"Destabilization Phase" and your thoughts and experience

[MidnightBlue1980]

Closure in an A is a bit of a unicorn, Ronnie. I've been reading these boards and the lingering questions are usually the same - why wasn't I enough? Why did you string me along? Do you still love me? Was I just a toy? Did any of this mean anything to you? The answers will hurt whether they are lies: "It's not that you're not enough I just can't because ~insert excuse about circumstance with wife and kids~ and ~insert something about misaligned stars or bad cosmic timing~, I didn't string you along and I want you to know I will always love you. You will mean more to me than you'll ever know and I hope you never forget what we had together..." or the truth: "No one could replace my wife - I married her, didn't I? Haven't left her yet, have I? I'm sorry, but I strung you along because you let me. I'm in love the way you make me feel but I'm not in love with YOU in the marrying forever after sort of way, and even though you weren't a toy, I knew nothing would ever come of our affair. I hate to say it, but I just didn't end it because I didn't want to stop feeling the way you make me feel. You're better off forgetting I ever existed."

 

The fact he's willing to meet with you means he isn't done and that means the door is still open. You may not get closure, but you could get the last word: Text him you changed your mind, that you have too much respect for yourself to go through the pain and agony of one last goodbye, and go black.

 

"Tis better to ignore than be ignored." ~Midnight, 2016

 

I was watching a movie last night and the girl said, "there is no spoon". And I thought, oh my God! Lobe!

 

I have to agree with the above. I was forced to break no contact because he had directly emailed me and asked me a question related to my position and our organization. The simple act of answering him unraveled me.

 

I confronted him today that I knew he was (again) lying to me, pretending to me that he was considering leaving when meanwhile he is taking over my position in October. So he will be there at least a year. He said he thought it was a secret. I felt so stupid - such an idiot - I fabricated this whole relationship in my mind from - seriously? him saying I love you and some bad sex. Why on earth do I think I have a special bond with this guy? Do I need a building to fall on my head?

 

He wrote a paragraph about how I should not make any rash decisions about leaving, what a great asset I am, networker. I could throw up. I'd think he'd want me to leave. His wife does not mind my presence there forever? He's probably telling her I won't leave.

 

Regarding Lobe's post, she is on the money.

 

I am just feeling so stupid.

[MidnightBlue1980]

"Tis better to ignore than be ignored."

 

I know. Do as I say, not as I do. This is why I am going to get out of the situation in the fall. My H thinks I should not run but I'm having trouble breaking my patterns.

[Chica80]

Wow so many things going on this morning.

 

First LOBE your post I think summarized it perfectly.

Ronnie it's going to hurt no matter what he says no matter the answer he gives you. This is my "teenager self" talking but the one who hurts less wins. Im with Midnight. It's your time. Tell him you love him tell him to call off the engagement tell him you want to be with him. Not beg not plead not cry just matter of fact. I think you know what his answer will be. Everything that LOBE said.......

 

But that may be your closure....because no matter what he says you spoke and said what you had to say...

 

Do what you got to do. Know that it won't bring you any less pain, but actually more pain and know that we are here to listen after.

 

Don't kiss and dont!! Have sex that will be a bonus for him but a knife through your heart.

 

Love and HUGS

[Lobe]

I know. Do as I say, not as I do. This is why I am going to get out of the situation in the fall. My H thinks I should not run but I'm having trouble breaking my patterns.

 

New job sounds fabulous. You're not running away, you're running towards something new. You go girl.

 

(and seriously, he's taking over your position but lies about it? what a piece of work)

[MidnightBlue1980]

Wow so many things going on this morning.

 

First LOBE your post I think summarized it perfectly.

Ronnie it's going to hurt no matter what he says no matter the answer he gives you. This is my "teenager self" talking but the one who hurts less wins. Im with Midnight. It's your time. Tell him you love him tell him to call off the engagement tell him you want to be with him. Not beg not plead not cry just matter of fact. I think you know what his answer will be. Everything that LOBE said.......

 

But that may be your closure....because no matter what he says you spoke and said what you had to say...

 

Do what you got to do. Know that it won't bring you any less pain, but actually more pain and know that we are here to listen after.

 

Don't kiss and dont!! Have sex that will be a bonus for him but a knife through your heart.

 

Love and HUGS

 

I agree. I would directly ask him if he would end the engagement. In my situation I asked if he would leave her - I asked this because I was sitting in a hotel room, my husband and I had a huge fight, and I wanted to know where I stood. He did not even pretend, he said no, he could not leave her, we just had to continue like this, I had to go home and keep my mouth shut about him in my house. So I said, it's over then. This affair is over. 2 days later I saw him in person and same thing. He just stared at his hands. I will say, I did not cry, beg or plead. I kissed him on the cheek, said Merry Christmas, got out of the car and drove away.

 

Granted, the last 7 months, I basically made myself look pathetic but I never asked for anything again from him, except the endless questions. I will say if I could go back, I would have not done all this pathetic behavior. But on the other hand, I have no confusion about maybe if I said this or that.

 

Believe me, I said it all.

 

But don't kiss him. That haunted me for a long time, my last chance. But honestly, now I don't recall what it was even like.

[MidnightBlue1980]

New job sounds fabulous. You're not running away, you're running towards something new. You go girl.

 

(and seriously, he's taking over your position but lies about it? what a piece of work)

 

I'm being vague on purpose although at this point I've given away enough info, people could identify me. But who would be reading this and my husband knows, my friends know, his wife knows. I don't even care anymore at this point.

 

It's not a job exactly. I have my own business. It's like a group I get business from - like a chamber, sort of. He could leave as he is only sent there by his boss. He gets a salary, I'm self employed. I get a lot of business and I can't just suddenly stop going, we need the money. But I can look into a different location. This guy would need to approve my switching locations - the irony is not lost on me. I would think he would want me to leave. His wife cannot be happy with us together forever there and I'm obviously a fatal attraction. I should come with a warning label. Flammable.

 

For a long time I thought I couldn't leave as I'd have no reason to see him again. But I'm feeling better about that now.

[ladydesigner]

I was watching a movie last night and the girl said, "there is no spoon". And I thought, oh my God! Lobe!

 

I have to agree with the above. I was forced to break no contact because he had directly emailed me and asked me a question related to my position and our organization. The simple act of answering him unraveled me.

 

I confronted him today that I knew he was (again) lying to me, pretending to me that he was considering leaving when meanwhile he is taking over my position in October. So he will be there at least a year. He said he thought it was a secret. I felt so stupid - such an idiot - I fabricated this whole relationship in my mind from - seriously? him saying I love you and some bad sex. Why on earth do I think I have a special bond with this guy? Do I need a building to fall on my head?

 

He wrote a paragraph about how I should not make any rash decisions about leaving, what a great asset I am, networker. I could throw up. I'd think he'd want me to leave. His wife does not mind my presence there forever? He's probably telling her I won't leave.

 

Regarding Lobe's post, she is on the money.

 

I am just feeling so stupid.

 

(((MidnightBlue1980))) I remember thinking the same thing for the longest time after my A had ended with xOM. It felt like it took forever to get over him and I had nothing special either except that he treated me better than my WH did and told me things that reeled me in emotionally and that was missing from my M at the time. The sex with my xOM I couldn't even compare it to my WH my WH was so much better

 

I think I was grieving my own fantasy.

[Ronnie33]

I don't have to ask him ladies, i already know. When I left my husband I asked him what he wanted because I was going to be single soon and I knew he would hate that. He said "I'm getting engaged soon, I was going to tell you" I felt like the wind had been knocke out of me. I was so upset and asked him when did he decide this and am did he ever really give a crap about me and blah blah. He said "I always cared for you and I still do but our timing was wrong" then I said to him "you weren't supposed to fall in love with her and he said you were supposed to leave sooner"

 

And that was that ladies. There's nothing to ask, he's marrying because he wants to.

 

I will not sleep with him.

[MidnightBlue1980]

I don't have to ask him ladies, i already know. When I left my husband I asked him what he wanted because I was going to be single soon and I knew he would hate that. He said "I'm getting engaged soon, I was going to tell you" I felt like the wind had been knocke out of me. I was so upset and asked him when did he decide this and am did he ever really give a crap about me and blah blah. He said "I always cared for you and I still do but our timing was wrong" then I said to him "you weren't supposed to fall in love with her and he said you were supposed to leave sooner"

 

And that was that ladies. There's nothing to ask, he's marrying because he wants to.

 

I will not sleep with him.

 

Okay, I get the timing but he could still end it. It ain't over till its over. People end engagements all the time. The fact that he still sees you is proof. This is all very tragic, unnecessarily tragic.

 

There is not a lot of hope for his marriage. I would expect him to not let you go easily. Don't waste more time.

 

I'm just curious, does he say what he wants. In my situation, xMM said, he wanted our love to flourish like a butterfly till it was strong enough that he felt he could leave her.

 

I'm crying typing this. Who says that?

[MidnightBlue1980]

(((MidnightBlue1980))) I remember thinking the same thing for the longest time after my A had ended with xOM. It felt like it took forever to get over him and I had nothing special either except that he treated me better than my WH did and told me things that reeled me in emotionally and that was missing from my M at the time. The sex with my xOM I couldn't even compare it to my WH my WH was so much better

 

I think I was grieving my own fantasy.

 

I did not realize you were both a OW and a BS. So am I and yes, the sex is a million times better with H.

 

I can't remember, are you still with your H?

[imperfectangel]

Aw MB, they know what to say and when to say it don't they? It WILL get easier

[ladydesigner]

I did not realize you were both a OW and a BS. So am I and yes, the sex is a million times better with H.

 

I can't remember, are you still with your H?

 

Yes I first came to LS as a MOW it has been 8 years since my A ended. I am still with my WH but it is sort of limbo between us. He never seems to improve while i am always looking to improve myself and how I view and react to things. It's a constant work in progress.

[MidnightBlue1980]

Yes I first came to LS as a MOW it has been 8 years since my A ended. I am still with my WH but it is sort of limbo between us. He never seems to improve while i am always looking to improve myself and how I view and react to things. It's a constant work in progress.

 

8 years....omg. I hope you feel better. When did your H stray? After?

 

I am trying to move on. I just told heard back from xMM, he said, it sounds like your mind is made up to leave. It's unbelievably heart wrenching. I feel like I am doing the right thing for everyone - myself, my H and even his wife. This has to end. I will not continue to exist in this limbo state. He is getting everything he wants - his marriage, seeing me - whereas I live in hell.

 

He had the chance in December - my H and I almost split after the open marriage disaster. xMM did not want me. He did not want me. And I said to him now. This is not my fault. I am not the bad guy, a quitter.

 

He would have me spend years of life in this hell. I...Have...To...Get...Out

[ladydesigner]

8 years....omg. I hope you feel better. When did your H stray? After?

 

I am trying to move on. I just told heard back from xMM, he said, it sounds like your mind is made up to leave. It's unbelievably heart wrenching. I feel like I am doing the right thing for everyone - myself, my H and even his wife. This has to end. I will not continue to exist in this limbo state. He is getting everything he wants - his marriage, seeing me - whereas I live in hell.

 

He had the chance in December - my H and I almost split after the open marriage disaster. xMM did not want me. He did not want me. And I said to him now. This is not my fault. I am not the bad guy, a quitter.

 

He would have me spend years of life in this hell. I...Have...To...Get...Out

 

I am completely recovered from my A but not my WH's A's ( and it's not really the A's that bothers me as much as his character). I had my own A a month after I discovered my WH's first infidelity.

 

Ugh your MM is guilt tripping you. He knows you want to end it and he is stunned at how strong you are. My WH comes on the strongest when I am at my strongest. It was that way with his MOW from what I read of their texts and what she told me.

[Lobe]

he wanted our love to flourish like a butterfly till it was strong enough that he felt he could leave her.

 

I'm crying typing this. Who says that?

 

A completely manipulative assh*le who wants the milk but not the cow.

[Adoraxx]

In my situation, xMM said, he wanted our love to flourish like a butterfly till it was strong enough that he felt he could leave her.

 

I'm crying typing this. Who says that?

 

((((((((( HUGS ))))))))) They truly do say the stupidest things don't they... Build you up to break you down huh... Ugh.

 

My xMM told me (before he disappeared for seven months): "If I wouldn't be married, I would be with you now.... I would marry you if I was single, REALLY." Blah blah blah. As if that would make me any happier! He also lied: "we'll still be friends... I'll come see you... I'll email you" . More blah blah blah.

Or what about: "I love YOU. You are my sun". (?!)

[MidnightBlue1980]

((((((((( HUGS ))))))))) They truly do say the stupidest things don't they... Build you up to break you down huh... Ugh.

 

My xMM told me (before he disappeared for seven months): "If I wouldn't be married, I would be with you now.... I would marry you if I was single, REALLY." Blah blah blah. As if that would make me any happier! He also lied: "we'll still be friends... I'll come see you... I'll email you" . More blah blah blah.

Or what about: "I love YOU. You are my sun". (?!)

 

These guys. So here is my update.

 

Yesterday was a bad day for me. He was emailing me, and I finally came out with that I knew he was not telling me he was taking over my position and pretending to think about leaving. He admitted he (again) had lied but in his defense, he thought it was not public knowledge. This is not the president of the united states here, its a stupid group. Anyway so I said I was going to look for a different chapter when my term was up, he thought I should not leave and so on. I may have said this here already, not sure.

 

But then as usual, his communication left me confused. To me, I cannot tell his intentions. He said all this stuff but then retreats behind the friends thing. You all know this dance, I don't need to write a novel. I was messed in the head yesterday and this morning

 

So I asked him this morning via email if we could talk for a few minutes next week after the meeting. He wanted to call me today. I was really surprised, we have not spoken on the phone since it ended. In any event, I said not a good idea. So I just asked my question right now. I said I am confused. He says he is working on his marriage, so I pull back and he pursues. I said, what is going on? Mixed messages.

 

His response - "I'm sorry if I am confusing you. I will try to be very clear and say that I am not pursuing you in any way. I am only being friendly to you; that’s all. I understand that we are both members of the XXXX and we will see each other on a weekly basis. If you need to pull back, I will respect that."

 

So naturally I felt stupid/hurt/angry at myself and started to draft a reply about him doing this to me 3 times now and so on, I'm sure we all write these guys these huge sob emails, don't we ladies? So typical of us. But while I was writing my super emotional email about all the pain and suffering he has inflicted on me, and how he should never talk to me again, I was taking so long that I got this:

 

"I hope my response wasn’t too harsh. I didn’t mean it to be. I’m just trying to be honest with you."

 

Then I had a lightbulb moment. He is expecting one of my 13 paragraph emails about my feelings to which he will then respond, "I understand. I didn't mean to hurt you". But what if this time, I did something unexpected? What if I just did nothing? Not say anything at all. Literally did not respond and act like I don't have a care in the world next week. That would be so much cooler, don't you think?

 

So that is what I am going to do.

[Chica80]

These guys. So here is my update.

 

Yesterday was a bad day for me. He was emailing me, and I finally came out with that I knew he was not telling me he was taking over my position and pretending to think about leaving. He admitted he (again) had lied but in his defense, he thought it was not public knowledge. This is not the president of the united states here, its a stupid group. Anyway so I said I was going to look for a different chapter when my term was up, he thought I should not leave and so on. I may have said this here already, not sure.

 

But then as usual, his communication left me confused. To me, I cannot tell his intentions. He said all this stuff but then retreats behind the friends thing. You all know this dance, I don't need to write a novel. I was messed in the head yesterday and this morning

 

So I asked him this morning via email if we could talk for a few minutes next week after the meeting. He wanted to call me today. I was really surprised, we have not spoken on the phone since it ended. In any event, I said not a good idea. So I just asked my question right now. I said I am confused. He says he is working on his marriage, so I pull back and he pursues. I said, what is going on? Mixed messages.

 

His response - "I'm sorry if I am confusing you. I will try to be very clear and say that I am not pursuing you in any way. I am only being friendly to you; that’s all. I understand that we are both members of the XXXX and we will see each other on a weekly basis. If you need to pull back, I will respect that."

 

So naturally I felt stupid/hurt/angry at myself and started to draft a reply about him doing this to me 3 times now and so on, I'm sure we all write these guys these huge sob emails, don't we ladies? So typical of us. But while I was writing my super emotional email about all the pain and suffering he has inflicted on me, and how he should never talk to me again, I was taking so long that I got this:

 

"I hope my response wasn’t too harsh. I didn’t mean it to be. I’m just trying to be honest with you."

 

Then I had a lightbulb moment. He is expecting one of my 13 paragraph emails about my feelings to which he will then respond, "I understand. I didn't mean to hurt you". But what if this time, I did something unexpected? What if I just did nothing? Not say anything at all. Literally did not respond and act like I don't have a care in the world next week. That would be so much cooler, don't you think?

 

So that is what I am going to do.

 

 

Yes omg!!! I know these long emails the angry text!! Yes it's a cycle. "He who cares less wins" it's childish but right now it helps get through this.

 

If you can stay "friends" then he doesn't have to feel like a complete a hole. And/or keep options open. Who knows?

 

I think your new option. Is a good plan stay focused!

[Chica80]

So I have not talked or text.. yesterday I did go on to look at text. (It tells me the last time he "was seen") I know but he did look at it and I hadn't yet at that point in days. So far it's been a week NC. This is usually when I would text or talk to him. But I'm trying not to. I think to myself one small change at a time. One day at a time....

[imperfectangel]

Lol I am famous to him for those emails! So embarrassing when you realise you've hit send and he's actually read it. Always made me wanna die lol anyway, I think they love them. What a great way to forever have a ego boost. Don't reply if you can help it and walk in next week as if nothing has even happened, maybe even with a bounce in your step if you can manage it.

 

They always do this. Last time I saw MM it was all, you're gorgeous, I want you, I'm not happy being married then half an hour later, I'll always be married, blah blah blah

 

I have the luxury of not seeing mm regularly but if I did I prepare for the next time. Get your hair did, nails done etc it's time we all started looking after ourselves (((hugs)))

[MidnightBlue1980]

Lol I am famous to him for those emails! So embarrassing when you realise you've hit send and he's actually read it. Always made me wanna die lol anyway, I think they love them. What a great way to forever have a ego boost. Don't reply if you can help it and walk in next week as if nothing has even happened, maybe even with a bounce in your step if you can manage it.

 

They always do this. Last time I saw MM it was all, you're gorgeous, I want you, I'm not happy being married then half an hour later, I'll always be married, blah blah blah

 

I have the luxury of not seeing mm regularly but if I did I prepare for the next time. Get your hair did, nails done etc it's time we all started looking after ourselves (((hugs)))

 

Yes - I can write emails about my pain and suffering which could be published on the front page of the New York Times, given the amount of time and effort I spend on them. Meanwhile he confuses "your" and "you're".

 

I think they like them too. It must feel good knowing someone is going nuts over you. And you have to be the right kind of nuts - not the "I'd outside your house" nuts but the "I love you, I need you, please bless me with a 5 word text" nuts.

 

I like your advice. I am 100% not going to respond. I admit I was going to when I got that second email. I am totally not, no matter what he writes me - even if it is about our business purpose.

 

He who cares less, wins. I like that!

[MidnightBlue1980]

So I have not talked or text.. yesterday I did go on to look at text. (It tells me the last time he "was seen") I know but he did look at it and I hadn't yet at that point in days. So far it's been a week NC. This is usually when I would text or talk to him. But I'm trying not to. I think to myself one small change at a time. One day at a time....

 

I am not familiar with this app. I did have something in an athletic app where I could see literally see when he was awake, asleep, moving around. I deleted him finally as my friend on it. I was obsessed with his movements. It was nuts.

 

Stay strong!

[MidnightBlue1980]

I am wondering how Ronnie's lunch went. I need a life! haha

[imperfectangel]

Yes - I can write emails about my pain and suffering which could be published on the front page of the New York Times, given the amount of time and effort I spend on them. Meanwhile he confuses "your" and "you're".

 

I think they like them too. It must feel good knowing someone is going nuts over you. And you have to be the right kind of nuts - not the "I'd outside your house" nuts but the "I love you, I need you, please bless me with a 5 word text" nuts.

 

I like your advice. I am 100% not going to respond. I admit I was going to when I got that second email. I am totally not, no matter what he writes me - even if it is about our business purpose.

 

He who cares less, wins. I like that!

 

 

I was all back in my a, this week mm has been away playing happy families so this thread along with no contact from him anyway has made me wanna go nc again. I hope he just doesn't contact me at this point. I do want us to legitimately be together but like he said he'll always be married and I told him repeatedly that I don't want an affair so what's the point anyway?

 

Lol at your and you're getting mixed up. My mm does that too. His typing mistakes annoy me lol

[imperfectangel]

I am wondering how Ronnie's lunch went. I need a life! haha

 

Me too I hope she's ok