A Question To People That Have Affairs.

[Logan787]

A question I've always wanted to ask married people that have affairs is this. Why would you trust someone that is cheating on their spouse? I mean if you think about it, the person that you are sleeping with is proving to you, that no matter how good their marriage is, or how bad, that they will betray the one that they at one time loved just like they are loving you.

 

If they broke the vows that they made to their current spouse, why should they keep them with you? The new always wears off, the euphoria never lasts, and you always end up with someone with issues. We all have them. I understand people fall out of love with their spouse, but you can fall back into it can't you? When two married people are in an affair together, they are basically proving that both of them are liars and cheaters. So why should they be all righteous and faithful all of a sudden when they leave their current spouses and be faithful to the one they are messing around with?

 

Their deceptive character, unfaithful nature, and deviant personality are still there when you marry them and get them to leave the spouse you stole them from. What changes after you marry them? Answer? Nothing, but addresses. Two people that are married to other people and in an affair together, is kind of like the mafia. Everybody is dirty, and you constantly have to be looking over your shoulder.

Edited September 8, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
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[immokk]

I think it depends... and this is mooted a lot here.

 

However, I don't think all situations are the same.

 

For the vast majority of affairs,I think the MM/MW is probably always going to be untrustworthy but there are a small portion where things are different.

 

 

They're hard, that's it. And they're rarely right.

 

But no judgement from me. None. And I'm an OW who's xMM lied and was hurtful in the end (I ended it!) and it's been horrible and I don't think I'd ever trust him.

 

But not everyone is the same... until you walk a mile and all that.

 

However, if my H had cheated and then I saw that he'd been lying to the OW as well as me (some MM, not many I hasten to add, are actually really very honest to the OW.) then I could never forgive it. Or trust him again. I'd never take him back.

 

It's one thing to lie to one person but to lie to two? Nope. And this is why I think most BS and often wrong to stay. There's lots of false reconciliation. But some MM/MW want to change and have lied very little. It's never right but there are levels of forgive- ability (as it were)

[Just a Guy]

Hi Logan, sorry I wouldn't be able to answer your question as some one affected by infidelity since I have'nt been cheated on or have, myself, cheated on my spouse. However, quite frankly, both parties in a cheating game, whether one of them is single or married are untrustworthy and not worth touching with a barge pole. However, since they are partners in crime, they possibly have to forcibly gel with each other. This fantasy gelling will come crashing down when reality hits them in the face and their dirty secret is revealed to the public.

 

Immokk, I wanted to ask you whether you are married or are single. I am asking because you mentioned something about your husband lying to both you and his OW. Your remark may have been rhetorical in which case I'm sorry for making the assumption that you are married. My point was actually about your statement that if your husband was cheating on you and was lying to both you and the OW, then you would never trust him again nor would you forgive him. That sounds to me like a case of the pot calling the kettle black. Even if you are not married currently, you have been a partner in crime because you were having an affair with a married man all the while knowing that he was married. You would have known that he would be lying to his wife so as to enable his trysts with you yet you did not hesitate to continue seeing him till he showed what a slime ball he actually was when he started lying to you. With what face would you confront your husband while occupying the moral high ground when you yourself have been scrabbling around in the cookie jar. Maybe you have a reasonable explanation for this and if so please do let us know. Warm wishes.

[goodyblue]

I was OW, turned girlfriend turned wife. I trusted him initially because I had known him for many years before our friendship turned into an affair, I knew his ex was an alcoholic, and many other problems in the relationship. He was waiting for his daughter to finish school and leave. Also, our affair was short, we had a timeline of when he would leave and he was sucking to it. When his ex found the burner phone he told her everything and left that very day. I knew he was not lying to me and that their relationship was over.

 

But, it is all very personal, and many mm do lie and eat cake. I was lucky my h was honest.

[SammySammy]

I agree.

 

I always thought if she would cheat with me, then she would cheat on me.

[Redhead14]

A question I've always wanted to ask married people that have affairs is this. Why would you trust someone that is cheating on their spouse? I mean if you think about it, the person that you are sleeping with is proving to you, that no matter how good their marriage is, or how bad, that they will betray the one that they at one time loved just like they are loving you.

 

If they broke the vows that they made to their current spouse, why should they keep them with you? The new always wears off, the euphoria never lasts, and you always end up with someone with issues. We all have them. I understand people fall out of love with their spouse, but you can fall back into it can't you? When two married people are in an affair together, they are basically proving that both of them are liars and cheaters. So why should they be all righteous and faithful all of a sudden when they leave their current spouses and be faithful to the one they are messing around with?

 

Their deceptive character, unfaithful nature, and deviant personality are still there when you marry them and get them to leave the spouse you stole them from. What changes after you marry them? Answer? Nothing, but addresses. Two people that are married to other people and in an affair together, is kind of like the mafia. Everybody is dirty, and you constantly have to be looking over your shoulder.

 

Exactly. The bond between the couple involved in the affair is based on bad character PERIOD. It's two people with no scruples getting together and expecting that they will each behave the way people with good character will behave just because they are with each other????????? They are delusional, desperate, lack insight and forethought, and wrapped up in immediate gratification.

[goodyblue]

Hi Logan, sorry I wouldn't be able to answer your question as some one affected by infidelity since I have'nt been cheated on or have, myself, cheated on my spouse. However, quite frankly, both parties in a cheating game, whether one of them is single or married are untrustworthy and not worth touching with a barge pole. However, since they are partners in crime, they possibly have to forcibly gel with each other. This fantasy gelling will come crashing down when reality hits them in the face and their dirty secret is revealed to the public.

 

Immokk, I wanted to ask you whether you are married or are single. I am asking because you mentioned something about your husband lying to both you and his OW. Your remark may have been rhetorical in which case I'm sorry for making the assumption that you are married. My point was actually about your statement that if your husband was cheating on you and was lying to both you and the OW, then you would never trust him again nor would you forgive him. That sounds to me like a case of the pot calling the kettle black. Even if you are not married currently, you have been a partner in crime because you were having an affair with a married man all the while knowing that he was married. You would have known that he would be lying to his wife so as to enable his trysts with you yet you did not hesitate to continue seeing him till he showed what a slime ball he actually was when he started lying to you. With what face would you confront your husband while occupying the moral high ground when you yourself have been scrabbling around in the cookie jar. Maybe you have a reasonable explanation for this and if so please do let us know. Warm wishes.

 

Not true. We have done a lot of soul searching, a lot of therapy both IC and CC to forgive ourselves for what we did, and it certainly was wrong, but we have moved on and are simply a better match. I trust him with everything. If you think that people can't change then every single couple that tries to reconcile is barking up a dead tree, because the cheater will always be a cheater and nothing more.

 

I believe in love. I believe in forgiveness, and I believe on personal growth. People grow up, change, evolve, become better people.

[road]

I think it depends... and this is mooted a lot here.

 

However, I don't think all situations are the same.

 

For the vast majority of affairs,I think the MM/MW is probably always going to be untrustworthy but there are a small portion where things are different.

 

 

They're hard, that's it. And they're rarely right.

 

But no judgement from me. None. And I'm an OW who's xMM lied and was hurtful in the end (I ended it!) and it's been horrible and I don't think I'd ever trust him.

 

But not everyone is the same... until you walk a mile and all that.

 

However, if my H had cheated and then I saw that he'd been lying to the OW as well as me (some MM, not many I hasten to add, are actually really very honest to the OW.) then I could never forgive it. Or trust him again. I'd never take him back.

 

It's one thing to lie to one person but to lie to two? Nope. And this is why I think most BS and often wrong to stay. There's lots of false reconciliation. But some MM/MW want to change and have lied very little. It's never right but there are levels of forgive- ability (as it were)

 

There is no way to be a WS and have an affair without lying.

 

 

Example: BH how was work today?

 

 

WW Ok, I wound up going to lunch later then normal (truth) but the lie is leaving out how WW hooked up with her OM then.

 

 

OMW how was work today?

 

 

OM/WH Usual, nothing new (truth) but a lie because he is leaving out the part that he bangs his OW/WW everyday during lunch.

[DKT3]

Exactly. The bond between the couple involved in the affair is based on bad character PERIOD. It's two people with no scruples getting together and expecting that they will each behave the way people with good character will behave just because they are with each other????????? They are delusional, desperate, lack insight and forethought, and wrapped up in immediate gratification.

 

I agree with the logic with the exception of them all being bad people with poor character. They have poor boundaries, doesn't necessarily make them have poor character. Good honest people also find themselves in this situation. The thing is good character gets them out of it fairly quick. Those that chose to betray their spouse everyday for years on in fit the description you gave.

[Redhead14]

I agree with the logic with the exception of them all being bad people with poor character. They have poor boundaries, doesn't necessarily make them have poor character. Good honest people also find themselves in this situation. The thing is good character gets them out of it fairly quick. Those that chose to betray their spouse everyday for years on in fit the description you gave.

 

The thing is good character gets them out of it fairly quick -- Eh, not so sure about that. Usually, they get out quick because they get spooked and afraid of getting caught, not because they've realized the error of their ways and are truly repentant. Yes, it happens sometimes, but I don't think it's the majority.

 

If they get out quick and confess their infidelity, then I'd say they've redeemed themselves. If they get out quick but don't confess or actually get caught, they will do it again when they find a situation they feel is "safer".

[Birdies]

If you think that people can't change then every single couple that tries to reconcile is barking up a dead tree, because the cheater will always be a cheater and nothing more.

 

I believe in love. I believe in forgiveness, and I believe on personal growth. People grow up, change, evolve, become better people.

 

Exactly. Probably most cheaters would do it again, but some truly learn their lesson and change. The person's underlying moral character has a lot to do with that, and to say that all cheaters have the exact same moral character is simplistic and untrue.

 

It's a risk that you have to take. How well do you know your affair partner, how well do you know their history, what kind of honesty do they display in the rest of their lives, how do they deal with conflict and difficult times, how seriously do they regret their mistakes and are working on addressing the root causes of them, etc.

 

It's a lot more complicated than the generalizations posted by people here, but hey, easier to paint an entire swath of people with the same brush, I suppose.

[immokk]

Hi Logan, sorry I wouldn't be able to answer your question as some one affected by infidelity since I have'nt been cheated on or have, myself, cheated on my spouse. However, quite frankly, both parties in a cheating game, whether one of them is single or married are untrustworthy and not worth touching with a barge pole. However, since they are partners in crime, they possibly have to forcibly gel with each other. This fantasy gelling will come crashing down when reality hits them in the face and their dirty secret is revealed to the public.

 

Immokk, I wanted to ask you whether you are married or are single. I am asking because you mentioned something about your husband lying to both you and his OW. Your remark may have been rhetorical in which case I'm sorry for making the assumption that you are married. My point was actually about your statement that if your husband was cheating on you and was lying to both you and the OW, then you would never trust him again nor would you forgive him. That sounds to me like a case of the pot calling the kettle black. Even if you are not married currently, you have been a partner in crime because you were having an affair with a married man all the while knowing that he was married. You would have known that he would be lying to his wife so as to enable his trysts with you yet you did not hesitate to continue seeing him till he showed what a slime ball he actually was when he started lying to you. With what face would you confront your husband while occupying the moral high ground when you yourself have been scrabbling around in the cookie jar. Maybe you have a reasonable explanation for this and if so please do let us know. Warm wishes.

 

No offence or anything taken.

 

I'm not married. I was a long time ago but it was before I got involved in an Affair.

 

My point was hypothetical and is largely around the different reasons and ways people get into situations.

[immokk]

I'm sorry all.

 

I posted my response when this was in the Other Man/ Woman forum and felt it was a safer environment for conversation.

 

No more involvement from me. I'm not here for judgement. I ended my A. Everyone has their reasons for whatever they do.

 

I am not condoning anything nor I am saying I am blameless. I am saying that I use this forum as a place to help and help myself, not for judgement.

 

There are other places I could go for that.

[immokk]

Frankly, I'm a little perplexed as to why this is deemed general discussion by the moderators. It clearly isn't,

[Redhead14]

Relative to comments regarding affairs as being judgemental . . . it's not necessarily about being judgemental, it's about applying morals and adhering to a value system which is actually what keeps most people in check when they are morally conflicted. It's about taking them by the shoulders and telling them to get a grip on reality.

 

If no one was critical of cheating/affairs, what would actually keep a person from doing it?

 

My point is, why would people whose moral compass is intact, stroke and coddle a person who cheats?

 

If a person is seeking "support" for doing something that is not socially accepted, they will only get support from people who have done it themselves and so I would question the value of that support . . .

 

Somethings require a kick in the as*, not hand-holding and stroking. I wouldn't call it judgemental, I'd call it tough love.

[MuddyFootprints]

No question here, just a guised opportunity to preach.

[Birdies]

Relative to comments regarding affairs as being judgemental . . . it's not necessarily about being judgemental, it's about applying morals and adhering to a value system which is actually what keeps most people in check when they are morally conflicted. It's about taking them by the shoulders and telling them to get a grip on reality.

 

If no one was critical of cheating/affairs, what would actually keep a person from doing it?

 

My point is, why would people whose moral compass is intact, stroke and coddle a person who cheats?

 

If a person is seeking "support" for doing something that is not socially accepted, they will only get support from people who have done it themselves and so I would question the value of that support . . .

 

Somethings require a kick in the as*, not hand-holding and stroking. I wouldn't call it judgemental, I'd call it tough love.

 

You entirely missed her point. Her point was, why would the people to whom the question is *actually* directed try to answer this question honestly and thoughtfully, if the thread is going to be filled with a bunch of people who *don't* have that experience and are just saying "those people are all exactly the same and are morally bankrupt scumbags and it's pointless to try to differentiate between any of them and trust any of them ever again".

 

Anyway, yeah, I'm out of here too.

[immokk]

Relative to comments regarding affairs as being judgemental . . . it's not necessarily about being judgemental, it's about applying morals and adhering to a value system which is actually what keeps most people in check when they are morally conflicted. It's about taking them by the shoulders and telling them to get a grip on reality.

 

If no one was critical of cheating/affairs, what would actually keep a person from doing it?

 

My point is, why would people whose moral compass is intact, stroke and coddle a person who cheats?

 

If a person is seeking "support" for doing something that is not socially accepted, they will only get support from people who have done it themselves and so I would question the value of that support . . .

 

Somethings require a kick in the as*, not hand-holding and stroking. I wouldn't call it judgemental, I'd call it tough love.

 

Another example of people reading what they want to read.

 

I came on here for support in the aftermath. At no stage have I ever claimed to be right or morally just, I have, however, said I am not prepared to be judged by anyone.

 

You judge someone based on your own compass. Each person is different. Who says the people here are the judge, jury and executioner of right or wrong?

 

Plenty of people suffer in all walks of life. Few people deserve your judgement or anyone elses.

 

Last man who did no wrong got nailed to a cross.

[carhill]

A question I've always wanted to ask married people that have affairs is this. Why would you trust someone that is cheating on their spouse?

I think the question could apply to people in general who have affairs, not just married people. IME, to answer your question, trust is built over a long period of time, far beyond the average lifespan of any affair. So, I don't expect to trust a MW and generally haven't, same as women in general, due to long life experience with them.

I mean if you think about it, the person that you are sleeping with is proving to you, that no matter how good their marriage is, or how bad, that they will betray the one that they at one time loved just like they are loving you.

People can betray other people at any time, for any reason, or no reason at all, and without notice and generally without serious consequences, like termination. At worst, they get hammered with a divorce settlement/lawsuit if they're married. In general, in our society, lying and cheating are not punished in any significant way which is part of why they're so rampant and have been during my lifetime. Nothing new.

If they broke the vows that they made to their current spouse, why should they keep them with you?

I don't expect them to, but sure, hope springs eternal. Heck, I was often surprised that my exW would show up at home after work

The new always wears off, the euphoria never lasts, and you always end up with someone with issues. We all have them. I understand people fall out of love with their spouse, but you can fall back into it can't you?

Sure, we're always changing and there are no guarantees in life save for that abyss at the end of it. Can people fall back in love? Sure, anything is possible. IME with MW's, it has happened, as has divorce, as has arrangements like living separate lives, as has soldiering on in a dead marriage. Everyone is different and always changing.

When two married people are in an affair together, they are basically proving that both of them are liars and cheaters. So why should they be all righteous and faithful all of a sudden when they leave their current spouses and be faithful to the one they are messing around with?

I'm assuming in all of this you're talking about cheating, which denotes deception, as affairs can be both open/conspicuous and deceptive. People have unique psychologies, can compartmentalize, and often rationalize their behaviors situationally. I can be a man, kill people for a living, tell my wife I love her, have sex with a prostitute and offer up my life in protection of my children. Same guy, many boxes of behavior.

 

Their deceptive character, unfaithful nature, and deviant personality are still there when you marry them and get them to leave the spouse you stole them from. What changes after you marry them? Answer? Nothing, but addresses. Two people that are married to other people and in an affair together, is kind of like the mafia. Everybody is dirty, and you constantly have to be looking over your shoulder.

 

It could be, sure, and deceptiveness could rule them, or it could be specific to the box they were applying it to prior, their old partner. In general, regarding stealing, unless procured by force or coercion, people can't steal people. We all have free will. If a better deal, for them, comes along, they are free to take it in any way shape or form they choose. Associations, save for those of prisoner or slave, are completely voluntary. That may last an hour, a day, a week, a month, a year, a decade, or maybe a lifetime. No way to know. No way to read minds.

 

Enjoy the ride. It's brief.

[Redhead14]

A person doesn't have to have been burned in a fire to know that fire burns . . . and they can explain clearly and succinctly to another person that they shouldn't stick their hand or anything else in a fire and why they shouldn't do that. That's called insight.

 

This is not about walking around in someone else's shoes in order to be "qualified" to comment. I know that I wear a size 6.5 shoe. I don't have to walk around in a size 4 to know that my feet would hurt and cause damage to my feet and the shoes.

[JamesM]

Desperate situations lead to desperate measures. And I firmly believe that just because someone cheats in one marriage does not mean that he or she will cheat in the next. Circumstances may lead to a poor decision and a vow betrayal that came after desperation, depression and frustration took over. Perhaps the WS did everything in his or her power to change the marriage and yet the spouse ignored all attempts. People do change.

 

Leaving is not always the best option.

 

A person lives for many months or years in a marriage that never gets better. Attempts at improvement are met with disbelief ("What problem? I don't need sex so it is your problem?") or perhaps some little change to keep the spouse in the marriage a little longer. But he or she knows this is never going to be good. Yet the children deserve two parents, and the marital problems can be "covered" while the parents actually do have a good friendship. Then along comes someone who cares and comforts and understands. The WS suddenly realizes that he or she is sexy and desirable. This is not his problem. A joy and new self confidence makes his days brighter as this new person makes life so much better. Step by step the affair begins and continues despite perhaps many somewhat rational attempts at stopping it. He or she knows it is wrong, and yet after months or perhaps years of desperation, it seems so right. There was no definite time when the decision was made, but one day after each little step, the most wonderful thing happened. And so he or she enters in the wonderful and deceptive world of an affair.

 

I am not condoning affairs, nor is this from my own experience. After more than ten years on here and after living in a sexless marriage with many attempts at change, I understand how affairs can begin. I understand why they can. I also understand what happens with the majority of them, and thankfully that realization keeps me raional.

 

And there is another thing we forget. Affairs are all about the moment and rarely about the future. Affairs are about how the other person makes "me" feel. It is about how the other person makes me feel desirable and important. It is about having that thrilling feeling about someone. It is about how each moment is like a fantasy. Talk about budgets, parenting, and household chores don't fit into that world.

 

And cheating is justified.

 

 

One last thing as has been noted here many times. Affairs bring about a "fog" in the brain that changes the ability to make rational decisions.

 

The above does not apply to every situation or affair, but it certainly applies to most.

[RecentChange]

Oh we never trusted each other, we knew we were both being sneaky snakes! But our "affair" was an arrangement for sex, not these love affair dramas that i read about on LS.

 

I honestly had no idea that so many people looked for LOVE outside of their marriage - I figured most were like mine - and about getting some tail. Well maybe most men are just looking for tail, but tell all sorts of lies to get it.

[Just a Guy]

Hi Goody, I am sorry if I came across as painting each and every one involved in an affair with the same brush. That was not my intention. My comments were of a generic nature and meant to cover a broad swathe of people involved in affairs. However I am sure that there will be a number of affairs which are the exception to the rule. Yours would be one which definitely was an exception. There were certain mitigating factors in your situation. Your AP, who is now your husband, had already checked out of his marriage. While I should think that he should have desisted from having an affair while still married to his ex, he did have the moral courage to accept his shortcoming and exiting the marriage immediately. My point would be about people who indulge in affairs while having no intention of leaving their spouses. Also, people who are single and get involved with married people are also doing a great disservice to the BS in case the BS and the WS have an ostensibly stable and happy marriage. There are cases currently being discussed on the infidelity sub forum which fall in this category. However, I will be the first to admit that there are many cases where there are extenuating circumstances and that each affair is as different from another as chalk is from cheese.

 

Immokk I'm sorry if I appeared to be judgemental in your case. That certainly was not my intention. I was responding to the query raised by Logan and since yours was the only post after his, I also took into account what you had to say. While what I said must be unpalatable for you, I was stating what is commonly accepted on this forum as the guiding principle as far as affairs go. I do not know you personally and I have not walked in your shoes. There may have been some very good reason as to why you got involved with some one who was married. You have to live with what you did and if you can justify to yourself that what you did was not really wrong then so be it. If otherwise then you have probably suffered enough to not have others point fingers at you. I certainly do NOT want to point fingers at you. I do hope what I have had to say here clears the air about what I had written earlier. Warm wishes.

[MJJean]

DH and I were AP's and have been together 16 years, 13 of those married. We trust each other implicitly. How? My marriage to DH isn't my marriage to exH.Two completely different relationships.

[Whoknew30]

Relative to comments regarding affairs as being judgemental . . . it's not necessarily about being judgemental, it's about applying morals and adhering to a value system which is actually what keeps most people in check when they are morally conflicted. It's about taking them by the shoulders and telling them to get a grip on reality.

 

If no one was critical of cheating/affairs, what would actually keep a person from doing it?

 

My point is, why would people whose moral compass is intact, stroke and coddle a person who cheats?

 

If a person is seeking "support" for doing something that is not socially accepted, they will only get support from people who have done it themselves and so I would question the value of that support . . .

 

Somethings require a kick in the as*, not hand-holding and stroking. I wouldn't call it judgemental, I'd call it tough love.

 

This is completely not true. It's not stroking it's called not judging or knowing someone had other issues going on that helped create their lives toward an affair. It's never black & white...why would someone that has such high morals feel the need to be judge mental unless they knew the whole situation & each person involved would be more my question...that doesn't sound like high morals, sounds more like "high horse" thinking. There's plenty of people that become councilors for many different things that have never have done that behavior & yet don't judge.