Neuroticism

[Wave Rider]

I've recently learned about the Big Five personality traits after coming across The Science of Happily Ever After, which I talked a little about in my last thread. It turns out that I score pretty high on the trait called neuroticism, which is the propensity for experiencing negative emotions, such as stress, anxiety, and depression. And high neuroticism scores are the best predictor of relationship dissatisfaction and failure, according to the aforementioned book.

 

So I'm in a tough spot, because I am exactly the kind of partner that the research literature warns people to avoid.

 

I want to talk about this neuroticism trait, because it's possible that neuorticism is a good way of thinking about what's been bothering me all this time. I've been to many therapists, as I've said before, and there is something at my core that I feel has not improved at all through all the therapy I've done. Since neuroticism is considered to be an essentially fixed personality trait, it's possible that this may be a good way of thinking of this "diagnosis" that has eluded me all this time and throughout all this therapy. No therapist has ever been able to come to a diagnosis that seems to fit well for me or that leads to effective treatment. I feel like I'm reasonably satisfied with neuroticism as way of thinking about my problems.

 

The difficultly is that neuroticism does not respond to any kind of treatment. You just have to live with it and try to manage it. I'm quite disappointed that no therapists have mentioned it to me.

 

I am hoping to find other people her who can talk about this personality trait, who have it and who can tell me about effective ways of living with it.

 

One upside of neuroticism is that it's often associated with high creativity, as we are all familiar with the stereotype of the moody depressed artist. There is data to support this, and many of history's most inventive people were also highly neurotic.

 

So instead of trying to fight or hide my neuroticism, I'm considering just being a damn good neurotic. If I'm a moody creative type, maybe I should just be the best moody creative type I can be. This may include sometimes acting in ways that are mildly or moderately destructive. And it will probably mean that my relationships will be tumultuous and will possibly end in disaster. Instead of fighting a losing battle trying to be a stable, normal person I will never be and working for a stable, normal relationship that I will never have, why not make my relationship disasters just really good disasters?

 

Are there any neurotics who want to talk about this?

[Wave Rider]

I will re-phrase the question this way: Have you ever had a situation where you met someone and you liked them and felt like you were interested, and the next morning you woke up and realized that they had major personality problems or liabilities, or you felt like something about them was "off" or "not quite right," and you suddenly lost interest in them?

[Ruby Slippers]

I'm interested in the subject and will write more on it at a later time, when not typing on my phone.

[Ruby Slippers]

I think "neuroticism" and all these "disorders" are in most cases simple focusing on the wrong subjects to think about. I say this as someone with a powerful, active intellect who's just beginning a path toward mastery of refocusing worrisome/sad/negative thoughts to relaxed/happy/positive thoughts.

 

Look into the teachings of "new thought" philosophers. I can PM you some links if you're interested. Some of these modes of thought have helped me expand my thinking and the conditions I'm creating around me in powerful and quite amazing ways.

 

I always knew I had this power within, and I know I'm only beginning to harness it. Before, I was unconsciously restricting its flow. Now I'm beginning to expand and allow for it, and it's quite a delight.

[Satu]

Here's a little psychological koan for you to play with:

 

 

“Neurosis is the way of avoiding nonbeing by avoiding being”

 

― Paul Tillich, The Courage to Be

 

 

Take care.

[Redhead14]

I've recently learned about the Big Five personality traits after coming across The Science of Happily Ever After, which I talked a little about in my last thread. It turns out that I score pretty high on the trait called neuroticism, which is the propensity for experiencing negative emotions, such as stress, anxiety, and depression. And high neuroticism scores are the best predictor of relationship dissatisfaction and failure, according to the aforementioned book.

 

So I'm in a tough spot, because I am exactly the kind of partner that the research literature warns people to avoid.

 

I want to talk about this neuroticism trait, because it's possible that neuorticism is a good way of thinking about what's been bothering me all this time. I've been to many therapists, as I've said before, and there is something at my core that I feel has not improved at all through all the therapy I've done. Since neuroticism is considered to be an essentially fixed personality trait, it's possible that this may be a good way of thinking of this "diagnosis" that has eluded me all this time and throughout all this therapy. No therapist has ever been able to come to a diagnosis that seems to fit well for me or that leads to effective treatment. I feel like I'm reasonably satisfied with neuroticism as way of thinking about my problems.

 

The difficultly is that neuroticism does not respond to any kind of treatment. You just have to live with it and try to manage it. I'm quite disappointed that no therapists have mentioned it to me.

 

I am hoping to find other people her who can talk about this personality trait, who have it and who can tell me about effective ways of living with it.

 

One upside of neuroticism is that it's often associated with high creativity, as we are all familiar with the stereotype of the moody depressed artist. There is data to support this, and many of history's most inventive people were also highly neurotic.

 

So instead of trying to fight or hide my neuroticism, I'm considering just being a damn good neurotic. If I'm a moody creative type, maybe I should just be the best moody creative type I can be. This may include sometimes acting in ways that are mildly or moderately destructive. And it will probably mean that my relationships will be tumultuous and will possibly end in disaster. Instead of fighting a losing battle trying to be a stable, normal person I will never be and working for a stable, normal relationship that I will never have, why not make my relationship disasters just really good disasters?

 

Are there any neurotics who want to talk about this?

 

I'm quite disappointed that no therapists have mentioned it to me. -- The reason that no therapists have mentioned it is because neurosis is no longer an accepted diagnosis in the mental health community. The traits and features associated with neurosis are hallmark features of other diagnosable and treatable conditions like PTSD, somatic disorders, phobias, adjustment disorders, etc. They are also associated with less manageable disorders. The term neurosis because a catch all phrase really because the patients were usually resistant in therapy and so a real diagnosis couldn't be made. It was basically, an "I give up" from therapists who simply became frustrated with their clients.

 

I would continue with a therapist that you are comfortable with and really start digging down deep into your life and what's going on inside of you. Leaving no stone unturned. People with the kinds of "issues" you're describing are very astute and will avoid the root of their issues very well and thereby, making a true diagnosis and treatment plan nearly impossible. It's easier to stay the way 'they are' than to figure everything out and go through the process and be "all in".

 

All the best to you. Do keep trying to unravel the mystery of why you are the way you are . . . you're an intelligent and valuable young person who deserves to be happy.

[anduina]

Not someone neurotic but if you're into the five factor model, consider the HEXACO Scales since it breaks out the five factors into smaller slices. This might help you identify what aspects cause you grief within the Neuroticism dimension since identification is the first step towards improvement.

 

Personality test using the HEXACO personality model

[Wave Rider]

I'm quite disappointed that no therapists have mentioned it to me. -- The reason that no therapists have mentioned it is because neurosis is no longer an accepted diagnosis in the mental health community. The traits and features associated with neurosis are hallmark features of other diagnosable and treatable conditions like PTSD, somatic disorders, phobias, adjustment disorders, etc. They are also associated with less manageable disorders. The term neurosis because a catch all phrase really because the patients were usually resistant in therapy and so a real diagnosis couldn't be made. It was basically, an "I give up" from therapists who simply became frustrated with their clients.

 

Yeah, and "I give up" is about where I'm at with finding a diagnosis. I don't think I have a clinically diagnosable mental health condition. Instead, I seem to have mild anxiety, mild depression, mild PTSD, mild phobia, mild somatic disorder, mild OCD, and mild adjustment disorder. Individually they aren't too bad, but they all combine together to cause some real problems. If neurosis is an "I give up" diagnosis, I think it fits pretty well for me.

 

And it fits pretty well with the idea of neuroticism as a personality trait, not a disorder. All of my issues here are sub-clinical, and yet they cause real problems in my life.

 

 

Look into the teachings of "new thought" philosophers. I can PM you some links if you're interested. Some of these modes of thought have helped me expand my thinking and the conditions I'm creating around me in powerful and quite amazing ways.

 

 

Yeah, go ahead and send them to me.

 

Here's a little psychological koan for you to play with:

 

 

“Neurosis is the way of avoiding nonbeing by avoiding being”

 

― Paul Tillich, The Courage to Be

 

 

Take care.

 

Well, I sure do avoid being, but I'm not sure how that helps me avoid nonbeing.

 

Not someone neurotic but if you're into the five factor model, consider the HEXACO Scales since it breaks out the five factors into smaller slices. This might help you identify what aspects cause you grief within the Neuroticism dimension since identification is the first step towards improvement.

 

Personality test using the HEXACO personality model

 

I took the regular test, not the HEXACO test. Maybe it will help.

[anduina]

I took the regular test, not the HEXACO test. Maybe it will help.

The first test has 240 questions and will provide you with a graph and some explanations for each slices per trait.

 

This one has 100 questions and does something similar, although it's not in graph form, more of a chart.

 

The HEXACO Personality Inventory - Revised

[devilish innocent]

I'm certain I would score quite high in neuroticism, and yet I'm in a stable relationship of 16 years (8 years dating and 8 years marriage). I do sometimes wonder why he puts up with me. It probably really helps that I always apologize for my emotional outbursts. The other secret is setting aside time to connect with each other in a relaxed environment. I just wanted to share my story so you know that being neurotic doesn't mean you can never have a fulfilling, lasting relationship.

[Wave Rider]

I'm certain I would score quite high in neuroticism, and yet I'm in a stable relationship of 16 years (8 years dating and 8 years marriage). I do sometimes wonder why he puts up with me. It probably really helps that I always apologize for my emotional outbursts. The other secret is setting aside time to connect with each other in a relaxed environment. I just wanted to share my story so you know that being neurotic doesn't mean you can never have a fulfilling, lasting relationship.

 

It probably has to do with how the neuroticism manifests itself. If you're just moody, and you say regrettable things in the heat of the moment, that's something that you can apologize for. If you have self-sabotaging behaviors like I do, that becomes harder to apologize for. I think it also has to do how the neuroticism fits into the overall personality. We'd expect a poet or musician to be moody and neurotic, and we accept that as part of their shtick. But we wouldn't readily accept moodiness from, say, a scientist or an athlete, which is more what I am. It doesn't really fit the archetype. Scientists are expected to be both analytical and enthusiastic, while athletes are expected to be stoic and disciplined. Neuroticism is not part of those respective shticks.

 

So maybe yes, there is hope for a good relationship. How does it work for you?

[Mind-Chants]

Since neuroticism is considered to be an essentially fixed personality trait, it's possible that this may be a good way of thinking of this "diagnosis" that has eluded me all this time and throughout all this therapy. No therapist has ever been able to come to a diagnosis that seems to fit well for me or that leads to effective treatment. I feel like I'm reasonably satisfied with neuroticism as way of thinking about my problems.

 

First thing is personality traits are not diagnosed, disorders are. Neuroticism doesn't necessarily mean extreme negative emotions. It is also associated with extreme positive emotions. It's more of a roller coaster on either side of emotions. Mostly it's the rate of fluctuation of emotions and degree of emotional stability that determines neuroticism.

 

On a curious note (if you don't mind sharing), what is your MBTI personality type and how you feel about your career achievements ??

[Wave Rider]

On a curious note (if you don't mind sharing), what is your MBTI personality type and how you feel about your career achievements ??

 

I'm INTP. I have mixed feelings about my career achievements. I have two bachelor's degrees, one in physics and one in music composition. I'm in a PhD program in physics. I've done some really cool work, like working at NASA, doing an experiment on a zero-gravity airplane, and having my musical compositions performed. The negative side is that no one else seems to be impressed by my achievements. I feel like I've done some really cool stuff, but other people treat it like it's just "white noise" so it's hard for me to care about it when other people don't seem to care about it.

[anduina]

Might I suggest that you stick to the Big Five since it's a lot more robust than MBTI?

 

There's correlation between the Neuroticism/Limbic trait, to mental health issues.

 

Since you're a physics major, are you consistently looking for logical progression to ascertain causation within social dynamics? If that's the case, analogous might be waves.

 

Should add that social dynamics aren't logical.

Edited September 1, 2016 by anduina

[TheAntiHero]

Borderline personality disorder? Look it up.

 

I'm curious as to what you are dealing with.