? What was happening at that exact moment?

 

My parents have called the police 4 times, each time months apart.

 

The first time was 4 years ago. I had a moment where I wasn't thinking clearly and quickly came up behind him and grabbed him. At that point it was a big no-no. He grabbed me hard and left hand marks around my arm and neck. My parents saw the marks and noticed I was shaken up when I met them for lunch a few days later and they called the police that night. They knew damn well what really happened.

 

The second time (we weren't married yet) my husband and I were at my parents house for dinner. My husband started having an attack and needed to leave. We left abruptly. I texted them and told them why but they called the police saying he forced me from their home.

 

The third time we were out with my sister and brother at my parents lake house. It was our only time going. Something triggered a flash back in my husband and while we were walking he grabbed me (non-violently) by the back of my jacket and held me and told me not to go that way. It triggered a flash back in myself and me panicking made him worse and it was just a giant "sh*t show". Triggering each other doesn't happen often, anymore, but when it does it can go to hell quickly. My sister panicked because she is a moron and sent a video to my parents who, you guessed it, called the cops.

 

And the fourth time was recently. My parents came over unexpectedly, I told them to leave but they didn't. My husband was on edge all night because he doesn't like people "invading" his safe zone and has a hard time staying calm when there is a lot of noise because he can't focus on other sounds (ie. someone breaking in). My dad, who is totally unaware and refuses to learn about about PTSD, slapped my husband on the back as he walked by. My husband pinned him to the wall and started screaming at them both. This what the first violent reaction he had in a couple years and has had very few since.

 

Do your family & friends believe that you are being abused by your husband? Has he ever physically or verbally hurt you?

 

My family is adamant that I'm being abused by my husband. Anything I have a bruise or scrape it's "What did Luke do to you?". Or if I say no to having dinner, lunch or a visit they say he's controlling me and isolating me from them. He's not. My family has been burning bridges for a long time. So of course I don't want to see them often, and the fact that they call the police makes me even more sure that I don't want to see them.

 

He has never purposely, intently hurt me. Ever. Whenever something has happened he feels extremely bad following the event.

 

Why? [does he not trust himself fully to be around a child.]

 

Few reasons. Because children are unpredictable in behavior and he needs predictable. There has never been any issues with children but he doesn't want to take the risk. And because of some things that happened he does not feel worthy to have children.

 

Does his PTSD manifest itself in aggressive or violent behaviours? Has he ever frightened you?

 

I think this pretty much was summed up above. But yes to both. I have been scared, in the moment. I do not live in fear and violent or aggressive behavior is a rare thing these days. We didn't sleep in the same bed until 2 years ago because it was too unreliable. Times that we tried or accidentally fell asleep almost always ended up badly. Now that is not an issue.

Edited June 16, 2016 by Rylie

[ChocolateRain]

.

He grabbed me hard and left hand marks around my arm and neck

.

My parents saw the marks and noticed I was shaken up when I met them for lunch a few days later and they called the police that night. They knew damn well what really happened.

 

 

well that explains why they are scared for you ... as a parent i would have probably done the same ...

 

i dont know what he went through but i hope he continues with Therapy...

but can you understand why your parents would be concerned ?

Edited June 16, 2016 by ChocolateRain
correction

[Rylie]

A marriage can be legally invalidated if it hasn't been consummated. .

 

But a spouse has to do that, right? Parents or family cannot make that happen?

 

You guys sound like emotional support and a therapy for each other.

That might really not be a good definition of a marriage, so people around you might be right.

You do get what you need from each other because you think nobody else would understand you.

 

This is what friends on both sides have said. Basically that we are only support and private therapy for each other; that one of us, or both, will eventually realize it's not actual love and leave; we are not actually in love with each other but just think we are because it became so familiar; and neither of us thought someone would want to be with us so we clung to each other. Another thing people have said is that when we heal and stop needing support we will drift apart.

 

..

well that explains why they are scared for you ... as a parent i would have probably done the same ...

 

i dont know what he went through but i hope he continues with Therapy...

but can you understand why your parents would be concerned ?

 

I can understand why people think they were justified. But I also know they are just being terrible people. My dad served for almost 30 years. He was deployed all the time but was lucky enough to never be deployed somewhere dangerous. Sitting in Fiji for a year is NOT the same as being in the middle of a war zone. My dad has never had to kill someone or shoot a child, he has never seen his friends be blow to a million pieces or lived in constant fear. Regardless, my dad thinks it's the same. He thinks my husband is just abusive, controlling and dangerous.

 

My mom understands PTSD better but thinks it should manifest in the same way mine does. That's not the case. She understands that he has PTSD but thinks he is too dangerous to be around.

Edited June 16, 2016 by Rylie

[oldshirt]

Your parents have had valid reasons to fear for your safety and were justified in contacting the authorities.

 

The fact that multiple people that care about you and your well being are concerned that this is an unhealthy relationship is a huge red flag.

 

The fact that both of you have problems and find comfort and sanctuary in each others dysfunctions, does not make the relationship functional.

 

Your friends and relatives concerns are founded.

 

I don't think that it is that your marriage is a "sham" per se as I do believe that both of you are sincere. It is that both of you are unstable and volatile and are at very high risk of being harmed or of continued dysfunction and volatility.

 

You two are legal adults and unless someone can prove that you are actually mentally incompetent to take care of yourself, no one can force your relationship to end.

 

However that doesn't mean that they have to agree with your marriage or support it and neither can they be prevented from contacting authorities if they feel you are in immediate danger or that a crime has been committed.

 

As was stated earlier, where there is smoke, there is fire. And there are large plumes of thick, black smoke billowing out here.

[Rylie]

Do your family & friends believe that you are being abused by your husband?

 

I want to expand on this more because I realize I wasn't clear. My family does believe that I am being abused or in danger. My friends do not. In the past my friends were concerned when I would have marks from him but now that it rarely happens AND they understand better it's not thought. What my friends (and husband's friends) are hung up on is that to them we are not in a real marriage, just legally husband and wife. They also think that if we were both with someone "normal" we could heal faster.

 

Your parents have had valid reasons to fear for your safety and were justified in contacting the authorities.

 

But is it really valid reasons when they know I have PTSD and they know he has PTST and as much as I have tried to explain it to them they won't listen? Each time I have tried to explain the situation to them but they will not listen.

[Moxie Lady]

In the past my friends were concerned when I would have marks from him but now that it rarely happens AND they understand better it's not thought.

 

It should NEVER happen. Never. Do you understand that?

 

But is it really valid reasons when they know I have PTSD and they know he has PTST and as much as I have tried to explain it to them they won't listen? Each time I have tried to explain the situation to them but they will not listen.

 

Yes they are valid reasons because PTSD or anything else are not excuses for there to be fear, violence, and physical abuse.

 

In your reply post there were several things that alluded to your being fearful of his behavior and instabillity. For instance there was something you said about how accidentally you fell asleep in the same bed and things did not go well. You werent very specific but the overall feeling was not a good secure one.

 

If my child were in this relationship I would have a huge issue with it and I would definitely call the authorities when your family did.

 

911 was called 4 times by a variety of people. Surely you can see that there is nothing coincidental about that.

[oldshirt]

 

 

But is it really valid reasons when they know I have PTSD and they know he has PTST and as much as I have tried to explain it to them they won't listen? Each time I have tried to explain the situation to them but they will not listen.

 

Yes.

 

He may have a condition that has a name but he is still dangerous and his actions are still a crime.

 

A mental condition does not make harmful actions ok.

 

Are you a Walking Dead fan? It's the same with the zombies on the Walking Dead. They may have a disease that makes them eat people and it may not be their fault that they got that disease, but they are still dangerous and will still eat people if those people do not take action against them.

 

It's the same here. Here may have a psychological condition that requires care and treatment and concern and compassion. But it is still unacceptable, dangerous and illegal for him to lash out with violence.

[oldshirt]

As a father myself, I will be honest with you. Your parents have been very lenient and accommodating IMHO.

 

I have a daughter and if I witness any man treating my daughter that way or doing that to me, we are going to go to Pound Town right then and there and he is going to get his azz kicked by a pi$$ed off father.

 

Then he is going to be given the option of getting himself straightened up and flying right, or he is really going to have some trouble.

 

Your folks have actually shown too much restraint and conservative response IMHO.

[oldshirt]

as much as I have tried to explain it to them they won't listen? Each time I have tried to explain the situation to them but they will not listen.

 

You can't explain away bad and dangerous behavior. There is no excuse for unacceptable behavior.

 

You can't explain why they should accept this treatment of their daughter.

 

The malfunction here is within you, not them. They are reaction and responding appropriately (actually they are not responding enough IMHO but that's beside the point) Your acceptance of unacceptable behavior and you trying to make excuses and justifications for it is the dysfunction.

 

For some reason, you believe that it is ok for you to accept this unacceptable treatment and behavior.

 

This is why it is important for you to continue your therapy and strive to seek treatment for your issues.

[Cablebandit]

As a father myself, I will be honest with you. Your parents have been very lenient and accommodating IMHO.

 

I have a daughter and if I witness any man treating my daughter that way or doing that to me, we are going to go to Pound Town right then and there and he is going to get his azz kicked by a pi$$ed off father.

 

Then he is going to be given the option of getting himself straightened up and flying right, or he is really going to have some trouble.

 

Your folks have actually shown too much restraint and conservative response IMHO.

 

to combat violence you resort to, more violence. That is what is wrong with our culture.

[66Charger]

Your husbands behaviour is reactionary, and that in it self is a problem. This not the same as a anger management issue, this is what was taught to him. When you feel your life is threatened, you must react immediately, or your life may end. Your husbamd may still be in a war zone. He has never been properly debreifed. The triggers are real and the reactions will continue until he "comes home" Your parents are unfortunately correct. This is the price some pay for their sanity.

 

This is a marriage, perhaps based on love, but it has roots are based in fear. From both sides. Right now, you are both drowning in fear while clinging to each other. One day, one or both of you may learn to swim. Together, or away from each other. No one knows, including you.

 

I have no advice as to your marriage or whether you should stay together. But you should recognize the threat as real, even if it is not intentionally directed at you or someone close. He needs help that you can not give. Strength and Honor

 

A prayer for you both.

Edited June 16, 2016 by 66Charger

[Gemma1]

Your parents are absolutely in the right to call the police on your husband. He has left marks on you and pinned your father to a wall. If you were my daughter, I'd have done the same thing. I think that you guys sincerely believe you are helping each other, but it's more likely that you're hindering each other's healing. Whether he means to or not, he IS isolating you from your family. He's driving a wedge between you and people who clearly love you due to his inexcusable violence.

 

I don't believe it's Stockholm syndrome, but it's a huge problem and you are in denial.