Alpha, beta ?

[wmacbride]

Do you really agree with the way some categorize men into "alpha" "beta" , etc.? ( is there such a thing as "gamma", "delta" " epsilon "men?)

 

To me, it sounds like a load of crap, and it's also lazy. While I can't clam to be any sort of expert on men, there are very few I have met who can so easily be stuck into a category. Most that I have met are a blend of these "types".

 

To me, it sounds lazy to just put men into different boxes, and it's also unfair to them.

[Wade Lamare]

Do you really agree with the way some categorize men into "alpha" "beta" , etc.? ( is there such a thing as "gamma", "delta" " epsilon "men?)

 

To me, it sounds like a load of crap, and it's also lazy. While I can't clam to be any sort of expert on men, there are very few I have met who can so easily be stuck into a category. Most that I have met are a blend of these "types".

 

To me, it sounds lazy to just put men into different boxes, and it's also unfair to them.

 

Yes, it's crap.

 

Also, which alpha beta? Different proponents of the ideology seem to have different ideas of what they actually mean. Athol Kay probably has the most simple outlook on this. There are, to him Alpha characteristics and Beta characteristics and women only get proper horny for a guy who displays alpha characteristics. Beta stuff is being nurturing, home building, parenting, helping support the family etc. and that apparently doesn't make her want to ride her man like Sea Biscuit.

 

To give Athol his due he does mention that a man in a good relationship would be a good mix of various traits.

 

Other proponents have all other layers of Greek letters, for some Alpha is the top dog, the business leader. Beta is in fact simply (to them) a step down from alpha, still a very desirable man nevertheless, their scorn is reserved for the epsilons, deltas etc. They do however also include gammas who buck the trend. They are not identifiable as alpha or beta but are lone wolves who confuse alphas as women get weak kneed around them.

[Haydn]

Right i`m off to the shed to saw a piece of wood in half.

[Wade Lamare]

I think that all too often beta is confused with doormat. In my experience women can relate to so called beta traits but not to a doormat

 

In Athol Kay's work men are told that the reason their wives strayed or are no longer interested in sex is because they became betaised. It obviously wasn't their fault, society has a nasty betaising ray which it uses on men. They obviously miss the point that many 'alpha' men also have their wives stray.

 

They are then told to up the alpha.

 

Exercise, lose the gut, broaden the chest, dress well, be decisive, get a good career, change things up from time to time, mean what you say and say what you mean etc. etc.

 

 

So it turns out that most women (not all) like their men to be trim with a good male figure, well dressed, decisive, able to help provide for a family and fun.

Rather than fat, lazy, a slacker at work, eat pizza, burgers and chug beer while playing WOW to stupid o' clock in the morning. Then, once a fortnight, roll on top of their wives, two minutes later ejaculate, fart and go to sleep.

 

Well hit me upside the head with the 'gosh I'm surprised' stick.

 

And some men need a book to tell them that?

[wmacbride]

I think that all too often beta is confused with doormat. In my experience women can relate to so called beta traits but not to a doormat

 

In Athol Kay's work men are told that the reason their wives strayed or are no longer interested in sex is because they became betaised. It obviously wasn't their fault, society has a nasty betaising ray which it uses on men. They obviously miss the point that many 'alpha' men also have their wives stray.

 

They are then told to up the alpha.

 

Exercise, lose the gut, broaden the chest, dress well, be decisive, get a good career, change things up from time to time, mean what you say and say what you mean etc. etc.

 

 

So it turns out that most women (not all) like their men to be trim with a good male figure, well dressed, decisive, able to help provide for a family and fun.

Rather than fat, lazy, a slacker at work, eat pizza, burgers and chug beer while playing WOW to stupid o' clock in the morning. Then, once a fortnight, roll on top of their wives, two minutes later ejaculate, fart and go to sleep.

 

Well hit me upside the head with the 'gosh I'm surprised' stick.

 

And some men need a book to tell them that?

 

I don't see how one is alpha and the other is beta. the guy who works hard, dressed well and is a leader in the workplace ( which are supposed to be "alpha" traits) can also be a great dad, caring spouse and helpful human being.

 

It sounds like a load of bunk to me, and it's also a very lazy way of looking at people- designed to do little more than sell books, podcasts, web page views, etc.

 

btw, what about women? Does this theory also indicate that there are are there also alpha, beta, gamma, delta,epsilon etc. women?

[Whoknew30]

I don't see how one is alpha and the other is beta. the guy who works hard, dressed well and is a leader in the workplace ( which are supposed to be "alpha" traits) can also be a great dad, caring spouse and helpful human being.

 

It sounds like a load of bunk to me, and it's also a very lazy way of looking at people- designed to do little more than sell books, podcasts, web page views, etc.

 

btw, what about women? Does this theory also indicate that there are are there also alpha, beta, gamma, delta,epsilon etc. women?

 

Yes, it pertains to women too. Alpha/beta isn't based on either type not being able to show traits of the other...it's based on what traits are more dominant.

 

I'm a Alpha, always, in pretty much every situation just bc that's my personality. My H is a Alpha at work & anything he does out of the house pertaining to men but when it comes to our relationship, he's beta all the way.

 

Alpha's are usually natural leaders that take charge of their situations & betas usually are the ones that more so follow direction. There isn't anything wrong with being either way as long as it's healthy for the individual.

[Satu]

Its pure nonsense, dreamt up by the largely defunct Behaviourist Psychology school, of the last century.

 

 

"While behaviourists often accept the existence of cognitions and emotions, they prefer not to study them as only observable (i.e. external) behavior can be objectively and scientifically measured.

 

 

"Therefore, internal events, such as thinking should be explained through behavioural terms (or eliminated altogether)."

 

There's no fundamental (qualitative) distinction between human and animal behavior.

 

Therefore, research can be carried out on animals as well as humans (i.e. comparative psychology.

 

Consequently, rats and pigeons became the primary source of data for behaviourists, as their environments could be easily controlled."

 

Source

 

Take care.

Edited December 3, 2016 by Satu

[Haydn]

I`d never label myself.

 

I`m a cracking bloke.

 

Alpha, Beta? Means nothing to me. (Could be Greek, i suppose)

 

Apart from the one time i took to wearing an eye patch....

 

whilst having one toothpick, provocatively hanging from my lips

 

and using grunting noises when addressed.

[Wade Lamare]

I don't see how one is alpha and the other is beta. the guy who works hard, dressed well and is a leader in the workplace ( which are supposed to be "alpha" traits) can also be a great dad, caring spouse and helpful human being.

 

It sounds like a load of bunk to me, and it's also a very lazy way of looking at people- designed to do little more than sell books, podcasts, web page views, etc.

 

btw, what about women? Does this theory also indicate that there are are there also alpha, beta, gamma, delta,epsilon etc. women?

 

Women? No they are meant to merely gaze wonderingly at their men and say "gosh, you're so alpha."

 

It is largely bunk. The characteristics have been listed as alpha or beta on an arbitrary basis.

As you mention in your first post, most peeps are a mixture of traits. This mixture of traits, alpha, beta or whatever else you want to call them, is what makes up the complete person.

 

I've had this convo with my wife several years back. She asked me not to try and become more 'alpha' as she was so done with that rubbish having been burnt by so called alpha guys in the past. She felt used and abused by these guys. I assured her I had no intention of dong so, I was merely interested in understanding the concept.

 

My wife calls me her 'Balpha cocky cook'.

 

Her ideal mix of beta and alpha, cocky because.... and cook because I enjoy cooking for her.

[Weezy1973]

It doesn't fit with human sexuality, but in other species, the alpha male is the male the gets to have sex with all the women. So people use the term very loosely when applying it to human sexuality. And people don't really fit into such categories...

[Wade Lamare]

In general, not always, there are outliers, the men regarded as Alpha males are tall, handsome, wealthy or famous.

They are confident go getters, and women fall at the feet of their mighty alphaness.

 

Well duh! It's rather easy to be regarded as alpha when all the advantages of life are laid out for you.

It's a bit like Superman, it's rather easy to be a superhero when you are all but invincible.

 

I'll almost guarantee you that if you took a short, mousy, timid and plain 'beta' guy, stretched him to 6' 2", gave him plastic surgery to make him look handsome, within a few years he'd be an alpha badass too.

[wmacbride]

I`d never label myself.

 

I`m a cracking bloke.

 

Alpha, Beta? Means nothing to me. (Could be Greek, i suppose)

 

Apart from the one time i took to wearing an eye patch....

 

whilst having one toothpick, provocatively hanging from my lips

 

and using grunting noises when addressed.

 

So far, all that the theory has done for me is give me a chance to actually use my very limited knowledge of the Greek alphabet- my brother always teased me for trying to learn it when I wad a kid...- yes, I'm a big nerd)

 

Just my observation, but it sounds to me like the stereotypical 'alpha" male type appeals more to other men than women, especially over the long term.

I mean if there are two movies being released and one is all about a guy who would be considered by some to be "beta" and one who is 'alpha", which one will the majority of men want to watch more? What about the women? ( think "rambo" vs. " love story" - sorry for the examples, as I don't watch a lot of movies:laugh:)

[Haydn]

So far, all that the theory has done for me is give me a chance to actually use my very limited knowledge of the Greek alphabet- my brother always teased me for trying to learn it when I wad a kid...- yes, I'm a big nerd)

 

Just my observation, but it sounds to me like the stereotypical 'alpha" male type appeals more to other men than women, especially over the long term.

I mean if there are two movies being released and one is all about a guy who would be considered by some to be "beta" and one who is 'alpha", which one will the majority of men want to watch more? What about the women? ( think "rambo" vs. " love story" - sorry for the examples, as I don't watch a lot of movies:laugh:)

 

 

I don`t have a theory.

 

But Downton Abby?

 

`Just put a wardrobe together with my replica Swiss army knife`

[jen1447]

The problem w the alpha/beta thing is definition of terms - everyone has their own little pet definition of what these things supposedly mean that fits their personal experiential paradigm, and no one ever means the same thing by it. So bc of that it's a largely pointless discussion, at least until you could actually define those traits universally.

 

If a beta male to me is a guy who makes less than $75,000 a year and a beta male to you is a guy who lets you order off the menu for him, we're just talking past each other and any mutual determinations will be coincidental and meaningless.

[dreamingoftigers]

I think that all too often beta is confused with doormat. In my experience women can relate to so called beta traits but not to a doormat

 

In Athol Kay's work men are told that the reason their wives strayed or are no longer interested in sex is because they became betaised. It obviously wasn't their fault, society has a nasty betaising ray which it uses on men. They obviously miss the point that many 'alpha' men also have their wives stray.

 

They are then told to up the alpha.

 

Exercise, lose the gut, broaden the chest, dress well, be decisive, get a good career, change things up from time to time, mean what you say and say what you mean etc. etc.

 

 

So it turns out that most women (not all) like their men to be trim with a good male figure, well dressed, decisive, able to help provide for a family and fun.

Rather than fat, lazy, a slacker at work, eat pizza, burgers and chug beer while playing WOW to stupid o' clock in the morning. Then, once a fortnight, roll on top of their wives, two minutes later ejaculate, fart and go to sleep.

 

Well hit me upside the head with the 'gosh I'm surprised' stick.

 

And some men need a book to tell them that?

 

Seems like Beta may be synonymous with "not giving a F."

 

Which really isn't "Beta."

 

I like man that would be more often considered "Beta."

 

I don't like the whole "plant in it six million women" idea that many of these so-called "Alphas" are after.

[basil67]

Those who use the terms Alpha and Beta seem to be men who have social skills which are inadequate for dating.

 

If I heard a new or potential date banging on about being Alpha, I would not date him further.

[wmacbride]

The problem w the alpha/beta thing is definition of terms - everyone has their own little pet definition of what these things supposedly mean that fits their personal experiential paradigm, and no one ever means the same thing by it. So bc of that it's a largely pointless discussion, at least until you could actually define those traits universally.

 

If a beta male to me is a guy who makes less than $75,000 a year and a beta male to you is a guy who lets you order off the menu for him, we're just talking past each other and any mutual determinations will be coincidental and meaningless.

 

I asked in a previous post if there is such a thing as an alpha woman...

 

If there is, I';m guessing she's like Roseanne

[wmacbride]

Seems like Beta may be synonymous with "not giving a F."

 

Which really isn't "Beta."

 

I like man that would be more often considered "Beta."

 

I don't like the whole "plant in it six million women" idea that many of these so-called "Alphas" are after.

 

hmmmm....the six million woman man...is he anything like the Six Million Dollar man? If so,i don't want to know what parts of him have been replaced by robotic technology

[PrettyEmily77]

IRL, I've never met any guy describing himself in those terms, I've never discussed the potential virtues or deficiencies of 'alphas' / 'betas' or whatever with any of my female friends, and have only really come across that type of terminology online.

 

Seems to bring comfort, soothing and a bit of an ego boost to people who like to label each other or themselves - which is harmless, I suppose, if they need that sort of validation.

 

Other than that, totally pointless tosh to me.

[Shining One]

I only see the Alpha/Beta discussion online. Typically, it goes like this:

 

Women referring to Alphas: Men who posses the specific traits I find attractive

Women referring to Betas: Men who posses traits I find unattractive

Men referring to Alphas: Me

Men referring to Betas: Not Me

[central]

Sure, it's lazy, as most people not just one thing.

 

Of course, you're premise also means that it's crap to label people male, female, Democrat, Republican, straight, gay, good, bad, lawful, criminal, jerk, compassionate, etc.

 

But, these things are convenient shortcuts that convey useful information, as long as you realize they aren't fully defining and that they are changeable.

[basil67]

Sure, it's lazy, as most people not just one thing.

 

Of course, you're premise also means that it's crap to label people male, female, Democrat, Republican, straight, gay, good, bad, lawful, criminal, jerk, compassionate, etc.

 

But, these things are convenient shortcuts that convey useful information, as long as you realize they aren't fully defining and that they are changeable.

 

All the those labels have generally accepted definitions and can convey a real meaning. Unlike Alpha and Beta which have so many different interpretations as to render them meaningless. I don't even think that Alpha and Beta is a thing.

[thefooloftheyear]

It's absolutely real, and while it may be more prevalent in males, there are also Alpha females..

 

Anyone who says otherwise is kidding themselves...

 

And while women generally look favorably upon Alpha males, it really isn't even about that...or sex...

 

I can list a lot of unique ways that people act around an Alpha...and if you are one, you will know what I mean, if you aren't you will have no idea what I am talking about...

 

TFY

[basil67]

It's absolutely real, and while it may be more prevalent in males, there are also Alpha females..

 

Anyone who says otherwise is kidding themselves...

 

And while women generally look favorably upon Alpha males, it really isn't even about that...or sex...

 

I can list a lot of unique ways that people act around an Alpha...and if you are one, you will know what I mean, if you aren't you will have no idea what I am talking about...

 

TFY

 

But nobody seems to agree on what it actually is - and that's why I don't agree that it's a thing. I'd be surprised if we could reach a consensus.

 

The only Alpha which I do agree with is in the animal kingdom where the strongest male will drive away all the weaker males so that he can be king of the pride. But humans don't do that.

[thefooloftheyear]

But nobody seems to agree on what it actually is - and that's why I don't agree that it's a thing. I'd be surprised if we could reach a consensus.

 

The only Alpha which I do agree with is in the animal kingdom where the strongest male will drive away all the weaker males so that he can be king of the pride. But humans don't do that.

 

It doesn't have to be defined...but it's 100% real....And the reason most people don't believe it exists is that they have never and will never experience it...

 

And there is no other logical explanation...

 

TFY