Should I Prepare to Leave - He Hasn't Proposed

[elaine567]

I believe there are people who want to get married eventually and people who don't.

 

BUT it is complicated.

 

Some of the people who want to marry never meet the person of their dreams so they mess about with "perpetual dating"/LTRS that go nowhere/ "live in" relationships. They eventually may have to "settle" or remain unmarried.

Some of the people who never want to marry get "forced" into marriage by pushy gfs/bfs, families and social pressure.

 

Some of those who don't want to marry may discover a fantastic person they just can't let go, so marry them, and some who want to marry may become sorely disillusioned along the way, so change their minds about marriage all together.

 

At 37, this guy will know how he feels about marriage. He is not shutting down and stringing along the OP for no good reason.

He did not jump at the chance of tying the OP down into marriage, when she brought the subject up.

He is, I guess, confident she is not leaving, whatever happens, or he is not fussed either way...

 

I guess he may be like some of the men who come on here with the long term gf who he loves, but is not in love with. His eyes are looking around at other women, he is bored with the sex, he doesn't want to take things any further with his gf, but he is somewhat stuck.

He doesn't want to hurt her, and there is nothing essentially wrong with her, she loves him, but he sees no future with her.

These guys then tell us about the cute co worker, or the hot girl at the gym, who he is either cheating with, or wishes he was cheating with...

 

Of course this may be all be financially motivated. He has a business, he may feel that he does not want the complication of a failed marriage to ruin his 5 year plan...

 

Or it may be that he feels that everything is not going swimmingly in this relationship and the last thing he wants is to get in any deeper.

Sex is very important to most men, if he is not having sex with the OP, he is not feeling connected to her. 2 monthly sex is NOT a good sign here.

[Gaeta]

This is just plain rude. She doesnt just want any husband. She wants to marry her boyfriend.

 

If marriage doesn't mean anything to you,or isn't important to you that's fine, but it is something the OP wants and not just with any random man.

 

You took this way too seriously. Relax. It was a Canadian inside joke that OP fully understood and laughed at.

[Gaeta]

I guess he may be like some of the men who come on here with the long term gf who he loves, but is not in love with. His eyes are looking around at other women, he is bored with the sex, he doesn't want to take things any further with his gf, but he is somewhat stuck.

He doesn't want to hurt her, and there is nothing essentially wrong with her, she loves him, but he sees no future with her.

These guys then tell us about the cute co worker, or the hot girl at the gym, who he is either cheating with, or wishes he was cheating with....

 

There was this whole debate earlier about women initiating divorce at something like 70%. It's not because women don't value relationships it's because men have a deep fear of being alone and prefer being in a mediocre relationship than being single again. So many men have the type of relationship you are describing and won't break up. The GF is there, she cooks, she cleans, and maintain a nice home environment, she is a type of security for them that is all.

[elaine567]

There was this whole debate earlier about women initiating divorce at something like 70%. It's not because women don't value relationships it's because men have a deep fear of being alone and prefer being in a mediocre relationship than being single again. So many men have the type of relationship you are describing and won't break up. The GF is there, she cooks, she cleans, and maintain a nice home environment, she is a type of security for them that is all.

 

She gets fed up of the cooking and cleaning with nothing in return. She doesn't want mediocre, she wants more "connection", on so many different levels..

She tries to make it work, but he isn't really listening. She stops trying, he thinks she is now happy.

She walks, he is clueless as to what went wrong.

[stillafool]

I'd be more concerned that a 37 year old man only wants sex once in 2 months. This would be a big issue for me especially if I wanted kids and definitely for my sexual satisfaction.

 

I've been married twice and both times I was engaged within a year.

[ClaraCAKES]

There was this whole debate earlier about women initiating divorce at something like 70%. It's not because women don't value relationships it's because men have a deep fear of being alone and prefer being in a mediocre relationship than being single again. So many men have the type of relationship you are describing and won't break up. The GF is there, she cooks, she cleans, and maintain a nice home environment, she is a type of security for them that is all.

 

I know better than that, we have a cleaner that comes 4 times a week Who does his laundry as well.

 

And I don't cook either........

 

If all my friends weren't married or laiden with kids I would definitely go on a holiday for a few weeks and then he would soon know if he missed me. But who wants to go away on their own

[elaine567]

I know better than that, we have a cleaner that comes 4 times a week Who does his laundry as well.

 

And I don't cook either.

 

Well, that may actually be your problem.

Can't/won't house keep. can't/won't cook...

[stillafool]

Well, that may actually be your problem.

Can't/won't house keep. can't/won't cook...

 

This and no sex!

[travelbug1996]

I would never live with a man before marriage if I know in my heart that's what I want.

 

He doesn't feel a NEED to get married.

[sandylee1]

I know better than that, we have a cleaner that comes 4 times a week Who does his laundry as well.

 

And I don't cook either ........

 

 

Maybe that's the issue for him.

 

That you don't fit his image of a wife. Some men actually want a wife who can cook and does cook.

 

I'm not saying it's right, but I know lots of men who say they'd never marry a woman who can't cook.

 

I find it quite chauvinistic in this day and age, but that view is still held, even if it isn't vocalised.

 

Look at it this way... What would he say you do for him?

 

He can pay a cleaner himself

 

He can buy takeout himself or sort out his own meals

 

Your sex life isn't great.

 

I don't know if you do much going out together or having fun, but I'm not seeing what benefits he'll see in marrying you, especially if he's not fussed on having kids.

 

The more you say, the more I can see why he's not jumping at marriage and it isn't about you personally, it's the whole relationship.

[No_Go]

Oh now I know why I have never married

 

I find it very strange that the view that the woman should cook/housekeep is still a thing... I personally do the same as OP with cleaning, not that frequent but I find it MUCH cleaner if I pay for a professional service ... Heck my cleaner spends 4 hours at minimum per job, I'd need to take time off work to do the same. For cooking: all my partners used to cook great, so I never had to do it. If I'm alone, I just make a salad/sandwich and that's it.

 

Maybe it depends on where you live but at least in my circles, housekeeping&cooking has never been a requirement for a 'wife material'. Guys are better cooks anyway most of the time

 

Maybe that's the issue for him.

 

That you don't fit his image of a wife. Some men actually want a wife who can cook and does cook.

 

I'm not saying it's right, but I know lots of men who say they'd never marry a woman who can't cook.

 

I find it quite chauvinistic in this day and age, but that view is still held, even if it isn't vocalised.

 

Look at it this way... What would he say you do for him?

 

He can pay a cleaner himself

 

He can buy takeout himself or sort out his own meals

 

Your sex life isn't great.

 

I don't know if you do much going out together or having fun, but I'm not seeing what benefits he'll see in marrying you, especially if he's not fussed on having kids.

 

The more you say, the more I can see why he's not jumping at marriage and it isn't about you personally, it's the whole relationship.

[Robert]

Please return to the topic of the thread, folks. We've deleted the last 24 posts. ~6

[Leigh 87]

All the men that I've ever known who met "Miss Right", all knew by 6 months that they wanted to eventually propose.

 

My BF and I weren't into marriage; which of course changed and within 6 months he had already brought up how stunning he thought I would look in a wedding dress and other not so subtle hints.

 

Men who are indifferent towards marriage tend to want to propose to the rare women they truly cherish and fall hard enough for. Most men are indifferent or pro marriage.

 

My ex wanted to marry me. He knew after three weeks that I was the one he wanted to marry. He couldn't function when I left. That type of adoration runs deep and IS NEVER found in men who take several YEARS to know whether a girl is Miss Right.

 

You're boyfriend is either just not that into you (although I am sure he really likes you as a person and cares for you a lot), or he is legitimately AGAINST marriage.

 

NO man that fell head over heels and maintained adoration and respect over years, takes this long to propose. UNLESS he never wants to get married to anyone, ever.

[Mrlonelyone]

Well. OP I am not sure what to say. Maybe he's not the marrying type. Maybe for whatever reason he does not think of you as a potential wife. You need to decide for yourself what you want. May I ask one question.

 

Original Poster, did you ever consider proposing to him?

 

It is possible he is not 110% that you would say yes. Even if you have said you want that in the past.

[BlackCherry]

Well. OP I am not sure what to say. Maybe he's not the marrying type. Maybe for whatever reason he does not think of you as a potential wife. You need to decide for yourself what you want. May I ask one question.

 

Original Poster, did you ever consider proposing to him?

 

It is possible he is not 110% that you would say yes. Even if you have said you want that in the past.

 

 

He absolutely knows she would say yes.

 

My take is that this has become a bit of a tug of war, even if he had wanted to marry you at some point (and from his actions I don't think he ever did), the constant pressure has put him in a position where he can't propose now without it essentially being him acquiescing to her demands. No matter how romantic the proposal, they will both know in their hearts it was forced not given, and it'll take away any joy and excitement. OP you gotta think beyond the big question and imagine how you'll feel planning a wedding alone with this guy dragging his heels, and walking down the aisle knowing he doesn't want to be there. It's so sad.

 

I don't blame you for wanting to get married and I think a lot of posters are being harsh on you. You were in your early twenties when you got together, and no doubt he said or you heard the right things being said. Over time your hope has diminished, but nobody would find it easy to walk away from someone they loved, knowing it could be another few weeks or months until the proposal comes.

 

But the pressure tactics have lost you any real bargaining ground. All you can do now is calmly tell him you want a relationship including marriage, and then set yourself a mental deadline and shut up. I think you can give it three to six months, and if he hasn't proposed you calmly walk away. You have time to meet someone who wants these things, I promise.

 

If marriage is so important to you you're only happy to have a relationship that leads to it, that's your prerogative many share and you will never be happy with this man.

[elaine567]

But the pressure tactics have lost you any real bargaining ground. All you can do now is calmly tell him you want a relationship including marriage, and then set yourself a mental deadline and shut up. I think you can give it three to six months, and if he hasn't proposed you calmly walk away. You have time to meet someone who wants these things, I promise.

 

Seems to me that when a woman stops bringing a subject up that is a cause of conflict between them, most men then think she has given up, that it is all sorted, that she is happy to accept his POV, that he has "won".

I think stating her POV and then waiting another 3-6 months is probably a waste of time here.

He knows what she wants, he is just in no mind to give it to her.

As the OP doesn't appear to want to walk away right now, it is however as good as strategy as any other.

[Mrlonelyone]

Seems to me that when a woman stops bringing a subject up that is a cause of conflict between them, most men then think she has given up, that it is all sorted, that she is happy to accept his POV, that he has "won".

I think stating her POV and then waiting another 3-6 months is probably a waste of time here.

He knows what she wants, he is just in no mind to give it to her.

As the OP doesn't appear to want to walk away right now, it is however as good as strategy as any other.

 

This if the op wants change she has to make it happen. Walking away may make him realize what he's going to live without. Now, he has what he wants.

[NuevoYorko]

Why do you think it is, or how is it, I should say, that some men "know" with right away, or soon, and other men (like the one in question on this thread) don't know? Does he really already "know"?

I don't think they necessarily consciously "know." They are just doing what they intend to do, which, in this case, is maintaining the status quo.

 

If they break up, the OP's guy may not ever feel like marrying anybody else either

 

How can a person know that they are dating someone who wants to marry, and who wants to marry them in particular? Do you think one year is long enough to get on to the next step? Meaning proposal?

 

As I've said in your own thread, I believe that a person who has a clear GOAL of getting married really needs to ONLY date others who have the same clearly stated goal. Not people who "might for the right person." People who definitely ARE gong to get married when they meet the right person. That way, all the getting-to-know and dating will be with the same goal in mind. If either one realizes that they are not dating their future spouse, they will break it off and move on towards their goal. It will be very balanced, since carrying on would be a waste of time for both of them equally. Probably between about 6 months to a year, a couple will know whether they want to commit to spending the rest of their lives together.

 

Many people don't care if they get married or not; plenty of times couples like this end up together and deciding together to get married. Some people are not going to marry. If you're dating with the goal of marriage, you are making a big mistake if you "go with the flow" or try to sway someone who is not just where you are.

 

The OP's bf clearly does NOT want to get married to her, or else she would know it and they would not be fighting when she brings it up. He may "think" that he "might" marry her "someday." That is not meaningful in the situation.

 

This OP needs to either accept this relationship just as it is, today, or move on.

[kendahke]

This if the op wants change she has to make it happen. Walking away may make him realize what he's going to live without. Now, he has what he wants.

 

I knew a woman (ex friend, actually) who did exactly this. She was dating him, then moved in with him and lived with him, but wanted marriage. AFter about a year of that, she moved out. He came up off of a marriage proposal and they got married.

 

10 years and two children later, she cheated on him with another married guy and now she's divorced and remarried to her cheat partner.

 

And the crusher? I liked him before she even though about him. I told her and she decided she liked him. One day after leaving work late, I came around the corner of the building to see them both dressed up going out on a date. When she turned around and saw me, she literally cringed in shame. Needless to say, that was the end of our friendship. Dude passed up a good woman to be with her and now, he's divorced and paying alimony/child support. Tough rocks to him-his woman picker is damaged, to be sure.

[Mrlonelyone]

I knew a woman (ex friend, actually) who did exactly this. She was dating him, then moved in with him and lived with him, but wanted marriage. AFter about a year of that, she moved out. He came up off of a marriage proposal and they got married.

 

10 years and two children later, she cheated on him with another married guy and now she's divorced and remarried to her cheat partner.

 

And the crusher? I liked him before she even though about him. I told her and she decided she liked him. One day after leaving work late, I came around the corner of the building to see them both dressed up going out on a date. When she turned around and saw me, she literally cringed in shame. Needless to say, that was the end of our friendship. Dude passed up a good woman to be with her and now, he's divorced and paying alimony/child support. Tough rocks to him-his woman picker is damaged, to be sure.

 

You see this OP and others who may read this.

 

Basic human nature is to want what is hard to obtain more than what is easy to have. Marriage is a way to earmark that hard to obtain person and brand them as "This is my woman" or "This is my man".

 

If you are a woman and you are with a man for years, live with him, take care of him, have sex with him, have his kids ... what is there left for him to get out of marrying you?

 

It is a basic law of nature. Objects in motion will stay in motion and objects at rest stay at rest unless acted upon by an outside force. The state of a system does not change unless acted upon. If you are in a relationship but not married unless one of you acts you will be in that state forever.

[Pill]

I know better than that, we have a cleaner that comes 4 times a week Who does his laundry as well.

 

And I don't cook either........

 

If all my friends weren't married or laiden with kids I would definitely go on a holiday for a few weeks and then he would soon know if he missed me. But who wants to go away on their own

So why do you think you're entitled to his proposal? Is it because you've shown yourself to be marriage material and have sacrificial love for him m or because you just happen to be his GF and you want to be married right now?

[ClaraCAKES]

So why do you think you're entitled to his proposal? Is it because you've shown yourself to be marriage material and have sacrificial love for him m or because you just happen to be his GF and you want to be married right now?

 

Actually I want to know the relationship is going in that direction, because it's something I want.

 

Are you implying that a woman is only entitled to a proposal if they cook and clean for a man!

[CaliforniaGirl]

I would never live with a man before marriage if I know in my heart that's what I want.

 

He doesn't feel a NEED to get married.

 

Who "needs" to get married?

 

We're not queens attempting to reconcile warring kingdoms through combined offspring or something.

 

People don't usually get married because they "feel a need" to...they get married because THIS is the person they want "forever" with and they want to cement and express it in a certain cultural way.

 

I wouldn't want someone to marry me because he felt he needed to...I mean or else what? I'd run away? Or...he needed to because I was pregnant with his child or something...? I don't know...I guess I just disagree with this view, as nearly all the people I know married because of a great feeling of love and a great desire to stay together and express that the way people traditionally express it, and for many, because they wanted children and marriage seems more stable for that, etc., but that second part could be anybody...people who want to get married in order to have children still reject suitors if they don't love them enough...etc.

 

I don't think forcing a feeling of need or panic or anything else is the way to go in order to "get" someone to marry you (not saying the person I quoted said this, I'm just sort of taking this to a potential conclusion).

[Mrlonelyone]

Actually I want to know the relationship is going in that direction, because it's something I want.

 

Are you implying that a woman is only entitled to a proposal if they cook and clean for a man!

 

Since you asked OP... lots of men who are all "family values" and who see marriage as something they urgently want also want a woman who will full fill traditional stereotyped female roles.

 

That said, there are lots of men who want a woman who is an independent person who would be ok making more money and having a house husband.

 

It all comes down to compatibility and life goals. You want to be married and I imagine have children. As a woman you are time limited when it comes to children. If his life goals are not compatible with yours ...

 

There are two ways I see you can find out.

 

Propose to him. Buy the ring. Arrange a romantic location tell him how much he means to you and that you want to grow old fat and ugly with him. Put it all out there and see what he does.

 

OR

 

Leave him and see if he chooses to chase you down with a proposal then say yes.

 

Either way you'll know quick fast and in a hurry if you have compatible goals.

[CaliforniaGirl]

Actually I want to know the relationship is going in that direction, because it's something I want.

 

Are you implying that a woman is only entitled to a proposal if they cook and clean for a man!

 

Unfortunately, it IS possible (though of course none of us here can possibly "know" this is the case...this is literally a guess for your case in particular) that his internal vision of what a wife "should" be includes cooking and cleaning and that this is why he doesn't want to marry you.

 

BUT unless his previous "fiance" (that sounds odd...and kind of like a disaster) didn't cook or clean either, then that's probably off the table. Who knows.

 

However...yes, we do in fact have internal subconscious checklists of what makes a "husband" or a "wife" and yes, those ideas will color whom we decide we want to marry. That's natural, IMO...it's a very common thing.