Back Again ...

[GreatDadAlways]

for my own sanity.

 

 

I have been doing great. Newly married and never knew what happy could be. My ex-wife got engaged over the holidays and this was the last piece of solid info I needed. Filed for termination of spousal support since I can check all the boxes ... 1) Intimate Relationship, 2) Sharing Expenses and 3) Living Together.

 

 

Really no way to contest the evidence so what does she do ... Tells the kids I'm taking their home away from them. Now my children once again want nothing to do with me.

 

 

Why would a mother ever tell their kids something so terrible? I'm simply executing the agreement we entered into for the divorce. But for some reason she feels I am obligated to pay because her soon to be husband doesn't have the income potential I do.

 

 

Is this a classic "I want my cake and eat it too" or what. If she wasn't prepared for it then it's not exactly my problem. Have I done something wrong here?

 

 

Appreciate everyone's feedback.

[The_Onceler]

Hi Great Dad:

 

Your post doesn't have a ton of contextual information, so my comments will be fairly generic. First off, I would say that your ex made you look like the bad guy because something is mentally or emotionally wrong with her, and of course, she doesn't like what you have done. In short, she threw a tantrum.

 

I don't know you, but I suspect that even though you are petitioning to end spousal support, if your children were REALLY in a position where they might lose their home, you would likely step in and do something. I have said as much to my ex: I devoted myself to providing for my kids in every way from the moment of their conception. I am not going to stop that, now or ever, just because you and I don't get along.

 

It is worrisome to hear that your children "once again want nothing to do with you" as a result of what she told them. This seems to indicate some deeper troubles. I tell my kids all the time, words are only words. Yes, they have impact, but they do not shape reality. I can tell you as often as I want that I am ten feet tall, but regardless, I am still 6 foot 1. Your ex can tell them that you are taking their home away, and you can as easily tell them that you are not. Why is the default outcome that they hear her and ostracize you?

[GreatDadAlways]

Why is the default outcome that they hear her and ostracize you?

 

Onceler ... this is exactly the struggle I have had with my children. You have clearly understood where I'm coming from.

 

 

When I asked their permission to propose to my current wife they were elated. They quickly informed their mother of my engagement. They have not said a word about their mother getting engaged. I'm certain it's because they were told not to tell me.

 

 

As for taking their home away, it simply not true. But their mother has always positioned her home as their home and mine as dad's house. Her issue is we always had very nice homes. She is now in a very modest and quite small home. I have managed to return to my former standard of living and that angers her. It's also not true because she was awarded enough money to pay her home off. The reality is she doesn't want to because then she would have to get a job and build her own retirement.

 

 

She also doesn't like that fact that I upgraded. My wife is from a very well respected family. Despite all her efforts to trash my wife, there simply is nothing there. Her fiancé however, has a very shady record let alone being unemployed.

 

 

All this being said, she tries to make herself feel better by posting FB rants about me and trashing me to the kids. It all weighs heavily because my family was my priority. I work very hard as so many of us do to give them the best life possible. It's not my fault she chose a fiancé that doesn't have my income potential. Time for her to move on!

 

 

This to shall pass ...

[Mr. Lucky]

Your post doesn't have a ton of contextual information, so my comments will be fairly generic.

 

Agreed. If your kids are 5-8, shame on her. If they're 15-18, shame on them for being so easily swayed.

 

Do you pay child in addition to spousal support?

 

Mr. Lucky

[The_Onceler]

Great Dad: If you don't mind that I ask, what is your custody situation? My ex and I have a 50/50 custody agreement. I have found that, by spending so much time with them, their opinion of me is shaped more by what I do than by what their mother says.

 

I do find that the kids fear her more than me. For instance, my ex recently reminded me that our kids needed new shoes. She had just bought them boots, so I went out to buy then regular shoes. I let the kids choose their own, and my 8 year old chose a pair of Champion sneakers (among others).

 

Well, I just found out that she was told not to wear them. My ex feels that they are of insufficient quality, and might adversely impact the development of my daughter's feet.

 

I discovered this one morning when my daughter had gym class. I told her to put the sneakers on, and she refused. I was rushing around to get them out the door on time for the bus, so rather than slow down and listen, I just insisted that she stop fooling around and put on the sneakers.

 

The next thing I knew, she was in tears. So, THEN I slowed down to see what was the matter. In a nutshell, she knew that her mother would be picking her up from school, and she was afraid to have her mother find her in those sneakers.

 

Anyway, I guess my point is that while my ex cannot change their impression of me, she still is able to sway their behavior, even to the extent that they feel that they cannot obey me in those cases where my directions run counter to their mother's wishes. So, I get that your ex will be able to impact your kids, if she wants, but what about your situation allows her to shape their opinion of you?

 

 

And on that topic: if you are doing well, and their mother is not and is engaged to a jerk, are you in a position to attempt to get full custody? Are you interested in that? It sounds from these few posts that they might be better off with less of their mother and more of you.

[GreatDadAlways]

Three kids are 15 - 21. The 21 yr old has it figured out because she is on her own.

 

 

The other two are the issue. My parenting time is 50/50 in the summer and traditional 1 night each week and every other weekend during the school year.

 

 

Things do seem to be worse during the school year when I have less time with them.

[Marc878]

Time will fix this. Stay steady

[Marc878]

I think your biggest issue is you may be too much of a Mr Nice Guy.

 

Read up "No More Mr Nice Guy" free PDF download

[GreatDadAlways]

It was a relaxing weekend and then bam! My youngest daughter asks "why are you trying to take moms child support away?". I didn't avoid the question and told her this was not true. I explained that there are many factors involved and that it's between her mom an I. I did clarify, however, that all of this was agreed upon in the divorce decree. Her response was very direct "Well I know you are trying to ruin mom's life and that means you are ruining my life."

 

 

Clearly manipulation from my ex and it's so sad. My daughter should not even know what's going on. We haven't even had a hearing yet.

 

 

Trying to stay strong but hurts deeply thinking my kids want nothing to do with me and may never again want anything to do with me. All because I am executing our agreement and they are being manipulated.

[aliveagain]

Get your kid's counselling then find a way through the counsellor to correct the misinformation they are being fed by your ex wife. Children should never be dragged into adult drama, shame on your ex for using your children to manipulate and extort you. Perhaps you should go for full custody if she and her broke fiancé can't afford to raise your children. Talk to a lawyer and a counsellor for advice.

[Mr. Lucky]

It was a relaxing weekend and then bam! My youngest daughter asks "why are you trying to take moms child support away?".

 

Is this child support or spousal support at issue?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Ronni_W]

Her response was very direct "Well I know you are trying to ruin mom's life and that means you are ruining my life." <snip> Trying to stay strong but hurts deeply

Hugs, GreatDadAlways.

I echo what aliveagain suggested, above. I'd also offer to interview a number of counselors until something instinctively 'clicks'.

 

Your daughter, at 15 y/o, is of reasonable age to know better -- unfortunately, it cannot ALL be put on your ex even though she most likely is the original cause. (We cannot discount the extent of the influence, if any exists at all, of your ex's current partner or other outside people.)

 

If your daughter's personality and attitude might allow it, you could perhaps start meeting her on a more adult level, along the lines of: "Hon, whether or not you want to know it right now, that is hurtful and not at all true. I am, in fact, trying to be reasonable and fair -- without sacrificing or ruining my own life."

 

I believe there are books on co-parenting teenagers and young adults -- the counselor could probably offer you a list.

 

Best of luck through this very difficult stage.

[GreatDadAlways]

This continues to be harder than expected. My ex actually said last night that I made a choice to drag the kids through the divorce stress again. Interesting considering her infidelity led to the divorce in the first place.

 

 

The kids continue to ignore my attempts to communicate. They clearly have no interest in my explanation of what's going on and only listen to their mom's twisted version of the truth.

 

 

I want to believe that this too shall pass. But it hurts deeply.

 

 

How can I open the lines of communication with my kids so they can realize my desire to terminate spousal support has nothing to do with them?

[Ronni_W]

How can I open the lines of communication with my kids so they can realize my desire to terminate spousal support has nothing to do with them?

Unfortunately, it's impossible to give any truly helpful, constructive input on that, from this side of our keyboards and screens.

 

You can consult with psychologists who specialize in working with people in your children's age-group(s) -- this, I think, is your best bet and source for proper guidance and suggestions for your individual situation.

 

Hugs, and best of luck.

[aileD]

Your kids aren't that young...they will figure it out. Maybe you need to have more open honest conversation with them so they don't wonder about things. I always told my kids the backstory and facts on things (other family stuff, never been in this situation)...and it kind of gives them a clearer understanding.

 

Tell them straight out, ok lets talk so I can explain things to you and you can hace all the information. Explain that you pay child support for them and that will not change, you will never leave them out, you will always take care of them.

 

Then explain that when you got divorced, the agreement was that you would pay some spousal support to help her get back on her feet but it would end if and when she entered another marriage/serious relationship/however you explained it. And that's simply all this is. It's stated clearly in the divorce papers, their mom agreed to it in the divorce, and she knew by getting engaged that this would happen so she should have been preparing herself for the loss of that income.

 

Add that you will always pay your child support and if the kids find themselves needing something that mom is unable to provide that they can come to you and you and their mom can work something out to work together to do the best for the kids.

 

End with that you love your kids, and you aren't trying to hurt their mom or them, you're just doing what everyone agreed to when you got divorced and you understand that their mom is upset about it but you love them and will always love them and be there for them.

 

Your kids are older, they should understand this if you just give a little more background info. Then when mom puts you down at home, they may say to themselves "well you knew this would happen if you got married again, it's not a surprise and it's not dad's fault"

 

 

on a side note, your ex wife is awful.

[Mr. Lucky]

It was a relaxing weekend and then bam! My youngest daughter asks "why are you trying to take moms child support away?".

 

Tell them straight out, ok lets talk so I can explain things to you and you can have all the information. Explain that you pay child support for them and that will not change, you will never leave them out, you will always take care of them.

 

GDA, this is why I was trying to confirm that spousal support is the issue. With a 15-yr old, I assume you pay child support also. aileD's answer is on point.

 

Way back when, my ex took our son to Hawaii for "vacation" and then refused to come back. I found out later she told our young son it was because "daddy doesn't want to spend time with you". Like you, broke my heart that he would even think that.

 

All you can do is play the hand you're dealt. This means being the best parent you can be - both directly and indirectly - as opportunities present themselves. My son figured things out over time, today as an adult he's closer to my wife and I than he is to his mom. Think long term...

 

Mr. Lucky

[PhillyLibertyBelle]

Call your ex-wife's bluff. Ask for a meeting with your kids and your ex-wife to "set the record straight". If she wants to involve the kids, and they are old enough (which it seems they are) put her in a forum where she can't lie.

 

If your youngest is 15, your ex doesn't need to be a SAHM. Shame on her.

[GreatDadAlways]

Definitely not the woman I married that's for sure.

 

 

She was a stay at home mom that became bored. I worked long hours to give my family what I thought they wanted and deserved. Yet I was still involved with my kids driving to dance, coaching, etc.

 

 

I knew she wasn't the same person when I had to fight for my right to continue participating. What mother believes the father should just drop out of their children's lives? She was divorcing me ... I wasn't divorcing my children.

 

 

Unfortunately, these episodes are a continuous reminder that to her I don't exist and I'm just an inconvenience.

 

 

I find this all very odd after 23 years. What on earth does she have to gain by trashing me to the kids and anyone who will listen?

[Ronni_W]

What on earth does she have to gain by trashing me to the kids and anyone who will listen?

GreatDadAlways,

It's not going to help you at all, to just keep mulling over and asking the same questions and types of questions for which only your ex-wife has the answers.

 

At some point, you just need to stop with the thoughts and feelings of how wrong you are being done by, by her; it ends up being just victim mentality that you get stuck in and become known for. It is a state that cannot and will not help you to live up to your moniker - which I guess also represents your highest vision and goals for yourself. Thus, do not allow yourself to any longer wallow and spiral even lower into this mindset.

 

Of course it's extremely painful and frustrating and confusing and discombobulating. But. All of the stuff that got you to this very point is all ready done and dusted. Now,

not only for yourself but also for your children, you need to look ahead and make a plan for who you're gonna be and how you're gonna present to the world -- and just stick to fulfilling that vision and plan.

 

There are no more question about the past or about your ex's behaviour that are gonna be helpful or supportive of your future, and how you are going to be, in the future,

for your children. You are their Great Dad, Always.

 

Be that!

[aliveagain]

They hate it when your happy and move on specially when they realize they traded a diamond for a tu*d. Your the best thing that ever happened to her and she knows this. It's like she's trying to guilt the children into getting you to come back to her. She's someone else's problem now. I like the idea of disclosing the truth to them in the presence of a counsellor. Don't waste precious time with your children because of falsehoods that are scripted from the imagination of a woman that doesn't live in reality.

[Mr. Lucky]

I like the idea of disclosing the truth to them in the presence of a counsellor.

 

Might be in the minority but I don't think this is a good idea. Hauling your kids into "counseling court" for some kind of trial to determine the winner risks deepening the division.

 

GDA, if you're kids were younger than 15/21, a different approach would make sense. But they're old enough to figure this out on their own. Be a rock, don't stray from your principles and they'll come around.

 

Now,not only for yourself but also for your children, you need to look ahead and make a plan for who you're gonna be and how you're gonna present to the world -- and just stick to fulfilling that vision and plan.

 

Amen...

 

Mr. Lucky

[benpom]

OP, I can see why you are not happy about this whole situation: you finally see a relief, but she is dragging you down. She divorced you, but she is not happy you moved on.

 

Legally, you can stop paying child support, if the divorce decree says so. But if that's indeed the case, I think her lawyer did not do a good job at the divorce. Child support is meant for children, and they should not go away unless her income increases significantly (IMHO). Alimony support is a totally different issue though.

 

I don't know what happened in your marriage, but I do know it is very hard for a single mother to start over the career after a long break. For me personally, I gave up my career and followed my ex-husband to a small town where he got his dream job. My income was almost twice of his before that. If I stayed on my career path, our income level should be about the same. But the reality is that after 5 years of a being a stay-at-home mother, I cannot get back to where I was before, mainly because of the geographic limitation. I worked very hard for a new career as a salesperson, and it failed. It has been almost a year since our separation, and I am still struggling with my career. I am about to start trying another career path. If my children's life quality has to go down significantly because of this, I would be very upset with my ex-husband, especially because he was the first person to open a big crack in our marriage. He acknowledges his fault in the marriage, but he blames me as the reason why he divorced me. (yeah of course, he would not divorce me for his own fault.) Anyway, I am not holding him hostage forever. I only asked one year of alimony support. I am actually quite grateful he has a good career. It makes my kids' life better. Indirectly, it makes my life easier too. I may not get back to where I was in career because of geographic limitation, but I will just do my best to play the cards I am dealt with. I knew this is a possibility when I gave up my career. In general, he is still a pretty good person (otherwise I would have never chosen him in the first place). But it is so damn hard to start over a career when my choices are limited to a small town.

Edited February 9, 2017 by benpom

[benpom]

Might be in the minority but I don't think this is a good idea. Hauling your kids into "counseling court" for some kind of trial to determine the winner risks deepening the division.

 

I agree with you, Mr. Lucky. I also think it's not a good idea to haul the kids into "counseling court".

 

To children, losing a stable family is already hard enough. If I were a child in this case dragged into "counseling court", I would feel like being told these words by daddy: sweetie, I have to stop supporting you financially. It's your mom's responsibility now, even though she can't afford it. I can afford it, but I hate her more than I love you. Me being right is more important than your well-being. I will let your life get worse and watch but refuse to help. I can't be on your side. But remember, I am the good guy, so you should be on my side.

[Ronni_W]

I like the idea of disclosing the truth to them in the presence of a counsellor.

Might be in the minority but I don't think this is a good idea. Hauling your kids into "counseling court"

The idea for using a counselor as a 'mediator' of sorts, is to ensure that the children are not bombarded and overwhelmed by the angry words and counter-accusations of their parents. It's intended as a safe place for the children to be made aware of the truth and to be given 'just the facts' - while also being protected, by a properly-trained professional, from all of the hurt, blame, resentment, pain that each of their parents have not yet properly processed or don't know how to use constructively to begin to create a new future that will be both positive and happy for all involved.