I talked to his ex today...

[marcie114]

Hello – my name is Marcie and I am new to LoveShack. I am hoping to get some great insight and support here from the members.

 

I want to share my story which involves two separate guys: Ian and Jason (NAMES HAVE BEEN CHANGED). My story also involves a break-up and possibly abusive behavior from an ex (not sure).

 

Some background first…

 

-I met Ian when he was 18 years old and we dated briefly in college. It didn’t work out (maturity issues). We went our separate ways but remained acquaintances after I graduated.

 

-Then there’s Jason. Jason became my closest guy friend during college. I had a really special and unique connection and bond with him. We were pretty much inseparable and our friendship was at times, very flirty. Over the years, that flirtation blossomed into more and led to a FWB situation that lasted on and off for 3 years. I thought I was ok with it, until I realized my feelings for him ran deeper and was actually in love with him. When Jason realized, he freaked and told me that he only saw me as a friend. Obviously I was devastated.

 

I went into NC to heal my heart from Jason but it wasn’t easy. He came back 3 times trying to get me back into his life. Each time, he insisted he only wanted friendship. I knew I didn’t want the same. Jason also did a lot of things during this time to get a reaction out of me (positive or negative). This led to me feeling very emotionally unstable and eventually confronting him with an ultimatum: Be with me or I walk away. He continued to state that he didn’t see me “that way” but asked questions like “what if I change my mind” or “what if I find someone else”. I stayed strong and walked away with every intention of moving forward.

 

6 months later… I was still in my healing process and trying to explore other options. This is around the time that Ian re-entered the picture. It started with a message on Thanksgiving 2015 and led to a meet up. Unlike Jason, his intention was very clear – he wanted a second chance. We got back together officially on Christmas Day 2015.

 

At first things with Ian were better than ever. I’ll admit that I still had some lingering feelings for Jason, but I grew more invested to the relationship when I realized how much Ian loved me and wanted to make it work. Pretty soon I had “let go” of any hope for Jason. About 3 months in, I got a text from Jason inviting me to his 30th birthday. I ignored it.

 

The happiness in my relationship with Ian didn’t last. About 6 months in, we got into a terrible fight where he showed a side I never saw of him. It was hurtful and shocking. The next day he was very apologetic.

 

The fights didn’t stop and they were getting more frequent and worse.

 

Ian was awful when he fought. He would call me things such as a “spoiled brat”, “lazy”, “a procrastinator”. He insinuated I wasn’t qualified for my new job. He complained about a gift I gave him to his friends and then said he was “only joking” later. Any time I became upset, I was told I was overreacting or too sensitive.

 

I knew something was wrong because I was keeping things to myself just to avoid fighting. Sometimes I didn’t want to see him or hear his voice. Other times I missed him. I thought about leaving him many times but I was terrified to do so.

 

We finally broke up two weeks ago over Thanksgiving plans. During the break-up, I was blamed for everything that was wrong in our relationship and was also accused of wanting to “sleep around” and therefore causing the split. It was awful.

 

I have some truly wonderful friends who came with me to pick up my things from his apartment and gave me the strength to block him on Facebook and not contact him. He sent a “Happy Thanksgiving” message on Thursday but I haven’t heard anything else. I wonder if he ever truly cared about me. There are days when I am deeply hurt and angry by his behavior and other days where I actually miss his behavior.

 

My roommate and friends have called him “abusive” but I’m not sure if that’s what this was. Any insight on this would be appreciated.

 

Last detail... 2 days after the break-up, I got a text from Jason for the first time in almost a year and I really don't know what to think. It was a casual text about the new Harry Potter movie. We only exchanged a few messages and I haven’t heard much since. I have to admit I was very excited and shocked to hear from him. I’m not sure what it could mean but I hope it's not another attempt at friendship. Any insight into this would also be appreciated although I would never want to rebound with this particular guy. I found out that Jason and I are both attending a party for a mutual friend on December 17th so I will get to see him again.

 

Mainly I’m looking for advice/insight into the following…

 

1. Was my relationship with Ian abusive? If so, how do I get through this?

2. What does everyone think Jason’s intentions are?

3. How should I proceed and protect myself to avoid further hurt?

 

I appreciate anyone who took the time to read and evaluate my story. I look forward to hearing your insight and suggestions for my situation. I have been trying so hard to heal and stay positive.

 

-Marcie

[tojaz]

Mainly I’m looking for advice/insight into the following…

 

1. Was my relationship with Ian abusive? If so, how do I get through this?

2. What does everyone think Jason’s intentions are?

3. How should I proceed and protect myself to avoid further hurt?

 

 

1. It is very hard to determine if Ian was abusive off of the small tidbits posted here. There's probably not a person alive that hasn't displayed behavior like that when fighting with a partner. Did you fight a lot? Did he seem to instigate those fights?

 

An abusive relationship is about a pattern of behavior, not isolated incidents. If what you described above was a recurring situation in your relationship it was most definitely abusive.

 

2. Based on how you described Jasons previous attempts to draw you back, I think he misses your "Arrangement" and is trying to be your FWB again now that you are available.

 

3. Stick to what you have already done. Set clear boundaries and don't compromise them. If Jason wants to be friends then that will be all you are, no benefits. If he wants a relationship then be sure that is his true intention before you proceed

 

TOJAZ

[Expectmore]

First Marcie

Let me say Im sorry you have to deal with nasty words and comments like that.

I have not yet figured out why some people like to say such things during a disagreement.

I don't think either is healthy for you.

Remember your value and leave them to complicate some one elses life.

You should expect more and hold out for it.

It will come.

[marcie114]

1. It is very hard to determine if Ian was abusive off of the small tidbits posted here. There's probably not a person alive that hasn't displayed behavior like that when fighting with a partner. Did you fight a lot? Did he seem to instigate those fights?

 

An abusive relationship is about a pattern of behavior, not isolated incidents. If what you described above was a recurring situation in your relationship it was most definitely abusive.

 

2. Based on how you described Jasons previous attempts to draw you back, I think he misses your "Arrangement" and is trying to be your FWB again now that you are available.

 

3. Stick to what you have already done. Set clear boundaries and don't compromise them. If Jason wants to be friends then that will be all you are, no benefits. If he wants a relationship then be sure that is his true intention before you proceed

 

TOJAZ

 

Thanks for your response... most of the behavior from Ian happened when we were fighting but not always. He sometimes would say hurtful things to me without realizing they were hurtful. When I pointed it out, it often led to fighting or him saying I was "overreacting" or too sensitive. It wasn't always bad times with him but these moments became more and more frequent as the relationship went on...

 

Jason has never really seemed like that type to me. He's only ever had two serious relationships. He doesn't play the field or anything like that. I really hope he wouldn't be trying to do that. Like I said, we share an incredible unique bond and I would be surprised if his motivations were only physical. That being said, I already decided I couldn't be "just friends" with Jason a few years ago. I haven't changed my mind on that so unless he's prepared to give me what I want, I intend to stay away. I just hope that I'm not about to be given a lot of additional pain on top of my recent break-up.

[marcie114]

First Marcie

Let me say Im sorry you have to deal with nasty words and comments like that.

I have not yet figured out why some people like to say such things during a disagreement.

I don't think either is healthy for you.

Remember your value and leave them to complicate some one elses life.

You should expect more and hold out for it.

It will come.

 

Thank you so much. I guess right now all I want from Ian is an apology for all the blame he put on me when we ended things. I kind of want that closure but I'm not sure if he'll ever give me that.

 

With Jason there has always been a lingering hope that maybe something would change on his end but I'm not sure. Now that's he contacted me, I'm hopeful but proceeding with a lot of caution hoping that I'm not about to run into more pain.

[Slimtripper]

They are both **** guys. 0please listen to my male perspective on this.

Ian. I don't know the definition of abusive but it sounds like he has things to work on before being in a relationship. People do say horrible stuff when they break up it's just life so I wouldn't go off that. I definitely don't see any point keeping him in ur life for an apology. It's done, leave that alone.

 

Jason. Now I have girls that I've had fwb with or even been casual until they sudddenyl declare feelings. Some of these girls iv really been attracted to and enjoyed their company but I know I don't want what they want. So however much I'd like a quick night with them, I stay away. Because it will cause more problems otherwise.

 

If Jason wanted u he'd tell you. But he just wants u around for his own self esteem. He may keep pursuing until he asks u to date. Then he'll get u and lose interest.

If you are 30 now, it's time to look at fresh prospects. Not these jokers

[tojaz]

Thanks for your response... most of the behavior from Ian happened when we were fighting but not always. He sometimes would say hurtful things to me without realizing they were hurtful. When I pointed it out, it often led to fighting or him saying I was "overreacting" or too sensitive. It wasn't always bad times with him but these moments became more and more frequent as the relationship went on...

 

Technically "abusive" implies an intent to do harm, sometimes people are just stupid, callous, or oblivious to the effect their actions have on other people. Think someone tripping and knocking you down v/s someone deliberately shoving you to the ground. Result is the same but intent changes everything.

 

I wouldn't worry much about labeling it to be honest though, the situation was unsatisfactory for you and you felt you had to remove yourself from it. That's the important thing regardless of what label a therapist or anyone else would hang on the behavior.

 

Jason has never really seemed like that type to me. He's only ever had two serious relationships. He doesn't play the field or anything like that. I really hope he wouldn't be trying to do that. Like I said, we share an incredible unique bond and I would be surprised if his motivations were only physical.

 

There's a really big grey area between just wanting sex and being in love. There can still be a huge emotional connection with a FWB relationship which is what it sounds like here. I'm sure Jason isn't just looking to fulfill a physical need, it's more about him needing to stop short of actually committing to being an official couple. Scared of commitment? Exploring other options? Only Jason knows for sure.

 

TOJAZ

[marcie114]

They are both **** guys. 0please listen to my male perspective on this.

Ian. I don't know the definition of abusive but it sounds like he has things to work on before being in a relationship. People do say horrible stuff when they break up it's just life so I wouldn't go off that. I definitely don't see any point keeping him in ur life for an apology. It's done, leave that alone.

 

Jason. Now I have girls that I've had fwb with or even been casual until they sudddenyl declare feelings. Some of these girls iv really been attracted to and enjoyed their company but I know I don't want what they want. So however much I'd like a quick night with them, I stay away. Because it will cause more problems otherwise.

 

If Jason wanted u he'd tell you. But he just wants u around for his own self esteem. He may keep pursuing until he asks u to date. Then he'll get u and lose interest.

If you are 30 now, it's time to look at fresh prospects. Not these jokers

 

I'm 27... :\

 

The things Ian said were throughout the 2nd half of our relationship not just the break-up.

 

Jason isn't really the type of guy who does fwb or casual hooking up. I guess I was the exception. He's kind of an introverted guy who keeps to himself and cares deeply about others. He's very sensitive and always is the first one to help others. I don't know what to think about this new development but I really don't think he has any intention of using me. He's just not that kind of person.

[Slimtripper]

I'm 27... :\

 

The things Ian said were throughout the 2nd half of our relationship not just the break-up.

 

Jason isn't really the type of guy who does fwb or casual hooking up. I guess I was the exception. He's kind of an introverted guy who keeps to himself and cares deeply about others. He's very sensitive and always is the first one to help others. I don't know what to think about this new development but I really don't think he has any intention of using me. He's just not that kind of person.

 

Your making Jason out to be the messiah and that isn't logically going to be correct. Hes a guy, and he did FWB with you, so trust me, hes doing it plenty.

If i want to date a girl i date her. If i think she isn't good enough to date but want to just have sex, than ill do FWB.

 

Here is what happens when someone wants to be with you. They tell you they want to be with you. Anything less than that and you should assume that he doesn't and then go about your business.

And that is the best way to get him interested anyway. You're fixated on it because you've known each other and been obsessing for so long without having him.

You need to go out, meet other people, concentrate on that and wait until you are certain and he verbally says he wants to be together.

But even when he does that, i still feel that he will get that and then not want it anymore.

[marcie114]

Okay, so I've been broken up with him for about 2 weeks and I've been trying to process two different emotions - loneliness and anger. I am also trying to deal with the possibility that he was emotionally abusive towards me.

 

This morning I was driving and I thought about something I never really thought about before.

 

Early on in my relationship with him, he made me promise I'd never talk about our relationship in any way with anyone else. He said that our problems needed to stay between us and he didn't want everyone knowing our business.

 

I didn't think much of it at the time and for a while things were okay. Later on as the arguments became awful (he began calling me names, taking out his problems on me, and belittling me), he'd often shut me out and refuse to speak to me for days after saying those awful things to me. I'd be inconsolable and felt like I couldn't go to anyone.

 

Eventually I did start opening up to some friends about what was happening but I always felt guilty about it (like I was deceiving him and shouldn't be doing it).

 

Looking back, now I feel like maybe he was trying to control me by isolating me from any people who would point out he wasn't treating me well. Maybe that was the reason all along. And if so, that makes me feel foolish and angrier at him.

 

Anyone else experience this?

[travelbug1996]

That's what narcissistic psychopaths do. Look up the cycle of abuse and educate yourself about boundaries and what a healthy relationship looks like. Stay away from mean controlling angry men. They will try to ruin your life.

[mikeylo]

Its only 2 weeks since break up. Abusive men dont like break ups.He will come back with lots of sugar coating.Dont give in to it.

[marcie114]

That's what narcissistic psychopaths do. Look up the cycle of abuse and educate yourself about boundaries and what a healthy relationship looks like. Stay away from mean controlling angry men. They will try to ruin your life.

 

I bought a book to start learning more. So you think this definitely qualifies as abuse? I'm trying to understand and process this and why it happened and how to deal.

[marcie114]

Its only 2 weeks since break up. Abusive men dont like break ups.He will come back with lots of sugar coating.Dont give in to it.

 

So you think he was abusive? I'm still trying to confirm whether it qualified as abuse or if I'm just overreacting.

[Patrice]

you to be happy. Belittling and trying to make you stop your connections to others is a big red flag.

[elaine567]

It is in fact very common.

 

Isolation and Domestic Abuse: How Abusers Isolate Victims

 

Isolation and domestic abuse cannot be separated. Whether physical or emotional or both, isolation is the first step to convincing a victim that their controller is the most important person in the world. How do abusers isolate victims? Why are isolation and domestic abuse inextricably intertwined?

 

Usually the isolation in domestic abuse begins with the controller inserting emotional wedges between the victim and his or her family and friends. At some point, the victim finds it too difficult to connect with friends and family due to:-

1) the controller’s embarrassing or abusive behavior or

2) the victim’s belief that the controller is telling the truth.

Either way, physical withdrawal and isolation follows. Oftentimes, the victim of isolation and domestic abuse believes they chose to stay away from those people and do not see the controller’s manipulations at all.

[NuevoYorko]

I don't know if it was abusive but definitely a toxic situation. Good for you for getting out of it; stay out.

[coreander81]

On the flip side, to play devils advocate, there is such a thing as respecting the privacy of your partner/spouse. This applies to generally non-abusive people and it means you don't go spreading all their innermost hopes, fears, dreams, sexual fantasies, shortcomings, etc...with the rest of the world. I'm not an abuser. But if my gf or spouse was sharing all my confidential info with her family, I would be offended and would probably grow resentful and distance myself.

[marcie114]

On the flip side, to play devils advocate, there is such a thing as respecting the privacy of your partner/spouse. This applies to generally non-abusive people and it means you don't go spreading all their innermost hopes, fears, dreams, sexual fantasies, shortcomings, etc...with the rest of the world. I'm not an abuser. But if my gf or spouse was sharing all my confidential info with her family, I would be offended and would probably grow resentful and distance myself.

 

That is exactly what I thought I was doing during the majority of our relationship. I just kept telling myself "oh he's a private person - he doesn't want our business shared with everyone" and I wanted to respect that.

 

About 6 months in we had an argument where he showed a different side of himself. It was not like our old arguments. I had made a mistake about something and he told me he couldn't believe how stupid I was and told me I was a spoiled selfish little princess. I was beyond appalled and demanded an apology but he refused and then hung up on me. He wouldn't speak to me for days and I was incredibly upset and hurt. Eventually he did apologize but those fights became more common. He'd say awful things and then shut me out like I was being punished.

 

Eventually I was unbearably upset and I did start talking to my roommate and a few close friends who were really disturbed my his behavior. I always felt really guilt afterwards like I had invaded his privacy and gone against his wishes.

 

It didn't really hit me until this week that he may have asked me not to talk to others because he knew he wasn't going to treat me well and he knew other people would tell me to leave. Maybe it was an attempt to isolate me.

 

So now I don't know what to think. After I picked up my stuff I blocked him on Facebook and tried to remove all traces of him from my life. I'm actually trying really hard to heal but I still miss him at times which is probably insane given how horrible his behavior could be. I'm trying to figure out how to be without him and be happy again. Some days it's easy and other days it's really really hard.

 

It also hurts that after the break-up he never bothered to apologize for all of his hurtful behavior. I don't expect it but I feel like it would have helped me achieve some closure after all of this.

[SpiralOut]

I could see someone making that request if they had dated an immature person who told their friends every detail of every fight they had, showed no respect for his privacy, etc. However, it's not reasonable for him to ask that you never tell anyone anything at all. It's also weird that he made you "promise" not to do that.

 

I don't know if I'd call him abusive exactly, but the red flags are there. You don't want to be with someone who resorts to name-calling during fights.

Edited December 5, 2016 by SpiralOut

[marcie114]

Okay, so for those of you don't know the situation... the break-up was about a month ago and I am coming to terms with the fact that he may have been emotionally abusive and trying to process things.

 

This week I noticed that his ex "liked" one of my posts on Facebook. Never met her and she wasn't my Facebook friend so I figured she was either a. stalking me because she wanted him back or b. was generally curious about who I was.

 

I decided to reach out.

 

I took a screenshot of the image and contacted her by asking if we had anything to talk about. It took her a few days to answer and it was a bit awkward when we first started talking.

 

She immediately made it clear that she wanted nothing to do with him and asked why we broke up. I started telling her he had a tendancy to be mean and hurtful during fights and would find a lot of ways to put me down.

 

Eventually she told me her story and I am in SHOCK. Apparently, she experienced similar things with the insults. They both shared an apartment together and she said it eventually escalated to physical violence where he would push her around and leave welts on her body. She said it became so terrible that a neighbor called the cops on him. Eventually she told me she got the courage to leave.

 

She also told me she reached out to his exes as a way to heal and they all reported similar stories.

 

I am in shock. Of course I can't believe it 100% - he never put a hand on me but he was always pressuring me to move in which I wasn't comfortable with since we were always fighting.

 

I'm so glad I never moved in with him.

 

I am just in shock. This was abuse (or at least on it's way to abuse) and it could have been so much worse.

 

I'm glad I talked to her. This is all really difficult to process right now so I had to share. I'm thankful to be out but can't believe he went that far with someone else...

[turnera]

I had made a mistake about something and he told me he couldn't believe how stupid I was and told me I was a spoiled selfish little princess.

 

It didn't really hit me until this week that he may have asked me not to talk to others because he knew he wasn't going to treat me well and he knew other people would tell me to leave. Maybe it was an attempt to isolate me.

Abuse is a spectrum PD. There are all levels of abuse. What matters is if your partner cherishes you. He obviously didn't. You don't call people you cherish stupid. You don't even think it in the first place.

 

Between 18 and 27, I'd bet he's had a lot of relationships break up once he got to the level of disrespect you saw. And he's probably seen several women tell their friends or family what he did, and saw how bad he looks; thus the 'don't share our sh&t' comment.

 

Most abusers are not aware they are abusive. They just DO stuff. Stuff that they think works to get them what they want - your compliance, your not griping, your not questioning him, and so on.

 

As for you, have you been dating other people? It doesn't sound like it. Looks like you need to broaden your circle and go on some dates so you'll see more different personality types to see what kind of guy is right for you. See what they're like around their family - that's what you'll get. See how they treat service people - waiters, clerks, etc. If they aren't kind to those people, run. See if they have a sense of humor when something bad happens; if they get bent out of shape, run - they'll eventually turn that on YOU.

 

And no, Jason will never 'love' you. If you were to get with him, you would be settling for half of a relationship, if that much. He'll never give you what you need. Grieve for that relationship and move on.

 

The best book on abuse is Why Does He Do That? Inside The Minds Of Angry And Controlling People.

 

The best book I've read on why you end UP in relationships like that is Getting The Love You Want.

Edited December 11, 2016 by turnera

[elaine567]

Just because he didn't actually hit you doesn't mean he was not abusive.

The silent treatment is also abusive, he punishes you for perceived misdemeanours on your part.

What constitutes emotional abuse?

 

There are a variety of types of behaviour that could be classed as emotional abuse. These include:

 

• Intimidation and threats. This could be things like shouting, acting aggressing or just generally making you feel scared. This is often done as a way of making a person feel small and stopping them from standing up for themselves.
  
• Criticism. This could be things like namecalling or making lots of unpleasant or sarcastic comments. This can really lower a person’s self-esteem and self-confidence.
  
• Undermining. This might include things like dismissing your opinion. It can also involve making you doubt your own opinion by acting as if you're being oversensitive if you do complain, disputing your version of events or by suddenly being really nice to you after being cruel.
  
• Being made to feel guilty. This can range from outright emotional blackmail (threats to kill oneself or lots of emotional outbursts) to sulking all the time or giving you the silent treatment as a way of manipulating you.
  
• Economic abuse, such as withholding money, not involving you in finances or even preventing you from getting a job. This could be done as a way of stopping you from feeling independent and that you’re able to make your own choices.
  
• Telling you what you can and can’t do. As the examples above make clear, emotional abuse is generally about control. Sometimes this is explicit. Does your partner tell you when and where you can go out, or even stop you from seeing certain people? Do they try to control how you dress or how you style your hair?
  

[elaine567]

Many people put up with abusers as they are "people pleasers".

Abusers tend to target such people, they can smell them a mile off.

It is no coincidence that the victim ends up being abused, the abuser chose them specifically.

 

Watch this -

I now it would be very easy to fall into Jason's arms now, but you are in no place to make good judgements.

Stay away from him.