Why can some women not forget the past?

[basil67]

Oh also... My ex said nasty stuff too but I never let it hurt me and I am telling you ladies... I bet you can think back to a time when you have said some nasty nasty stuff to your partner in anger you did not mean.

 

My ex literally was pulling away 2 months before the wedding and I told her we couldn't cancel the wedding AGAIN because family and friends have spent thousands already and I was hurt she wanted to post pone it again. Her response "**** your family! It's not of their god damn business!" That is a HORRIBLE thing to say and yet... I totally forgave her the next day and she never apoligized for saying it. Seems rather unfair to me.

 

No matter how mad I am, I have never said something I do not mean. If I feel it, I might say it. If I don't feel it, I will never say it.

 

Why would you forgive her for something she didn't admit was wrong or apologise for? That's not you being good and kind....that's you being stupid. I'm so sorry this happened to you, but don't complain about life being unfair if you contributed by making dumb decisions.

 

If someone is horrible to you, you may choose to forgive it. But don't forget it. Put it on a score sheet and let it weigh into the general suitability of you both.

[Sweetfish]

Every single point you just listed Sweetfish, without exaggeration I can easily attach to my ex an things he did that are direct and examples of what you just said. This also includes some of the things the other guys have cited here as examples of what their ex's did, I can easily attach to my ex (who is a man).

 

So where does that leave your theory then that women just like to push boundaries and sappy guys who don't enforce them are the ones that create these patterns?

 

Look, this notion that women don't want advice is some cockamamie notion that was started up in some self-help manual in the 90's and it is still propagated 20 years later.

 

Do you like it when someone listens to what you have to say? When someone pays attention to what you are saying and especially if you are feeling emotional about something, who doesn't dismiss your feelings with underhanded comments? We like it too. It's that simple.

 

Personally, if I am going to bring home a problem or situation about my day I most definitely want to hear advice from my partner. We had many many discussions where he would give me awesome advice on many issues I would bring home; problems, dreams or life fantasies, family issues whatever and he would offer his advice and it was welcomed. Just so happens he was a great listener too. But there is offering advice and harsh criticism. We don't appreciate that, I don't think most people do.

 

My bone of contention is when we had a disagreement. All that great listening went out the window. It became a power struggle to get the next word out, and to argue a point and to dismiss any feelings that may be happening in the moment and at that very moment the floodgates would open and ghosts of pain past, would come orbiting back.

 

Sometimes it took a lot of circuitous arguing to get to a point where he could actually hear what I was expressing and see what was painful in his actions and reflect and see the pain he had caused (purposely or inadvertently). Where that could have easily been avoided if he were a better listener as opposed to being so defensive and reactive.

 

We don't expect our guys to never mess up or do some numb-nutty things...you will and you do. But we do expect you to understand why those numb-nutty things hurt us or preyed on our sensitivities.

 

We're not sitting here "high-fiving" each other because look "boobs and slates and tally boards" that's what we are...oh well."

 

The fact that those past pains can so easily creep up on is not a premeditative act, it is intrinsic to our make-up as women. Acting out on that and rehashing and reintroducing those memories over and over is something that is premeditative and that we can control.

 

 

A lot of women do test boundaries or do periodic "checks"

Sorry, but it's true. It seems that what women do as a majority is selective on good merits and the bad merits are localized to certain women. Ironic isnt?

 

Let me point out an example. Your boyfriend doesn't like that a new friend that is being very close to you. He is jealous by this guy. Eventually, an argument begins. You tell him he is being over reactive and you both resolve the argument eventually.

 

As a women. You have not resolved this scenario. You have simply kept 'score' and the man thinks the problem is resolved and feels that he should take his gf out for dinner because he feels remorse that he was the starter of the argument.

 

If the situation was reversed. He will still get scored. He will not be taken out to dinner or get remorse and be seen as untrusted.

 

This is not a healthy resolve to an argument and means his remorse (with in reason) has no value to you and you will not express this. So the only way to collect patterns or to determine long term commitment.. women will test the man again to see if he will get jealous again... or as said see a pattern. This will create a devalued attraction because the test is subjective to every women.

 

I'm not to sure about the self help manual you talk about.. but honestly women like to resolve problems on their own. Yes, many times many women love the idea of advice from their husband or boyfriend; however, many men rob the gf or wife of their independence and they become codependent. 99% of the time women just want to be heard and that was said by you many times...

 

Women know their S.O. sooo well they already know exactly what they are going to say or how he will respond. So the whole you wanna hear advice when "Betty at the job is being a A-hole today" I just don't buy it.

 

In this whole thread men are thrown under the bus. "Women are more sensitive?" Is that why this forum is like 75% men? We appear to lack depth in the relationship? Depends on who your dating. All bad habits seem to be a universal male trait and a women score base devalue system is just a genetic programming built-in because they are sensitive and are protecting them selves for the long term. Sounds like a sugar coated version of holding a grudge that will eventually show its ugly head at some random moment...weeks or years from now... really? Years? Lol

 

I hear a lot of me..me..me me in here and my feelings. Ever thought... I'm being serious.. that a man wants to be heard? That women do things that hurt men? I know many guys who work hard hours doing the same hard stressful job for 20 years for the women he loves only to be told about something he did years ago or that every mistake he makes is being tallied. While you get a clean slate for your mistakes. Seriously, how do you think that feels... horrible

 

Gonna have to do better than that..

 

Sunkissedpatio like everyone else says.. I've read your post too and your threads. You have good points and views..I value them...

 

But women generally do not understand what guys feel or even care how they feel....they only understand how they feel and that what ultimately matters.

[elaine567]

A lot of women do test boundaries or do periodic "checks"

 

EVERYONE tests boundaries, men test boundaries, women test boundaries, children test boundaries, even dogs test boundaries...

[Sweetfish]

EVERYONE tests boundaries, men test boundaries, women test boundaries, children test boundaries, even dogs test boundaries...

 

Hmmm. I said boundaries and periodic checks or periodic checks aka **** test

 

Yes.. children test boundaries to see how far they can get.

 

Men test boundaries usually to show power.

 

Dogs test boundaries unaware of their limits.

 

What's your point?

 

Women test boundaries and use helplessness, crying, "lack of knowledge" or emotions to validate those actions. If these tactics don't work many start to unload, get angry or breakdown like a light switch.

 

It's like when a women tries to use her charm to aquire free drinks at a bar... if you say no... 9 out of 10 the out come is met with anger.

 

If the guy friend is too close... they proceed with "oh he is just a friend" knowing that many men do have alternate motives and use lack of knowledge to justify and keep this guy around and will use him to test boundaries or do **** test. Men CANNOT do this and are suppose to br emotionless to these test for you will be tallied for every angry outburst or argument you do and will he held against in future arguments

 

I didn't make this up. Not all women do it.. but this will not be considered mostly universal to women have no universal bad habits

[dreamingoftigers]

EVERYONE tests boundaries, men test boundaries, women test boundaries, children test boundaries, even dogs test boundaries...

 

My dog was hilarious when she would do this.

 

Ever seen a dog try to 'sneak' something?

 

They look at you and see if you are watching, their tail starts going and then they dive out, FAST, because if they are 'fast' then they are 'sneaky.' LMAO.

[dreamingoftigers]

Hmmm. I said boundaries and periodic checks or periodic checks aka **** test

 

Yes.. children test boundaries to see how far they can get.

 

Men test boundaries usually to show power.

 

Dogs test boundaries unaware of their limits.

 

What's your point?

 

Women test boundaries and use helplessness, crying, "lack of knowledge" or emotions to validate those actions. If these tactics don't work many start to unload, get angry or breakdown like a light switch.

 

It's like when a women tries to use her charm to aquire free drinks at a bar... if you say no... 9 out of 10 the out come is met with anger.

 

If the guy friend is too close... they proceed with "oh he is just a friend" knowing that many men do have alternate motives and use lack of knowledge to justify and keep this guy around and will use him to test boundaries or do **** test. Men CANNOT do this and are suppose to br emotionless to these test for you will be tallied for every angry outburst or argument you do and will he held against in future arguments

 

I didn't make this up. Not all women do it.. but this will not be considered mostly universal to women have no universal bad habits

 

I can't relate to any of this.

 

And frankly, crying in general isn't manipulation. By the time a woman gets to actual tears, that's a very genuine physical and emotional reaction.

 

I find men who view crying as 'manipulation' also tended to be abusive overall.

[Sweetfish]

I can't relate to any of this.

 

And frankly, crying in general isn't manipulation. By the time a woman gets to actual tears, that's a very genuine physical and emotional reaction.

 

I find men who view crying as 'manipulation' also tended to be abusive overall.

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/he-speaks-she-speaks/201101/the-crying-game

 

How Can Women Manipulate Men Easily?

 

 

Yup...Men are all abusive and women never manipulate. They don't expose cleavage for advantage. They don't cry or use any female traits to get their way. Again point proven...bad traits are not universal among women.. Men manipulate as well.. but a female manipulator is far worse. My point is women seem to be absolutely oblivious to their wrongs. While men do admit and actively do try to work on there problems.

 

L

Edited November 26, 2016 by Sweetfish

[Woggle]

I don't believe most crying is manipulation but my ex could pretty much cry on cue and did in court while lying through her teeth.

[Sunkissedpatio]

A lot of women do test boundaries or do periodic "checks"

Sorry, but it's true. It seems that what women do as a majority is selective on good merits and the bad merits are localized to certain women. Ironic isnt?

 

Let me point out an example. Your boyfriend doesn't like that a new friend that is being very close to you. He is jealous by this guy. Eventually, an argument begins. You tell him he is being over reactive and you both resolve the argument eventually.

 

Oh the notion of "sht tests".

 

Yes, it is another creation brought to by the good ol'internet. It is nothing more than a term and description used by those that are in the camp that comfortably resides directly in opposition to feminazi/misandrists, who propagate the " women are crazy" notion.

 

That bile spewing, utterly unprofessional, woman-hating Dr. T who despises women based on the premise that she has likely spent her whole life wondering "what do all those guys see in her and why can't they just like me instead?" and her sidekick, misogynistic, radio host, who wants to get with all those girls that all the other guys get, and similarly wonders "why do all those guys get her , why can't she just fck me instead? "

 

Those two remind me of outliers on the periphery of what the average person gets/wants (in an idealized woman) but are never able to achieve it no matter how hard they try. So they have made their life a crusade against her - "the girl all guys want but that I will never be” or in his case "will never have" and out of that rejection the "women are crazy/psychos" is borne.

 

Those two have also bastardized and made a mockery of the nomenclature for BDP and have attached it to so much hateful stuff against women, and victimized men that are just as abusive and "broken" as the women they profess are “too crazy to love" that it is really difficult to take them seriously or any terminology they create that paints a broad stroke of how “women” have create sht tests to test boundaries.

 

What do you think the most commonly used term is when someone is being gaslighted? "you're crazy"

 

And "you're crazy" has been used to gaslight women far longer than the internet or any form of modern pop-psyche material was created.

 

Like Elaine said, “people, dogs, children” test boundaries. Our entire lives are built on testing boundaries. Ambition, achievement and progression is founded on boundary-testing. It’s human nature not “crazy female” antics. Sure there is manipulation, people can and will abuse .

 

Are there women that manipulate? Of course!

Are there men that manipulate? Of course!

 

As a women. You have not resolved this scenario. You have simply kept 'score' and the man thinks the problem is resolved and feels that he should take his gf out for dinner because he feels remorse that he was the starter of the argument.

 

If the situation was reversed. He will still get scored. He will not be taken out to dinner or get remorse and be seen as untrusted.

 

This is not a healthy resolve to an argument and means his remorse (with in reason) has no value to you and you will not express this. So the only way to collect patterns or to determine long term commitment.. women will test the man again to see if he will get jealous again... or as said see a pattern. This will create a devalued attraction because the test is subjective to every women.

 

We, (and when I say "we" I mean the typical woman who has her idiosyncrasies, many faults etc but does not have abusive tendencies overall) do not keep score because we want to test you. We "keep score" of those past instances that have hurt us deeply, or that have caused us to mistrust you or to shift our perceptions of your character in some shape or form that has made us wary of how you could hurt us in the future.

 

That is very different than sitting around scheming on how we will entrap you next so that we can re-hash old arguments or points that have been laid to rest for some subversive need to win power over you and turn you into a doormat.

 

Everyone likes to win an argument. Everyone likes to have their point heard. You cannot deny that.

 

I'm not to sure about the self help manual you talk about.. but honestly women like to resolve problems on their own. Yes, many times many women love the idea of advice from their husband or boyfriend; however, many men rob the gf or wife of their independence and they become codependent. 99% of the time women just want to be heard and that was said by you many times...

 

I don't know what world you live in, but the here and now of my world - 2016 Western world, a lot of us women are way past the point of having to prove we are "independent" because we ARE independent. Everyone works, everyone supports themselves (for the most part) everyone has freedom of thought and speech and makes some pretty liberal decisions about their bodies, sex, and life in general so we are no longer looking to be heard because we feel like the inferior "dependent gender"

 

We like to be heard because everyone likes to be heard. I like advice and I honestly cannot relate to this notion that if I bring up a problem about something to my partner that I'll get offended because he wants to fix it.

 

Sometimes what a man calls "fixing a problem" is actually dismissing your problem and wanting to shut the conversation down because he is in the middle of watching his favourite show, or criticizing when what we are looking for is some loving support. But that can happen to guys too. Never felt criticized or belittled by your woman when you were actually looking for some support?

 

Women know their S.O. sooo well they already know exactly what they are going to say or how he will respond. So the whole you wanna hear advice when "Betty at the job is being a A-hole today" I just don't buy it.

 

You are talking about advice right? Not crap that gets spewed in a fight or a broken record of complaints and nagging that get brought up in fights over and over just to jab or hurt the other person. Because those we definitely can predict. As you can from us.

 

Otherwise, wow that's a pretty two-dimensional way to look at your mate. I've been with men for years-on-end that never ceased to surprise me with their opinions, comments and views. Can't say I have ever been with someone that boring or predictable that I would go though life with him thinking "meh what's the point of talking to him or getting his advice, I already know what he is going to tell me anyway”

 

In this whole thread men are thrown under the bus. "Women are more sensitive?" Is that why this forum is like 75% men? We appear to lack depth in the relationship? Depends on who your dating. All bad habits seem to be a universal male trait and a women score base devalue system is just a genetic programming built-in because they are sensitive and are protecting them selves for the long term. Sounds like a sugar coated version of holding a grudge that will eventually show its ugly head at some random moment...weeks or years from now... really? Years? Lol

 

And you know why that is? And this isn't me saying this you can actually read it in many of that 75%'s posts that come here for advice. It's because guys don't have as many avenues to discuss their emotions and their relationship problems as women do in their real lives because their friendships or platonic relationships outside the virtual world run a lot less emotionally deeper than in women's case.

 

You read it over and over and over again, "I can't really discuss this with my family and my friends are sick of hearing me bring up my problems"

 

Oversimplification: of situations

 

Here's how I imagine what "my friends and family are sick of hearing me talk about this" might look in either gender:

 

Man

 

Bros hanging out. He brings up the g/f issues talk, discussion gets tossed around for a bit friend shuts it down with "you're being pssy dude, there's other chicks out there, forget about her not worth losing your self-wroth on all this drama”

 

"Hi everyone I’m new to LS posting my issue here because my friends are sick of hearing me talk about this."

 

Woman

 

Girls sitting down to have brunch with friend hearing the “drama” offering advice, comparing to their experiences, analyzing his behaviour, analyzing your behaviour, tell you where you can improve, tell you where he can improve, play devil’s advocate, have a bit of a go a their own situation/man. And this goes on pretty much until the check arrives and one of the girls asks “so how’s work going?”

Part ways. An hour later follow-up on tex about something said earlier. Follow-up to see how things are going? Next day call each other on the phone to continue discussion. Three days later get a desperate call in middle of workday on what to do from same girlfriend.

 

It’s three weeks later and the issues are still being discussed this time with input to compare from “crowed sourcing” ie. mother has a say, sister has a say, dad, work friends, Facebook friend random conversation, therapist etc.

 

"Hi everyone I’m new to LS posting my issue here because my friends are sick of hearing me talk about this.”

 

That example is a bit of a satire of how deep women can go with these types of discussion socially vs how men can but it isn’t too far off from the truth.

 

 

Sunkissedpatio like everyone else says.. I've read your post too and your threads. You have good points and views..I value them...

 

But women generally do not understand what guys feel

or even care how they feel....they only understand how they feel and that what ultimately matters.

 

Cool, thank you. As I do yours.

 

That's true if I am brutally honest my ex did say to me on few occasions exactly that. He felt he wasn't being understood or that he wasn't "allowed to have feelings" and rightly so because in those moments I am certain I really wasn't understanding his feelings.

Edited November 26, 2016 by Sunkissedpatio

[dreamingoftigers]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/he-speaks-she-speaks/201101/the-crying-game

 

How Can Women Manipulate Men Easily?

 

 

Yup...Men are all abusive and women never manipulate. They don't expose cleavage for advantage. They don't cry or use any female traits to get their way. Again point proven...bad traits are not universal among women.. Men manipulate as well.. but a female manipulator is far worse. My point is women seem to be absolutely oblivious to their wrongs. While men do admit and actively do try to work on there problems.

 

L

 

Is this a joke?

 

Because I wrote pretty clearly what MY EXPERIENCE was.

 

And now you are straight-up saying a bunch of crap about "yeah sure, men bad, women good. Whatever."

 

Frankly, I am someone who had some pretty extensive flaws and I've worked through a considerable amount of them for my own mental health and health of those around me.

 

I suspect most people (including the dreaded "women" ) eventually do.

 

As for women manipulators being "worse" the US has the most blatantly manipulative men at the helm of it right now, and that I would say is pretty damn bad. A lot worse than whatever cleavage has been flashed in yesteryear. Which is also something I can't relate to BTW.

 

I also stand by my claim that when people cry, it is a physical reaction that has emotion attached to it. The person might not be having a reaction to what you think they are though. Jeez, when I was 19 I had a 22 year old boyfriend that actually CRIED about missing an new episode of Pokemon because the movie we saw ran late. Yes, this actually happened.

[Sunkissedpatio]

In this whole thread men are thrown under the bus. "Women are more sensitive?" Is that why this forum is like 75% men? We appear to lack depth in the relationship? Depends on who your dating. All bad habits seem to be a universal male trait and a women score base devalue system is just a genetic programming built-in because they are sensitive and are protecting them selves for the long term. Sounds like a sugar coated version of holding a grudge that will eventually show its ugly head at some random moment...weeks or years from now... really? Years? Lol

 

I hear a lot of me..me..me me in here and my feelings. Ever thought... I'm being serious.. that a man wants to be heard? That women do things that hurt men? I know many guys who work hard hours doing the same hard stressful job for 20 years for the women he loves only to be told about something he did years ago or that every mistake he makes is being tallied. While you get a clean slate for your mistakes. Seriously, how do you think that feels... horrible

 

And I meant to also say on this front that it's not that men are "less emotional" or need any less to offload their feelings it is just that women have a lot more avenues to do that than men do because of the topical social relationships men have vs the ones women do.

 

It isn't a "he bad" / "she good" thing it is a social conditioning thing.

 

You know and this whole notion about crying... I completely disagree that women use crying to manipulate. Unless you are a method actress and have the power to cry on command (which people like this do exist) crying is a physiological reaction to feeling overwhelmed with emotion and it's a release so not sure how that is perceived as manipulation when we do it candidly and involuntarily?

 

Just a few days ago I was trying to think really hard how men in this current point in history are "conditioned not to cry" in childhood. Sure, boys make fun of other boys who cry, and girls who cry but what we live in a pretty enlightened world now especially when it comes to psychology and human behaviour. The sensitivities that we see in masculinity today is not at ALL what we saw even 30 years ago. Let alone much earlier than that. So how is it that women are seen as manipulators if they cry when guys are no longer being forced to suppress their emotions like, for example, our fathers were?

 

I've been with men that cried rather easily to varying degrees of situations (outside of a death of loved one or something tragic).

 

How is crying manipulative?!?!? That one is really confusing to me.

Edited November 26, 2016 by Sunkissedpatio

[dreamingoftigers]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/he-speaks-she-speaks/201101/the-crying-game

 

How Can Women Manipulate Men Easily?

 

 

Yup...Men are all abusive and women never manipulate. They don't expose cleavage for advantage. They don't cry or use any female traits to get their way. Again point proven...bad traits are not universal among women.. Men manipulate as well.. but a female manipulator is far worse. My point is women seem to be absolutely oblivious to their wrongs. While men do admit and actively do try to work on there problems.

 

L

 

I suggest you actually READ the whole Psychology Today article, because it was all about how and why we all cry, including many references to crying men.

 

It doesn't show any evidence of women crying to "manipulate" other than one sentence where it says that it is one way that men perceive it.

 

Which actually goes directly with what I said earlier, so thanks for the link. I check out the others when I get a chance.

[dreamingoftigers]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/he-speaks-she-speaks/201101/the-crying-game

 

How Can Women Manipulate Men Easily?

 

 

Yup...Men are all abusive and women never manipulate. They don't expose cleavage for advantage. They don't cry or use any female traits to get their way. Again point proven...bad traits are not universal among women.. Men manipulate as well.. but a female manipulator is far worse. My point is women seem to be absolutely oblivious to their wrongs. While men do admit and actively do try to work on there problems.

 

L

 

I just checked the second link too.

 

When it mentions crying it cites it as an example after a guy screams at a woman.

 

A woman crying at this is not uncommon. And if you read your own previous link, you can read WHY a woman cries after being screamed at and it isn't "manipulation."

 

In an article that very much seems to be written by a man or men.

 

It might benefit you to read your own links.

[Sunkissedpatio]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/he-speaks-she-speaks/201101/the-crying-game

 

How Can Women Manipulate Men Easily?

 

 

L

 

Holy crap! That's impressive and hilarious how she can do that.

I hadn't seen the video or read your articles when I posted my previous posts!!

 

C'mon she's exactly a part of that tiny fraction of society I mentioned earlier that can do it on command. Do you honestly think the average woman has taken time to develop techniques to cry on command?

You can honestly believe that.

 

It makes me sad anyone would be that jaded or mistrusting of the opposite sex to think they would go out way to "learn to do that"

[Sweetfish]

Is this a joke?

 

Because I wrote pretty clearly what MY EXPERIENCE was.

 

And now you are straight-up saying a bunch of crap about "yeah sure, men bad, women good. Whatever."

 

Frankly, I am someone who had some pretty extensive flaws and I've worked through a considerable amount of them for my own mental health and health of those around me.

 

I suspect most people (including the dreaded "women" ) eventually do.

 

As for women manipulators being "worse" the US has the most blatantly manipulative men at the helm of it right now, and that I would say is pretty damn bad. A lot worse than whatever cleavage has been flashed in yesteryear. Which is also something I can't relate to BTW.

 

I also stand by my claim that when people cry, it is a physical reaction that has emotion attached to it. The person might not be having a reaction to what you think they are though. Jeez, when I was 19 I had a 22 year old boyfriend that actually CRIED about missing an new episode of Pokemon because the movie we saw ran late. Yes, this actually happened.

 

We are not talking about you. We are talking about whats going on with men and women in general. So why are you taking it personal? But when it comes to men you generalize...

 

When it comes to most women it's about "me"

 

Even your paragraph is riddled with "me" and "i"

 

With female feelings at the forefront n combination with your scorecard system how is a guy ever at an advantage? They are at a disadvantage. It's not equal.

 

All this going back and forth... not any of the female have justified this one sided score base system as right nor wrong.

Edited November 26, 2016 by Sweetfish

[Sweetfish]

Holy crap! That's impressive and hilarious how she can do that.

I hadn't seen the video or read your articles when I posted my previous posts!!

 

C'mon she's exactly a part of that tiny fraction of society I mentioned earlier that can do it on command. Do you honestly think the average woman has taken time to develop techniques to cry on command?

You can honestly believe that.

 

It makes me sad anyone would be that jaded or mistrusting of the opposite sex to think they would go out way to "learn to do that"

 

 

No....it's society that does this and becomes natural habitat so it seems natural.

 

Let's be honest if your having an argument and you cry.

Your feelings are hurt.

 

Does that mean the man is not equally hurt?

 

So when men see this crying the man quickly adjust to this and the argument is now at the advantage of the women. If the man continues its abuse?

 

So in reality by theory... if a man is equally hurt and is not crying it's not abuse.

[Sunkissedpatio]

Can only speak for myself but if I am having an argument I don't cry, I fight back.

 

Two instances I can think of where I have cried during an argument:

 

1) when something is said that is so hurtful or shocking to learn that the person who loves you and who you look up to sees you this way

 

2) exhaustion and frustration of the inability to reach an amicable solution because the other person has wrongfully accused you of something and their grip on their conviction is so tight that there is nothing you can say or do to defend yourself or to convince them of your innocence

 

Those are the most frustrating situations for me, and I will likely cry.

 

We aren't crying to gain sympathy we are crying as a reaction to the pent up emotions.

Edited November 26, 2016 by Sunkissedpatio

[benpom]

I know this sounds PRETTY sexist but I do not mean it to come across like that at all. I have done a lot of research into the area and have seen countless times women usually fall out of love because they only think about the bad in the relationship and don't think about the good at all.

 

Example with my ex girlfriend from a few months back. She fell out of love with me and to this day never gave me a real solid reason why. I have found out on my own more than likely all the reasons why but that's not the point of this.

 

When we were still in contact if I EVER brought up anything from the past she would turn it into something negative and you could STILL see the anger she had over something I said or did. She even remembered a fight we had 6 freaking years ago and something I said out of anger...yet we had talked a while back and I mentioned I learned a song from the past on the piano and she said "omg... I totally forgot about that song... I remember you playing it for me and how happy you were... Omg you are so sweet."

 

I on the other hand have ALWAYS gotten past the fights and only remember most of the good things unless I REALLY dig deep. She didn't even have to dig to bring up something that happened one time 6 years ago lol.

 

So why is this? Why is it so hard for them to let go of the past? I want to know all this for my next relationship so I can learn in the areas I failed in this one.

 

There were a few bad moments in my relationship with STBX that I almost forgot, until he brought it up. I forgot them because he followed up with instant sincere apologies.

 

There were other bad moments that I remember vividly to this day, because either his apology was insincere or he would just give me silence treatment. Years later, he would just say: I don't understand why you can't just forget and move on.

 

It's not the bad moments that break the relationship, it's the bad attitude. I really hated hearing him say: why can't you just forget and move on?

 

Love is an attitude. It's about caring about the well-being of the other person's heart and soul. Any statement of 'why can't you just forget and move on? ' is the opposite of love. It is conveying this message: I don't care how much I hurt you; I just want you to relieve me of the consequences.

 

OP, perhaps this can give you some insight why your ex left you?

[dreamingoftigers]

We are not talking about you. We are talking about whats going on with men and women in general. So why are you taking it personal? But when it comes to men you generalize...

 

Because when speaking on behalf of "women" I make sure I use only my own experience as a woman. I can't really say "women only do x" because I don't speak as a group of women. I'm an individual. So I can only respond to "women do this" as "well I do" OR "I don't" OR "that's not what I see with women in general."

 

As such, I've had experiences with men in my life and on this forum. If the thread topic was women to women relationships, I would give my perspective as "here is how I perceive other women" and it would be less specific because IN MY EXPERIENCE, there's a lot more variance among woman than men.

 

When it comes to most women it's about "me" because I can't speak to how EVERY OTHER WOMAN is.

 

Even your paragraph is riddled with "me" and "i"

 

Yes, I am an individual after all. Had "women" sent me to be their representative, I would say "we."

 

With female feelings at the forefront n combination with your scorecard system how is a guy ever at an advantage? They are at a disadvantage. It's not equal.

 

I tend not to think of my basic wiring as "advantage/disadvantage". It's more "Can I trust this guy?"

 

I find a large percentage of men to be untrustworthy, enough so that I am pretty sensitive to it. I don't date women, so whether or not they are trustworthy in the relational sense is rather irrelevant, except when we apply it to friendships. And frankly, women use these same standards with other women. They remember incidents of untrustworthiness. In fact, I find women are quicker to drop an untrustworthy female friend then they are to drop an untrustworthy boyfriend.

 

My only suggestion to men regarding their "disadvantage" is that they will SHINE, and be in a rather ELITE class with his girlfriend if he can listen to, consider and care about her feelings. If she says "x embarrasses me" and he says "I didn't realize that, that would never be my intent, how about I do y instead?" Wow. That guy is worth his weight in diamonds. If you learn and apply the skills instead of expecting problems to resolve themselves after a "time out." If you treat your wife or gf like she is making "noise," you're gonna have a bad time!

 

All this going back and forth... not any of the female have justified this one sided score base system as right nor wrong.

 

I don't think it's wrong to have your own standards and breaking points.

 

If I keep doing the same sht that pisses you off and acting like you are "just a whiny btch," I expect you'll leave eventually. For some reason guys are pretty blindsided when they don't want to actually listen to their women and then they walk out. They say "the breakup was really sudden."

 

I think even my husband would say our "breakup was pretty sudden" but he's accrued a sht ton of baggage. If he just went back to "I don't wanna talk about it, let it go, sick of hearing about it" I would INSTANTLY go. Because he just pulled too much sht to not have to listen to me now and then if he still wants anything resembling a marriage.

 

Guys KNOW that feeling are important, because often that's how they get girlfriends to begin with! Players even know that they sit and listen to a weak-boundaried woman sob about her bf, and he will get laid.

[dreamingoftigers]

There were a few bad moments in my relationship with STBX that I almost forgot, until he brought it up. I forgot them because he followed up with instant sincere apologies.

 

Actually, yes, ^^^^^ this, THIS IS how to erase a lot of bad moments before they settle in. SINCERE and relatively QUICK. Some of the more grievious crap that my husband has pulled never became an issue because of the sincerity and and instant apology.

 

There were other bad moments that I remember vividly to this day, because either his apology was insincere or he would just give me silence treatment. Years later, he would just say: I don't understand why you can't just forget and move on.

 

Which only compounds it because it remains unresolved.

 

It's not the bad moments that break the relationship, it's the bad attitude. I really hated hearing him say: why can't you just forget and move on?

 

It just sounds to us like saying "I don't give a fck about how you feel about it, I'm sick of hearing your blah blah blah. Take your hurt feelings and shove em."

 

Love is an attitude. It's about caring about the well-being of the other person's heart and soul. Any statement of 'why can't you just forget and move on? ' is the opposite of love. It is conveying this message: I don't care how much I hurt you; I just want you to relieve me of the consequences.

 

That's just a nicer way to phrase it.

 

OP, perhaps this can give you some insight why your ex left you?

 

You see gentlemen, if something is outrageous to us, we are not soothed by the passage of time.

 

We are soothed by ACTION that RESOLVES the prior poor action on your behalf.

[benpom]

There were a few bad moments in my relationship with STBX that I almost forgot, until he brought it up. I forgot them because he followed up with instant sincere apologies.

 

There were other bad moments that I remember vividly to this day, because either his apology was insincere or he would just give me silence treatment. Years later, he would just say: I don't understand why you can't just forget and move on.

 

It's not the bad moments that break the relationship, it's the bad attitude. I really hated hearing him say: why can't you just forget and move on?

 

Love is an attitude. It's about caring about the well-being of the other person's heart and soul. Any statement of 'why can't you just forget and move on? ' is the opposite of love. It is conveying this message: I don't care how much I hurt you; I just want you to relieve me of the consequences.

 

OP, perhaps this can give you some insight why your ex left you?

 

Just to be fair: I hurt my STBX plenty of times too. But if we keep score, he is the winner - he hurt me a lot more times. He left me as soon as I hurt him.

 

By the way, years ago, he was facing the choice of 1) the dream job in a city I could not find a job in my field and 2) a job he doesn't like in another city where I could fare well in my career. I followed him to pursue his dream job and I became a stay-at-home mother. Now he has left me, and he hired a lawyer to fight for the majority of our savings and properties.

[basil67]

Realistically how is this fair? I am actually curious how In a woman's eyes this is fair. Guys forgive and forget but ladies keep a score going. Why is she aloud to and the man not? Trust me.. I had some horrific girlfriends but I constantly forgave them for bad stuff (cheating, verbal abuse, lying, etc) but I never do any of this but have an argument on we're to go to dinner that escalates and it's kept track of? That seems completely unfair to me but all of my girlfriends have done it.

 

My last left cause of words said in fights.. I never hit her or anything like that BUT she slapped the hell out of me in the middle of a fight. The next day I was laughing about the fact she had slapped me and made the comment "you slapped the hell out of me... Didn't know you could hit so hard... hahaha" yet after that she was upset at me for getting her so upset to the point she slapped me... Wth?

 

That fight even started because I was working and I needed some space because of stress. She didn't care and got upset at me for being moody. Got in my face and was yelling at me even though I said we both needed to cool down because this fight was about something stupid and I was sorry. I explained it was just stress but she kept it going until the fight escalated. In fact every girlfriend I have ever had escalated the fights to no return and yet THEY leave because the fights got so bad... That they escalated and started 50 percent of the time?

 

I don't.. Understand... Hahaha

 

In fact the girl that left me because of the arguments in the end even said "idk why I fight with you... It's like I realize I am making it worse but I would rather fight with you then not talk and cool down" so she in a sense left me Because of something I did that she made worse because she wanted to fight? Women = confusion lol. No affect ladies. I love ya

 

Popbradley, do you realise how dysfunctional these relationships are? Perhaps you think that fighting like this is normal. But it's not.

 

When it comes to women (and men!) who leave because of the fighting, despite their own part in escalating the fights, it's actually really easy to understand. If a partner doesn't bring out our best, then it's best to end it.

 

Here's the thing: A person finds their partner's actions so infuriating that they lose control of their temper. This happens too frequently for their comfort. The partner's behaviour which triggers their reaction isn't going to change despite discussion about it. The only option left to the person is to leave.

 

A male friend of mine had this happen to him. He was always the most calm person to be around. But a new girlfriend managed to infuriate him to the point where he'd be yelling. This was so unlike him. She was bad for him and he needed to leave.

 

As every girlfriend you've ever had gets so infuriated that she loses her temper to this degree, then it stands to reason that you're the constant. Look inside and work on yourself. If someone gets upset with you, don't forget about it. Look inside at what you did and apologise. Make changes. Forgetting about the fight means that you aren't making positive changes to yourself and you're not recognising how your actions affect others.

 

Make yourself a good partner to be around and reap the rewards of a healthy and calm relationship.

Edited November 26, 2016 by basil67

[dreamingoftigers]

Actually, yes, ^^^^^ this, THIS IS how to erase a lot of bad moments before they settle in. SINCERE and relatively QUICK. Some of the more grievious crap that my husband has pulled never became an issue because of the sincerity and and instant apology.

 

 

 

Which only compounds it because it remains unresolved.

 

 

 

It just sounds to us like saying "I don't give a fck about how you feel about it, I'm sick of hearing your blah blah blah. Take your hurt feelings and shove em."

 

 

 

That's just a nicer way to phrase it.

 

 

 

You see gentlemen, if something is outrageous to us, we are not soothed by the passage of time.

 

We are soothed by ACTION that RESOLVES the prior poor action on your behalf.

 

There, I used "we" and "us" instead of "me" and "I"

 

Does that actually add something to it?

[dreamingoftigers]

Popbradley, do you realise how dysfunctional these relationships are? Perhaps you think that fighting like this is normal. But it's not.

 

When it comes to women (and men!) who leave because of the fighting, despite their own part in escalating the fights, it's actually really easy to understand. If a partner doesn't bring out our best, then it's best to end it.

 

Here's the thing: A person finds their partner's actions so infuriating that they lose control of their temper. This happens too frequently for their comfort. The partner's behaviour which triggers their reaction isn't going to change despite discussion about it. The only option left to the person is to leave.

 

A male friend of mine had this happen to him. He was always the most calm person to be around. But a new girlfriend managed to infuriate him to the point where he'd be yelling. This was so unlike him. She was bad for him and he needed to leave.

 

As every girlfriend you've ever had gets so infuriated that she loses her temper to this degree, then it stands to reason that you're the constant. Look inside and work on yourself. If someone gets upset with you, don't forget about it. Look inside at what you did and apologise. Make changes. Forgetting about the fight means that you aren't making positive changes to yourself and you're not recognising how your actions affect others.

 

Make yourself a good partner to be around and reap the rewards of a healthy and calm relationship.

 

Well, I don't think it's exactly fair to say that the person telling is always being pushed there.

 

I think that in the OP's case it could be:

 

1) His problem with his own communication

2) He picks women who blast off, maybe he even likes that, who knows?

3) some kind of combination of both

OR 4) it is a fluke.

 

I mean, there's all kinds of people in the world. You know that someone has been divorced five times that actually DID all of the right stuff, but got totally hosed. Statistically that person exists.

[guest569]

I am not going to read too much into the male versus female behaviours as I believe that both men and women are unable to forget the past. In some cases, perhaps it is pettiness. But in most, I would say it is about self preservation. We remember the bad things because of how painful they were/are and become wary because we don't want it to be repeated. It is not a matter of "keeping score". If someone is still hurting from something that was said months or years ago, then it is not resolved, for whatever reason.

 

Even if we are able to forgive, it is possible to still feel pain at what was said or done. Popbradley, you are still able to recall in great detail the hurtful things that your ex has said and done. You've mentioned that you are sensitive, and also very forgiving. Great qualities, but can leave us quite vulnerable! I hope you don't mind me saying, but I think you are too forgiving. For example, when your girlfriend slapped you and you forgave her without hearing an apology. I am curious to know how and why were you able to forgive and move on from that so quickly.

 

 

My experience has been that many men won't actually address the actual issue that I am having.

 

If I day I am bothered about being nagged or annoyed by his rude behaviour, often a guy will get defensive, or even blow up and then try to just rug-sweep it.

 

My ex listened to me, but did not show any understanding because he became defensive. Although we would say "ok" and embrace and go and do the grocery shopping, it did not mean that I had forgotten the issue and was not concerned about our future together. He hadn't taken responsibility for his actions and he thought his behaviour was acceptable. He did not acknowledge my feelings. He believed that the issue was resolved and that he would continue hurting me in the same way (this has all become a lot clearer with hindsight). He believed that everything was great simply because we had not broken up. As the relationship went on, and his hurtful behaviour continued, I was certainly taking note. Not out of pettiness, out of concern that the relationship was not going to work. Eventually, after more of the same..there was the last straw.

 

It also had no correlation with the level of love that I have for him.

 

I have done a lot of research into the area and have seen countless times women usually fall out of love because they only think about the bad in the relationship and don't think about the good at all.

 

Example with my ex girlfriend from a few months back. She fell out of love with me and to this day never gave me a real solid reason why. I have found out on my own more than likely all the reasons why but that's not the point of this.

 

It is hard to believe that someone can fall out of love for no reason. But maybe it can't always be explained or quantified. I was never given a reason in 2 cases, but wracked my brains at the time and tried to fill in the blanks myself. It was not a very healthy exercise! So I have decided to just accept it if they don't love me, which takes time.. and carry on being the best person I can be.