MM are designed to hurt us

[whichwayisup]

I know there is hypocrisy is complaining about how MM is treating me when I am married but how I am therefore treating my husband. In spite of what you may think, I love my husband and I do not want to leave him. But this thread is not about my husband and my marriage. It's about how I deal with the MM.

 

As I said in my opening post, he and I have not been together for several weeks. We have known that would be the case and if he had used that time to end things between us, I was actually prepared for that. It would have been easier for him too. But instead he has flirted and teased and made frequent reference to "us". He has led on this talk, I.e. he has been the one to initiate this kind of talk when we spoke. He has done nothing to make me think we were over until last week when he said he was "being good now". I think that was said the day before he asked me if I still loved him and he squeezed my thigh. Actions and words are far from consistent with him at times.

 

Then yesterday he carries on the flirting and whilst we knew all we could do was talk and nothing more, he suddenly starts talking of how I want more than he can give, yet also saying that he cannot do sex without emotion, that he's not like that. Somehow I was been accused of wanting more yet bring able to have sex without emotion and he was saying that he could only have sex with emotion yet also said he had been able to separate us from emotions because he has to as he is my boss. It was all contradictions trying to make it sound as if I was the problem. He and I are BOTH the problem.

 

He plays hot and cold and I let him. He keeps me just close enough for if he wants me and I let him.

 

I have given him that power over me. This is not the kind of person I usually am. I am a strong woman in so many ways but choose to be weak with him. But I am so annoyed that he tries to make out that he is innocent in all this and that it's all on me. What does he think? That I forced him to have sex with me??

 

This 'affair' is toxic and damaging you. I really hope you seek counseling and fix what's broken inside of you. I say this with care because this MM has a huge affect on you and it's not good. You're weak and making decisions that aren't good, he has so much power over you, as you say and you're addicted to the ups and downs, the drama and feelings that ensues constantly.

 

You are choosing this and it'll all end when you stop choosing/chasing MM, when you cut him out of your life. This is why I suggest counseling to help you get strong so you can end it. Otherwise you're going to lose your husband and family life as you know it.

[BuddyX]

You love your husband? How about you tell your husband about the affair but add "but I love you" at the end. See how that plays out.

 

Because that's what my ex wife did when I confronted her. She had the audacity to utter those words.

48 hours later my bag were packed and I left, never looked back. Funny, but you think that "but I love you" from my wife would've fixed everything. Nope. Love means squat when your f#%*ing behind my back.

Edited September 1, 2016 by BuddyX
Grammar

[Messy Lady]

To tell the truth I just do not know.

YOU are now no longer just a bit of fun at the office, you are too serious about him for that, and that is often a huge turn off for men who simply want NSA sex.

 

To me he doesn't seem that interested. He has had opportunities and did not take them. He knows you are ready, willing and able and he is choosing not to go there.

It may be a case of "been there, done that", or he feels guilty over his wife or he is attracted to someone else, or he may have countless other reasons... Who knows???

He has made it clear this time that sex is off the table, despite the outrageous flirting, so you need to listen to him.

 

I have a feeling he is a weak, probably a bit of a narcissistic man who just loves the attention, but he has bitten off more that he can chew with you and he now knows he could lose it all and that is scary.

My guess is that he knows you are the chink in his armour, so he is merely appeasing you by the flirting and teasing. He is scared to close you down completely, in case it all blows up in his face.

I think he may be just juggling the balls in the air and hoping he can keep you sweet, still get some validation for his ego, yet at the same time take sex off the menu, so he can "be good".

 

Elaine

 

Thank you for a very interesting and thought provoking post

 

I think there is truth in what you say. I think he has concerns that I am too invested in him. I know I am but I also think he believes it's more than it actually is. I have certainly never had any expectations or desire even for it to be more than it has been. The thing I have wanted is consistent between words and actions and over time.

 

The past few weeks have not actually given any opportunity for him and I to be together. Quite the reverse actually so there was never any expectation on my part that I would see him like that so his flirting to appease me and keep me "sweet" doesn't quite feel right. I think it is more about the ego feed for him, knowing that I want him. I made no move on him yesterday yet he flirted one minute, backed off the next and then flirted again.

 

I've made it very clear to him that he can trust me. I'm not going to cause trouble for him - why would I? It would only cause trouble for me too. I've also made it clear that whatever happens, I do not see that affecting our working relationship. He doesn't need to play games with me to make sure I don't cause trouble. I guess I feel insulted that he doesn't trust me the way I know he can.

 

 

For those of you who have chosen to post on what I clearly said was not the topic of this thread, I am not going to respond to your attacks. You have obviously decided that I want this push pull to continue but I don't. I'm fed up of games.

[BTDT2012]

I guess I feel insulted that he doesn't trust me the way I know he can.

No need to feel insulted. Why would he trust you when you are cheating yourself.

[ShatteredLady]

Oh Messy Lady. Please go back & read your first post. I'm not being mean. I really think you should go back & read all the way through. He has ALWAYS played games. He has ALWAYS manipulated you.

 

This IS the game that you're playing. 'Oh stop, we can't', 'You can't keep your hands off of me can you?', 'We can't do this again! See you in the car!'....

 

 

This is a quote from your first post here....

 

"We ended up having sex.

 

Next day back at work, he pulls back again - married, work etc. But that didn't last. We had a meeting on Monday and decided to not hold it in the office. Whilst we did work, we could hardly keep our hands off each other and ended up making out in his car later in the day. Tuesday he does the married thing and then Wednesday he is all over me again. Touching me, kissing me, etc and in the office too. Very high risk, I know. This was all initiated by him."

 

 

He will get bored, frightened, whatever & then come back to play. It's the dynamic of your relationship & he will always make you feel bad & claim that it's all your fault. Push. Pull. Push. Pull.

 

You have so much to loose & nothing real to gain. NOTHING!

[ChickiePops]

Elaine

 

Thank you for a very interesting and thought provoking post

 

I think there is truth in what you say. I think he has concerns that I am too invested in him. I know I am but I also think he believes it's more than it actually is. I have certainly never had any expectations or desire even for it to be more than it has been. The thing I have wanted is consistent between words and actions and over time.

 

The past few weeks have not actually given any opportunity for him and I to be together. Quite the reverse actually so there was never any expectation on my part that I would see him like that so his flirting to appease me and keep me "sweet" doesn't quite feel right. I think it is more about the ego feed for him, knowing that I want him. I made no move on him yesterday yet he flirted one minute, backed off the next and then flirted again.

 

I've made it very clear to him that he can trust me. I'm not going to cause trouble for him - why would I? It would only cause trouble for me too. I've also made it clear that whatever happens, I do not see that affecting our working relationship. He doesn't need to play games with me to make sure I don't cause trouble. I guess I feel insulted that he doesn't trust me the way I know he can.

 

 

For those of you who have chosen to post on what I clearly said was not the topic of this thread, I am not going to respond to your attacks. You have obviously decided that I want this push pull to continue but I don't. I'm fed up of games.

 

If the bolded is true then your way forward is very, very clear. Just stop playing.

 

 

Ignore him or report him to HR if he says anything out of line. Easy as that!

[Grammie]

I just went and read your other 2 long threads....

 

what has changed for you since April?

 

You still say you flirt with him. You still say you want to end things, but you do nothing to actually do that.

 

What is it you are looking for here? I don't understand

[Messy Lady]

I just went and read your other 2 long threads....

 

what has changed for you since April?

 

You still say you flirt with him. You still say you want to end things, but you do nothing to actually do that.

 

What is it you are looking for here? I don't understand

 

Those threads, like this one, help provide moments of clarity. Moments when I see how badly the MM treats me and how it's me letting him do that.

 

I'm so very tired of all this now.

[whichwayisup]

Those threads, like this one, help provide moments of clarity. Moments when I see how badly the MM treats me and how it's me letting him do that.

 

I'm so very tired of all this now.

 

Tired enough put your resume together and start looking for another job? Tired enough to seek counseling and ending your affair?

[Messy Lady]

Tired enough put your resume together and start looking for another job? Tired enough to seek counseling and ending your affair?

 

I have recently started looking out for other jobs.

[lftbehind]

Do you think he will come back for more sex at some stage then?

 

Yes, I think he'll come back for sex. I'm in a similar situation with my boss and is hot and cold. He is sending mixed messages and he'll talk to me and acts like he really enjoys it and I feel flattered, but a lot of times he'll ignore me and it makes me feel like nothing. I think that he has a girlfriend, but he told me that they broke up. We'll go a while and hardly talk at work and he won't text me or call me. I texted him a few times and he never answered, so I didn't do it again. When we start talking again, he says that I should have texted him. He said that he never got it. I really think that these guys are not invested in us, they just like to toy with us. I feel like I have to placate him, so my time at work is not miserable. I wish that I didn't have to see him again.

[Lois_Griffin]

Do you think he will come back for more sex at some stage then?

Some of them do when they get an itchy d*ck and know you're a sure thing.

 

Ahh, romance.

[wmacbride]

Those threads, like this one, help provide moments of clarity. Moments when I see how badly the MM treats me and how it's me letting him do that.

 

I'm so very tired of all this now.

 

you are making this incredibly complicated when it doesn't have to be.

 

You have two options. Either you want the A to continue or you don't. If you don't, then tell him and stick to you choice. If he refuses to leave you alone, then go to your company's HR department and file a complaint.

 

If you want it to continue, then keep on doing what you are doing and tie your mind up in knots trying to keep him interested.

 

Either way, you are not a victim and you have choices. He does what he does because you allow it. If you want it to stop, then make it stop. It's as simple as saying "no".

[stillafool]

Those threads, like this one, help provide moments of clarity. Moments when I see how badly the MM treats me and how it's me letting him do that.

 

I'm so very tired of all this now.

 

And what are you doing about this to help yourself?

[sandylee1]

Messy

 

You are the architect of your own destruction. You're not a lovesick teenager and you need to get with the programme. Not asking or hoping if he'll be back for sex. You sound desperate and that's what your MM sees. DESPERATION. It's not an attractive trait.

 

I didn't realise you were married initially. Let alone that you proclaim to love your husband. Since when did deception, breaking vows and cheating = love?

 

Your MM doesn't respect you. He knows your cheating on your husband and he wouldn't want a wife who did that. You serve a purpose and have a role for him when he wants.

 

The fact that he's warned you how to behave on the trip really speaks volumes. He flirts and toys with you to give him a boost and because he can.

[Messy Lady]

I don't want to talk to MM about "us" but I was wondering about sending him an email. When he and I had that last conversation about us, he said a couple of things which made it clear he has not understood how I felt about some things. In some ways, his understanding of how I felt (feel) is not as positive as the truth. In the email I could put him right on this.

 

But I also know there are reasons for not sending him the email - I.e. It is over between him and I so work only. But I don't like him thinking what he does.

 

I don't know what to do here.

[Tayla]

Can you email his wife and share with her your emotional desire for validation? Maybe she will have compassion since you both are involved with him?.

Come clean and move on. I'm sure you have it in you to grow beyond this scenario.

[Messy Lady]

.................

Edited September 5, 2016 by Messy Lady

[lftbehind]

I don't want to talk to MM about "us" but I was wondering about sending him an email. When he and I had that last conversation about us, he said a couple of things which made it clear he has not understood how I felt about some things. In some ways, his understanding of how I felt (feel) is not as positive as the truth. In the email I could put him right on this.

 

But I also know there are reasons for not sending him the email - I.e. It is over between him and I so work only. But I don't like him thinking what he does.

 

I don't know what to do here.

 

I think that the MM acting like he doesn't understand what you're feeling is part of his manipulation. I think he probably knows what you're feeling, but doesn't want to address it and doesn't really care. He sounds very selfish. Don't give him the satisfaction of sending an email explaining yourself.

[Southern Sun]

Messy, good grief, this man is straight up using you.

 

You are making yourself available to him, to be his beck and call girl.

 

He can say whatever he wants and do whatever he wants and you are just there.

 

He is talking out of both sides of his mouth for very simple reasons: he doesn't really want to have to deal with you emotionally, but would like to tap you for sex if and when he feels like it. But ONLY when he feels like it. He wants to control the situation entirely. He knows he can do this because he HAS done this with you. He keeps you guessing with one lip hooked on the line because it works. You are invested just enough emotionally to stick around. All your questions will remain unanswered because it keeps you there. And because his truthful answers would make any woman with any self-respect turn and walk.

 

And if he really is the way you describe, he may even get some sadistic pleasure out of seeing you respond like a puppet to his machinations.

 

I hope at some point you will see this for what it is and put him back in his rightful place...and you back in yours.

[Messy Lady]

I think that the MM acting like he doesn't understand what you're feeling is part of his manipulation. I think he probably knows what you're feeling, but doesn't want to address it and doesn't really care. He sounds very selfish. Don't give him the satisfaction of sending an email explaining yourself.

 

Whilst I'm not sure whether he does understand, my concern would be whether it gave him any perverse satisfaction if I clarified my feelings.

 

Messy, good grief, this man is straight up using you.

 

You are making yourself available to him, to be his beck and call girl.

 

He can say whatever he wants and do whatever he wants and you are just there.

 

He is talking out of both sides of his mouth for very simple reasons: he doesn't really want to have to deal with you emotionally, but would like to tap you for sex if and when he feels like it. But ONLY when he feels like it. He wants to control the situation entirely. He knows he can do this because he HAS done this with you. He keeps you guessing with one lip hooked on the line because it works. You are invested just enough emotionally to stick around. All your questions will remain unanswered because it keeps you there. And because his truthful answers would make any woman with any self-respect turn and walk.

 

And if he really is the way you describe, he may even get some sadistic pleasure out of seeing you respond like a puppet to his machinations.

 

I hope at some point you will see this for what it is and put him back in his rightful place...and you back in yours.

 

I think there is so much in this - he wants the sex now and then but wants no emotions. I said to him last week that he doesn't know what he should do with me. He responded that he does - keep me at arms length. I'm close enough to reel in when he wants me and far enough away the rest of the time for him to pretend nothing is going on.

 

It's occurred to me since I started this thread that his guilt and back off mode last week may in part be due to the weekend not only being his wedding anniversary but also his wife's 60th birthday with lots of family celebrations etc. I'm sure he feels like he's the great husband after our latest ending (he's ended things before so I'm not convinced he won't be back).

 

Finally - thank you both for actually trying to help me with my last post and not just use it as a means of making another attack.

[bathtub-row]

He's just playing games with you in order to make you continue wanting him. It's a form of reverse psychology. You need to understand that your emotions are your worst enemy right now. This is how women end up making complete fools of themselves. It's not relevant how you feel about him. Learn to control your emotions and disguise them when you're around him. This situation has nowhere to go but down the drain.

[S2B]

I don't want to talk to MM about "us" but I was wondering about sending him an email. When he and I had that last conversation about us, he said a couple of things which made it clear he has not understood how I felt about some things. In some ways, his understanding of how I felt (feel) is not as positive as the truth. In the email I could put him right on this.

 

But I also know there are reasons for not sending him the email - I.e. It is over between him and I so work only. But I don't like him thinking what he does.

 

I don't know what to do here.

 

You are doing this to yourself. You have choices. You can choose not to communicate at all with him on a personal level.

 

When you no longer care what he thinks and what he does - that's when you will have your power back.

 

Stop handing him all your power. He's not victimizing you - you are a willing volunteer. I hope you get some professional guidance to get past these issues.

[lftbehind]

Whilst I'm not sure whether he does understand, my concern would be whether it gave him any perverse satisfaction if I clarified my feelings.

 

 

 

I think there is so much in this - he wants the sex now and then but wants no emotions. I said to him last week that he doesn't know what he should do with me. He responded that he does - keep me at arms length. I'm close enough to reel in when he wants me and far enough away the rest of the time for him to pretend nothing is going on.

 

It's occurred to me since I started this thread that his guilt and back off mode last week may in part be due to the weekend not only being his wedding anniversary but also his wife's 60th birthday with lots of family celebrations etc. I'm sure he feels like he's the great husband after our latest ending (he's ended things before so I'm not convinced he won't be back).

 

Finally - thank you both for actually trying to help me with my last post and not just use it as a means of making another attack.

 

You're welcome, hope that I help you some. I am in a similar situation with my boss and I posted a thread that's in the General section of loveshack. It's called for those that have had an affair in the workplace. My boss isn't married, but has a girlfriend. He told me that they had broken up. I think that he likes having control over me and my emotions, even though he doesn't talk to me much. He is looking at me all night at work. At this point, I just am wanting to be cordial with him. I do really like him, but don't think he cares about me and I'm tired of dealing with him. If you get a chance, please check out that thread. Good luck to you.

[winterkeep]

Messy, how would you react if this were a single guy acting this way? Would you keep making excuses of him, because that's what your doing. I'll be blunt, the guy is manipulating you because he likes the fact that he can. He'll be back for sex for sure but not before creating the narrative that this is all your fault, I think that's why he keeps bringing up the being married thing - poor faithful him, trying to fight the evil temptress - because when he justifies it to himself or anyone else he TRIED to tell you didn't he?

 

Don't let his mention of emotion throw you, he's hardly going to say "I just wanna use you for sex" as he's probably smart enough to know that you wouldn't sleep with him if he did. Instead he hints at emotion but never states it, again making it all your fault if you read too much into what he's saying.

 

I think at this point you are looking at him to emotionally validate you, he won't though and you cannot gain back the dignity or "earn" back the right of being viewed as a complete, autonomous human by him by appealing to him. Your only hope at regaining a semblance of that is to walk away and let him know he can't touch you anymore. Don't send him the letter, he doesn't care.