When the search is worthwhile

[ZA Dater]

I have had a few weeks to some reflecting and yesterday I simply managed to connect everything together, yes it wasn't ideal, in fact its fundamentally flawed but instead of looking at the flaws I simply enjoyed everything that was good.

 

 

It can be so demoralising to keep looking, keep hoping, getting rejected but for a few hours last evening I felt how good it could be and its like a wave of calmness washed over me. I felt good.

 

 

In the last few weeks I have me two people, neither really did anything for me, I wasn't inclined to see either of them again and last night I was reminded why, it was once again attraction by personality, to me the most pure form of attraction there is.

 

 

I gave it everything, I dropped my serious side, I dropped my shy side, I smiled (yes Gemma I did) and I even laughed. Why, simply because this person bring that side out of me, there is something magnetic about her, when she looks at me I often feel like she is looking into my mind.

 

 

My point here is we all search for out own piece of utopia, that person who makes us feel unbelievable and yes we doubt it can happen, it definitely can, even if the fundamentals aren't conducive to anything else.

 

 

At the end of the evening her bf came to fetch her and I wont lie I felt a bit uncomfortable (this was a dinner party by the way, there were 35 of us at the event), I managed to slink away from the table and mingle, it was probably clear I was trying to avoid meeting him.

 

 

As she was about to leave.

 

 

"Have you met abc my boyfriend?"

Me: no

Her: would you like to?

 

 

An odd question but it told me many things. Needless to say I wondered out to her bf with total confidence, shook his hand, looked him straight in the eye.

 

 

As I left I felt a bit sad, she went home with him and not with me but I also felt truly thankful because to be around her, she brings me something nobody else ever has been able to, I truly feel happy, I really see just a bit of how incredibly good things can be.

 

 

People say the friend zone isn't a good place, I don't know what we have but for me its immeasurably better than trawling dating sites. I am learning so much and for that I am truly thankful and most of all I am learning its ok to be me, me isn't truly awful and just the interaction is so great.

 

 

I would encourage people who battle like I do to focus less on the concept of relationships but rather the concept of self improvement.

[ZA Dater]

Do any of you feel like relationships and the opportunities for them are passing you by?

 

I know we all say lets improve, lets better ourselves to create chances but how do you measure that improvement or how do you really know if you have improved at all.

 

Do some of you feel that maybe you need to date down or even resort to unconventional methods of dating?

 

Do you think relationship experience is an advantage when looking and if so in what way is it advantageous.

 

Is there an age by which your chances fall off dramatically where its no longer acceptable to have had no relationship experience?

 

I'd be interested in the forum thoughts.

[JuneJulySeptember]

 

Is there an age by which your chances fall off dramatically where its no longer acceptable to have had no relationship experience?

 

I'd be interested in the forum thoughts.

 

If there is an age, it's probably extremely early, like age 23 or so. At that point, the majority of males will have had sex and relationship experience. So, if a woman views life as any kind of a competition (which in reality, the majority of people do), then anybody who doesn't have experience at that point will be excluded.

 

For the remainder of women, they would probably accept a guy who is much, much older and has virtually no experience without a real cap, depending on circumstances.

[Mysterio]

For me. I think that I should be dating up. That means that I can't go into the relationship with pure lust needs.

 

Its so up in the air for me. It feels like I should do more prayer and meditation over finding a right fit. Than just going out there just putting myself through the ringer.

 

Think tanking myself. I should just be more chill. Just go about my daily agendas and let the universe bring the right woman to me. I don't think its passed me by. Yet I rarely find a woman around my age range that is very compatable to me and vice versa.

 

It feels like most women around me are cold. Weather they are into me or not. The vibe I get is don't try to turn me into a romantic thing at all. I would think 10 times before asking a woman on a date now a days. I also don't feel like I am missing out all the time.

 

Bottom line. At age 45. I don't think I have been passed by, but the having kids part is closing in fast. I don't want to be a really older parent. I would say by 60 would be the time I would have a vesectomy.

[Newcitygirl]

I don't down grade for anyone. I have been single long enough I have my standards. I've had plenty of opportunities to date guys. But something has been off on them for me to fully commit. I'm not settling for average or average passion.

[ZA Dater]

I think this a valid question. Lots of threads on this forum revolve around people who have no success, myself included but how many of these people are able to connect with ladies on a social level?

 

 

In between eating turkey I started to wonder if me being alone isn't due to that fact above all else and perhaps the fact I don't look so great to actually as another poster said "if you were attractive you would be attracting people".

 

 

How do you connect with people, I never seem to be able to and the only times I am able to actually get a conversation going are when its about hobbies or work and even then most ladies aren't interested in either of those things.

 

 

Being unable to connect with ladies perhaps is why so many people struggle. I look at guys who are successful and they all seem to connect well, make girls laugh, make girls smile, engage in small talk and it just seems to work with flirting. Others of us cant really do any of that and perhaps that's why we aren't and wont ever be successful. That sort of charm is something I just cant seem to do.

[Satu]

Learn how to be a really good listener.

 

Good talkers are ten a penny, but really good listeners are rare.

 

 

Take care.

[ZA Dater]

Learn how to be a really good listener.

 

Good talkers are ten a penny, but really good listeners are rare.

 

 

Take care.

 

Point taken but its never really worked for me, it seems women want assertive confident guys, those are the ones who have success.

[LightWave93]

I've tried literally every suggestion thrown at me in the last year, and nothing has worked. It's easy for many to suggest being a good listener, getting out more, smiling etc, but unfortunately even then it's all very hit and miss.

 

Some people have it, some people have the potential, some people don't. Maybe you and I fall into the latter camp. I know I'm undesirable.

[LookAtThisPOst]

I think this a valid question. Lots of threads on this forum revolve around people who have no success, myself included but how many of these people are able to connect with ladies on a social level?

 

 

In between eating turkey I started to wonder if me being alone isn't due to that fact above all else and perhaps the fact I don't look so great to actually as another poster said "if you were attractive you would be attracting people".

 

 

How do you connect with people, I never seem to be able to and the only times I am able to actually get a conversation going are when its about hobbies or work and even then most ladies aren't interested in either of those things.

 

 

Being unable to connect with ladies perhaps is why so many people struggle. I look at guys who are successful and they all seem to connect well, make girls laugh, make girls smile, engage in small talk and it just seems to work with flirting. Others of us cant really do any of that and perhaps that's why we aren't and wont ever be successful. That sort of charm is something I just cant seem to do.

 

There is no such thing as "generating" a connection. Either they are attracted or they are not. Either the connection is there, or it is not.

 

I do not ascribe to the addage of onus being on ONE person to generating the attraction for BOTH

[ZA Dater]

There is no such thing as "generating" a connection. Either they are attracted or they are not. Either the connection is there, or it is not.

 

I do not ascribe to the addage of onus being on ONE person to generating the attraction for BOTH

 

Well ok, yes I agree the connection comes from attraction but some also subscribe to what I call the theory that Oh you may be attracted over time but the reality is this doesn't work. I have yet to see anyone ever give someone say a few dates to prove themselves so to speak.

 

 

My connection I am talking about here is a social one for the most part.

[carhill]

There is no such thing as "generating" a connection. Either they are attracted or they are not. Either the connection is there, or it is not.

 

^^^Yeah, pretty much.

 

IMO, look when you feel like looking. Connections come in many forms, romance being but one. Enjoy what comes your way. Yeah, that's a choice, as is looking. I get that, as guys, we need to generally be the 'out there' ones but most adult men are used to that and it's like getting up in the morning and heading off to work when we'd perhaps rather be fishing. It's part of what males do.

 

Enjoy the turkey.

[ZA Dater]

I've tried literally every suggestion thrown at me in the last year, and nothing has worked. It's easy for many to suggest being a good listener, getting out more, smiling etc, but unfortunately even then it's all very hit and miss.

 

Some people have it, some people have the potential, some people don't. Maybe you and I fall into the latter camp. I know I'm undesirable.

 

I am inclined to agree to a certain extent. Personally I do think there is a bit more to it then some being able to and others not.

 

 

Hit and miss is one thing where possibly we all have something in common, analytically I am not going to bother with that tall slim brunette in the bookstore because I know she is taken and even if she wasn't I would not be of interest to her anyway, that's just the way I think and every dating experience has pretty much laid the foundation of what I think I can and cant get.

 

 

For me if I could do one dating related thing in life it would be to get everyone to experience just once, having a short term relationship with someone they really want.

[ZA Dater]

^^^Yeah, pretty much.

 

IMO, look when you feel like looking. Connections come in many forms, romance being but one. Enjoy what comes your way. Yeah, that's a choice, as is looking. I get that, as guys, we need to generally be the 'out there' ones but most adult men are used to that and it's like getting up in the morning and heading off to work when we'd perhaps rather be fishing. It's part of what males do.

 

Enjoy the turkey.

 

You and I obviously are not the same because I don't really feel the need to be out there anymore. I haven't been out for probably 6 months to any social place, bar, club etc. My forays out are with a purpose in mind. When I was out here all I felt like most of the time was an outcast and a misfit. I don't really miss either of those two feelings.

[preraph]

ZADater, I think what you said in your first post is absolutely right. It IS easier to connect over mutual hobbies or work (because you both are involved in it) or anything you both do in life. It's much easier to connect that way and to have something to talk about.

 

Yes, it's true, some people have a gift for gab and can just walk up to people and talk about general stuff and be entertaining. Certainly those people are usually more popular. It's a gift if you are genuinely interested in people -- not just the attractive ones but all people on all levels and not just because you're physically attracted, because people respond best to someone asking them about themselves and it's nice when it's genuine.

 

Of course, we all have different levels of ability at different points in our lives when it comes to how comfortably social we are. I advise anyone on the low end of the spectrum to seek therapeutic help in case there is anything that can be worked on there, like understanding how you ended up with low self-esteem or whatever the issue is. But I think it's equally important to simply push your own envelope and take baby steps out of your comfort zone to build up your own confidence. Trouble is, we all get shot down socially by one social sector or another. The classically popular and traditional are shunned by the unconventional sector as being too bland. The unconventional outliers are shunned by the conformists, etc. We all have to learn to deal with it or just not place value on it and stay focused on our path and keep reaching out.

 

Once you find your niche or a small group of loyal friends, your trust will build and your confidence will too, plus it's the core of any social network, those few close friends, and you meet people through them as well as through hobbies and work.

 

The one thing you can't do and expect to get anywhere is isolate and just stay home because that's the most comfortable thing for you. You have to get out of the house and follow interests. The more you do, the more you have in common with other people. The more interests, the more you have to talk about that isn't boring. It's like building a snowball, so get busy!

[thecrucible]

I think flirting has to come naturally. If you're thinking about it too much, then it isn't working. Personally I'm an introvert and I don't have gift of the gab particularly, so I flirt differently.

 

I'm gradually coming to terms with the fact that I won't be the kind of person to become instant friends with people and get instant attention. But I am a good listener and I like to take an interest in people's lives (I'm not saying more charming people don't though) and I think while I can't be really entertaining, at least I can be caring a good listener. I know my strengths and weaknesses.

 

Btw OP, not all women are going to want to date the loudest guy in the room type. I mean I like guys like that but if they go too far, they become very annoying. I dated a very extroverted guy and he was very charming and most people would like him but other attributes put me off - his lack of patience and his wanting to get his own way all the time. I think every positive trait in all of us has a flipside and it depends on how you look at it.

 

OP, you just need to find the right woman for you. Not all of us will settle simply on superficial charm. I mean personally I want a lot more than that from a guy.

[ZA Dater]

<snip>

 

The one thing you can't do and expect to get anywhere is isolate and just stay home because that's the most comfortable thing for you. You have to get out of the house and follow interests. The more you do, the more you have in common with other people. The more interests, the more you have to talk about that isn't boring. It's like building a snowball, so get busy!

 

 

All fantastic in theory in the reality isn't really so sugar and like.

 

 

I go out to say a bar and I don't fit in there, I go to a club and don't fit in there either. Ok I go to the mall walk around and buy the odd thing, that at least has some sort of purpose to it.

Edited December 28, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Fix quote

[preraph]

 

 

All fantastic in theory in the reality isn't really so sugar and like.

 

 

I go out to say a bar and I don't fit in there, I go to a club and don't fit in there either. Ok I go to the mall walk around and buy the odd thing, that at least has some sort of purpose to it.

 

If you keep going to the club, you might become familiar to someone eventually that you can then stand around with, male or female. While you're there, talk to anyone who isn't actively trying to shun you, male or female, just a small comment about the place or music and then don't push it, and maybe next time you see them there, they'll say hi or feel comfortable standing with you.

 

Better is active hobbies or studies or physical activities, even if it's only bowling or playing pool, just to give you a focus and a common little thing to have with anyone else who plays.

 

Even at my most social (most of my leisure spent at gigs in bars) I certainly had nights when I felt very conspicuous or sometimes just invisible. But I had other nights when acquaintances would show up that I felt like a part of things.

Edited December 28, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Fix quote

[Mrlonelyone]

It is a numbers game. A way that helps me to think about it is to consider the odds any given person would be someone I'd like and who would like me.

 

List just five things you would like in a woman (or man if you like) then find out what % of the people have each of those qualities.

 

Say 50% are the gender you want. Then you want someoen who is college educated (33%) , not obese or underweight (66%), of reprodictive age (33%), Not married (50%) has a job 95%.

 

.33*.66*.33*.50*.95 that gives 0.0017 or 3.4% of women are all of those things. Drop requiring healthy weight and college education and that number goes up to 15.6%

 

In short if you have standards that have nothing to do with being "hot" just healthy, educated, employed, not married, and of child rearing age ... you have a 3.4% chance of meeting someone.

 

So, your challenge is to go out and go on 100 to 200 dates this year mathematically you will meet 3 to six compatible women.

[JuneJulySeptember]

I think this a valid question. Lots of threads on this forum revolve around people who have no success, myself included but how many of these people are able to connect with ladies on a social level?

 

 

In between eating turkey I started to wonder if me being alone isn't due to that fact above all else and perhaps the fact I don't look so great to actually as another poster said "if you were attractive you would be attracting people".

 

 

How do you connect with people, I never seem to be able to and the only times I am able to actually get a conversation going are when its about hobbies or work and even then most ladies aren't interested in either of those things.

 

 

Being unable to connect with ladies perhaps is why so many people struggle. I look at guys who are successful and they all seem to connect well, make girls laugh, make girls smile, engage in small talk and it just seems to work with flirting. Others of us cant really do any of that and perhaps that's why we aren't and wont ever be successful. That sort of charm is something I just cant seem to do.

 

Read this blog, and then tell me how that changes (if at all) your perspective on needing to amazingly connect with a woman on a communication level in order to date her...

 

Top 10 Surprises about Marrying Someone Who Speaks a Different Language | Texan in Tokyo

[shoplocal]

Read this blog, and then tell me how that changes (if at all) your perspective on needing to amazingly connect with a woman on a communication level in order to date her...

 

Top 10 Surprises about Marrying Someone Who Speaks a Different Language | Texan in Tokyo

 

Yikes! Maybe because I'm such a chatterbox, but this arrangement/marriage sounds terrible. What did she fall in love with in three days? Not doubting it happened, just wished she'd been able to elaborate a bit before launching into her list of pros and cons.

[JuneJulySeptember]

Yikes! Maybe because I'm such a chatterbox, but this arrangement/marriage sounds terrible. What did she fall in love with in three days? Not doubting it happened, just wished she'd been able to elaborate a bit before launching into her list of pros and cons.

 

The point of posting it was to show OP that guys don't always need to be the super social/charisma/witty/intellectual to get a woman.

 

Of course, in this situation, there's no doubt in my mind that the guy was probably super handsome, but I digress.

 

A connection was made in another way.

[GunslingerRoland]

I think I've said this before in one of your other threads, but I agree that rather than hyper focusing on relationships you need to just go live life and when I say that I mean make connections with other people. I consider myself an extremely socially awkward introvert, but I can still meet people and make strong connections with them. Focus on that first.

 

Because whether you end up having to live the life of romantic loneliness that you think you need to resign yourself into or not, you still need to have meaningful relationships in your life.

[ZA Dater]

I think I've said this before in one of your other threads, but I agree that rather than hyper focusing on relationships you need to just go live life and when I say that I mean make connections with other people. I consider myself an extremely socially awkward introvert, but I can still meet people and make strong connections with them. Focus on that first.

 

Because whether you end up having to live the life of romantic loneliness that you think you need to resign yourself into or not, you still need to have meaningful relationships in your life.

 

A good point but extremely hard for me to do when I simply don't seem to fit in at all or find anyone with common interests. I find people pretty unforgiving and harsh, if they don't like you well then that is that. If you don't fit into a mould them well that is that too.

 

 

In short I live a juxtaposition of a life in many respects and this doesn't really help much either.

[Mysterio]

I don't think that Dating is a numbers game. I think its someone picks up on romantic vibes. Then they act on it. Sometimes the person you like acts on it. Sometimes they are not into you.

 

All my friends that are in what I call successful romantic relationships. Its the women that made the moves on them for the most part. They just picked up on it. One has the power. The other does not.