Did he cheat & consequences

[Mrs. John Adams]

I told my husband...if you want to go to strip clubs...that's fine...but take me with you

 

if you want to look at porn...that'e fine...i will give you naked pictures of me to look at

 

guys like to look...FACT...I don't have a problem with it...but if you play with fire you might get burned...sooooooo

 

I know you travel...I know you miss me...here's a picture....

 

 

But my point was...any clubs we have ever been to...have a very strict no photography rule. How did he take those pictures? Did someone send them to him? Or did the bouncers at the club allow it? were they REALLY pictures of him at the club?

 

Too many questions for me.......

[Lady Hamilton]

Would you disagree its a good idea for her to speak to him about this once she calms down?

 

Women check out guys as well. It's human biology.

 

Freaking about it is insecure.

 

I don't disagree she should talk about it. I never said I did. I just disagreed with the idea that men ogle women, they can't help it, and the problem is she's bothered by it, not that he was conducting himself inappropriately.

 

Do women notice attractive men? Of course. But this goes beyond noticing an attractive woman. I can't remember the last time I saw a guy rubbing himself on another woman in a semi-private setting and my first response was to grab my camera and take pictures. Not only is being around that disrespectful to my husband, but to take pictures and hang on to them is disrespectful to the guy that I'm treating like a wild animal I stumbled upon.

 

You can't control noticing an attractive person. You can control how you react to noticing said attractive person. Taking photos of a woman in a situation you know you shouldn't have been in while intoxicated in the middle of a weekday, then leaving them somewhere your kids can find them... That isn't biology. That's somebody acting a fool who needs to be called out.

 

If that is behavior that's impossible to control, then he has very serious issues that need to be addressed, most likely by a qualified professional.

[Lady Hamilton]

But my point was...any clubs we have ever been to...have a very strict no photography rule. How did he take those pictures? Did someone send them to him? Or did the bouncers at the club allow it? were they REALLY pictures of him at the club?

 

Too many questions for me.......

 

I understood it to be that he was in a sports/country club and she was brought in for a private performance and/or she was a random Becky who got a bit rowdy.

[Mrs. John Adams]

Many years ago...I went to the NCO club on the base where my husband was stationed...I went in to deliver Avon...lol

 

I had never been inside...and I will never forget the girl dancing in a bikini to an Eagles song. I was shocked and I told my husband when i got home he better never set foot in there.

 

My point is....what we women may find offensive...may not be offensive to a man....and I don't know where this husbands mindset was at the time...

 

I too would be upset to find these pictures on the phone....I would be insanely jealous and worried.

 

I totally understand why she is upset...but I also don't want her to blow things out of proportion...I don't want her to worry unnecessarily...because this really may not be a big deal to him.

 

Discussing boundaries is very very important. Communicating how upset and worried she is... is very important. He needs to know that she is upset and they need to discuss between them her views and his as well.

 

I truly don't think this is a big deal....but then who am i to say what she should or should not be feeling? The one thing I have learned...people feel what they feel...and they cannot always help feeling the way they do.

 

I think Communication in this situation will clear up a lot of things...and they will be ok. I pray that it is true.

[ChickiePops]

What I am trying to process here is how he took those pictures

 

Most clubs have a very strict no photography rule

 

Strip clubs do..sportsmans lodges, not so much. She stated in her first post that it wasn't a strip club. She said she's been to the location before so I imagine she would recognize it in pictures. It sounds like it was just a chick who was desperate for male attention and was showing off in front of a group of drunk guys.

 

I don't think it was cheating, but I'd be angry too. The pictures were unnecessary, and not deleting them was even more unnecessary. It is gross and tacky..but not cheating.

[Lady Hamilton]

I'm in Mrs. Adams boat. My husband isn't a stripper guy. He's not a porn guy. He's made clear he finds them both uncomfortable and inappropriate. So if one day I found the pictures, I'd be concerned simply because he is going against what he's always said he believes... So that would worry me.

 

In OP's situation, it's not so much that he did it, it's that he did it and then lied about it until being caught. The behavior is bad, the lie is worse. I'd be more upset that one day last January when I said "So, what did you do today?" and be replied with "Oh, nothing..."

 

I'd be worried about the lie and what else he lies about and how this is presumably out-of-character for him. A sudden behavior change is always something to make your ears perk up.

[Cpl11]

If have questions at how he could be so drunk just after noon on a Thursday that he would think taking these kids of pics and being there for that kind of behavior would be ok... And that he kept the pictures. In 7 months he wasn't sober enough to delete them?

 

Is it cheating? No. Not as is.

 

Tacky and a breech of trust, sure.

 

Sorry I am new to site, not really sure how to respond. I do need to clarify tbat it was 1230 am, we both work full-time, I actually maje more $$$ than him, someone was asking if I was the kids caretaker while he was at work. I can see that this was not cheating but it was lying & he wants to go back!!!! I sm having an issue of trust here & I do not think thst is unreasonable!!! Thsnks for all the input, I am too embarssed to talk to my friends sbout it yet

[S2B]

Is he willing to never go to that "sportsman's club" again?

 

How is he planning to earn back your trust?

[Lady Hamilton]

So it was midnight on a workday and he was alone with 5 peers and this girl who was being sexually provocative... And he refuses to not go back?

 

Yeah, I'd be tweaked too. There are legitimate trust issues here that need to be addressed.

 

I get that some of it is just my dynamic and YMMV, but I'd be not exactly thrilled if my husband was out past midnight getting drunk (I hope he didn't drive) and getting into compromising situations with women...

[standtall]

Is he willing to never go to that "sportsman's club" again?

 

 

 

Wow...I bet he is willing to go to that sportsman club again, and she won't ask him not too. I wouldn't hang out with the strippers anymore, and neither should he, but what wife would ask him to quit? He is a grown man, not a 10 yr old getting grounded by mom. As an lead male, I would do the exact opposite if my wife commanded/demanded me too..and she wouldn't. if you pick up on the post, most men that are members of sports clubs are alpha men and won't take well to this line of thinking.

 

 

How is he planning to earn back your trust?

 

You mean punish don't you? Most men would apologize and say it won't happen and move on. End of story.... Get over it.

[Lady Hamilton]

Why get married if that's your attitude? "I do what I want to do and if you don't like it, get over it. I'm an alpha male and I'll do the opposite of anything you ask of me that I don't like. So there." How is that at all constructive?

 

You don't want your wife to act like your mom, then why respond to a marital issue like a small child? No rational adult flat out does the opposite of what is asked of them out of spite, just like no adult complains discussing resolutions to marital problems is a punishment... While simultaneously planning how to act in a way that punishes their spouse for daring to have a negative feeling about their behavior.

 

If my husband did something like that, I'd tell him he broke my trust and I don't want him to go there anymore until it feels like we are on a path to recovery. If I got the response above, I'd assume the hostility and confrontational behavior was masking a greater sin and/or he's entering into a pattern of disrespect towards me that I neither have the time or patience to deal with. I have no interest staying at home with kids while he runs around town at midnight acting a fool, then coming home and acting a bigger fool. If that's how he'd want to roll, I'd call his bluff and help him find the nearest exit..

 

Having dated, and dumped, my share of "alpha males" or "lead males" who can't take anything short of complicity one generally finds in a person with a lobotomy, I am always baffled by the mentality that says "I refuse to listen to you, so you listen to me and obey every word of it." Do you really think a functional relationship is doing what you want and your partner has to just deal? The killer was when they'd not get why I broke up with them after such a display of total unwillingness to have any sort of mutually beneficial relationship.

 

So what happens on the nights she wants to go out and get plastered with her girlfriends at midnight and get felt up by a strange guy? You going to happily sit home alone with the kids while saying "Well, it's her way and I have no right to question it.." Here's guessing that's a big fat nada.

Edited July 10, 2016 by Lady Hamilton

[standtall]

It's not the message, it's how your encouraging the OP to phrase it.

 

Life is full of different people..we are a rich tapestry with many voices. There are many many dominant males out there...more than what most posters here realize. Dominate, alpha, sports club member guys typical don't post on this forum...they could care less. Most wouldn't get caught dead posting here. Heck, I've been teased by a close friend for my postings.We don't like being told what to do by anybody...we control ourselves for the most part and when do fail, we fix it ourselves..on our terms. It's the way we are. Your situation works for you and your husband. He sounds like a passive person to you if you were to even talk about " a road to recovery" for being around a stripper. Personal, if my wife said that to me, I would die of laughter.

 

I am making an educated guess about the OP situation, and assuming she if married to another dominant male, and IMHO,if she presents demands..ie..you need to quit that club..ie you have to earn my trust back..it will blow up much more than it needs be, because he made a minor mistake..he did not cheat..end of story.

 

As far as a man feeling up my wife..it depends. If it was unwanted, he would wake up in a hospital. If she wanted it once...I would get over it. If she did it again..it would be a divorce quicker than her head could spin...that's after 20 yrs and 3 kids.

Edited July 10, 2016 by standtall

[S2B]

Wow...I bet he is willing to go to that sportsman club again, and she won't ask him not too. I wouldn't hang out with the strippers anymore, and neither should he, but what wife would ask him to quit? He is a grown man, not a 10 yr old getting grounded by mom. As an lead male, I would do the exact opposite if my wife commanded/demanded me too..and she wouldn't. if you pick up on the post, most men that are members of sports clubs are alpha men and won't take well to this line of thinking.

 

 

 

 

You mean punish don't you? Most men would apologize and say it won't happen and move on. End of story.... Get over it.

 

And most with that attitude should/would be quickly single again...

 

A man who isn't considering the woman he's married to and her feelings isn't marriage material.

[Lady Hamilton]

For the record, my husband is not a passive person in the slightest. In his whole life, there was only one situation where indecisiveness was his shortcoming, and again, it was because his strong personality conflicted on itself. He is very much a stubborn, strong willed person and it did initially lead to some problems. However, he quickly realized the "me man, you woman" attitude wouldn't get him far in our relationship.

 

And even at his worst in that attitude, he'd know this kind of behavior is wrong, simply because if I left him alone with the kids at midnight on a weekday and had a drunken grind fest with a man who may or may not have been a stripper, then took and kept pictures of it, then proceeded to lie about it until outed, he'd be over-the-moon ripped. It would damage our relationship for months.

 

The "road to recovery" I'm talking about, if it were me, has nothing to do with him seeing a stripper. It has to do with his lying about it and being satisfied to lie about it until pictures of it were almost spotted by our children. That's not something that can be wiped away with an "I said I'm sorry... Geeze, get over it..." It's a lie. It's a breech of trust. It's a continued lie and a forced apology only after being caught, by our kids no less.

 

Again, if my husband who had no propensity to visit strippers suddenly acted in a way that's not typical for him and went and saw a stripper, acted in a way around her that most strippers would disallow, then took pictures of it, lied about it, then continued to lie until pictures he took and had no business keeping were found by our child... It shows a pattern of disrespect. Blowing it off or me off or laughing in my face over it being a problem that needs fixing over time, as all trust breeches would be, that just shows a continued pattern of disrespect.

 

Now we have a problem that has nothing to do with strippers... We have a problem with a partner feeling there's no issue in persistiantly disrespecting their partner, lying about it, a partner acting in a way seemingly completely different than they normally would, and an oppositional and confrontational attitude in discussing these issues... As well as deliberate attempts to worsen it out of spite to punish the partner for daring to contradict or challenge some sort of biological gender right that really doesn't exist.

 

So macho make can say it's a minor mistake and blame her for making the situation worse because she challenged him, but the fault really is macho male feels that being a macho male is a legitimate excuse to have to not give a banana about something that he did that was clearly wrong and violated the trust and feelings of his partner.

 

This is, of course, ignoring the fact that the true definition of a alpha male from a psychological standpoint includes a strong, assumed traditional gender roles in the relationship as well as fierce almost primal need to defend and protect ones spouse and family because they feel it is their responsibility to do so. And doing what you want to do and telling a partner to pound sand if their upset is the exact opposite of that... As alpha males are prone to impulsive actions that can cause offense, but are also highly prone to over apologizing and amends making to their partners for said transgression so as to repair the damage as quickly as possible to return the family unit back to order...

 

But that's neither here nor there. I get that this is again a misapplied use of the word and concept to justify me-centric behavior and attitudes and not a true discussion on what alpha males and dominant males behavior and attitudes are.

Edited July 10, 2016 by Lady Hamilton

[66Charger]

What I think this comes down to, is, does the punishment fit the crime. You have those who have done so much worse, screaming bloody murder. Justifying their "misdeeds" while acting uprighteous about a picture of a stripper. The hypocrisy.

 

Men look. Women look. Men take pictures, Women take pictures. Dont recall where it was said he was grinding on said woman, but I guess we all speculate. And now that it ismentioned, I had better take a.hammer to my old phones.

 

There are very few, who have never done wrong, but not every "crime" deserves a crucifixion. Most say this was not cheating. It wasnt clear where the lie is. Did he deny it when presented with the question? Sometimes a event should be dealt with on its own, and not be a condemnation of the entire marriage, or all that is male.

 

For the record, I went to strip show once and felt it was degrading. Not so much with occasional porn, especially if It is shared.

Edited July 10, 2016 by 66Charger

[standtall]

I with the poster above...I reread the OP again. there was no lie, he just thought it was no big deal..heck it was on an old phone most likely to get tossed. Either way the OP is out and so am I.

[Lady Hamilton]

What I think this comes down to, is, does the punishment fit the crime. You have those who have done so much worse, screaming bloody murder. Justifying their "misdeeds" while acting uprighteous about a picture of a stripper. The hypocrisy.

 

If you are talking about me, I'm neither "screaming bloody murder" nor am I acting righteous about the situation. And me having an affair doesn't mean I can no longer have an opinion on what's appropriate vs not appropriate.

 

One would think that if I'd be passively shamed for the lie of a spouse via an affair, that others would see the issue with another person lying to their spouse as well. I've said, repeatedly, the issue isn't the stripper. It's the lie.

 

Men look. Women look. Men take pictures, Women take pictures. Dont recall where it was said he was grinding on said woman, but I guess we all speculate. And now that it ismentioned, I had better take a.hammer to my old phones.

 

This is not a case of looking. And no, not everybody whips out their phone and takes pictures of people they find attractive. And no, not everybody puts themselves in a situation where they are in a semi-private place with a woman getting undressed and "rubbing" people. And it's not speculation, it's what the OP said.

 

If this was a case where he looked at a woman on the street and then kept on going, there would be no issue. But it's not. And there's a way you can go about a situation like this without disrespecting your wife or degrading the stripper. He failed on both counts.

 

Just because you have pictures you took on your phone of women you found attractive doesn't have any bearing on anything. If your wife/partner is fine with it, either because she knows and doesn't care or that's the type of dynamic you have, then enjpy. The OP didn't know, because he didn't tell her and lied about it, and she does have an issue with it. So if you and your wife are fine with it really does nothing to make her feel better... And even though we can keep saying this is normal, the truth is, it so very much isn't.

 

There are very few, who have never done wrong, but not every "crime" deserves a crucifixion. Most say this was not cheating. It wasnt clear where the lie is. Did he deny it when presented with the question? Sometimes a event should be dealt with on its own, and not be a condemnation of the entire marriage, or all that is male.

 

The lie is in that he didn't tell her it happened. By lying through omission, one is still lying, and by not telling her, then trying to excuse it by saying he was drunk, it does point to his knowing it was a behavior that wasn't cool.

 

And who's condemning the entire marriage or all that is male? This isn't a "women ganging up on men" issue. I agree it's not cheating, but his not telling about it and his follow up behavior to it caused her some justifiable upset.

 

For the record, I went to strip show once and felt it was degrading. Not so much with occasional porn, especially if It is shared.

 

But that is you. That isn't her.

 

And I say again, if you found pictures on your wife's phone of a stripper undressing, posing provocatively, and "rubbing" people, taken when she was drunk and while you were alone with the kids all night, would you chuckle and say "Hey babe, looks like you had a fun night! Hope you do it again soon!" Or would you be upset?

 

Because for all the guys who have said its no big deal when he does it, not one of them he said it would be no big deal if it was their wife doing it...

[ShatteredLady]

I can only talk to the kind of 'wonderful' relationship that I once thought I had with my husband.

 

We've had all kinds of fun over the years. I actually really enjoyed walking around the red light district in Amsterdam. The sex museum was interesting.

 

In England, when you're young, it's very common for people to hire strippers for special occasions (for both men & women). I always sunbathed at least topless on those kinds of beaches in Europe because I hate the look of a rich tan with white bits.

 

I looked. He looked. What's the big deal?

 

If it's 'normal' for my H to go to a family type club every week & suddenly some woman takes her clothes off & puts on a show what should I expect? I wouldn't mind the photos. I'd expect my H to walk through the door & say "OMG!! Guess what happened?? Look at this!!!".

 

Isn't that what couples do?

 

Isn't that normal?

 

It's the secrets that would bother me. Why NOT tell your partner that something so strange, weird & funny (in a kind of way) happened on a 'normal' night at the local sports club?

 

The only issue I read into this story is... Why don't you guys share 'events' of your lives??

[Lady Hamilton]

I with the poster above...I reread the OP again. there was no lie, he just thought it was no big deal..heck it was on an old phone most likely to get tossed. Either way the OP is out and so am I.

 

If he thought it was no big deal, he would have told her and he wouldn't have had the "well I was drunk" excuse. That points to him knowing she'd have been upset but doing it anyway, then lying about it until caught.

 

Besides which, his thinking it's not a big deal doesn't automatically make it so. For something to be not a big deal, both need to agree it's not. If they don't, then it's something that becomes something you have to work through.

[66Charger]

I with the poster above...I reread the OP again. there was no lie, he just thought it was no big deal..heck it was on an old phone most likely to get tossed. Either way the OP is out and so am I.

 

I agree. People Insert whatever they wish into threads to paint a picture to their liking. The op asked was it cheating, and most agree, it was not. While being perfect would be nice,.lets hope the Husband sees this as a learning tool and both can set strong boundaries and move forward without a war.

[ShatteredLady]

OP. How would you of reacted if your husband had come home that night & told you what happened?

 

Would you as a couple of found it weird or funny & just laughed, been shocked, whatever. Would you guys of talked about it as a 'team' or would you of been mad at him because he didn't immediately leave the place?

[66Charger]

I would like to make a point based on SLs.question. If I knew there was going to be a strip show, (bachelor party type deal) I would feel obligated to let my SO know in advance, but if it was just hanging out, and some drunk woman got up and decided to do a strip tease, and the only thing I did was look, would I go home and "confess"?. Probably not. Whats to confess?

 

However, I do understand that if you see a picture 6 months later, there is going to be some explaining to do, and the wife DOES HAVE THE RIGHT to say no more of that club.

[ShatteredLady]

I'm not even talking about confessing. I find it strange that something REALLY unusual happened & he didn't share it....you know? Like a family of ducks crossing the freeway or some strange new security drill at work? When something odd happens couples share it.

 

If a man took his clothes off & danced on top of a car in the car park at work?? Wouldn't everyone tell their partner??

 

Just wondered why they didn't chat, be shocked, laugh or roll their eyes or whatever together about it.

[SevenCity]

I'm not even talking about confessing. I find it strange that something REALLY unusual happened & he didn't share it....you know? Like a family of ducks crossing the freeway or some strange new security drill at work? When something odd happens couples share it.

 

If a man took his clothes off & danced on top of a car in the car park at work?? Wouldn't everyone tell their partner??

 

Just wondered why they didn't chat, be shocked, laugh or roll their eyes or whatever together about it.

 

 

From the OPs reaction, I'm sure the husband did the right thing by not sharing. It likely meant nothing and she would have been hurt by it.

 

She doesn't stike me as the type to find this a humorous story.

[holyrolypoly]

So who was taking photos when this woman was rubbing up on OP's husband?