Wife of almost 23 years wants divorce [updated]

[DKT3]

Bad idea. Why do you want to poison your kids relationship with their mother? It has nothing to do with them...she is still their mother and to them she will always be that. Doing this is a petty, spiteful, pathetic attempt to get your children to pick sides and judge her. It is manipulative and it uses your children to get even with her. Her cheating pales in comparison to this act. Using your children as pawns to exact vengeance on someone...not cool. Bad wife does not equal bad mother and ultimately they will suffer much more than she will. Jeff1960, I get that you're mad, and would love to get even with her, and God knows she deserves it, but I don't think your thinking clearly here.

 

He isn't impacting them by being honest about the state od the family and what's behind it. His kids are older actually young adults, they would figure it out anyways. Him being honest with them protects his relationship with them, at this point her relationship with them isn't Jeff's responsible.

 

This is the ole you telling did the damage, it wasn't that I actually did what you told that did the damage..kill the messenger, right?

[notbroken]

The previous poster said "What does being a "cheating whore" have to do with her parenting with the children..nothing at all. Using your own kids as pawns..shameful act."

 

While you should never use your kids as pawns, cheating definitely DOES have something to do with being a parent. Doesn't doing something that will break up their home and family affect the kids? Of course it does. Cheating is a selfish act that destroys families - including damaging the children and changing their lifestyle and attitudes forever. She definitely doesn't get a free pass for that. She shares the blame for that too.

 

I didn't tell my children the truth to help preserve their relationship with their mother. It cost me big time. She lied to them to cover up the truth and made me the 'bad guy'. Do NOT 'throw their mom under the bus' by using derogatory terms (ex: whore), but if they are late teens then they should know the truth - without 'rubbing their face in it'. Anything else just continues the lies. The truth will eventually come out.

[kgcolonel]

Good grief back. You BS's will do anything, including using your own children to get even. Your anger blinds you.

 

This sums it up

 

What does being a "cheating whore" have to do with her parenting with the children..nothing at all. Using your own kids as pawns..shameful act.

 

As far as telling the truth, if they're adults, it aint their business. If young children, then you definitely don't tell them details...it will poison their relationship with both parents.

 

Actually, not a BS here, only one that believes in family values, integrity and treating one as I would want to be treated....to answer the question, What does a cheating whore have to do with her parenting with the children????? Everything, they need to know that any individual who betrays another is defined by their actions. Looking up to or admiring someone who can do something as despicable as what she is doing doesn't deserve the "protection" of anyone, from the course in life she has chosen.

 

Jeff, the ultimate decision is yours however, keeping this from your kids could backfire on you as your oldest will eventually not only find out what she has done but also that both you and your youngest knew and didn't tell him. I am on the fence about exposing to other family members as that imo borders on vengence....

[kgcolonel]

Jeff, I have spent a lot of time listening to therapists discuss the "How to discuss this type of issue with the kids." The consensus has been to tell the WW that she has the opportunity to disclose what she has been up to (in your presence) by this date. If she refuses, you will disclose to them with the evidence. This way, there will be no derogatory names or lies, just the truth and honesty that a parent should be teaching the children is the foundation of the family.

[Marc878]

Good grief back. You BS's will do anything, including using your own children to get even. Your anger blinds you.

 

This sums it up

 

What does being a "cheating whore" have to do with her parenting with the children..nothing at all. Using your own kids as pawns..shameful act.

 

As far as telling the truth, if they're adults, it aint their business. If young children, then you definitely don't tell them details...it will poison their relationship with both parents.

 

If you read back her own son said she spent more time on the phone with OM than with them. I guess she's not that great of a mother afterall. Why lie to protect that?

[Jeff1690]

Let me also add this standtall. We have pounded honesty, integrity, and loyalty into our sons. Me because that is how I was raised and the Marines re-enforced that. My wife the same except she was and is betrayed by her family at every turn. The military is what turned her life around and her being a former Marine as well as a soldier now she has pounded the same things into our sons.

 

When my youngest was sitting there crying about his mother's betrayal all he could just about sit there and say was she always talked about how she hated people who would lie and deceive. She always told us to have loyalty to Family and friends, and not betray people and she would describe things about what her family has done to her. Now she has lied and betrayed you and we don't have our family as a whole anymore.

 

Now tell me why the oldest should not know?? I don't want to sit down and call their mother a lying whore. Hell Standtall I have told my youngest to forgive his mother and rebuild their relationship. Yes I angry, hurt, and betrayed. But, that is still their mother. Maybe if she comes clean with them and asks for forgiveness (even if she doesn't for me) then maybe they will forgive her in time and rebuild a close bond that she has destroyed with this ****.

 

My youngest son is freaking devastated about this information. I have raised great sons. Both are Eagle Scouts do great in school and the youngest wanted to become an officer in the Marine Corps (be a Marine just like mom and dad). The other day he said I guess some Marines aren't always faithful. Maybe I should not join.

[minimariah]

Both are Eagle Scouts do great in school and the youngest wanted to become an officer in the Marine Corps (be a Marine just like mom and dad). The other day he said I guess some Marines aren't always faithful. Maybe I should not join.

 

well, keep raising them & recognize this as an unique moment to teach them that the world isn't a black and white kind of place = OF COURSE there are MANY Marines who aren't worth sh*t, that's not the reason your son shouldn't join. will he not go to school because some of his school buddies are sh*t, too?! will he not live because the world is filled with mean people?!

 

their mother is a human being, with faults. and you are, too. like i said - this is a unique moment for you to REALLY raise the kids and prepare them for what is waiting for them in the real world. help them & seek counseling if needed.

 

also - your kind words aren't enough, you need to be proactive and supportive in their relationship with their mother and them seeing her. their relationship with her is not nearly enough destroyed and will most likely recover once enough time passes and especially when they're adults and are able to understand the situation a bit more clearly.

[Marc878]

well, keep raising them & recognize this as an unique moment to teach them that the world isn't a black and white kind of place = OF COURSE there are MANY Marines who aren't worth sh*t, that's not the reason your son shouldn't join. will he not go to school because some of his school buddies are sh*t, too?! will he not live because the world is filled with mean people?!

 

their mother is a human being, with faults. and you are, too. like i said - this is a unique moment for you to REALLY raise the kids and prepare them for what is waiting for them in the real world. help them & seek counseling if needed.

 

also - your kind words aren't enough, you need to be proactive and supportive in their relationship with their mother and them seeing her. their relationship with her is not nearly enough destroyed and will most likely recover once enough time passes and especially when they're adults and are able to understand the situation a bit more clearly.

 

Time will ease a lot of the upfront feelings. OP should have a lengthy talk about this with his sons with the gist that she is still their mother. No deragatory or demeaning of her. The truth in a sanitized way is enough.

 

However, this is something his wife needs to address. I would only be available to my sons for support and guidance. IMO step back and let them work it out together. OP will need to completely detach from interaction with her to move on with his own life.

 

Yes, we are all flawed to some degree but this is more of a betrayal of core values. Not just a mere flaw. Nothing worse than saying "do as I say not as I do". Hopefully she can do her part in fixing it as much as it can be fixed. She owns it not OP.

[kgcolonel]

Marc

 

I agree with you however IMO Jeff has concern that she will spin this to be his fault with lies etc.....I would want to be present when she has the talk even as a silent presence to ensure her tale is accurate....she has already proven herself to be untrustworthy in the worst way....I'd tell her that she's invited to the family meeting....where the truth should come from her, not him but if she's not there.....

[Jeff1690]

minimariah, Believe me I know all about Marines on liberty cheating on their wives. My youngest is not stupid, or naive to world believe me. Heck he has a 148 IQ. I believe his statement about not joining because obviously some Marines are not always faithful was him saying something else.

 

He has wanted to be a Marine since he was 4 years old, no joke. He has always been proud to tell folks both his parents were in the Marines. He has also been proud of my wife's service in the Army. Despite their somewhat rocky relationship (both are much alike when it comes to standing ground and not backing off and trying to work things out peaceably when angry. Both will cool down and hug a few hours later) He has always been so proud of her and what she has accomplished in the military.

 

I said all that to say maybe he was saying the Marine he was so proud of (his mother) who had always taught him his values wasn't everything he thought she was and why had he dreamed about following that course because of his pride in her (and maybe me too. who knows). I think his knowing what she did is making him rethink everything she has ever told and taught him, and that I am sure is tearing him up inside.

 

Not sure what you mean my kind words are not enough? Telling my son to forgive the woman who betrayed me destroyed my family unit and my dreams of being with her the rest of my life isn't enough? My wife and I were best friends before we dated. She has been my best friend for 25 years, 23 years my wife. She has left me with no communication, no intimacy, and no sex for a year and there I was thinking it was the menopause, PTSD, and the sexual abuse issues, plus tearing myself up trying to figure out what the hell I was doing wrong. Kept trying and trying to talk to her and got nothing. Then to find out with the last few weeks she also has been spending money on things that had nothing to do with us (thousands of dollars, taking trips to the beach with OM with our money, and finally not paying off my bills like we always have at the the end of the month. Her CC are all paid off though..

I think I have been more than nice for what has been done to me.

Edited August 5, 2016 by Jeff1690

[turnera]

Also I have pulled the bills from last year yesterday. Still going through them. Guess what. She has not paid off my credit cards which we used to always pay off at the end of the month. Truck and Harley not paid off. But, everyone of her credit cards so far on paid off. Since last year she has been taking extra money buying crap that could have been used to pay off my bills like she was supposed to and been buying new furniture, clothes, and everything else.

Make sure you send this data to your lawyer so that when he makes the proposal for dividing up assets, she has to put back in the amount she was supposed to have paid on YOUR bills before she can get half. Or else just take half of that amount off what she gets in the end. Make it a nice, pretty spreadsheet, with colors, showing the judge how 'girl' bills got paid off but 'boy' bills were ignored. He won't like that.

[Marc878]

This is the thing if you go through an official divorce assets get split 50/50 and since she makes more than you guess what? You are eligible for alimony payments.

 

She's probably getting a better deal than you are in this.

[Jersey born raised]

Both of your's retirement benefits by law are included as assets and an agreement is needed on division. Since she is in military you should also recieved medical coverage while retired.

 

Assest division is it 50/50 or is she trying to get you to agree to less?

 

OM is he in the marines as well? Is he a higher rank?

 

Why is the lesbian so invested in your wife's OM? I only read the first 3 and last four pages of this thread, but how do you know it is a man? While it should not matter, if she is involved with another woman it seems to matter to her. Why?

 

I suggest you read downtown's post on BPD http://www.loveshack.org/forums/members/84986-downtown/ not necessary because she is BPD or Custer B but because often they are the result of CSA and battery. Understand BPD and cluster B are based on a scale on several different areas of personality and she is must likely high on a few of them. Proper planing prevents piss poor results. Know your wife. Know what drives her.

 

Your attorney is he versed in military devices?

 

Finally get with a professional who deals with CSA. Not to save the marriage but to protect your sons and you from the fall out !

[Jersey born raised]

I would also caution a lot of advise here may be wrong. In a case of CSA a lot of good advise actually needs to be reversed. Things that make sense to you is like explaining the difference between blue, green, red and purple to a person who is color blind!

 

To get out whole you have to get into their reality and work within it to get a fair settlement.

[S2B]

I agree you have been more than nice. Stop being so nice and start demanding more!

 

Request spousal support since she makes more. Request for HER to pay off your credit card debt! Request she pay you more money to own your house.

 

She blew your life apart! IF she wants a divorce - make it hurt!

 

Stop being so agreeable with her! Don't sign those papers until you get MORE THAN you think you need! I promise, in ten years you'll be happy you asked for more than what you're asking for now.

[standtall]

Jeff... I have a lot to read. I am a little buzzed tonight and I will do better to respond in the morning. I have reasons to say what I have been saying and I am not ignoring anyone.

[tinkerbell16]

The previous poster said "What does being a "cheating whore" have to do with her parenting with the children..nothing at all. Using your own kids as pawns..shameful act."

 

While you should never use your kids as pawns, cheating definitely DOES have something to do with being a parent. Doesn't doing something that will break up their home and family affect the kids? Of course it does. Cheating is a selfish act that destroys families - including damaging the children and changing their lifestyle and attitudes forever. She definitely doesn't get a free pass for that. She shares the blame for that too.

 

I didn't tell my children the truth to help preserve their relationship with their mother. It cost me big time. She lied to them to cover up the truth and made me the 'bad guy'. Do NOT 'throw their mom under the bus' by using derogatory terms (ex: whore), but if they are late teens then they should know the truth - without 'rubbing their face in it'. Anything else just continues the lies. The truth will eventually come out.

 

Yep, this happened to me... tried to protect my adult kids from the truth that their dad cheated after almost 30 years together then one of my kids took his side for divorcing him for "no good reason".

 

Apparently I should have stayed while he got through his mid life ego boosting affair.

 

My opinion is be honest but respectfull when asked direct questions.

[tinkerbell16]

I have been following but not posted for everything has been covered well.

Though I have to add this. Typical WW story where the WW has a gets a high paying job or already has one.

 

 

They justify the affair in their mind because they only see $$ signs thinking only if I had a man that was pulling in big money like I am. Damn, life would be so sweet with both of our high incomes.

 

 

How come men in reverse situations do not do this?

 

Oh they do... it isn't gender specific

[Jeff1690]

The thing about our retirements I also work for a gov. entity and because we have been married more than 10 years she can get half my retirement. I have invested a lot into a secondary retirement from employer and in the end she would wind up winning. The asset split is good according to my attorney.

 

I have an appointment with him this coming week because I see a big problem. She wants me to sign the papers when we get the refi money. Since the house is being put in her name the check will be in her name. Now the divorce papers clearly state I get the money from the refi and savings account. So if I do sign the money is a done deal.

 

But if the divorce is finalized before I finish the cabin I am then stuck with relying on her to let me stay there. She said the last time she came home after I got the papers she did not realize filing the application from divorce attorney would show up so quick. She thought it would take 6-12 weeks. I told her if she wasn't in such a damn rush it clearly states uncontested divorce once signed will happen in 6-12 weeks.

 

Now here is the thing. The application for an uncontested divorce clearly states the lawyer is only representing one party and I am signing this with that understanding and that we have agreed to everything on the paper work, asset splits etc.

 

I never signed them. I asked the wife if she signed my name she said there was only a place to sign for her. My lawyer of course says this is BS I was supposed to sign. Now the divorce paper work is exactly the way we discussed but we had a verbal agreement (which I recorded) that we would not file the application for the divorce papers to be drawn up until the refi, I had established my residence, and got all address changes done. If she or someone else has signed my name that is forgery in this state.

 

This is my ace in the hole. Once again when I give her another piece of evidence of her deception. I can tell her well the house is yours the divorce once I have the money in hand. If not maybe I can just file a police report for forgery and there goes your security clearance and job and retirement.

 

I would like to do this anyway but not really sure sons would forgive me for totally destroying their mother (even if the youngest is angry at her now it probably won't be forever). Plus if she lost the job she loses the house and then the sons are out. Of course they can stay at my place but it isn't going to be huge and it is miles from the city and their college.

 

Another thing I did this weekend was went to the same stores where she spent thousands and bought an entire new wardrobe. Still didn't spend a quarter of what she spent the last three months in those stores. When I saw the bill I was like holy **** how could she not have even batted an eye about what she spent just on clothes.

 

We have always been frugal with our money and just seeing what I spent made me cringe. Then it made me think about the beach trip, the furniture, redo of her apartment, and all the other things she spent money on. Really got me worked up last night and could not sleep, especially what is in store for me financially. Hopefully I will come out of this totally debt free. But, the way my luck has been running makes me worry lol.

[Jeff1690]

Forgot to add my lawyer is going to draw up papers that state if the divorce takes place before the cabin is complete I can stay in the house until it is. Since she has not owned up to anything I have put forward about what she has done it makes me think she is still enjoying all her new found freedom and feels no guilt or sees no consequences for her actions. Her getting served some papers may be a bit of an eye opener. Just like when I came home to find divorce papers.

 

Also had a female friend who was cheated on a long time ago and divorced give me a woman perspective of what my wife is thinking. She of course mentioned all the issues PTSD, menopause, sexual abuse, but even these did not give her a reason to cheat. She thinks they added to the wife's stress level. Then adding in our being apart so much, the stress of her job, her inferiority complex and maintaining two homes probably made her think the grass was greener on the other side.

 

Once I got my promotion and we didn't have the same days off the game changed for my wife. Suddenly she getting a little freedom, the boys are college and self sustaining basically, and now she doesn't have to worry about taking care of our relationship. She has a bunch of divorced friends and she starts doing things with them and thinks "Hey this is great!"

 

Then this OM starts complementing her and despite how much I always complimented my wife and told her she was beautiful everyday (hell thats what I said when she called "hello beautiful". Also ever since we were married put little love notes hidden in clothes, purse, pill bottles that she would randomly find. Now that she has discovered this new found freedom hearing complements from OM and me being out of the picture most the time do to our work schedules it sounds great. The rest is history.

 

She also said in a year or two once this affair crashes as most do, and she has a few ****ty relationships searching for the Affair high she isn't gonna find it because there isn't the excitement of the affair she will realize how bad she screwed up. Not just my life but our sons. She is spot on with that. The youngest told me today knowing what his mother did has totally changed how is going to interact with women. He said once his anger has subsided he is going to tell her exactly what he knows and what her actions have caused him.

 

So how do you think my friend did on her outlook of it?

[Marc878]

Well you have to understand her logic. OM is younger so that money was well spent on impressing him.

 

Unfortunately that's what's behind it.

 

Nice idea on the wardrobe btw!!!!

 

She better hope this works out cause she's on the wrong end of 40. You on the other hand will find there are a lot of younger eligible women looking for a good man. It's all in the logistics.

Edited August 7, 2016 by Marc878

[S2B]

You better hurry up and get a copy of the papers you think she forged.

 

And make sure and get your portion of the money ordered by the court in the correct amount! It is possible she signed your name but you could be out the money if that check goes to get only! Then she has the house and the money and you have nothing but an empty promise from her.

 

She may be pulling a fast one on you! Start protecting yourself by getting the agreement ordered by the courts - IF she gets the house and money before the signed papers go to the judge - then your are out of luck - based on nothing but her breaking her word - and no judge counts verbal agreements at all.

 

Start being smart - she's about to get everything while you COULD end up with nothing! Once she has that moment there is NOTHING that shows she HAS to give you your share!

[Jersey born raised]

She is still getting you to trust her in the end. You keep expession doubts but still go ahead anyway. Title insurance is always required. Find out which one is being used and have your lawyer contact them and explain if certain terms are not meant the title would be challenged.

 

Do not accept it is never done like that or it can't be done like that. 30 years ago when I bought my house with a Var rate mog the rate when we agreed on price the interest rate was 7%. I knew a guy who at closing got hit with and extra 4%. The mor guy swore no problem he get it done before the rate changed. In writing - no. So I put in a clause if the rate rose more then .25 the sale was off. Instant shyt storm. I said you got your price, we got the money, but not to pay a rate of 7.25 with a gar of no more than x increase a year. We just want 7.25. Well....and Well... Before I walked I stated a contract is what is agreeable to all parties and transition is legal. I got my clause.

 

Well suddenly we need this, then a day later this the rates climbed. Three weeks later it is 7.5. I called the real estate agent (his commission of 7 grand was on the line-yea he had motivation) and canceled the sale and faxed him notification and had our lawyer send a certified letter. 3 days later we gad our commintment 4 weeks prior to closing.

 

Yea right - can't be done that way. She wants it done - she does it right by you. No trust just sound business.

[Mystery2Me]

Jeff I hope today shone some sunshine your way! You are growing and healing by leaps and bounds especially as it is still early days.

 

You've earned a well deserved A+ in the anger phase of the grief cycle....goodness knows us betrayed spouses all have. Going forward what will give you everlasting peace is acceptance. Right now the anger is necessary and normal to get you thru this st storm of securing yourself and learning that the wife you knew is long gone.

 

Acceptance does not mean you roll over and love the cards you've been dealt...rather you reach a point where you decide a better use of the time you have is better spent enjoying life. Yes you are losing a great deal, but still have more than you are losing.

 

You friend has nailed the postmortem of you wife....now what...you still have to live.

 

My story is sadly similar to yours....picture the scene 15th Wedding Anniversary Dinner and former husband tells at the dinner table he wants to divorce.

 

Trust me when I say grieve as you certainly must do, but acceptance will give you peace.

[Jeff1690]

The wife's birthday is this Friday. Should I make sure both sons remember-I always have to remind them to get her a card or present every year. The oldest is out of state on a college field trip, the youngest still has made NC with mother for 5 days. I do not intend to send a happy birthday anything.

 

Also as some of you have read my youngest knows about the phone records and is angry with mother. He has not bothered to call or text her. Looking at the phone records my wife has stayed in constant contact everyday with the oldest via text. Asked him he had talked to mother he said she never answers the phone (same thing youngest says) just texts.

 

The youngest is the one who my wife said I was trying to drive a wedge between them by talking about financial difficulties of divorce. Called her out on that and she knows she is wrong. Do you think she has now decided since she is closer with the oldest than the youngest that she has determined mentally she will have relationship with one son and I the other?

 

My wife has become her mother when it comes to contact with the sons. Her mother chose her step-father over her when sexual abuse as child discovered. To this day my wife has to initiate all contact with mother. A SA councilor once told me that many SA victims will continually try to fix relationships with the broken family (in this case mother) and eventually through time if they get no help will actually destroy the things they love (like a her own family). This seems to be exactly what she is doing.

 

By the way not making excuse for her A. Just looking at all the facets of my ordeal. I really don't want my sons to wind up in a relationship with their mother like she has with her's.