So Angry Right Now

[13Hearts]

I'm not sure why but reading posts and other perspectives from affair partners was definitely not helping me. It was causing me all kinds of negativity, negative thoughts, negative feelings, anxiety, anger, etc. But when I read posts and blogs written by betrayed spouses, I feel more resolved, not negativity. It doesn't make me feel happy to read these stories and perspectives and some of them are so heartbreaking. It is a little overwhelming to realize just how many people are being cheated on, betrayed, and traumatized by their spouses' affairs and it makes me more cynical about ever finding a permanent partner for myself. But reading them is helping me, so I just wanted to share that in case someone else might benefit.

 

It's sad the excuses MM and MW use with their spouses. And the blaming, the fingerpointing, the gaslighting; the emotional abuse. The BSs call their WSs narcissists a lot. I can see why.

 

WSs are so very, very selfish. I wish everyone who ever thought about getting involved with a married person could know this firsthand, before getting involved. Because I don't think this kind of selfishness goes away or gets better. All of this sure is helping me to realize that the belief that xMM was eventually going to leave his marriage and we would be together was just a damn fairytale he made up to draw me in. The whole damn thing was just a story. WTH? What kind of people do this sort of thing? Evil?? Demented?? It reminds me of guys in high school and the head-games they would play with the girls who were in love with them.

[pooldog]

I totally agree that this helped me too. I read chumplady and the infidelity board here and understood the other side and I felt relieved to be out.

 

There are tons of good men waiting.

 

The best thing about dating is telling someone your schedule instead of being an affair partner and waiting for the coast to be clear!!

 

I'm not sure why but reading posts and other perspectives from affair partners was definitely not helping me. It was causing me all kinds of negativity, negative thoughts, negative feelings, anxiety, anger, etc. But when I read posts and blogs written by betrayed spouses, I feel more resolved, not negativity. It doesn't make me feel happy to read these stories and perspectives and some of them are so heartbreaking. It is a little overwhelming to realize just how many people are being cheated on, betrayed, and traumatized by their spouses' affairs and it makes me more cynical about ever finding a permanent partner for myself. But reading them is helping me, so I just wanted to share that in case someone else might benefit.

 

It's sad the excuses MM and MW use with their spouses. And the blaming, the fingerpointing, the gaslighting; the emotional abuse. The BSs call their WSs narcissists a lot. I can see why.

 

WSs are so very, very selfish. I wish everyone who ever thought about getting involved with a married person could know this firsthand, before getting involved. Because I don't think this kind of selfishness goes away or gets better. All of this sure is helping me to realize that the belief that xMM was eventually going to leave his marriage and we would be together was just a damn fairytale he made up to draw me in. The whole damn thing was just a story. WTH? What kind of people do this sort of thing? Evil?? Demented?? It reminds me of guys in high school and the head-games they would play with the girls who were in love with them.

[13Hearts]

I totally agree that this helped me too. I read chumplady and the infidelity board here and understood the other side and I felt relieved to be out.

 

There are tons of good men waiting.

 

The best thing about dating is telling someone your schedule instead of being an affair partner and waiting for the coast to be clear!!

 

I never really got into telling xMM when I was available. I think he just learned my schedule and then would just come over, or would ask if I wanted to go to lunch or somewhere else with him. Not realizing or caring how inconvenient it is to always have to accommodate his limited availability.

 

A couple months on I realized he actually expected me to remain quiet when he talked to his wife on the phone. I was appalled and angry and he knew it. I just could not understand, first, why he needed to answer her phone calls while we were together and second, who the hell he thought he was, expecting me to remain quiet so the person on the other side didn't know who he was with. Call me stupid but if a man is living apart from his wife, why do they need to speak while he and I are together? To me, he should have just said he'd talk to her later.

 

He'd tell me she was worried and needed to talk about the kids but the kids were GROWN. 19 and 20 years old! WTH kind of person is so worried about normal 19 and 20 year olds that they can't wait until later to talk about them? It made no sense, but I know now it was because I am so damn gullible! Duh. It was probably the same excuse he used with his OW when the kids were little and he probably just expected me to fall into that role. That never happened.

[Lobe]

I'm not sure why but reading posts and other perspectives from affair partners was definitely not helping me. It was causing me all kinds of negativity, negative thoughts, negative feelings, anxiety, anger, etc. But when I read posts and blogs written by betrayed spouses, I feel more resolved, not negativity. It doesn't make me feel happy to read these stories and perspectives and some of them are so heartbreaking. It is a little overwhelming to realize just how many people are being cheated on, betrayed, and traumatized by their spouses' affairs and it makes me more cynical about ever finding a permanent partner for myself. But reading them is helping me, so I just wanted to share that in case someone else might benefit.

 

It's sad the excuses MM and MW use with their spouses. And the blaming, the fingerpointing, the gaslighting; the emotional abuse. The BSs call their WSs narcissists a lot. I can see why.

 

WSs are so very, very selfish. I wish everyone who ever thought about getting involved with a married person could know this firsthand, before getting involved. Because I don't think this kind of selfishness goes away or gets better. All of this sure is helping me to realize that the belief that xMM was eventually going to leave his marriage and we would be together was just a damn fairytale he made up to draw me in. The whole damn thing was just a story. WTH? What kind of people do this sort of thing? Evil?? Demented?? It reminds me of guys in high school and the head-games they would play with the girls who were in love with them.

 

Funny - I feel the same way reading AP posts instead of BS posts, which often just depresses me and takes me right back to d-day. It also humanizes the AP for me, hearing the "other" side - the BS gets gaslighted and starts to feel like it's their own fault they are literally going insane because they are told they are being unnecessarily suspicious and overbearing, the AP gets fed massive doses of sparkly unicorn sh*t in fantasyland but can't see it's still sh*t for all the glitter, and the WS just sits there shovelling cake in his face with his grubby little paws.

 

I think that a lot of WSs are not demented evil people but short-sighted fools who end up making stupid, selfish decisions when opportunity presents itself. It's one thing when the WS is on a singles site snaring unsuspecting victims - that to me would have been grounds for me to leave my WH - but reading here how so many APs just kind of create these little vacuums for themselves by making really bad life choices lol - it's just painful, for everyone. I asked my husband at one point why he future faked with his AP and you know what he said? "Because I thought when you found out what I had done, you wouldn't take me back." So he just kept digging, giving in to more of her demands, and giving up on me, all with me being clueless why he was being such a heartless, insensitive assh*le towards me.

 

Addictions are ugly things - they don't have a conscience. They turn normal, loving, kind people into the worst possible versions of themselves - users, manipulators, abusers, liars, cheaters, fakes, frauds... Yes, there are true narcissists and sociopaths who completely lack empathy, but I think the cognitive dissonance required for most people to convince themselves the affair is OK causes normal, rational human beings to lose their godd*mned minds. Like they brainwash themselves. lol

 

Maybe I'm overly optimistic about human nature. But I'm not naive anymore - that's why the logger on the router.

[13Hearts]

Funny - I feel the same way reading AP posts instead of BS posts, which often just depresses me and takes me right back to d-day. It also humanizes the AP for me, hearing the "other" side - the BS gets gaslighted and starts to feel like it's their own fault they are literally going insane because they are told they are being unnecessarily suspicious and overbearing, the AP gets fed massive doses of sparkly unicorn sh*t in fantasyland but can't see it's still sh*t for all the glitter, and the WS just sits there shovelling cake in his face with his grubby little paws.

 

I think that a lot of WSs are not demented evil people but short-sighted fools who end up making stupid, selfish decisions when opportunity presents itself. It's one thing when the WS is on a singles site snaring unsuspecting victims - that to me would have been grounds for me to leave my WH - but reading here how so many APs just kind of create these little vacuums for themselves by making really bad life choices lol - it's just painful, for everyone. I asked my husband at one point why he future faked with his AP and you know what he said? "Because I thought when you found out what I had done, you wouldn't take me back." So he just kept digging, giving in to more of her demands, and giving up on me, all with me being clueless why he was being such a heartless, insensitive assh*le towards me.

 

Addictions are ugly things - they don't have a conscience. They turn normal, loving, kind people into the worst possible versions of themselves - users, manipulators, abusers, liars, cheaters, fakes, frauds... Yes, there are true narcissists and sociopaths who completely lack empathy, but I think the cognitive dissonance required for most people to convince themselves the affair is OK causes normal, rational human beings to lose their godd*mned minds. Like they brainwash themselves. lol

 

Maybe I'm overly optimistic about human nature. But I'm not naive anymore - that's why the logger on the router.

 

I hear what you are saying about addictions and I agree with that description. But I'm not convinced it applies to WSs and their affairs. I'm also not so optimistic as you regarding WS stupidity and lack of foresight. MM has lots of foresight and is very strategic, cunning even. I also have had more than my fair share of experience with men who act narcissistic and sociopathic due to addiction and alcoholism and men without those problems who are equally N and S, and it's all the same. There is a black hole, a blankness, behind a sociopath's gaze. At least men who behave narcissistically are also capable of empathy, care, and understanding. The sociopath has no such ability, and couldn't give a $hit anyway.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by OW forming vacuums. I live my life within my life, surrounded by my associates. I don't live my life in MM's world. I don't know the same people he associates with, and I don't know his wife. I have and had no firsthand knowledge or observations of their relationship. I am apparently gullible because I trusted his representations of his marital relationship as the truth.

 

Also, many, many people separate from their spouses and remain so for various reasons, without seeking divorce. My brother has been separated from his wife for about two years and I doubt they are going to be reconciling. I've known people living alone in apartments, separated from their spouses but not yet divorced. It's not far-fetched to believe someone when they tell you they separated for a year, ran out of the financial resources to continue supporting two households, but are moving towards divorce.

 

So, you see, I don't think I created a vacuum for myself. I believed what he told me, until I saw enough evidence that what he was saying just wasn't true. I should have done more investigation up front. I'm not sure who I would have asked though.

 

That is very strange that you get the same kind of feelings reading posts by other BSs, but feel better when you read from APs. I guess it helps because we're getting the bigger picture now, instead of remaining stuck with only half the story. It also makes me feel like I am not so alone, trying to maneuver my way through this experience. And I feel less stupid because it brings to light the fact that I was not the only one fooled by MM.

[whichwayisup]

Thanks, WhichWay. Is that baggage reclaim a web site?

 

I've been reading Chump Lady and it is helping a lot.

 

You are right, he has been taking up space in my head and what a waste!! I think I was depressed and that's why I couldn't stop thinking about it all.

 

Yeah it is, just type it in with a .com

 

He isn't worthy to be in your head so much. Tell yourself this "He isn't thinking of me, he isn't crying over me so why am I crying and thinking of him?" Rid of him! Fall asleep with your tv on so you can doze and let your mind relax.

[pooldog]

I love your saying, Lobe, that the MM is like a grubby cake eater.

 

13Hearts I hope you are better today! I had a great day today and forgot about him entirely until i came to check in on everyone.

 

 

 

I hear what you are saying about addictions and I agree with that description. But I'm not convinced it applies to WSs and their affairs. I'm also not so optimistic as you regarding WS stupidity and lack of foresight. MM has lots of foresight and is very strategic, cunning even. I also have had more than my fair share of experience with men who act narcissistic and sociopathic due to addiction and alcoholism and men without those problems who are equally N and S, and it's all the same. There is a black hole, a blankness, behind a sociopath's gaze. At least men who behave narcissistically are also capable of empathy, care, and understanding. The sociopath has no such ability, and couldn't give a $hit anyway.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by OW forming vacuums. I live my life within my life, surrounded by my associates. I don't live my life in MM's world. I don't know the same people he associates with, and I don't know his wife. I have and had no firsthand knowledge or observations of their relationship. I am apparently gullible because I trusted his representations of his marital relationship as the truth.

 

Also, many, many people separate from their spouses and remain so for various reasons, without seeking divorce. My brother has been separated from his wife for about two years and I doubt they are going to be reconciling. I've known people living alone in apartments, separated from their spouses but not yet divorced. It's not far-fetched to believe someone when they tell you they separated for a year, ran out of the financial resources to continue supporting two households, but are moving towards divorce.

 

So, you see, I don't think I created a vacuum for myself. I believed what he told me, until I saw enough evidence that what he was saying just wasn't true. I should have done more investigation up front. I'm not sure who I would have asked though.

 

That is very strange that you get the same kind of feelings reading posts by other BSs, but feel better when you read from APs. I guess it helps because we're getting the bigger picture now, instead of remaining stuck with only half the story. It also makes me feel like I am not so alone, trying to maneuver my way through this experience. And I feel less stupid because it brings to light the fact that I was not the only one fooled by MM.

[Lobe]

13, I think the affair atmosphere - lies, deception, delusion - creates the vacuum. Or maybe a black hole is a better metaphor...

 

Your MM sounds like a bit of a douche canoe. I'm not saying my WH wasn't a manipulative conniving lying sack of turd during the A, but I can definitely tell you that he was not like that before nor has he been like that since. He was short sighted, selfish, and deluded. He dragged his AP (albeit willing AP) through his dirty trough of blsh*t every bit as much as me. And he is a terrible liar and even worse actor, so I do believe the shame and remorse he exhibits is true. It's a choice, though. I get that.

 

Really, only person who has all the information needed to make a fully informed decision is the WS. The bottom line for me in every AP scenario boils down to this: unless you are completely unaware that the person you're hooking up with is married, you always get to choose whether you believe the lies or not. There's a choice there. Considering they pretty much all say the same thing, like there's s playbook, I think that if the opportunity to have an affair ever presents itself to me I'll just run. Hard and fast. lol

 

Keep moving forward, 13. Wiser and stronger, with each passing day.

[13Hearts]

I love your saying, Lobe, that the MM is like a grubby cake eater.

 

13Hearts I hope you are better today! I had a great day today and forgot about him entirely until i came to check in on everyone.

 

Yes, I liked Lobe's word picture of the grubby cake eater, too.

 

I am better, thank you ❤❤ I am not obsessing about it, angry, questioning, or anything anymore, thank God. I am, however, doing something that is probably ill-advised, and that is texting with him about nothing in particular. I'm treating him on text as though nothing has changed, just so I can figure out whether or not he is a sociopath. I have no interest or desire at all of starting back up with him. I'm also reading the George Simon In Sheep's Clothing book again, to see if I can identify xMM in there.

 

I know, I know, I should get a better hobby. But I do get satisfaction of texting with him but THIS TIME I am the one pulling the wool over HIS eyes, instead of vice versa! If there was a devil smilie available, I would post it here!

[13Hearts]

DOUCHE CANOE!! HAHAHAHAHAHA

 

Yes, actually, he IS a douche canoe, in fact!

 

 

13, I think the affair atmosphere - lies, deception, delusion - creates the vacuum. Or maybe a black hole is a better metaphor...

 

Your MM sounds like a bit of a douche canoe. I'm not saying my WH wasn't a manipulative conniving lying sack of turd during the A, but I can definitely tell you that he was not like that before nor has he been like that since. He was short sighted, selfish, and deluded. He dragged his AP (albeit willing AP) through his dirty trough of blsh*t every bit as much as me. And he is a terrible liar and even worse actor, so I do believe the shame and remorse he exhibits is true. It's a choice, though. I get that.

 

Really, only person who has all the information needed to make a fully informed decision is the WS. The bottom line for me in every AP scenario boils down to this: unless you are completely unaware that the person you're hooking up with is married, you always get to choose whether you believe the lies or not. There's a choice there. Considering they pretty much all say the same thing, like there's s playbook, I think that if the opportunity to have an affair ever presents itself to me I'll just run. Hard and fast. lol

 

Keep moving forward, 13. Wiser and stronger, with each passing day.

[Maggie888]

Really 13? All these pages and pages of wisdom and now you are texting him?

 

Why not use your time to help shelter animals or homeless people or child cancer patients?

 

Who cares if he is a socipath or not? Really? This is why people in here keep saying you need to realize your eole in this. Bad choices you are making.

[elaine567]

I'm treating him on text as though nothing has changed, just so I can figure out whether or not he is a sociopath. I have no interest or desire at all of starting back up with him. I'm also reading the George Simon In Sheep's Clothing book again, to see if I can identify xMM in there.

 

I know, I know, I should get a better hobby. But I do get satisfaction of texting with him but THIS TIME I am the one pulling the wool over HIS eyes, instead of vice versa! If there was a devil smilie available, I would post it here!

 

YOU are playing a dangerous game, as you are in no real place to be so uninvolved, so distant, so cold and so manipulative.

He will pretty good at that game, he is the expert.

He will reel you back in little by little until one day you will be back at stage one - wanting him, needing him and you will have undone all your good work here and for what?

 

Stop obsessing about HIM, he is who he is.

You got away from him - just make sure it stays that way.

[anika99]

13 have you considered getting counselling so that you can can get to know yourself and gain wisdom? I have noticed in reading this thread that you tend to become overly defensive, outraged even, whenever anyone so much as mentions that you bear some responsibility for your own choices and life. You get so angry whenever anyone suggests that you should look inward or make different decisions.

 

I have not been an OW but I have had a string of failed relationships with the childish self centred men you describe. I used to feel the victim and would stew over the unfairness of it all. After awhile I began to accept that I was a participant in those relationships and that alone made me 50% responsible for them.

 

Whenever someone suggests that you bear some responsibility for the affair you say no, you had endless conversations with him regarding the right thing to do and what your expectations of him were. But why did you even put that much time and effort into trying to get the MM to meet your expectations? That in itself was a poor decision was it not? If you came across a vicious dog looking to attack you would you have endless conversations with that dog trying to convince him to be a nice doggy and do the right thing so that you can be happy or would you just say this dog is dangerous and get yourself out of his reach?

 

I also notice that you contradict yourself regarding your feelings. You will say it was a short affair that didn't really affect you and then in another post you will say different. You just don't really seem to know yourself or realize that you are empowered to make your life what you want it to be.

 

and now you are playing some sick game of texting with the MM you claim is so awful and powerful that you simply couldn't walk away from him or do anything to get him out of your life. And why? Because you want to know if he is a sociopath? Who freaking cares?! Why are you still making this all about him and what's wrong with him? Why not just accept that he is not a good person and remove him from your life? Here you are making yet another choice to involve yourself with him so you you are responsible for whatever comes of this? You are not a victim here, you are choosing this. Just walk away and try to open yourself up to the idea that you are controlling your life and life is not just happening to you. You are in the drivers seat and maybe, just maybe you are the one who is steering your life in the wrong direction but you can choose to steer in another direction?

[Lobe]

I concur with anika that at this point, you're choosing to put your hand in the fire... I don't understand how texting to prove he is a sociopath is going to accomplish anything. What happens when you confirm or deny it?

[Lady Hamilton]

I know, I know, I should get a better hobby. But I do get satisfaction of texting with him but THIS TIME I am the one pulling the wool over HIS eyes, instead of vice versa! If there was a devil smilie available, I would post it here!

 

Girl, you're pulling nothing on him.

 

Right now, he's out on a lunch date with his other OW and he's not hinking if her, thinking of his wife, and thinking that even will all of them around and you knowing they're around, that you're still banging down his door for him. Right now he thinks you are desperate, he's all that, and you're just another girl who proves that.

 

Then, if you go off on him, he won't think "Man, she played me!" He will say "Poor girl couldn't take not having me... Now she's just another crazy b..." And if you think he will hear "I was just using you like you used me" and he'll feel one-upped by you?

 

Think again.

 

He'll think of all you did, the hours you spent doing it, time that could have been spent moving on and living your life, and he'll think you're sad, pathetic, and a psychopath.

 

You still care too much and with every text you announce it. And when it blows up and you fall back into bed with him as his other other woman, or you confront him with a WebMD diagnosis of mental illness, you will walk out the loser, not him.

 

It takes trained professionals serious time to diagnose a patient they have sitting right in front of them with what you, a layman, is trying to diagnose via text. And let's say he is a sociopath... Then what? It won't make you feel better. It won't negate your role in the affair and what you need to be accountable for. It won't make you the victim. It won't be used to find him treatment.

 

At this point, be in or out. This walking the middle stuff doesn't do you any favors.

[heartwhole]

You recently told me to stop looking at OW's social media, so I will return the favor and tell you to stop texting xMM. Ask yourself what you are hoping to get out of this. If he reveals himself to be really, really dastardly and callous, would that change how you feel about things right now? If he seems to want you again, would that change things? If he seems kind of regretful and maybe like a complex person with some good qualities, would that change things? I see this as a no win situation. If he's just a callous jerk, you'll be angry all over again, no matter what you say now. If he expresses any kind of interest, you might get sucked back in. If he seems kind of remorseful and multi-dimensional, then you won't be able to dismiss him as a sociopath and shrug it all off. So I don't see how you wind up ahead by doing this.

 

I understand the urge to "mess with" people who have hurt you, but I don't think following those urges ever puts you on the right side of karma.

[pooldog]

13hearts - how are you doing today?

 

I would never text xMM. But that is me. Where do you want to go next? Some neat hobby, career skills, something else? Make sure you are taking you forward. The rest can be left in the dust. Won't matter soon.

[13Hearts]

13hearts - how are you doing today?

 

I would never text xMM. But that is me. Where do you want to go next? Some neat hobby, career skills, something else? Make sure you are taking you forward. The rest can be left in the dust. Won't matter soon.

 

Doing great, thanks pooldog. I have a bunch of stuff I am working on, which takes up a lot of time and attention. Having some home improvements done, working long hours at work, and taking care of some matters for a sick family member. It's stressful but I stay busy so it's OK.

 

I can't possibly respond to everything everyone has said in response to my texting experiment. But I do want to say thank you all for posting and trying to steer me in one direction or another. Also, let me answer some of your concerns:

 

Those few weeks when I was sad and depressed and couldn't stop thinking about what happened, I realize now it was because 1) for some reason, I went back to believing all the romantic BS he told me early on and 2) I started to believe the reason he was not delivering on his promises had something to do with my self-worth.

 

When I was angry, I was angry, and no one is rational when they are angry. If you knew me in real life you would know that I actually know myself VERY well, and have been told by many different people that I know myself better than anyone they have met.

 

I am not a victim and never claimed to be a victim. I said that the cheating married man is to blame for this mess. Yes, of course I got involved with him, that rather goes without saying, doesn't it? But even HE admits he is entirely to blame. And anyway, it doesn't matter because I simply do not believe in blame or fault. What happened, happened, and I assure you I will not be listening to ANY more men tell me we're meant to be together, or we're going to be together, or that they will be divorcing, or any other romantic or future nonsense.

 

I don't care what xMM thinks, or thinks about me. He's a loser, no matter how you slice it. I gave him the benefit of the doubt and it was a mistake. I'm not attracted to him anymore because I see him for who he really is now. I know you all mean well but you make is sound like he's a superhero or has some superhuman powers that will cause me to collapse as soon as I see him.

 

We're talking about a man who is supposed to be in one of the most ethically stringent professions in the US, but who runs around on company time spending hours each day having sex with women who are not his wife. He has also told me about contracts he has gotten against the rules of his employment contract, basically stealing clients from his employer. So, this man has shown me that he betrays his employer and betrays his wife, so what makes you think I would now put myself in a position where he could betray me? I'm smarter than that.

 

Anyway, I'm not trying to figure out if he's a sociopath so that I can then throw it in his face. I'm not going to TELL him, for goodness sake. I'm just trying to figure out how someone who can ACT so kind, caring, and sweet can actually be a slimy, stinky, snake in the grass. I've known this man for most of my life and I want to figure out how I didn't know he was not who I thought he was.

 

I'm not going to accidentally have sex with him. He wasn't that great. In fact, he was very boring, the kind of guy who has to have everything his way, control the entire sexual experience, and strangely he would never just be present with me. He always had to make up some kind of a story or something; it was really weird and tiresome!

 

Anyway, thank you, you are all so very sweet for warning me and trying to help me or prevent me from getting hurt. I'm not getting reinvolved with MM, I promise!

xoxo

I'll let you know what I figure out, if anything.

[anika99]

Oh so are you a psychologist and experienced in diagnosing personality disorders? Do you know the criteria for diagnosing a sociopath and the procedure taken to make that diagnosis? I'm just curious to know what he could possibly say in a text message conversation that would let you know for sure, beyond a doubt, that he is a sociopath. What do you need to hear from him to determine that he definitely is or definitely isn't a sociopath? You already know all of the big things, like he is a cheater, a liar and manipulative. What else is there to know?

[DKT3]

Doing great, thanks pooldog. I have a bunch of stuff I am working on, which takes up a lot of time and attention. Having some home improvements done, working long hours at work, and taking care of some matters for a sick family member. It's stressful but I stay busy so it's OK.

 

I can't possibly respond to everything everyone has said in response to my texting experiment. But I do want to say thank you all for posting and trying to steer me in one direction or another. Also, let me answer some of your concerns:

 

Those few weeks when I was sad and depressed and couldn't stop thinking about what happened, I realize now it was because 1) for some reason, I went back to believing all the romantic BS he told me early on and 2) I started to believe the reason he was not delivering on his promises had something to do with my self-worth.

 

When I was angry, I was angry, and no one is rational when they are angry. If you knew me in real life you would know that I actually know myself VERY well, and have been told by many different people that I know myself better than anyone they have met.

 

I am not a victim and never claimed to be a victim. I said that the cheating married man is to blame for this mess. Yes, of course I got involved with him, that rather goes without saying, doesn't it? But even HE admits he is entirely to blame. And anyway, it doesn't matter because I simply do not believe in blame or fault. What happened, happened, and I assure you I will not be listening to ANY more men tell me we're meant to be together, or we're going to be together, or that they will be divorcing, or any other romantic or future nonsense.

 

I don't care what xMM thinks, or thinks about me. He's a loser, no matter how you slice it. I gave him the benefit of the doubt and it was a mistake. I'm not attracted to him anymore because I see him for who he really is now. I know you all mean well but you make is sound like he's a superhero or has some superhuman powers that will cause me to collapse as soon as I see him.

 

We're talking about a man who is supposed to be in one of the most ethically stringent professions in the US, but who runs around on company time spending hours each day having sex with women who are not his wife. He has also told me about contracts he has gotten against the rules of his employment contract, basically stealing clients from his employer. So, this man has shown me that he betrays his employer and betrays his wife, so what makes you think I would now put myself in a position where he could betray me? I'm smarter than that.

 

Anyway, I'm not trying to figure out if he's a sociopath so that I can then throw it in his face. I'm not going to TELL him, for goodness sake. I'm just trying to figure out how someone who can ACT so kind, caring, and sweet can actually be a slimy, stinky, snake in the grass. I've known this man for most of my life and I want to figure out how I didn't know he was not who I thought he was.

 

I'm not going to accidentally have sex with him. He wasn't that great. In fact, he was very boring, the kind of guy who has to have everything his way, control the entire sexual experience, and strangely he would never just be present with me. He always had to make up some kind of a story or something; it was really weird and tiresome!

 

Anyway, thank you, you are all so very sweet for warning me and trying to help me or prevent me from getting hurt. I'm not getting reinvolved with MM, I promise!

xoxo

I'll let you know what I figure out, if anything.

 

This is an interesting post in sense that had someone told you he was a loser before, you wouod be prepared to defend him with your life.

 

Interesting in the sense that mm is pretty nice interchangeable, it's not him that got you hooked on him it's you that got you hooked on him. It's the way you convinced yourself he made you feel. All the things you complain about now has always been true about him, why couldn't you see it before?

 

At any rate, your doing great, process it then keep moving forward. Just do your best to not make the next guy pay because this guy is a jackazz.

[pooldog]

I hope you are better today. I have a feeling this is your way of making sense of the lunacy and that you are seeing new light. But I hope you turn the corner and find a bright and happy path. Better days are ahead.

[Lady Hamilton]

Honestly, I think as long as you're still so involved with him like this, it's not an ex-MM and an ex-affair... It's a current MM and, at the least, an emotional affair.

 

You're clearly still emotionally invested in him and absolutely nothing good can come from what's going on. It's bordering on obsessive and more-than flirting with bunny-boiling.

[13Hearts]

Oh so are you a psychologist and experienced in diagnosing personality disorders? Do you know the criteria for diagnosing a sociopath and the procedure taken to make that diagnosis? I'm just curious to know what he could possibly say in a text message conversation that would let you know for sure, beyond a doubt, that he is a sociopath. What do you need to hear from him to determine that he definitely is or definitely isn't a sociopath? You already know all of the big things, like he is a cheater, a liar and manipulative. What else is there to know?

 

No, I'm not a psychologist and I'm not trying to diagnose him. I'm just maintaining civil conversation via text message with him; the same kind of stuff you might discuss with a co-worker, but no more intimate or friendly than that.

 

I just want to see what the weirdo is going to do next, that's all. Plus, Dr Simon describes what he calls Covert-Aggressive, and compares them to a Sociopath, and I'm pretty sure xMM is actually one of those and not a Sociopath because Dr Simon says a Sociopath is rare and truly dangerous.

[13Hearts]

Thanks DKT3. I promise I won't try to make future men pay. But I have had quite enough of men who proclaim their undying love for me, swear we make the greatest couple, and tell me they've never fallen in love with anyone like me before. Whatever. I'm tired of men who make promises and never follow through on them. This isn't the first time it has happened but it will be the last time I fall for it. If they aren't doing what they claim they will do at the time I meet them or become interested, they're OUT!

 

You are right, i fell in love with who I believed he was before really knowing the truth about him. But it was not my idea to become super involved with him, that was his idea. I just wanted to have a little fun, have a few laughs, and be done with it, but he would just not let me go.

 

I wouldn't have defended him with my life had someone called him a loser to my face. I would have, however, told them they didn't know what they were talking about and then I would have stopped talking to that person. Like I've said, xMM was a friend of mine for about 30 YEARS before the affair. I know a lot of people think he's the magic married man who can somehow woo me back into bed with him, but that's just not realistic and I'm not going to dump a lifelong friend completely just because I slept with them and figured out they're weird, disloyal, controlling, and boring in bed. Not all of my friends have to be PERFECT you know.

 

I couldn't see the truth about him before because, like I said earlier, I was never in his inner circle. We never hung out or associated with the same people. I don't know his family and he keeps most people at a distance, for whatever reason.

 

This is an interesting post in sense that had someone told you he was a loser before, you wouod be prepared to defend him with your life.

 

Interesting in the sense that mm is pretty nice interchangeable, it's not him that got you hooked on him it's you that got you hooked on him. It's the way you convinced yourself he made you feel. All the things you complain about now has always been true about him, why couldn't you see it before?

 

At any rate, your doing great, process it then keep moving forward. Just do your best to not make the next guy pay because this guy is a jackazz.

[13Hearts]

I hope you are better today. I have a feeling this is your way of making sense of the lunacy and that you are seeing new light. But I hope you turn the corner and find a bright and happy path. Better days are ahead.

 

Thanks pooldog. Everything is bright and happy right now. I am getting lots of stuff done, have a nice day with family planned tomorrow, all is calm, not worried or brooding over xMM or any of that. I am good!