In a Jam

[salparadise]

I appreciate your concern, but I live in an open carry state, so "brandishing" is not really an issue. If I have my firearm holstered at my side then there's nothing nobody can do. on top of that we have stand your ground laws here, so if she tries to physically assault me, especially in my home or with a weapon, then the law is on my side.

 

and that is the key difference: self defense with a firearm is not illegal. but what you did IS illegal. I'm not talking about threatening or assaulting anyone, let alone doing something more. but if this girl is mentally unstable, which she seems to be, and if she continues to escalate this situation, then I must then check that escalation to protect my own life. otherwise I may end up like Travis Alexander.

 

You are WAY off with this new bent. Don't even think about showing that firearm as a way of threatening anyone. You're just escalating it all to a new level. You don't want to shoot anyone, and you don't want to show a gun unless/until you're serious about shooting. If you were to shoot someone, no matter the circumstances, it will change your life... and you will regret it from that day forward. So just get a grip and quit with the dramatics.

 

If you haven't heard from the girl since that day, just let it be. Chances are that she will go away if you ignore her. So she didn't tell her boyfriend that she had banged you... your best bet is to let it stay as it is right now, with the boyfriend believing that nothing happened and she's having a meltdown. A restraining order would just escalate it again.

 

You said that she was threatening self-harm and that she had things in her past. That, plus the the fact that she was chasing your down, has no boundaries, thought it was more than sex, then the screaming meltdown (splitting episode), make me suspect borderline PD. If she is threatening self-harm then she needs in-patient psychiatric care.

 

Again, the best thing you can do is nothing. Avoid her and don't escalate it in any way. Maybe when you go back after break it will all be settled down. If she shows up again, don't be mean... just say that she is your friends' girlfriend and you have no relationship and no desire for one, nicely. It's in your interest to look completely rational, reserved and unexcitable.

Edited January 1, 2017 by salparadise

[Space Ritual]

I appreciate your concern, but I live in an open carry state, so "brandishing" is not really an issue. If I have my firearm holstered at my side then there's nothing nobody can do. on top of that we have stand your ground laws here, so if she tries to physically assault me, especially in my home or with a weapon, then the law is on my side.

 

and that is the key difference: self defense with a firearm is not illegal. but what you did IS illegal. I'm not talking about threatening or assaulting anyone, let alone doing something more. but if this girl is mentally unstable, which she seems to be, and if she continues to escalate this situation, then I must then check that escalation to protect my own life. otherwise I may end up like Travis Alexander.

 

 

 

PF, that is some funny stuff. Funny in that I see you more of a Fredo Corleone type at the Christmas Market fumbling his pea shooter when Virgil "The Turk" Sollozzo's goons plug Marlon Brando.

 

I'll step away from this thread, but in parting I just urge you to be careful. Every dog has his day. I hope you never have to find out first hand that lesson.

 

Take care. And stop that gun nonsense.

[PinkPampies]

My bet is that they will get into an argument with one another and to hurt him, she will announce that she slept with you. Then ***** will hit the fan

 

My advice? Now that you're out of the house, tell him. This is not something you want to carry your whole life. It will be a big fallout first, but then die down.

 

He deserves to know what kind of girlfriend she is. Chances are, after he freaks out, he'll calm down at a later date and appreciate it.

 

Trust and believe, THE TRUTH WILL COME OUT.

 

better that he hears it from you than someone else.

[VeveCakes]

yeah...shes just busy with the holidays. Once she is back at school she will be back harassing you. You need to tell your friend. Regardless of what happens now this friendship is toast, not like you can hang out with him and his gf now.

 

Time to man up and face the consequences before she starts crying rape.

[Power_Forward]

PF, that is some funny stuff. Funny in that I see you more of a Fredo Corleone type at the Christmas Market fumbling his pea shooter when Virgil "The Turk" Sollozzo's goons plug Marlon Brando.

 

that's fine. You assume I'm inexperienced with firearms because I'm younger than you. Remember that to assume makes an a** out of you and me. I've been shooting since I was 14. I know how to manage a weapon big guy.

 

 

I'll step away from this thread, but in parting I just urge you to be careful. Every dog has his day. I hope you never have to find out first hand that lesson.

 

There's really nothing I can say at this point to make you think I'm in the right. I believe that you see yourself in me, and you are projecting your own troubled past onto my situation. My situation is different to the one you found yourself in.

 

Take care. And stop that gun nonsense.

 

"Gun nonsense"? Ok. I believe in the second amendment. If that's "nonsense" to you then perhaps you should move to Canada. And this is what my state legislature has to say about firearms:

 

In Arizona, you are justified in threatening or using deadly physical force against another if a reasonable person would believe that deadly physical force is immediately necessary to protect yourself against the other's use, or attempted use, of unlawful deadly physical force against you.

 

So apparently I am in the right here as far as the law is concerned.

[Power_Forward]

yeah...shes just busy with the holidays. Once she is back at school she will be back harassing you. You need to tell your friend. Regardless of what happens now this friendship is toast, not like you can hang out with him and his gf now.

 

Time to man up and face the consequences before she starts crying rape.

 

I would do that but I already told him that his GF made that story up. At this point both of us are in agreement that she is the one who is unstable.

[Power_Forward]

You are WAY off with this new bent. Don't even think about showing that firearm as a way of threatening anyone. You're just escalating it all to a new level. You don't want to shoot anyone, and you don't want to show a gun unless/until you're serious about shooting. If you were to shoot someone, no matter the circumstances, it will change your life... and you will regret it from that day forward. So just get a grip and quit with the dramatics.

 

If you haven't heard from the girl since that day, just let it be. Chances are that she will go away if you ignore her. So she didn't tell her boyfriend that she had banged you... your best bet is to let it stay as it is right now, with the boyfriend believing that nothing happened and she's having a meltdown. A restraining order would just escalate it again.

 

You said that she was threatening self-harm and that she had things in her past. That, plus the the fact that she was chasing your down, has no boundaries, thought it was more than sex, then the screaming meltdown (splitting episode), make me suspect borderline PD. If she is threatening self-harm then she needs in-patient psychiatric care.

 

Again, the best thing you can do is nothing. Avoid her and don't escalate it in any way. Maybe when you go back after break it will all be settled down. If she shows up again, don't be mean... just say that she is your friends' girlfriend and you have no relationship and no desire for one, nicely. It's in your interest to look completely rational, reserved and unexcitable.

 

I think any rational person would say I've done my part. I moved out. Got my own place. Have not bothered them since. But now she's stalking me and getting combative. Have you ever had someone come to your house with the possible intent of doing you harm?

 

Now think if that person is mentally ill? It's not something you can just forget about. What if one night she's waiting in the bushes and jumps out and stabs me? What if she breaks into my house when I'm sleeping and decides to harm me in some way?

 

At the end of the day I just want to be left alone, but if someone is coming after me, the law says I have a right to defend myself. There's no point in being the nice guy if it winds up getting you killed.

 

You agree?

[anna121]

OP, since you went to the trouble to look up the law, what in your most recent encounter would you argue gives rise to a reasonable apprehension that you were about to be the target of deadly force? Do you think someone cursing you out and having hysterics counts?

 

If so....good luck.

[salparadise]

I think any rational person would say I've done my part. I moved out. Got my own place. Have not bothered them since. But now she's stalking me and getting combative. Have you ever had someone come to your house with the possible intent of doing you harm?

 

Now think if that person is mentally ill? It's not something you can just forget about. What if one night she's waiting in the bushes and jumps out and stabs me? What if she breaks into my house when I'm sleeping and decides to harm me in some way?

 

At the end of the day I just want to be left alone, but if someone is coming after me, the law says I have a right to defend myself. There's no point in being the nice guy if it winds up getting you killed.

 

You agree?

 

 

If I thought you were actually in any danger it would be different, but I don't think the situation justifies the self-defense rhetoric. I just think it's terrible judgment, and quoting right wing scripture ranting about the second amendment just makes you sound like a nutcase yourself.

 

When you first posted about the situation I thought you were being thinking and behaving rationally. I thought then, and still do, that backing away gently and downplaying everything was the best way to handle it. You did that; you removed yourself from the situation. Good. But then...

 

The girl comes over to your new place upset over the rejection, and you're ready to go Waco? That is just nuts. The last few posts talking about self-defense, second amendment, stand-your-ground and all of that crap make you sound like the unstable one. I don't think she poses any physical threat to you at all. Even if she has issues with emotional regulation, that's a different realm than being homicidal and lurking in the bushes with a knife. Women hardly ever turn violent with premeditated lethal intentions. They cry and seek consolation.

 

What is more likely to turn into a self-defense situation is the boyfriend, if she managed to convince him that you banged her twice. But she isn't doing that, she's isn't going to admit what happened. Meanwhile, the boyfriend already recognizes that she's off center and has confided that to you. Even if she were to change her story again, the chances of him believing her are slim to none. The chances of him believing her and then coming after you with lethal force are smaller still.

 

With respect to her motivation... I suspect that she has sense of self issues, similar to low self esteem. She probably uses sex appeal to bolster her low self image. When she banged you, she expected that you'd be pursuing and stroking her ego. That make her a drama queen, but I do not think that makes her a threat. And I don't think the boyfriend is likely to be either. I also think the people telling you to go and confess sound wacky.

 

So, no I don't agree. You lost me when you started talking like a paranoid gun nut.

Edited January 6, 2017 by salparadise

[Power_Forward]

OP, since you went to the trouble to look up the law, what in your most recent encounter would you argue gives rise to a reasonable apprehension that you were about to be the target of deadly force? Do you think someone cursing you out and having hysterics counts?

 

If so....good luck.

 

umm, because she was screaming and going completely psycho? add a sharp object or firearm to that mix and she's becomes capable of deadly force in a heartbeat.

 

there's a concept called "escalation" that law enforcement is well aware of. this psycho chick may decide to escalate at the drop of a hat.

 

better to be prepared than unprepared.

[stillafool]

I don't know too many 20 year old men who would turn down a naked girl smiling at them twice. Just doesn't happen. This psycho chick knew what she was doing and now because you don't want her she is crying harm. I feel sorry for you and your friend. Even though you have told him you didn't boink her you now have to go back and tell him the truth to protect yourself. I think you should first do as someone else here suggested and text her and make her admit that she came on to you. Keep this as proof to show your friend and possibly law enforcement because I wouldn't be surprised if she accused you of rape. I hate women like her who do these things and get mad because it didn't have the effect they wanted.

[VeveCakes]

umm, because she was screaming and going completely psycho? add a sharp object or firearm to that mix and she's becomes capable of deadly force in a heartbeat.

 

there's a concept called "escalation" that law enforcement is well aware of. this psycho chick may decide to escalate at the drop of a hat.

 

better to be prepared than unprepared.

 

my only comment on the guns is - now that you have posted it online, its not going to be seen as self defence even if she beats your ass. It's already been written on the internet that you have this plan....I would def NOT go down that rd.

[Power_Forward]

my only comment on the guns is - now that you have posted it online, its not going to be seen as self defence even if she beats your ass. It's already been written on the internet that you have this plan....I would def NOT go down that rd.

 

What "plan" did I state that I have? Only to protect myself in the likelihood of grievous bodily harm or death, nothing more. Articulating my intent to protect myself from someone who is harassing me in no way implicates me for premeditation or implies that I want to proactively harm that person, which I do not. But if i comes down to that, I would have no choice but to take action.

 

As I stated before and will reiterate again: I just want to be left alone in my own residence. If she does show up at my place again I will get it on tape to prove my case.

 

But I'm not naive: there is a thing called escalation. In her twisted mind she may decide to up the ante, as she seems obsessed with control, and may attempt to violently attack me. If she does I want to be ready and have the tools to protect myself, that's all. And the law is fully on my side with that.

 

It would be like if you stated your intention to carry a concealed weapon in the event that you were raped, and then someone did try to rape you, and you shot them. The fact that you stated your intention to protect yourself would in no way make you guilty of murder. It's irrelevant.

[Power_Forward]

I think you should first do as someone else here suggested and text her and make her admit that she came on to you. Keep this as proof to show your friend and possibly law enforcement because I wouldn't be surprised if she accused you of rape.

 

good idea...

[Power_Forward]

If I thought you were actually in any danger it would be different, but I don't think the situation justifies the self-defense rhetoric. I just think it's terrible judgment, and quoting right wing scripture ranting about the second amendment just makes you sound like a nutcase yourself.

 

I fail to see how protecting yourself is "right wing scripture" uttered by a "nutcase". Self defense is a basic right which the law provides for. There is nothing unusual or abnormal about someone wanting to protect themself.

 

When you first posted about the situation I thought you were being thinking and behaving rationally. I thought then, and still do, that backing away gently and downplaying everything was the best way to handle it. You did that; you removed yourself from the situation. Good. But then...

 

Correct. I did my part. I took the necessary steps to extricate myself from the environment. My current stance is merely a continuation of this logical thought process. What should I do? Move out of my place and go into hiding? Get a new identity? Enter the witness protection program. No, standing my ground IS the next logical choice here and is in logical sequence with the previous chain of events.

 

The girl comes over to your new place upset over the rejection, and you're ready to go Waco? That is just nuts. The last few posts talking about self-defense, second amendment, stand-your-ground and all of that crap make you sound like the unstable one.

 

Really, why? Why is it "nuts" to want to protect yourself from a crazy person?

 

I don't think she poses any physical threat to you at all. Even if she has issues with emotional regulation, that's a different realm than being homicidal and lurking in the bushes with a knife. Women hardly ever turn violent with premeditated lethal intentions. They cry and seek consolation.

 

Sorry, but to quote the Big Lebowski "that's like, your opinion man". In reality you have no knowledge of what she is capable of, and whether or not she is homicidal or not. Women kill men. It happens. The case of Travis Alexander is a perfect example.

 

 

What is more likely to turn into a self-defense situation is the boyfriend, if she managed to convince him that you banged her twice. But she isn't doing that, she's isn't going to admit what happened. Meanwhile, the boyfriend already recognizes that she's off center and has confided that to you. Even if she were to change her story again, the chances of him believing her are slim to none. The chances of him believing her and then coming after you with lethal force are smaller still.

 

He's cool, he's on my side.

 

With respect to her motivation... I suspect that she has sense of self issues, similar to low self esteem. She probably uses sex appeal to bolster her low self image. When she banged you, she expected that you'd be pursuing and stroking her ego. That make her a drama queen, but I do not think that makes her a threat. And I don't think the boyfriend is likely to be either. I also think the people telling you to go and confess sound wacky.

 

My friend said she confessed something to him that was on a whole other level, something he couldn't tell me. I suspect she was abused in some way. I don't know. Whatever it was she needs help.