If it takes a village.....

[JLeaks3]

If it takes a village.....

 

We hear it all the time when it comes to parenting. While there are so many opinions about parenting (co-sleep, cry it out, breastfeeding vs formula, etc.) there is still a general respect for the each other's children and when we see a child in danger, it's only common decency to go and help out, like if I saw a lost child, I would make sure that they found their parent and not let him wander off. It's just the right thing to do. And I would certainly hope that it's a general accepted truth that one shouldn't ever take someone else's child.

 

So if it takes a village when it comes to general welfare of our kids, then why is it that we don't have the same attitude to doing OUR PART when it comes to protecting other people's marriages and their vows? As in, I have read over and over again here, generally from the OW/OM side about how they don't feel "accountable" to the BS because it is only the WS that is responsible for his or her own marriage. I find this so insulting. Like here is this interloper who knowingly acts against someone else's marriage, and so easily absolves themselves of any sense of accountability because they aren't the ones that made those vows with them?

 

I mean, is it not as absurd as a drunk driver going to the widow of the person they killed saying, "I didn't personally hit you with my car, so I'm only responsible and accountable to your dead husband." Does anyone else struggle with this?

 

I have also read that the responsibility of protecting the marriage is solely on those in the marriage. Maybe so, but I certainly feel a responsibility as a human being to not interfere or have an affair with someone else's husband BECAUSE IT'S THE ONLY RIGHT THING I HAVE CONTROL OF as it relates to other people's vows and marriages. I may have not said their vows, but I have enough respect for them as human beings to not cause them pain and suffering at my hands.

 

I'm rambling. But as I work through my husband's EA and the damaged pieces of what an otherwise extraordinary marriage we had and work to rebuild, I am really struggling to find empathy for OW/OM and the attitude that people have that they have no obligation to respect the BS because of their selfish desire for someone that was never and should have never been theirs to begin with. It's precisely the act of detaching yourself from someone in such a way and prescribing to the notion that you have no "responsibility" for the pain your actions create because you don't directly interact with that person that allows for the interloper to continue on the selfish and destructive path being complicit in the utter ruin of someone else's whole life and marriage.

 

To be clear, my husband has taken responsibility for his own actions and I hold him accountable for what he has done to fracture our marriage. But now, I feel a growing anger towards his OW for her selfish actions and complete disregard for my marriage. It will not subside and I know it's unhealthy. I'm struggling.

[wmacbride]

If it takes a village.....

 

We hear it all the time when it comes to parenting. While there are so many opinions about parenting (co-sleep, cry it out, breastfeeding vs formula, etc.) there is still a general respect for the each other's children and when we see a child in danger, it's only common decency to go and help out, like if I saw a lost child, I would make sure that they found their parent and not let him wander off. It's just the right thing to do. And I would certainly hope that it's a general accepted truth that one shouldn't ever take someone else's child.

 

So if it takes a village when it comes to general welfare of our kids, then why is it that we don't have the same attitude to doing OUR PART when it comes to protecting other people's marriages and their vows? As in, I have read over and over again here, generally from the OW/OM side about how they don't feel "accountable" to the BS because it is only the WS that is responsible for his or her own marriage. I find this so insulting. Like here is this interloper who knowingly acts against someone else's marriage, and so easily absolves themselves of any sense of accountability because they aren't the ones that made those vows with them?

 

I mean, is it not as absurd as a drunk driver going to the widow of the person they killed saying, "I didn't personally hit you with my car, so I'm only responsible and accountable to your dead husband." Does anyone else struggle with this?

 

I have also read that the responsibility of protecting the marriage is solely on those in the marriage. Maybe so, but I certainly feel a responsibility as a human being to not interfere or have an affair with someone else's husband BECAUSE IT'S THE ONLY RIGHT THING I HAVE CONTROL OF as it relates to other people's vows and marriages. I may have not said their vows, but I have enough respect for them as human beings to not cause them pain and suffering at my hands.

 

I'm rambling. But as I work through my husband's EA and the damaged pieces of what an otherwise extraordinary marriage we had and work to rebuild, I am really struggling to find empathy for OW/OM and the attitude that people have that they have no obligation to respect the BS because of their selfish desire for someone that was never and should have never been theirs to begin with. It's precisely the act of detaching yourself from someone in such a way and prescribing to the notion that you have no "responsibility" for the pain your actions create because you don't directly interact with that person that allows for the interloper to continue on the selfish and destructive path being complicit in the utter ruin of someone else's whole life and marriage.

 

To be clear, my husband has taken responsibility for his own actions and I hold him accountable for what he has done to fracture our marriage. But now, I feel a growing anger towards his OW for her selfish actions and complete disregard for my marriage. It will not subside and I know it's unhealthy. I'm struggling.

 

Trying to force yourself not to be angry often backfires by just making you even angrier.

 

Instead, try looking at the reasons why you are angry and address them individually. I know a lot of people disagree with me, but I think it's okay to let yourself be angry, so long as it doesn't fester. I say this as giving yourself permission to feel an emotion helps you to move forward and away from it.

[katielee]

While I don't harbor anger for the APs, I do hold them responsible. If you know someone is married, yes YOU OWE THEM the decency to respect that marriage, no matter what shape it's in. There is the girl code, the mom code and the HUMAN BEING CODE. Honor it.

[amaysngrace]

I'm not sure but I think people hook up with someone's partner because they need that kind of external validation.

 

A mentally healthier person wouldn't go there so in some regard I think people who go with someone else's partner are broken in a way.

 

It'd be hard to understand that mentality unless you yourself are broken. But this is just a guess.

[dichotomy]

I get you completely.

 

Without explain my story and wife's history with me and before she met me - One of the things (among many) that disturbed me about my wife was that she did not care one bit about MM's wife's feelings - and only a little about the kids. She also took the view (about her single mistress days) that she was not breaking her vows to anyone - and it was not her marriage she was hurting - it was 100% the ownership of the MM.

 

She did eventually with one of her MM's break it off saying she did not want for the MM's kids to blame her for the divorce (which happened a year after she broke PA with him but not full NC). So she felt she wanted no blame from the kids - which is good - but she never really felt bad for her involvement - until I got her into therapy.

 

However this is common among cheaters. Often its enough for them to express regret to their own spouse - let alone if the AP's partner - if the AP was married.

[Lobe]

I'm rambling. But as I work through my husband's EA and the damaged pieces of what an otherwise extraordinary marriage we had and work to rebuild, I am really struggling to find empathy for OW/OM and the attitude that people have that they have no obligation to rTo be clear, my husband has taken responsibility for his own actions and I hold him accountable for what he has done to fracture our marriage. But now, I feel a growing anger towards his OW for her selfish actions and complete disregard for my marriage. It will not subside and I know it's unhealthy. I'm struggling.

 

It's natural to project your anger towards the OW - it allows you to preserve your relationship with WH. While I don't think APs are blameless and I don't condone their actions, I also think it's important to acknowledge that they were in an affair fog, too, in no small art based on lies that WS said...

[heartwhole]

I struggle too, and it's been 14 months since DD for me. I've also thought of the fall-out of an affair being like an accident caused by a drunk driver. Of course, those behind the wheel claim they didn't mean to hurt anyone, but it was unreasonable to think you could drink and drive and not hurt anyone. And innocents pay the price.

 

Of course, it's also not reasonable to expect all 3 billion women in the world to be as principled as you are. There will always be those who for lack of [judgment, self-esteem, better options, fill in the blank] will be willing to have an affair with married men. So ultimately my concern must be with the person whose judgment and self-esteem and coping skills I thought were sound but discovered to be otherwise . . . my husband.

 

For me personally, I really don't have anger towards the OW for her part in the affair. I feel sorry for her that she thought it was a smart move. I do have anger towards her for publicly Tweeting that my husband should be strong enough to let go (of our marriage!) and that she would never give up on him. Girlfriend, don't be putting that stuff on Twitter if you don't want to elicit my eternal ire. But as for the affair, it should never have been an option for her if my husband had had his head on straight. I truly do not blame her for it. I do think it was some weird combination of hubris and lack of self-esteem on display, and I would never have believed her a fit person to be in my children's lives, but I can't pretend I could have controlled that in case of a divorce.

 

What confuses me the most about participating in 99% of affairs is that one is acting against one's own interests. Sure, there's limerence and sex and fun for a brief period, but it inevitably blows up and wreaks destruction far greater than the sum of the "good" stuff. Although I believe in social contracts and the greater good and the golden rule, I can kind of understand why people do things like underreport their income on their taxes (talked to some dad on the playground who admitted to this like it was no big deal the other day). But I can't understand why people do things that are very likely to be injurious to themselves and others and very unlikely to result in happily ever after. But hey, that's just me, your risk-averse, principled, long-range planner. Clearly others are wired differently, and some people have never been in a healthy relationship and lack coping skills and emotional maturity. So maybe OW just didn't know better and couldn't do better. But my WH did and could. That's the saddest part of this whole story.

[RecentChange]

If it takes a village.....

 

We hear it all the time when it comes to parenting. ..... there is still a general respect for the each other's children and when we see a child in danger, it's only common decency to go and help out

 

Because its a CHILD. Not an adult capable of making their own decisions. Not an adult who knows the consequences, not an adult who doesn't need protecting by strangers.

 

So if it takes a village when it comes to general welfare of our kids, then why is it that we don't have the same attitude to doing OUR PART when it comes to protecting other people's marriages and their vows?

 

Again, because a marriage is an agreement between two adults, not a lost child that needs an adult to hold their hand. Unless your husband is a lost child that needs others to parent him, and show him right from wrong, its not other's responsibility to keep him on a narrow path.

 

I But as I work through my husband's EA and the damaged pieces of what an otherwise extraordinary marriage we had and work to rebuild

 

I think you both need to discuss what was happening in the marriage before he strayed. It may not be a popular opinion, but I think an extraordinary marriage wouldn't be prone to an affair - there were most likely cracks, ones that you might not even be aware of that allowed him to open himself up to an affair. FIND THOSE CRACKS, talk about them, and correct them. Saying everything was perfect, and then an affair for "no reason" usually doesn't result in the real fixes that are needed.

 

I am really struggling to find empathy for OW/OM

 

I don't think you owe any empathy to the OW. I don't think you can blame her for your husbands wandering, but I do not think you have to like, agree with, or have empathy for her.

 

To be clear, my husband has taken responsibility for his own actions and I hold him accountable for what he has done to fracture our marriage. But now, I feel a growing anger towards his OW for her selfish actions and complete disregard for my marriage. It will not subside and I know it's unhealthy. I'm struggling.

 

I am sorry you are going through a hard time - but the OW didn't cause this. Your husband did, and his not a lost little boy that didn't know right from wrong. I doubt there was something "magical" about the OW - if it wasn't her, it would have been another. Your husband choose to violate his vows. Certainly not a helpless victim like a lost child.

 

And lastly, it may sound cold - but to expect a stranger to honor your marriage vows, when your own husband won't - is overly optimistic. Some do! Some say married no way - but some obviously give in when pursued by a married man.

[ladydesigner]

JLeaks I agree with you and you would think ADULTS would know better!

 

I think it should just be a HUMAN common courtesy not to f**k somebody else's H or f**K someone while being M'd.

 

I think what it comes down to is a lot of people do not respect the foundations or believe in marriage and that is why they cross the line, be it a OW/MW/MM/AP whatever!

 

Others feel it's not such a big deal to cheat so they do what they want being selfish.

[Mr. Lucky]

I feel a growing anger towards his OW for her selfish actions and complete disregard for my marriage.

 

I think people that don't cheat are most influenced by their own standards. Self-respect is their governing belief, not respect for marriage...

 

Mr. Lucky

[heartwhole]

I think people that don't cheat are most influenced by their own standards. Self-respect is their governing belief, not respect for marriage...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

I agree. I'm sure if I wanted to cheat I could come up with some creative way to justify it. I'm pretty good with arguments, after all. But before I worry about anybody else, I worry about myself, and it would add nothing good to my life to lie to those who trust me, to invite trouble and disease into my life, to accept being somebody's dirty secret. I deserve and demand more. And I treat others as I want to be treated because the golden rule just plain makes sense.

[Sabella]

Hi Jleaks,

I think it's completely understandable to feel a lot of anger towards the ow. I can tell you are processing a lot, and sorting through this all still. I don't think you even need to get to any sort of point of forgiveness towards her. The anger is justified and I'm sure it's just part of the process. I guess I would only caution not to focus on that aspect for too long.

 

I guess every ow has a story, reason, or justification as to how the affair happend and I'm sadly no different. I've read some horror stories here about how some of the ow's behave even after a dday, that honestly just shock me.

 

I was going to just avoid this thread, because I am an ow and things like this are not only difficult to read, they are difficult to explain, as I am still sorting it myself. But I'm trying now not to avoid difficult things in my life, as that is what got me in the mess to begin with.

 

So I wanted to say to you that I'm very sorry you are hurting. I truly hope that you can move forward with your marriage, stronger and better than ever.

[waterwoman]

It depends on how you view marriage. If you think of it as an entirely private undertaking with no relevance to others your view makes no sense. If however you accept marriage as a social contract, witnessed by other people, with a benefit to society as a whole you are correct. I tend to think if anyone beleive a marriage is only a private matter, why bother with it?

[understand50]

One would hope that others would respect a marriage, but sadly they do not. In the case of infidelity, that first person does not is the WS. While many AP's have stated they did not know that the person was married, many do, and just do not care.

 

This only line of defense, is to have the two people in a marriage respect it. Hoping the world will help is not a good policy. If you are married, and do not have a "open" marriage, then it comes down to you and your spouse, and only you and your spouse alone to keep faithful.

 

For myself, if I was single, I would not sleep with a married woman, nor would I interfere with a married couple. That would be my standard, and I think many others, but many do not have the same idea.

 

For the OP, place the blame where it belongs, on your husband, and I hope he accepts that he let you and himself down. I wish you luck in your reconciliation.

 

My two cents.

[JLeaks3]

RecentChange,

With all due respect, whether or not it's a "helpless" child or an adult who makes his or her own choices is just splitting hairs when it comes to another adult behaving in a way that hurts someone else out of their own selfish wants and desires.

 

And this is exactly why I have an issue with OW/OM and the general notion that somehow the responsibility lies solely on the those who made the vows. The APs created a love triangle without any regard to the BS and then when the crap hits the fan, somehow it's a rationalization that one segment of that triangle is not to be accountable for their complicity in the damage?

 

My marriage? Yes, it was most definitely extraordinary. We have healthy children who are kind and well-liked by their peers, we are both healthy and while we may have the usual stresses of life with the mundane things like bills, and busy schedules and work, yard work, housework, etc. my husband and I very much are in love with each other. The biggest issues in our marriage has been finances. We lost our house and had to file for bankruptcy during the recession when his construction business totally dried up and I was laid off from my job. You want to talk about cracks and stress on a relationship? We've been through it and we've worked through it together.

 

I've read about limerence and all the affair fog and romantic love being different, etc. My husband and I never got out of romantic love. We still very much desire each other after 17 total years of being with each other. Like I have said before in other threads, we make love about 3-4 times a week, and while we had dry spells in the past, usually when I was pregnant, we have always had a healthy sex life. Even before and during the EA. And it's not just normal vanilla sex, it's passionate and sexy and desirous.

 

Why do I tell you this? It's not to brag. But to illustrate that even an extraordinary marriage is prone to these kinds of devastation caused by affairs. Even my husband found himself on the slippery slope of befriending another woman thinking "just friends" and develop romantic feelings and flirt and all that nonsense. Nothing is safe from the destruction of infidelity. And I think that is why I struggle. If my marriage was rocky, maybe I could have understood such an indiscretion. But because our marriage was in fact pretty damn near perfect and STILL infidelity crept in, I constantly feel like I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop.

 

So I struggle with feelings of security. Not because I don't trust my husband. I trust the utter disgust he has in himself to have hurt me so unimaginably to never do it again. He is completely transparent with me with everything he does, all his accounts, everything. Everything he does is a message of love for me. But why don't I feel secure?

 

I started reading here because I really have no idea what his OW was thinking. I come here to see what other OW experiences are and I read about the complete disregard they have to the lives they bulldoze over and I get mad at my husband's OW. Maybe it's unfair to project those sentiments on her.

 

But again, maybe I'm naive to expect people to just do the right thing and respect other people's marriages, but I struggle with how low the expectations we have as a whole society to continue to enable cheaters with the whole thinking that we somehow don't have a responsibility to each other to not do hurtful things like engage with a married person. When someone flat out says OW/OM have no accountability to the BS because they were not the ones that made those vows, that's just enabling them and saying it's okay to deliberately do things that are directly affecting others in a negative and hurtful way. What a twisted universe we live in. It's a completely self-centered way of thinking that I could do everything that pleases me and to hell with who gets hurt on my path to self-indulgence and gratification. That's exactly the kind of attitude that affairs thrive in. And people enable it.

 

I have pretty high expectations on my children to be good people and to treat others kindly. I certainly don't make excuses for their bad behavior and don't accept excuses from them. So why would that stop for adults? Why do I hear so many people accepting excuses for hurtful actions?

 

Thank you all for your responses. I would like to reply to each of you individually, but I've already written a book in my response to Recent Change, but I think some of it touches on your points as well.

 

Sabella, thank you for your kind words and I appreciate your courage to come on this thread as an OW knowing it's difficult and hard to read. I wish you the best in your own healing.

[JLeaks3]

One would hope that others would respect a marriage, but sadly they do not. In the case of infidelity, that first person does not is the WS. While many AP's have stated they did not know that the person was married, many do, and just do not care.

 

This only line of defense, is to have the two people in a marriage respect it. Hoping the world will help is not a good policy. If you are married, and do not have a "open" marriage, then it comes down to you and your spouse, and only you and your spouse alone to keep faithful.

 

For myself, if I was single, I would not sleep with a married woman, nor would I interfere with a married couple. That would be my standard, and I think many others, but many do not have the same idea.

 

For the OP, place the blame where it belongs, on your husband, and I hope he accepts that he let you and himself down. I wish you luck in your reconciliation.

 

My two cents.

 

My husband has felt my wrath and hurt for what he has done.

[oldshirt]

If you have read some of my posts, I am probably one of the people you are talking about as I was a serial OM and had contact with several married women during my mid and upper 20s.

 

Now I will admit that now I am 25+ years older (and hopefully wiser) and have a home and family and wife of 20 years myself, my attitude, values and beliefs have changed a lot.

 

I simple truth is that if no one messes with someone else's spouse, there would be no such thing as adultery in the world.

 

That would be nice, but it simply is not a reality.

 

The reality is people at the end of the day are self-serving and their default setting is always to take care of themselves. Some just experience that more and some less than others, but it does lay deep in all of us.

 

Those that say they would "never" cheat or never touch a married person, just haven't had the right person hit on them or the right set of circumstances occur yet.

 

In reflection and 20+ years of self reflection, a big part of my decision to accept the offers of married women, was the ease and seemlessness that women had cheated on me and ultimately dumped me and the endless line of male suitors happily willing to jump on them with total disregard to their relationship with me.

 

I became jaded and realized it truly is every man for himself and that women are going to instinctively go for the fittest. I could either the proverbial "Nice Guy tm" sitting on the sidelines hoping I could get some leftovers. Or I could suit up, put my game face on and go out on the field and take my lumps and get my uniform dirty.

 

Did I have guilt and remorse and angst with touching another mans wife? Not really. I did not pursue and seduce the women, they approached me. I wasn't looking for a LTR or marriage at the time and only wanted NSA fun. It was the perfect arrangement for the time.

 

My attitude was there was nothing special about me, there for if they were wanting side action and it wasn't me, they would just screw someone else while I sat there getting nothing. I was tired of playing by the rules and watching other guys get laid.

 

I did have a couple pissed off guys show up on my doorstep. My response - "not my problem Dude. Take better care of your woman."

 

Now as I said, now that I am 50+ years old and have wife of 20+ years and a family of my own, my attitude is vastly different.

 

I still have no real remorse or regret in regards to the BH's, they played their role in it and I was looking out for my interests.

 

But what I have now is a unique perspective and insight on cheating wives and BH's and OM. I now spend a great deal of my time and bandwidth offering my firsthand experience on what BH's can do to discover the WW's activities and what they can do to shore up their defenses and keep from getting manipulated, bull shirted and cuckolded.

 

If I am doing that out of some sort of guilt or quest of redemption due to my previous behavior, then so be it.

[wmacbride]

If you have read some of my posts, I am probably one of the people you are talking about as I was a serial OM and had contact with several married women during my mid and upper 20s.

 

Now I will admit that now I am 25+ years older (and hopefully wiser) and have a home and family and wife of 20 years myself, my attitude, values and beliefs have changed a lot.

 

I simple truth is that if no one messes with someone else's spouse, there would be no such thing as adultery in the world.

 

That would be nice, but it simply is not a reality.

 

The reality is people at the end of the day are self-serving and their default setting is always to take care of themselves. Some just experience that more and some less than others, but it does lay deep in all of us.

 

Those that say they would "never" cheat or never touch a married person, just haven't had the right person hit on them or the right set of circumstances occur yet.

 

In reflection and 20+ years of self reflection, a big part of my decision to accept the offers of married women, was the ease and seemlessness that women had cheated on me and ultimately dumped me and the endless line of male suitors happily willing to jump on them with total disregard to their relationship with me.

 

I became jaded and realized it truly is every man for himself and that women are going to instinctively go for the fittest. I could either the proverbial "Nice Guy tm" sitting on the sidelines hoping I could get some leftovers. Or I could suit up, put my game face on and go out on the field and take my lumps and get my uniform dirty.

 

Did I have guilt and remorse and angst with touching another mans wife? Not really. I did not pursue and seduce the women, they approached me. I wasn't looking for a LTR or marriage at the time and only wanted NSA fun. It was the perfect arrangement for the time.

 

My attitude was there was nothing special about me, there for if they were wanting side action and it wasn't me, they would just screw someone else while I sat there getting nothing. I was tired of playing by the rules and watching other guys get laid.

 

I did have a couple pissed off guys show up on my doorstep. My response - "not my problem Dude. Take better care of your woman."

 

Now as I said, now that I am 50+ years old and have wife of 20+ years and a family of my own, my attitude is vastly different.

 

I still have no real remorse or regret in regards to the BH's, they played their role in it and I was looking out for my interests.

 

But what I have now is a unique perspective and insight on cheating wives and BH's and OM. I now spend a great deal of my time and bandwidth offering my firsthand experience on what BH's can do to discover the WW's activities and what they can do to shore up their defenses and keep from getting manipulated, bull shirted and cuckolded.

 

If I am doing that out of some sort of guilt or quest of redemption due to my previous behavior, then so be it.

 

Why do the people who have cheated or been an ow/om so bent on smugly insisting that anyone can cheat? I'm sorry, but I will never understand this.

 

You are speaking for yourself, and I get that. I am speaking for myself when i say I don't have it in me to cheat, or, if I was suddenly to find myself single, knowingly getting involved with a married man. If things get to a point where I would even want to,what's the point fo staying married, and if I can;t live p to my own system of values, then what's the point of eve having them? Besides, after being cheated on myself, I couldn't look at myself in the mirror knowing I was a part of something that was hurting someone else so much.

 

Op,

you are wasting your time trying to get ow or om who feel no remorse to suddenly feel some. Thy have a different way of viewing the situation than you do, and its a very selfish one.

[RecentChange]

RecentChange,

With all due respect, whether or not it's a "helpless" child or an adult who makes his or her own choices is just splitting hairs when it comes to another adult behaving in a way that hurts someone else out of their own selfish wants and desires.

 

And this is exactly why I have an issue with OW/OM and the general notion that somehow the responsibility lies solely on the those who made the vows. The APs created a love triangle without any regard to the BS and then when the crap hits the fan, somehow it's a rationalization that one segment of that triangle is not to be accountable for their complicity in the damage?

 

First, let me set the stage for you. My husband had an emotional affair, and I didn't for a moment blame the other woman. I blamed him, myself, and our relationship. THAT IS WHERE THE BLAME LIES.

 

The affair partner did not "create" a love triangle. YOUR HUSBAND did. He is the one in the middle. He was the one wildly in love with you, yet at the same time CHOSE to share his heart, and fall for another woman.

 

He knew it was wrong, he knew where it was leading, and kept making those choices to go down that road. Because he is not a child, he knew.

 

I have cheated as well. So, I have seen both sides of this coin. I know how it can start out feeling so innocent.... and then you start to know where things are headed. Because we are NOT innocent lost children, but an ADULT who CHOOSE to cheat!

 

Look, I never thought my relationship was on the rocks either. I thought we were "good!" he thought we were good - our friends point to us as an ideal relationship. When our newly engaged friends pointed to us and said "goals!" I thought - oh, only if you knew!

 

I disagree that affairs happen for "no reason". On the surface, his happened for "no reason" - through counseling, we learned about the reasons and improved our communication.

 

When I had an affair - my AP and I agreed that our own relationships were in "great shape!" and that we really didn't have a reason to cheat - other than lusting for each other.

 

That was a fallacy as well. If things were as perfect at home as I even believed they were, I wouldn't been open to an affair - like the 14 years prior, I would have not reciprocated any flirting, I wouldn't have made myself available - but suddenly I did.

 

It took a lot of introspection to find out WHY I allowed myself to go down that path. WHY I choose to flirt back rather than ignore (like your husband did).

 

Getting to the bottom of that, the reasons that laid within me, and the reasons that sourced from my relationship have allowed me to address those things.

 

Let me ask you this - what was he getting from his affair partner, that he was not getting from your relationship? Have you two talked about that?

Edited June 22, 2016 by RecentChange

[oldshirt]

Why do the people who have cheated or been an ow/om so bent on smugly insisting that anyone can cheat? I'm sorry, but I will never understand this.

 

You are speaking for yourself, and I get that. I am speaking for myself when i say I don't have it in me to cheat, or, if I was suddenly to find myself single, knowingly getting involved with a married man. If things get to a point where I would even want to,what's the point fo staying married, and if I can;t live p to my own system of values, then what's the point of eve having them? Besides, after being cheated on myself, I couldn't look at myself in the mirror knowing I was a part of something that was hurting

 

If there is one thing that all WS's and all AP's have in common is that every last one them have said that they would never cheat and never mess with a married person at one point.

 

Cheaters do not come from a different mold. They are not a different species. They all come off the same assembly line from the same factory.

 

Everyone says they won't and they are sincere when they say it - but then the right offer from the right person at the right time and under the right circumstances comes along.

 

That's what makes this all so scary and so disturbing. It's troubling and discomforting because it literally can happen to anyone. No one is immune, no one is shielded.

 

We want to place people in tidy boxes of those who do and those who don't, but that is not the reality.

 

The reality is is that it is something that we all can face at some point no matter how good of a person we are.

[wmacbride]

If there is one thing that all WS's and all AP's have in common is that every last one them have said that they would never cheat and never mess with a married person at one point.

 

Cheaters do not come from a different mold. They are not a different species. They all come off the same assembly line from the same factory.

 

Everyone says they won't and they are sincere when they say it - but then the right offer from the right person at the right time and under the right circumstances comes along.

 

That's what makes this all so scary and so disturbing. It's troubling and discomforting because it literally can happen to anyone. No one is immune, no one is shielded.

 

We want to place people in tidy boxes of those who do and those who don't, but that is not the reality.

 

The reality is is that it is something that we all can face at some point no matter how good of a person we are.

 

It's not an issue of me seeing myself as better than anyone else. I have a huge number of foibles and issues that i would love to change.

 

I am not speaking for anyone else. I am speaking for myself, and as a 40 plus year old adult who has been through cr@p in my marriage and in my life in general. I'm used to married but on my own for over a year at a stretch with little to no contact from my H. I have learned a lot about myself and what I will and will not allow myself to do. I also know the way I develop an emotional connection to people, casual sex has little no no appeal to me, and I am also painfully introverted in person. to a point that I find it difficult to talk to people and has almost always taken me a very long time to feel any sort of a connection to someone. If i was to cheat, it wouldn't be a" it just sort of happened" thing. I would have to force myself to even talk to the other person, and the follow through from there.

 

I do understand your point though, even though it may sound like I don't.

[oldshirt]

It's not an issue of me seeing myself as better than anyone else. I have a huge number of foibles and issues that i would love to change.

 

I am not speaking for anyone else. I am speaking for myself, and as a 40 plus year old adult who has been through cr@p in my marriage and in my life in general. I'm used to married but on my own for over a year at a stretch with little to no contact from my H. I have learned a lot about myself and what I will and will not allow myself to do. I also know the way I develop an emotional connection to people, casual sex has little no no appeal to me, and I am also painfully introverted in person. to a point that I find it difficult to talk to people and has almost always taken me a very long time to feel any sort of a connection to someone. If i was to cheat, it wouldn't be a" it just sort of happened" thing. I would have to force myself to even talk to the other person, and the follow through from there.

 

I do understand your point though, even though it may sound like I don't.

 

 

And I understand your point and I believe your sincerity.

 

I'm just say with the right offer from the right person at the right time under the right circumstances, it can happen to anyone. No one is immune or protected even if the chances of all those circumstances occuring together seem really remote.

 

Virtually all WS's and all AP's have said the same thing and virtually all thought their situation was unique to the point it could never happen to them.

[oldshirt]

 

Virtually all WS's and all AP's have said the same thing and virtually all thought their situation was unique to the point it could never happen to them.

 

In my case, I was quiet, skinny, geeky and not ongoing and flirty. I was not a lady's man at all and had very little if any interest from many single women.

 

Before it actually happened, I would have sworn with my last breath that no married woman would even notice me let alone want to bed me.

 

If someone would've told me I woul touch a married woman, I would've either laughed at them or be offended by the assertion.

[MJJean]

I read the description of the marriage and have yet to see anything "extraordinary". What was described seems so ordinary it's almost cliche. Including a wife who thinks nothing is wrong and a husband having some sort of an affair.

 

I agree with a previous poster. There is/was something off or missing in the marital relationship that lead to the affair. He was a grown man of some years and experience when it turned from friendship into something more. He knew where it was going, he enjoyed it, and he perpetuated it because he was getting something he needed from it and that something was so important to him that he betrayed you and the marriage for it.

 

If you and he never find out what he needed and wasn't getting, he'll be vulnerable to a repeat performance.

 

As to the original question, I think the idea that there is some kind of "code" is something we tell ourselves to make ourselves feel better. Lord knows, people have been violating this "code" left, right, and center, in fairly large numbers since forever.

 

When a couple marry, they make vows to each other. They may do it in front of the community, but the vows are made to each other. The community doesn't make any vows. The community doesn't promise not to violate the marriage. Only the couple marrying do.

[oldshirt]

 

 

To be clear, my husband has taken responsibility for his own actions and I hold him accountable for what he has done to fracture our marriage. But now, I feel a growing anger towards his OW for her selfish actions and complete disregard for my marriage. It will not subside and I know it's unhealthy. I'm struggling.

 

Your disgust and anger towards the OW is founded. Do not try to hide, suppress it or deny it.

 

If someone broke into your home, took things that belonged you and tracked mud and dog poop all over your home, would you dismiss the intruder and hold your husband 100% accountable because he didn't keep the door locked??

 

An AP is an intruder than knowingly comes into your marriage and takes things that belongs to you and smears mud and poop throughout all areas of your marriage. They need to be held accountable for their role in the damage to what is yours.

 

I do encourage BS's to confront the AP and assert your marital boundaries.

 

I also encourage BS's to immediately expose the A to the AP's partner if they have one.

 

It is my firm belief that the AP is typically in the A for extra fun and attention and are not actually invested in the WS or relationship.

Once the A is no longer fun and no longer "easy" and no longer free, they fade out like a fart in the wind.

 

Don't give AP's a free pass to mess with what is rightfully yours.