When hope is all you have left

[CrushingHope]

I've been in a complicated situation for the last 6 months.

I moved to a small town where I met a neighbour who lives downstairs from me. In May he ended a relationship with a woman he's been involved with for 7 years. The relationship is toxic. She has an alcohol dependency and is violent when she drinks. She has a history of treating men badly and then begging them to come back. She has done with this with for many years. He continues to try to leave but something keeps bringing him back.

 

We started dating a few weeks after they broke up in May (I knew that him leaving soon recently was a red flag but I did it anyway...I felt our connection was worth exploring). I believed that he wanted to make a new start for himself. We dated for almost 2 months, and everything was going really well. Then he ended it to go back to her.

 

2 months into that, he ended things with her..."for good". He said he just couldn't do it anymore and was always going back out of guilt. He said that now that he knows what a normal, healthy and loving relationship is supposed to be like, he can't ignore it anymore. All he could do was think about me. So in August, we got back together and for 2 months...again...he was everything. We did amazing things together...weekends away, drives in the truck every couple of nights, walks every night...we fell in love. He said it first. We talked about where life was taking us. He told me every single day how amazing this is and how he's never felt like this. He was starting to look for a new home. He asked me to move in with him. I said he should move first and if we were still going strong in a few months, I would move in. He bought me a (used, nothing crazy expensive) piano for the new place, to make me feel at home. Two weeks before this, his ex had found out that he was dating someone and she started doing all her old tricks to win him back. And it worked. Again. 3 days after the piano, he went back to her. He told me he "couldn't live with himself if he didn't try". He said he was struggling with what he wanted to do (be with me) and what he felt he needed to do to "be able to live with himself". She said she would go to counselling. He said it was too late. She said he owed it to her after 7 years. So he said ok.

 

And now he's gone. 3 weeks has gone by. I know I "shouldn't" have hope. I know I should move on, but I keep hoping that he will finally see that he has to leave her for good. My friend knows her and said this has been her pattern with people and she is really a sick woman. But he must be sick too for going back like 10 times. And I must be sick too for wanting HIM back.

 

I get that. I just wish I felt differently.

 

I am going to counselling to try to get help, but I continue to want him.

 

We haven't been talking too much. A little here and there. He won't answer any of my questions regarding why any of this continues to happen. He has a 17 year old son whom he leaves home alone every night to be with her. The son told me that his dad has "never been as happy as when he's with you. He told me he was going to marry you"...

 

He texted me on Friday. And it was flirtatious. He called me by my "pet name" and then by my secondary pet name that he only reserves for the "sexy" me. I don't know what it means. I responded and engaged in the conversation, knowing that I "shouldn't". But why do I do it??

 

I know I shouldn't live on hope but I know I am. I'm just being honest, even though it makes me look stupid and so foolish.

 

I don't know what advice I'm looking for because I already know what the "right" thing to do is and the best choice for me.

 

But what do you do when you physically can't/won't make that choice but are so miserable without him that you can't force yourself to give up that hope?

 

I beat myself up about this because I don't want to feel like this but I keep myself involved and hopeful because I feel like he's the only person who has meant this much to me in 10 years and I worry that he's my last chance at love.

Edited November 7, 2016 by CrushingHope

[topher]

Don't be too hard on yourself. You know it's wrong but feel you can't help yourself. Same probably applies to him. We contain multitudes. I think it's good you're seeking stability. But it doesn't sound like he's capable of providing that. If he's gone for good, you should respect his wishes. Focus on yourself. There was a you before him. If he engages you, protect yourself by maintaining some boundaries.

 

Cut through the bull****. Pay attention to his actions, not his words. You're a respite from the push and pull he usually experiences. Don't be so sure he's not toxic in his own ways. Ask yourself what you think you deserve in a relationship and don't settle for less.

Edited November 7, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
language~T

[CrushingHope]

thank you Topher. I appreciate your kindness. I feel like a lot of people just to cut ties...if I felt capable of doing that all the time I would. Logically I know that's the right thing and the best to promote healing.

 

I guess I don't believe it's actually over. I believe they will break again. And maybe for good one day. How can they possibly work?

 

I do think he's gotta be sick or toxic on some level in order to be able to go back to this horrible (and very physically unattractive, no offence) person. But I didn't see any of that in him when it came to us. I don't doubt that his feelings for me were real. I wasn't the only one who saw it.

 

But he was still pulled back by her...I guess for now that's the reality of the situation.

[Satu]

Here's a clipping from my journal:

 

 

"Never begin a new relationship until you've fully moved on from the one before.

 

Also never begin a new relationship with someone who hasn't fully moved on from their one before.

 

By 'moved on,' I mean any necessary grieving done, not preoccupied with the ex, enjoying life, feeling good about yourself, and optimistic about the future.

 

The best way to move on is to decide to be single for a while; not dating, not hooking up, no fwb. Some short term counselling if you feel you need it.

 

'Get back on the horse' is sound advice, but its best to let the cuts and bruises heal before you do."

 

 

He never moved on from her; never healed the cuts and bruises.

 

Thats why it didn't/couldn't work out with you and him.

 

 

Take care.

[CrushingHope]

Thank you, Satu. Insightful post for sure...sadly I already knew this stuff and did it anyway...and again a second time.

 

I realize it's my own fault. I should never have gotten involved. But I did and now here I am.

[Satu]

Have you ever done any journalling - just writing about your thoughts and feelings?

[Offspring]

I think the best thing to do is prepare yourself to move on, internally. I know it is hard (almost impossible) to stop "wanting" somebody, even though they are toxic, or doing something wrong, and you don't have to stop desiring them. What you need to do though is continue your physical life without him. If he knows where he stands with you, and you have conveyed that to him, then that is all you need to do. By engaging with his "crumbs" (flirtatious behaviour, even though he has assumingly not left the ex GF yet), you are settling for less.

 

You don't have to change how you feel. That may come with time, however, I would get on with my life, and if he seriously wants to engage with you, then he should do it in a respectful and transparent manner.

 

The other side of the coin is that maybe he needs time. Time to see that a stable and healthy relationship is fun and pleasant.

 

I feel for you, a couple of months is enough time to get attached and desire somebody. Hell, a couple of weeks is almost enough!

 

Actions speak louder than words. Step back and see what is really going on.

[Offspring]

double post.

 

Was just going to add this bit:

 

I was in a similiar situation. Held myself off relationships for 7 years, only to meet somebody who I thought I had amazing chemistry with, only to flip out and end the whole thing. It hurt, but i wish her well and am going to be ultra cautious before i engage anybody else

Edited November 8, 2016 by Offspring

[Satu]

This is a bit blunt, but if you accept it, you will heal faster and have less pain to go through:

 

 

He is where he wants to be, with the person he wants to be with.

 

 

The final healing comes from acceptance.

 

 

Take care.

[CrushingHope]

Thank you Offspring and Satu.

 

I agree, Offspring, that I believe what he needs is time. He has told me that there is "more going on here than you even know" but has never shared more with me even though I've asked him on several occasions. If you heard the whole history of this woman, you would understand how that could be possible.

 

Yes, although it's only been 6 months that I've known him, I definitely fell hard for him in that time. I know my life can go on without him but it's been very difficult, especially with him living downstairs. The sad part of all of this is that when he is with this woman, he doesn't make good choices for himself or his son and the son is at home alone almost every night. My ex will come home for like 10 minutes after work and then go to the gf's house. The son lived with them for 5 years but after his dad moved out and swore he would never go back again, the son doesn't go over there much. He can't stand the gf. And now my ex's ex-wife is trying to get him to move out of the house so she can move back in and take care of the son. But my ex keeps putting in an appeal so that he can bide his time. He said to his son that he doesn't want to move with the gf in case "something happens again".

 

I see what you're saying, Satu, and agree somewhat...but I don't think things are that simple all the time. I think yes he is where he "wants" to be right now. But he has been back and forth...if he went back to her the first time and stayed that one be one thing, but the constant back and forth...I don't know how it's possible to tell at all where he wants to be. Regardless, I do understand that he has chosen her right now and I have to accept that. And I guess I'm finding that hard.

 

I do keep a journal. I'm an obsessive writer. It's the only way to clear my head. That's why I came here too...I need the conversation aspect too.

[de elle]

Dear Crushing Hope,

More than you know right now, you are offering strength to those of us who are hurting in a manner similar to you. You speak our words, your convey our fears, you emote our sadness.

I am grateful that you, Offspring and Satu are incredibly generous with your time and energy.

de elle

[CrushingHope]

Dear Crushing Hope,

More than you know right now, you are offering strength to those of us who are hurting in a manner similar to you. You speak our words, your convey our fears, you emote our sadness.

I am grateful that you, Offspring and Satu are incredibly generous with your time and energy.

de elle

 

Hi de elle,

 

I'm glad to know that I'm helping someone on some level. I can't seem to help myself yet in all of this.

 

I sit here waiting to hear from him. I check my phone every few minutes. I keep thinking that because I heard from him on Friday, and things were flirtatious and light, that I would hear from him again soon.

 

I made the mistake of texting him yesterday morning. I wrote "I know I shouldn't, but sometimes I just want to tell you to have a good day". (because every morning after he left, he would text me to have a good day and that he loved me). He wrote back "Thank you. I hope you have a good day too :)"

 

It wasn't "enough" and I felt disappointed.

 

I just wish I knew what was going to happen with them. I just wish I could force him to see that they aren't nearly as good as what we were. I know they have 7 years under their belt, but it's been at least a few years of torture. He told me last month that no matter whatever happened between us (but had hoped we would be together forever), he could never ever go back to that life he had with her. He said "it was a terrible way to live".

 

He's not ready to leave. I guess that's all there is to it.

[CrushingHope]

Just writing because I'm really feeling down today.

 

I don't know how to get through this without answers. I don't know how he can just pick up and leave me and barely look back. I know I have received a few breadcrumbs from him but it just makes me wonder if our whole thing was a lie. How could it have been? Why would he buy all of that stuff to move out of his place if he had planned to go back to her? I really felt like we were in a really amazing place together. I know he has told me "there is so much more to this than you even know"....but what could that even be?

 

I wish I could turn off my feelings like he seems to be able to.

 

He said in a text last week that it takes "everything in his power" not to reach out to me every single day.

 

Then why....

[Scarlett.O'hara]

It might be quite eye opening if you take a look at the other woman/man forum. You may notice some striking similarities between your ex and the way married men treat the "other woman".

 

I'm not suggesting the situation is exactly the same, but his behavior does seem typical of those types of men. Lots of future faking, love bombing, switching between women, offering breadcrumbs, it all sounds eerily similar.

 

I encourage you to at least take a look at what other people are experiencing. Perhaps it will help you gain some perspective on your current situation, perhaps not.

 

Regardless, you can't be stuck in this painful limbo forever. It isn't fair to you.

 

All the best.

[CrushingHope]

Thank you Scarlett,

 

I actually have been on that forum. I did see similarities as well.

 

I guess I have to accept that he was never really available to me. I do think he wanted to be. And I think that's why he started making all the attempts to move out to his new place and eventually have me there with him. But when she found out about us and started contacting him, it was clear that he wasn't ready to move on from her, even though i feel like he wishes he could.

 

I really don't think he would tell his son he was "going to marry her" (me), if he wasn't convinced that he was really moving on from her.

 

He's not a cheating kind of guy or a guy to have an affair, from what I know, so maybe this is his version of that. I know he's dated other women when he's been apart from her, but from what I know, it was never with anyone serious and no one that he had claimed to "love". Not that I know how to take his words of love now. But they sure seemed real at the time. I just don't know why he would even bother to say all of that stuff. I wasn't going anywhere - there was no need to sweet talk me into staying or something. But perhaps he was trying to convince himself that he was more in love than he claimed to be so that he wouldn't go back to her.

 

But I don't know. I really don't. I have to accept, I suppose, that I won't have the answers. It's really been one of the hardest things for me with this.

[CrushingHope]

I feel like I'm holding on because "moving forward" means saying goodbye for good and I'm not ready to do that because I still feel like there's hope. He is back with an on/off toxic relationship with a horrible woman whom he continues to say "ruins his life", whom he's been with for 7 years.

 

I've been in touch with his ex-wife (not the gf he is with now), as she and I know each other. She says she knows him and he is not happy with this woman and hasn't been for a long time. He has "tried to leave" on so many occasions...even did for 8 months last year. Every time he leaves her, he ends up going back. Everyone thinks it's out of guilt because she's been through a lot in her life, is an alcoholic, and manipulates him into going back. She also hits him when she's drunk.

 

He left me twice to go back to her. This time around he declared his love for me and says I'm too good to be true and the most perfect woman for him. About 5 days before he went back to her, he had sent a text to her that said "you can't ruin my life anymore!!!" She had found out about him dating someone new and started contacting him again. And then he went back. He told me that "there's so much to this than you know" and that he has to go back in order to "be able to live with himself". he won't expand on what that means. He gives me no answers to anything. I told him to tell me outright to move on...but he won't.

 

None of it makes any sense to me. What we had was so amazing. I realize that he had never fully left her and wasn't available to me, but I really believed that he was moving on from her.

 

I'm just venting I guess. I know it's not a good situation for me to be a part of and I know he needs to figure this out on his own. He lives downstairs from me (has been evicted by the ex-wife whose parents own the house...because when he dates this woman, he is never at home with his teenaged son, so the ex-wife is moving back in). Anyway...it's complicated.

 

I just haven't felt love in a really long time and this relationship was amazing on so many levels. The only problem was this ex-relationship. I know it's just bad timing. I am trying to leave him alone to figure things out. The ex-wife had to see him last week and told me he looks like crap - said he looks tired and run down and withdrawn. His own son says he's not happy with the gf and was so happy when he was with me.

 

I just find it all so confusing and hard to walk away from. I want to reach out to him so badly but am trying so hard not to. He texted me last week...was definitely flirting with me...but hasn't texted again. Last time he ended things with me, we remained in touch and ended up back together.

 

I believe he is very confused about what he really wants.

Edited November 16, 2016 by CrushingHope

[PrincessWarrior1]

You can still start to take care of yourself and "move on" with the possibility of being pleasantly surprised in the future. You'll be in a better place emotionally if you just start to focus on yourself and making yourself happy.

 

What NC has done for me was help me to set boundaries and enforce them. Also if I don't "wait around" or initiate contact it's better for self esteem and the way we are viewed. Also when you don't initiate contact, you don't have to deal with being ignored or rejected. Men tend to value women who are happy living their lives. It's more attractive

 

You will feel better not worrying about him or his issues and just doing whatever make you happy. I like rewarding myself with gifts for lengths of NC and definitely not initiating. It gives you something to look forward to and makes you feel better. Whatever will happen will happen in the future. If you force it then you will always wonder if he would have picked you on his own or why invite all the chaos and drama rather than have a secure happy relationships that you don't have to wonder or share your man or worry if and when he is going back to so and so , or if you're being used to get over so and so. I'd say the heck with all that mess, you're better than that!

Edited November 16, 2016 by PrincessWarrior1

[CrushingHope]

Yeah. In theory, I know it's a better choice for me to go NC as much as possible right now (since he lives downstairs I do have to hear him come and go but I don't actually bump into him much). My friend said the same thing...to move on, and if he comes back after he has fully dealt with that situation, then I'll be in a better place to either go back with him and give it another go, or decide I don't want to be involved anymore. I know you're right, but I am just really struggling with it. I'm in a small town that I moved to last year for school (second career, full life flip) and I'm lonely and he was someone who filled so many voids in my life.

 

When we were apart the first time, he was still in contact pretty regularly. It was clear he missed me. But this time he has barely contacted me. He texted last week and was actually flirtatious with me. I engaged, which I know I shouldn't have, but I wanted it to be what it was last time and lead us back together. But we haven't really talked since.

 

I truly believe he is torn. I believe he was happier with me but has a history with her that I can't even come close to competing with (7 years with her, 6 months, with a 2 month break) with me. I know it's not a long time to be with someone, but we spent every night together, every weekend and did really amazing things together and we both got attached so quickly. And then he told me he was falling in love with me and then "I love you". We talked often about how we couldn't believe this was happening and how crazy life was to bring us together etc etc etc. It was very romantic and everything I feel I've been waiting for. I'm 41, he's 45. It just seemed so right.

 

Until he went back to her.

 

And his son says they barely talk to each other. He said "when you guys were together, you laughed and held hands and just seemed happy". He said they're not like that at all. I guess things change after 7 years, but it's hard to imagine why he would keep going back to that horrible relationship.

 

My therapist has been talking to me a lot about the cycle of domestic abuse and for sure it seems to apply to them perfectly. I just wish I could have been enough to pull him away from her for good.

Edited November 16, 2016 by CrushingHope

[PrincessWarrior1]

Maybe he goes back out of guilt or if they have a child together sometimes people do it for the child. And she has not met anyone yet herself too. Some people really try to not let their children come from broken homes. Sometimes rebound relationships also make you miss your former partner too.

 

Don't beat yourself up about the responding to his contact. I have not mastered that myself and probably never will. I can just not initiate but I always respond. The only thing is if when I get off the phone if I feel toxic thoughts and I'm in turmoil. I usually send him a text breaking plans or letting him know his you know what is not going to fly and is not ok.

[PrincessWarrior1]

It's almost like sitting around waiting for a married man, when all you end up being is enough comfort for him to feel better and go back and try again. He gets to have his cake and eat it too and you get all the pain.

 

Please don't allow this for yourself, you're better than that and you deserve more. He needs a kick in the...

[PrincessWarrior1]

Mine is selfish and abusive. He also has very loose morals, no respect, and has an extensive criminal past. It's still a lot of chaos and pain and leaves you so hurt and depressed after all you have done for this person and put up with. I just stopped after the last time I spend a whole weeks check and found out he hangs out w swingers etc. The pain was so bad I couldn't focus at work I had no energy and I'm still trying to recover. My brilliant mind is all messed up, no energy, sad etc.

 

So the next time he asked me for money.. nope! GTFO And I have not physically been with him since only texts and him trying. Also I went and bought condoms and told him if you want to be out there like that, I can't stop you but I am protecting myself from now on. So whatever he does doesn't have to affect me so much. And he knows I was faithful and never let him worry the whole time he was in jail.

 

I wish I could just forget about him too but he always contacts me and it's so hard to meet people these days. And just like you I'm always alone and I get lonely.

[stillafool]

I feel like I'm holding on because "moving forward" means saying goodbye for good and I'm not ready to do that because I still feel like there's hope. He is back with an on/off toxic relationship with a horrible woman whom he continues to say "ruins his life", whom he's been with for 7 years.

 

I've been in touch with his ex-wife (not the gf he is with now), as she and I know each other. She says she knows him and he is not happy with this woman and hasn't been for a long time. He has "tried to leave" on so many occasions...even did for 8 months last year. Every time he leaves her, he ends up going back. Everyone thinks it's out of guilt because she's been through a lot in her life, is an alcoholic, and manipulates him into going back. She also hits him when she's drunk.

 

He left me twice to go back to her. This time around he declared his love for me and says I'm too good to be true and the most perfect woman for him. About 5 days before he went back to her, he had sent a text to her that said "you can't ruin my life anymore!!!" She had found out about him dating someone new and started contacting him again. And then he went back. He told me that "there's so much to this than you know" and that he has to go back in order to "be able to live with himself". he won't expand on what that means. He gives me no answers to anything. I told him to tell me outright to move on...but he won't.

 

None of it makes any sense to me. What we had was so amazing. I realize that he had never fully left her and wasn't available to me, but I really believed that he was moving on from her.

 

 

I believe he is very confused about what he really wants.

 

I have to tell you that as bad as you say this woman is and how bad she treats him those are the type of women that men just can't get out of their system. It's equivalent to the bad boys that women cling to when they know they are abusive and emotionally unavailable. It has been my experience that men seem to have a harder time getting over a bad girl than women do getting over a bad boy. Do yourself a favor and move on because he will never stop wanting her. Crazy women = incredible sex and that's what the men can't get out of their minds.

[CrushingHope]

Yeah, well you could be right as he has said that their sex life is the only thing they ever got right. But I have to say that our sex life was pretty amazing too.

And not to sound too horrible, but she is honestly one of the most unattractive women I've ever seen. She is so used up looking - people say she looks like a crack addict. It's pretty mean to say, but she is really unattractive. But I guess he doesn't see her that way.

 

I don't know. I would really like to think he will move on from her one day. She's not a good person, and has been so mean to his kids (they do not have kids together) over the years. His kids are late teens now, but the damage is done. They won't go over there anymore.

[PrincessWarrior1]

Things will get better. You don't have to try to navigate through everything all at once. You can take little babysteps and they'll add up! Just start taking your power back little by little and building yourself back up. You'll know what to do and how to handle it. Just please start loving yourself more and putting the focus on what makes you happy. Situations like this and many other tends to fall in place when we are just busy loving ourselves and being content and happy alone.

[stillafool]

Yeah, well you could be right as he has said that their sex life is the only thing they ever got right. But I have to say that our sex life was pretty amazing too.

And not to sound too horrible, but she is honestly one of the most unattractive women I've ever seen. She is so used up looking - people say she looks like a crack addict. It's pretty mean to say, but she is really unattractive. But I guess he doesn't see her that way.

 

I don't know. I would really like to think he will move on from her one day. She's not a good person, and has been so mean to his kids (they do not have kids together) over the years. His kids are late teens now, but the damage is done. They won't go over there anymore.

 

There's a saying: It's not the beauty, but the booty!