When will he finally leave his wife?

[oldshirt]

....it's slightly different for a WW, but the end result is often the same.

 

If a WW leaves, it typically is for the OM, but when she shows up with all her kids and baggage and drama, the OM typically opts out.

 

This is what happened to the woman I mentioned above. Once she was out of the house, the OM quickly lost interest in a 40 year old woman with jr high aged kids and left the scene.

 

But what ended up happening is now an attractive 40 year old MILF was on the market and available and another guy that was a divorced father himself that was looking for a partner snatched her up.

 

My bottom line here is it is very very rare for a WS to actually end up with the AP following an end to the marriage.

[Arieswoman]

OP,

Oldshirt nails it in posts #175, #176 & #177.

 

Now, my exH ended up with his AP but it was a very turbulent journey.

 

(I've posted this sorry tale before, so those who have already seen it can stop reading now, if they wish.)

 

I discovered his affair after 7 months and told him to end it. He refused saying “he loved her”. He got the divorce papers the next week and went ballistic running out of the house shouting “I won't let you divorce me” ( ! ) - apparently this is typical cheater behaviour when their cake supply is taken away.

 

A month later he was out and living in a flat and still seeing OW (who had a fiance.) They both signed the papers and I got the divorce after about 5 months. OW decided it was all too much hassle and dumped him. I found out who the fiance was and told him. The fiance dumped OW.

 

OW went running back to WS and he took her back and he went to live with her and her mother, while he awaited the financial settlement. As soon as he got that he bought a new car.

A big row/fight followed as OW began to see that he wasn't that committed and told him to get out. He came around to see me with a tale of woe and wanted me to rent him a room ( ! ). I told him to go and do something physically impossible. She couldn't take the stress and had a suicide attempt.

 

She was scared he might go back to me, so she put up the deposit for a house (he agreed to paying the mortgage). He moved in but said he wasn't ready to live with her yet. So she stayed with her mother and went round regularly to do cooking, cleaning have sex etc.

 

After having this arrangement for four years, yes, four years, she decided that as there was no sign of marriage and her biological time-clock was ticking (she was now over 30) she got pregnant.

They got married in the middle of winter, on a day that poured with rain, when she was about 7 months pregnant and she then moved in with him.

 

Now, in the this case the OW “got her man”, and they are still together. Apparently, she does absolutely everything about the house and he slobs around just like he did with me.

She posts pictures of them on Fakebook with her smiling and him having a face like a burst boot.

 

Now OP, is this the type of “happy ever after” you would aspire to? Or would you prefer that this would be better as a script for a soap opera?

[cocorico]

 

My bottom line here is it is very very rare for a WS to actually end up with the AP following an end to the marriage.

 

Depends where you look. It's pretty common in academia for senior male academics to land up in long-term second marriages to their former grad students - many, if not most, of those Rs start as As.

[Arieswoman]

Coricoro,

Oldshirt #177 says ;

 

My bottom line here is it is very very rare for a WS to actually end up with the AP following an end to the marriage.

 

In my experience of girls I know, the husbands who left them for the OW did so within a couple of months of meeting OW.

 

In two cases the WS left when the youngest child was a new baby.

 

OTOH I know of girls who were a MM's mistress for years ( in one case 25 years ) wasting their lives waiting for something that wasn't going to happen.

 

So the OP is gambling with very long odds here.

[independentwoman]

Coricoro,

Oldshirt #177 says ;

 

 

 

In my experience of girls I know, the husbands who left them for the OW did so within a couple of months of meeting OW.

 

In two cases the WS left when the youngest child was a new baby.

 

OTOH I know of girls who were a MM's mistress for years ( in one case 25 years ) wasting their lives waiting for something that wasn't going to happen.

 

So the OP is gambling with very long odds here.

 

I have come to realize this. Even if he did leave. Do I want that expectation of perfection put on me? I mean sure we ow and our MM want to demonize the bs often (not always but I know I did and, and I am seeing things a lot differently now) basically in his mind, the cheating was justified, because she wasn't a "perfect" wife. His complaints of her made it okay in his mind.

 

What I've really started thinking about is do I want to have to be perfect for the rest of my life? I mean I know I'm not! So later on 2 or 3 or 10 years will he use my faults to justify doing it again?

 

I'm coming to see that an honest person who is not happy in a marriage either tries to fix it, or leaves it, they don't go out and have an affair.

(Sorry if this offends anyone but that's how I'm seeing it now)

 

I also see now his selfishness towards me. How selfish is it to keep a single woman hanging on for years, waiting for him to finally leave, her life on hold. Family always asking about why you're still single, missing out on opportunities with someone who wants to be in an honest and authentic relationship.

 

So not only is he willing to hurt his bs, who I now know after speaking with her has suffered terribly through this. He was more than willing to hurt me, the one he supposedly loves. If he's willing to hurt me before we're even real, well I don't know, but I can't believe I could ever let myself truly trust him.

 

I just don't want that, and as much as I truly miss him, I'm seeing more every day that everything with him was just words, no actions.

 

Love is an action.

[cocorico]

Coricoro,

Oldshirt #177 says ;

 

 

 

In my experience of girls I know, the husbands who left them for the OW did so within a couple of months of meeting OW.

 

In two cases the WS left when the youngest child was a new baby.

 

OTOH I know of girls who were a MM's mistress for years ( in one case 25 years ) wasting their lives waiting for something that wasn't going to happen.

 

So the OP is gambling with very long odds here.

 

I remember reading a thread on here where the average time it took, for those OWs who were M to their fMM, was about three years. Recently someone posted an update where the MM had D after a long separation, following an A of about 6 or 7 years. And others leave within months. It really does vary from case to case.

 

I'm certainly not implying that most MMs leave their M, or that all of those live happily ever after with their fOW. In the "leave quickly" scenario - the archetypal "exit A" - they probably are even less likely to land up together than those As which go on for a while, where the MM wasn't already packed and waiting by the door for any passing OW to give him a lift out of his M. In those As where the MM genuinely falls I love with the OW, goes through a period of questioning, weighing up the situation, deep introspection, IC (even MC) etc before leaving, he's probably more likely to have done the necessary to allow him to leave comfortable with his decision, and the R is more likely to be sustainable.

 

IIRC the OP has resigned herself to not ending up with her xMM. And, as far as we can tell, for most OWs, that's probably realistic. No one should just hang on in the hope that things will work out. Of all the Rs one experiences in one's life, few become Ms or LTRs. Why should As be different?

[Patrice]

divorce. If he waffles, drags his feet and tries to keep juggling you and his wife .. he isn't serious. Ultimatum time ... and even if he does divorce - give it time, don't move in together, keep your finances separate. Give him a time frame and stick to it. If he does nothing, go NC. And heal what is missing in you. Nobody has the right to take away your dignity as a human being, that isn't love in any sense of the word.

[Arieswoman]

coricoro,

 

No one should just hang on in the hope that things will work out. Of all the Rs one experiences in one's life, few become Ms or LTRs. Why should As be different?

 

^^^

 

A good point.

 

However, an A has the added complication of triangulation as a dynamic, which makes for an unequal power balance at the expense of the OW.

[independentwoman]

divorce. If he waffles, drags his feet and tries to keep juggling you and his wife .. he isn't serious. Ultimatum time ... and even if he does divorce - give it time, don't move in together, keep your finances separate. Give him a time frame and stick to it. If he does nothing, go NC. And heal what is missing in you. Nobody has the right to take away your dignity as a human being, that isn't love in any sense of the word.

 

Patrice I'm already nc, as my above post states, I have no intention of going back. He takes no responsibility for the failure of his marriage at all. Now that I've taken the rose coloured glasses off that shows me that when (and all relationships have rocky times) so when we have those who is mostly likely to get blamed? It won't be him because in his mind he is perfect.

 

I am starting to feel a lot of anger towards him, is it rational? Probably not.

 

I also feel ashamed of what I did to his bs. For the whole of the affair I either hated her or pretended she didn't exist, but that I could be involved in doing that to another human being now makes me deeply ashamed.

[Patrice]

If you believe he is, you just avoided a major catastrophe.

 

The Cheating Narcissist & Why Great Sex w/ You Changes Nothing

[Patrice]

There is no cure for that, he is a deeply flawed individual, with perhaps childhood trauma ...

[independentwoman]

If you believe he is, you just avoided a major catastrophe.

 

The Cheating Narcissist & Why Great Sex w/ You Changes Nothing

 

I just read that Patrice, and I used to think my MM was kind and sweet and great and it was just that he had a terrible wife, he said he never lied to me, but of course he did, how could he cheat and possibly not, yeah I think that pretty much sums him up.

[Patrice]

draw the line, the other Jekyll and Hyde personality comes out. Narcissists are very manipulative people ... VERY.

[Arieswoman]

Independentwoman,

 

I just read that Patrice, and I used to think my MM was kind and sweet and great and it was just that he had a terrible wife, he said he never lied to me, but of course he did, how could he cheat and possibly not, yeah I think that pretty much sums him up.

 

I'm glad that you are now seeing the reality of the situation and I hope it will help you to move forward with your life x

[independentwoman]

Independentwoman,

 

 

 

I'm glad that you are now seeing the reality of the situation and I hope it will help you to move forward with your life x

 

I'm trying so hard, it's just getting the heart and head to match up.

[Patrice]

out at anyone, and for goodness sakes, leave them alone.

[Arieswoman]

Indywoman,

 

I'm trying so hard, it's just getting the heart and head to match up.

 

That's normal.

 

It takes some time for the heart to catch up with the head.

 

Most people can't just roll over and start again - if they could it would show how shallow they were IMO.

 

I still loved my husband when I divorced him and I still loved him about 6 months later. But I knew that there was no way on God's earth I could stay married to him.

 

I went through months of fighting with myself, dealing with mood swings, anger, despair, (and just about every emotion known to man) trying to keep on track, holding down a f/t job, etc etc.

I lost 2 stone in the process.

I can honestly say it was the worst time of my life.

 

But I went through it, survived, and built a new life for myself.

 

And so can you.

 

Good luck. x

[independentwoman]

Indywoman,

 

 

 

That's normal.

 

It takes some time for the heart to catch up with the head.

 

Most people can't just roll over and start again - if they could it would show how shallow they were IMO.

 

I still loved my husband when I divorced him and I still loved him about 6 months later. But I knew that there was no way on God's earth I could stay married to him.

 

I went through months of fighting with myself, dealing with mood swings, anger, despair, (and just about every emotion known to man) trying to keep on track, holding down a f/t job, etc etc.

I lost 2 stone in the process.

I can honestly say it was the worst time of my life.

 

But I went through it, survived, and built a new life for myself.

 

And so can you.

 

Good luck. x

 

Are you happy now?

[independentwoman]

out at anyone, and for goodness sakes, leave them alone.

 

I am leaving them alone, I know for my own healing that it has to be full no contact forever.

[Arieswoman]

Indywoman #193

 

Are you happy now?

 

Yes, very happy.

I am now married to a wonderful man.

 

My happiness began when I stopped looking to others for external validation and started to learn to love myself.

[afoolto no end]

Hi there,

 

First of all I am so sorry you got yourself all caught up in MM's awful game to build up his ego......

He was never leaving he just plied each one of you with lies as he needed to get through that moment.

You deserve so much better and I am really hoping his wife gets that too about her life.....

It is unbelievable the cruelty in this story, do the kids know or was that a lie. How does he live with that......the kids know adultery is wrong...

My guess is he has lied to them too....think about that, how little he cares about any of you, to maybe crush everyone's life with his lies.....despicable really.

You don't wan to be a part of this train wreck........just think of that kind of pain and that you were helping....

You have your chance, get out, learn from it and make yourself a better person for someone who does actually love you..

What are you really missing. a lying cheater, your better than this.

You should be mad at yourself for allowing yourself to be treated so poorly for so long by someone who outsmarted you and used your emotional weakness as his tool to control you and the situation, he is doing the same to his wife, emotional blackmail to get what he wants, the two of you don't really even matter.....it's about him and his $$$ nothing more

[Patrice]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bN9OHDssYSE

[victoria5]

divorce. If he waffles, drags his feet and tries to keep juggling you and his wife .. he isn't serious. Ultimatum time ... and even if he does divorce - give it time, don't move in together, keep your finances separate. Give him a time frame and stick to it. If he does nothing, go NC. And heal what is missing in you. Nobody has the right to take away your dignity as a human being, that isn't love in any sense of the word.

 

Thank you. I finally came to that realization and wish I had stopped talking to him sooner. 100% of the guys in my past NEVER talked to me again after mutual ghosting. This is my first encounter of a ghost that came back, and of course, I thought--if he is seeking me out, it's because underlying the communication, he will do right by me. And that did not turn out to be the case, at all. And I do not have to compete with anyone.

 

If he really wants children in his future with whom his wife he cannot, then he will put forth the actions to make that a reality. And I have no reason to be there in the picture until if ever that happens. There is no coaxing, no persuasion, no enticing, no nothing. If anything, by continuing to participate in our illicit liaison, then I know 100% certainty that he would never leave. It was too convenient for him.

 

If I had engaged in No Contact sooner, I wonder how much of my dignity could have been salvaged. He was extremely predatory and relentless when he pursued me, but of course, I'm the one painted as the red lady. Nobody sees that side nor should they care. Bottom-line, it's doomed and how weak am I to indulge the lack of dopamine and the firing of serotonin in my brain when I hear from him? Did I lose respect amongst my peers that did know?

 

Getting over this has been a huge challenge, because I am dealing with so many things on different levels. How naive and dumb that I believed him when his actions said something else. How I presented myself with little self-respect and cheated myself for so much in-authenticity and pain. How hopeless I feel that I'll find someone with whom I'll share as much rapport as I did with him. The thing is, if he felt the same about me, he'd be with me. That goes for anyone, regardless of circumstance. If I had more money, commanded higher social stature, offered a deal he could not refuse. But a love based on ransom is not love at all.

 

So, it begins again, of how dumb I feel that I fell for the most cliche, the oldest trick in the book--he played to my heart's greatest desire, a family. I want so much to go grocery-shopping together, to bear children, to send out Christmas cards with our names, all of the little things, and to think he'd listen and respect me knowing what I wanted and how short he came to giving me that. I am also 100% certain that he feels little if any remorse for the pain and havoc he's wreaked on the people around him. How can you say you love me when you put me through that to satisfy your selfish wants? I'm supposed to live on breadcrumbs? Please, give me more credit. Give us more credit.

 

I think of the line from the movie, "When Harry Met Sally" when Carrie Fisher says to Meg Ryan, "He's never going to leave her, is he?" And she replies, "No, he's not." I don't like to think of it so harshly, "maybe he leaves her"--I think more, maybe they have an honest communication and agreement. If that means that they're better than ever and happy, more power to them; if that means, I'm not happy here, please let me go, then let there be an amicable, peaceful resolution. But in all scenarios, LEAVE ME OUT OF IT.

 

I refuse to be a parenthesis, an escape. I am a human being, not a doormat.

 

I don't know who ultimately reads this, but this entire experience has been extremely isolating. At least writing it down with the possibility that someone else does read it alleviates some of that isolation and it helps to strengthen my resolve of leaving the shadows behind. So, thank you.

[sandylee1]

coricoro,

 

 

 

^^^

 

A good point.

 

However, an A has the added complication of triangulation as a dynamic, which makes for an unequal power balance at the expense of the OW.

 

Agree with you AriesW.

 

As are different, because they are based on lying, deceit and sneaking around.

 

I'd say it's quite self explanatory for a normal well adjustedand developed adult to realise that an affair is not comparable to an honest open relationship, where you don't text andcall secretly.

 

I think to expect an A to be the same as aregular relationship, shows a degree of naivety or something much worse than that.

[cocorico]

Agree with you AriesW.

 

As are different, because they are based on lying, deceit and sneaking around.

 

I'd say it's quite self explanatory for a normal well adjustedand developed adult to realise that an affair is not comparable to an honest open relationship, where you don't text andcall secretly.

 

I think to expect an A to be the same as aregular relationship, shows a degree of naivety or something much worse than that.

 

We didn't lie, deceive or sneak. There was no need. We didn't text and call secretly. We were perfectly open. The only one who didn't know was the BS - because she lived in her own realm of delusion.

 

Of course an A can be a regular relationship - there are many examples on here of those which were / are. If a man loves you, puts you first, fetes you openly and acts as an official couple with you in his family life and professional life, and with his friends, then the vestigial M and the BW that leads her own life entirely separately are not regarded by anyone (apart, perhaps, from the BW) as the *real* R. There are examples on these boards of MM who live with their OW in one country, very occasionally flying to another country to conduct domestic matters with the BW; others where the MM and OW lived together all week, with the MM returning to see the kids on weekends; still others where the MM and BW lived in the same house maintaining a charade until kids were grown, but living separate lives. Not all As involve a MM lying to a BW to get her to believe he still loves her, while playing happy families with his OW.