Improbable Romance [UPDATE: Is "Stop" the Only Response?]

[CuriousQD]

So my story is on the similar side. I met my Frenchie on tinder. He was in the US for work and actually comes here about every 8 weeks for a week at a time. He told me he was 'looking for friends to show him around my city as he'd been coming here for a few months and wanted to do things with someone else.' He also told me that he was divorced and they shared custody of their two kids.

 

We had an amazing date. I kissed him first but he was def the leader with everything else. I did not sleep with him but close. He went home the next day and we continued to talk and talk and talk. He finally told me that he was not divorced, they were still very much together. Never married but together I think 15 years or so. He'd cheated on her 3 times that I know of (I later found out he lied about when the "stories" were. One was when his daughter was a newborn. He also lied about the kids' ages, I think so I wouldn't realize when the affairs were.) I got the whole kit and kaboodle- she's terrible and abusive to him and the kids, he's so deeply unhappy, he wants more from his life, they're not intimate (enough), etc etc and on and on. He and I had such an amazing connection. He literally could not have been sweeter, more loving (though he would never use that word, he used words as code for that) or more attentive. Given the time difference it's amazing that we managed to talk something like 15 hours a day.

 

We "broke up" once when the guilt felt too bad. And every time he would come here he would freak out after the first time we had sex. Then everything would be fine. I told myself that it was ok, he was leaving, she was terrible, etc. Even though the things he told me about her sounded like normal work/ life stress esp for someone with 2 kids and a selfish partner.

 

I ended up coming here when trying to find stories about people who's As worked out. Instead I found out how nothing that he said or did was original. I ended up pushing him for more, trying to get him to prove that it was real and special and not what everyone else pointed out. Well, that backfired. He felt pressured and the Fun Time American ended up being too much of a drag. We ended things last january. He did. Sorry, not we.

 

He came back this summer. We both had big birthdays a month apart and wrote to wish each other a good day. He came here right after mine, we spent the week together and slept together once. And he freaked out. Right on time. The next time was just making out but there was a lot of talking. He was trying to work on his relationship, he said. But he also said that he was not ruling out meeting someone else, just that he was trying really hard to make things better with his partner.

 

A month later they went on a 3 week vacation and she caught him using porn. The ***** hit the fan and he blocked me only to unblock me a day later. But it was over. I sort of lost it on him. I never heard from him again and blocked him on everything. I truly believe she may have found out about me or something to that effect. I don't think I will ever know.

 

In some ways, I miss him like crazy. It had been a VERY VERY VERY long time since I'd had sex and what felt like even longer that I'd met someone I liked who liked me back. Someone who made me feel as special and beautiful and cherished as he did. I thought I found a unicorn. He was smart and funny and so incredible looking and FRENCH. I never knew how hot a French accent was. Lol. I felt good for the first time in a long time....

 

Until I didn't. And boy did that feeling good switch dramatically. This experience broke me. BROKE ME. My self esteem is shot. I became someone that went against everything I stood for, I hurt people I didn't know and who didn't deserve it, I accepted crumbs, less than crumbs, from someone who tossed me off the second he was done with me. The last times I saw him he even backtracked on some of the sweet things he'd said to me. He even took back the things that made me feel good. Who does that? And who allows that? I have been trying so hard to get myself back but boy, it's not going so well. I still think of him often. I am sure he's back to life as usual and their good relationship (my therapist is convinced that their relationship is and always was just fine and he just wanted more more more, esp bc he was out of town. I know that I was his fun time, his time away from his life) and more than likely feels nothing about me or for me. That kills me. I am here in pieces and he is just fine.

 

I don't believe it's a French or European thing bc he also told me that she would kill both of us if she found out. I think it's a purely selfish aHole thing.

 

You ask if the only thing to do is stop. Of course not. There is such a thing as ethical non monogomy and polyamorous relationships. But that's not what this is. You're both hurting other people that you KNOW would be destroyed if they found out (or if they knew it was still going on). you know this because you've been through it. And, honestly, because you're here. If you weren't concerned about it you wouldn't have found this forum in the first place. You wouldn't have started more than one thread. It's just the truth. And I'm sorry for it. I wish that all of our As were different. That they all meant something and were unlike anything else ever. Yes, I know people who ended up marrying their AP and lived happily ever after. Well, one, I know one. And the people they hurt remain hurt to this day.

 

I know you're looking for validation and to be told it's ok to be selfish because like it short and you deserve to have your fun and damn everything else. I know, because I thought that and wanted that too. But the truth is as fun as this is now, it's going to be 100 times less fun when it ends.

 

Sorry for the long post. I haven't been on here in a very long time because it brings everything up for me. Clearly. Lol.

 

Wow, there must be a guidebook to affairs because our stories are so much alike! Thanks for sharing this with me! I'm struck by what your therapist told you: that they are doing fine, and all of this was lies for sex. Of course you know when you're in the middle of it, it doesn't feel that shallow even if it is. It feels very real. What do you think would happen if he came again and contacted you? And in the middle of it, did you think it was going to blossom into something more? I'm also struck about everyone else being hurt forever. That is unfair, and I think that is part of my problem too. Maybe this is some sick way of getting revenge for what happened to me. I've been too chicken to delve into that.

Edited January 24, 2017 by CuriousQD

[CuriousQD]

one thing caught my eye - continuing the A makes you feel empowered. WHY? what is i about this A that makes you feel empowered? breaking the rules, doing something naughty and forbidden...? why did you choose this A as a way to empower yourself? does it really make you feel more empowered...?

 

Finally putting myself first. Feeling attractive and desirable and the object of a mad, audacious hunt. Finally feeling visible and back in the game.

 

And all the other things you say are true.

[rainbowsandkittens]

well, I'm glad your AP bought your ticket so in case you change your mind about going (crossing my fingers) you won't lose any money.

 

What struck me about your trip is no just the going home at the end of the night, the rushing to the hospital (who knows if that was even true) and the declaration of love. He face timed you from the bathroom. He snuck into the bathroom to call you. Doesn't that strike you as gross? Especially if his wife fainted the night before? She faints and goes to the hospital and he goes out and whoops it up with his friends until 4 am. And then sneaks into the bathroom to chat with his girlfriend. Just think about his wife for a second. Can you imagine how that would feel? Esp since he was found out and swore he wouldn't do it anymore? What kind of a man does that?

 

I don't know what your thought is about his wife's statement. It seemed to me that she was saying that whatever you see in her husband she sees as well. And he's hers. They're already committed.

 

I don't know what I would do if he contacted me. I know he's been here since we stoped speaking. We stopped in august and he was supposed to come in September. I happened to check his twitter one long sad night and saw he had literally just gotten home from here. It broke my heart. I wanted him to miss me, to contact me. I wanted him to apologize to me. But it was never going to happen. The last time he was here he was even pulling away and doing things without me. So now he doesn't need me anymore. I think he must have been here in December too for the company holiday party. And maybe once more. Maybe not. I want to believe if he contacted me again I would tell him to go f himself and what a crappy person he is and how much I hate him. But I don't think I would. I am weak and, more than that; I am human.

 

Oh and yes, I did think it would be something more. We had the whole 'if only we met sooner/ when he was single' conversation. But he started backtracking at some point. He kept telling me he thought he was having a mid life crisis (side note: you know what's really fun? Being told you're someone's mid life crisis. Lucky me!) So it would waffle back and forth about what I thought would happen. But the nail in the coffin for us was right before Christmas I said that I was hoping we would keep moving forward instead of standing still. I could tell by his face that it was the wrong thing. He was sweet at Christmas and New Years Eve but the damage was done. I wanted something from him that he clearly was never going to give me.

 

I do think he'll have more affairs. I honestly think he's probably already got someone or is grooming someone. He needs the attention and adoration and to have an outlet to let out the steam of his frustration and disappointment of his life.

 

You're coming off the high of being with him. Nothing we say is going to damper those good sexy time feelings and the draw of him telling you he loves you. But revisit this in a week or two when things have time to settle. I think you'll feel differently.

[rainbowsandkittens]

One other thing: you asked if infidelity is really so wrong and if you stay in your lane is it really that bad? And the answer is yes. Because you're choosing for someone else. Maybe you don't care about cheating (which you do because you divorced your ex over it), maybe your AP doesn't either (clearly.). But his WIFE cares. She's the one who's getting screwed in all this. He'd said she would kill him if she found out. She did and she's staying. That is her choice. But he admitted how badly this has effected her (I'm sure whatever he told you is a gross understatement.). If you didn't have to lie and sneak around then I would say l, sure, stay in your lane. Who's it hurting. But you're lying and sneaking and his son is upset, his wife is hurt. And you can't just ignore that.

[minimariah]

Finally putting myself first. Feeling attractive and desirable and the object of a mad, audacious hunt. Finally feeling visible and back in the game.

 

fair enough!

 

I just don't know what he's getting out of it.

 

romance, as simple as that.

 

one thing i can't figure out - the A is SUPER... well, OUT THERE. friends and family know and no one seems to care... at all. there HAS to be something more to that.

[CuriousQD]

well, I'm glad your AP bought your ticket so in case you change your mind about going (crossing my fingers) you won't lose any money.

I've got a little more than two months to decide. Oddly enough, this will be the longest we gone without seeing each other since we met. It might do the trick to have this longer separation.

 

What struck me about your trip is no just the going home at the end of the night, the rushing to the hospital (who knows if that was even true) and the declaration of love. He face timed you from the bathroom. He snuck into the bathroom to call you. Doesn't that strike you as gross? Especially if his wife fainted the night before? She faints and goes to the hospital and he goes out and whoops it up with his friends until 4 am. And then sneaks into the bathroom to chat with his girlfriend.

I had a lot of doubts about that hospital visit, too. I suspect she made it up. On previous trips she has called him repeatedly, and I could hear her complaining that their son wouldn't sleep and he was waiting for Francois. The son is 14 and she was describing him like he was a baby. But because even the aunt, who is in her 80s went with them, I figured there was something to it. The bathroom thing would sound gross to most. I don't know how much you've read of my story, but this man's body is chiseled like a Greek god, and I constantly ask him to send me pictures, which he does, usually in the morning before showering for work. At the time, it wasn't unusual to get a call from him in the bathroom.

 

Just think about his wife for a second. Can you imagine how that would feel? Esp since he was found out and swore he wouldn't do it anymore? What kind of a man does that?

 

I don't have to imagine. I have been there. It's soul-destroying. I'm not 100 percent unaffected by this, but I'm choosing to elevate my feelings over hers. She will not lose anything she has. I don't want to take her husband and she never had his fidelity.

 

 

I don't know what your thought is about his wife's statement. It seemed to me that she was saying that whatever you see in her husband she sees as well. And he's hers. They're already committed.

 

That makes perfect sense.

 

I don't know what I would do if he contacted me. I know he's been here since we stoped speaking. We stopped in august and he was supposed to come in September. I happened to check his twitter one long sad night and saw he had literally just gotten home from here. It broke my heart. I wanted him to miss me, to contact me. I wanted him to apologize to me. But it was never going to happen. The last time he was here he was even pulling away and doing things without me. So now he doesn't need me anymore. I think he must have been here in December too for the company holiday party. And maybe once more. Maybe not. I want to believe if he contacted me again I would tell him to go f himself and what a crappy person he is and how much I hate him. But I don't think I would. I am weak and, more than that; I am human.

I totally understand. It's kinda what I'm talking about here. We advise other people to do things we ourselves don't have the strength to do were the AP to try to come back. I'm just choosing to enjoying whatever this is without the anger and resentment.

 

Oh and yes, I did think it would be something more. We had the whole 'if only we met sooner/ when he was single' conversation. But he started backtracking at some point. He kept telling me he thought he was having a mid life crisis (side note: you know what's really fun? Being told you're someone's mid life crisis. Lucky me!) So it would waffle back and forth about what I thought would happen. But the nail in the coffin for us was right before Christmas I said that I was hoping we would keep moving forward instead of standing still. I could tell by his face that it was the wrong thing. He was sweet at Christmas and New Years Eve but the damage was done. I wanted something from him that he clearly was never going to give me.

As you know, I can relate, but I've never entertained the thought of there being more. The one male skill I have is compartmentalization. He would not fit in my life in the States, and I wouldn't have the courage to tell anyone how it began. Only three girlfriends know about him at all and none of them know he's married. He's as much a side-show to me as I am to him, though I admit I love that crazy man, and I know this is insane, but I believed him when he said it to me. But the good part for you is that you realized that he couldn't give you what you wanted. Out of curiosity did he tell you he would break up with her?

 

I do think he'll have more affairs. I honestly think he's probably already got someone or is grooming someone. He needs the attention and adoration and to have an outlet to let out the steam of his frustration and disappointment of his life.

Interesting. I wouldn't be surprised if mine is in concurrent affairs. He's definitely got a big ego. He also told me he was an altar boy when he was little and was on his way to the priesthood, but women (he didn't say women - he said a body part) have always been his downfall. That's the closest I've gotten for true motivation for why he does this. One of my churchgoing male friends said his motivation was because he had this sense of entitlement, that it was unfair that he be limited to only one woman for the rest of his life.

 

You're coming off the high of being with him. Nothing we say is going to damper those good sexy time feelings and the draw of him telling you he loves you. But revisit this in a week or two when things have time to settle. I think you'll feel differently.

I didn't react strongly to the L-bomb, because I assumed he would have to do something big after the previous day's disappointment. He's flirted with it before, signing off with phrases like, "My love is with you always" and "It's all love." This was the first time he's said it directly. I will not risk being a fool and say that it's true love, but I believe his feelings run deeper than people here would suggest. There's enough action on his part to back it up. The hiatus this time just might do the trick. I'm also setting up a date for the weekend.

[CuriousQD]

One other thing: you asked if infidelity is really so wrong and if you stay in your lane is it really that bad? And the answer is yes. Because you're choosing for someone else. Maybe you don't care about cheating (which you do because you divorced your ex over it), maybe your AP doesn't either (clearly.). But his WIFE cares. She's the one who's getting screwed in all this. He'd said she would kill him if she found out. She did and she's staying. That is her choice. But he admitted how badly this has effected her (I'm sure whatever he told you is a gross understatement.). If you didn't have to lie and sneak around then I would say l, sure, stay in your lane. Who's it hurting. But you're lying and sneaking and his son is upset, his wife is hurt. And you can't just ignore that.

 

Funny you remind me of the thing that used to anger me the most in my divorce. It was that other people were deciding things for me. My life gets turned upside down and my whole identify gets changed because of other people's choices. It all seemed so unfair. You make a good point here.

 

And I know he wasn't giving the full story on his wife. He knew that this is why I divorced so he also knew I knew the story runs deeper than what he said.

 

So he doesn't wear a ring, and I thought he was not married the first time I went back there, and he introduced me to so many people in his life. At the very outset, I didn't think anything was being hidden. Now of course it's different, but it still doesn't feel very much like hiding because of how brazen he is. We walk hand in hand when out and his brother, aunt, friends and coworkers all know me. He was feeding and kissing me and carrying my purse within view of his wife's sister. Not sure I'll ever understand it all, but this is a very public affair.

[CuriousQD]

fair enough!

 

 

 

romance, as simple as that.

 

one thing i can't figure out - the A is SUPER... well, OUT THERE. friends and family know and no one seems to care... at all. there HAS to be something more to that.

 

Agreed. But what? I can see him getting an ego boost from it. I should mention he has said to me many times that he's very open with the people in his life (well, I guess everyone but his wife). We had some very interesting discussions about how he's raising his son to weigh in on things I don't think children should. For example, in that conversation when I asked him what his wife would do if she found out, he also said that his son would interrogate him about it and there'd be a family meeting and his son would help to make decisions about what to do. That's how they handle things. He told his aunt about the tablet and about my divorce, and his friends are very much in the loop about every detail of his life from his weight to what he eats for breakfast. It will sound crazy that the man who is having an affair is very transparent with his life, but it's sorta true in this case.

 

But I agree there's got to be more to it. Maybe someone he's had an affair with has threatened him physically in the past?

[minimariah]

Maybe someone he's had an affair with has threatened him physically in the past?

 

what do you mean...? not sure i understand.

 

it's odd, most definitely. maybe it's not his first A... so it's nothing new to his peeps. maybe it was his wife who had an A of her own? maybe the wife isn't close with his family & friends but then again... i assume HER SISTER would have her back? maybe EVERYONE is having an A of their own and are cool with it. i honestly have no idea, he's pretty much dating you out in the open. and his W, on the other hand, isn't cool with the A and is watching him like a hawk... which - to be honest - does seem like a stretch. if that is the case - how did he manage to steal time away from her? i mean, the BS would be suspicious even if he has his friends as cover --- right? it's super odd.

 

and i don't think it's about the culture. i've lived in France for three years and Frenchies aren't as accepting of adultery as folks seem to think they are. and yeah, i figured he is treating his son like an adult already... when i was 14, all i cared about was if Mark from down the street liked me... NO WAY would i even pay attention to what's going on between my parents. but yeah, that's his & the wife's parenting style - i'm not going to criticize that.

 

his behavior is interesting, for sure. and i do think he fell in love with you.

Edited January 24, 2017 by minimariah

[Poppy47]

This sounds, respectfully, like a great plot for a tv series.

 

I have never read anything quite like this on LS before.

Poppy.

[Darren Steez]

Seems to have made her choice.

 

Let her enjoy herself no one is going to tell her otherwise.

[angel.eyes]

Ha! I was wondering if someone was going to notice I never said I went to France, only that his family spoke French. (But the other part is that they live in an English-speaking country.). It is of course beside the point.

Ha ha! I was just struck by how everyone fixated on France even though some of your details wouldn't be found there. There are many places where men would speak French, and it's English-friendly for tourists, but not many where the men are such brazenly shameless, aggressive cheaters. That narrowed it down immediately. Plus it's a destination Americans would pick during the winter holidays, especially for weekend trips, and again, just some of the details in your descriptions. I'm sticking with islands like Dominica!

 

Now a little dose of reality since you seem determined to dive head first into an empty swimming pool...

 

My very first reaction to him was definitely that this is something he does with as many tourists as possible. If I had stopped it at that first encounter, it would have been just a great story because of how quickly and sharply it changed me. But I had to drag it out.

I'm not trying to minimize how special you feel right now, but unfortunately, you aren't the first tourist he ensnared and you certainly won't be the last. You're still excited. Understand that your story is as old as the hills. Change the names, the dates, a few trite, cheesy sweet nothings... This will end badly for you. As scarred and cynical as you sound from your first brush with infidelity, this will leave you in far worse shape. By the time he is done, you'll wonder what happened to "you."

 

For the record, there are men (and women) who choose to remain faithful and honor their commitments! In my experience, the vast majority do. The key is picking the right guy. Here, unfortunately, you let the wrong guy pick you! He saw low-hanging fruit with someone who wasnt in the best emotional shape, and he went in for the kill. He's no different than a predator eyeing the annual migration of prey until he spots a weak one in the herd who won't give much of a chase when he pounces. He was looking for an easy mark and unfortunately sensed one in you.

 

Affairs are like an addictive drug. The first hit is the best. After that you feel compelled to try and get that original rush back, all the while the quest destroys your life and the essence of who you are.

 

Think hard about how you felt during the Kindle incident when he got angry, focused on his family and largely was incommunicado with you. How about on this trip? You fly down to spend the weekend with him and Saturday he disappears, showing you exactly where you lie in his priorities. In an earlier post you mentioned you would stay with his aunt, and would just pay airfare on this trip. Yet there you were all alone in a hotel by yourself after he disappeared to be with his wife. Did you fly down to experience that? To spend a whole Friday evening/night being chaperoned by his boys? He came in his work clothes to get you because that's the only way he could hide that he was seeing you. His cover was work. His friends were there the whole evening because they were also his cover and his escape. Driving them home was his excuse to get away from you without any besotted mistress "drama" to spend the night. He went to spend the rest of his night alone at home with his wife. Remember, you aren't his first rodeo. He knows how to handle you and how to keep you wanting more as long as it suits his purposes. Hence the love bombing just before you left.

 

And honestly video-conferencing from their bathroom after he abandoned you for the key part of your trip? Probably while his wife is sleeping in their bed in the adjacent room? Come on now!!! Surely you can do way better than this tawdry sleaze! Granted Mr. "Can't Afford His Lunch" Isn't the answer, but these aren't your only two options!

 

You went for a three-day trip. How much of it did you actually spend alone with him, without his people hovering around in the background to help him manage his women?

 

You're still in fantasy-land, but reality will start to seep through slowly. Things will get worse...much worse than you can possibly imagine now. You're in fantasy land, and still blinded by his smooth words. His choices and actions though are already clear about where you stand in his life.

 

Right now you feel empowered? Alive? Within months, you'll be hanging around begging for a scrap from him. That feeling of empowerment? That sense of being desirable? Your self-esteem? You'll be shocked at how badly he eventually treats you now that it's clear that you're okay with playing second fiddle to an admitted serial cheater.

 

I wouldn't ever know how many others there are, but this last time I asked him in a roundabout way and got a better answer. Instead of asking if he had cheated before, I asked him had he ever been caught before, he said no, but had had lots of drama with other women in the past. Details in my next post. The only thing I would say is I am not looking to be his permanent anything.

 

This is no different than watching a drug addict who claims they're different from all the others, and they will control their use even as you watch them slowly destroy their life with their growing addiction. As outsiders, it's easy to see where your "same old, tired story" with the local player is going.

 

And on a dime, this experience has made me put myself first. It made me think about satisfying my needs, and I can't remember when I last thought about them. So I feel a huge self-esteem boost in this moment, and I'm not under any illusion that I can reform a cheater. What I don't know how to do is stop this: he's good to me (in every way), it's fun to get away from my life, the country is amazing, and I'm doing something that is thrilling beyond words.

Sorry, you aren't putting yourself first! That's not obvious to you right now, but in a few months, you'll start to understand that you put him first. Chasing after a cheater is not putting yourself first. Has he gotten on a plane to come see you? Get back to us on who ultimately pays for that ticket for your next trip in two months. It will be much like that hotel you weren't supposed to pay for this trip.

 

Eventually, you'll shock yourself with how low you'll sink to try and get any scrap of his attention. And unfortunately, when you think it can't get any worse or you can't sink any lower, you will. That self-esteem boost will prove illusive. This fantasy escape will end fairly abruptly for you...on his timeline of course, not yours. And yes, behind you stand a long line of damaged women who will be just as open to his charms and just as eager to stroke his ego and try out his island fantasy and chiseled abs. Lather, rinse, repeat. He'll be on to the next so quickly when your drama starts, that your head will spin.

 

...whatever this thing is, isn't built to last. I know that, how I will react when it's time -- don't know. It seems to me it behooves me to be better about building a relationship here so that I am the one who ends it.

Again, the illusion of managing your addiction so that you get all of the benefits without any negative consequences. Yes, that's all part of the fantasy. Numerous threads here. Pick any one of them for the reality you're about to face.

[Midwestmissy]

Can someone explain how half naked bathroom selfies are sexy? And maybe he's a hot young cheater and therefore a 'prize' but he's going to be an old shrivelled cheater in due time. I'll bet he's busy with other tourists on the weekends the OP isn't in town. This is like watching a dog run across the highway.

 

Again, trying to understand how bathroom chatting and pics are a thing. Where is the self respect in any of these participants?

[CuriousQD]

what do you mean...? not sure i understand.

 

it's odd, most definitely. maybe it's not his first A... so it's nothing new to his peeps. maybe it was his wife who had an A of her own? maybe the wife isn't close with his family & friends but then again... i assume HER SISTER would have her back? maybe EVERYONE is having an A of their own and are cool with it. i honestly have no idea, he's pretty much dating you out in the open. and his W, on the other hand, isn't cool with the A and is watching him like a hawk... which - to be honest - does seem like a stretch. if that is the case - how did he manage to steal time away from her? i mean, the BS would be suspicious even if he has his friends as cover --- right? it's super odd.

 

and i don't think it's about the culture. i've lived in France for three years and Frenchies aren't as accepting of adultery as folks seem to think they are. and yeah, i figured he is treating his son like an adult already... when i was 14, all i cared about was if Mark from down the street liked me... NO WAY would i even pay attention to what's going on between my parents. but yeah, that's his & the wife's parenting style - i'm not going to criticize that.

 

his behavior is interesting, for sure. and i do think he fell in love with you.

 

Leave it to me to think of a sinister motivation, but he alluded to having lots of drama with women in the past. Maybe having the friends around and knowing her is protection for him, just in case. That's a stretch. I really don't know.

 

Yeah, his parenting is unusual to my American senses. He says his son can drive his truck (a stick) too. I won't criticize it either.

 

Maybe this openness is a new form of adrenaline. Maybe he's had so many affairs that the usual way of doing things no longer provides enough excitement. But he could be risking my safety to get his kicks. Or maybe he's not as experienced as I think he is and he doesn't know what he's doing. Better to go to the source and ask. I'll let you know what I find out.

 

And there you go again encouraging me! I don't think this is just about sex for him, anymore at least, and he has developed strong-ish feelings for me.

[CuriousQD]

This sounds, respectfully, like a great plot for a tv series.

 

I have never read anything quite like this on LS before.

Poppy.

 

Ha! This is what my girlfriends tell me, that I should write this down. It's definitely going down as one of the most interesting experiences of my life. Wish I could see the ending now.

[rainbowsandkittens]

You can see the ending. You just don't want to.

 

I hate the low hanging fruit comment. Someone said that to me in a thread or I read it. Can't remember. But it stuck with me for months and is one of the things that messed me up the most. Thinking of one's self as low hanging fruit is soul destroying. Maybe true. But so damaging.

 

I didn't mean that the bathroom part was gross. I've been guilty of a bathroom selfie or 10 in my time.. I meant it was gross of him to hide in there to call you when his wife and son were in the other room and she'd just been in the hospital the day before. You pointed out what a good man he is for driving a friend to get his car or something of the sort. What about going out to 4 am with friends (one of which is his lover) after his wife was in the hospital. Still that same great guy?

 

As a note: my frenchie used to do the same thing- text me from the bathroom in the morning as soon as he got up and while he was getting ready for work. He liked to send me naked pictures and videos. What a lucky girl I was! But it also always struck me that he would do that until the kids and his partner woke up. Then he was family man. What a weird compartmentalization. Imagine if they found out....

[heartwhole]

This made me think of the questions you're asking. The Mistresses' Affair Rules ~ Infidelity Help Group

[CuriousQD]

Ha ha! I was just struck by how everyone fixated on France even though some of your details wouldn't be found there. There are many places where men would speak French, and it's English-friendly for tourists, but not many where the men are such brazenly shameless, aggressive cheaters. That narrowed it down immediately. Plus it's a destination Americans would pick during the winter holidays, especially for weekend trips, and again, just some of the details in your descriptions. I'm sticking with islands like Dominica!

 

Now a little dose of reality since you seem determined to dive head first into an empty swimming pool...

 

 

I'm not trying to minimize how special you feel right now, but unfortunately, you aren't the first tourist he ensnared and you certainly won't be the last. You're still excited. Understand that your story is as old as the hills. Change the names, the dates, a few trite, cheesy sweet nothings... This will end badly for you. As scarred and cynical as you sound from your first brush with infidelity, this will leave you in far worse shape. By the time he is done, you'll wonder what happened to "you."

 

For the record, there are men (and women) who choose to remain faithful and honor their commitments! In my experience, the vast majority do. The key is picking the right guy. Here, unfortunately, you let the wrong guy pick you! He saw low-hanging fruit with someone who wasnt in the best emotional shape, and he went in for the kill. He's no different than a predator eyeing the annual migration of prey until he spots a weak one in the herd who won't give much of a chase when he pounces. He was looking for an easy mark and unfortunately sensed one in you.

 

Affairs are like an addictive drug. The first hit is the best. After that you feel compelled to try and get that original rush back, all the while the quest destroys your life and the essence of who you are.

 

Think hard about how you felt during the Kindle incident when he got angry, focused on his family and largely was incommunicado with you. How about on this trip? You fly down to spend the weekend with him and Saturday he disappears, showing you exactly where you lie in his priorities. In an earlier post you mentioned you would stay with his aunt, and would just pay airfare on this trip. Yet there you were all alone in a hotel by yourself after he disappeared to be with his wife. Did you fly down to experience that? To spend a whole Friday evening/night being chaperoned by his boys? He came in his work clothes to get you because that's the only way he could hide that he was seeing you. His cover was work. His friends were there the whole evening because they were also his cover and his escape. Driving them home was his excuse to get away from you without any besotted mistress "drama" to spend the night. He went to spend the rest of his night alone at home with his wife. Remember, you aren't his first rodeo. He knows how to handle you and how to keep you wanting more as long as it suits his purposes. Hence the love bombing just before you left.

 

And honestly video-conferencing from their bathroom after he abandoned you for the key part of your trip? Probably while his wife is sleeping in their bed in the adjacent room? Come on now!!! Surely you can do way better than this tawdry sleaze! Granted Mr. "Can't Afford His Lunch" Isn't the answer, but these aren't your only two options!

 

You went for a three-day trip. How much of it did you actually spend alone with him, without his people hovering around in the background to help him manage his women?

 

You're still in fantasy-land, but reality will start to seep through slowly. Things will get worse...much worse than you can possibly imagine now. You're in fantasy land, and still blinded by his smooth words. His choices and actions though are already clear about where you stand in his life.

 

Right now you feel empowered? Alive? Within months, you'll be hanging around begging for a scrap from him. That feeling of empowerment? That sense of being desirable? Your self-esteem? You'll be shocked at how badly he eventually treats you now that it's clear that you're okay with playing second fiddle to an admitted serial cheater.

 

 

 

This is no different than watching a drug addict who claims they're different from all the others, and they will control their use even as you watch them slowly destroy their life with their growing addiction. As outsiders, it's easy to see where your "same old, tired story" with the local player is going.

 

 

Sorry, you aren't putting yourself first! That's not obvious to you right now, but in a few months, you'll start to understand that you put him first. Chasing after a cheater is not putting yourself first. Has he gotten on a plane to come see you? Get back to us on who ultimately pays for that ticket for your next trip in two months. It will be much like that hotel you weren't supposed to pay for this trip.

 

Eventually, you'll shock yourself with how low you'll sink to try and get any scrap of his attention. And unfortunately, when you think it can't get any worse or you can't sink any lower, you will. That self-esteem boost will prove illusive. This fantasy escape will end fairly abruptly for you...on his timeline of course, not yours. And yes, behind you stand a long line of damaged women who will be just as open to his charms and just as eager to stroke his ego and try out his island fantasy and chiseled abs. Lather, rinse, repeat. He'll be on to the next so quickly when your drama starts, that your head will spin.

 

 

Again, the illusion of managing your addiction so that you get all of the benefits without any negative consequences. Yes, that's all part of the fantasy. Numerous threads here. Pick any one of them for the reality you're about to face.

 

This is so heavy. Where do I start?

 

So this did not happen in Dominica. LOL, I visited there many years ago and I understand they speak Creole there, but no, this is a pure French speaking family living in another country. And this country is not known for having a lot of French speaking people there, but there is a surprisingly large contingent of them. They seem to stick together. I'd love to know the history of how that came to be.

 

And thank you for the foul-tasting dose of reality. I don't think I can argue that you don't speak the truth, but I insist there are feelings involved. Not that they mean that much in the long run.

 

We are all in agreement that this will end, and there is a risk of it ending badly. No one here seems to take me seriously when I say I'm working on another relationship. I really am taking notes and trying to minimize the damage of the end. Truly. I could be doing better and be more enthusiastic about it, but I'm really, really trying. Every day.

 

I didn't want to complicate the story, but I have a really good man in my life who has made it clear that he wants to marry me. We dated briefly after my divorce. It's a whole other thread on why it didn't work out but we remain friends. Total truth, I am not physically attracted to him, and his not an alpha male. He has children who are younger than mine, and although he is a super terrific dad, I am not super keen on being the Brady bunch, taking care of six kids and being a party of eight. But I am trying to use my intellect. I know deep down in his bones, he is a person of integrity and I should give him another chance. So every day, I talk to him. I've flaked on him a 1000 times when he's asked to see me, but he knows my weakness is travel. He's originally from Boston and he asked me to go with him in May for a friend's birthday party. I might go. And there is another person who could work out, who I think is cute, but he is never married and childless. I know they are not the only two men on the planet, so I keep slowly, but surely opening myself up to more.

 

I did feel awful when I didn't hear from him very much during Tabletgate, and when my Saturday night disappeared. I had for the record gone back and forth between his house site and the aunt. I'm not sure what else could have been done, given the circumstances. I chose this, so I chose to deal with these issues as they arise. (I even got a lipstick pepper spray on Amazon--just in case. Girl Scout ) It didn't feel good, and should these things continue, I'll know, thanks to you all, that I'm on that slippery downward slope and it's time to get off this ride.

 

I also chose not to stay with his aunt, and it's complicated why. For one, although she is one of the greatest cooks this side of heaven, she is also very much still a grieving widow, who just spent her first Christmas without her husband. She can taaaaalllllkkk, hours on end about people and things I know nothing about. I am also a natural recluse and need a certain amount of alone time. I felt I would be more comfortable on my own. Totally my decision, so I paid for it. The other part is I had reached out to those friends of my girlfriend the previous time I was there and Francois did not like that at all because two are guys. I assured him they are younger than I am and I have zero interest in playing cougar, but he threw a little a fit over it. I knew there was a chance I'd have some downtime without Francois, so being the girl scout, I asked them to leave room in their weekend for me this time. I couldn't have them come get me at the aunt's house. See, I am decent at predicting problems and making contingency plans. But yeah, this is a lot of work for a light and carefree affair.

 

I need more time to process how I am not putting myself first and I am behaving like an addict. I trust, very much, that you can see things I can't, so I'm listening and learning.

[freengreen]

Stop. short answer

 

long answer

 

sssttttooooooopppppp!

[CuriousQD]

Can someone explain how half naked bathroom selfies are sexy? And maybe he's a hot young cheater and therefore a 'prize' but he's going to be an old shrivelled cheater in due time. I'll bet he's busy with other tourists on the weekends the OP isn't in town. This is like watching a dog run across the highway.

 

Again, trying to understand how bathroom chatting and pics are a thing. Where is the self respect in any of these participants?

 

Probably makes no sense, but bathroom selfies are definitely a thing. I've taken many of them myself. It's the big mirror and lighting and the closed door so no one can see you do such a silly thing. To each his own.

[CuriousQD]

You can see the ending. You just don't want to.

 

I hate the low hanging fruit comment. Someone said that to me in a thread or I read it. Can't remember. But it stuck with me for months and is one of the things that messed me up the most. Thinking of one's self as low hanging fruit is soul destroying. Maybe true. But so damaging.

 

I didn't mean that the bathroom part was gross. I've been guilty of a bathroom selfie or 10 in my time.. I meant it was gross of him to hide in there to call you when his wife and son were in the other room and she'd just been in the hospital the day before. You pointed out what a good man he is for driving a friend to get his car or something of the sort. What about going out to 4 am with friends (one of which is his lover) after his wife was in the hospital. Still that same great guy?

 

As a note: my frenchie used to do the same thing- text me from the bathroom in the morning as soon as he got up and while he was getting ready for work. He liked to send me naked pictures and videos. What a lucky girl I was! But it also always struck me that he would do that until the kids and his partner woke up. Then he was family man. What a weird compartmentalization. Imagine if they found out....

 

Yeah, the low-hanging fruit comment is affecting me too. It's hard to imagine that feeling this good is really being perceived as desperate and having low self-esteem. I'm not going to argue it, but I need to figure it out.

 

So the festival was Friday night, so that was before the hospital visit. I don't have an adjective. I'm trying to be realistic about it all. What could he do? What would I have done? I can never fault him for taking care of his family, and I won't resist when he takes care of me.

 

Yep on the routine. My ex had a similar one. I could never figure out how he spent so much time talking with her considering how much I talked with him during the day. He used his morning and evening commutes to do it. They figure out a way. But...if anyone is trying to get me to be angry that he tries to be respectful of his wife while he is in her presence, I can't figure that out. Should he contact me in front of her? I am always acutely aware that we are engaged in an affair.

[CuriousQD]

This made me think of the questions you're asking. The Mistresses' Affair Rules ~ Infidelity Help Group

 

Wow, that was good. That read me like a book. If there was any doubt left that all of this is tried and true territory, it has now been erased. Except for maybe why he's so open about everything. Thanks for sharing that.

[CuriousQD]

Stop. short answer

 

long answer

 

sssttttooooooopppppp!

 

I will. It's inevitable.

[rainbowsandkittens]

Here's the thought I had while getting ready this morning (and forgive me if it's been said already): Do you think this is empowering not because you're getting your mojo back but because you're in the position that your husband's OW was in? Before you were the victim, the helpless wife who had this all thrust on her. In some ways I'm sure you felt that both your Ex and his AP had all the power. Now the tables are turned and that's you. Which both gives you the feeling of power and the ability to turn your back on his wife- since you probably in some way see her as weak and less than.

 

Maybe? If this is the case then I would spend some time thinking about if that's truly empowering or something else.

 

Just a thought.

[anika99]

I didn't want to complicate the story, but I have a really good man in my life who has made it clear that he wants to marry me. We dated briefly after my divorce. It's a whole other thread on why it didn't work out but we remain friends. Total truth, I am not physically attracted to him, and his not an alpha male. He has children who are younger than mine, and although he is a super terrific dad, I am not super keen on being the Brady bunch, taking care of six kids and being a party of eight. But I am trying to use my intellect. I know deep down in his bones, he is a person of integrity and I should give him another chance. So every day, I talk to him. I've flaked on him a 1000 times when he's asked to see me, but he knows my weakness is travel. He's originally from Boston and he asked me to go with him in May for a friend's birthday party. I might go. And there is another person who could work out, who I think is cute, but he is never married and childless. I know they are not the only two men on the planet, so I keep slowly, but surely opening myself up to more.

 

No,no,no. It's a terrible idea to try to make yourself become attracted to someone you are not physically attracted to. It's just as much a waste of time as seeing a married man and it ends with people being hurt. You need to be honest with that friend and let him know that there is no chance of the friendship turning into more. You are disrespecting so many people including yourself. Your friend deserves someone who likes him and who is madly attracted to him. You deserve someone you find physically attractive and who is not married. You are not being an authentic person, you are doing a lot of rationalizing and telling yourself lies to justify disrespecting yourself and others. You are not putting yourself first. How exactly is spending time alone in a hotel waiting on a taken man and time talking with a man you are not even attracted to putting yourself first. If you were putting yourself first both of those options would be distasteful to you.