desperate for understanding and how to overcome

[purplesoul]

The title says it all. I am desperate. I was brought up in a fanatical controlling and religious background. We had money and traveled a lot for their work. However, being submissive to them/ religious took precedence over education. I generally performed well but it was driven by a desperation to leave to university and 'escape' my background. I wasn't allowed to go out with friends most of the time, we had to dress conservatively, we were SO different from everyone I went to school with and what made this feel worse for me at least is from the outside I don't 'look' like someone who comes from a conservative ethnic background ( no offence to anyone but I think it would have been easier had I had a cultural background I felt affiliation with).

 

Parents unstable and one day loving, the next day a mess if I went against what they wanted ie go out with my friends. We always did our chores at home and were very disciplined but the minute I went to university I lost it. I wasn't allowed to go to university of my choice as my other brother didn't get in. I also developed a serious eating disorder and suffered greatly from depression. No clue who I am. I did poorly at university. I have never been able to keep a job properly because I either give up, feel attacked or am too guilty and to be honest lazy. I had a good opportunity once, but I let it go as I was guilty and felt I HAD to come back to where my parents were living. I didn't know how to stand up to them. I married my first husband for lust/ convenience. It's as though I sought escape.

 

I KNOW I am intelligent internally. I've been told it all my life but what have I physically accomplished? Not much. I don't know how to be my own person. My parents and most people view me as someone who is independent and more free than most but I am caged. I spend so much time fantasizing about how to break free and tell my parents I don't believe what they do, I am going to accomplish my dream of doing X project. I am lucky in that in my second marriage I found a good partner and friend that I love who is SUPPORTIVE and while happy with him, I can't seem to appreciate everything he does for us.

 

We have a good life and I have a rare opportunity to accomplish my dreams but all I can do is laze around, think about the past, feel stuck and I can't just seem to care. I am disconnected from the world. The only time I feel very alive is in conflict. I don't have friends I can even talk to about this because I am ashamed. I don't know what my problem is. I am so unhappy and in years past I have been to therapists but I get repulsed and I lie without meaning to. I don't know how the lies slip so easily past my mouth. I had a psych that was good a few months ago but I slip so easily into sexual energy ( if that makes sense) in that I become TOO aware of the doctor being a man as opposed to a doctor.

 

I'm sorry if this is all jumbled but I can honestly say while I wish I could say I am unhappy I am not. I just remember a part of me that wasn't always like this. I'm becoming someone I don't like inside my heart. I don't know what I'm looking for. Any insight would be appreciated.

 

I've looked high and low on how to stop being the way I am. Why have I not been able to keep a job? Why am I so okay with taking the back seat for accountability? How can I be so assertive one way and yet so scared and worried all the time. I'm so frustrated as I write this letter I want to cry but I can't even tell what's real or not anymore.

 

(this is a repost from the self improvement section as I didn't see the family section. i hope that's okay.)

[preraph]

You have some trouble functioning independently because your parents were so overly protective. You can't teach a kid how to be an adult by continuing to control them like an infant.

 

I know the type of oppression you are talking about. I was lucky my own parents weren't that bad, but I grew up in an oppressive community of crazy Christian fundamentalists. They didn't even want us to have school dances and we wouldn't have if it hadn't been that we were partly also funded Federally because of a nearby military base.

 

It's unfair that you have not been prepared to be an adult by your fanatical controlling parents and that you will have to learn that on your own.

 

I suggest you find a friend or friends who knows how to be independent and support themselve and are also reliable people, and then get a job or more than one job and move in with that person and learn. But there's no way to do it without working. My fear is you'll get mixed up with a controlling man who will put his thumb on you just like your parents did because that is what is familiar to you, so please always remember that controlling = abusive, and do not go there!

 

Good luck. It's all up to you. It's your life, not theirs. They had their life to live how they chose to, and they chose to live it in a miserable way. They don't get to choose their lives and then run yours for you too. This is yours to live however you choose, but you do have to learn to survive.

[Downtown]

I don't know how to be my own person.... I am disconnected from the world. The only time I feel very alive is in conflict.... I am ashamed.... I don't know what I'm looking for. Any insight would be appreciated.... I can't even tell what's real or not anymore.

Purple, welcome to the LoveShack forum. A few of the behaviors you describe for yourself -- e.g., the feeling of dissociation, not knowing who you are or what goals you want to pursue, and lack of a strong self identity -- are on the list of behavioral symptoms for BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder).

 

One of the hallmarks of BPD symptoms is the feeling of dissociation, which can be manifested as a feeling that things are not real or that you somehow are a character in a movie. It also will be manifested in frequent escapes from boredom -- or from stressful situations -- through daydreaming.

 

A common experience of dissociation, for example, is the sudden realization -- when driving a car -- that you cannot recall seeing anything for the past ten minutes, not even the three lighted intersections you had to have gone through. Another example is the time you walked to the kitchen for food but, on opening the refrigerator, you suddenly realize you have forgotten what you were looking for. In these examples, your conscious mind was daydreaming a thousand miles away -- while your subconscious mind was performing the task of driving you carefully through three intersections and walking you around furniture in the living room on your way to the kitchen.

 

I caution that BPD is not something -- like chickenpox -- that a person either "has" or "doesn't have." Instead, it is a spectrum disorder, which means every adult on the planet occasionally exhibits all BPD traits to some degree (albeit at a low level if the person is healthy). That is to say, we all have experienced the dissociation occurring when our subconscious minds drive us through three intersections -- and walk us around furniture so we can make it to the refrigerator.

 

At issue, then, is not whether you exhibit BPD traits. Of course you do. We all do. Rather, at issue is whether you exhibit those traits at a strong and persistent level (i.e., are on the upper end of the BPD spectrum). Not having met you, I cannot answer that question.

 

I therefore suggest you take a quick look at my list of 18 BPD Warning Signs to see if most sound very familiar. If so, I would suggest you also read my more detailed description of these red flags at my posts in Rebel's Thread. If that description rings many bells, I would be glad to discuss them with you -- and I would suggest you read the book, Borderline Personality Disorder Demystified: An Essential Guide for Understanding and Living with BPD.

 

Significantly, learning to spot these warning signs will not enable you to diagnose your own issues. Yet, like learning warning signs for breast cancer and heart attack, learning those for BPD may help you avoid a very painful situation -- and may help you decide whether it would be prudent to spend money seeking a professional second opinion from another psychologist.

 

If it turns out that you really do exhibit BPD traits that are stronger than average, you will be able to take advantage of the excellent treatment programs available in nearly all major cities. Programs like DBT and CBT can teach you how to better regulate your own emotions, thereby reducing the intense feelings that distort your perceptions of other peoples' intentions and motivations. Take care, Purple.

[DrReplyInRhymes]

Purple, welcome to the LoveShack forum. A few of the behaviors you describe for yourself -- e.g., the feeling of dissociation, not knowing who you are or what goals you want to pursue, and lack of a strong self identity -- are on the list of behavioral symptoms for BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder).

 

One of the hallmarks of BPD symptoms is the feeling of dissociation, which can be manifested as a feeling that things are not real or that you somehow are a character in a movie. It also will be manifested in frequent escapes from boredom -- or from stressful situations -- through daydreaming.

 

A common experience of dissociation, for example, is the sudden realization -- when driving a car -- that you cannot recall seeing anything for the past ten minutes, not even the three lighted intersections you had to have gone through. Another example is the time you walked to the kitchen for food but, on opening the refrigerator, you suddenly realize you have forgotten what you were looking for. In these examples, your conscious mind was daydreaming a thousand miles away -- while your subconscious mind was performing the task of driving you carefully through three intersections and walking you around furniture in the living room on your way to the kitchen.

 

I caution that BPD is not something -- like chickenpox -- that a person either "has" or "doesn't have." Instead, it is a spectrum disorder, which means every adult on the planet occasionally exhibits all BPD traits to some degree (albeit at a low level if the person is healthy). That is to say, we all have experienced the dissociation occurring when our subconscious minds drive us through three intersections -- and walk us around furniture so we can make it to the refrigerator.

 

At issue, then, is not whether you exhibit BPD traits. Of course you do. We all do. Rather, at issue is whether you exhibit those traits at a strong and persistent level (i.e., are on the upper end of the BPD spectrum). Not having met you, I cannot answer that question.

 

I therefore suggest you take a quick look at my list of 18 BPD Warning Signs to see if most sound very familiar. If so, I would suggest you also read my more detailed description of these red flags at my posts in Rebel's Thread. If that description rings many bells, I would be glad to discuss them with you -- and I would suggest you read the book, Borderline Personality Disorder Demystified: An Essential Guide for Understanding and Living with BPD.

 

Significantly, learning to spot these warning signs will not enable you to diagnose your own issues. Yet, like learning warning signs for breast cancer and heart attack, learning those for BPD may help you avoid a very painful situation -- and may help you decide whether it would be prudent to spend money seeking a professional second opinion from another psychologist.

 

If it turns out that you really do exhibit BPD traits that are stronger than average, you will be able to take advantage of the excellent treatment programs available in nearly all major cities. Programs like DBT and CBT can teach you how to better regulate your own emotions, thereby reducing the intense feelings that distort your perceptions of other peoples' intentions and motivations. Take care, Purple.

 

Are there free services, because apparently this **** is actually a thing and real,

But most insurances won't cover the treatment and it's not a cheap, ya feel?

[Downtown]

Are there free services, because apparently this **** is actually a thing and real, But most insurances won't cover the treatment and it's not a cheap, ya feel?

In the USA, there are no free services I know of unless the client is a college student or qualifies for SSI and thus is on Medicaid. Psychologists, however, usually offer a sliding scale of charges that somewhat reflect the client's ability to pay.

 

I agree that, if the client is being treated for having strong BPD traits, insurance carriers usually refuse to cover it. That's one reason that it is rare for a therapist to list the diagnosis as "BPD." Instead, it typically is recorded and reported as one of the co-occurring disorders (e.g., PTSD or bipolar or anxiety) that is covered by insurance.

[Tayla]

Insurance cannot deny pre existing conditions, this includes mental health. in 2014 Obama clarified this .

 

We do not know if the op has this specific concern. It's best to have a professional access.

 

Most times though Op, a person who is objective in perspective can guide you to some remedies...

You seem to be aware of how this is effecting your daily life... That is a step towards resolution or adapting.

[purplesoul]

I'm on my way home now so not able to respond as I would like but wanted to send a huge thank you plus provide more information. Borderline personality has crossed my mind several times. In my previous relationship, it honestly should have never happened but I can say while I did have emotions for him, he was an escape.

 

I can't recall ever feeling anything outside of the times he would upset me and not validate my feelings. With my parents, I lived in utter fear of upsetting them while living a life they'd never approve off (not that it was even that bad to be honest). To put it basically I think at heart I am a good person, but I have awful thoughts/motivations that I'd never voice out. Things like wanting so badly for my current partner s ex to KNOW he doesn't love her as he loves me. My current partner has not done anything to cross boundaries in that respect, but it's as though I NEED him to prove he chose me ( even though he absolutely did and that relationship was over before I even entered his life!). I feel attacked so easily and triggered. That or I experience shut down of emotions.

 

I can honestly say that in the past two years I have made strides in that I left an unhappy relationship, I stopped abusing substances, I became healthier and have tried to slowly make amends to myself by taking steps to confront my parents. I have a good partner, I'm more or less okay with my body and am well living the life I always wanted BUT I am still stuck. Now I don't even have the excuse of depression. I am obsessed with seeking problems or drama or creating it while manipulating the situation to make it seem like it's not me. My partner agrees I need help but right now we are between moves so won't be in a position to start with anyone. In his opinion I can't be comfortable with being happy and I try to stir the pot to say the least. I know I sound muddled but I think getting it out is helping . I feel stupid when I explain this to anyone. Like a self indulgent perosn.

 

I've seen the looks when I have said in past that I don't feel I am "here'. Sadly sometimes when we have sex sometimes even though I Am wildly attracted to him ( and truly 100 percent honestly here) the only way I can "be into it" is imagining HIM but he's with me?? My brain can't seem to digest it but once I imagine him ie think of a picture of him or us from a birds eye view, I start to enjoy sex?! That or I keep repeating in my head HE is with you. The very person who you have to imagine as he's with you to feel? I only bring up this example because it's a heightened one.

 

However the minute I fear losing something, it's instant clarity. I will respond later when I am home but was wondering is there anything I can do to actively help myself? Also what can my partner do to help me? Hes asking. I know I'm a drain. I don't want to be this. I am absolutely open to anything to get me to stop being so passive. I want empathy back. I know it's there but I can't reach it :-( it's all I think about...

[Downtown]

To put it basically I think at heart I am a good person, but I have awful thoughts/motivations that I'd never voice out.

Purple, even if you do determine that you are a BPDer (i.e., exhibit strong and persistent BPD traits), you most likely are a "good person," as you say. BPDers generally are very good and caring people. Their problem is not being "bad" but, rather, being unstable.

 

My current partner has not done anything to cross boundaries in that respect, but it's as though I NEED him to prove he chose me ( even though he absolutely did and that relationship was over before I even entered his life!).

If you exhibit strong BPD traits, you have such a weak, fractured image of yourself that you don't have a stable, consistent set of goals and desires that you can draw from. Moreover, you lack the emotional skills needed to regulate your own emotions -- which results in you experiencing frequent changes of intense moods.

 

The result of all this is that you cannot trust YOURSELF because you don't know today what mood you'll be in -- or what goal you will want -- two weeks from now. Significantly, until you learn how to trust yourself, you will remain incapable of trusting anyone else for a sustained period. Granted, you likely will be able to believe that your H deeply loves AT THIS VERY MOMENT. But you will live in fear that, once he discovers how empty you are on the inside, he will abandon you.

 

This is why BPDers typically administer ***** tests to their loved ones, repeatedly testing their devotion and love. Yet, because a BPDer is incapable of trusting for very long, passing one of those tests does not mean that the partner has "proven" his love. Rather, it only means that -- in a few days or weeks -- the BPDer will test him again and will raise the hoop higher for him to jump through.

 

I feel attacked so easily and triggered.

BPD is said to cause people to be so overly sensitive to other people that they frequently experience "emotional hemorrhaging," i.e., a seemingly unstoppable flow of intense emotions. This is why BPDers sometimes say they feel like they have no skin to protect themselves from the outside world. As to being "easily triggered," I note that BPDers can flip from adoring a partner to devaluing a partner in just ten seconds. And, a week later, they can flip back again just as quickly.

 

I am obsessed with seeking problems or drama or creating it while manipulating the situation to make it seem like it's not me.

BPDers suffer from a feeling of emptiness and don't know who they are. They therefore oftentimes seek to fill up that void and give themselves a sense of control over life by creating drama. Moreover, part of the drama serves to push the partner away (when he is suffocatingly close or when the BPDer fears he is about to abandon her).

 

I want empathy back. I know it's there but I can't reach it.

If you are a BPDer, you likely have very strong empathy much of the time. Yet, because you are emotionally unstable, your empathy likely will disappear for long periods while you are hurting -- or while you are splitting your H black.

 

I feel stupid when I explain this to anyone.

That's just a feeling. Don't believe it.

 

I've seen the looks when I have said in past that I don't feel I am "here'.

As I noted above, every adult experiences mild dissociation many times every day in the form of vivid daydreams. With BPDers, these instances of dissociation are more frequent and much stronger. At a very strong level, for example, dissociation can feel like an out-of-body experience.

 

Indeed, some BPDers report that they have sometimes felt like they were floating above themselves and watching their activities as though they constituted a movie. This is why, in a DBT or CBT therapy session, one of the very first lessons taught to a BPDer is "mindfulness," i.e., how to remain present in the room and in the moment without escaping into daydreams about the past or future.

 

Sadly sometimes when we have sex sometimes even though I Am wildly attracted to him ( and truly 100 percent honestly here) the only way I can "be into it" is imagining HIM but he's with me?? My brain can't seem to digest it but once I imagine him ie think of a picture of him or us from a birds eye view, I start to enjoy sex?!

Because BPDers have such a weak sense of personal identity and extremely weak personal boundaries, they can quickly start feeling suffocated by their partner's strong personality during intimacy. It is a frightening feeling of being "controlled" and "dominated" by the partner -- to the point that the BPDer may feel like she is vanishing into thin air and losing her identity and individuality.

 

This scary feeling is called the "engulfment fear." I mention it because, if you exhibit strong BPD traits, it could explain why you feel the need to picture your H at a distance instead of being consciously aware of him being only inches away. That mental image of him being seen "from a birds eye view" may make it far more tolerable for you to be so physically close to him.

 

During your courtship period, however, it is unlikely you had to do that mental imaging. If you are a BPDer, your infatuation for him would have convinced you that he is the nearly perfect man who has arrived to rescue you from unhappiness. In that way, your infatuation would have held your two fears (abandonment and engulfment) at bay. Yet, when the infatuation started evaporating about six months later, those two fears would have started returning -- becoming stronger and stronger.

 

That or I keep repeating in my head HE is with you. The very person who you have to imagine as he's with you to feel?

Like I noted above, you don't have to fear losing yourself inside his strong personality as long as you imagine him (and your own body) to be six feet away from your conscious mind.

 

However the minute I fear losing something, it's instant clarity.

A BPDer's greatest fear is abandonment. So that fear will get your attention immediately. It would be a mistake, however, to conclude that being fearful necessarily brings "clarity." With respect to our perception of other peoples' intentions, our experiencing an intense feeling (such as great fear or anger or love) usually causes our judgment to fly out the window.

 

That is, intense feelings will distort our perception of other peoples' intentions and motivations. This is why, by the time we're in high school, nearly all of us already know we cannot trust our own judgment when our feelings our strong. We know, even then, we should try to keep our mouths shut -- and keep our fingers off the keys -- until we have time to cool down.

[turnera]

Are you going to a therapist?

 

Are you living with your parents?

[purplesoul]

Purple, even if you do determine that you are a BPDer (i.e., exhibit strong and persistent BPD traits), you most likely are a "good person," as you say. BPDers generally are very good and caring people. Their problem is not being "bad" but, rather, being unstable.

 

If you exhibit strong BPD traits, you have such a weak, fractured image of yourself that you don't have a stable, consistent set of goals and desires that you can draw from. Moreover, you lack the emotional skills needed to regulate your own emotions -- which results in you experiencing frequent changes of intense moods.

 

The result of all this is that you cannot trust YOURSELF because you don't know today what mood you'll be in -- or what goal you will want -- two weeks from now. Significantly, until you learn how to trust yourself, you will remain incapable of trusting anyone else for a sustained period. Granted, you likely will be able to believe that your H deeply loves AT THIS VERY MOMENT. But you will live in fear that, once he discovers how empty you are on the inside, he will abandon you.

 

This is why BPDers typically administer ***** tests to their loved ones, repeatedly testing their devotion and love. Yet, because a BPDer is incapable of trusting for very long, passing one of those tests does not mean that the partner has "proven" his love. Rather, it only means that -- in a few days or weeks -- the BPDer will test him again and will raise the hoop higher for him to jump through.

 

BPD is said to cause people to be so overly sensitive to other people that they frequently experience "emotional hemorrhaging," i.e., a seemingly unstoppable flow of intense emotions. This is why BPDers sometimes say they feel like they have no skin to protect themselves from the outside world. As to being "easily triggered," I note that BPDers can flip from adoring a partner to devaluing a partner in just ten seconds. And, a week later, they can flip back again just as quickly.

 

BPDers suffer from a feeling of emptiness and don't know who they are. They therefore oftentimes seek to fill up that void and give themselves a sense of control over life by creating drama. Moreover, part of the drama serves to push the partner away (when he is suffocatingly close or when the BPDer fears he is about to abandon her).

 

If you are a BPDer, you likely have very strong empathy much of the time. Yet, because you are emotionally unstable, your empathy likely will disappear for long periods while you are hurting -- or while you are splitting your H black.

 

That's just a feeling. Don't believe it.

 

As I noted above, every adult experiences mild dissociation many times every day in the form of vivid daydreams. With BPDers, these instances of dissociation are more frequent and much stronger. At a very strong level, for example, dissociation can feel like an out-of-body experience.

 

Indeed, some BPDers report that they have sometimes felt like they were floating above themselves and watching their activities as though they constituted a movie. This is why, in a DBT or CBT therapy session, one of the very first lessons taught to a BPDer is "mindfulness," i.e., how to remain present in the room and in the moment without escaping into daydreams about the past or future.

 

Because BPDers have such a weak sense of personal identity and extremely weak personal boundaries, they can quickly start feeling suffocated by their partner's strong personality during intimacy. It is a frightening feeling of being "controlled" and "dominated" by the partner -- to the point that the BPDer may feel like she is vanishing into thin air and losing her identity and individuality.

 

This scary feeling is called the "engulfment fear." I mention it because, if you exhibit strong BPD traits, it could explain why you feel the need to picture your H at a distance instead of being consciously aware of him being only inches away. That mental image of him being seen "from a birds eye view" may make it far more tolerable for you to be so physically close to him.

 

During your courtship period, however, it is unlikely you had to do that mental imaging. If you are a BPDer, your infatuation for him would have convinced you that he is the nearly perfect man who has arrived to rescue you from unhappiness. In that way, your infatuation would have held your two fears (abandonment and engulfment) at bay. Yet, when the infatuation started evaporating about six months later, those two fears would have started returning -- becoming stronger and stronger.

 

Like I noted above, you don't have to fear losing yourself inside his strong personality as long as you imagine him (and your own body) to be six feet away from your conscious mind.

 

A BPDer's greatest fear is abandonment. So that fear will get your attention immediately. It would be a mistake, however, to conclude that being fearful necessarily brings "clarity." With respect to our perception of other peoples' intentions, our experiencing an intense feeling (such as great fear or anger or love) usually causes our judgment to fly out the window.

 

That is, intense feelings will distort our perception of other peoples' intentions and motivations. This is why, by the time we're in high school, nearly all of us already know we cannot trust our own judgment when our feelings our strong. We know, even then, we should try to keep our mouths shut -- and keep our fingers off the keys -- until we have time to cool down.

 

Downtown, thank you so much for your hugely helpful response. I've spent the past few hours thinking about your response plus researching engulfment and abandonment. Truth is much of what you said has heavily resonated with me especially the engulfment. I tried very hard earlier to just "see" my partner and was flooded by a weird fear. I think the problem with me ( which I'm really trying to work through) is I assume I know better..That I should be over the past and that it doesn't affect me but it does. As I was reading about the signs ie helicopter parents, religiously controlling background, my "quick defense" of parents and trying to protect them (even in therapy), the huge guilt because they did after all provide for me ( I feel really bad about demonizing them when I speak of them because there is a lot of good to them too) but most importantly the inability to connect. I can honestly say I don't know how to love platonically.

 

I mean I care about people but I think it's quite in general. The people I am closest to are those I enjoy. I think outside my siblings and parents (husband too), I don't know if I feel anything for anyone. I really don't think that's the truth. I think I bury affection and caring. I think the reason I think is often when I get "clarify" I get overwhelmed with pain of others.

 

I want to get therapy but fear I can't do it in the next few months (we are moving countries) and don't know much about resources available there. Will do my research though.

 

I just want to know what else I can do to make this road easier for me. At least how to make peace with it? I'm truly open to all. Everything so far has been incredibly helpful and touches my heart that strangers would help someone like me.

 

A few questions I struggle with / observations. I get disgusted by closeness/ or repulsed at least aside from partner. This is in direct contradiction to my nature who enjoys deep conversations and genuinely interested in helping others. I say I love you all the time but run away from "intensity" of others being close to me. This is especially true with my parents. I can't ever imagine having a heart to heart. It fills me with disgust.

 

Aside from this, I'm usually bored unless I am distracted or something intense is happening. Even as I type this, I'm worried I'm misrepresent myself. How can one person have so much going on in their head? Am I just difficult? My poor partner really does try but can't understand himself as I seem alright of most time and am at least in spirit quite a happy person ( at least demeanor). Everything about me is a contradiction and even I am so confused hence the desperation for any form of insight.

 

I want to figure out what is normal and what isn't. I thought for the longest time that most people felt as I do - apathy. It comes as a surprise that people meet each other and care for each other. I mean I know I DO (???) At least I hope I do. How do I reach my heart again?? I just want to feel:(

[purplesoul]

Are you going to a therapist?

 

Are you living with your parents?

 

Not yet but I feel I'm losing hope as I've seen several in past and we'll to be honest I feed them what they want to hear or I think I know better or they try to give me drugs which havent worked. Unfortunately I can't seem to squish the part of me that analyses them as they try to help me and I get so frust rated. I really don't want to be that anymore but I'm so ashamed and feel incredibly weak when it comes to opening up even to a professional. I get repulsed at all the emotion and start to feel resentment. There are times it has worked in a session but it's a horrifying sensation like the scales over the years being removed and finally seeing. I remember those times of clarity. It's scary but instead of fightin it, I want to learn how to embrace it.

 

No don't live with parents. My partner has noticed that I have become more myself around them though but I'm lying all the time to them about who I am erc.

[Downtown]

Everything about me is a contradiction and even I am so confused.

Purple, all of us are filled with contradictory feelings and thoughts. In early childhood, we lack the emotional skills to tolerate being conscious of our strongly conflicting feelings (e.g., love-hate) toward our loved ones. We also cannot tolerate those contradictory feelings about ourselves. It takes years to be able to perceive of oneself as "an essentially good child who sometimes behaves badly."

 

Until we develop that skill and insight, we cope by categorizing everyone (including ourselves) as "all good" or "all bad." Hence, when Mommy brings out the toys, her young child will absolutely adore and love her. But, when she takes one away, the child will instantly flip to hating her. Of course, the child actually has both love and hate feelings (toward his mother) in his young mind. His conscious mind, however, only has access to one set of strong feelings at a time. Otherwise, the child cannot cope because he is too immature to handle both conflicting feelings simultaneously.

 

Although this all-or-nothing attitude greatly simplifies our early lives, it makes us very reluctant to acknowledge a mistake or bad behavior. Such acknowledgement would mean, in this black-white view of childhood, that we are "all bad" because gray areas are not allowed. This is why young children rely heavily on several primitive ego defenses to avoid thinking of themselves as "all bad." One such defense is projection, where the child subconsciously attributes the bad feeling or action to someone else in the room. Other primitive defenses include, e.g., denial, magical thinking, and the black-white thinking mentioned above.

 

I mention all this because, if you have strong and persistent BPD traits, you are heavily reliant on this black-white view of other peoples' intentions and motivations -- in the same way that young children must fully depend on it. Indeed, ALL adults tend to revert to using these childish ego defenses whenever they experience intense feelings. As I noted earlier, our judgement goes out the window whenever we have very intense feelings. The main difference with BPDers, then, is that they experience intense feelings more frequently and thus rely far more heavily on those primitive ego defenses.

[turnera]

Not yet but I feel I'm losing hope as I've seen several in past and well to be honest I feed them what they want to hear or I think I know better

So stop doing that.

 

Do you want to get better or not?

 

Nobody is going to do it for you. Nobody is going to wave a magic wand and make it all go away. And nobody can help you if you don't tell them the truth.

 

This is your grownup moment to change direction and do the RIGHT thing instead of the 'temporary feel good' thing. Tell them you suspect BPD and ask them to help with that.

[purplesoul]

Purple, all of us are filled with contradictory feelings and thoughts. In early childhood, we lack the emotional skills to tolerate being conscious of our strongly conflicting feelings (e.g., love-hate) toward our loved ones. We also cannot tolerate those contradictory feelings about ourselves. It takes years to be able to perceive of oneself as "an essentially good child who sometimes behaves badly."

 

Until we develop that skill and insight, we cope by categorizing everyone (including ourselves) as "all good" or "all bad." Hence, when Mommy brings out the toys, her young child will absolutely adore and love her. But, when she takes one away, the child will instantly flip to hating her. Of course, the child actually has both love and hate feelings (toward his mother) in his young mind. His conscious mind, however, only has access to one set of strong feelings at a time. Otherwise, the child cannot cope because he is too immature to handle both conflicting feelings simultaneously.

 

Although this all-or-nothing attitude greatly simplifies our early lives, it makes us very reluctant to acknowledge a mistake or bad behavior. Such acknowledgement would mean, in this black-white view of childhood, that we are "all bad" because gray areas are not allowed. This is why young children rely heavily on several primitive ego defenses to avoid thinking of themselves as "all bad." One such defense is projection, where the child subconsciously attributes the bad feeling or action to someone else in the room. Other primitive defenses include, e.g., denial, magical thinking, and the black-white thinking mentioned above.

 

I mention all this because, if you have strong and persistent BPD traits, you are heavily reliant on this black-white view of other peoples' intentions and motivations -- in the same way that young children must fully depend on it. Indeed, ALL adults tend to revert to using these childish ego defenses whenever they experience intense feelings. As I noted earlier, our judgement goes out the window whenever we have very intense feelings. The main difference with BPDers, then, is that they experience intense feelings more frequently and thus rely far more heavily on those primitive ego defenses.

 

Thanks. It's incredible how much you know. I don't want to abuse your knowledge but I don't think anything's helped me quite this much. How do you know so much? To be honest, I think BPD might have been something I suspected for a long time but I did not want to admit it to myself as it seems like such a 'evil' kind of disorder/ that and it isn't straight forward. What you had mentioned earlier about inability to trust rings very true. I'm sick of feeling this way and I think whatever is going on with me seems to be worse as I'm becoming less articulate, having more social anxiety ( I never had this before) and far more introverted. I used to love socializing before, I can't stand it anymore unless I 'have' to. I can spend hours online doing nothing.

 

I can't do anything right now in reference to getting therapy due to living circumstance but I should be in a good place several months from now. I am open to therapy through Skype as well but not sure how good that would be...

 

This is such an awful thing to be living. I used to drink heavily before ( several years ago) but since I stopped, it's been even harder to deal with it. I have some good days though and certain things that make me happy but beyond anything it's the dissociation that bothers me. I don;t think anyone looking at me could tell what I'm going through as ( to the best of my knowledge ) it doesn't show. I spent yesterday was my partner's family and felt so sad as that closeness they have is something I've never known. My family has financially provided for me but I can't think of one instance in which they were ever there for me. They are still obsessed with their way of being even though my partner believes they are trying from their end. I just can't seem to be normal with them and while I love them, I can't stand being near unless I have to or guilt forces me to.

 

While I would like children in near future, I've promised myself I will not as long as these problems are in my head. I see some controlling things in me that have affected my own partner negatively. I'm open about it (as much as it sucks) and trying to work through it. It really doesn't come from a bad place but more so, I am petrified of being left.

 

You know the hardest thing aside from disassociation to deal with is I feel my brain is getting slower and I'm just an imposter. I've always been seen as a 'smart' person but I think as the years pass, I started to give up more and more without admitting it to myself. I don't want to be that anymore

 

Thank you so much

[Downtown]

I think BPD might have been something I suspected for a long time but I did not want to admit it to myself.... I see some controlling things in me that have affected my own partner negatively. I'm open about it (as much as it sucks) and trying to work through it.

Purple, if you do exhibit strong and persistent BPD traits, you have an amazing level of self awareness. Simply amazing! I've had the good fortune to communicate with nearly a hundred self aware BPDers on several forums. They are so rare, however, that I've never knowingly met one in my private life even though I do know a number of BPDers.

 

I've never seen any statistics on it but I would guess that the share of high functioning BPDers who are self aware is roughly 5%. It is far higher among low functioning BPDers because they are in such severe pain that they are forced to be more introspective. In contrast, a HF BPDer nearly always reacts to the news by refusing to believe it. If the spouse is claiming she may have strong BPD traits, a HF BPDer nearly always will project the accusation back onto him. Because the projection is done subconsciously, she will actually believe that her spouse is the one having BPD.

 

I mention all this to explain why, if you are a BPDer, your chances of doing well in therapy are dramatically improved by your remarkable level of self awareness. That is, the main reason that BPD treatment has such a dismal success rate among HF BPDers is that it is rare for any of them to have sufficient self awareness to take advantage of the treatment programs. Nearly all of them (i.e., the 95%) refuse to attend therapy. A HF BPDer is filled with so much self loathing that the last thing she wants to find is one more item to add to the long list of things she hates about herself.

 

Further, even when these BPDers attend therapy at the insistence of a spouse, they typically will play mind games with the therapists (as my exW did with six different psychologists in weekly visits for 15 years). It therefore is very very encouraging that you have already overcome what is the biggest impediment to a successful treatment.

 

You are not out of the woods yet, however. In addition to the self awareness, you also must have the ego strength required to be willing to work hard in therapy for several years (at least) of weekly sessions. If you have strong BPD traits, it is important to find a therapist who is very experienced in treating it (with programs such as DBT and CBT).

 

As it seems like such a 'evil' kind of disorder/ that and it isn't straight forward.

As I noted earlier, a BPDer's problem is not being "bad" or "evil" but, rather, being emotionally unstable. This instability occurs, usually only around loved ones, because the BPDer's emotional development is stuck at the level of a four-year-old. Hence, unless you perceive of all young children as being "evil," there is no reason to hold that view toward BPDers. Like young children, BPDers flip back and forth between adoring and devaluing their loved ones.

 

I've always been seen as a 'smart' person.

It is common for BPDers to be very smart and to excel in demanding professions such as being a college professor, psychologist, physician, police officer, or social worker. What is uncommon is for a BPDer -- no matter how smart she is -- to have the high level of self awareness you are exhibiting here. Having that self awareness -- while also having a condition that nearly always makes self awareness impossible for others -- goes far beyond "smart." So far beyond that nobody yet understands how a tiny portion of BPDers are able to accomplish it. If anyone understood how you're able to pull it off, they would be making a fortune teaching other BPDers how to do it.

 

Beyond anything it's the dissociation that bothers me.

It's okay to be "bothered" by it for now. Just don't let it scare you. Like I noted earlier, dissociation is something we all do every day to some degree. At a strong and persistent level, it can become a real pain -- as you know all too well. Yet, as I mentioned earlier, DBT is excellent in teaching folks how to tame it. Indeed, "mindfulness" is one of the very first skills taught. It is one of several emotional skills that you had no opportunity to learn in childhood. But you can learn those skills now as soon as you obtain professional guidance on acquiring them.

 

You know the hardest thing aside from disassociation to deal with is I feel my brain is getting slower and I'm just an imposter.

Because BPDers never had an opportunity to learn to integrate their fractured personalities -- and because they generally grew up in an invalidating environment -- they all feel like "imposters" until they have undergone treatment.

 

How do you know so much?

I am not a psychologist, Purple. I am simply sharing my experiences from having lived with a BPDer for 15 years and having read a lot about it. I also have been looking after a bipolar-1 sufferer (my foster son) for much longer than that. Moreover, I am sharing what I've learned from the nearly 100 self-aware BPDers (and several thousand nonBPDers) I've communicated with online.

[purplesoul]

Purple, if you do exhibit strong and persistent BPD traits, you have an amazing level of self awareness. Simply amazing! I've had the good fortune to communicate with nearly a hundred self aware BPDers on several forums. They are so rare, however, that I've never knowingly met one in my private life even though I do know a number of BPDers.

 

I've never seen any statistics on it but I would guess that the share of high functioning BPDers who are self aware is roughly 5%. It is far higher among low functioning BPDers because they are in such severe pain that they are forced to be more introspective. In contrast, a HF BPDer nearly always reacts to the news by refusing to believe it. If the spouse is claiming she may have strong BPD traits, a HF BPDer nearly always will project the accusation back onto him. Because the projection is done subconsciously, she will actually believe that her spouse is the one having BPD.

 

I mention all this to explain why, if you are a BPDer, your chances of doing well in therapy are dramatically improved by your remarkable level of self awareness. That is, the main reason that BPD treatment has such a dismal success rate among HF BPDers is that it is rare for any of them to have sufficient self awareness to take advantage of the treatment programs. Nearly all of them (i.e., the 95%) refuse to attend therapy. A HF BPDer is filled with so much self loathing that the last thing she wants to find is one more item to add to the long list of things she hates about herself.

 

Further, even when these BPDers attend therapy at the insistence of a spouse, they typically will play mind games with the therapists (as my exW did with six different psychologists in weekly visits for 15 years). It therefore is very very encouraging that you have already overcome what is the biggest impediment to a successful treatment.

 

You are not out of the woods yet, however. In addition to the self awareness, you also must have the ego strength required to be willing to work hard in therapy for several years (at least) of weekly sessions. If you have strong BPD traits, it is important to find a therapist who is very experienced in treating it (with programs such as DBT and CBT).

 

As I noted earlier, a BPDer's problem is not being "bad" or "evil" but, rather, being emotionally unstable. This instability occurs, usually only around loved ones, because the BPDer's emotional development is stuck at the level of a four-year-old. Hence, unless you perceive of all young children as being "evil," there is no reason to hold that view toward BPDers. Like young children, BPDers flip back and forth between adoring and devaluing their loved ones.

 

It is common for BPDers to be very smart and to excel in demanding professions such as being a college professor, psychologist, physician, police officer, or social worker. What is uncommon is for a BPDer -- no matter how smart she is -- to have the high level of self awareness you are exhibiting here. Having that self awareness -- while also having a condition that nearly always makes self awareness impossible for others -- goes far beyond "smart." So far beyond that nobody yet understands how a tiny portion of BPDers are able to accomplish it. If anyone understood how you're able to pull it off, they would be making a fortune teaching other BPDers how to do it.

 

It's okay to be "bothered" by it for now. Just don't let it scare you. Like I noted earlier, dissociation is something we all do every day to some degree. At a strong and persistent level, it can become a real pain -- as you know all too well. Yet, as I mentioned earlier, DBT is excellent in teaching folks how to tame it. Indeed, "mindfulness" is one of the very first skills taught. It is one of several emotional skills that you had no opportunity to learn in childhood. But you can learn those skills now as soon as you obtain professional guidance on acquiring them.

 

Because BPDers never had an opportunity to learn to integrate their fractured personalities -- and because they generally grew up in an invalidating environment -- they all feel like "imposters" until they have undergone treatment.

 

I am not a psychologist, Purple. I am simply sharing my experiences from having lived with a BPDer for 15 years and having read a lot about it. I also have been looking after a bipolar-1 sufferer (my foster son) for much longer than that. Moreover, I am sharing what I've learned from the nearly 100 self-aware BPDers (and several thousand nonBPDers) I've communicated with online.

 

Your words made me cry. I'm so used to thinking of myself in such negative ways that it's so touching to be made to feel 'human'. I'm sorry you had the experiences you had with your BPDer for so long. I can see how hard I am to live with and the things I am capable of. The thing is I don't want to be this anymore. Today I took a large step and told my parents how much the style of living we had hurt me and how lost I am. Okay so I had a shot of tequila beforehand as didn't have guts to do so but it went okay I guess. My mother seemed upset ( in fairness, that's not what I was looking for) but I just needed to be heard. With my partner, I am controlling but yet very giving. I don't want to be controlling at all. I want to simply live. It's weird to know at heart you aren't come horrible person but at same time, I want to at the least theoretically have other people feel bad so I feel good (like his ex or some of my friends). Mostly I don't act on it but it is there and that's so surreal to recognize in myself.

 

Thank you for making me feel better about myself. I know 'this' isn't me and is related to many things in past/ conditioning but it helps to hear it.