Fighting fair and how to repair the relationship when your'e exhausted

[ms.x]

This is my first time posting on any site about my relationship. I feel uncomfortable. I have talked a little with a close friend, but I am concerned (since I live in a small community) that my husband will feel humiliated knowing that I'm hashing things out with friends and neighbors. So first off, thank you to whoever reads this and responds. You don't even know me. I'll try my best to describe the situation.

 

My husband has been more irritable than usual lately. Sometimes we have conversations and I get the sense that he feels put off by something I've said, but instead of telling me what it is, he denies feeling upset, for days even. He assures me that he thinks it's better to stew and not say anything he'll regret. But then I worry about what "it" is. I admit that this time I pushed him to talk, after three days of preoccupation on his part, and he ended up telling me he was worried I've just lied to him about how I felt about our life together, our plans for the future. He gave examples of times he thought I was rebelling against our future plans (which involve a big traveling adventure) and not showing enough enthusiasm. I have a hard time showing authentic, original feelings about these plans because he is often very anxious they won't happen, that he won't be happy in life if they don't, and demanding to talk about how we are going to do it, step by step, at inopportune moments (like right before bed when I need to sleep).

 

I've decided to be very honest with him about how I think and feel about our plan so far, and I do feel like we reached some kind of common ground, but ever since then he is quick to anger, and has steered other conversations toward argument several times. Once this week I wanted some support or encouragement from him because I was feeling overwhelmed with my current workload, and he said that he thought I could do all of the things I was worried about, and "if you're unhappy with your life, it's your own damn fault!"

We had another argument this week and the next morning he left the house without telling me anything. Later, when I told him I don't like that and I want him to at least leave me a text message, he shouted in my face about how I could have just called him instead of worrying.

 

He has been having a lot of arguments at work, shouting at people and calling them names. This week he has also called me cowardly, and I disagree with him. I don't know what's going on. I feel like he's changed suddenly. I'm trying to be assertive, but have this feeling that maybe I have set a bad precedent and tried to please him too much in the past. Maybe I've tried to ask less of him in the relationship and now that things are getting "real" (with plans, and me going through a temporary period of overwhelm), he feels intolerant of that.

 

Listen, I have no idea what's going on. Could someone help me? Is this "fair" fighting? Should I be more assertive than I've been? He wants me to feel comfortable and close with him but I don't feel very trusting after all these fights. How do I get back there in a real way, without slapping on a happy face?

 

Edit: Just to give some background, my own parents had a very unhappy but superficially "good" relationship before they divorced. As a child I experienced some mild emotional abuse, and I've been in relationships with emotionally abusive men before (so I may be on "high alert" about things and I feel like I have no concept of what is healthy beyond what I can read from a book).

Edited February 13, 2017 by ms.x

[Lady2163]

From what you've written, he does sound a bit....well, abusive.

 

I'm usually very even keel and I don't get revved up about much. I'm in the Midwest, we often have a flat affect and don't emphasize when we speak. Yet, a few months ago, a family member came into MY house and screamed at me about something they were wrong about. It escalated to me whipping out the C word and telling them to gtfo. I NEVER name call, I think it is a sign of insecurity to name call, I think it is unfair in fights and in almost 50 years of living I had never used the C word except in jokes.

 

So, when you write that he wants you to be close to him and forthcoming, but then he shuts you down (it's your own damn fault) that isn't cool. Something is bothering him and personally I think step one would be a full medical workup just to make sure everything is functioning correctly.

 

Maybe you would benefit from some counseling - both IC and MC. Counselors can help you both learn to communicate and discuss things without fighting. It could take a couple different counselors. I know people who give up when the first one doesn't help, but sometimes you have to try two or three before they click. Our marriage counselor was worthless and while I fell out of love with my ex husband long before we divorced, I wish I had tried others before throwing in the towel.

 

Your husband is also using his approval and mere presence (or lack thereof) as a weapon. He gets mad, so he slights you however he can. Leaving in the morning without saying goodbye is pretty petty.

 

Good luck.

[ms.x]

As I'm typing this I realize I might sound like I'm justifying his behavior, but I think he learned to fight in a more intense way from his parents, who both valued fighting as a way to work through things and get closer. My parents fought privately and I never saw. But now I'm thinking of all the things that make me wonder if the dynamic is abusive, like that he is very cold when I cry. There are also some things he has done in the past (before we started dating) that disturbed me. He had a girlfriend who was a vegetarian and purposely made her walk through a meat market as a way of teasing her (and she cried, which he said he felt bad for) and he once hit a small dog with his motorcycle on purpose. I feel sick writing that. It feels surreal, like it's a secret I've had to keep about him. He was just a teenager when it happened, but that doesn't excuse it at all. He is very well-respected in our community and most of the time I feel OK with him. This is really hard for me because I am terrified of being on my own. We have two small children. He is good with them. Ironically, I feel like the crazy one. He doesn't call me conventionally mean names. He's more critical in a lecturing sort of way, making me feel as if I'm not seeing things correctly, and telling me how I am or how things work. I've chalked it up to emotional immaturity or something new that's bothering him. But I have only considered any of this abusive for the past two days. So I'm kind of in shock.

[basil67]

So, this is new behaviour and he's doing it at work and at home? Sounds to me like he's got a mental health issue going on. I'd start with taking him to a doctor before thinking about counselling.

 

Have you approached him with the attitude of "I'm worried about you"? Would he go to the GP with you to discuss this?

[ms.x]

I haven't yet, but I haven't put the two together until recently. He seems surprised at himself when he talks about fights at work. He has a job that is difficult to get fired from, and his coworkers are trying, but still. Maybe I'll try that.

[basil67]

I haven't yet, but I haven't put the two together until recently. He seems surprised at himself when he talks about fights at work. He has a job that is difficult to get fired from, and his coworkers are trying, but still. Maybe I'll try that.

 

I don't want to alarm you (perhaps I've watched too many medical TV shows), but I'd also be considering a brain scan if no mental health issue is found.

[mightycpa]

He's fighting emotionally and not rationally. You might want to tell him that you want to discuss fighting.

 

Start out by asking him why he fights with you. Ask him if he fights to solve problems or to make himself feel better by unleashing his anger on you?

 

From what you write, I don't think he's trying to solve problems. I think he resents you for something or many things, I don't know, and his outbursts are evidence that he's hiding this from you, but that resentment needs to come out, and that's how it happens.

 

If this is the case, then he can start to discuss with the purpose of solving whatever the problems are. For example, he might resent you because you don't seem to have an interest in his grand adventure. That might be solved by scheduling time to plan it together. But he has to say the words first, and that will allow the resentment to disappear.

 

I don't know the rest of the issues. You probably have an inkling, but it will be a lot better if he knows that he can tell you and you won't sulk or cry about it.

[ms.x]

mightycpa I have a feeling he would be more receptive to your strategy than me telling him to go to the doctor because he might have a brain tumor. I'll watch for signs, though. I tend not to cry and sulk, so I don't think that's the issue. He's said that when he feels anxious he tends to lash out, and I do notice that it makes sense that it would be what's behind him wanting to control the conversation about his grand adventure. Maybe we're at an impasse? I've tried to say and show that I want to be honest and talk about it. Scheduling time to talk about it sounds like a great idea, but I doubt that he'll bring it up. I could take initiative on that.

[ms.x]

Well, it turns out he was offended by me expressing worry about the pattern of fighting with me and at work. When I tried asking about what might be going on beyond the details of our individual fights, and expressed interest in knowing (calmly, politely, and because I care about our relationship), he denied anything. He told me he didn't remember much from our fights or what were the "takeaways" and he said he was afraid we'd have another fight. I told him it's important to me that he try not to yell hurtful things at me during fights. He focused mostly on trying to convince me he wasn't yelling (that it was just "raising my voice" or loud talking) and that I had responsibility in our fights and he felt like I was putting all the blame on him. I stayed very calm and said I know there are things I'm responsible for (and I named a few), but I am just asking you to try not to yell hurtful things at me during a fight. It came to a point where he refused to talk. I had just said that I want him to show me that he cares about repairing the damage in our relationship, and that being willing to address this is a way to do that, and it would help me feel more comfortable, which I know he wants.

 

I don't know what to make of it. I'm glad I stayed calm and observed our interactions a little more, but I did notice that he tried to deflect and his general tone was cold, fatigued, and irritated. I know we are both exhausted, but isn't there a healthier way to respond to your partner when they feel hurt or want to talk about fighting more fairly? I feel like he tries to make me think this is normal, but I don't think it is. Abusive or not, it seems like showing care is the last thing he wants to do right now, and I feel awful about that.

[BaileyB]

He needs to find a good counsellor. What he's doing - becoming defensive, shifting the blame to you, and giving you the silent treatment/cold shoulder - he is not fighting fair in any way and this is not ok. This is definitely not normal - what he is doing is not a healthy or respectful way of communicating with your partner.

 

Of course, you don't want to trust him right now and make yourself vulnerable to him... To be close to him or be affectionate now would be like hugging a porcupine.

 

I would strongly suggest counselling - individual counselling for him and marriage counselling for both of you. If he resists, then that tells you a lot...

[Popsicle]

What's wrong with taking a "grand adventure" (as you phrased it)? What is your problem with it? Why wouldn't you want to do that?

 

Sounds lovely to me. Maybe he should find a woman who would be thrilled to go on a grand adventure.

 

There is obviously more to this than you are telling us. Do you want to have a baby or something and he doesn't?

[d0nnivain]

For whatever reason this grand travel adventure is incredibly important to him. You are not 100% behind this trip & it's wearing on your marriage.

 

 

I think you both could benefit from a good marriage counselor to get to the root of the problem. If he's using the trip to prove his value to himself (which I'm not saying is a healthy plan) your doubts undermine his self esteem.

 

 

However, without professional intervention he does not seem open to listening to you which exacerbates the problem.

 

 

You also said you are afraid to be alone. Staying in an unhealthy unfulfilling relationship because you are afraid to be alone is equally damaging.

 

 

Stop trying to fix this without professional insight.

[fivegrands]

I'm so sorry for what you are experiencing in your marriage. You sound very upset and concerned. I agree with others that counseling would definitely be in order, but since you live in a small town your husband may be uncomfortable that friends would find out, and so reject this option. I am concerned that emotional abuse may be going on, or even bullying. However, these possibilities should only be addressed within the environment of professional counseling and not in your home. For starters, how about trying to follow these tips for "fighting fair":

 

1. Start your sentences with "I" instead of "You" — "I feel frustrated when we're late" is easier to hear than "You always make us late."

 

2. Keep your fighting away from your kids — unless you model how to resolve it in front of them.

 

3. Stay clear of "character assassination" — don't assign negative labels to each other (e.g., "You're so lazy").

 

4. If you need a timeout, take it — but agree on when you'll come back.

Avoid expressing contempt by rolling your eyes or being sarcastic — it's toxic to your relationship.

 

Remember that all couples have arguments. You are 2 different people with 2 different opinions in many areas. It is important to concede when you can, so that you can stand your ground when needed, without your spouse feeling like he always gives in to you.

[mightycpa]

Well, it turns out he was offended by me expressing worry about the pattern of fighting with me and at work. When I tried asking about what might be going on beyond the details of our individual fights, and expressed interest in knowing (calmly, politely, and because I care about our relationship), he denied anything. He told me he didn't remember much from our fights or what were the "takeaways" and he said he was afraid we'd have another fight. I told him it's important to me that he try not to yell hurtful things at me during fights. He focused mostly on trying to convince me he wasn't yelling (that it was just "raising my voice" or loud talking) and that I had responsibility in our fights and he felt like I was putting all the blame on him. I stayed very calm and said I know there are things I'm responsible for (and I named a few), but I am just asking you to try not to yell hurtful things at me during a fight. It came to a point where he refused to talk. I had just said that I want him to show me that he cares about repairing the damage in our relationship, and that being willing to address this is a way to do that, and it would help me feel more comfortable, which I know he wants.

 

I don't know what to make of it. I'm glad I stayed calm and observed our interactions a little more, but I did notice that he tried to deflect and his general tone was cold, fatigued, and irritated. I know we are both exhausted, but isn't there a healthier way to respond to your partner when they feel hurt or want to talk about fighting more fairly? I feel like he tries to make me think this is normal, but I don't think it is. Abusive or not, it seems like showing care is the last thing he wants to do right now, and I feel awful about that.

You shouldn't. From what you've written, I'm convinced he's holding back on you, not telling you deep down inside what's really bothering him. He probably doesn't want to say the words.

 

You should encourage him to write it down until the written words express exactly what he's feeling. It may take a dozen drafts or more to get it right, so give him some time. Tell him to let you know when he's done it. When he tells you, just have him read it to you.

 

He's mindreading right now. He has determined if he says X, then you'll react Y, and he doesn't want to deal with that.

 

I'll bet he doesn't want to say what he's thinking because he knows it's going to hurt you and he's afraid it will jeopardize or worsen the relationship. All you have to do is convince him that maybe it will hurt, but you knowing can only make your relationship stronger and better. You have to make him understand that he has to stop being afraid of what he thinks you might do or feel.

[ms.x]

Wow. Thanks fivegrands, for your actually helpful advice.

 

We solved this problem on our own, in less time than any of these suggestions would take, because we are competent. I didn't even need to listen better and deeper way with pen and paper and tons of encouragement and the promise of no sulking and crying.

 

I wrote a tirade that I just accidentally deleted, so I'll keep this brief.

 

This is the wrong place to take relationship issues. If I weren't discerning, I'd be following all of this horrible advice and losing track of reality. I spent roughly two hours trying to figure out whether I was in an emotionally abusive relationship, but I'm sure I'm not. Really glad I didn't hit him with the trifecta of "marriage counselor NOW," "you are abusive," and "maybe you have a brain tumor."

 

And Popsicle ... just, wow. Thankfully I feel secure enough that your comment just seemed bizarre.

 

I'm getting the hell of this site because it's done more harm than good for me in a matter of less than a day. I wish I hadn't come.

 

But again, thankfully I have my own head on my shoulders and I can happily go upstairs and eat with my husband, who I just cuddled with for ten minutes.

 

I'm gonna GTFO, deactivate my account, and block this site for my own good. I have enough garden variety toxicity in my own life. I don't need this.

[Mr. Lucky]

For whatever reason this grand travel adventure is incredibly important to him. You are not 100% behind this trip & it's wearing on your marriage.

 

Agree but can't help wonder what the trip represents to him? ms.x, is this "adventure" part of retirement? Are there financial worries or other issues?

 

Your husband seems to have all his emotional eggs in this basket and he's threatened by your lack of similar buy-in. As always, communication is the key...

 

Mr. Lucky