Bitter Over The Fact That I Have No Experience With Women

[Sunkissedpatio]

My ex worked for an entire summer as camp counsellor at an all-girl camp. He said he learned everything he needed to know about women and how to related to their "craziness" after that summer. He also said one summer was enough.

 

Point being, it wasn't in a romantic setting and he learned a LOT about women that way

 

 

I should clarify, this was way back when he was 19. He is in his late 40's now That would be really weird if he did that now....

 

Summer jobs in the service or retail industry are ideal, you meet a lot of people that way.

[Dark Horse]

I'm surprised that no one commented on this, because it is so simple, so basic. Sometimes the simplest posts are the best.

 

OP, for all the griping you did, you actually told us very little. What have you tried? How are you even putting yourself out there, if at all?

 

The guys your age who are going on dates are....(1) actually working with these girls via summer jobs, (2) taking classes with these girls and flirting with them there, (3) meeting women through friends of friends, (4) seeing these girls around via activities such as CrossFit or whatever you're into, (5) meeting girls going out these warm summer evenings (I assume you are like 75% of the board and live in the Northern Hemisphere). Some of them are even meeting them via cold approach in the daytime! (rare but it happens) See where I'm going with this? Many ways to meet women, I just thought of six right on the spot. How many of these have you tried?

 

 

You're right, I haven't tried that hard.

 

I think to be honest, i'm not the type of person who takes risks, it's hard for me to get out of my comfort zone. I have a mental block with women that's very hard to break and it's hard to rewire your brain after years of habit unless you're truly committed.

 

Iv'e wanted a girlfriend all my life but I have a mental block around women that is very hard to break and requires me to get out of my comfort zone. I'm slowly but surely building up to this.

[Inflikted]

OK, well maybe you shouldn't wait it out.

 

I don't know. Yes, I was generalizing, but LS is a bunch of gross generalizations.

 

Wait what out? Not sure I understand your response.

[ChickiePops]

You're right, I haven't tried that hard.

 

I think to be honest, i'm not the type of person who takes risks, it's hard for me to get out of my comfort zone. I have a mental block with women that's very hard to break and it's hard to rewire your brain after years of habit unless you're truly committed.

 

Iv'e wanted a girlfriend all my life but I have a mental block around women that is very hard to break and requires me to get out of my comfort zone. I'm slowly but surely building up to this.

 

So then really, the person you should be angry at is yourself. What are you doing to change this?

 

Also, bitterness and anger are not sexy. Just FYI. So please don't succumb to that...

[JuneJulySeptember]

So then really, the person you should be angry at is yourself. What are you doing to change this?

 

Also, bitterness and anger are not sexy. Just FYI. So please don't succumb to that...

 

I don't think there's anything wrong with venting online. In a way, it's semi-therapeutic.

 

Nobody can read minds. My success in dating in the real world had zero correlation to the anger and frustration that I vented online. If you tell a person their bitterness is the root of their lack of dating success, it will only aggravate them more.

 

I actually have friends/acquaintances who openly vent on Facebook. Like one guy openly posts on his Facebook page about how shallow women are (in VERY colorful terms) for rejecting him in OLD because he is short. I could hardly believe what I was reading. But despite that, he still does OK.

Edited August 12, 2016 by JuneJulySeptember

[Chris2016]

I don't think there's anything wrong with venting online. In a way, it's semi-therapeutic.

 

Nobody can read minds. My success in dating in the real world had zero correlation to the anger and frustration that I vented online. If you tell a person their bitterness is the root of their lack of dating success, it will only aggravate them more.

 

I actually have friends/acquaintances who openly vent on Facebook. Like one guy openly posts on his Facebook page about how shallow women are (in VERY colorful terms) for rejecting him in OLD because he is short. I could hardly believe what I was reading. But despite that, he still does OK.

 

Good point. Something for all to keep mind. Venting on LS, because it's anonymous, doesn't have to translate to anything IRL. One can be mindful and keep things separate.

 

JJS, if I recall from your threads, weren't you somebody who struggled/struggling? What was the turning point? Asking for myself and maybe on behalf of OP.

[basil67]

You're right, I haven't tried that hard.

 

I think to be honest, i'm not the type of person who takes risks, it's hard for me to get out of my comfort zone. I have a mental block with women that's very hard to break and it's hard to rewire your brain after years of habit unless you're truly committed.

 

Iv'e wanted a girlfriend all my life but I have a mental block around women that is very hard to break and requires me to get out of my comfort zone. I'm slowly but surely building up to this.

 

Nice to see you back Dark Horse. I was afraid all the thread hijacking had turned you away.

 

Now, this mental block of yours: Can you talk with women who you're NOT attracted to? Do you have young women in your life in any way, shape or form?

[JuneJulySeptember]

Good point. Something for all to keep mind. Venting on LS, because it's anonymous, doesn't have to translate to anything IRL. One can be mindful and keep things separate.

 

JJS, if I recall from your threads, weren't you somebody who struggled/struggling? What was the turning point? Asking for myself and maybe on behalf of OP.

 

In terms of success with women, there was no turning point ...

 

I just kept asking and asking and putting myself out there. Yes, I have a girlfriend right now, but I could just as easily not.

 

In terms of my happiness, the turning point was ...

 

1) Instead of whining about how bad you have it (which I can 100% relate to), do something to help others. This is not just giving a homeless guy a dollar. It's talking to a guy/gal in the office who maybe is really quiet, or going out of your way to attend a birthday party for a friend even though you have better things to do. Anyway, it takes the focus off of you.

 

2) I stopped seeing life as a competition/status show where I care what anybody thinks of what I make or what I have done with my life. Live your life for you. If what you want in life required that you are making $15/hr at age 45, then so be it. And that translates 100% to the dating world.

 

It took me a long time to really buy into this, and I wish I had earlier, because my life would be different. It's hard to do at age 21 though.

Edited August 12, 2016 by JuneJulySeptember

[ChatroomHero]

You want to complain about not meeting a woman more than you actually want to meet a woman.

 

 

It's like complaining about wanting a job but never submitting one application because you say no one will hire you, then bitching you don't have a job.

 

 

The universal truth is 1. You know it takes an effort to meet someone. 2. You are openly refusing to put in any effort. 3. We can determine you really don't want someone as bad as you say, at least not bad enough to put the effort in.

 

 

if you wanted a video game that cost $50 and you had no money, you would put in at least the amount of effort to get the money to buy the game. If not, you really did not want the game that bad.

 

 

It's the same with anything, sitting around wanting it to fall in your lap is, well, stupid and childish and 100% your fault and your choice. Karma, the universe, some hidden force is not against you, you are.

 

 

You need to think of something else too. You say you read about all of these people on here and relationships and get angry and frustrated...you do realize most people are posting about bad things, right? I am going to tell you something you will find out soon enough-

 

 

You'll meet an awesome woman, you'll be excited, you may be head over heels in love with her, thinking about the perfect life with her...yet there will be plenty of times you'll just want to get away from each other and wish you were single and wonder how you could ever get so mad/frustrated at someone. Your rosey picture of relationships will be destroyed and replaced with a small idea of the effort you have to put in to maintain it and how much of a pain in the ass it will be.

 

 

That knowledge will help you get women in the future too. The aloof, hard to get attitude plays well a lot of times when in reality it is just the guy thinking, "Man she's hot, but I know in 3 months I will be completely sick of her sh*t and wishing someone else would take her off my hands, do I really want to deal with that right now?".

Edited August 13, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
language ~T

[Satu]

Find something to be happy about.

[MGX]

After he said his age, 21, I don't see it much as a big deal as opposed to being in your late 20s. I never had a girlfriend when I was 21 *shrug* and I wasn't making as much of a stink about it then...guess my interests lied elsewhere.

 

Of course, there's a lot of pregnant teens doing it, so that tells you about their upbringing.

 

18-23 is rough because that's when most horny young people are hooking up and starting relationships. I was on a college campus surrounded by young people who were hooking up in their dorm rooms after club or frat parties. Others were serious couples. Although I tried to ask women out (and thus had TONS of female friends), I was always ultimately rejected. I felt left out and inhuman until I got a girlfriend at 30.

 

LOL, even my first year roommate got a girlfriend and lost his virginity on campus. My other roommate had a girlfriend at another college whom he cheated on.

[MGX]

You're right, I haven't tried that hard.

 

I think to be honest, i'm not the type of person who takes risks, it's hard for me to get out of my comfort zone. I have a mental block with women that's very hard to break and it's hard to rewire your brain after years of habit unless you're truly committed.

 

Iv'e wanted a girlfriend all my life but I have a mental block around women that is very hard to break and requires me to get out of my comfort zone. I'm slowly but surely building up to this.

 

What exactly are you afraid of with women?

 

Do you fear the possibility of failing, so you don't ask out anyone?

Is it tiring rejection after tiring rejection?

Is it the idea that women might gossip about you failing to ask them out?

Are you afraid that lose a female friend by asking her out?

Are you fat/poor/ugly/short?

[ZA Dater]

Dark Horse, get out and date try online dating and don't go for the girls you ultimately wish to be with try girls that you sill find appealing and who are not at the top of your desire pile. Learn to relate to women in a date setting. My ex worked for an entire summer as camp counsellor at an all-girl camp. He said he learned everything he needed to know about women and how to related to their "craziness" after that summer. He also said one summer was enough.

 

Point being, it wasn't in a romantic setting and he learned a LOT about women that way.

 

 

 

 

Yes but all things being equal and attraction working on the premise of being within the same league as the person you aspire to be with...is your overall package more equal to a stallion, donkey, or something in between?

 

I think that what the Elaine567 was saying was that you have to start somewhere. Not use people, nor pay for sex but let's face it the OP is not at the level of attracting a stallion at this point. He may have the physical attributes to do so but the emotional are not there. He is a self-admitted negative and possibly "scared/insecure" person about his dating abilities.

 

The problem I see with some people when they are younger is that they see their friends who have more experience or more confidence and looks attract a certain level of people and they feel entitled to the same.

 

It's a known fact in this world that some people just need to work harder. Some people will not attract the 9 and 10 packages that others are attracting unless they can work on certain aspects of themselves that compensates for the parts they are not scoring that "highly" on the attraction scale.

 

I HATE having to attach numbers to explain this but it's the clearest way to explain it.

 

I think it really depends on ones own mind set, the OP clearly isn't in a good space hence my suggestion to find a better space, find something positive not related to dating. I don't think dating is the key to happiness but I do think its the key to find some completeness in life.

 

 

In my opinion life is about experiences and that's why I flat out reject the idea of dating down or using people to gain experience, those experiences wont ever be the ones you want so why even chase them. One needs to have realistic ambitions too, I think most people are capable of being great but that comes from within, it comes from not being bitter.

 

 

Its easy to say thing but having walked many years in the OP shoes I can say its very hard to watch other succeed and never have any success. In hindsight the key probably is to not date down but not let rejection cloud ones outlook to such an extent it negatively effects ones life.

 

 

Improvement starts from within, if you are lucky someone will arrive in your life which makes you question yourself, makes you see you can be better, motivates you to be the better person and my experience is this feeling is a good one.

 

 

OP try find that.

[ZA Dater]

As usual, there's practical, concrete reality and there's abstract LoveShack dating theories and platitudes and hypothetical situations.

 

So, let's rewind. When I was a sophomore in college, I worked with a woman who was about the same age. One of our fellow co-workers told me I should ask her out and that she thought I was cute (which remains one of the very few instances in my life that sort of thing has happened).

 

The reasons as I recall that I was lukewarm on her were because 1) she was kinda cute but not 'wow what a cutie' cute, 2) she wasn't in school (sure she has her degree by now), 3) she wasn't born here (though her English was good). She was also quite nice and pretty funny.

 

So, I kind of made a half ass attempt and then bailed. In retrospect, all of those reasons why I was lukewarm about her are totally retarded. And we could have had some fun.

 

But again, live life your own way.

 

Hey, the guy is on here whining and miserable, so I'm just giving him advice to change it up.

 

Hindsight is a lovely thing isn't it?

 

 

We are never given the benefit of it. The fact is one needs to be strong when attempting to date but there is also no shame in walking away, these past few weeks for me have been some of the best, I am not putting pressure on myself, am ignoring the quips about me never having had experience. Of course you can walk away for a time and go back or you can walk away completely.

 

 

I totally get where the OP is coming from but the way I see it he has been gifted an opportunity, he has realised there is an issue and at his age its so easy to improve, there is lots of opportunity but when you are filled with resentment and self hate its hard to see those opportunities.

 

 

The OP has time on his side and that's a huge positive, being in his position at 32 is quite different, the dynamics are different and the expectations are different too.

[ZA Dater]

You want to complain about not meeting a woman more than you actually want to meet a woman.

 

 

It's like complaining about wanting a job but never submitting one application because you say no one will hire you, then bitching you don't have a job.

 

 

The universal truth is 1. You know it takes an effort to meet someone. 2. You are openly refusing to put in any effort. 3. We can determine you really don't want someone as bad as you say, at least not bad enough to put the effort in.

 

 

if you wanted a video game that cost $50 and you had no money, you would put in at least the amount of effort to get the money to buy the game. If not, you really did not want the game that bad.

 

 

It's the same with anything, sitting around wanting it to fall in your lap is, well, stupid and childish and 100% your fault and your choice. Karma, the universe, some hidden force is not against you, you are.

 

 

You need to think of something else too. You say you read about all of these people on here and relationships and get angry and frustrated...you do realize most people are posting about bad things, right? I am going to tell you something you will find out soon enough-

 

 

You'll meet an awesome woman, you'll be excited, you may be head over heels in love with her, thinking about the perfect life with her...yet there will be plenty of times you'll just want to get away from each other and wish you were single and wonder how you could ever get so mad/frustrated at someone. Your rosey picture of relationships will be destroyed and replaced with a small idea of the effort you have to put in to maintain it and how much of a pain in the ass it will be.

 

 

That knowledge will help you get women in the future too. The aloof, hard to get attitude plays well a lot of times when in reality it is just the guy thinking, "Man she's hot, but I know in 3 months I will be completely sick of her sh*t and wishing someone else would take her off my hands, do I really want to deal with that right now?".

 

 

Completely disagree I'd think most guys who have never had any experience would quite enjoy this experience and any negatives would be completely cancelled out.

[Dark Horse]

I honestly think having a girlfriend would be a good experience for me, both the good and bad parts of it.

 

For one thing, i'd have much more motivation to clean my house and room and learn how to cook. If you're having your girl come over and stay the night, you definitely don't want a messy apartment. If I had a girl over, you better believe i'm going to clean the sht out of my place. I'd tell my roommate to do the same (we're both single and he's also not likely to find anybody anytime soon)

 

I'd be having sex, hopefully lots of it. And I woudn't have as big of a desire to masturbate or watch porn since i'm getting laid so it would be easier to quit.

 

I would have a companion and somebody to talk to. There's just something about being in the presence of an attractive female that makes me feel better, not just the sex but perhaps the companionship, love is like a drug for me. It feels amazing when you know that a girl wants you.

 

I woudn't be lonely if I had a female in my life.

 

 

And for those of you saying enjoy being single, yeah easy for you say! I think the truth is, you have to experience what it's like to be in a relationship and to have sex before you can really enjoy being single. Our brain is hard-wired to want to seek love and sex, and it will probably stay this way throughout your lifetime.

Edited August 13, 2016 by Dark Horse

[losangelena]

I honestly think having a girlfriend would be a good experience for me, both the good and bad parts of it.

 

For one thing, i'd have much more motivation to clean my house and room and learn how to cook. If you're having your girl come over and stay the night, you definitely don't want a messy apartment. If I had a girl over, you better believe i'm going to clean the sht out of my place. I'd tell my roommate to do the same (we're both single and he's also not likely to find anybody anytime soon)

 

I'd be having sex, hopefully lots of it. And I woudn't have as big of a desire to masturbate or watch porn since i'm getting laid so it would be easier to quit.

 

I would have a companion and somebody to talk to. There's just something about being in the presence of an attractive female that makes me feel better, not just the sex but perhaps the companionship, love is like a drug for me. It feels amazing when you know that a girl wants you.

 

I woudn't be lonely if I had a female in my life.

 

 

And for those of you saying enjoy being single, yeah easy for you say! I think the truth is, you have to experience what it's like to be in a relationship and to have sex before you can really enjoy being single. Our brain is hard-wired to want to seek love and sex, and it will probably stay this way throughout your lifetime.

 

I beg to differ, actually.

 

A "female" in your life is not a cure for loneliness.

A "female" in your life is not a solution to your porn-watching habits.

A "female" in your life is not an answer to your poor domestic habits.

 

Sure, having a partner can and ideally does motivate one to be "better," but to expect that the mere presence of a woman is going to turn you into a different person, it ludicrous. That's not how it works.

 

Women are not magical unicorn fairies of self-improvement.

[spiderowl]

You're right, I haven't tried that hard.

 

I think to be honest, i'm not the type of person who takes risks, it's hard for me to get out of my comfort zone. I have a mental block with women that's very hard to break and it's hard to rewire your brain after years of habit unless you're truly committed.

 

Iv'e wanted a girlfriend all my life but I have a mental block around women that is very hard to break and requires me to get out of my comfort zone. I'm slowly but surely building up to this.

 

Trying different approaches and making friends of girls is at least a start. You are only young. I know you may think you are way behind your peers, but you are not. Some of them will be boasting. Some of them will have dated and slept with girls but the girls may not have liked them so that can't really be counted as dating 'success' either.

 

I am quite a lot older than you. I have enough life experience to know that lack of sexual experience in a guy is not the worst thing in the world. The worst things are selfish guys, boring guys, dangerous guys, guys who treat you like rubbish. You can learn about women and be a great boyfriend to someone. I'd much prefer someone with a lack of experience to an experienced guy who had no respect or consideration. You need to value the great qualities you've got and recognise that they mean far more. The rest will happen naturally.

[Dark Horse]

I beg to differ, actually.

 

A "female" in your life is not a cure for loneliness.

A "female" in your life is not a solution to your porn-watching habits.

A "female" in your life is not an answer to your poor domestic habits.

 

 

 

Why?

 

The reason why i'm lonely is because of my lack of dating success and experience with women. It's like a void that needs to be filled, so woudn't it make sense that if I did have a girlfriend I woudn't be lonely?

 

Secondly, the only reason why I watch porn and jack off is because it's an outlet for my sexual urges. If I was regularly having sex, I woudn't have as strong of a desire to watch porn because i'm getting the real thing.

 

Thirdly, getting a girlfriend would motivate me to clean my apartment. I would want to improve myself for her.

 

 

Not to mention that having a girlfriend would help me with my social anxiety around women and I would become a lot more comfortable talking to girls in general so that when we do break up, it will be a lot easier to have more success with women the second time around.

 

A girlfriend WOULD help me with my loneliness and WOULD help me experience new things.

 

 

And you know what? I could be wrong, and that's the point. I want to experience what it's like to be in a relationship, the good and bad of it. Just to be able to say that I was loved in return...

 

All I want is a girl to love me. That's what I want! And you can't extinguish that flame, not even I can't! And I won't let anybody tell me to not pursue what I wan't.

Edited August 14, 2016 by Dark Horse

[Imajerk17]

Dark Horse, what do you have to GIVE women? What new experiences could *you* lead *them* to. A lonely horny and desperate dude who's looking for a woman to rescue him from his misery is just NOT desirable to the average female. I'm guessing this goes double if he currently keeps a messy apartment and spends his days jacking off to porn. I'd even go so far to say it's kind of insulting of you to think that a woman would be ok w a guy like that.

 

I think you have some serious work to do on improving yourself first.

Edited August 14, 2016 by Imajerk17

[Dark Horse]

Dark Horse, what do you have to GIVE women? What new experiences could *you* lead *them* to. A lonely horny and desperate dude who's looking for a woman to rescue him from his misery is just NOT desirable to the average female. I'm guessing this goes double if he currently keeps a messy apartment and spends his days jacking off to porn. I'd even go so far to say it's kind of insulting of you to think that a woman would be ok w a guy like that.

 

I think you have some serious work to do on improving yourself first.

 

How do you improve yourself? How do you make yourself more valuable to women?

 

And how do you let go of not wanting a girlfriend/sex? I don't know how. All I know is that I want it so badly, and it's unhealthy and mentally draining on my emotional health.

 

A sex drive over the roof and an over-active fear response is the perfect storm.

[ZA Dater]

Trying different approaches and making friends of girls is at least a start. You are only young. I know you may think you are way behind your peers, but you are not. Some of them will be boasting. Some of them will have dated and slept with girls but the girls may not have liked them so that can't really be counted as dating 'success' either.

 

I am quite a lot older than you. I have enough life experience to know that lack of sexual experience in a guy is not the worst thing in the world. The worst things are selfish guys, boring guys, dangerous guys, guys who treat you like rubbish. You can learn about women and be a great boyfriend to someone. I'd much prefer someone with a lack of experience to an experienced guy who had no respect or consideration. You need to value the great qualities you've got and recognise that they mean far more. The rest will happen naturally.

 

Exceptionally good advice.

 

 

The day I realised the bold my quality of life improved vastly.

[basil67]

Why?

 

The reason why i'm lonely is because of my lack of dating success.....<snip>

Not to mention that having a girlfriend would help me with my social anxiety around women and I would become a lot more comfortable talking to girls in general so that when we do break up, it will be a lot easier to have more success with women the second time around.

 

A girlfriend WOULD help me with my loneliness and WOULD help me experience new things

 

Sorry Dark Horse, you've got the social thing backwards.

 

Being around women in general as part of a social group will help you gain the skills required to get a girlfriend. Having friends will also help to reduce your loneliness.

 

All the things you want a girlfriend to help you do are same things which need to be in place before getting a girlfriend. A girl wants a guy who's got his act together and who is already comfortable talking with women.

 

If you want a girlfriend, you need to learn this stuff on with friends or with the help of a professional. Then you'll be in a place to find a girl

Edited August 14, 2016 by basil67

[elaine567]

Dark Horse, what do you have to GIVE women? What new experiences could *you* lead *them* to. A lonely horny and desperate dude who's looking for a woman to rescue him from his misery is just NOT desirable to the average female. I'm guessing this goes double if he currently keeps a messy apartment and spends his days jacking off to porn. I'd even go so far to say it's kind of insulting of you to think that a woman would be ok w a guy like that.

 

I think you have some serious work to do on improving yourself first.

 

Agreed.

A woman is going to take one look at the mess of your life, and turn on her heel and leave, and then where will you be?

 

Add rejection to all that misery...

[MGX]

Sorry Dark Horse, you've got the social thing backwards.

 

Being around women in general as part of a social group will help you gain the skills required to get a girlfriend. Having friends will also help to reduce your loneliness.

 

All the things you want a girlfriend to help you do are same things which need to be in place before getting a girlfriend. A girl wants a guy who's got his act together and who is already comfortable talking with women.

 

If you want a girlfriend, you need to learn this stuff on with friends or with the help of a professional. Then you'll be in a place to find a girl

 

I think MALE friends who have successfully dated can help him. They can let him know about women and their approaches to eventually acquiring a relationship. The guys can also tell him from experience where he's going wrong and what to start doing to change his fortune.