BF got cold feet! Guys, please help! :(

[organge]

MikeE

 

I don’t agree with you. The argument you are having – if they would be very much in love the certificate would not be important can be easily turned around.. if the certificate is not important – then what’s the problem with just having it – why argue against it?

 

I think you would have a point saying that they have not been together enough to get married. But then again if they both would be ok with that – why not it’s their choice. From my friends who are married I can say that 95% of men need a little bit of pressure to do that step. Therefore I think a little bit of pressure is a good thing. But if there is a need for huge pressure or nothing happens after months/years of pressure – the relationship is not good or complete (at least from the guys point of view- otherwise he would marry the girl)

 

Well it’s just my opinion.

 

RP – I think now you have to take a pause – don’t talk about marriage to him for some time – you have made your point. If no activity from his side within few weeks - remind him again how important that is to you.

[ReluctantRomeo]

Originally posted by RecordProducer

The good thing about long-distance relationships is that they can't get the milk without buying the cow!

 

Although he does seem to get occasional deliveries...

[RecordProducer]

Originally posted by ReluctantRomeo

Although he does seem to get occasional deliveries...

 

[RecordProducer]

Originally posted by MikeE

If you're so in love and you know this is the one, is it so important to have that certificate?

 

Without the certificate we'll always stay in a LDR on separate continents. Or we need to break up which neither of us wants to. The marriage is the only way for us to be together.

[RecordProducer]

Originally posted by organge

MikeE

RP – I think now you have to take a pause – don’t talk about marriage to him for some time – you have made your point. If no activity from his side within few weeks - remind him again how important that is to you.

I am sweet and meek to him now and he tells me how much he loves me and misses me. Honestly I don't feel like breaking up with him under any circumstances unless if he would do that.

I decided to give him as much time as he needs to feel comfortable with whatever decision. If he is not sure in a few weeks about marriage but doesn't want to break up, why would I break the possibility to be happy with him? I don't want anyone else.

 

Besides, I know he is not the kind of man that would prolong things endlessly. He is not comfortable with the LDR either. It's harder to prolong LDRs because the relationship is on hold while the partners are separated. So it won't take years. Maybe a few months.

I hope for the best anyway.

 

 

I liked the pro-vs.-against-certificate point you made. Witty too!

[organge]

to RP - sorry, i guess i was not clear enough - i actually ment to take a pause from pressuring the guy. just have a nice relationship, without talks about marriage for some time. then after some weeks/month have a talk again explain how important this is to you.. and then again - just be calm and consistant in your message.

[RecordProducer]

No, you were clear enough, but I just think I shouldn't mention the word M at all until he brings it. He got the message so how short can his memory be?

He also wants to be married, he just wants to make sure that this time it's forever.

[MikeE]

Excuse my igorance, but again why is marriage so critical here? I understand that you want to end the LDR and be together always but why is marriage (and that legal ceritificate) so necessary for that? I suppose it has something to do with being from different continents, yes?

 

Anyway, living together changes everything. I am a huge proponent of living together for a period prior to marriage. Rationally, on-line chats and a few brief visits can't possibly reveal enough.

 

Have you seen this person at their absolute worst? If so, did you love them anyway?

 

I'll say it again, the love here is not real.

 

You both just want security. I hope it lasts though your chances are very slim.

[MikeE]

Originally posted by organge

MikeE

 

I don’t agree with you. The argument you are having – if they would be very much in love the certificate would not be important can be easily turned around.. if the certificate is not important – then what’s the problem with just having it – why argue against it?

 

OK, here's why. Love needs to exist before making a legal commitment to each other. That legality is the worst and most frightening aspect of marriage. Falling in love and just being with each other is great, but bring legality into it and everything changes.

 

You say the reverse is true. So what does that mean? They should get legally married then hope they fall in love? That would be the reverse of what I stated and that's ridiculous.

[SoleMate]

RP, I have just read this story for the first time, and I must say I am VERY concerned. I don't think your bf is (necessarily) a criminal, but I really do have many of the same questions as shygurl. Marriage needs to be founded on earned trust and love, built over a period of time, not on Internet chats and great sex. The decision to marry should be freely taken by BOTH parties. Otherwise, no marriage. Usually you seem fairly savvy...yet on this topic, your naivete really takes the cake. The emails to freinds failing to mention the "upcoming wedding" are the nail in the coffin of this deceit-filled r/s. Someone happily planning to marry will be ALL about letting his close friends know. Especially in his case, since he will be "marrying" a woman who is beautiful and much younger than him.

 

Please folks, do not marry anyone if you have never visited them in their hometown, met their parents, friends, family, etc. and seen them in CONTEXT. IT's pretty darn hard to live a lie with all of the reality of your life up front and center - but over the Internet, anyone can be whoever they want to be.

 

RP, I think your "bf" enjoys having a lover/mistress/whatever in Europe, but you know, there are over 100 million adult women in the US and I would presume, nearly the same number of adult males in Europe. If either of you wanted a same-continent r/s, you COULD find it.

 

If you pressure your "bf", you will become unfun. Then he will not come to see you as much anymore. That's my fear. But wait, it's actually the best thing for you, IMO.

[rble618740]

RP:

 

You have responded to threads that I have started, and you have always been honest and helpful. I will strive to do the same, but you may not like what I'm about to say.

 

I think you should examine why you are so anxious to get married. Why have you set a deadline? I know how hard a long distance relationship can be, but if your honey has the financial means, you could probably work out a non-married, acceptable temporary circumstance.

 

I think you've been holding your man "hostage" in a way. It seems as if you are trying to force him into marriage by using guilt, time pressure, and the threat of you being with someone else. I would advise you to stop this immediately. It is a lose-lose situation. If he caves and marries you, you have the dual concerns of whether he can be truly happy with a decision he was forced into and you will wonder if he would have married you without the pressure. If he doesn't cave, you've left him no choice but to walk away. In that situation, it'll be some time before you meet and marry someone else anyway, so why not stop pushing this thing to happen so quickly.

 

Let it go, for now. Tell your honey that you appreciatd and respect the fact that he wants to make this decision carefully. Tell him you do want to get married sometime in the future and, if he doesn't see this relationship moving forward, he needs to be honest and let you know. If however he sees this relationship progressing, just at a slower rate than it has been lately (and slower than you would like), tell him that you'll be patient for a while (but not forever). Review things in six months. You think he's someone you want to marry so it won't be a waste of your time if there's a chance of a future for the two of you.

 

Be still. Take a deep breath, don't make any sudden moves, just be still. Sometimes...just sometimes...the men we love know what they're doing (I can't believe I'm saying this - but sometimes they make wiser decisions than we do when our emotions are involved).

 

Whatever you decide....I wish you peace in that decision.

[Samantha2005]

I know this is the 21st century and we're all quite free to live as we choose, but there is one thing that will never change, Record Producer, and that is this:

 

If men know they can get sex from you without any sort of commitment, they are going to take it every time, then, unless they are a rare exception, they are going to turn around and walk away from you once they've exploited from you all they can get ... (and want).... then they'll move onto greener pastures.

 

Let me add too that if they think they have a good catch, they will LIE just about anyway to achieve the desired results.

 

Dont think for a minute that you have something special that any man cant find somewhere else, indeed, he can find it anywhere at anytime and there are only too many willing females out there waiting... like the fools they are... to give it to them.

 

Men are like gold miners and women who give out free sex are like gold to them ... and you'd best believe they'll be out to get all they can get.

 

You would be infinitely better off by first getting to know a man online and by phone for AT LEAST a couple of months. You need to have SHARED COMMONALITES (and not the sexual kind) on which to base your relationship, then, make it clear that sex wont enter into a first meeting, indeed, it shouldnt be a condition of a continuing relationship unless there is FIRST a commitment ... follow this formula and you may get your man.

 

Too many "relationships" these days (if not 99% of them) are merely guises for exploiting gullible women for sexual favours ... and nothing more.

 

If a man isnt willing to get to know you and respect you as a person, not to mention as a woman, then they are up to tricks ... bottom line ... they're hunting for sex.

 

Good luck, Record Producer

[RecordProducer]

Thank you for your replies. Samantha, sorry, hun, you sound so bitter that I can't even consider your answer as valid. I advise you to change your view on men as wolves who try to get some gullible lamb to f*ck.

I do have a lot of special things that other women don't have, just like other women have special things that I don't have.

My BF and I have been in a relationship for 10 months, we talk every day for hours and have seen each other 4 times (he came to visit me each time). I can't visit him due to visa issues. It's neither his or my fault.

I was advised by some people here to wait and see what happens and that's the advice I am going to accept. So I don't need any discouragement in the limbo period. Time will show what's going on.

I

n any case, as much as I admire women's intuition, we have a talent to doubt, predict, suspect, and accuse without evidence. That feature leads us to arguments and fights with our men. The more relaxed we are the greater the chances that our men will never leave us. It's not good to be careful, cautious, suspicious, and doubtful as you girls might think... guys don't like women who always keep their guns loaded with suspicion and bitterness and are ready to pull the trigger at any doubt.

Rble, I like your answer.

 

Oh, and I must add that Woogle gave me a lot of comfort; he opened my eyes with his fear of marriage. I realized that people who have failed marriages behind them have a huge fear of the possibility that it might happen again. I guess after 10 months my BF is not sure that this time it will be forever so he needs time to be sure before making the final commitment.

 

Hm... nobody is reading this anyway...

[Samantha2005]

Well, Record producer, I’m really sorry that you see me as bitter because I don’t feel bitter at all. And as for you not seeing my response as valid ... well, that is totally up to you.

 

All men are NOT wolves, and I certainly don’t recall ever making that statement... of course, some are more so than others.

 

Do all men like sex? and will MOST of them take it when they can get it ?? Yes !! Our job (so we wont have to be sitting and writing bitter posts ) is to find out which men are going to become a problem BEFORE they have a chance to do so !!

 

And of course, we ALL have special things about us and no doubt about that !! We are all individually beautiful people !! However, it takes finding that special (and right) someone to appreciate our individuality and not allow them to exploit us.

 

You may well speak with your buddy multiple times a day i have no doubt, but from the sounds of what you stated in your initial post, he is being inconsistent, and to put it mildly, seems he was jerking you around big time.... after all ... that IS why you took the time to sit down and write the post, right ??

 

As for the issue with visa: Why doesn’t he marry you and bring you over ? I mean, that would solve it all now wouldn’t it ?

 

The problem is this:

 

If that man wanted you, there would be no visa problem at all, he would be working on those papers to bring you over as his wife and you’d have never had reason to create this post in the first place.

 

So, of course alot of guys hate women who are re all full of suspicion, and if you get to know them in the first place, you’d have NO REASON AT ALL to ever demonstrate suspicion as YOU did in your posting ... you demonstrated doubt and suspicion !!

 

Guys like that hate women who are suspicious because they don’t want to be exposed for the jerks they are .

(Key word ... GUYS LIKE THAT... not all guys) . Ergo... get to know your bud BEFORE you go to throwing your tail up in his face and you might not be sitting here writing posts.

[Woggle]

You are right him having fears about marrying again. From all you say it sounds like he does care about you and he sounds like a good guy. Just try to enjoy hee time you have with him and don;t try to force marriage. Let it evolve naturally into marriage.

 

Also men don't hate suspicious women because we are guilty. We just hate feeling like we are being put through the spanish inquisition by the woman we love.

[Samantha2005]

Of course men dont like feeling they're being subject to the "Spanish Inquisition" and neither do women.

 

I think the whole idea though is to try to find someone with whom the "inquisition" will never be an experience. I know I would never tolerate it or expect to receive such treatment.

 

Key to all of this again, though, is weeding out the good ones from the bad ones at relationship's inception, and so far as I'm concerned, RP has a loser and she knows it... after all, that is why she posted in the first place.

[RecordProducer]

Samantha, you make assumptions about him and don't even want to consider the possibility that maybe, just maybe, you might be wrong. You are certain that he is a liar and cheater and loser who jerks with me. Well that he isn't even if we never get married.

 

Men don't travel 5,000 miles back and forth 4 times and spend over $10,000 just to get laid. Oh, and what a pleasure he receives from manipulating me through my kids by spending a lot of time with them! All that for sex? Wow! Nobody has ever done anything like that just to get sex from me. The guys before him hardly ever drove me home after it...

 

If sex means so much to him then he might marry me for the same reason?

[VirginiaBob]

I have to say though, if you look at my other post about my wife's sister, he went all the way around the world only to take her virginity. Probably spent about $3000, not $10000. I guess maybe it is possible that thier are guys that do that kind of thing. But when it comes down to it, did he really spend the $3000 just to have sex with her for 2 weeks, or did he spend the $3000 to spend 2 weeks on an exotic island for a vacation and wanted someone to hang out with and screw while he was there? You know, like was she just an extra bonus?

[Samantha2005]

Probably both ??

 

That's a good point Bob and it's bad about your sister's experience, I'm sorry that happened to her. I'll try to find the post and read it. I'm just trying to make the point that so many (both men AND women) can and will do that sort of thing now.

 

As you probably know, many travel internationally now for business the way they use to travel just nationally

and many work overseas for long sprints. I meet people here every single day of my life who are basically world residents... things are just different now.

 

I read this article about an arab guy who was involved with a woman in either Oregon or Washington state and he proposed to her ... I cant remember all of the details now, but what it came down to is that this guy had something like 56 women on a string !! If you do a google search you may be able to find the article I dont know.

 

Nothing some of these people do now surprises me and I love making new friends but you can believe I will remain on high alert.

[RecordProducer]

If life was written in articles then articles wouldn't be written at all. That's why the newspapers write about such cases because they are rare. If I would base my judgment on all lonely cases about men then I should never even look at anyone, because they might rape me on the first date, sell me as a sex slave on the second, and kill me if I marry them.

 

I don't care what many guys do, I am only interested in what my guy does.

[RecordProducer]

Sam, . I started the post and asked specific questions about getting cold feet. I don't know why his veracity is being discussed by some of you at all! I am surprised none of you stopped at the fact that I started a few fights out of jealousy and because I was forcing him to marry me as soon as possible so that we could be together soon. I also wanted my kids to start school there.

 

What the hell does him getting cold feet have to do with having a bunch of girlfriends all over the world? He even brought all the documentation and wedding rings (yes, I saw them). He said he wanted to postpone things for an indefinite period of time. We're still together and will see each other again.

 

The thing is I was trying to get some constructive help here (and I did by quite a few people) and some of you are trying to discourage me completely. You base your logic on your assumption that he's an ass who has no better things to do in life but travel 5,000 miles to play with some woman's (and her kids') heart.

[Samantha3005]

If you really feel he has virtue, then prove it to yourself. Why dont you hire a PI (private investigator) to find out what's really all about.

 

I had a relationship with guy in Dubai who was hounding the holy hell out of me to go over there ... pushing and pressuring me... then when i hesitated, he wanted to meet in london and then finally to come over here.

 

But i just had a feeling that things werent quite right, so i found a guy in texas (who does online and background investigation) to alleviate at least some of my fears as well as look into what he was doing online.

 

Well I decided against pursuing the relationship so I didnt use the guy. He charges $500.00 but does a thorough background investigation and will also get info about what's going on in the other person's "online life"... like instant messages to others, etc.

 

Though I know there's software we can get that does same I'm afraid to use it and I just prefer not to go through the entire mess to be honest. I just decided that my gut feeling I should listen to and listen to it I did.

 

What it comes down to is that it really meant alot to me (potentially) but this guy comes from money and can afford to go anywhere at anytime.... for instance, he did his undergrad studies in london and then master's degree here in u.s. ... the worked a year in San Francisco... so all of this traveling and spending of money is nothing to alot of people and it's not really so very expensive to travel anywhere in the world these days.

 

As I said, good luck. But you owe it to yourself to find out what he's really all about and you owe it to your children !! Much easier though on front end instead of backend of relationship

[RecordProducer]

Now if I would hire a PI to track his internet actions, I would really feel like a total loser!

If he eventually dumps me... oh well, I'll live. I'm a big girl.

So what happened with the guy from Dubai?

[Samantha2005]

I dont know.

 

The last time we had anything to do with each other was November of 2004. All I could go by was just little things he said and did over the course of our relationship. My friends just told me... if you have a gut feeling, just go with it.

 

So I dont know and I guess I'll never know unless I decide to use this man's service in Texas. It's been awhile though so I dont think about him anymore, but when I think back on what I could have let myself in for, I guess I'm glad I let it go.

 

But If I ever do decide to get involved and I think I've found the right one, you can be sure I will STILL have him checked out just to be safe.

[soccorsilly]

Note to self: double check my own credit history, criminal record, and any other records before asking Samantha out on a date!

 

While I may agree with some of the red flags, they do not necessarily indicate that he is up to something dishonest. Remember, at least here int he US we are innocent until proven otherwise--apparently it is different in Canada, and wherever Samantha lives.

 

The fact is that these two are in love--maybe it is too soon and maybe it is not. Someone is having doubts and she wants to know what we think.

 

Stop playing the games with each other. No one like deadlines (I miss them ALL the time), no male likes to have an ex boyfriend in the wings, and I agree, if you planned to be married--you tell the whole freaking world. Saying they are not important friends IMHO is just playing with your head.

 

But he is back home now and getting his head together and hopefully he will figure it out. I would be very honest with him in any conversations--I would not avoid what you normally do to keep in touch. If yo have never called him, I suggest you still not call him. You can send a yahoo message and if he is offline he willget it when he signs on, Email is fnie, but I would not go outside of the norm that is already there.

 

You need to put the well being of your kids as your top priority and yours a close second. Do not make any life changes to them that you are not VERY sure of. In the bigger picture, your kids will be on their own someday, and that is the time when you can be totally selfish and do it all for YOU. Just be very careful as to how this will impact your children. They are a true gift (although a pain in the ass at times) and you are their guardian for a short time-make the most of it.

 

On that note, at 50, as an independent businessman, he may be close to retiring or getting out. Selling his share to his twin, etc. Maybe in a few years he can move to Eurpoe? I know I would jump at that chance when my kids have flown the coop.

 

Wait till the 28th and see what happens. Get engaged, continue the visits, and maybe increase them. I too think that if you are considering a movet to the US whenever, you need to come test the waters-maybe sometime down the road, mom can watch the kids for a week. Maybe you can take a holiday for two weeks and see what it is all about. You never know, you may absolutely HATE his hometown and could never see yourself living in it. Believe me there are some towns that I avoid specifically because I hate them. It could happen.

 

But sit tight, think of the kiddos, stop the head games (both of you--soccor is scolding you both right now), and see what happens. Maybe the LDR is the way to go for a few more years.

 

As for the impetus of the cold feet. While I do not know (and I wish I did) specifically from my ex wife's point of view what I did to end the marraige, I have identified some things that I think I may have done that led to the downfall on may part. Obviously there were actions on her side as well, but I wanted to take inventory of my faults (so to speak) and correct those that I could to insure that they did not happen again. Maybe he is doing just this right now!

 

And for crying out loud, no Private Investigators--they are for when the trust is broken--not for finding out if trust can be granted!