Mid life wife drama

[Mr. Lucky]

Your wife isn't working a solid program.

 

Amen. rocky2marie, a 12 Steps program isn't a Chinese Menu, you don't get to pick some parts (fellowship) to follow and ignore others (honesty and amends). Your wife is using AA as a social club, a fairly common detour from real recovery.

 

The problem is I hear things I don't want to and become very reactive. i.e.: "I need to flirt" "I'm getting older and want attention from OS". "If in a perfect world where you wouldn't be affected I'd like to experience falling in love again. But I'd never actually do it" ??

 

All of this pretty much guarantees you'll be here expressing the same angst years from now...

 

Mr. Lucky

[rocky2marie]

Mr. Lucky

All of this pretty much guarantees you'll be here expressing the same angst years from now...

 

You've hit the crux of it Mr Lucky. I've quoted this exact thing in couples therapy over and over. "If you're saying you want new love at 43 what's going to happen at 48? I'd rather get free now than put five more years into a doomed enterprise". She and therapist agree on same terms: "Trust is a choice you have to make for yourself Rocky".

She looks me in the eyes "I've never actually cheated on you for 15 years. Can't I get some profs for that??" I'd almost rather she had than a pressure cooker build up for ruination later.

Edited January 13, 2017 by rocky2marie

[Jersey born raised]

Actually ????

 

Who is this IC? What is her background.

[rocky2marie]

Therapist actually had her leave the room and confronted me: "why don't you believe her? I believe her and I've been doing this 20 years". Whole thing has become a referendum on me rather than her: I'm controlling, jealous, and insecure etc. Therapist like I said advocates "polyamory" (very liberal we live in SF) So no surprise on his POV. He sees it as a feminist issue and will always uphold her right to play at least in heart and mind as no problem.

Edited January 13, 2017 by rocky2marie

[rocky2marie]

If i did divorce her hard to imagine being able to trust anyone again. The guy who'd marry my wife after her mid-life would be the lucky son of a bitch. I saw it happen to a friend of mine. Wife just went wild at 47. ****ed a bunch of guys, got it out of her system completely. Got remarried and is the image of stability now. Really nice guy and got totally ****ed. All this stuff makes me hate people so much.

[Mr Blunt]

By Rocky

Therapist like I said advocates "polyamory" (very liberal we live in SF) So no surprise on his POV. He sees it as a feminist issue and will always uphold her right to play at least in heart and mind as no problem.

 

 

 

 

By Blunt

Just convinces me more that I was right when I posted to you several days ago to kick your therapist in the nuts and get another therapist.

 

 

 

 

By Rocky

Well about a year ago she started working out all the time, changed her hair to platinum blonde and started having extremely loud passionate sex in her sleep. About three times a week.

 

 

 

 

By Blunt

Your wife has been replacing you with her thoughts and dreams; in plain English, you are not her number one man and she treats you like shyt. That would be enough for me even if it was proven that she has not had other men’s penis in her body at some point. However, you are in total control of your life and actions. You are either going to compromise and stay with her of you are going to make a plan and get going on that plan RIGHT NOW. That plan’s number one objective is for you to get a lot stronger in self-sufficiency and get emotionally strong enough so that you will realize that you will make it with her or without her.

 

If you do not execute the plan then you will be compromising your self-respect as your wife will continue to disrespect you. Get stronger then make your move!

[road]

Therapist actually had her leave the room and confronted me: "why don't you believe her? I believe her and I've been doing this 20 years". Whole thing has become a referendum on me rather than her: I'm controlling, jealous, and insecure etc. Therapist like I said advocates "polyamory" (very liberal we live in SF) So no surprise on his POV. He sees it as a feminist issue and will always uphold her right to play at least in heart and mind as no problem.

 

Time is way overdue to fire this counselor.

[road]

If i did divorce her hard to imagine being able to trust anyone again. The guy who'd marry my wife after her mid-life would be the lucky son of a bitch. I saw it happen to a friend of mine. Wife just went wild at 47. ****ed a bunch of guys, got it out of her system completely. Got remarried and is the image of stability now. Really nice guy and got totally ****ed. All this stuff makes me hate people so much.

 

Did they remarry each other?

[Jersey born raised]

The therapist is the control freak. He gives the profession a bad name. He is trying to stuff poly crap down your throat. Do argue with him he knows what he knows, everyone should obey him, the he'll with everything else.

 

He is the worst possible choice for your marriage. He most likely feels your wife is entitled to a poly relationship and if you will not give her one she should divorce you, ethically divorce you of course.

 

Do an online background search on him for complaints etc. Find a new therapist for yourself.

[rocky2marie]

Yeah it's hard around here to find a more conservative therapist tho! It's San Francisco. The more I write about it on these boards the more I'm remembering things over the years I didn't like. I've always felt my wife was too loosey goosey and flirtatious. When we first met she'd do these Craigslist ride shares between L.A. and S.F. with complete strangers. I remember telling her NO one in L.A. (she was new to L.A.) just gets in the car with a stranger. Of course they were always men. And I remember once when our child was really small she took him to the airport in long beach to watch planes take off. And some guy pulled up in his plane and offered her a joy ride. And she went in this stranger's Cessna with my 1 year old son and sent me photos of it. I never confronted her in any brash way about it. I expressed my disdain though and she now says she felt really guilty and "taken down" by these things. I just remember not feeling good about it. And then once at a party before our kids were born these two very drunk brothers started hitting on her extremely hard and slurrly told me "we're gonna **** your girlfriend dude what are you gonna do about it?" I immediately punched him out, then grabbed the idiot brother and threw him off the porch. Was the only actual fight I'd been in my adult life. I also remember being much more angry at her. Because she was smiling and batting eyelashes as they were hitting on her instead of just walking toward me or at least away. I don't think she liked the fighting part but she was definitely into them hitting on her. Something she vehemently denies to this day.

 

"I just didn't know what to do so I froze and started smiling"

 

Any woman I'd ever dated previously would have thrown her drink in their faces and walked off. So anyway... there was that very raw incident. I never said anything but a part of me didn't trust her since. And she's felt she needed to hide who she really was. Maybe it's why when she took sex away during the pregnancy I felt actually zero remorse when I cheated. Felt entrapped...doomed to be with someone who was maybe never going to "actually cheat" but always drive me crazy by behaving in this sort of ferile way.

It's like having your boundaries tested and masculinity constantly put in check. I cracked down on it enough and threatened to leave enough over the years that she straightened up and completely buried it. But now that she realizes I'm here to stay maybe she's just rolling out her real self again.

[Jersey born raised]

Was it this thread a poster who responded to a lot of red flags but no smoking gun: "they have given you a lot of reason to divorce, but none to stay"?

 

Controlling ? You do not get to control her or tell her what to do, but she has NO INPUT ON HOW YOU RESPOND !!!

 

Look you lived isolated and alone for six years, six years without a simple kiss or touch, six years in despair and misery. That was her choice to your choice.

 

You where alone and dying of cancer. As you laid their alone she simply watched why waiting to die.

 

I urge you to continue to try to save your marriage but consult a lawyer and out together a post divorce life. For example: can you stay in your current school district and preserve your son's social network? What I am driving at is study what the courts think is "best interest of the child" and structure both your current parenting methods and future parenting methods to maximize custody. 50/50 legal custody with you as the primary household should be your goal.

 

Focus on that and it will help you clear your mind.

[Jersey born raised]

Bye the way don't know the tone you take when discussing these matters but it is best if you discuss in the abstract. Be calm do not let your emotions drive your behavior, rather let the control the context of what is said. Again context not tone. This is the only way to deal with DARVO.

 

Short version of DARVO*

 

DARVO refers to a reaction perpetrators of wrong doing, particularly sexual offenders, may display in response to being held accountable for their behavior. DARVO stands for "Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender." The perpetrator or offender may Deny the behavior, Attack the individual doing the confronting, and Reverse the roles of Victim and Offender such that the perpetrator assumes the victim role and turns the true victim -- or the whistle blower -- into an alleged offender. This occurs, for instance, when an actually guilty perpetrator assumes the role of "falsely accused and*attacks the accuser's credibility or even if the event occurred. * **term "DARVO" near the end of a 1997 publication about her primary research focus, "betrayal trauma theory."*

 

"By denying, attacking ' *and reversing perpetrators into victims, reality gets even more confusing and unspeakable for the real victim. .... These perpetrator reactions increase the need for betrayal blindness. If the victim does speak out and gets this level of attack, she quickly gets the idea that silence is safer." (Veldhuis & Freyd, 1999. p 274).

 

It didn't happen (an instance) or It rarely happens (a type of event)

It wasn't harmful *Put together they can take the form: "It didn't happen, but if it did, it wasn't that bad" or "It rarely happens, but when it does it isn't harmful." The two claims both serve to deny, but they depend upon different sorts of evidence. They may both be true, but they are sometimes somewhat suspicious when claimed simultaneously (or by the same person at different times), as for instance can occur in response to allegations of rape or child sexual abuse.

 

Bing/yahoo "gray rocking" as well.

[Mr Blunt]

By Rocky

But now that she realizes I'm here to stay maybe she's just rolling out her real self again.

 

So you have decided to stay with her no matter how she treats you?

If that is your decsion then you will be a door mat and remain the 3rd or fourth place person in her life in the years to come.

 

 

PS

Your internet name of Rocky does not match Rocky Marciano the undefeated boxer

[rocky2marie]

Gray rocking is interesting. Definitely going to try out flattening my reactions to ****.

[Jersey born raised]

What have you read ? Check with mods before posting links (I've collect a few warnings for this but no bans).

[rocky2marie]

Nothing just online stuff. "be boring" if asked to engage in anything dramatic. Couldn't agree more.

[Jersey born raised]

Your thoughts?

[rocky2marie]

No thoughts in particular. But gray rocking my wife certainly makes me feel better.

[Just a Guy]

Hi Rocky, how have things been lately? Hope for your sake they are getting better. Warm wishes.

[Overtaxed]

Time is way overdue to fire this counselor.

 

Man, what the heck is with these therapists?! I'm convinced my wife's therapist is trying to torpedo our marriage as well, and sure, if you're only looking at "short term" happiness of the patient, maybe that is the right idea. Just like going to the bar and getting drunk is a good "script" for getting over a cheating spouse. At least for 8 hours anyway.

 

I don't get it. Obviously this therapist and my wife's isn't looking at the long term play. Sure, poly might be fun, but if it blows up the marriage, will she still be thinking it's "fun" a year from now when she's living in an apartment instead of the family home? When guys are using her only for sex (which, frankly, is what most guys are looking for from older women, an easy lay)? When she's lost her job because of the affair exposure? I mean.. What the heck!

[Poutrew]

Rocky, I hate to say it, but your wife has the heart of a who*re. When she said " I didn't know what to do so I just froze and started smiling." Well, is that what she is going to say when you eventually catch her with someone else: "I didn't know what to do, so I just tore my cloths off and spread my legs..." ?? She isn't going to change. Now she has a 'professional' therapist who is essentially backing her up against you. It is all your fault,. It is all in your imagination. You . YOu . YOU. Can you really see yourself in this same position in ten years time? I can't. I think if you keep going in this situation, you will be dead within ten years, and your 'wife' will be happily married to another man and wont even remember you. Also, are you absolutely sure your kid is really yours? However this drama unfolds, I truly think that the time for you either to take a shyt or get off the pot is fast approaching... Sorry I have nothing good to say...

[rocky2marie]

Hi Rocky, how have things been lately? Hope for your sake they are getting better. Warm wishes.

 

 

Thanks for this kind check in Just a Guy. Things aren't great. Gotta stay out of her journals. It's become like a grim obsession. Everytime I open them I find something. She's got boxes and boxes of them in the basement. I went down and reached out and opened a random one -- from three years ago -- first page I opened to were multiple lists of "ideal world" scenarios. In all of them open marriage was essentially listed. (in an ideal world) "Rocky lets me make out with other guys and just be myself when I want and isn't jealous. Or at least doesn't find out". Man. Don't know what to do but call it. Wrecking ball on my sanity.

[rocky2marie]

worst part is I can't even confront her when I find this stuff either privately or in therapy -- Because then I'm violating her privacy and being controlling and jealous etc. I just have to swallow it and pretend everything's ok while basically imploding. I dont' know. Should I bring this stuff up? Or just archive it all for a eventual case?

[fireflywy]

worst part is I can't even confront her when I find this stuff either privately or in therapy -- Because then I'm violating her privacy and being controlling and jealous etc. I just have to swallow it and pretend everything's ok while basically imploding. I dont' know. Should I bring this stuff up? Or just archive it all for a eventual case?

 

Dude...sounds like your marriage is over. You say you don't have proof beyond a reasonable doubt pf her actually cheating but have a preponderance of evidence that she is fantasizing about it and wanting to. You mentioned her dancing with other guys, Craigslist, close encounters, etc.

 

You aren't going to be able to stop her, your messed up 'progressive" counselor (they aren't Gods by the way so you don't ALWAYS have to think they know best) is acting like a new age tard, and you're on constant alert mode. This isn't a marriage anymore. It's done and you should leave.

 

However, you don't want to. Why? Guessing you're held up on your wife's looks and more worried about another man possessing (understandable) her because you're upset about how you think she values you (in this case she doesnt all that much) and it makes you feel low.

 

Stop letting her actions be a reflection of your worth. Get over physical attraction and what comes next. Have some pride in yourself (it's okay) and let her go.

Edited January 23, 2017 by fireflywy

[Oberfeldwebel]

Reading your posts I am reminded of the scene in Gone With The Wind, where a drunken Rhett confronts his wife about Ashley Wilkes.

 

Rhett: Mr Wilkes, who can't be mentally faithful to his wife, but won't be technically unfaithful.

 

Your wife seems to have these same traits. The shame is that they spend so much time in a fantasy world, while true love slips them by. Hopefully, it won't end like the movie with you walking out the door saying frankly my dear I don't give a damn.

 

I think you get the gist of her writings, so I don't think there is much to be gained by reading more. I think that you two need to find some happy events, where troubles are not discussed, leave that to counseling. You need to find fun family events and joy in your life, after all tomorrow is another day.