GF is an alcoholic

[merrmeade]

I wish I had advice for one of the best advice-givers here, but I don't have much to add to the good advice you've already gotten. I'm just sorry you find yourself in this situation, and about the only thing I can say is that I know you'll do the right thing and can handle the results.

Ditto this sentiment. (((((Oh, BH)))) I would love to be your mother. Reading this was like listening/talking to my daughter. I know and respect her sense of balance and emotional health so well that we can cover a lot of ground quickly (whether or not that's a solution every time) when there's a problem - or just figuring out everyone else. In fact, I would love for you to meet and marry my daughter. Seriously. You already have my blessing.

 

Otherwise, I think you're getting some great advice from people that value the balanced, humane views and deep empathy you consistently share. The one thing I'd like to add is reassurance about your kids. I feel like I know the best parts of you (whoa - that's some assumption but anyway...) and what you want for them and, given their ages, it sounds to me like you've gotten them over the hump. I mean, you (and your wife - from what you said) carried off the divorce and succeeding years with their welfare and development foremost. Just saying that at this point you're not going to let anything happen that could deeply or permanently impair their ability to become the people they deserve to be. They've seen and gotten the best of you and will continue to benefit from that contact and, I daresay, capacity to reflect, assess and communicate. They're good and you'll handle what comes so that they stay that way. You know it's true.

[amaysngrace]

The hardest part for you might be the lack of drama that you've grown accustomed to but saying good-bye to her is the only thing to do if you value yourself at all.

 

Unless of course you don't mind being second to the alcohol.

[Quiet Storms]

Thanks.

 

As for ultimatums, I've made a few statements that it's the booze or me. She would typically stop for a while. Things would improve. She'd eventually have a rough day and ask if we could pick up a bottle of wine. I'd cave - I'm not good at this, especially since I also like to drink from time to time. That cycle has repeated itself a few times.

 

Some of our more recent arguments haven't really been due to alcohol. I think we've both got resentment that's slowly becoming contempt. It's sad, really. Neither of us are bad people and we both do care for each other immensely.

 

But this one issue might end up being the dealbreaker because it really is the elephant in the room.

 

Thanks for the supportive words. If nothing else, it does help to be heard.

 

I can understand your desire not to make a decision immediately. Living together for 3 years is a big commitment and you 2 still care for each other. I am sure you are still on the fence about whether you even want to end things with her. It isn't an easy decision.

 

It is a little hard to imagine that she can get to the point of throwing things at you and yet the kids are oblivious to it. But you know your situation better than anyone and you seem to be a very good dad. I hope things don't escalate. Good luck to you both

[Miss Clavel]

No suggestion about putting his life on hold - just no allowing any woman to live in the family home. He should date... Just choose wisely.

 

The family home is his environment to bond with his kids while they are still at home. Those years go by quickly.

 

ITA

 

and 10 characters.

[BetrayedH]

Ditto this sentiment. (((((Oh, BH)))) I would love to be your mother. Reading this was like listening/talking to my daughter. I know and respect her sense of balance and emotional health so well that we can cover a lot of ground quickly (whether or not that's a solution every time) when there's a problem - or just figuring out everyone else. In fact, I would love for you to meet and marry my daughter. Seriously. You already have my blessing.

 

Otherwise, I think you're getting some great advice from people that value the balanced, humane views and deep empathy you consistently share. The one thing I'd like to add is reassurance about your kids. I feel like I know the best parts of you (whoa - that's some assumption but anyway...) and what you want for them and, given their ages, it sounds to me like you've gotten them over the hump. I mean, you (and your wife - from what you said) carried off the divorce and succeeding years with their welfare and development foremost. Just saying that at this point you're not going to let anything happen that could deeply or permanently impair their ability to become the people they deserve to be. They've seen and gotten the best of you and will continue to benefit from that contact and, I daresay, capacity to reflect, assess and communicate. They're good and you'll handle what comes so that they stay that way. You know it's true.

 

Thanks Merrmeade.

 

We'll see if I get clear of this existing relationship before we discuss your daughter. I'm a bit of a stickler about that.

 

Thanks for the reassurance about my kids. I suppose you're right. I had really hoped to create and maintain a sense of stability after a period of such instability for them. And it's true that we have really turned a corner. They are very well-adjusted kids when things could have been much worse. And that's truly due to a serious amount of effort on my part as well as my exwife. This would be an upheaval that they could handle. And I think they'd understand. I just wish it was avoidable. I'm not sure it is and I'm just now kinda coming to grips with it.

[BetrayedH]

The hardest part for you might be the lack of drama that you've grown accustomed to but saying good-bye to her is the only thing to do if you value yourself at all.

 

Unless of course you don't mind being second to the alcohol.

 

Trust me, I relish the opportunity to escape the drama. I'm a peaceful person and weary of the drama. I fantasize about a life without it. Life was tough when I first got my own apartment, but it was also liberating to be handling life for my kids and I on my own. I was proud of the accomplishment. It was me and them and we made it. But I relish external validation as much as the next human and I wanted something for myself.

 

I think there's a side of me that posted here in hopes that I'd find some solution that has otherwise evaded me. I also knew that the odds of that were slim. I understand too much about this addiction to have much faith in miraculous change. And I've tried all of the external motivators.

 

Sigh.

[merrmeade]

Thanks Merrmeade.

 

We'll see if I get clear of this existing relationship before we discuss your daughter. I'm a bit of a stickler about that.

 

Thanks for the reassurance about my kids. I suppose you're right. I had really hoped to create and maintain a sense of stability after a period of such instability for them. And it's true that we have really turned a corner. They are very well-adjusted kids when things could have been much worse. And that's truly due to a serious amount of effort on my part as well as my exwife. This would be an upheaval that they could handle. And I think they'd understand. I just wish it was avoidable. I'm not sure it is and I'm just now kinda coming to grips with it.

Deal.

 

Regarding your kids again - It doesn't mean they might not have some negative reactions at first; it's bound to be disappointing, inconvenient and annoying. In fact, they could be pissed at you, but you WILL work it out.

 

And back to the main question: I think you're probably getting the answers you already knew in your heart, and when you're clear of this role you'll become more and more convinced you had no choice but to separate. Of that I have no doubt. She's an addict, and there are stages she'll go through, which you should not try to control or influence. I mean you can try, but it won't help and could hurt you.

 

I wouldn't wait if I were you. It's against your nature to live a lie.

[Mr. Lucky]

I have attended a few AA meetings. I'm just sorry to say that that it didn't seem to fit with me and the pressure to admit that I was powerless over alcohol and needed to submit my life to a higher power simply didn't resonate with me.

 

You've gotten great advice on your situation, don't have much to add.

 

But, as a not particularly religious person, I looked at the higher power as me plus one or more persons, working to support each other. Hope you don't give up on either the AA or Al-Anon options...

 

Mr. Lucky

[BetrayedH]

It's utterly amazing how weeks of continuous improvement can occur, only to be set back by one night of insanity.

[Raena]

It's utterly amazing how weeks of continuous improvement can occur, only to be set back by one night of insanity.

 

I'm going to assume something happened recently that made this situation worse based on this comment. I hope not... but it sounds like it.

 

My ex was an alcoholic so I completely get where you are coming from. The rollercoaster ride is no fun. Periods of calm followed by periods of insanity followed by periods of calm and on and on and on.

 

The only way I got him to quit drinking for good was to tell him very clearly that if he ever let another drop of alcohol touch his lips then we would be done. Period. No discussion. Stop drinking right this minute and be done with it for good or we are done. He stopped. (I stopped too to support him) However, he eventually resented me for it, found our sober life to be exceedingly boring and found his thrills elsewhere (cheating, as you know from our many conversations about his crazy behavior). He and I have been split for 3 years now and he started drinking again the moment we split up. (so did I, but only socially)

 

My point is, you can give her that ultimatum and she might follow it, but if you do, she could end up resenting you for it too.

 

It seems to me that the only way I ended up getting off the roller coaster of dealing with an addict was to leave the relationship. No matter how insistent you are that she needs to change, if she does it for you and not for herself it won't last. She won't do it for herself until she fully realizes what it's cost her. She has to hit rock bottom so to speak.

 

I'm sorry you are dealing with this. Seems like you really deserve a healthy happy relationship without all this drama. I'm sure it's out there somewhere for you. Keep your chin up and make a plan to get out. You've got this.

[amaysngrace]

Trust me, I relish the opportunity to escape the drama. I'm a peaceful person and weary of the drama. I fantasize about a life without it. Life was tough when I first got my own apartment, but it was also liberating to be handling life for my kids and I on my own. I was proud of the accomplishment. It was me and them and we made it. But I relish external validation as much as the next human and I wanted something for myself.

 

I think there's a side of me that posted here in hopes that I'd find some solution that has otherwise evaded me. I also knew that the odds of that were slim. I understand too much about this addiction to have much faith in miraculous change. And I've tried all of the external motivators.

 

Sigh.

 

I understand the need for companionship but is having someone by your side worth the dysfunction you're allowing to go along with it?

 

Dr Phil has an expression that I think can apply here "it's better to be healthy alone than sick with someone else"

 

Wishing better days for you.

[HappyAgain2014]

I'm sorry you're in this situation. It's very difficult to live with an addict and not become codependent. This leads to enabling behaviors but it seems you're quite aware of that.

 

The problem here is you have nothing to work with. Addicts are manipulative. I think you're stuck between your love for her and your distance for the addict. Unfortunately, there is no way to help her if she's not committed to sobriety.

 

You've come too far to settle, especially for a relationship that will ultimately emotionally drain you. You have a great plan. Hopefully the next few months will go as planned.

[dreamingoftigers]

It's utterly amazing how weeks of continuous improvement can occur, only to be set back by one night of insanity.

 

Welcome to addict-land.

 

That stability you thought was genuine can disappear in an instant.

 

I'm sorry BH.

[BetrayedH]

Thanks for the thoughtful posts. It helps to have additional perspectives.

 

I think it's only a matter of time before complete sobriety is the only option. I do believe she knows that, too, and has been really remorseful about the episodes that occur. She just slips back into it very easily as it's her coping mechanism. But she sees the damage that it's doing and we've been on a much better path lately.

 

It's difficult to balance my desire to recognize those efforts and continuous improvement and the sense that it somehow enables the process to continue.

[ja123]

If she's not willing to go to AA or a counsellor, then my suggestion is probably void:

 

 

But would she go to a psychiatrist to be evaluated for depression?

 

 

Some people try to self-medicate with booze.

 

 

I'm not making this suggestion to "save" your relationship, it's just that she seems like a sad soul.

[S2B]

Thanks for the thoughtful posts. It helps to have additional perspectives.

 

I think it's only a matter of time before complete sobriety is the only option. I do believe she knows that, too, and has been really remorseful about the episodes that occur. She just slips back into it very easily as it's her coping mechanism. But she sees the damage that it's doing and we've been on a much better path lately.

 

It's difficult to balance my desire to recognize those efforts and continuous improvement and the sense that it somehow enables the process to continue.

 

 

But this is backwards... YOU shouldn't be in a position to balance anything. It shows how much you're trying to control things. In any healthy relationship one person shouldn't have the need to control anything.

 

It's making it more glaringly obvious that she has a problem that's bigger than what you can control...

 

The alcohol will win every time for an active drinker like this. The only one who can decide that it's too much is her. Otherwise she will resent you even more for making that decision for her.

 

Since she can't willingly abstain on her own without your opinion and she causes harm when she drinks - makes me think you need to change things sooner rather than later for your own best interest.

 

They say that if you want change to happen - to look at changing things YOU CAN change.

 

 

Expecting HER to change is not an option. Whatever you want changed must come from you.

[Popsicle]

Remove yourself from the crazy. You'll be better off for it.

[salparadise]

I think there's a side of me that posted here in hopes that I'd find some solution that has otherwise evaded me. I also knew that the odds of that were slim. I understand too much about this addiction to have much faith in miraculous change. And I've tried all of the external motivators.

 

Alcoholism is a life destroying disease. People in its throes rarely have any objectivity. It's not just an individual problem; it's a family system dysfunction... and that includes the kids. Everyone is affected, everyone plays a role in it.

 

There really is only one thing that you can control and change––yourself. And nothing is going to change unless you change. Counseling, addiction treatment, sobriety is the solution, but the odds of success while living with another alcoholic who continues to drink are low, as you must surely understand. You have to be resolute in making that decision.

 

You're right. There is no compromise solution. Your choices are addiction or sobriety. For you. If both of you choose sobriety the relationship may have a chance.

[S2B]

In everything we do or don't do - we (as parents) set an example for our kids.

 

You are showing them that it IS "normal" to live in a home with a crazy drinker.

 

And if this pattern continues for any length of time at all - they will get the idea that this is what they choose for themselves when they grow up.

 

IF you have her leave... they get a solid indication that bad behavior should have real consequences and it is unacceptable - and they will learn that as a life lesson to live by.

 

What do you plan to show them as their life goals? To live with unacceptable behavior or to eliminate people/situations that are destructive to self? You can't have both under these circumstances.

[BetrayedH]

If she's not willing to go to AA or a counsellor, then my suggestion is probably void:

 

 

But would she go to a psychiatrist to be evaluated for depression?

 

 

Some people try to self-medicate with booze.

 

 

I'm not making this suggestion to "save" your relationship, it's just that she seems like a sad soul.

 

Mental health concerns are an issue. Both bi-polar and depression. I have been a good influence on her life but I have my hands full.

 

She has a good history with enthusiastically attending therapy and being responsive. She's also remarkably good with medications.

 

The alcohol is understood not to be a good mix (the understatement is also acknowledged).

 

I respect sunny's perspective but I also just don't feel that life is that simple. I'm not sure I've ever know anyone that wasn't damaged in some way. It's in my nature to empathize and help. I don't see it as control.

[ja123]

Well, if she knows about her mental health issues is she taking medication for it? Is she currently in counselling for depression or bi-polar depression?

 

 

Regarding your empathy being a means of control. Perhaps 'yes', perhaps 'no'; but, you do need to learn to have empathy for yourself - you don't deserve poor treatment (being yelled at, having things thrown at you) regardless the cause.

 

 

Have you looked into codependency regarding yourself?

[Art_Critic]

I think it's only a matter of time before complete sobriety is the only option. I do believe she knows that, too,

 

Of course, the issue is that even though she will say she knows it her denial will kick in and she will not admit she is powerless over Alcohol to HERSELF, which is what needs to occur for sobriety to begin to take place..

It is also what it will take for her to stay sober...

 

The other thing is that your codependency is showing and you could use some help with that, Alanon or perhaps some books on codependency will help you.

 

Most likely you and her are going to need outside help with this...

[S2B]

 

 

Originally Posted by BetrayedH View Post

I think it's only a matter of time before complete sobriety is the only option. I do believe she knows that, too,

 

 

But you see, the number one rule of admitting to being an alcoholic is that no on else decides this for another person. No one.

 

And if anyone has issues with it then it's better that they exit the drinkers life.

 

And really- I'm trying to see where you're NOT being controlling but I'm not seeing that - can you fill me in on what I'm missing?

 

Did her drinking lead to the end of her prior relationships?

 

 

I must add... behind most heavy/problem drinkers there's someone behind the scenes trying to control the drinkers drinking - usually with threats and punishments but always with checking up on the drinker.

 

The top two symptoms of an active problem drinker is anxiety and depression. At times it presents like a bipolar disorder - yet those symptoms usually disappear after the drinking has ended for an extended period of time (6-12 months sober), many times sooner IF the ex drinker is working a solid plan of recovery.

 

So how do you think you're not trying to control her and her drinking? From what you've typed I'd like clarification.

 

Have you ever been to Al-Anon?

[S2B]

Is she repaying you a solid regular amount of money each month on the amount she owes you?

 

You want that paid up by April... what's the plan to be sure you get the money back before she moves...?

[BetrayedH]

Sorry I don't feel much like engaging with my own thread.

 

Two nights ago I put my foot down (controlling or not) and made it clear that I'm no longer drinking and that if another drop passes her lips, we're done. It was a night of drama prior to that but she agreed and, in short, was glad to feel like she had a partner in doing it.

 

At this point I'm just focused on keeping my end of the bargain and steeling myself to enforce the boundary.

 

Fingers crossed.