With MM, Do actions REALLY speak louder than words?!

[Hunniebae]

Actions vs words with a mm?

 

A mm already knows his limitations with an ow which makes the ow think his contributions to the affair is equal to what she's feeling and thinking. If he's saying he's thinking of you all the time you are apart, why is he still at home?

[heartwhole]

But if you're genuinely constantly thinking about your ow/om are you (mm/mw) fully in the marriage? The actions of the mm (in my case) have him physically with his wife but if mentally they're elsewhere, and never really "in" the moment at home always seeming distant/distracted living in their heads etc doesn't that mean more than "actions"?

 

for mm/mw that pine for their other for years,(and I think this is more common than people think) does his physical actions of being with the spouse really count for much if he/she is never really "there"?

 

My goal in my marriage is true companionship, true intimacy, being best friends and lovers, prioritizing our relationship above every other relationship except our role as parents which we do together. So there's absolutely no way to have the kind of marriage I want if my husband is mentally elsewhere, or if I'm mentally elsewhere.

 

When I first came to LS, I didn't share it with my husband. I was embarrassed, I guess. So I checked it only when he wasn't around. I didn't share that I was connecting with people on here. But as our bond has been strengthened and repaired, it is natural that I would share everything I'm thinking about and doing with him.

 

My husband's affair was only 5 months, but absolutely I sensed that he was not all there during the affair. Maybe I didn't know why exactly, but I noted changes -- not sitting near me and putting his arm around me at our best friends' house, for example. That was unusual. So I asked him to do so and he did. After having the OW visit him in our country on a business trip, he had an opportunity to go to her country, but when I in good faith said, "Well, this is a huge time commitment and a lot of money, but if you can explain why it's really important to you, I'll try to make it work," he just couldn't pull the trigger. We went on a trip without our kids to the Caribbean instead. So by the time DD happened, he was thinking to himself that life with me had been pretty fun recently (very condescending but where he was at the time). Because I had noticed a distance between us and was making an effort to bridge it, our relationship improved, though it could only improve so much while there were still lies and another woman between us.

 

So all this is to say that if this hypothetical MM is still at home with his wife and family, then there is the potential for their bond to increase. Most MM decide that the wife who was so awful they needed to get a mistress isn't so awful when DD comes. So remaining in that dynamic for years and years and years, as you describe, seems like a huge waste of time and effort. Much better to invest in a healthy relationship.

 

And no, it doesn't count for anything to stick around while you cheat on me. You get no credit for that whatsoever. You get to dig down to the very bottom of why you were so entitled and short-sighted as to expose me sexually without my knowledge and consent. You get to start practicing humility and ownership and selflessness. After you walk that road enough to show me that I am not a fool to give you a second chance, then maybe it counts for something. But sticking around while you have a secret girlfriend and lying to my face about it? No credit. I would respect you a lot more for taking the hit to your finances and reputation and time with your kids to have a respectable relationship with her. Maybe you'd get a little credit for that. But not for the cheating, never.

[sophinla]

If being constantly on a person's mind is what defines love, then we as humans sure have a lot of great loves. Drugs, alcohol, sex, fantasies, anything and everything that is capable of driving our minds into obsession and addiction.

 

I just think human love should be a lot bigger than a mind addiction. So yes, hell yes, if a man says he loves me , he better match it up with actions.

 

But then again, if every woman think this way, no MM would ever have any success getting into another woman's pants with sweet talk. So yeah, it takes all kinds.

Edited October 17, 2016 by sophinla

[cocorico]

Of course actions speak louder than words!

 

My fMM told me he couldn't leave his M, but he did.

He told me told me he would have to "stick it out" until the kids left "home" - but he didn't.

He told me he would walk away from "everything" - home, possessions, etc - but he didn't.

 

IC helped. Time, and perspective, helped. Friends and family support helped. He realised staying was damaging to the kids as well as himself, and he left.

 

Words may be true in the moment in which they are spoken, but they don't have to remain true forever.

[aileD]

Of course actions speak louder than words!

 

My fMM told me he couldn't leave his M, but he did.

He told me told me he would have to "stick it out" until the kids left "home" - but he didn't.

He told me he would walk away from "everything" - home, possessions, etc - but he didn't.

 

IC helped. Time, and perspective, helped. Friends and family support helped. He realised staying was damaging to the kids as well as himself, and he left.

 

Words may be true in the moment in which they are spoken, but they don't have to remain true forever.

 

If I remember ...didn't you give him a time frame ultimatum?

 

I'm always saying on here to OW...at the most of only takes 30-45 days to find an apartment and move in...if he doesn't do that....he most likely won't.

[cocorico]

If I remember ...didn't you give him a time frame ultimatum?

 

Nope. That's not my style.

 

I'm always saying on here to OW...at the most of only takes 30-45 days to find an apartment and move in...if he doesn't do that....he most likely won't.

 

I think that very much depends on where you live.

 

My H told the xW he planned to leave as soon as he found somewhere suitable for him & the kids to live, and then did so - but finding somewhere suitable did take a while. Perhaps if you're a single person it's easier, and if you aren't constrained by keeping your kids in the same school, with access to their after-school activities, friends ,etc as well as your own work, activities etc.

[cocorico]

Duplicate post

Edited October 17, 2016 by cocorico

[sandylee1]

 

Even my mm aside do you ever think there's any reason that do really justify why they don't leave? A poorly bs perhaps?

 

 

I was supporting a man. He wasn't a WS, but his wife treats him terribly. Yet he remained primarily because of his son. His wife has mental health issues and they haven't been intimate for over 6 years, yet he stays for fear of how leaving will impact on his young son.

 

She refuses to get help. She previously cheated on him with multiple men and yet he hasn't left ... so if this guy had an affair .... I can see him feeling he genuinely can't leave and that being true in his mind.

 

I don't understand how he has tolerated the abuse, but maybe if I felt my spouse having 50% custody of my child would be harmful, maybe I'd stay too .... but I doubt it. I'm more likely to emigrate and change our names, never to be found by him.

 

I tried to get himto see that this was eroding his self esteem, then he eventually started lookingat finances to leave.

[aileD]

Nope. That's not my style.

 

 

 

I think that very much depends on where you live.

 

My H told the xW he planned to leave as soon as he found somewhere suitable for him & the kids to live, and then did so - but finding somewhere suitable did take a while. Perhaps if you're a single person it's easier, and if you aren't constrained by keeping your kids in the same school, with access to their after-school activities, friends ,etc as well as your own work, activities etc.

 

I know your situation was different but for the most part the kids stay with the mother. So I guess in my eyes there's usually no good reason why they can't move out right away and be on their own and THEN spend some time finding the perfect place.

[Midwestmissy]

In response to the op, I believed his words "I would never cheat! I'm not having an affair!", and mow believed his actions - he said he's not leaving his wife but he's risking it all to be in this hotel so I mean something more to him.

 

Clearly, when the words aren't supported by actions, there will be pain and heartbreak. I think a lot of people say what they think needs to be said without meaning it, and a lot of people believe what they want to believe even as their gut is screaming at them. I had never had a reason to not trust my wh. Not once. So for me, past behaviour was what I based my thoughts on, even though this was the first time his behaviour was off the rails. I loved him and I wanted to be wrong about what I sensed. He played off that.

[wmacbride]

the question of words vs. actions is actually a really easy one to answer.

 

turn the tables around. a wh or ww may well be telling their bs that they love them, they may be making future plans with them, they may be paying them compliments, etc.

 

Those are all words.

 

Meanwhile, he or she is in an affair.

 

What value can one place on those words? what do they really mean? if he or she will lie to their bs then they will also lie to their ow/om if it gets them what they want or keeps them from having to face the consequences for their actions.

 

Words are easy and mean absolutely nothing. they are free to give, and there is no way for the listener to know if they are true or not without some kind of actual evidence to back it up.

[gettingstronger]

In a nutshell- yes, actions speak louder for sure-

To piggy back on a previous post- my WH claimed to have loved me the whole time he was in an A- thats just crap- his actions spoke otherwise- reconciliation for us means he backs up his words with actions- real changes, real actions that show he wants to be with me- the same would go for an OW, he can say what he wants-but if he doesn't back it up with actions, its meaningless-

[cocorico]

I know your situation was different but for the most part the kids stay with the mother. So I guess in my eyes there's usually no good reason why they can't move out right away and be on their own and THEN spend some time finding the perfect place.

 

How is having the kids full-time different to having them part-time, when it comes to finding suitable accommodation? If you're a MM staying "for the kids", and everyone tells you that dumping the BW isn't the same as dumping the kids, then of course you'd want to make sure that you can offer them a decent place to stay with you as well was with the BW, so that you aren't, in effect, dumping them. Basically, what you're advocating is that MM *do* dump their kids, flee the BW and move into a shoebox where they can't take the kids, just to prove that they value their R with the OW more than their life with heir kids (and BW)? Nope, can't support that view. Some MM may be so repulsed by the BW hat they're willing to give up on their kids just to get away from the BW, but I suspect that's a small proportion. Most would rather still see their kids.

[Cloudcuckoo]

How is having the kids full-time different to having them part-time, when it comes to finding suitable accommodation? If you're a MM staying "for the kids", and everyone tells you that dumping the BW isn't the same as dumping the kids, then of course you'd want to make sure that you can offer them a decent place to stay with you as well was with the BW, so that you aren't, in effect, dumping them. Basically, what you're advocating is that MM *do* dump their kids, flee the BW and move into a shoebox where they can't take the kids, just to prove that they value their R with the OW more than their life with heir kids (and BW)? Nope, can't support that view. Some MM may be so repulsed by the BW hat they're willing to give up on their kids just to get away from the BW, but I suspect that's a small proportion. Most would rather still see their kids.

 

Anyone who ends up 'repulsed' by the person they fell in love with, married and had children with then took an age to find the guts to leave must surely need a tremendous amount of therapy to understand THAT .....

 

Crikey.....

[cocorico]

Anyone who ends up 'repulsed' by the person they fell in love with, married and had children with then took an age to find the guts to leave must surely need a tremendous amount of therapy to understand THAT .....

 

Crikey.....

 

Exactly. I think that's far from the norm. I think most WS would rather stay longer with the BS to ensure they find suitable accommodation for themselves and the kids - whether they have the kids full time or part time - before moving out. I think the numbers of those who meet an AP and rush out with undue haste are very small. Most people get their ducks in a row first.

[wmacbride]

Exactly. I think that's far from the norm. I think most WS would rather stay longer with the BS to ensure they find suitable accommodation for themselves and the kids - whether they have the kids full time or part time - before moving out. I think the numbers of those who meet an AP and rush out with undue haste are very small. Most people get their ducks in a row first.

 

If this is true, then a majority of mm and mw must have millions of ducks because it takes them a lifetime to get them into a row so they can leave...

[aileD]

If this is true, then a majority of mm and mw must have millions of ducks because it takes them a lifetime to get them into a row so they can leave...

 

True. It's an excuse, You dont have to have a bedroom right away for your kids in order to be a good father and be present in their lives. And If they would choose not to move in with OW, any apartment with a couch will do for now.

[ladydesigner]

Another post made me think about this a bit more... Everyone always says actions speak louder than words - but do they really?

 

My mm "says"he loves me, will always want me thinks about me all the time etc BUT can't leave because of kids (we're long distance) and he can't afford to live alone. The latter I actually believe I know many people that work full time yet can't afford to live alone. He genuinely would hardly see his kids. Both seem valid reasons to me.

 

But if you're genuinely constantly thinking about your ow/om are you (mm/mw) fully in the marriage? The actions of the mm (in my case) have him physically with his wife but if mentally they're elsewhere, and never really "in" the moment at home always seeming distant/distracted living in their heads etc doesn't that mean more than "actions"?

 

for mm/mw that pine for their other for years,(and I think this is more common than people think) does his physical actions of being with the spouse really count for much if he/she is never really "there"?

 

No they are not fully in the M or the A. Some MM are only concerned about what they want in the moment. I don't believe they give either relationship a chance.

 

This applies to BS as well if WH isn't putting in the work (actions not words) is it really reconciliation? It definitely applies to me. My WH has not shown me by his actions or the MOW. He has only worried about looking like the 'good guy' throughout, hence only thinks about himself (I kid you not ).