Why is it so difficult to get over an abusive borderline tendency relationship?

[Frozensushi]

It's not that I harbour bad feelings towards those exes, it's just that I don't see the need to relive those times by viewing those pictures.

 

I agree with you. At the time, when I was going through my deleting rampage, a few pics plucked at my heart strings. I think keeping some of those memories was in essence, my fear of letting go completely. I believe there was a small part of me hanging on to the idealization I felt, that perhaps the imaginary woman I fell in love with would somehow return to me and make it all better. Delusional, yes, but I was rather desperate the following weeks after the breakup.

 

If I were to cleanse myself of everything today, though. I would have no problem ridding myself of every last memento as I want nothing to do with that person for the rest of my life. I'm not one to hold a grudge, but that bridge is burnt.

 

Life is crazy and we all deal with it in our own way. It's a struggle for sure, but as you've pointed out many times if we remove the source of our pain and frustrations we make room for the positive things to enter our lives.

[TexasGuy12]

Apologize if this isn't the best thread for this, but since the topic of this thread relates to BPD exs, and since many of us in this thread have experiences with them, I figured I would post this here.

 

Sometimes when I come to the boards, I start thinking more about my ex. I want to come and try to help others going through similar ordeals, but at the same time sometime it makes my mind wander. So in the depths of this night, I googled "BPD relationships" just to see what came up. I found my way to a different forum, and I found this story. And I had a "holy ****" moment when every single trait mentioned applied to my ex as well.

 

Here's the story...

 

I lived with a certified BDP for about 1.5 years. She was diagnosed with it and has been under therapy of some sort for most of her life.

 

Like many of you she seemed perfectly normal when i first met her. Pretty, well spoken, funny. And she came on like gang busters when I first met her. Sex right away, declaring her love for me within a week or two. Saying how i was her knight in shining armor. Hooked me immeaditely.

 

Soon I began to see many red flags. Drinking, many failed relationships, many different jobs, strange stories about her past, changed her hair style and color many times, could go from one hobby to the next like the drop of a hat and never revisit the old one again. She began to have depression, raging like you have never seen someone rage. I mean could literally go on for hours screaming over nothing. And then the next day be the sweetest person you would ever meet.

 

Soon when she began to doubt my true love for her she made up stories to attract sympathy. Saying she was raped in a parking lot, saying she was attacked when she took out the garbage and even had perfectly placed slice marks on her head to "prove it". Of course since I had found out so many of her past stories were lies, i really didn't believe these either and of course those turned out to be false as well. All to get my "attention".

 

After a while her daily drinking became so bad, her raging so bad, I was ready to move out and on with my life. Thats when she took a knife and in front of me slit her wrist wide open. Thankfully she sliced it parellel and not across, or she would have died right there. I mean her wrist was wide open, cut all her tendons, everything. She also o d'd on her her meds to try and kill herself.

 

She really tried to get help. I mean she realized what she had and didnt want to be that way but there was nothing she could do according to her.

 

Finally when i left for good, she hit and sliced herself and then called the police saying I attacked her-which I didnt. I was arrested, put in jail for two days, humiliated. I eventually got everything cleared but only after paying court costs, lawyer fees, and attending anger management class for 15 weeks at $50 a pop. If anyone knows me they call me the most laid back person they know. I never get angry, which is why that class was such a joke, and the instructor knew that after a week or two and gave me a glowing report to the judge.

 

She also stole my car, slandered me to everyone she knew. All because I left her.

 

There are a million other stories I could tell about her in the time we were together, but suffice it to say they are all very similar to the ones I gave here. Lets just call it a neverending soap opera.

 

I was sucked in. I thought I could "fix" her. When i got out of that relationship eventually it felt like all the life had been sucked out of me. Thats what they do, suck the life out of you and then move on since they always need new forms of excitement and drama to keep them from thinking about their own depression.

 

I am telling anyone now, if you have any inkling that your gf or wife has borderline personality disorder, run like you have never run before. I have had numerous psychiatrists tell me BPD is the one disorder they are actually scared of. It is untreatable.

 

Came on like gangbusters? Check!

 

Sex right away? Check!! (Crazy amazing sex)

 

Saying how I was her knight in shining armor? Check!

 

Drinking? Check! She would drink and I would "lose her" in that she would just become someone totally different. After one of our arguments when I triggered her abandonment fear, she offered to quit drinking.

 

Many failed relationships? Check! She had 3 failed marriages prior to getting with me. Of course, she had a perfectly logical story for each one of them.

 

Change her hair style and color many times? Check! Okay, this is nuts. She has gone from overweight to underweight, blonde to brunette, short to long...and back again.

 

Rage/sweet? Check!

 

Figured this would be helpful for people who maybe still aren't 100% convinced if their ex is a BDPer, or if you just need further evidence. I know firsthand that it helps.

[PLT]

Texasguy, that sounds HORRIFIC!

 

I know just what you mean about sometimes staying away from here because it can bring back memories. On the other hand it also helps me develop a kind of distance from her. It helps me seperate the romanticized version of her I build in my head (because we are caring and forgiving, this is natural I have learnt) from the reality of her.

 

I am more and more convinced that my ex is more on the narc side of things. I read the below articles last night and every single one of them is frighteningly accurate. They could literally have been written about my relationship. I could have written these. Every single word. In particular the total lack of any feelings of guilt (not just in relation to me, but in relation to everyone after she treats them like ****) really struck me. She "discarded" pretty much every single friend she had when I met her through the course of our relationship. Her words for this is "kicking them to the curb". It seems she spends her whole life just kicking various people to the kerb. Her rationale is "I'll just get new ones". Like replacing a blown lightbulb.

 

https://relationshipedia.me/2015/07/10/narc-sadistic-brainwashing-the-8-ingredients-of-mind-control/

 

https://relationshipedia.me/2015/06/16/the-8-most-common-narc-sadistic-conversation-control-tactics/

 

https://relationshipedia.me/2015/05/13/the-4-most-common-narc-sadistic-triangulation-tactics/

 

https://relationshipedia.me/2015/06/26/the-narc-sadistic-no-win-situation-traps-2/

 

 

It's still so difficult to truly believe that such a sweet, beautiful, funny, charming, free spirited person is actually such a grotesque, warped, bitter, twisted, vengeful, hateful, spiteful, manipulator, but as a science geek, (and former murder investigator), the EVIDENCE speaks for itself.

 

I'm nearing the end of my counselling now. My final session is next week. It's a bit scary. It had become my sanctuary. I do think though, that these past 8 months or so have given me tools to deal with it all. It's just up to me to use them now.

 

I have to keep reminding myself that she ISNT having this wonderful life without me that I think she is. She may project that illusion to others, and even to herself. Deep down though, I know which of us will be happier in 5 years time, as she is incapable of being truly happy, because she is incapable of love and compassion.

 

EDIT: Another thing struck me just now that I never really thought about before. After I ended things with her (our first break up) in September 2015 she said, and I quote "I don't get dumped. I do the dumping". Now when I look back she was more upset and angry by this than by our long term relationship crumbling into ****. If I think about it objectively, it's like she's been "getting her own back" on me ever since for daring to break up with her.

 

I haven't had the urge to unblock her or contact her since Sunday. So far so good. I have been chatting to someone on Tinder for a few days and thankfully it's not been full on or over the top. Just a couple of messages each day slowly asking each other about our lives. It's nice, at a nice pace and if the conversation continues well for another few days I might ask her to meet up for a drink or a coffee. She only lives 10 or so miles away too.

Edited November 17, 2016 by PLT

[theex]

This is a long thread, and admittedly, I didn't get past the first couple of pages. But from what I have read so far, sounds like there are much more men with female BPD exes than the other way around. I came on here trying to figure why my ex was so hot and cold, impulsive, irrational, dramatic, mean, immature, hurtful, etc. and realized that he could very well have BPD. I think it may be much more apparent in males because men stereotypically are not as emotional and when a man has wild mood swings in a relationship, I presume he's either cheating and is guilt-ridden or he's BPD. My ex was doing the former, driven by what I suspect is the latter.

 

Although I have made the decision to let him go and stop trying to help him, I can't help but think, "Do people with BPD end up in long-term relationships?" I feel my ex is so capable of loving someone, as I've seen him with his niece and he just dotes on her. Also, he has always wanted to be a father. We often talked about getting married and have kids. Whenever I would ask him what his passions in life were, he would answer, "To be a father." I believe there's some truth to that. I often wish that I could have my ex back, without the BPD that's ravaging his heart. He's pushed so many of his family and close friends away who have tried to help stabilize him. I have been the one fixture in his life that he held onto to and put all of his trust in. It's a good feeling to be trusted like that and it becomes addictive.

 

It just breaks my heart to read these stories of broken relationships because of BPD. Everyday, I pray to a god that I don't believe in for my ex to be "healed," for him to be able to love fully and genuinely. But I know right now, he's just looking for his next "victim" and shutting me out of his life so he doesn't have to face the shame and guilt of his actions. He's jumped from relationship to relationship for close to 30 years, looking for someone who will take him in, nurture him, and put up with his lies and deceit. He pushes emotional boundaries and sees what he can get away with. His parents have given up on helping him and all of his childhood friends turn a blind eye to his unstable ways. When I met them at a reunion/wedding, they all were thrilled that he'd met me and they all wanted him to keep me in his life, but as soon as things are good, he was already secretly creeping online, looking for a way to sabotage his own happiness. It is so sad and I want to help him so badly, but I know I can't do more than "pray" for him.

[Frozensushi]

Although I have made the decision to let him go and stop trying to help him, I can't help but think, "Do people with BPD end up in long-term relationships?"

 

It happens but I think usually no. I was shocked when my Ex revealed how many boyfriends and sexual partners she's had. I know she was only trying to be transparent, but it was quite unnerving. I should have taken it as a red flag, but then there's those who believe that having numerous failed relationships to be normal thing. I guess it comes down to your own personal values and standards.

 

Here a really good article ---> BREAKING UP WITH A BORDERLINE:

There must be 50 Ways to leave your Lover.

Edited November 17, 2016 by Frozensushi
Added link to article

[TexasGuy12]

This is a long thread, and admittedly, I didn't get past the first couple of pages. But from what I have read so far, sounds like there are much more men with female BPD exes than the other way around. I came on here trying to figure why my ex was so hot and cold, impulsive, irrational, dramatic, mean, immature, hurtful, etc. and realized that he could very well have BPD. I think it may be much more apparent in males because men stereotypically are not as emotional and when a man has wild mood swings in a relationship, I presume he's either cheating and is guilt-ridden or he's BPD. My ex was doing the former, driven by what I suspect is the latter.

 

Although I have made the decision to let him go and stop trying to help him, I can't help but think, "Do people with BPD end up in long-term relationships?" I feel my ex is so capable of loving someone, as I've seen him with his niece and he just dotes on her. Also, he has always wanted to be a father. We often talked about getting married and have kids. Whenever I would ask him what his passions in life were, he would answer, "To be a father." I believe there's some truth to that. I often wish that I could have my ex back, without the BPD that's ravaging his heart. He's pushed so many of his family and close friends away who have tried to help stabilize him. I have been the one fixture in his life that he held onto to and put all of his trust in. It's a good feeling to be trusted like that and it becomes addictive.

 

It just breaks my heart to read these stories of broken relationships because of BPD. Everyday, I pray to a god that I don't believe in for my ex to be "healed," for him to be able to love fully and genuinely. But I know right now, he's just looking for his next "victim" and shutting me out of his life so he doesn't have to face the shame and guilt of his actions. He's jumped from relationship to relationship for close to 30 years, looking for someone who will take him in, nurture him, and put up with his lies and deceit. He pushes emotional boundaries and sees what he can get away with. His parents have given up on helping him and all of his childhood friends turn a blind eye to his unstable ways. When I met them at a reunion/wedding, they all were thrilled that he'd met me and they all wanted him to keep me in his life, but as soon as things are good, he was already secretly creeping online, looking for a way to sabotage his own happiness. It is so sad and I want to help him so badly, but I know I can't do more than "pray" for him.

 

The bolded part of that really is true. It's something I figured out early about my ex. She lied and manipulated things so much, that even if she had wanted to stop, she wouldn't have been able to because she was in so deep, and once I found out who she really was, there's no way she was staying with me, and that's also why I personally don't expect to hear from her, even if her normal tendency would be to recycle and paint me white again.

 

It's so much easier for them to move on with someone new who she can recreate and manipulate from the beginning without worrying about all the baggage. She'll become someone totally different (She moved 90 minutes away one month after our breakup) and manipulate her next "victim" And then when the honeymoon period is over, that will start going downhill too.

 

Remember, most BPDers are actually pretty smart. My ex was absolutely brilliant. She was a geologist, has a PHD (at least I think so - LOL!!). Somewhere deep down, I believe they know how F'd up the thing they do are. And they don't want to face it. That's why they project it onto us. Rather than face their issues and faults, they project it on us. So no way they're sticking around to see the wreckage that they caused.

[TexasGuy12]

This is a long thread, and admittedly, I didn't get past the first couple of pages. But from what I have read so far, sounds like there are much more men with female BPD exes than the other way around. I came on here trying to figure why my ex was so hot and cold, impulsive, irrational, dramatic, mean, immature, hurtful, etc. and realized that he could very well have BPD. I think it may be much more apparent in males because men stereotypically are not as emotional and when a man has wild mood swings in a relationship, I presume he's either cheating and is guilt-ridden or he's BPD. My ex was doing the former, driven by what I suspect is the latter.

 

Although I have made the decision to let him go and stop trying to help him, I can't help but think, "Do people with BPD end up in long-term relationships?" I feel my ex is so capable of loving someone, as I've seen him with his niece and he just dotes on her. Also, he has always wanted to be a father. We often talked about getting married and have kids. Whenever I would ask him what his passions in life were, he would answer, "To be a father." I believe there's some truth to that. I often wish that I could have my ex back, without the BPD that's ravaging his heart. He's pushed so many of his family and close friends away who have tried to help stabilize him. I have been the one fixture in his life that he held onto to and put all of his trust in. It's a good feeling to be trusted like that and it becomes addictive.

 

It just breaks my heart to read these stories of broken relationships because of BPD. Everyday, I pray to a god that I don't believe in for my ex to be "healed," for him to be able to love fully and genuinely. But I know right now, he's just looking for his next "victim" and shutting me out of his life so he doesn't have to face the shame and guilt of his actions. He's jumped from relationship to relationship for close to 30 years, looking for someone who will take him in, nurture him, and put up with his lies and deceit. He pushes emotional boundaries and sees what he can get away with. His parents have given up on helping him and all of his childhood friends turn a blind eye to his unstable ways. When I met them at a reunion/wedding, they all were thrilled that he'd met me and they all wanted him to keep me in his life, but as soon as things are good, he was already secretly creeping online, looking for a way to sabotage his own happiness. It is so sad and I want to help him so badly, but I know I can't do more than "pray" for him.

 

One more thing about your post. You mentioned your ex with his niece. So my ex has a young daughter. She was 2.5 when I started dating her. Let me tell you - one of the things that initially attracted me to her was that she was legitimately the best mother I had ever, ever seen. I'm not one for dramatic, emotional statements, but I once told her that seeing her with her daughter shows all that is right in the world.

 

It's something I've always wondered. How could she be so amazing to her daughter, and so dysfunctional in all aspects of life? And when I say dysfunction, I mean pure catastrophic dysfunction. Drinking, lying about being sick, cheating, deceits, etc etc.

 

I have 3 theories. One, I think a lot of people with BPD, and I believe this has been confirmed/validated by some of the experts on here, have been impacted by rough childhoods. A lot of their issues start by their relationship, or lack thereof, with their parents. So I think my ex likely subconsciously recognized how F'd up her childhood was and that it has contributed to her issues today, and she didn't want her daughter to have her same issues. it doesn't have to be conscious, but I do think that had a role in it.

 

Two, I think that there is something deep inside them that is all about self-preservation. Having a child is a much bigger attachment than any partner, and I think the child becomes an extension of them rather than another person that can be painted black or white.

 

Finally, it's been said that BPD have the mental capacity of children, and I think that allows them to relate really well to kids. My ex would do the most awesome things with her daughter. Simple things like packing up food and taking her for a picnic in the park, or setting up a mini softball field in her basement and playing for hours down there. Kind of like how Michael Jackson built a carnival in his backyard. They're still kids at heart, and she did for her daughter perhaps what she had always wanted to do.

 

Obviously I don't know your situation or his with his niece, but I just wanted to shed some light that I do think kids have a special place in BPDers hearts, at least given my experience.

[TexasGuy12]

It happens but I think usually no. I was shocked when my Ex revealed how many boyfriends and sexual partners she's had. I know she was only trying to be transparent, but it was quite unnerving. I should have taken it as a red flag, but then there's those who believe that having numerous failed relationships to be normal thing. I guess it comes down to your own personal values and standards.

 

Here a really good article ---> BREAKING UP WITH A BORDERLINE:

There must be 50 Ways to leave your Lover.

 

What an unbelievably good article. Thanks for sharing!

[aloneinaz]

I have to keep reminding myself that she ISNT having this wonderful life without me that I think she is. She may project that illusion to others, and even to herself. Deep down though, I know which of us will be happier in 5 years time, as she is incapable of being truly happy, because she is incapable of love and compassion.

 

Ask yourself this. Was her life prior to you happy, cheerful, stable and drama free? Of course not. Why would it be after you?

 

I've mentioned this before. My BPD ex came back after me at 5-6 months post break up. When I finally replied to her so she would stop contacting me, she was told no. She tried off/on after that as well. I had moved on and had met my now fiance.

 

She married a new guy less than a year after meeting him. She texted me to tell me this. She wasn't blocked because there wasn't any contact between us and I'd moved on which she knew. I share this text with my fiance. She said how do you feel about it. I said I feel sorry for the guy and the hell he's going through. My finace has heard all the horror stories about this ex.

 

My rambling point is this. Who cares what the now ex is doing or how she's living her life. It not our worry on concern anymore. People don't change. Holding animosity and anger towards them is a waste of time and energy. Forgive them for the **** mental health card they were dealt. Then, be grateful you're free of the horror, stress, anxiety and drama that was a relationship with them.

[Downtown]

Here a really good article ---> BREAKING UP WITH A BORDERLINE: There must be 50 Ways to leave your Lover.

Frozen, because most BPDers also exhibit strong traits of a second PD as well, Shari Schreiber's blog might describe your Ex perfectly. I recommend, however, that you not rely on her for a basic understanding of BPD behavior. I strongly disagree with her portrayal of BPDers as uncaring emotional vampires and as manipulative spiders who spin webs to trap you. I also disagree with her claim that they are unable to love. Those claims are simply false and she makes no effort to support them.

 

Schreiber confuses BPD traits with those of narcissists and sociopaths and thus fails to distinguish among these three patterns of behavior. Yet, if your Ex has very strong narcissistic traits in addition to strong BPD traits, I can see how you might find Schreiber's descriptions useful. Keep in mind, however, that most BPDers do not exhibit strong traits of NPD or sociopathy (Antisocial PD). Only 39% of BPDers have strong NPD traits and only 14% have strong ASPD (sociopathic) traits. See Table 3 at 2008 Study in JCP.

 

If you read Shari Schreiber's page about herself at that same website, you will find that she claims to have an MA degree in psychology but is not licensed as a therapist. Previously she had claimed to be a therapist but, after BPDfamily.com raised objections to that claim, she started describing herself as an "educator" and "healer" on her website. On Twitter, she refers to herself as "PsychSavant." In Calif, she apparently completed an internship for therapy but not the requirements for being licensed.

 

I nonetheless do like her explanation of how we caregivers may get to be excessive fixers in childhood. This is why I sometimes refer caregivers to her blog article, Do You Love to be Needed? But please keep in mind that neither "excessive caregiving" nor "codependency" is considered to be a disorder. That's why it does not appear in the APA's diagnostic manual (DSM-5).

[bruindds]

Thank you everyone for sharing; I read just about every post in this thread. I am so glad I found this!

My friends and family have been so understanding, but to hear what you all have been through really helps!

Like so many, the initial stage was so wonderful -- about 14 months. The past 14 months have sucked, with a gradual deterioration and so many 'come here/go away' cycles, and finally a couple months of painful breakups and get back together. I am realizing so much of what I wanted was just a fantasy. Realizing I was on the receiving end of a lot of verbal abuse has helped me let go. Let go of the fantasy that she could be the sweet gf that she used to be. Let go of the fantasy that I could be the hero for her and her daughter.

 

I am about 7 weeks post final break up and I am starting to see the fog clearing, less cravings, so much less anxiety, actually feeling pretty good not being in a relationship! I am 49 and this is my first time in my life that I am truly on my own. The NC has been so helpful although I can feel that if she were to contact me I would feel like I should respond. Something there for me to work on. I am encouraged by everyone here saying effectively: Vanish from her life.

[PLT]

Welcome to the club no one wants to be in bruindds.

[salparadise]

 

I have 3 theories. One, I think a lot of people with BPD, and I believe this has been confirmed/validated by some of the experts on here, have been impacted by rough childhoods. A lot of their issues start by their relationship, or lack thereof, with their parents. So I think my ex likely subconsciously recognized how F'd up her childhood was and that it has contributed to her issues today, and she didn't want her daughter to have her same issues. it doesn't have to be conscious, but I do think that had a role in it.

 

Yes, that's the etiology. It's pretty well accepted by the old school psychologists. An inherited biological predisposition combined with interruption or failure to develop the necessary secure bonding with the mother (or primary caregiver) during the critical window of development in early childhood leaves them with an incomplete sense of self. They rely on the other to fill that void. The current trend is to not focus on etiology, but I think it's key to understanding the disorder.

 

Two, I think that there is something deep inside them that is all about self-preservation. Having a child is a much bigger attachment than any partner, and I think the child becomes an extension of them rather than another person that can be painted black or white.

 

Yes, their relationships tend to be enmeshed. They rely on the child to meet their needs, and since the child is reliant on them it becomes a cycle of dysfunction and codependence. Unfortunately, the child learns that the affection of the mother is reliant on behavior (child meeting her needs) rather than unconditional and the child ends up with the same dysfunction. It's common for the child to replace the spouse as the primary relationship, which of course, is not the way a healthy family is structured.

 

Finally, it's been said that BPD have the mental capacity of children, and I think that allows them to relate really well to kids. My ex would do the most awesome things with her daughter. Simple things like packing up food and taking her for a picnic in the park, or setting up a mini softball field in her basement and playing for hours down there. Kind of like how Michael Jackson built a carnival in his backyard. They're still kids at heart, and she did for her daughter perhaps what she had always wanted to do.

 

They have the EMOTIONAL capacity of a child, but can be quite intelligent. Emotional development is arrested or regresses depending on whether bonding was interrupted or never established. The mother-child relationship is typically enmeshed with the BPD parent seeing the child as an extension of herself. Since the child is completely dependent, it feels more secure than the relationship with the spouse. She sees the spouse as an extension as well, however, the spouse is not malleable like a child and may not always behave as she would have them. So the spouse may trigger the deep insecurities by being too independent, whereas the child reinforces her by learning that acceptance depends on mirroring the mother and meeting her needs.

[Frozensushi]

Yes, that's the etiology. It's pretty well accepted by the old school psychologists. An inherited biological predisposition combined with interruption or failure to develop the necessary secure bonding with the mother (or primary caregiver) during the critical window of development in early childhood leaves them with an incomplete sense of self. They rely on the other to fill that void. The current trend is to not focus on etiology, but I think it's key to understanding the disorder.

 

My Exe's father abandoned her as a child. Her mother then married a physically and emotionally abusive man. She told me that she felt her mom had chose her step-father over her. She felt like her mom abandoned her, emotionally, to be with this man. She revealed this to me fairly early in the relationship, obviously to gain my sympathy and to ignite my 'savior' status. Which of course, it did.

 

Yes, their relationships tend to be enmeshed. They rely on the child to meet their needs, and since the child is reliant on them it becomes a cycle of dysfunction and codependence. Unfortunately, the child learns that the affection of the mother is reliant on behavior (child meeting her needs) rather than unconditional and the child ends up with the same dysfunction. It's common for the child to replace the spouse as the primary relationship, which of course, is not the way a healthy family is structured.

 

Wow, I've not really touched on this aspect of my relationship with my Ex, but this hit home in a big way. It only took me a short while to see the codependency and dysfunction my Ex had with her child. It was an extremely toxic relationship, even though the child was a mere toddler. At age 4 she was still breastfeeding, sleeping with, always carrying around and hand feeding her child (or she wouldn't eat). My Ex always gave in to what the child demanded just to get a moment's peace (as my Ex would say "Because it's easier"). My Ex had no boundaries with her child.

 

The child was very emotionally unstable and was in control of the household. When her mom wasn't around she'd act like a very well adjusted kid, calm and happy. Once my Ex returned, her child would freak out, start crying or demanding many things. There were no rules, no structure or routine in the child's life. So that meant the child's day was always random, from taking naps at 6 PM and not going to bed till 2 AM to feeding her unhealthy foods like a stick of butter and grated parmesan cheese, just to calm the child down. The kid was always watching TV or playing on my Ex's phone, all day and right before bed the kid had her laptop watching cartoons.

 

I know some people will say attachment parenting or being a helicopter parent is perfectly fine. Perhaps, but if the parent has no boundaries with their child it will get out of control. I do believe my Exes codependency with her child was a major factor as to why it was so easy for her to split me black and push me away for weeks and months. I suspected as much after learning about the BPDers fear of abandonment. I knew that's why she had no issue disengaging with me, as she had a backup.

 

In a moment of honesty, my Ex told me she felt guilty about something. When I asked her what she felt guilty about, she said she loves her child, just really didn't like her. She then told me if she had the means she'd go to high schools around the country teaching students how important it was to use protection and only having children if you're in a stable marriage.

 

What is someone supposed to say to that??

 

Anyway, everything you said hit home. Especially the part where you said "The mother-child relationship is typically enmeshed with the BPD parent seeing the child as an extension of herself.".

 

We were at the zoo not too long before the final breakup. I told me Ex, "Hey, we should come here by ourselves some time." my Ex replied "What's the point? I'd never come here without my daughter.". She said that because, after the honeymoon, her child was involved in everything we did. Instead of seeing it as an opportunity to be a couple and spend some alone time together, she took it as an insult. No more dates, no more alone time. If her child wasn't was going to be a part of it, then what's the point?

 

Thank you for bringing up the topic and having such great insight about it salparadise. It's hard for me to talk about, as I miss the child and I hate knowing I'm no longer there to help her.

[salparadise]

I know some people will say attachment parenting or being a helicopter parent is perfectly fine. Perhaps, but if the parent has no boundaries...

 

Anyway, everything you said hit home. Especially the part where you said "The mother-child relationship is typically enmeshed with the BPD parent seeing the child as an extension of herself.".

 

Thank you for bringing up the topic and having such great insight about it salparadise. It's hard for me to talk about, as I miss the child and I hate knowing I'm no longer there to help her.

 

Glad you found it helpful, Frozensushi. I would just add that this is not the same as helicopter parenting. Helicopter parenting is mildly dysfunctional because the parent is preventing the child from having natural experiences... action A leads to consequences B. But enmeshment is way more than that.

 

And it's also strange how they're enmeshed on the one hand and missing the secure attachment that the child needs to develop autonomy and a complete sense of self.

 

My ex is still trying to get my 21 year old daughter to meet her needs. My daughter seems to have broken the generational inheritance, thank goodness.

[Frozensushi]

Glad you found it helpful, Frozensushi. I would just add that this is not the same as helicopter parenting. Helicopter parenting is mildly dysfunctional because the parent is preventing the child from having natural experiences... action A leads to consequences B. But enmeshment is way more than that.

 

Indeed salparadise, indeed. I'm well aware of that. I only put those two parenting styles out there in my earlier response so that people who are reading this, who might be misinformed and unaware of the BPD condition, might not snap back at me for my comments about her conduct with her child. It happens on this forum quite a bit, unfortunately. I am fully aware of what 'enmeshment' is and what effect it had on me and my Ex GF's child.

 

The things you said, it hit home in such a way that it was like a deluge of emotional baggage I've been carrying around, as I've not discussed this part of my relationship with anyone. Now I realize what a monumental part it played. Jesus. :\

 

And it's also strange how they're enmeshed on the one hand and missing the secure attachment that the child needs to develop autonomy and a complete sense of self.

 

I'm really glad you brought that up. I fought my Ex constantly about this issue she had with her child. After a while, she did see my point and did her best to try to force her child to be independent. But at the end of the day, it always defaulted back to the security blanket of codependency. No matter how hard I tried and no matter what I did, it always fell back on their codependency to each other.

 

There were moments of clarity when my Ex knew the relationship she had with her daughter was toxic. She could see it clearly. Just as an alcoholic would realize all his problems in life stemmed from alcohol. BUT, just like an alcoholic going back to the bottle anytime life reared it's ugly face, she just could NOT stop going back to what was easy, what was comfortable, that security blanket she knew and loved. The thing is, that security blanket was tattered and soiled. We both knew it.

 

One night during a moment of clarity, my Ex was so fed up with her daughter's behavior, she'd seceded her stance that she was an "Awesome Mom" and told me "I did it all wrong, I'm a failure as a parent". Of course, 'savior' me tried to intervene on her behalf and help her, guide her to a better way of life with her child. Of course, this caused her to resent me and in the end was the demise of our relationship.

 

 

**For people who might be offended by my parenting views**

I dated an awesome woman/mom for 3 years who ran a tight ship with her kids. She set a standard of parenting, that in my eyes, was nothing short of amazing. Her three girls thrived on routine and structure. These girls today are well on their way to success. So if anyone wants to tell me my current Ex was "doing the best she could", please stuff it, you suck as a parent. Kids need to be independent, they need structure and they need routine. They don't need to sit in front of the TV all day and they certainly should not be babied till they are out of the nest. It might have worked for you, but you are an exception in my books. Sorry to upset you, but I'm an adult and have a lot of experience with MANY kids and parents.

[Downtown]

I fought my Ex constantly about this issue she had with her child. After a while, she did see my point and did her best to try to force her child to be independent. But at the end of the day, it always defaulted back to the security blanket of codependency.

Frozen, I agree with you and Sal that spoiling a child can be just as damaging as verbally abusing her. When the child is being spoiled, a parent is continually sending the message that "I'm doing this task for you because you're incapable of doing it correctly." When a young child gets hundreds or thousands of these messages throughout childhood, she can grow up feeling incompetent and having very low self esteem.

[Been]

What's the number 1 trait for someone who has this mental disease.

I ask because my ex demonstrates ALOT of these traits but not all.

All her major relationships featured recycle phases. All of them.

She lied about almost everything. One minute she was happy then minute latter she wasn't. One minute were are getting married. Then the next we aren't.

Everybody wanted her according to her-then she would state she wasn't that hot.

It was like her words couldn't meet her actions. Or vice versa.

[DeepVibeZ]

What helped me during the BU was finally realizing that after a year when she mirrored me - which felt pretty fantastic - I eventually began to mirror her and felt awful - depressed, reclusive, anxious, rage-filled, almost suicidal.

And this was long before I knew about BPD. If I had known I'd have got out years ago.

Why would ANYONE in their right minds want to go back to that life with those feelings? Why would anyone miss feeling like ****?

[Downtown]

What's the number 1 trait for someone who has this mental disease.

The key defining trait for BPD is being so emotionally immature that -- like a young child -- the person is unable to regulate his/her own emotions. The result is emotional instability, which is listed in the DSM-5 as a defining trait for BPD but not for any other personality disorder. Indeed, it is such a key feature of BPD that a substantial share of the psychiatric community has been lobbying for two decades to change its name to "Emotional Regulation Disorder."

 

She lied about almost everything.

Deception, as indicated by repeatedly lying, is a defining trait for ASPD (Antisocial PD, aka sociopathy). It is not a defining trait for BPD.

 

One minute she was happy then minute latter she wasn't. One minute were are getting married. Then the next we aren't.

You are describing emotional instability. The most common causes of such moodiness are drug addiction and a strong hormone change (e.g., puberty, pregnancy, postpartum, PMS, or perimenopause -- i.e., any significant life event starting with the letter "P," LOL).

 

It those two causes can be ruled out, the two remaining most-common causes of emotional instability are BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) and bipolar disorder. In note #72 above, I gave you a link to a description of the primary differences I've seen between the behaviors of a BPDer (my exW) and a bipolar-1 sufferer (my foster son).

 

Everybody wanted her according to her-then she would state she wasn't that hot.

Grandiosity, arrogance, and a fixation on fantasies of power and attractiveness are three of the defining traits for NPD (Narcissistic PD). They are not defining traits for BPD. Significantly, if your exGF has strong and persistent traits of one PD, she likely also exhibits strong traits for at least one other PD and at least one other clinical disorder (e.g., bipolar or anxiety). Of the folks exhibiting full-blown BPD, for example, 40% also exhibit bipolar disorder, 39% also exhibit NPD, and 14% also exhibit ASPD. See Table 3 at 2008 Study in JCP. Edited November 19, 2016 by Downtown

[PLT]

Hey folks. Just checking in really. How is everyone getting along?

 

Myself, I think I've hit a breakthrough after what can only be described as a hellish year.

 

Firstly, she is no longer on my mind all the time. I still think about her quite a lot, and it's still every day, but its a big improvement. Next, I am not nearly as tearful as I have been for the past month or so. I'm able to watch a film and my mind doesn't wander to her to the point where I'm no longer taking much notice of the film. There are triggers obviously but I try to mitigate those where I can. Finally I saw some photos of friends of a friend and two of the ladies in those photos are gorgeous. It's not that I think anything would happen with either of these two, I don't even know them. But simply finding them attractive is something I would not have done even a week or two ago.

 

Onwards and upwards!

[Downtown]

PLT, thanks for checking in to give us an update on your situation. Glad to hear you've finally reached a "breakthrough" where you're starting to feel much more like your old self. Yes, I agree, "onwards and upwards"!

[Frozensushi]

Firstly, she is no longer on my mind all the time. I still think about her quite a lot, and it's still every day, but its a big improvement. Next, I am not nearly as tearful as I have been for the past month or so. I'm able to watch a film and my mind doesn't wander to her to the point where I'm no longer taking much notice of the film. There are triggers obviously but I try to mitigate those where I can.

 

Hey PLT! It's great to hear about your progress. You seem to be on the right track, keep it up.

 

I'm currently 3 1/2 months. It seems to have flown by. Feels like it was only yesterday I saw my Ex for the last time. It's so crystal clear in my mind. It's not been easy, I've had many moments of weakness. The hardest part for me was detaching the feelings of my Ex from the 'mirroring/idealization' phase to the person she really is. It's like my mind won't let me accept it was all an elaborate illusion as my emotions and memories from that time so clearly dictate otherwise.

 

So many of us have gone through this same experience and we've all walked away with similar scars. It's amazing how someone had the ability to push all the right buttons within us to the point we'd be willing to throw out all of our self-respect, boundaries and personal needs by accepting their irrational and toxic behavior just for the off chance they would honor us by pushing those 'good' buttons again.

 

It's good you are not trying to focus on her. It does get better, but these BPD wounds seem to take longer to heal than your standard fair. That's why it's important to remain firm in your healing and not allow her to reopen those wounds.

 

You will have bad days, but they do seem to get further apart with each passing week. You're doing great and we are all rooting for you. Seeing your progress helps me, it's a reminder that I'm not the only one struggling to free myself from the shackles of BPD hell!

[TexasGuy12]

Hey folks. Just checking in really. How is everyone getting along?

 

Myself, I think I've hit a breakthrough after what can only be described as a hellish year.

 

Firstly, she is no longer on my mind all the time. I still think about her quite a lot, and it's still every day, but its a big improvement. Next, I am not nearly as tearful as I have been for the past month or so. I'm able to watch a film and my mind doesn't wander to her to the point where I'm no longer taking much notice of the film. There are triggers obviously but I try to mitigate those where I can. Finally I saw some photos of friends of a friend and two of the ladies in those photos are gorgeous. It's not that I think anything would happen with either of these two, I don't even know them. But simply finding them attractive is something I would not have done even a week or two ago.

 

Onwards and upwards!

 

It's great when you feel like you're making progress! Something that Downtown mentions a lot that I've really felt to be true, is that you have to remember that progress from this is not a perfectly straight line. Rather, it will gradually go up and up and up over the course of time, with mini road blocks mixed in. You'll have some road blocks. It will happen. You're not perfect, none of us are. Just know that when you do, it will be easier to get over them than the last time, and so on and so on.

 

Today I was driving on the highway and I passed the exit that she used to live in. When we first started dating, it was the holiday season and I would always go over her house and hang out. So here we are, in the Christmas season, passing the same exit - I wasn't thinking about her at all and then it all just hit me.

 

3 months ago, I would have probably started crying. Tonight, it totally made me think of her and it made me sad that she's not a part of my life anymore, but I got over it way quicker than I would have in the past.

 

Thanks for checking in man. Stay tough. We're always here. This is a really brutal thing to go through. Addictions are tough, and we're addicted to the idolization and mirroring phase that they put us through in the beginning? And why wouldn't we? We're guys who want to feel wanted and who love great sex. They gave us both of that and more.

[TexasGuy12]

By the way I can't stress how much my self control with regards to not checking out her social media has helped. Sometimes I'll be thinking about her, and I'll get the urge to check it, and I almost do it so quickly before my rational self can stop me. I actually almost just did it after posting my last post. Instead, I came back on here to tell you all about it. LOL.

 

Not knowing anything about her has helped tremendously.