Sociopaths

[imsosad]

I would add that a jerk is often just a jerk, with very obvious behavior.

A sociopath/psychopath will often go undercover as a "good guy" and that is where it gets so confusing. He will have the appearance of the perfect guy for you. He will be kind, considerate, romantic. He will be your dream come true. Jerks don't bother to do that, they're more outright in their behavior.

| see it as very much connected to Midnight's litmus test. The socio/psychopath gets under your skin and in to your mind because there is such a gap between what is presented to you and what it actually going on.

[gettingstronger]

When labeling someone, is it based on how they treated you (the end of an affair, etc) or a pattern you see in their lives and behaviors?

[Survivor12]

How would you define a "jerk"? I meant is a sociopath not a jerk?

 

I knew the differences between the three disorders. Thanks,

 

Poppy

 

Yes, a sociopath is most often a "jerk", but a jerk is not necessarily a sociopath.

 

Just like a "psycho" is generally emotional, but being emotional doesn't mean that someone is "psycho".

[MidnightBlue1980]

How would you define a "jerk"? I meant is a sociopath not a jerk?

 

I knew the differences between the three disorders. Thanks,

 

Poppy

 

A jerk is also known as an ahole, a guy who generally is not trying to hide the fact that he is who he is. He typically thinks a lot of himself and does not lovebomb you as it would not occur to him to have to fool you as he thinks he is pretty wonderful, and why would you NOT want him? He is really not a liar or a user, but if you allow it, he will definitely use you. But he won't make promises he can't keep or say he loves you if he doesn't, as he actually does respect women, he just likes to have his fun and as long as you are game, it's all good.

 

Some examples from my own life: I dated this guy before I met my husband. We met online. We hung out a lot for a month. I slept with him and I thought it was going well. He never said he loved me, no future plans or any of that stuff, but I thought he liked me, he acted like he did. We had a date during the week and I mentioned I had rescheduled plans with my friends to see him and he got "that look", you know the look when you just know you are about to be dumped? He said I shouldn't change plans for him but he still brought me home with him and made a date for that weekend, only to stand me up and not answer my calls. That was a real d*ck move, he was a big jerk, why make the last date with me? I never got that part. I got over him in 5 hours. Not a sociopath. He got a nasty email though.

 

Another example, I have a friend who is a client. The guy is always trying to sleep with me. He even knows about all the stuff I went through with xmm. He knows him. When he found out, this guy said that I really hurt his self confidence because now he doubted if he was really as good looking as he thought he was. The guy is so obnoxious that it is hysterical. He tells me that he is actually a good guy because he is not lying to me or other women, pretending to love me, he really just wants sex. I just text him back to not hit on his friends; I'm good, thanks; I'm married, not interested. He's unbelievable but not a sociopath.

 

A sociopath takes the time and effort to slowly work on you, they flatter you, typically say they will love you forever, they are pathological liars, they plot and plan with the sole intention of using you and they have no remorse about it. They do not see other people are human beings, merely as pawns for their enjoyment. And when they discard you, you are so hooked, it can take years to get over them.

[RecentChange]

How would you define a "jerk"? I meant is a sociopath not a jerk?

 

I knew the differences between the three disorders. Thanks,

 

Poppy

 

Jerk isn't a medical term, Webster's says the informal use is "a contemptibly obnoxious person"

 

I don't know what you are searching for. Does it make things different if a person has a medically defined personality defect, or is just a conventional jerk?

 

Honestly, I think I have some sociopathic tendencies.

 

These things are black and white, a yes or no, but rather a sliding scale. All of us fall somewhere on the spectrum - from the extremely empathetic who have a hard time coping in the world given their sensitivity, to the abhorrent psychopath who leaves destruction in their wake.

 

What we can do, os open our eyes and recognize patterns of behavior and use that information to make decisions about who we welcome into our lives.

[Samhain]

Quite a few women here who are labeling their ex MM as a narcissist/sociopath, when an affair ends and they are no longer of any use to him.

 

I don't think it's so easy to diagnose someone with such personality disorders.

 

If you think about it, when you enter into an affair with a married man you are beginning a relationship with somebody who you are well aware is going home to his wife and playing "mr nice guy" while lying daily to her face and hiding an entire other life from his family. You do it willingly and ignore the obvious selfishness of such a person because you're getting what you want also.

 

So why would it be shocking that this same person would then discard your feelings when he tires of you?

 

I can't help but wonder if an affair partner often feels more comfortable pinning personality disorder labels onto their ex cheater because it makes it easier for them to feel they are less to blame for entering into such a dishonest relationship when it all goes pear shaped, and the MM/W shows them the same face they have been showing their spouses. All with their AP's full knowledge.

[FortyandForlorn]

Jerk isn't a medical term, Webster's says the informal use is "a contemptibly obnoxious person"

 

I don't know what you are searching for. Does it make things different if a person has a medically defined personality defect, or is just a conventional jerk?

 

Honestly, I think I have some sociopathic tendencies.

 

These things are black and white, a yes or no, but rather a sliding scale. All of us fall somewhere on the spectrum - from the extremely empathetic who have a hard time coping in the world given their sensitivity, to the abhorrent psychopath who leaves destruction in their wake.

 

What we can do, os open our eyes and recognize patterns of behavior and use that information to make decisions about who we welcome into our lives.

 

This is where I am. I think the reason it all gets stuck in our heads is because it's a secret relationship between married people. Married people looking for an escape, so it's not grounded in reality. We put so much of our mental energy into it.

 

If all parties were single, we would probably classify these APs as jerks. Before I met my husband, I dated this loser (who was also an alcoholic) for 6 months. We were together all the time, then one day out of the blue he tried to ghost me. I went off on him as a final goodbye and within 2/3 weeks, I was totally over him. He was just a jerk. A jerk with a substance problem, but just a jerk.

[Poppy47]

Jerk isn't a medical term, Webster's says the informal use is "a contemptibly obnoxious person"

 

I don't know what you are searching for. Does it make things different if a person has a medically defined personality defect, or is just a conventional jerk?

 

Honestly, I think I have some sociopathic tendencies.

 

These things are black and white, a yes or no, but rather a sliding scale. All of us fall somewhere on the spectrum - from the extremely empathetic who have a hard time coping in the world given their sensitivity, to the abhorrent psychopath who leaves destruction in their wake.

 

What we can do, os open our eyes and recognize patterns of behavior and use that information to make decisions about who we welcome into our lives.

I was really only being light hearted with my question ....Sorry.

 

Having been around this world for 69 years, I DO recognise a jerk when I see encounter one!

 

A sociopath is a different proposition. He was the "guy next door" type.

 

Cheers,

 

Poppy

[goodyblue]

There is no way to diagnose anyone over the internet. Also, sociopaths, psychopaths and NPD's are pretty dang rare. It is doubtful there is one in every family but every family certainly has a jerk or two.

[Poppy47]

There is no way to diagnose anyone over the internet. Also, sociopaths, psychopaths and NPD's are pretty dang rare. It is doubtful there is one in every family but every family certainly has a jerk or two.

 

My goodness that is the truth goodyblue. LOL

 

I know it is impossible to diagnose over the interenet. It would be foolish to do so when diagnosis involves a qualified psychologist/ psychiatrist.

 

Poppy.

[Poppy47]

Quite a few women here who are labeling their ex MM as a narcissist/sociopath, when an affair ends and they are no longer of any use to him.

 

I don't think it's so easy to diagnose someone with such personality disorders.

 

If you think about it, when you enter into an affair with a married man you are beginning a relationship with somebody who you are well aware is going home to his wife and playing "mr nice guy" while lying daily to her face and hiding an entire other life from his family. You do it willingly and ignore the obvious selfishness of such a person because you're getting what you want also.

 

So why would it be shocking that this same person would then discard your feelings when he tires of you?

 

I can't help but wonder if an affair partner often feels more comfortable pinning personality disorder labels onto their ex cheater because it makes it easier for them to feel they are less to blame for entering into such a dishonest relationship when it all goes pear shaped, and the MM/W shows them the same face they have been showing their spouses. All with their AP's full knowledge.

 

I totally own the part I played in the A. Most people here who had affairs, will also. What he was is not shocking at all.

 

I walked away from him 8 months ago and have been totally NC ever since... except for one email from him which was deleted and ignored

 

It interesting to speculate about how difficult it is for people to recover from affairs. Some seem to struggle with it more than others, some recover quickly and others have been on LS for years.

 

Poppy.

[freengreen]

Quite a few women here who are labeling their ex MM as a narcissist/sociopath, when an affair ends and they are no longer of any use to him.

 

I don't think it's so easy to diagnose someone with such personality disorders.

 

If you think about it, when you enter into an affair with a married man you are beginning a relationship with somebody who you are well aware is going home to his wife and playing "mr nice guy" while lying daily to her face and hiding an entire other life from his family. You do it willingly and ignore the obvious selfishness of such a person because you're getting what you want also.

 

So why would it be shocking that this same person would then discard your feelings when he tires of you?

 

I can't help but wonder if an affair partner often feels more comfortable pinning personality disorder labels onto their ex cheater because it makes it easier for them to feel they are less to blame for entering into such a dishonest relationship when it all goes pear shaped, and the MM/W shows them the same face they have been showing their spouses. All with their AP's full knowledge.

 

Affair is a fantasy but like in any other relationship the emotions are asymetric. As much as it is wrong unfortunately one of them puts real emotions and the other uses that fact to their own good.

 

Most of the OWs here own their ****, but the pain when you realise that u had been a fool and the other person just kept using you dry , just hurts.

 

I dont say what you said is not right but what we say is not wrong too.

[Southern Sun]

When labeling someone, is it based on how they treated you (the end of an affair, etc) or a pattern you see in their lives and behaviors?

 

In order to be diagnosed, the behavior must be pervasive, affecting multiple areas of the person's life.

 

I do believe though that a person's traits (narcissistic or cluster b, whatever), can become more or less pronounced, depending upon the situation and what obstacles they are or are not facing.

 

Unfortunately, many folks who would otherwise be diagnosable with a cluster b disorder will never receive that diagnosis because they do not seek treatment. Many think nothing is wrong with them or even if they do, are just fine with it, because it works for them. So we resort to labels.

 

I would bet money my xMM could be diagnosed with NPD. And not because of how he treated me at the end. It was the whole she-bang. And everything else I saw about how he lived his life and treated his "loved ones."

 

We shouldn't be quick to label when we are hurt, but we should be able to recognize behavior that has been abusive so that we empower ourselves to separate truth from fiction. And hopefully to move on.

[DKT3]

Affair is a fantasy but like in any other relationship the emotions are asymetric. As much as it is wrong unfortunately one of them puts real emotions and the other uses that fact to their own good.

 

Most of the OWs here own their ****, but the pain when you realise that u had been a fool and the other person just kept using you dry , just hurts.

 

I dont say what you said is not right but what we say is not wrong too.

 

It's no different then what those women are doing to thier husbands for.those married. It's really that pot and kettle thing.

[freengreen]

It's no different then what those women are doing to thier husbands for.those married. It's really that pot and kettle thing.

True on the causing pain, but also pain on the other side of the door is real. While we people sitting here posting on how we repent everything and BS posting the anger, all of it is true.

 

Also, true is that, the 'fittest' in all this affair war will still be out there for prey. Serial cheating and getting out of it with a gloat is a different story.

Edited December 10, 2016 by freengreen

[DKT3]

True on the causing pain, but also pain on the other side of the door is real. While we people sitting here posting on how we repent everything and BS posting the anger, all of it is true.

 

Also, true is that, the 'fittest' in all this affair war will still be out there for prey. Serial cheating and getting out of it with a gloat is a different story.

 

There is a huge difference, WS chose this. As a MC told my wife, your like the kid that started a rock fight when you got hit in the head with the rock it's all part of the game, your husband was the kid across the street playing with his Tonka truck who wasn't playing and got hit by the biggest rock.

 

Your pain is from playing the game, you choose that path with full understanding of what were getting into. MM is the same guy now that he was when you thought he was the answer to it all. Your fault.

[road]

Because a man will say anything to get into a woman's pants and keep on saying it does not make him a sociopath.

 

 

He is just a user. Without a conscience.

 

 

To be a sociopath one has to do more/worse then get laid by as many women as he can.

 

 

It seems that you need to place blame on the OM for him being able to get you to put out.

[Midwestmissy]

I think the most prevalent personality type is the manipulator. Not npd or sociopath, but people who have difficulty facing their own emotions and issues, and deal with it by toying with others. Even unconsciously. By watching other people deal, suffer, pay, they can continue to not face it.

 

We have a business that employs social workers. There's a percentage who "fix" other people as a way to deny their own problems. Again, this isn't the whole industry, but something I've observed. One in particular is a very elevated, arrogant, spiritually superior woman who spouts this new age drivel about how her whole life has been healing others. Meanwhile, she's a hoarder who had to buy the house next door to store things like sandwich ties. It's clearly OCD and a personality disorder. But she avoids by spending all her time fixing others. It's coconuts. She's a manipulator for sure, of her image of her abilities, etc. The kind who plows thru boundaries and offends then responds with, "I'm sorry you misunderstood (implying you're stupid)" with a huge grin and batting eyes.

 

This kind of behavior is rampant. See George Simon.

[Daisy2013]

I wonder if my MM had some of these tendencies. But, the more I think about what I read here (interesting thread btw), I tend to lean more narcissistic than sociopathic.

 

Everything was about him and his feelings and worries. He would compliment me and never degraded me ... still compliments me ... but I sometimes wonder if I were dealing with a Narc or at least one with that had lots of those traits bc it all had to revolve around his timing and comfort (which he admitted). I wasn't even allowed to become upset with him, if I shut down, he would become angry and say "Friends don't treat friends this way." He once said "friends don't let friends drive drunk" after telling me how irresistible I was to him, and it made me feel he blamed this A on me because I allow him to "drive drunk" (speaking figuratively- he doesn't drink).

 

Not meaning to TJ, this thread just got me to thinking whether I was dealing with some personality disorder or just a selfish person.

[freengreen]

Your fault.

My bad yes.

[Southern Sun]

Being involved in an affair is very narcissistic behavior, period.

 

There are levels of course, but you have to believe that your relationship is "special", you are above the law or entitled, you won't get caught, and even if you recognize it's wrong, you just want it anyway!!

 

It's all "me, me, me."

 

I remember trying to tell xMM one time that relationships were supposed to be give and take, you should think of one another's feelings. I said, "It's not always all about you." And he said, almost stomping his feet, "Sometimes it is all about me!!"

 

Of course now I see the absurdity in all of this...me trying to get my partner in adultery to think of me unselfishly. Bahahaha.

 

I'm not putting all the narcissism on him. I believe I was behaving that way as well. But we all have the ability to have some level of those traits in us. The question is, is it bad enough to meet the criteria for a disorder? Does it reach to most areas and circumstances of your life? Do you have not only empathy, but compassion for others? I think I acted like a selfish jerk during that time, but from what I saw, it went a lot deeper for xMM.

[DKT3]

Being involved in an affair is very narcissistic behavior, period.

 

There are levels of course, but you have to believe that your relationship is "special", you are above the law or entitled, you won't get caught, and even if you recognize it's wrong, you just want it anyway!!

 

It's all "me, me, me."

 

I remember trying to tell xMM one time that relationships were supposed to be give and take, you should think of one another's feelings. I said, "It's not always all about you." And he said, almost stomping his feet, "Sometimes it is all about me!!"

 

Of course now I see the absurdity in all of this...me trying to get my partner in adultery to think of me unselfishly. Bahahaha.

 

I'm not putting all the narcissism on him. I believe I was behaving that way as well. But we all have the ability to have some level of those traits in us. The question is, is it bad enough to meet the criteria for a disorder? Does it reach to most areas and circumstances of your life? Do you have not only empathy, but compassion for others? I think I acted like a selfish jerk during that time, but from what I saw, it went a lot deeper for xMM.

 

Qualify introspection here. I'm amazed at how often MW see themselves as so different then her AP. Maybe she isn't in the front seat but she is for damn sure riding in the same car.

 

Bottom line is the vast majority of these people place a higher value on how others treat them then how they treat others. Call it what ever label you want.

[Poppy47]

Because a man will say anything to get into a woman's pants and keep on saying it does not make him a sociopath.

 

 

He is just a user. Without a conscience.

 

 

To be a sociopath one has to do more/worse then get laid by as many women as he can.

 

 

It seems that you need to place blame on the OM for him being able to get you to put out.

 

Where does one come across men like that ?

 

Poppy.

[MissCongeniality]

Quite a few women here who are labeling their ex MM as a narcissist/sociopath, when an affair ends and they are no longer of any use to him.

 

I don't think it's so easy to diagnose someone with such personality disorders.

 

If you think about it, when you enter into an affair with a married man you are beginning a relationship with somebody who you are well aware is going home to his wife and playing "mr nice guy" while lying daily to her face and hiding an entire other life from his family. You do it willingly and ignore the obvious selfishness of such a person because you're getting what you want also.

 

So why would it be shocking that this same person would then discard your feelings when he tires of you?

 

I can't help but wonder if an affair partner often feels more comfortable pinning personality disorder labels onto their ex cheater because it makes it easier for them to feel they are less to blame for entering into such a dishonest relationship when it all goes pear shaped, and the MM/W shows them the same face they have been showing their spouses. All with their AP's full knowledge.

Just about every Ex I have has called me a sociopath, narcissist and B granted they were all jerks but in their defense I do tend to be very high maintenance and demanding.

[MidnightBlue1980]

Someone made a good point about it being impossible to tell if the guy is a sociopath purely by the way he treats you, you would have to observe him in other areas of his life. He definitely treated both myself and his wife as a sociopath but I really have no idea about other areas of his life. I would probably then say no, he is more is more of a misogynist, a man who hates women.

 

Thinking more on it, it does fit better. I'm there for business and way back when, he never referred me any work in 4 years, would call me "good girl" until I finally said 'I'm not a dog, stop calling me that', put down on my H saying I should be the one at home, not my H, and so on. He totally controlled his wife, calling her stupid, lazy, a slob, fat and so on. And he works for his sister in law, which must kill him. He definitely has made a lot of comments on how men are better than women.

 

Check this out.

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-mysteries-love/201502/12-ways-spot-misogynist