Is anything going on

[troubadour]

OP, has your wife ever told you what had attracted her so much to him? Was it his look, personality, or something else? Work affairs are one thing but she seemed to go completely off wheels for him with an absolute disregard for anyone and anything else including welfare of her own child.

 

I wish you good luck and hope that once you are divorced you will never even remotely consider any reconciliation with her. She doesn't deserve it.

[Try]

OP, has your wife ever told you what had attracted her so much to him? Was it his look, personality, or something else?

Based on the OP stating today that "She quoted a discussion with 2 female co-workers when she asked about OM chasing her and how should react. Their response was basically it's ok, flirt a bit, he's so lovely", it sounds to me like she was seeking status and validation with her co-workers, and was encouraged to hear that they too thought that the OM was "so lovely". Sadly, I am guessing that if they had told her that the guy was a loser, she would have dropped the OM like a hot potato.

[Try]

In my opinion your situation is worse because this was no one night stand

I saw the video and it is bad. The other man (OM) is laying back in the bathroom with his pants down and she is on top riding him. The husband, his family, his friends, his coworkers, everyone in the country seeing his wife going at it with this OM in the bathroom would be difficult to top as one of the most horrible and humiliating things a husband could endure. Also, there is no reason to think that this was the only time for her, this was just the one where it was widely publicized in a video. The one in the news blurred some parts, but the video that the husband and the rest of the office saw clearly showed who she was. Edited January 10, 2017 by Try

[WilyWill]

I saw the video and it is bad.

 

The poor guy actually posted on SI. A single post, but then he never came back. I can understand--how humiliating.

[aliveagain]

That is why infidelity is so hard to overcome, the shame the betrayed spouse has to endure in order to save their marriage is almost inhuman. It's the worst form of disrespect one spouse can show another. As if being humiliated and cockold isn't enough the betrayed spouse is forced to eat an additional sh*t sandwich with the knowledge that they can never balance the scales again unless they divorce. The only thing the betrayed spouse can be faulted for was falling in love with a trickster that used that love against them. I would rather be single then have to endure a life with someone I couldn't trust.

[merrmeade]

Drone, the post below made me wonder if you're questioning the information you're getting from her. It seems that you're accepting her version of what happened. The version that the betrayed spouse gets from the WS is always going to put the WS in a better light and shift the blame. You have to question her calling the OW/M the aggressor if you only have the WS's word for it:

... So when he started singling her out and pursuing her, at certain point in time she asked him to stop in a "I'm married" way. He indeed didn't stop and doubled the effort. She took it as something very significant, very bold, bright and attractive. That did make all the difference for her then. Her biggest shock was not even that he didn't take the blame with HR as she was subconsciously hoped AFAIK but when he told her (days when I found out) something like "so what's the big deal, we had fun, now let's pretend nothing happened and your deal with your own family issues".

 

I'm not defending her or trying to shift all the blame on om and make her a victim. For me it is much worse than if she would be pursuing him.

[merrmeade]

I must say she's being quite honest (below):

I have asked her only if she, when she was at the point of no return, realised that knowing me and my perhaps archaic views on marriage and all, this will certainly ends the marriage. Or she was counting on me never finding out? Her response was that part of her knew it, but bigger part was to go ahead anyway. ...

 

But in the next part she does not sound not kind or rational. I saw this behavior also. It's the effect of exposure and their shame. They can only think about what terrible people they are, so they try to point out your faults. I understood this as sort of an explosion of shame that must be shared.

At this point she was starting attempts to find my own faults that could lighten the guilt so the discussion stopped...

[Drone117]

Correct. I'd understand and probably be able to forget a one time romp in a party full of alcohol (maybe) but not them walking hand in hand to a hotel room and taking it from there.

 

And no videos, thanks, I have enough juicy details from the diary already and has been humiliated enough without YouTube videos circulating around.

 

As a matter of update I had draft paperwork made ready for me and am going to give it to her asap. So I hope it'll be over soon, given her state of acceptance and (I assume) attraction to this guy I hope the divorce will be clear.

 

 

Probably another jilted married co-worker that lost out on his affection. There is an newspaper article that has gone viral in the UK. This all happened over the Christmas holiday and involves a husband and wife that both work for the same company. Apparently the poor husband stayed home to watch their young children while the wife attended the company Christmas party. She got drunk and out of hand and ended up in a cubicle in the woman's washroom with another employee and had sex with him.

has

Other employee's saw them enter the woman's washroom maybe together and filmed them having sex from the next cubical with their cell phone. This is how the poor husband found out about it, the video was sent from employee to employee and someone sent it to him. There was no doubt about it, his wife was clearly recognizable. She had to confess because her sexual escaped made the newspapers. I think this all started because of the encouragement of others and the thing I find most disgusting is they all know her husband, they work with him. I am not sure how this has played out as they have just gone back to work after the Christmas holidays.

 

In my opinion your situation is worse because this was no one night stand, infidelity takes a lot of planning. Just think about the amount of deceit required to hide it from you for so long(planning around your schedules, all conscious decisions, premeditated and sometimes planned weeks in advance). Think about the health risk she put you in for her selfish bit on the side(they always lie about using protection specially if it's been going on for a while, the exchange of bodily fluids is part of the rush). I went through it several times and my policy now is one of no tolerance because you never get over it. The best you can hope for with a lot of counselling is to learn to live with it but it will always be the white elephant in the room. Just read your first posts here, she made you think your going crazy intentionally.

[Drone117]

Drone, the post below made me wonder if you're questioning the information you're getting from her. It seems that you're accepting her version of what happened. The version that the betrayed spouse gets from the WS is always going to put the WS in a better light and shift the blame. You have to question her calling the OW/M the aggressor if you only have the WS's word for it: [/b]

 

After she's been getting home and behaving as usual (almost) while sleeping with other man and being all over him, I wouldn't believe anything she'd tell me. I doubt she's lying to her own secret diary however.

[Drone117]

 

Has your wife asked for forgiveness and/or asked you to not divorce

 

Yes, in a way that she's sorry for hurting me and ruining they marriage, not like asking me to forgive her and take her back and blur to divorce.

[merrmeade]

Business as usual? As if nothing happened? Hell no. We are basically like roommates sharing accommodation plus co-parents. Asked her not to engage me unless strictly necessary.

Is she trying to engage me? Constantly, despite the above. The problem is she's nothing constructive to say or more often I cannot understand her cryptic messages. My reading she's accepted the loss of the family and at crossroads so to speak, I could be wrong of course.

Emotions? Constantly. Crying, staring at the wall, spontaneous irritations, etc.

So definitely not an ice queen, however what I see is probably in terms of this forum is qualified as regret. I think her actions match the behavior if the person who's loved one has passed away. Like she's grieving of course, but whatever happened was inevitable so eventually the life will go on. At least that is how I am interpreting her words, writings and actions.

 

My intuition tells me that if I kneel and beg and promise to forgive she might go back but only to have a temporary foundation to move on, so I'm not really considering this option. Really need no breadcrumbs from her.

So what I'm trying to get at is that since you confirmed the infidelity, the information has kind of been both incomplete and inconsistent about what's going on. I've been wondering if you're getting the best advice.

 

You see, the thing is your situation is so unique for two reasons: (1) your access to the diary and, therefore, her thoughts and feelings and (2) language. Your English is great, but I think there've been some gaps in communication. For one thing, once the infidelity was established, we were dealing with another stage, and we just haven't gotten much information about what's transpired between you, what she's said that's made sense (and not the "cryptic messages"), what she understands.

 

Also, no one has explained remorse to you and what she should/would do if she really wanted to prove to you she wants only you - e.g., hand over passwords, open all accounts to you, tell you everything that happened, answer all your questions ...

 

Ahhh, but that's the thing: You already know! So you're not asking or what? That's a really unusual interaction; I can't even imagine it. Here, the BS has the advantage, which the WS doesn't even realize, and the BS isn't asking for an explanation of the affair and the WS's feelings because he feels he knows. But do you? Has she always kept a diary or was it just about the affair? How detailed is it? Does she write about you or other things in general? How has the writing changed since she realized you "know"? Have you talked about how you know? Does she ask you?

 

There are just so many things that I don't think you've been given venue to talk about in an organized way that are very relevant to what you understand and what you do next in relation to your wife and your marriage.

 

I don't think you should kneel and beg or promise forgiveness either. But I do think both you and your wife should be in individual counseling to get help with what is important right now. I do NOT think that Loveshack can serve that role.

[Drone117]

Honestly, not a lot of things she's said make sense to me. In a nutshell I've got a personalized version of " I love you but not in love with you". She keeps saying she loves me but she allowed herself to be involved with the other man. Since this happened she is torn and cannot honestly commit back into the same relationship we've had before. Also as she knows I'm not going to forgive her sleeping with him, the only way forward it's to face the consequences ans she's very sorry I and the kid have to pay the price as well. That she'd wish to take it all back and she should've known better but that was "above her" not to have that affair.

 

Yes, by now I kind of know what remorse looks like, and she's not doing that for the reasons above. Even if she starts doing that, so what? Let's say I have her passwords, 100% transparency and every other choice from the menu - how does it suddenly make everything alright and negates the fact she was all over him in all interpretations of the word until he bailed out?

 

I asked her for the details and got a simplified minimised digest of what happened less details. More or less consistent with what I know. I can push for details that I'm not supposed to one but what would be the point since we are parting ways? Also not sure if I want to hear this from her. Yes she asked me how did I find out. She's got a simplified minimised digest of how did I fund out less details the diary. Unusual, I agree, but again ok for a divorcing couple I guess.

 

She was always using her diary to write just about everything. I knew where her "usual" one is, never wanted any access. Since she started to take interest in this guy, she opened another - the secret one,v dedicated to her relationship with him. That is the date I count her affair from. Thev diary is extremely detailed (she's a good writer, better than me) and she doesn't mention me a lot, mostly about her, him and the office. LIke it was all happening in a parallel world. Since the discovery, there is less about their relationship and more about me. Once again her position is what I wrote at the beginning, she is ready to move on, at least that is how in interpreting it. She's much less in love with him now and regrets ever meeting him but thinks that was almost like a destiny. A lot of worries about the kid and the job and - counterintuitively - about me finding out details (trust me there are not nice), though Im not sure why it matters to her anymore.

 

You are right about the "venue" and I thank you for your questions as a have an opportunity to write about it.

 

Counselling? May consider for myself, she's an adult and now has to decide by herself if she needs one.

 

 

 

 

You see, the thing is your situation is so unique for two reasons: (1) your access to the diary and, therefore, her thoughts and feelings and (2) language. Your English is great, but I think there've been some gaps in communication. For one thing, once the infidelity was established, we were dealing with another stage, and we just haven't gotten much information about what's transpired between you, what she's said that's made sense (and not the "cryptic messages"), what she understands.

 

 

Also, no one has explained remorse to you and what she should/would do if she really wanted to prove to you she wants only you - e.g., hand over passwords, open all accounts to you, tell you everything that happened, answer all your questions ...

 

Ahhh, but that's the thing: You already know! So you're not asking or what? That's a really unusual interaction; I can't even imagine it. Here, the BS has the advantage, which the WS doesn't even realize, and the BS isn't asking for an explanation of the affair and the WS's feelings because he feels he knows. But do you? Has she always kept a diary or was it just about the affair? How detailed is it? Does she write about you or other things in general? How has the writing changed since she realized you "know"? Have you talked about how you know? Does she ask you?

 

There are just so many things that I don't think you've been given venue to talk about in an organized way that are very relevant to what you understand and what you do next in relation to your wife and your marriage.

 

I don't think you should kneel and beg or promise forgiveness either. But I do think both you and your wife should be in individual counseling to get help with what is important right now. I do NOT think that Loveshack can serve that role.

[merrmeade]

That was really clear, Drone and I'm satisfied you are doing exactly what you need to do. You've been amazing throughout. I think you will find someone worthy of you and find peace again.

[Cephalopod]

When a woman checks out she checks out. That's it. Very rarely does a woman become reattached to her husband once she has detached and latched on to a new partner. It's as much a biological thing as a psychological block.

 

First of all she has to want to re-connect and reestablish her bond with you. Sounds like she doesn't want to. If that is the case, you've already lost the fight.

 

Secondly, even if she wants to, she has to do the hard work of not only fixing her issues, but also reestablishing her bond with you and helping you heal from the pain she inflicted on you. Most waywards cannot do all three at the same time. It would take a monumental effort on both your parts for over a long period of time. Do you and her have it in you to do it?

[Drone117]

Secondly, even if she wants to, she has to do the hard work of not only fixing her issues, but also reestablishing her bond with you and helping you heal from the pain she inflicted on you. Most waywards cannot do all three at the same time. It would take a monumental effort on both your parts for over a long period of time. Do you and her have it in you to do it?

 

I think this is somewhat a rhetorical question. It looks obvious to me she doesn't have it (at list when it comes to me) and I don't have it to do it all on my own (I simply see no justification of such humiliating and futile attempt). So the divorce in my eyes is but that much of an attempt to punish her or "kick her out of the fog" but the most logical and natural way forward flee both of us.

[Jersey born raised]

Has there been any new devopments at her work?

 

Have you decided the issue of custody?

 

Can you afford to stay in the home or in the neighborhood to preserve your child's social circle and school placement?

[Jump Through Loops]

I think this is somewhat a rhetorical question. It looks obvious to me she doesn't have it (at list when it comes to me) and I don't have it to do it all on my own (I simply see no justification of such humiliating and futile attempt). So the divorce in my eyes is but that much of an attempt to punish her or "kick her out of the fog" but the most logical and natural way forward flee both of us.

 

I believe she stated previously that she's lost you for what she did to you, so she's already resigned herself to that fate. She's an intelligent woman so I'm sure she's therefore already worked out that there's little point in even attempting to reestablish anything with you. 'She' has lost 'you'.

 

 

I'm left wondering what her reaction would be if she was given something to grasp onto in regard to the above, other than the fate that she firmly believes awaits her.

[Chaparral]

Is there anything she could do to make you consider reconciliation?

[Jersey born raised]

Look, previous posters, remember how we speak a lot about the WS having to do the heavy lifting? While doing the heavy lifting is many things it starts with the BS struggling and keep struggling to find a way, a reason.

 

Mrs Adams had a brilliant insight on another thread with a gaslighting WW: she has given you every reason to divorce, that is not the issue. The issue is she has not given you a single reason to stay!!! A WS rarely finds a single reason for the BS. It is the repeated attempt to find reasons that resonate for both spouses that is the foundation for a sucessfull reconcilation. At best his WW spouse is a rather cruel passive-aggressive attempt to manipulate him. A reason to divorce not reconcile.

 

Drone is doing the heavy lifting to get out of adultery which is the number one rule. Kill the adultery either though reconcilation or divorce. He has meant with and is filing for divorce. Giving the circumstance that is the only way out,

He states he does not write well in English but I sense real pain and reluctantence to divorce but determination to end the adultery. Good on him.

Edited January 12, 2017 by Jersey born raised

[BluesPower]

Look, previous posters, remember how we speak a lot about the WS having to do the heavy lifting? While doing the heavy lifting is many things it starts with the BS struggling and keep struggling to find a way, a reason.

 

Mrs Adams had a brilliant insight on another thread with a gaslighting WW: she has given you every reason to divorce, that is not the issue. The issue is she has not given you a single reason to stay!!! A WS rarely finds a single reason for the BS. It is the repeated attempt to find reasons that resonate for both spouses that is the foundation for a sucessfull reconcilation. At best his WW spouse is a rather cruel passive-aggressive attempt to manipulate him. A reason to divorce not reconcile.

 

Drone is doing the heavy lifting to get out of adultery which is the number one rule. Kill the adultery either though reconcilation or divorce. He has meant with and is filing for divorce. Giving the circumstance that is the only way out,

He states he does not write well in English but I sense real pain and reluctantence to divorce but determination to end the adultery. Good on him.

 

And the thing is, unlike most of us, he actually knows what she was thinking. This is a big deal.

 

She is not trying to reconcile. She checked out of the marriage before the affair. She does not deserve a second chance.

 

She will change her mind a few months after the divorce and want to come back, but hopefully Drone is not that stupid.

 

Drone, I think that you have handled this situation really well under horrible circumstances. Good on you...

[drifter777]

Your best chance to recover from this is to just focus on the divorce and get this behind you. Move out or have her move out as soon as possible so you can begin the final stage of detachment. You know there is nothing left of your marriage and that's just the way it is. Millions of people go through divorce and end up much better off than they were when they were married to the cheater. You will be fine - keep the divorce moving forward and get to No Contact with her ASAP. Good luck.

[Sweetfish]

And the thing is, unlike most of us, he actually knows what she was thinking. This is a big deal.

 

She is not trying to reconcile. She checked out of the marriage before the affair. She does not deserve a second chance.

 

She will change her mind a few months after the divorce and want to come back, but hopefully Drone is not that stupid.

 

Drone, I think that you have handled this situation really well under horrible circumstances. Good on you...

 

 

I do believe this is what will happen. Reality has not droped its anchor yet.

[Jersey born raised]

Huge typo in my last post used BS instead of WS. It is up to the WS not the BS to struggle at first to find a way to reconnect.

 

While we are on the subject (which at this point is a T/J) one other note on reconciliation. All marriages have issues. A company I once worked for had a motto "their are no problems, there are opportunities". In a sense healthy marriage meets these opportunities and build a better marriage. So there are issues here that need to be addressed on both sides and perhaps pain as well.

Those who divorce that do well own their personal issues and treated them as opportunities to be meet to create a better marriage with someone eise. A poster here wrote about her husband who's wife destroyed him by engaging in adulerty.

 

Why improve yourself by the new wife of a BS*

 

As a side note I always find it very interesting when a person is hammering their ex mate so hard for cheating and refuses to accept any responsibility for anything that might have been wrong in the marriage.

 

My husband's exwife cheated on him and left him for the OM. She was pregnant by OM before the divorce was final. When I met him he admitted he knew he'd done things in the marriage which left it vulnerable to an affair.*

 

He didn't condone her affair but he accepted responsibility for his part in the demise of their marriage. That was something I had to respect. He worked on himself, in therapy, while they were separated and divorcing. When she wouldn't go to MC, he went alone, and I have reaped the benefit from that counseling. *

 

___________________________________________________________

 

BE be this person. *

 

That divorce, his chid and becoming a guy like that posters husband needs to be Drone's only concern. End of TJ

[Drone117]

Is there anything she could do to make you consider reconciliation?

 

Well, you tell me (by "you" I mean the collective brain power of this forum, not personally you) - is there anything a women could do under these specific circumstances?

 

Let me explain. First of all, chances she'll do anything above what's going on are low. I'll be presenting her the draft paperwork within hours from now, I have asked her for a "time you talk" and she didn't flinch, just said "ok".

 

let's assume however that some of you are correct and she all of a sudden rolls up her sleeves and starts behaving like a really remorseful WW. I won't deny part of me wants that. But here comes my brain dump: she ticks every checkbox on the list I've seen here: total transparency, I have all passwords, she owns her affair up publicly, resigns, goes to counseling, officially dumps the OM... Have I missed anything? All of this will give the a solid indication and even confidence she wants her marriage back, nothing more than that. Nothing which would make her as attractive as a partner before the affair.

In other words, she allowed herself to check out of marriage, be totally owned - even disrespected -'by some office dude (trust me this was some heavy stuff I had to read) , who realistically just dumped her - then she cones back, ok, proves to me 100% she wants things as they were... and that's it? Knowing she is remorseful am I expected to just take her back as if nothing happened? Or am I missing something? Once again, say i know she is remorseful I have no doubts. Am I expected to say "honey welcome back", live for another week or two with tears, shaking and "what have I done"s which I have plenty now and than we are back to being lovey dovey having fun couple enjoying each other like ever before?

 

 

Especially if this happens after the divorce, I assume she may start everything hard - on her backup plan.

[S2B]

True remorse wouldn't look like what you're describing - not after everything that's happened.

 

There's a big difference between being sorry you did it - vs - being sorry you got caught and willing to do anything/everything to repair the damage you've caused.

 

She seems she is sorry she got caught.

 

In the near future - expect her to create some chaos to grab your attention - so you come running. It's usually a trip to an emergency room or some sort of drama designed for you to run to her = don't fall for this important tactical move/manipulation. Be warned: be ready.