Cohabitating [For most of the marriage I've been less than fulfilled.]

[S2B]

[quote]Quote:
Originally Posted by Ontos  View Post
I haven't accepted her "as is", per my post: I've not been happy with things for years and have tried various approaches as well as attempting to have dialogue about what will make us both happier.
[/quote]

 

 

If YOU want/need something specific to be different with her then straight up tell her.

 

And it's not right that you make decisions/determinations "that make you both happier"! It may not be what makes her happy! Have you ASKED her what YOu can do to make HER happier? Or is this all about you?

[S2B]

From your first post - sounds like you are ripe for an affair.

 

Is there a woman you've had in mind?

[S2B]

Pteromom - I didn't "Take her Car". I pay for it and she drives it. The reason I've asked her to sign a promissory note is b/c she refuses to help with my son's college! Refuses! She has money to buy clothes, botox, spray tan and Amazon delivers some face **** or eye cream every other day.

 

So, I'm expected to haul the financial load, provide her with a brick house on 2 acres, big SUV and pay all the tuition, too?? and she can't even be nice to me?

 

I simply told her, "I'm taking customers out this week and the need the other car". She gasped, "You're going to make me drive your car"? It is a nice car - It just isn't a big flashy SUV.

 

Here is something I haven't shared, but I think is significant: In the past I've done the 180, filled my time with activities - hiking, mt biking, running, etc. She really didn't seem to care as long as I fulfilled my role as financial provider, father (coaching soccer, spending time with kids), and head of the family.

== most SO would have snapped to and engaged, but my wife doesn't care. As long as her nice life is in tact she is happy to not have an intimate relationship as long as everything stays copacetic and she can have a secure life, our kids provided for and she can tootle around in her big SUV and dress nice and have botox.

 

I'm convinced, that she is just not a kind, passionate and warm person to anyone - me included.

 

Like another poster said. Maybe I just need to accept it: She isn't a drunk, isn't running up debt and I get laid every 2 days.

 

My dog shows me tons of love, maybe that's the best I'm gonna get.

 

Oh wow - that's a whole lotta underlying hostility... Have you considered going to a therapist so you can address the anger you have toward your wife?

 

Sounds like you really don't even like her. You use her for sex and a comfy home and she uses you for financial security.

 

Where's the love? Throw that crap out onto the table and start talking about it all! Avoiding it isn't making the marriage work.

 

Heck, you could have a room mate situation that could be more interesting than what you have with your wife.

 

It amazes me that married folks don't work at making the marriage awesome... It takes being honest! If you're unhappy with the lack of connection then sit down and talk about it. If nothing is going to change then let her know you have a decision to make.

[oldshirt]

Oh wow - that's a whole lotta underlying hostility... Have you considered going to a therapist so you can address the anger you have toward your wife?

 

Sounds like you really don't even like her. You use her for sex and a comfy home and she uses you for financial security.

 

Where's the love? Throw that crap out onto the table and start talking about it all! Avoiding it isn't making the marriage work.

 

Heck, you could have a room mate situation that could be more interesting than what you have with your wife.

 

It amazes me that married folks don't work at making the marriage awesome... It takes being honest! If you're unhappy with the lack of connection then sit down and talk about it. If nothing is going to change then let her know you have a decision to make.

 

Your points are valid but if I remember correctly they have been to MC and they have discussed it multiple times.

 

She acts "sweet" for a week or two then back to the same-ol' same-ol'.

 

How much discussion and MC is required for it to count?

[Ontos]

Oh wow - that's a whole lotta underlying hostility... Have you considered going to a therapist so you can address the anger you have toward your wife?

 

Sounds like you really don't even like her. You use her for sex and a comfy home and she uses you for financial security.

 

Where's the love? Throw that crap out onto the table and start talking about it all! Avoiding it isn't making the marriage work.

 

Heck, you could have a room mate situation that could be more interesting than what you have with your wife.

 

It amazes me that married folks don't work at making the marriage awesome... It takes being honest! If you're unhappy with the lack of connection then sit down and talk about it. If nothing is going to change then let her know you have a decision to make.

 

Your points are valid but if I remember correctly they have been to MC and they have discussed it multiple times.

 

She acts "sweet" for a week or two then back to the same-ol' same-ol'.

 

How much discussion and MC is required for it to count?

 

UPDATE: So I put her on notice that I'm moving towards transitioning out of this marriage, getting my ducks in a row, researching how we can make this as peaceful as possible and best for the kids.

 

She then began her "nice act" and told me "I'm going to work on things, I'm gonna, I'm gonna".

 

I calmly said that her words are empty and no matter what she says her actions are all I'm looking at. If she wanted this marriage to have a chance she has to "DO", not "Say".

 

So, as of the last 4-5 days she's been extra sweet. Asking me if I want a Starbucks, actually kissing me bye, etc.

 

I'm still skeptical and I'm not going to crack the whip - if she slides back to her old self I'm not confronting anymore. I'll just continue with my exit plan.

 

Life is too short....

[oldshirt]

UPDATE: So I put her on notice that I'm moving towards transitioning out of this marriage, getting my ducks in a row, researching how we can make this as peaceful as possible and best for the kids.

 

She then began her "nice act" and told me "I'm going to work on things, I'm gonna, I'm gonna".

 

I calmly said that her words are empty and no matter what she says her actions are all I'm looking at. If she wanted this marriage to have a chance she has to "DO", not "Say".

 

So, as of the last 4-5 days she's been extra sweet. Asking me if I want a Starbucks, actually kissing me bye, etc.

 

I'm still skeptical and I'm not going to crack the whip - if she slides back to her old self I'm not confronting anymore. I'll just continue with my exit plan.

 

Life is too short....

 

I think that is reasonable in principle.

 

However you have huffed and puffed and threatened to blow the house down before as well.

 

Both of you have cause to be watching actions but be skeptical of words.

 

If she sees you going back to same-ol' same-ol' behaviors, she will have cause to question your sincerity and resolve as well.

 

This is going to be a Mexican Standoff with each of pointing a cocked gun at each other watching to see who will flinch or fire first.

 

If you have any inkling of wanting to stay together and have it be a happy, healthy relationship. It will likely require more professional counseling.

 

At some point you'll both have to $h1t or get off the pot.

[Ontos]

 

 

If YOU want/need something specific to be different with her then straight up tell her.

 

And it's not right that you make decisions/determinations "that make you both happier"! It may not be what makes her happy! Have you ASKED her what YOu can do to make HER happier? Or is this all about you?

 

I am VERY vocal, she is not. I've told her STRAIGHT UP and yes, I've asked what she needs to make her happy. Lately she has been reading some books that seem to make her focus more on herself (yikes, she already is self focused) and she says she needs to figure herself out first before she can work on us. I call BS on that. I believe the books are called "The 4 Principles" and the other has something to do with " Princess Warrior"? These books seem to give her a blank check to be selfish.

 

From your first post - sounds like you are ripe for an affair.

 

Is there a woman you've had in mind?

 

No - Do I crave the love of a woman - YES. I have not opened myself up to anyone and have no woman of interest in mind. Frankly, being in the dating scene sounds like a pain in the ass.

 

Before my wife, I never had trouble meeting girls - but I don't relish being back out on that scene.

[lucy_in_disguise]

I don't know what the right answer for you is, but I will say that all the "emotional warfare" is not going to produce a lasting intimate connection. I don't know anyone who is motivated to be sweeter by threats of legal action. If you are interested in repairing your marriage, I think you need counseling and to realize that the lack of connection is a two-way street. That means you may need to start caring about her interests and needs as well as expecting she care about yours. I get that you tried and she sucks at vocalizing them- that's what counseling is for.

 

I will also reiterate that your marriage sounds pretty functional (at least it did, until you got to your description of the emotional warfare). No affairs, no mental issues, active sex life- I would guess a majority of people in longer-term marriages would consider that a success. Of course your definition of success clearly differs, but it's some food for thought. You may divorce only to find yourself in a typical sexless situation, regretting breaking up your family.

Edited August 17, 2016 by lucy_in_disguise

[JoeSmith357-1]

I probably would have used that as a mandatory criteria before I married her and had 2 kids with her, but I guess that ship has sailed...

 

I think it's a little late in the game to be demanding things like this / changes. You have tried to get her to change, and she has not. I think that tells you where she stands on the issue. So you have to ask yourself if it's worth divorcing her over.

 

And the question, depending how old you are, can you actually FIND someone at this point in life that would give you what you need... I have to imagine you are in your late 40's if you have been married 21 years.

 

Attractive women without a ton of baggage / issues who are looking to get re-married don't exactly grow on trees at that age.

Edited August 17, 2016 by JoeSmith357-1

[Mysterio]

Ever ask yourself a question if you broke up with her. If she would date again and if so. Do you think she would be all over and super affectionate with the new guy?

 

I think you should go into marriage therapy. See what pops out.

[pteromom]

Pteromom - I didn't "Take her Car". I pay for it and she drives it. The reason I've asked her to sign a promissory note is b/c she refuses to help with my son's college! Refuses! She has money to buy clothes, botox, spray tan and Amazon delivers some face **** or eye cream every other day.

 

So, I'm expected to haul the financial load, provide her with a brick house on 2 acres, big SUV and pay all the tuition, too?? and she can't even be nice to me?

 

I simply told her, "I'm taking customers out this week and the need the other car". She gasped, "You're going to make me drive your car"? It is a nice car - It just isn't a big flashy SUV.

 

Maybe your wife is very shallow and materialistic. And/or maybe there was some other reason she doesn't like driving your car.

 

At any rate, you seem to really dislike her as a person. And you know she FEELS that. And you can't expect someone who feels your disdain for them to be all vulnerable and open and lovey.

 

It's a CYCLE. And you both take part in it. If you want her to be loving, you have to be loving too. Love begets love. Kindness begets kindness. Understanding begets understanding.

 

Here is something I haven't shared, but I think is significant: In the past I've done the 180, filled my time with activities - hiking, mt biking, running, etc. She really didn't seem to care as long as I fulfilled my role as financial provider, father (coaching soccer, spending time with kids), and head of the family.

== most SO would have snapped to and engaged, but my wife doesn't care. As long as her nice life is in tact she is happy to not have an intimate relationship as long as everything stays copacetic and she can have a secure life, our kids provided for and she can tootle around in her big SUV and dress nice and have botox.

 

Have you discussed with her what HER definition of a great marriage is? Some people need what you describe as intimacy more than others do. You want touchy, feely, flirty, sexy... maybe she wants deep discussion and connection on an intellectual and spiritual level, and that is HER definition of intimacy. Maybe you guys kinda want the same thing, but are going in completely different directions to get there, and aren't making that connection.

 

I'm convinced, that she is just not a kind, passionate and warm person to anyone - me included.

 

Was she kind and warm when you were dating? Is she kind and warm to her children? To her friends? To her parents?

 

If she just isn't kind and warm and never has been, you are beating yourself up for no reason trying to make her act in a way that is foreign to her.

 

BUT - if she IS kind and warm to others, then you need to do a lot of soul searching on what it is YOU do that causes her to shut herself off to you.

 

Like another poster said. Maybe I just need to accept it: She isn't a drunk, isn't running up debt and I get laid every 2 days.

 

My dog shows me tons of love, maybe that's the best I'm gonna get.

 

It is up to you whether to accept this or not. You only have one life. But yes, every choice comes with pros and cons. No life will ever be perfect, and no person will ever be every single thing you want.

[Bufo]

Time for the serious talk. She needs to hear you and understand you that she's behind in the fourth quarter with the clock running. The current game

Plan isn't working

 

Ask if she will now consider IC for her to learn why she feels about you as she does. Or MC with you. She may agree now that you've explained to her the current situation will not continue indefinitely. Or you will learn that the spark has died and that you D decision is reasonable. Either way you are moving forward out of your current Limbo state.

 

Tell her at unless she can figure out why she is not in love with you and apparently hasn't been long before she made that confession, there is nothing you can do to try to improve the status quo. You are not a mind reader,'yet it seems she is expecting that from you. Again if her reply is "nothing" then your decision and path are much clearer.

 

You cannot reasonably expect her to assume the entire burden of change. I'm quite sure she feels there is nothing wrong with there type of relationship you have. Even though she knows you aren't happy. In her mind if she can make herself content why can't you?

 

Be appreciative of the changes she has started to show. Sure, fear may be a major motivator now. Showing some appreciation (verbal) may reduce that fear if she figures out that your genuine appreciation is her reward.

 

Finally, be alert and aware. ILYBINILWY is classic cheaterspeak. If you read JFO's you'll see that exact phrase repeated all too often at the discovery of an A. And have you checked whatever meds she might be taking? Meds for depression and for anxiety can turn a patient into a flat, emotionless person.

Edited August 26, 2016 by Bufo
Stupid autocorrect can't read my mind