"Destabilization Phase" and your thoughts and experience

[MidnightBlue1980]

Oh def cultural. It's one of the things he said. His family would never accept me. I'm divorced and I have children.

He's a firstborn son. Big deal, big expectations.

 

Yes compartmentalized. He has a drawer in his office gifts from me. It's like a drawer of secrets like me. the only visible gift is a painting he has on his wall, I made him.

 

Yes Ronnie, and I are similar and it sucks!!!

 

Midnight I'm glad you are doing so well. Its encouragung. Stay strong.

 

Thanks. I admit my heart jumped when I saw his name in my inbox. It felt good that I ignored him and that made him reach out. At the same time, I'm not 16. He's playing games - push pull purgatory -and this is my life here. I took my marbles and went home.

 

Sunshine, since you are divorced, why not just move on and meet new single guys? I get you love him but don't you think it's time to find at least a distraction?

[Ronnie33]

Sunshine, you want him to tell you that the reason he cheats is because he really loves you but can't be with you. I often times would wish for that too but it's not true.

 

I know my AP did love me and I think a part of him still does, but he loves her more and that's his life. They stay in this because we are comfortable for them and they do have feelings for us, but that's not enough a

 

If someone would have told me three years ago that he would have been marrying this girl and I would be here, I would have told them they are crazy and no way.

 

He fills a void in my life, I do think that if I could fill that void with someone else, it wouldn't be this bad. I do care for him and love him as a person but I think a lot of it has to do with my own unhappiness. I've had it attached to him for so long but it's not really him, it's the image of him.

 

Yes, our stories are very similar. How did you handle it when he left to get married? I can't be around him for that. After three years, I can't be around him for that.

[Chica80]

midnight I'm not divorced yet. Moved out 7 mo ago. Just started the filing process. Not really in the place to date. Yes it would be a good distraction but for my personality would just create more probs. Part of the reason I'm probably so attached.

 

Ronnie

YES you said it exactly.Not that he doesn't love her, I can accept that. She prob is better for him more stable none of the complications. I just would want to hear him say. Yes I love you we can't be together but I love you. HE will never say that. Rick and Ilsa (casablanca you know)

 

Ronnie I fell apart. When he left to get married I fell apart. I cried for days I was a mess. I text him on his wedding day. Congratulations. I tried to be happy for him. Strange right. I was in another country on a missions trip. He was in Europe. We text after that. While he on honeymoon. It wasn't anything but about my trip. He text me one day you would love these art museums. And sent me a pic of the art.

 

When we came back to wrk. I couldn't take it I tried to act normal. But it was so painful to hear how happy he looked honeymoon and soon babies......(things other people said he never said)

 

So I moved my shifts around and didn't text or call. That lasted two weeks.....my ex and I were actually kind of getting along......then he text hope you are well have a good weekend" at first I didn't respond just said thx. The next day I txt.....he proceeded to tell me how awful his week was. How he almost txt me so many times to tell me something. How he missed my "craziness".....

 

Ronnie that was almost a year ago. He your MM will NEVER let you go. He has told you as much. Since he got married we've played this game the NC the LC. I get so angry until I'm not anymore....

 

Sorry loooong response. Another reason dating is just not for me now. The reasons I keep going back...things I'm working on trying to learn trying to change. In IC.

[ladydesigner]

midnight I'm not divorced yet. Moved out 7 mo ago. Just started the filing process. Not really in the place to date. Yes it would be a good distraction but for my personality would just create more probs. Part of the reason I'm probably so attached.

 

Ronnie

YES you said it exactly.Not that he doesn't love her, I can accept that. She prob is better for him more stable none of the complications. I just would want to hear him say. Yes I love you we can't be together but I love you. HE will never say that. Rick and Ilsa (casablanca you know)

 

Ronnie I fell apart. When he left to get married I fell apart. I cried for days I was a mess. I text him on his wedding day. Congratulations. I tried to be happy for him. Strange right. I was in another country on a missions trip. He was in Europe. We text after that. While he on honeymoon. It wasn't anything but about my trip. He text me one day you would love these art museums. And sent me a pic of the art.

 

When we came back to wrk. I couldn't take it I tried to act normal. But it was so painful to hear how happy he looked honeymoon and soon babies......(things other people said he never said)

 

So I moved my shifts around and didn't text or call. That lasted two weeks.....my ex and I were actually kind of getting along......then he text hope you are well have a good weekend" at first I didn't respond just said thx. The next day I txt.....he proceeded to tell me how awful his week was. How he almost txt me so many times to tell me something. How he missed my "craziness".....

 

Ronnie that was almost a year ago. He your MM will NEVER let you go. He has told you as much. Since he got married we've played this game the NC the LC. I get so angry until I'm not anymore....

 

Sorry loooong response. Another reason dating is just not for me now. The reasons I keep going back...things I'm working on trying to learn trying to change. In IC.

 

Just curious as to why it matters if the MM says this or not? They may love during the A and after but over time feelings change. There was a time I thought I loved my xOM. Now looking back I loved how he made me feel not necessarily him. I have no feeling of 'love' towards him now. He is a non entity and a part of my past I don't really care to remember anymore.

[Lobe]

Just curious as to why it matters if the MM says this or not?

 

Think of every romantic movie about an affair and how the closing scene plays out when an affair ends with the wayward returning to their spouse. In one version, the WS says to the AP, "I love you but the fates are keeping us apart and I will carry with me forever an undying, unquenchable love for you and wonder until my death bed what we could have had in a different time and place..." In the other, the WS says to the BS, "I love you, I have always loved you, and I will spend the rest of my life making it up to you, my one and only true love..."

 

The line spoken last before the lights fade and the curtain closes determines who "won" in a way. I get it.

[ladydesigner]

Think of every romantic movie about an affair and how the closing scene plays out when an affair ends with the wayward returning to their spouse. In one version, the WS says to the AP, "I love you but the fates are keeping us apart and I will carry with me forever an undying, unquenchable love for you and wonder until my death bed what we could have had in a different time and place..." In the other, the WS says to the BS, "I love you, I have always loved you, and I will spend the rest of my life making it up to you, my one and only true love..."

 

The line spoken last before the lights fade and the curtain closes determines who "won" in a way. I get it.

 

Yes I see what you are saying, but who wants to be in this pseudo love with someone from afar forever. Those words won't even matter anymore 5-10 years from now. I look back at my own A and I can care less if xOM ever loved me. I don't even think of my exes in that way. I know at the time of ending you want to know it meant something and I get it, but most relationships lose their meaning over time. Of course this is my own opinion.

[Lobe]

Yes I see what you are saying, but who wants to be in this pseudo love with someone from afar forever.

 

People who feel used and abandoned, I imagine. It's likely easier to romanticize it than let disillusionment (and therefore accountability) set in.

[MidnightBlue1980]

People who feel used and abandoned, I imagine. It's likely easier to romanticize it than let disillusionment (and therefore accountability) set in.

 

I felt used and abandoned for months. Lately though, I am seeing it differently. I really took a person and wrote a whole personality on him. Then when it did not play out as I expected, I was destroyed. But he showed me who he was way back in the beginning. There were many times in the beginning I saw the real person but I chose to ignore it and saw him through rose colored glasses. Some was from him, as he did feed me a bunch of whoa is me crap, but some was me as I took something he said and put my own spin on it, generally in his favor, enabling him to be the victim he was portraying himself to be.

 

He said I love you a lot, constantly. But its all meaningless. In the end he only loves himself. That said when he would not say it two weeks ago, it finally gave me the strength to pull back and break contact. I know he does not realize it as he's been emailing me. But I can ignore them now. I used to feel bad - because we loved each other. Now I do not feel bad. Not at all.

[MidnightBlue1980]

Just curious as to why it matters if the MM says this or not? They may love during the A and after but over time feelings change. There was a time I thought I loved my xOM. Now looking back I loved how he made me feel not necessarily him. I have no feeling of 'love' towards him now. He is a non entity and a part of my past I don't really care to remember anymore.

 

It matters because Sunshine and Ronnie still love them. I wanted to hear him say it too and I was so upset he would not say it. It validates the whole thing. Without love, what the heck are any of us doing in these things? Are we just masochistic? That is my take. But once he would not say it, I was set free. I realized the whole thing started because he told me he loved me. A lot of us here, we just want to be loved.

[Lobe]

~runs over and gives midnight a high five~

[Chica80]

Think of every romantic movie about an affair and how the closing scene plays out when an affair ends with the wayward returning to their spouse. In one version, the WS says to the AP, "I love you but the fates are keeping us apart and I will carry with me forever an undying, unquenchable love for you and wonder until my death bed what we could have had in a different time and place..." In the other, the WS says to the BS, "I love you, I have always loved you, and I will spend the rest of my life making it up to you, my one and only true love..."

 

The line spoken last before the lights fade and the curtain closes determines who "won" in a way. I get it.

 

Your post made me laugh so hard!!! It's stupid but so true....it's just my own issues I'm dealing with.

 

Abandonment validation self worth.

It's part of the reasons for the A. Also what keeps me stuck in a sense.

[Chica80]

It matters because Sunshine and Ronnie still love them. I wanted to hear him say it too and I was so upset he would not say it. It validates the whole thing. Without love, what the heck are any of us doing in these things? Are we just masochistic? That is my take. But once he would not say it, I was set free. I realized the whole thing started because he told me he loved me. A lot of us here, we just want to be loved.

 

Yes midnight!!! Yes! If not love then WTF. What's the point?

 

There are small little clicks in my head of things that make sense. Then things that don't.

 

Like was I just easy prey, or easy to spot. And not to put it all on him I made choices. But what's the draw....why me why him. Because if I think this is love and you tell me it's not then really I have no idea what is. What is it supposed to be like? What does healthy look like?

Edited August 8, 2016 by Sunshinechica

[Lobe]

Your post made me laugh so hard!!! It's stupid but so true....it's just my own issues I'm dealing with.

 

Abandonment validation self worth.

It's part of the reasons for the A. Also what keeps me stuck in a sense.

 

I'm pretty sure this is what WH's xOW is stuck on. In the same email where she accused me of driving my husband off she also congratulated me on "winning." I was like, hold up, ladypart - I did not "win" because I was never in a competition in the first place. Furthermore, I actually served him with papers so he could go be with you and he STILL picked me, the person you were led to believe was so inadequate that fate brought you to him. So, YOU were the one who tried to win him over and sadly, the truth is, the OW is rarely "enough."

 

I can tell you from the BS's perspective it's frustrating to read, over and over and over, the "surprise" that APs feel when they are not picked in the pick-me dance. I can't imagine what that does to a person's esteem.

 

Edited to add: that is a result of the wayward's selfish and self-serving actions causing both the AP and the BS so much pain.

Edited August 8, 2016 by Lobe
adding

[ShatteredLady]

But as a bs it's totally soul destroying to know that there was ever a choice in the first place. Everyone looses. I've got my H but I've lost our love story & a whole lot more...

[Lobe]

But as a bs it's totally soul destroying to know that there was ever a choice in the first place. Everyone looses. I've got my H but I've lost our love story & a whole lot more...

 

Don't I know it. And our love story was seriously the cutest grossest thing ever, until it was sullied by his A. Every day that goes by and I wake up, roll over, and have to decide if I feel like snuggling up to or punching my sleeping husband in the balls. Most days I just get out of bed and keep moving.

[MidnightBlue1980]

I'm pretty sure this is what WH's xOW is stuck on. In the same email where she accused me of driving my husband off she also congratulated me on "winning." I was like, hold up, ladypart - I did not "win" because I was never in a competition in the first place. Furthermore, I actually served him with papers so he could go be with you and he STILL picked me, the person you were led to believe was so inadequate that fate brought you to him. So, YOU were the one who tried to win him over and sadly, the truth is, the OW is rarely "enough."

 

I can tell you from the BS's perspective it's frustrating to read, over and over and over, the "surprise" that APs feel when they are not picked in the pick-me dance. I can't imagine what that does to a person's esteem.

 

Edited to add: that is a result of the wayward's selfish and self-serving actions causing both the AP and the BS so much pain.

 

It does damage your self esteem, immensely.

 

I also see it from the other side. When I found out what my H was doing, I told him to pack his bags and go there. I said, lets get a divorce, obviously I am already doing my own thing with xMM. But he had zero intentions of going to OW. Said he was only there because things were so messed up between us.

 

And I know that is why xMM got involved with me. His W was not paying him attention. All these men, all they really want is attention from their mommies, whoops, I mean wives. But I had kids, a business and its all a competition. For xMM, his W put their daughter first and he wanted to be first.

 

The OW are just collateral damage in the MM quest to get attention from their wives. I used to feel really bad about this with xMM but over time it hurts less and less.

[MidnightBlue1980]

Because if I think this is love and you tell me it's not then really I have no idea what is. What is it supposed to be like? What does healthy look like?

 

What does love look like? It's when you can't decide what to order so your SO orders one of what you wanted, so you can eat both. It's when he saves the last glass of good wine for you and drinks the crap. It's when he sleeps on the couch because he is sick and coughing and you need sleep. It's when you are scared to fly and the guy drives 3000 miles with you and calls it an adventure - and you already bought plane tickets. It's when he watches 8 seasons of True Blood with you. It's when he lets you name the kids. It's when he comes out to pick your drunk butt up at 3am. It's when you both have soup and he gives you all the seafood out of his, because you love seafood and he has broth.

 

What does love not look like? It does not look like crying, or pain or hours on LS when you should be working. It's not gifts or stolen moments. It's not sex. And it's not "I would leave my wife for you if not for (fill in the blank)."

[ladydesigner]

It matters because Sunshine and Ronnie still love them. I wanted to hear him say it too and I was so upset he would not say it. It validates the whole thing. Without love, what the heck are any of us doing in these things? Are we just masochistic? That is my take. But once he would not say it, I was set free. I realized the whole thing started because he told me he loved me. A lot of us here, we just want to be loved.

 

I know ladies I know. It just idk it saddens me to see people so hung up on these MM (idiots) I'm sorry I am so jaded.

[Ronnie33]

People who feel used and abandoned, I imagine. It's likely easier to romanticize it than let disillusionment (and therefore accountability) set in.

 

This is it exactly. If it wasn't love, then why the hell did I sacrifice my morals and self respect for three years and why the hell did he cheat on the "woman he loves" for the last two.

 

It's the need to know it wasn't all for nothing.

[MidnightBlue1980]

People who feel used and abandoned, I imagine. It's likely easier to romanticize it than let disillusionment (and therefore accountability) set in.

 

This is it exactly. If it wasn't love, then why the hell did I sacrifice my morals and self respect for three years and why the hell did he cheat on the "woman he loves" for the last two.

 

It's the need to know it wasn't all for nothing.

 

Well, you loved him. I loved him. I still do love him. I just chose to love myself more. Clique' I know.

 

Its never all for nothing. There is always a lesson to be learned. What did you learn?

[Chica80]

So many things to respond to. Lobe and shattered. I'm sorry for all of your immense pain. I have never seen his BS as evil. I see her as innocent. I would actually like her if I wasn't so jealous and felt there was a competition. Shes very sweet and very nice. For that I feel so guilty. Knowing that he married her and their whole first year of marriage he has been unfaithful. Not that it makes it ok it's never ok. But what possible "excuse" could you have. It wasn't oh my wife doesn't pay attention too me or the kids or we don't have sex anymore.....you are just starting your life! With the person you say you love.

 

So from what Ronnie stated, ya I want to know it wasn't all for nothing. That I didn't compromise who I am what I believe for nothing. Starting the A for me was a wakeup a wakeup to change. I want change I want more. Would my marriage have still fell apart w/out A. Prob not. But I would also prob be in the same unhealthy cycle I was in before.....now just in a new unhealthy cycle.

[Lobe]

It's the need to know it wasn't all for nothing.

 

I've yet to figure out how an affair benefits anyone, including the wayward, who in the long run usually ends up losing BOTH the BS and the AP.

 

If the WS stays with the BS, the BS wonders, "Why wasn't I enough for WS that he had to find someone else?" and the AP wonders, "Why wasn't I good enough to keep WS when he said he was so unhappy with BS?" The BS will always have unanswered questions about the A and will never again have the same innocent trust of the pre-affair marriage. The truly remorseful WS ends up having to live with the shame and pain and guilt of what he did to his family and deal with years of trying to regain the trust and respect of those dearest to him, while the BS has to live down the pitying stares of people who think the BS is weak for taking their WS back. The AP wonders if it was all just a sham and feels used and abandoned while the BS wonders if the WS would still be having the affair if it hadn't been discovered or disclosed.

 

Meanwhile, if the WS leaves the marriage it's with at best half of what they had before the affair, decreasing the quality of life for the BS and the children and bringing not all that much to the table in the AP's corner. The kids might question if the BS really was unlovable or if the WS didn't love the BS enough and figure out how to cope with someone who isn't their parent as a part of their nuclear family in order to have a relationship with their wayward parent. The AP gets to wonder if the WS actually left the BS for them or if the BS simply sent the WS packing and the AP is a convenient fall back. AP always has to wonder if that saying, "If WS will cheat with you they will cheat on you," is true or not. Worst of all, they get to live down the judgmental stares of those people who know the relationship began as an A and don't approve.

 

Even if the WS is a narcissistic asshat and regardless of what the WS does, both the AP and the BS end up with a lifetime of self-esteem and trust issues to wade through.

 

I could go on but really, it's just all sh*t. Is it too early for wine?

Edited August 8, 2016 by Lobe
neutralizing pronouns...

[ladydesigner]

I've yet to figure out how an affair benefits anyone, including the wayward, who in the long run usually ends up losing BOTH the BS and the AP.

 

If the WS stays with the BS, the BS wonders, "Why wasn't I enough for WS that he had to find someone else?" and the AP wonders, "Why wasn't I good enough to keep WS when he said he was so unhappy with BS?" The BS will always have unanswered questions about the A and will never again have the same innocent trust of the pre-affair marriage. The truly remorseful WS ends up having to live with the shame and pain and guilt of what he did to his family and deal with years of trying to regain the trust and respect of those dearest to him, while the BS has to live down the pitying stares of people who think the BS is weak for taking their WS back. The AP wonders if it was all just a sham and feels used and abandoned while the BS wonders if the WS would still be having the affair if it hadn't been discovered or disclosed.

 

Meanwhile, if the WS leaves the marriage it's with at best half of what they had before the affair, decreasing the quality of life for the BS and the children and bringing not all that much to the table in the AP's corner. The kids might question if the BS really was unlovable or if the WS didn't love the BS enough and figure out how to cope with someone who isn't their parent as a part of their nuclear family in order to have a relationship with their wayward parent. The AP gets to wonder if the WS actually left the BS for them or if the BS simply sent the WS packing and the AP is a convenient fall back. AP always has to wonder if that saying, "If WS will cheat with you they will cheat on you," is true or not. Worst of all, they get to live down the judgmental stares of those people who know the relationship began as an A and don't approve.

 

Even if the WS is a narcissistic asshat and regardless of what the WS does, both the AP and the BS end up with a lifetime of self-esteem and trust issues to wade through.

 

I could go on but really, it's just all sh*t. Is it too early for wine?

 

Right?!?! That's why I was asking why any of it even matters! It seems like it is all for not for each and every side. Great question Lobe, who is it that REALLY benefits from an A?

[MidnightBlue1980]

Right?!?! That's why I was asking why any of it even matters! It seems like it is all for not for each and every side. Great question Lobe, who is it that REALLY benefits from an A?

 

The man benefits because he has it all, the complete package - wife, kids, house, dog, society approved existence with the sexy, mysterious OW who brings drama and excitement to his life. But then he loses when it ends because he has to go back to a life which is now dull whereas the woman tends to be thankful for the lack of drama. Afterall, she really only wanted love, not drama.

 

This is my take.

[Chica80]

Midnight you have given me alot to think about today. Thank you