Almost every time I tell a woman what I do for work they stop replying

[Fishfingersareyummy]

A person who works in retail? It's fair to guess thay have a lower education, lower drive and is happy to float along in life. If this isn't what they are looking for, you're going to get passed over.

 

I don't know what the pay structure is in your country, but in my country a retail store manager can earn a lot of money. Add the bonuses with the base salary, throw in a company car and the bills for the car paid by the employer and a store manager for my business organisation can make a lot of money. That's before you consider the next role up of regional manager and then zonal manager's.

 

The problem with people like you is simple. You don't have a clue what you're talking about. This OP could become a very rich man in retail providing he works his way up the hierarchical structure.

[GemmaUK]

Because in some ways it's true. How many times do you hear of a woman using a guy for his resources where she's not that crazy about him but only views him as good enough because he can provide for her. I'm not saying even most women do this, but I've heard of it quite a bit.

 

OP, you really don't have to be worried at all about this in your salary bracket.

 

If I had been chatting to you, got to know you and started dating you then below is the real deal of what I would be finding out and thinking.

 

First, I'll tell you where I was at the age of 25.

By the age of 25 I was in a career in the finance department of the head office of a huge retail chain. I joined the dept from another within the company when I was 22 and had worked my way up 3 positions by the age of 25 to team leader managing a team of 4 people.

Aside from my own work I was also responsible for hiring and firing, discipinaries, appraisals - all that comes within a manager's role.

I had moved out of home at 19, ended up back home for a bit and then moved out for good at 22.

 

Finding things out about you and what I would think:

 

He is going to go back to college in January - OK, cool, are these further studies? Hmm, no, sounds like he didn't ever finish college so that is why he is going back.

What's he studying? Hmm, he doesn't know what he is going to do yet study wise - which in turn means he likely hasn't had enough work experience yet to know what he wants to do for a living.

 

So what does he do for a living? Works in retail - OK, cool, is he a manager?

In a retail store it's not too tough to work your way up when you have initiative and do a good job. Providing the positions come up and it's not a very small independent shop then there are almost always opportunities to move up, It's just a case of keep applying for roles and making sure you stand out amongst supervisors and managers as one who is keen, is willing to do over and above and is reliable and presentable.

Right so he stacks shelves (as an example).

He is stull fairly young and has worked there for a while yet still hasn't progressed to even working the tills yet. Either he's never applied for something else or he isn't standing out to supervisors as someone who is perfectly capable and willing to do more.

 

He still lives at home with his folks - that must be it - he has to take care of his parents - one or both is ill and needs 24/7 care. I get that and it does make things tougher on work life with hospital appointments and emergencies.

Hmmm, nope, he just lives at home. His folks don't need looking after.

He hasn't yet moved out or lived independently so does that mean he doesn't know how to cook for himself, do his washing, look after a home and manage his finances? Paying bills and budgeting etc.?

 

Looks to me like this guy isn't wanting to do much for himself and his future - a lack of motivation - he even mentioned (because you did in another thread) that he wanted to study from home as it would be 'more relaxing' for him than attending a college.

It takes a lot of motivation to study from home, stick with it and pass on top of that I would guess he will also be working at the store to keep a bit of money coming in so he certainly won't have much time to date and won't have funds or time for weekend trips and holidays like I do.

 

I'm 25, a supervisor, live alone, know how to look after myself and my finances. If he hasn't ever lived independently then would it all be down to me to take care of us and a house as well as working full time and overtime while he is at home studying and earning shelf stacking pay?

Plus, I am looking to meet someone to have babies with before I hit 30 - 27 is about when I'd like to start a family. I will get maternity pay but after a few weeks maternity pay cuts right back down to £140 per week so if he is still in college or still working as a shelf stacker there's no way he would be able to support us and a little one. I would have no choice but to go back to work pretty much straight away and even then child care costs are astronomic so I'd likely need to get a second job to cover that expense. I can't see him juggling being a stay at home dad and studying

 

Even if kids are not in my life plan though it still looks like most of the financial and household responsibilities would fall upon me and we'd not be a team. I'm not interested in getting seriously involved with a man whom I would have to support continually in those ways.

 

So yeah OP, when she hears about your current job and the studying and living at home it's no wonder she'll cut the contact. She will have thought about all of the above scenarios already when she thought about how she wants her life to pan out.

[basil67]

It's not negative, it's just that what guy wants a woman to be with him mainly for his resources more than anything else.

 

Why do you think that a woman goes mainly after his resources? I would think it's more about what he does than what he earns. Anyway, there are many reasons a woman may not date a man. Having a dead end job is just one of them.

[joseb]

OP, if I were I'd focus on girls looking for something more casual.

Women looking to settle down and have kids are likely to view your career position negatively.

[ChickiePops]

What if the guy in my example had an actual career job that only paid around 30 grand a year or so? Would that still not be good enough & be seen as lazy if he went to school for something, but the field just happened to not pay much in the end?

 

And obviously not much since it seems women don't want me with the job I have now. But on the flip side of it, I'd really just dislike for a woman's deciding factor to be with me is due to having a good job.

 

Me & my friend pointed this out today that there's so many gorgeous women on online dating that are a bit older with very successful career jobs yet they're still single. How are there so many women in the late 20s-late 30s age range that are gorgeous looking with great careers still single? What are those women looking for in a guy that's keeping all of them single? And it can't just be that every one of them just got out of a relationship since there's way too many of them I've come across. I'm just genuinely wondering your perspective on what that can be.

 

Unfortinately for you, you don't get to decide how anyone else chooses the people they want to date. So you can dislike it as much as you want becaue it makes absolutely no difference to the women who are rejecting you.

 

Use it as your motivation to go back to school and figure out an actual career path.

 

For me, if I were single, I'd be looking for a guy who wants to settle down and start a family pretty soon. A guy who is stable and happy and kind and funny and smart. I would need to be physically attracted to him as well.

 

Just like a man, being beautiful and successful does not guarantee success in the dating world. Perhaps all these women have some kind of fatal flaw that sends men running.

[Fishfingersareyummy]

OP, if I were I'd focus on girls looking for something more casual.

Women looking to settle down and have kids are likely to view your career position negatively.

He could focus on building a better life for himself and not for the benefit of women.

 

In my country more and more men and women are living separately, marriage is on the decline and single Mums seem to be common place. Never mind about these women judging a man on what he does, perhaps they should learn how to keep a man in the first place.

[ChickiePops]

Err, that's unfortunately..spell check fail!

 

Also, as another poster said, it's more about your lack of motivation than the actual money you make. You've been coasting for years..not sexy.

[Fishfingersareyummy]

Err, that's unfortunately..spell check fail!

 

Also, as another poster said, it's more about your lack of motivation than the actual money you make. You've been coasting for years..not sexy.

 

How do you know that?

 

I'm in a similar position to the OP and it's not down to a lack of motivation believe you me. My dream growing up was to be a soldier and when I was 16 I wanted to become an elite soldier for my country's Army but I couldn't join until I was 22 because I had a history of asthma and had to be clear for four years, so during that time I spent every single day running with 40kg on my back, I ran for miles and miles. I built my body and my mind up for the challenge ahead only to have my entire family turn against me because they didn't want me to go out to war zones and risk my life. They became incredibly nasty to me and in the end I had to get a job because my dead beat Mother needed financial support and threatened to evict me, so I got a dead end job and I spent a year not knowing what to do before I enrolled on a part -time business degree and that's what I am doing now.

 

I accept that a majority of women will find my position unacceptable and will not view me as dating material and that's fine, I don't have any problem with that but to call me unmotivated is not something I will tolerate.

 

I'd like to see women like you getting up at 5 am, putting 40kg on your back and running for several miles. I'd like to see you carrying 40 kg jerry cans without placing them on the floor or running 1.5 miles in 8:57 seconds. When you can do all of that is when you can come to me and call me unmotivated.

[basil67]

I don't know what the pay structure is in your country, but in my country a retail store manager can earn a lot of money. Add the bonuses with the base salary, throw in a company car and the bills for the car paid by the employer and a store manager for my business organisation can make a lot of money. That's before you consider the next role up of regional manager and then zonal manager's.

 

The problem with people like you is simple. You don't have a clue what you're talking about. This OP could become a very rich man in retail providing he works his way up the hierarchical structure.

 

I agree wth you. Quite a career can be made working up through the hierarchy. Problem is that he's not working towards management. If he was undertaking a management trainee program it would be a whole different ball game.

 

Try reading the full story before you criticise posters.

[Fishfingersareyummy]

Try reading the full story before you criticise posters.

 

If he's studying for a degree or any other qualifications then it's obvious that he's looking to work his way up in life and instead of criticising him perhaps it would be better to encourage him and offer support.

 

He's trying to better his situation and that is something worthy of admiration.

[basil67]

NJ, you also have to remember that this is online dating. A woman has a cast of many to choose from and can be as picky as she likes. It's really not that different to shopping for shoes on Amazon.

 

I think that it's easier to be dismissive of a dating profile than it is with a person who you've built a rapport with in real life. In real life, she may find that his job leaves her a bit non plussed. But she really loves the way his eyes twinkle when he smiles. And she loves the way he makes her feel really important, so she gives him more of a chance.

 

Online dating is nothing more than commercialisation of dating. And consumers are ruthless.

[basil67]

If he's studying for a degree or any other qualifications then it's obvious that he's looking to work his way up in life and instead of criticising him perhaps it would be better to encourage him and offer support.

 

He's trying to better his situation and that is something worthy of admiration.

 

Again I agree. But he's not studying for a degree. He's thinking about one, but hasn't decided on a field yet. And a person gets points for working through their degree - not for thinking about it.

 

We've been trying to build hm up for a very long time - look at his history. We've given lots of advice and ideas. Problem is that he's not wanting to make any proactive changes and people are getting blunter in their advice.

[Fishfingersareyummy]

Again I agree. But he's not studying for a degree. He's thinking about one, but hasn't decided on a field yet. And a person gets points for working through their degree - not for thinking about it.

 

We've been trying to build hm up for a very long time - look at his history. We've given lots of advice and ideas. Problem is that he's not wanting to make any proactive changes and people are getting blunter in their advice.

 

He's thinking about what to subject matter(s) to study for his degree classification? Good, it means he's serious about building a better future for himself. I hope he is able to find something that he considers worthwhile and pursues it.

[elaine567]

He is a 30 year old man, who lives at home with his fit and healthy parents, who has an entry level job in retail and who is "thinking" about going back to school in January, but the subject and course have yet to be finalised.

It is all atm pie in the sky.

 

He is no go getter.. He would not be even considered normal or average in the ambition stakes. Women do not necessarily need a go getter but they need a man with a plan, a man with some fire in his belly.

Nothing wrong with people who want to pursue dreams even if it isn't financially lucrative, but here there is no dream, no real ambition to get out of the hole he has found himself in.

I guess if he wasn't looking for a woman here, he would just saunter along. His only ambition apparently stems from the need to find a woman, not from anything inside him.

Fine, if he was happy, lots of people saunter along in life and are perfectly content, but he isn't even happy with his lot here.

 

NJ123,

Time to finalise that course, get the forms, apply and just do it.

It will at least look better on your CV, to be seen to be doing something even if you never actually get any practical use from it.

Finishing the course will do your self esteem no end of good if nothing else.

Getting in to college will also open up other avenues for meeting like-minded people too.

[Fishfingersareyummy]

He is a 30 year old man, who lives at home with his fit and healthy parents, who has an entry level job in retail and who is "thinking" about going back to school in January, but the subject and course have yet to be finalised.

It is all atm pie in the sky.

 

He is no go getter.. He would not be even considered normal or average in the ambition stakes. Women do not necessarily need a go getter but they need a man with a plan, a man with some fire in his belly.

Nothing wrong with people who want to pursue dreams even if it isn't financially lucrative, but here there is no dream, no real ambition to get out of the hole he has found himself in.

I guess if he wasn't looking for a woman here, he would just saunter along. His only ambition apparently stems from the need to find a woman, not from anything inside him.

Fine, if he was happy, lots of people saunter along in life and are perfectly content, but he isn't even happy with his lot here.

.

 

You're making a lot of assumptions here.

[GemmaUK]

You're making a lot of assumptions here.

 

These aren't assumptions.

We have listened, tried to help over and over and lived through all of this.

 

NJ is not prepared to 'do' anything for himself - unlike yourself - you wanted that goal of the army - you worked hard and pushed to the limit for it.

I am sorry that it didn't work out however you have that drive inside you and I have no doubt you will use it again.

[elaine567]

You're making a lot of assumptions here.

Start reading NJs many threads and posts.

[GemmaUK]

Start reading NJs many threads and posts.

 

Agreed.

 

Sorry Elaine for speaking on your behalf there, no disrespect intended towards you in the least.

[xxoo]

 

Getting in to college will also open up other avenues for meeting like-minded people too.

 

This is very true.

 

Forget OLD. As you're finding, that's a tough crowd for someone in your position.

 

Go to college; start your program. You'll meet women in the same position career wise, but most importantly, you'll interact with women daily, make friends, and have the opportunity to connect with someone special in real life.

 

I strongly suggest you take in person classes (not online) for these reasons.

[central]

At the age you're at, women are starting to think about settling down. Getting married..having kids..etc. Can you honestly say that you would be capable of contributing 50% of all household bills right now?

 

That sounds sexist, even if it's reality for many. Many women never have and never will be capable of contributing anywhere near 50% of all household bills, and don't even have plans to continue their education. Talk about coasting! Would you consider them undesirable partners, too? Yet women with low paying jobs - or no job - have usually been able to find a mate. Is that because their primary value is as breeding stock? Is a man's primary value in providing financial security?

[Arieswoman]

Central,

 

Yet women with low paying jobs - or no job - have usually been able to find a mate. Is that because their primary value is as breeding stock? Is a man's primary value in providing financial security?

 

I would go along with this, in part.

 

From my own experiences, there are some men out there who feel threatened by an articulate, intelligent, independent woman.

 

All they want is someone to have the meals on the table when they get home from work, the kids bathed and out of the way and their **** sucked when they feel like it.

 

So they pick women who are so grateful to even have a mate that they are happy to perform this role. Also, if the man has control of the money then he has power in the relationship.

 

I will now put on my tin hat and await the brickbats

[GemmaUK]

Getting in to college will also open up other avenues for meeting like-minded people too.

 

Um, in OP's other long thread he said he didn't want to attend a college but wanted to study from home as it would be more relaxing for him - so college won't actually open up any dating avenues.

[Buddhist]

I'm not sure what the point of this thread is. If we all agree with the OP and say yes, you'll never get a gf while you work in retail what good does that do? All it does is cement the OP's fate as being desperate and dateless. He's so convinced this is the case anyway that our agreement or not makes no difference.

 

What I did see in this thread though is [one of] the major conflicts within him which is probably the reason why a relationship will not come to him. He fundamentally believes the women see men as a resource and he understandably doesn't want to be used as a resource. But if he believes this is what women want from him he actually has a very good motivation to NOT improve his economic circumstances, for fear of being used. On the one hand he wants a relationship, on the other hand he believes women just want to use him. A relationship will not come to him while he holds this fear of being used.

 

Whether he verbalises that fear or not, doesn't matter. He will subconsciously act in ways that turn women off because in actual fact he fears being in a relationship with a woman. He has so many negative beliefs about women's motivations for relationship that he will sabotage himself every single time to avoid what he fears.

[xxoo]

Um, in OP's other long thread he said he didn't want to attend a college but wanted to study from home as it would be more relaxing for him - so college won't actually open up any dating avenues.

 

If this true, then I want to reiterate:

 

I strongly suggest that you take in person, on campus courses so that you have the chance to connect with people, and not just for dating. Networking is the key to finding a job after completing the program.

 

OP, you need to break out of your comfort zone if you are going to achieve the things you want to achieve in your life.

 

A few years back, I was going through a transition in life and it was scary. I was pushed out of my comfort zone, and I didn't know exactly where I was headed. The attitude I adopted to deal with it was to say "yes" to every opportunity that came my way, if possible. My natural inclination is to say "no". I'm cautious and not a risk taker. So I simply decided to say "yes". I grew a lot that year, both personally and in my career.

[elaine567]

Um, in OP's other long thread he said he didn't want to attend a college but wanted to study from home as it would be more relaxing for him - so college won't actually open up any dating avenues.

 

I know, but he shouldn't really be doing that, should he?

He needs to get out amongst other people and widen his horizons.

Attending college would do that.