Well, he is back from his trip...nothing new happened, just felt like writing.

[Donburi]

Hello again. Just updating, mostly for my sake since writing things out is theraputic for me. I think some of you may remember my story, my ex walked in on his now ex-friend and I, he went on a trip to Japan recently, etc...

 

Well, he came back last Sunday. He didn't call me that day, but he called me the day after. He IM'ed me online, did our usual chit chat and he eventually asked me if I wanted to go get burritos with him since he was craving them. (chile doesn't exist in Japan) I was too afraid to see him because I'm scared of what his answer is (answer of whether he will take me back or not) so I politely said no thank you. Of course I regretted it because I missed him so I changed my mind. While talking to him online I was checking out LJ and saw one of our mutual friends had posted about a bbq that was happening at my ex's house that day (4th of July) I brought it up and asked if I could go. His answer was "only if you want to."

 

Well, we ended up not getting burritos because the place he had in mind was closed. I drive over there alittle after we finish our conversation online. Our mutual friend who posted the entry was there with him. I cut my hair which he commented on, talked about what went on while we were seperated, blah blah. I was little sad that I didn't get a hug or anything, but I wasn't really expecting it. We were affectionate when we were together so thats probably why I felt weird. He gave me some gifts that he got while he was in Japan which I thought was really nice. They were gifts that were specifically for me, he said he knew no one else could appreciate them the way I would.

 

Well, eventually people start coming over and it was pretty awkward. Everyone in our group knows about the situation, and since they're all closer to my ex then they are/were with me, they naturally picked his side. It didn't bother me too much because I was just happy to be around my ex. There were moments where it almost seemed like it was old times, we laughed and joked around. There was one of his friends in particular who made a hissy fit about me being there though. (don't know if you remember this from my older posts, but this is the guy who spread rumors about the "friend" and I, saying that there were mutiple incidents. A drama starter.) Well, he lives with my ex now. When he saw I was there he requested to have a "talk" with my ex. The two of them go off to another part of the house. A little while later, my ex comes back and doesn't act as happy as he did before. When he was in an isolated area I went up to him and asked if the conversation was about me, which it was. My ex said that his friend was worried that me being there would cause more drama. My ex tried to explain to him that we were still communicating and that he didn't mind having me over. From the impression I got it seems my ex agreed with his friend and I got the feeling I wasn't going to be invited there for a while. We talked about that for a bit and then the topic of US came up. My ex doesn't really feel any different then he did before he left for Japan.(which was about almost a month). He says he still doesn't know what to do, he thought about alot of things while he was out there, but didn't come to any conclusion. Again, we may date in the future, we may not.

 

I wasn't really expecting him to have an answer yet, though it did cause some of my emotions to stir up when he told me that. I started tearing up alittle and I probably shouldn't have done this, but I told him I still feel the same way about him, and that i'm willing to wait for however long he needs, and that I'd still like to move to Japan with him, which was our original plan before all this happened. He started to tear up too, and told me we'll see what happens.

 

He did something which I was thought kind of sweet. He downloaded a program on his comp that lets you see any part of the world, and you can zoom in 80 ft above from the destination. He told me he followed the road from his house to mine and said it brought back alot of memories (before I had a car he used to pick me up all the time.)

 

Well, the BBQ fest came to an end, I left his place around 3am. I was kind of surprised, but I shouldn't have, given the situation, that he let me drive home (a 30min drive) that late. Before, he would never EVER let me drive any time after 12am and demand that I stay the night. And if I did drive late, he would make me call him the second I got home, something he didn't ask me to do that night. I know, its silly of me to expect him to do the same things, but it was just a thought.

 

I came home and checked some stuff online and saw on LiveJournal that one of his friends (this guy is nice, he keeps to himself) posted a journal about the "Incident." He basically posted his opinions and said that the three of us who were involved each have alot of problems we need to deal with. He also strongly suggested that the three of us do NOT communicate with eachother anymore, and mentioned that my ex was so far the only one to realize that. He said that I wasn't going to make either one of them happy, and vice versa. This was news to me because as far as I knew, my ex was still keeping contact with me. What surprised me more was my ex commented saying how right he was, and how things were mending, it was time to move on, how he wanted to start over in Japan, and thanked him ALOT for being so sincere...I couldn't understand it. I felt like my ex was being two-faced, telling me one thing and telling others another.

 

Well, I didn't talk to my ex til today, he IM'ed me asking if I read so'n so's journal. He went on saying that was the last thing he needed to read, and how he's tired of people bringing up the issue, etc.. Annoyed and confused, I simply said "your comment said otherwise." He explained he didn't want to fuel the fire (??) and that he didn't know what else to write, and said there is no changing what people will do and think. It was kind of weird to see my ex acting like this, it was if he was trying to explain his actions or something. I guess he caught me at a bitter moment because I didn't really care. I changed the subject, and then quickly signed off. I wasn't rude about it.

 

So yeah...that is pretty much what has happened since I last posted...Its been a little over than 2 months since this has all happened. Things haven't really changed...I wonder how long these kind of things take...guess we'll see.

[Cecelius]

I think your ex wants to break up but just doesn't have the guts or motivating factor to do it. Plus he likes being in a choosing position. Frankly and honestly, if any girl that turned his head and seemed to have less drama associated with her came along, I think his mind would be made up very quickly.

 

For your own sake, I would strongly suggest that you put the incident behind you (so that future b/fs don't have as huge a red flag to deal with and you have some hope of a normal relationship) and move on.

[Sal Paradise]

I think you should give him 1-2 weeks and then let him know that if he isn't sure what he wants then you have to move on. Let him know that you're not blaming him but it hurts you too much to continue this and that the best thing for both of you is no contact. This will have one of two effects, you will both move on, or he will realize he doesn't want to lose you. You've given him the space but you can't do this forever, you can't wait forever. The danger of staying in this limbo is that he could take advantage of the situation. I personally don't think he is but the possibility is there nonetheless. When and if you issue no contact it has to be real no contact. No text messages, phone calls, leaving notes on diaries, sending messages thru mutual friends, NOTHING. If not it won't work, actually it will make things worse if you don't do it right. I would also go NC with his friends. You don't seem to be able to cut them out (you can't stop reading the online journals). You need to stop reading these online journals(whats up with everyone you know keeping a journal? I don't know 1 person who has an online diary). You need to let it go.

 

Good Luck

[Donburi]

Originally posted by Sal Paradise

I think you should give him 1-2 weeks and then let him know that if he isn't sure what he wants then you have to move on. Let him know that you're not blaming him but it hurts you too much to continue this and that the best thing for both of you is no contact. This will have one of two effects, you will both move on, or he will realize he doesn't want to lose you. You've given him the space but you can't do this forever, you can't wait forever. The danger of staying in this limbo is that he could take advantage of the situation. I personally don't think he is but the possibility is there nonetheless. When and if you issue no contact it has to be real no contact. No text messages, phone calls, leaving notes on diaries, sending messages thru mutual friends, NOTHING. If not it won't work, actually it will make things worse if you don't do it right. I would also go NC with his friends. You don't seem to be able to cut them out (you can't stop reading the online journals). You need to stop reading these online journals(whats up with everyone you know keeping a journal? I don't know 1 person who has an online diary). You need to let it go.

 

Good Luck

 

Thanks for replying...1-2 weeks? I know for a fact he won't have an answer by then. He keeps saying its still gonna be a while before he knows what he wants. I feel like I should give him some more time, at least one more month. I really don't know...Waiting does hurt me but I brought this upon myself. Do you personally think someone in this situation would know what they want by now? I don't expect him to say "hey babe, I'm ready to date, lets go to the movies!" or anything but it would be nice to hear from him that he for sure wants to date me when he is ready....I really want to do what you suggested but I'd feel like that would be pressuring him or threatening him...And I already told him I'd wait as long as he needed, because that was the least I could do...I guess that wasn't the best move, huh.

 

I don't think he wants to lose me because he still talks to me...and he let me come into his house that was full of people who were against me and him getting back together...so I think that took alot for him just to do that. That has to mean something, right?

 

I think I will do what you suggested, but I will make it one month instead. That should be enough time, I don't mind the wait. I told him that we didn't have to date until we left for Japan,( which is a year from now) I told him it would hurt alot to wait that long but if I could have him again then it would be worth it. He said we'll see what happens. So yeah, I want to do what you reccommended, and I probably will, but being as dumb as I am, I said some things that would go against it...

 

Thanks again, I'll keep you updated...still trying to decide what to do...

[Sal Paradise]

If you feel a month is what you want to give then thats fine.

 

Just be sure to stick to it at the end of the month though. Yes you hurt him and its understandable that he's confused but he can't have forever. If he doesn't know what he wants after 1 more month he may never know unless you show him you won't be around forever. Its not to pressure him, its to protect yourself.

 

A month is fine if thats what works for you. I wouldn't go any further than that though. At the end of the day its your decision.

 

I think one thing you could do is start developing your own life that has nothing do with his. Get some friends that he doesn't know. Start doing things on your own. That will be good for you and it could show him that you're not just waiting around for him. You can keep the contact while you do this and if nothing changes at the end of the month have the talk that I suggested. You need your own life. You need to stop reading these journals, what good has come of it? All it does is make you worry.

 

I would also cut his friends out (no contact at all not even online) unless you see them while in the company of your ex.

 

Good luck.

[Donburi]

Sal, after doing some thinking, I decided I will do what you suggested. I will wait til the end of July and if nothing happens, I will explain to him that even though I still want to work things out, waiting and not knowing what will happen is destroying me (which it is, its really all I can think about now.) I have school and a future to focus on and this situation is keeping me from doing so.

 

What hurts is I can bet my life on the fact that he won't have an answer by then.

I just hope that by me doing that it will make him realize something, ANYTHING. Good or bad...If he does want to be with me, that will make me the happiest girl in the world. Unfortunately, I can't see him calling me up and telling me that. He is the type of guy who doesn't like to look vulnerable or needy. When we're together he can be the most caring, sensitive guy in the world but when we're not it is a completely different story. I'm afraid that he may want to be with me but just won't do anything about it in fear of losing his pride or whatever.

 

Lately I have been cold to him on AIM. Part of me is actually ready to move on because it just hurts so much to talk to him. I signed off in the middle of our convo once, rude I know but I seriously couldn't handle it anymore. I'm a selfish person, so part of me was hurt to see him all cheerful and happy. He continues to be online and lately he hadn't been talking to me (I wondered if he was upset that I just signed off) til this morning. We were both online for a while and he finally texted me (I always ALWAYS let him initiate it) and we just chitted chatted...as usual. *sigh*

 

I was wondering if it was possible for my ex to move on and still be able to talk to me...well, online anyways. I know for a fact that I couldn't if I still continued to chat with him. The only way I could forgot about him and my feelings was if I did complete 100% NC. He claims that he still wants to hang out and stuff...I just don't know. I'm sure its possible for some to not have feelings for their ex anymore and continue to still communicate with them...

[Donburi]

I feel so empty inside...(sorry for sounding so dramatic )

 

Update : I know I said I'd wait a month to do what Sal suggested, but being silly, dumb, impatient me, I ended up doing it today. Yesterday was a really rough emotional day, I could hardly focus on anything. Everytime we talk online, everytime he acts so happy and content with his life, I lose a little bit of my emotional strength. With each passing day I feel more and more depressed. I feel stuck. It hurts so much to see him so happy in a life that does not have me in it anymore. I can't continue our happy little chit chats anymore, I don't want to pretend to be something I'm not. I'm not happy, I'm not doing ok.

 

I guess the best way to describe it is posting the aim conversation I had. Just to warn you, I act and say some pretty childish things which I regret, so no need to tell me that, I'm well aware. It is pretty long so I apologize for that...

btw, I am M and he is J.

 

M: I'm sorry J, but I have to ask you to not talk to me anymore...it really does hurt too much.

 

J: I'm sorry...I just try to make things bearable...

 

M: I think it'd be easier for both of us if we just didn't talk to eachother.

 

J: :-( I understand...are you sure though?

 

M: yeah...I want to work this out, I still want to be with you, but I know the answer you're going to make. Waiting around like this really is destroying me. I don't know how long I can do this.

 

J: How do you know what I'm going to do? I don't even know. I don't even wanna guess. It's up to you to make this decision, but I want you to be sure.

 

M: it hurts to go from being the most important person in your life to just words on a computer that you chat with for just a few mins a day.

 

J: I'll do what I can to help, and if not talking to you helps, I'll do that

J: I know it's not easy, M

J: I'm sorry things are going the way they are... :-(

 

M: I know, I know its not easy for you, either.

M: But I really don't feel like you want anything to do with me...if I wasn't online we'd probably never communicate. You only talk to me when I'm there. other then that, you don't go out of your way to do it. you said you still want to hang out but you never call me...

 

J: Then why do I still talk to you?

J: I don't even know what to say, really. I'm just sorry, though.

 

M: I don't know. there could be alot of reasons. for pity, a "backup" plan, you just want to be friends, I dunno.

M: I'm sorry too.

 

J: It's not out of pity, I'm not mean enough to do that. You're not a backup plan for anything, and yes, at the very least, I do want to be friends

J: And maybe it just can't happen at all right now

 

M: I want to wait for you for as long as you need, but I don't have the emotional strength for it. I'm already feeling so tired inside, and with each passing day I feel more and more drained.

 

J: I will do what you want for you to be the most comfortable

 

M: I'll never get over you if I continue to talk to you.

 

J: I understand.

 

M: and i really don't see us happening in the future, so I need to move on. It hurts too much.

 

J: If it'll help you, then I'll comply

 

M: its the last thing I want, but I don't really see any other options.

M: I wish you could just tell me it was over...

 

J: I don't know what anything in the future holds, so I can't tell you it's over. But I can't confirm it'll happen, either, so I need you to make this decision, and I will comply with it.

 

M: thats the only reason you can't tell me its over? becuase you don't know what the future holds? You could say that for anything! Why can't you say its because you still have feelings for me or that you still care for me? If thats what you go by then how can you be sure of ANYTHING?

M: you control the future, it doesn't control you.

 

J: Because I don't know if it's over! I don't know what's going to happen! How do you expect me to know, especially so soon? If I was basing what I wanted to do about us around the way everything ended, I certainly wouldn't be saying that I want to be with you. I'm trying to give everything time to make sure I know what I want to happen. I'm not gonna second guess anything like this.

 

M: I don't know what to do anymore.

 

J: I don't either.

J: I wish I did so I could do it

 

M: I'm scared that is just going to get worse and worse.

 

J: What do you think should happen?

 

M: I don't know.

 

J: If you want to call everything quits right now, we can. It may make it easier.

J: But I don't know

 

M: Maybe we should, I don't want to, but it might be for the best. Don't be dumb J, we both know you're not going to take me back. It doesn't take this long to realize you want to be with them. Yes, in this situation, it would take a very long time to actually BE with them, but not to know you want to be with them in the future, you know?

 

J: You're telling me not to be dumb just because I have hope? What about all that stuff you wrote to me and told me?

 

M: and with more time goes on, the more you'll forget about everything.

 

J: Maybe! Maybe I'll finally forget all the **** that happened!

J: I hope I forget everything!

J: Because it still, to this day, isn't helping me out a lot! I still think about it and want to stop!

 

M: I had hope because I knew what I wanted! you can't hope to have hope in the future!

M: you either have it or you dont

 

J: Did I ever say I didn't have hope, then?

 

M: to me, you hope about things you KNOW you want. You claim to not know what you want.

 

J: I know what I want. I want to be happy. I want none of this to have happened. I want a pretty significant part of my life deleted to make way for what SHOULD'VE happened. I want those.

 

M: well thats why I think it'll help both of us for us to not be in contact anymore. You don't look at me the same way you used to. You don't love me anymore. All I am is a reminder of what happened.

 

M: and I don't want to hurt you anymore. I've done that enough.

 

J: You're also an inpsiration, no matter how much it hurts. You're the best girlfriend I had ever had, and I think about that constantly.

J: But maybe you're right, maybe this is all just a dumb dream that needs to come to and end for both of us.

 

M: I don't want to cry anymore, and I fear I might be slipping into depression...I really wanted to try to give us another chance...but with more time goes on, the less likely it seems...

 

J: I don't know what to say. I don't want you to risk everything

J: I want you to do what you need to.

J: Your life is, first and foremost, about you.

J: Do what you need, I can take care of myself..

J: I need you to make your decision, though. Let me know right now what you need.

 

M: I don't know what I need though. I want to be with you, but you can't give me an answer so I don't know what to do! if I continue waiting its just slowly going to destroy me inside but if I give up and move on without hearing some sort of closure, there is gonna be a little bit of hope that is always going to be there torturing me.

 

J: Then the best thing I can probably do for you is to say don't hope. I hate to say it, and truly don't believe it, but for your sake. :-(:-(

 

M: ok then...

M: thank you for everything.

 

J: M....

J: God, I hate this

 

M: goodbye...

 

 

I was hoping to get some kind of closure out of this, ANY kind of answer but unfortunately that was not the case. I'm still in the same situation only now I won't be talking to him anymore...I probably just ruined my chances of anything happening...Its been more than two months since we broke up and I know thats not a very long time, so I'm pretty selfish to already be demanding for answers...but I guess I'm weak. It was so hard when he went to Japan for almost a month...I was filled with negativity and fears but I had something to look forward to, something to keep me going. I was counting down the days til he came back and hoped we could work something out. He came back almost more than a week ago, and I've only seen him once. He only talks to me using AIM and he will only chat with me for a few mins. I've been devestated. It's like a kid getting all hyped up for Christmas day to come which only then someone tells them, after they've been waiting patiently for so long, that Santa Clause doesn't exist. I feel so emotionally drained. I'm so tired inside. I don't know how long I can do this.

 

I still can't give up on all this because he STILL hasn't given me an answer. I know I should just start moving on anyway, with or w/o an answer but I can't. like I said in the conversation, unless I get closure, there is always going to be that little flame of hope that will continue to burn.

 

I also regret doing what I did. It hurts to talk to him, but I think it will hurt me more not to. Maybe he didn't really know what he wanted yet, but my reaction might have made his decision for him. I don't know. I don't know if I should wait to see if he decides anything (like if this made him realize he didn't want to lose me, which was what Sal suggested) and I don't know I long I should wait either...

 

Why am I so pathetic?

[Sal Paradise]

You probably should of waited at least one more week.

 

His problem is he says he is waiting till he can forget. He is NEVER going to FORGET. No one ever forgets something that causes that much pain. The question is whether he can FORGIVE. And whether he can live with someone who bretrayed him and hurt him to that degree.

 

I'm not blaming him. But he also needs to realize that you can't wait forever. 2 and a half months is enough time for him to decide whether he wants to work on the relationship or not. There are no guarantee for any relationship. The problem is he wants something no one can offer. Which is natural. When you get hurt like he was you become scared to take that leap again. He is scared of getting hurt. No amount of waiting is going to change that at this point. He either gets past it or he doesn't. That's probably why he said this....

 

so I need you to make this decision, and I will comply with it.

 

He is scared to make a committment to doing anything. He is scared to get back together and he is scared to break up completely. It almost sounds like he is saying he needs you to end it since he is too weak to do it himself.

 

I think you have given him enough time. Now that you've made the decision you need to be strict with no contact. It also must include his friends. They will probably check up on you on his behalf. Ignore them. It will only cause you grief. They will probably say crap like how happy he is, or how he is seeing this girl or that girl....

 

You need to cut them all out. No text messages, phone calls, emails, none of it.

 

No Contact will have 1 of 2 results.....

 

1) You will eventually move on. Out of the two paths, this is most likely to happen. This is the one you need to prepare yourself for.

 

2) He will realize he wants you back and will contact you asking to get back together. This could happen tomorrow or it could happen in 6 months. It is less likely to happen but it is possible. I would not sit around expecting this to happen. You need to go into NC with the mindset that its over. If you do end up back together thats fine but don't expect it.

 

Things will get easier. The longer you go without talking the better you'll feel. The first month will be the toughest. At some point you will love again and date again. Don't expect too much too soon. You're going to hurt like hell but its better to go thru it now and to be working for a future, than to sit in limbo possibly working for nothing at all.

 

Personally I think he will try to talk to you sometime within the first 2 months, even if he has no intention of getting back with you. People seem to have a hard time letting go of exes. Either he or one of his friends will probably go out of their way to let you know when he dates someone else. And when you eventually move on and date again, if he finds out he'll probably contact you.

 

If he does try and contact you within the first 2-4 weeks, unless he is doing it to tell you he wants to get back together, I would ignore him. It will only keep you in limbo. He is out of his mind if he thinks you two can remain friends. You can't be friends with an exe. Especially when 1 still wants to be with the other. It never works out.

 

Good luck, and keep us updated.

[Donburi]

Well...he contacted me yesterday on aim, and like the idiot I am, I gave in.

He still can't say anything for sure, but he said he DOES want to mend our relationship, but he believes we should mend what we have right now first.

So basically, he wants to be friends for a while (because he is still not ready) and we will see how that works.

 

When I asked him if the talk I had with him the other day scared him he said it frustrated him, but he wasn't overally worried. He said he knew we would talk again. Guess he knows me too well and that I'm not strong enough to keep my word.

 

I agree with you Sal, I believed two and a half months was enough to know if you wanted to work on a relationship or not. Even though we are not dating yet, it seems that he does want to work on rebuilding our relationship, he is just not ready to actually date me yet. But, I suppose everyone works differently.

 

For some odd reason, I don't feel as if I was ready to either. It was so strange. He suggested we hang out for a bit today to talk about things (which is when we agreed that starting off as friends might be for the best to start things over) I looked at him today and got scared. I didn't feel ready to be with him like that, either. This was something I obsessed with for two months now, but today I just felt different. I knew I loved this man and wanted to have a future with him, but I didn't want to jump into the relationship yet. Is it guilt? Do I not feel as if I matured enough yet? Maybe I haven't paid the price enough? Who knows. I don't. But, my gut is definitely telling me now is not the time.

 

Only time will tell.

 

To me, this man is worth waiting for, and I'll most likely end up getting hurt, but that is something I am willing to do. At least things are changing a little bit. He seems a little more sure of what he wants, we have some sort of plan, and we aren't just going to communicate online anymore, we won't hang out everyday, but its definitely a change.

 

Oh, I was curious about something. He has an account on myspace which is basically a place where you post things about yourself, pictures, journals, etc (to me, its a "give me attention!!" kinda thing, but whatever ) and I was checking out my ex's since I hadn't in a while and saw that he had updated many things. He had more pics up, more friends on his list, the whole works. On his bio thing he had put himself as single and was there for friends and networking. No big deal. When I checked yesterday I saw he had added on that he was there for dating, too. This upset me. 1, because he told me he was not interested in dating me or anyone AT ALL at this point, and 2, because he had some cute asian girls on his list with some pretty obvious flirting. Innocent and not too serious, but still flirting. I asked him about it and he said he had no idea he put that there and said it was no big deal, he wasn't on there to look for girls. He changed it back to friends and networking only.

 

I have no right to be upset but I certainly do not want to be waiting for a man who is saying one thing and doing another. He NEVER did this kinda thing when we were together, he hardly talked to other girls. I was just wondering, considering what I did to him, is it possible that his self-essteem and confidence are low, and just wants to see, don't exactly know how to word it, but to see if he's still "got it?" and nothing more? Do you think thats a possibility?

[Sal Paradise]

Sounds like he wants to keep the status quo. Working on the friendship isn't really changing anything. Its just a way of keeping things the way they are.

 

Also don't believe that crap about not knowing his date option was on his profile. Its BS. I don't think it has anything to do with self esteem. I think he's unsure of what he wants, he wants to keep you around in case he decides you are what he wants, he wants to also see what other "options" he has.

 

He could view you as a back up plan. I'm not saying he does but its possible..

 

I think you need to stick to NC until he is willing to comiitt ro a relationship, not a friendship.