Clarity and Missed Opportunities

[BourneWicked]

Today I had a moment of clarity, and a missed opportunity.

 

I was being weird, he said. I was being weird because for a moment while I stood at his desk and looked at his family pictures, I saw how others see him. I saw his family, his ring. His entire life that he built that has nothing to do with me. None of it has anything to do with me. And I felt sad. I felt distanced. It was a lightning flash of awareness that our lives are trains on separate tracks, going to opposite ocean coasts, where the sun sets at different times.

 

I wanted to say, “I don’t want to do this anymore.”

 

And because it was so sudden, and so painful, I didn’t say anything at all.

 

Because I was 4 PM hangry, tired from a sleepless night with a snuffly three year old, I was silent.

 

I hate myself for what I started with him.

 

I hate myself for not taking this opportunity. An opportunity to say thank you, I’ve enjoyed your company, your intelligence, your sweetness, cleverness, and kindness, but I can’t do this to myself anymore.

 

We don’t contact outside of work. We can’t text, we can’t be facebook friends. Because we aren’t friends. Because I ruined that.

 

I'm not really looking for sympathy, or advice. I wouldn't mind hearing some experiences though. I'm just hoping I can grab hold of that same clarity again and use it. I know I need to stop. In the end, the longer it goes on, the sadder it makes me. I know it's a fantasy, a lie, a poorly written romance novel.

 

It's just that these feelings and strong connections don't come by much in life. It's hard to shake, even though everything and everyone tells you that it's wrong.

 

The feeling of clarity is the reality. It's popping the bubble and coming to the surface. That first breath burns the lungs and hurts like hell, but it's what I need to survive. Everything below the surface is just a shimmery, pretty illusion.

 

Thanks for listening to my ramble

[Grey Cloud]

Unfortunately these moments of painful clarity are going to become more frequent and continue to bite you.

 

I also worked with my xMM and much the same story - our main contact was at work, weren't Facebook friends etc. I also stood at his desk one day and saw his family photos (it was only later that I discovered he had stuffed a framed photo of him and his wife in his top drawer as it made him feel guilty!).

 

This is not a real relationship. It will continue to become more painful for you and you will discover that the pain of being in the affair becomes greater than the pain of ending it.

 

You haven't missed an opportunity. You have plenty of opportunities every minute of every single day to end this as it's a dead end road to nowhere.

 

The good thing is that your blinkers are coming off and you are more aware of your reality. Ending it will be painful but so will staying in it.

 

It will take you months to recover and get over this (especially if you work with him). So why not start that process now?

 

I wish you all the best.

[minimariah]

wow, your writing is beautiful! you have a way with words, for sure... you seem very articulate. i'm sending you lots of virtual hugs and hopefully - you'll post more!

[Lifeisgood1]

You need a replacement pill. It should help! All the best!

[sunrise_sunset]

Bourne – had to respond to you – this is my first post/response in a while, because I’ve been just plodding along with LC with my xMM at work. I had a setback in January that threw me right back to square one, but we’ve been NC outside the office for almost 4 weeks, and just LC at the office during that time. The office. So fxxking hard.

 

Anyway, I’m just piecing together your own story – you work together, yes? I’m trying so hard to work out an alternative job situation (so many factors involved in trying to figure out an exit strategy) -- are you? My xMM and I...we are from such different worlds (hence my screen name – we would never have connected if it hadn’t been for the job). But thanks to posts from amazing folks like GreyCloud, MidnightBlue and HeCan’tBreakMe, I’ve realized it’s close to impossible to stay at the office. I don’t have pictures plastered all over my office, and neither does he, but most colleagues know of our families and our children, and even this week, I heard one of my colleagues mention him and his family and their recent vacation (I’ve done so well avoiding all these conversations until that moment – but it’s a constant challenge).

 

Are you in both EA and PA (I have been in both)? And has it reached some kind of ending? And are you plodding along in a confused state of LC at work – like me? For me, there was no DDay, there was no big gigantic dramatic ending, he just simply ghosted me after 1+ year of amazing highs, and terrible –heart wrenching lows. This second year has been harder – I have been working through milestones that we keep hitting (at this time last year, etc etc…New Year's, Valentine’s Day last year)…) – I can’t wait until the day I can be OK with the milestones.

 

For the first time in my life, I have reached out to a therapist to work through this. My first appt is next week. I have to figure out where my relationship with my H stands in all this (we are pals, quite distant, no intimacy in years, etcetc), and I have to figure out how to successfully get past the A (especially while at the office). Not ONE PERSON in my life knows a thing. It’s killing me slowly. Does anyone in your world know what you're going through? I know I have to talk to someone other than these wonderful folks at LS. But the stories here? The sharing? The fights – the bonding – they are the only thing keeping me afloat much of the time.

 

I don’t want to do this anymore either. Like I said – we never had a real breakup, but I would give ANYTHING to say what you wrote. “I can’t do this. I’ve enjoyed your company – everything about you, etc etc. But I am done. Goodbye.” I’d give anything to have that opportunity.

 

When will that time come for us?

[BourneWicked]

Thank you Grey Cloud - I read some of your story at it sounds so much like my own. The MM is not a bad guy, relatively honest, but making the same kind of mistakes that we are.

 

I know I will have this opportunity again. I want to say it in the right way. Because the MM is so much like myself. That he's looking for love and acceptance from me that he really needs to get from himself. (Not to say he isn't looking for sex from me, but the feeling of recognition and acceptance we get from each other is a drug in itself). To ghost him would be the same as the experience that women here have when their MM drops off the face of the earth. I want to tell him why, but I need to let him go.

 

To clarify - I'm not married but in an LTR (going on 8 years). I think there is a reason I'm not married, and this is part of it. That I don't just want a good sex life, I want an emotional and mental connection too. In my current LTR, I think I got here by focusing on the sexual connection primarily. Because if that works, and no one is complaining, how can I get hurt? My bf will never attempt an EA because we are not emotional, he is not emotional. I'm realizing, far too late in life, what I want in a relationship.

 

Minimariah - thank you - you're kind needing the hugs right now

 

Lifeisgood - I'm working on the self improvement and hobbies. I'm hoping that will help.

[BourneWicked]

I don’t want to do this anymore either. Like I said – we never had a real breakup, but I would give ANYTHING to say what you wrote. “I can’t do this. I’ve enjoyed your company – everything about you, etc etc. But I am done. Goodbye.” I’d give anything to have that opportunity.

 

When will that time come for us?

 

 

 

Sunrise_sunset I hope you can get to this stage. This is the first it's happened for me. I'm mostly EA with a bit of PA (our offices are opposite corners of the state, and we get few opportunities to see each other).

 

I've been fortunate that I shared with a friend who had an affair with a MM. At the time, when her ordeal happened (it ended tragically, which should have taught me something) I thought - how could anyone do this? Don't you know that work and romance don't mix? He was married, duh? Etc, etc, etc. And then I found myself in the same situation due to my own stupidity.

 

Our distance helps... it makes me miss him, but it also separates. I know he hasn't told a soul about our mistakes.

 

Anyway I would be happy to talk with you. It is very isolating...

 

I think at the end of the day it's about being honest with yourself. He would be happy to have a wife and an extremely hot mistress on the side but when I go to sleep at night, I know what I want from him. And I know I can't have it. So I need to stop, before either of us really gets hurt.

[Grey Cloud]

Bourne – had to respond to you – this is my first post/response in a while, because I’ve been just plodding along with LC with my xMM at work. I had a setback in January that threw me right back to square one, but we’ve been NC outside the office for almost 4 weeks, and just LC at the office during that time. The office. So fxxking hard.

 

Anyway, I’m just piecing together your own story – you work together, yes? I’m trying so hard to work out an alternative job situation (so many factors involved in trying to figure out an exit strategy) -- are you? My xMM and I...we are from such different worlds (hence my screen name – we would never have connected if it hadn’t been for the job). But thanks to posts from amazing folks like GreyCloud, MidnightBlue and HeCan’tBreakMe, I’ve realized it’s close to impossible to stay at the office. I don’t have pictures plastered all over my office, and neither does he, but most colleagues know of our families and our children, and even this week, I heard one of my colleagues mention him and his family and their recent vacation (I’ve done so well avoiding all these conversations until that moment – but it’s a constant challenge).

 

Are you in both EA and PA (I have been in both)? And has it reached some kind of ending? And are you plodding along in a confused state of LC at work – like me? For me, there was no DDay, there was no big gigantic dramatic ending, he just simply ghosted me after 1+ year of amazing highs, and terrible –heart wrenching lows. This second year has been harder – I have been working through milestones that we keep hitting (at this time last year, etc etc…New Year's, Valentine’s Day last year)…) – I can’t wait until the day I can be OK with the milestones.

 

For the first time in my life, I have reached out to a therapist to work through this. My first appt is next week. I have to figure out where my relationship with my H stands in all this (we are pals, quite distant, no intimacy in years, etcetc), and I have to figure out how to successfully get past the A (especially while at the office). Not ONE PERSON in my life knows a thing. It’s killing me slowly. Does anyone in your world know what you're going through? I know I have to talk to someone other than these wonderful folks at LS. But the stories here? The sharing? The fights – the bonding – they are the only thing keeping me afloat much of the time.

 

I don’t want to do this anymore either. Like I said – we never had a real breakup, but I would give ANYTHING to say what you wrote. “I can’t do this. I’ve enjoyed your company – everything about you, etc etc. But I am done. Goodbye.” I’d give anything to have that opportunity.

 

When will that time come for us?

 

Sunrise - next week it will be one year since xMM left my office. Even now, one year on there are still random times I will hear his name come up in a conversation or see a document with his name on it. But now there is no emotion attached to it. I just smile and move on. At first I thought there would be no escape, when he first left there were so many memories and I felt suffocated at every turn. But time does heal. I shudder to think if we still worked together. We would either still be on/off in the affair or I would have had a breakdown of some sort!

 

Not working with him as given me the clarity and perspective to be able to improve my relationship and intimacy with my husband. Working with my xMM would have continued to cloud all of that because all my emotional energy would have been still tied up with my him rather than being focused at home.

 

I have gone through the past year re-living all the "milestones" as you have said. Unfortunately that is something you just need to do. I am looking forward to not having to go through all of that (as badly) this year.

 

As for missed opportunities to say things, all I can say is that "closure" is a myth. I wanted closure so badly that it kept me stuck for such a long time - "if only our ending have had of happened this way, if only I had said this, if only....etc". D day or not, these things rarely end well when feelings and emotions are involved.

 

I don't post much these days but feel tempted to chime in when it is a work situation as I have been there and I know how much it sucks!

[DKT3]

You say mistake alot, mistakes aren't something you make constantly and continuely, it becomes a willing purposeful act.

 

You nailed it, honesty is the way out, so often we see people here MM/MW, and BW/BH totally delusional about the situation and it's impending impact on those who love and trust them. You seem completely in tune with this, intellectually you know it's false.

 

I believe you will right the ship and find yourself single and free ready to hit the reset button.

 

But self honesty isn't all, your boyfriend also deserves some......Good Luck

[BourneWicked]

Sunrise - next week it will be one year since xMM left my office. Even now, one year on there are still random times I will hear his name come up in a conversation or see a document with his name on it. But now there is no emotion attached to it. I just smile and move on. At first I thought there would be no escape, when he first left there were so many memories and I felt suffocated at every turn. But time does heal. I shudder to think if we still worked together. We would either still be on/off in the affair or I would have had a breakdown of some sort!

 

Not working with him as given me the clarity and perspective to be able to improve my relationship and intimacy with my husband. Working with my xMM would have continued to cloud all of that because all my emotional energy would have been still tied up with my him rather than being focused at home.

 

I have gone through the past year re-living all the "milestones" as you have said. Unfortunately that is something you just need to do. I am looking forward to not having to go through all of that (as badly) this year.

 

As for missed opportunities to say things, all I can say is that "closure" is a myth. I wanted closure so badly that it kept me stuck for such a long time - "if only our ending have had of happened this way, if only I had said this, if only....etc". D day or not, these things rarely end well when feelings and emotions are involved.

 

I don't post much these days but feel tempted to chime in when it is a work situation as I have been there and I know how much it sucks!

 

 

Grey - thank you again. I'm curious - is there something that you feel your husband offers you that your MM did not? My LTR offers me lots of xxx (surprisingly, right!) while the MM offers an emotional and mental connection that makes the xxx really good. So my ultimate goal could be a sexless marriage with great communication with him I guess....

 

Again, I'm not married. So I'm very much curious about what factors may cause someone to work out a primary relationship instead of the more exciting/less stable relationship.

 

Mostly I don't think I've ever let myself be in a relationship where I would be emotionally vulnerable, until I was in one that wasn't "real". Now that I've had it, I want all of that. I want someone who is sweet and affectionate and funny. I realize that leaves me vulnerable, but now that I've found it exists, I just want that connection with someone. That ridiculous mind-body connection.

 

Ughhh. Basically it sucks. And I feel like I have my boyfriend to thank that I've come so far from a not-great childhood to be the person I am now. I finally know what I want, but it feels like too late.

[Birdies]

Sunrise_sunset I hope you can get to this stage. This is the first it's happened for me. I'm mostly EA with a bit of PA (our offices are opposite corners of the state, and we get few opportunities to see each other).

 

I've been fortunate that I shared with a friend who had an affair with a MM. At the time, when her ordeal happened (it ended tragically, which should have taught me something) I thought - how could anyone do this? Don't you know that work and romance don't mix? He was married, duh? Etc, etc, etc. And then I found myself in the same situation due to my own stupidity.

 

Our distance helps... it makes me miss him, but it also separates. I know he hasn't told a soul about our mistakes.

 

Anyway I would be happy to talk with you. It is very isolating...

 

I think at the end of the day it's about being honest with yourself. He would be happy to have a wife and an extremely hot mistress on the side but when I go to sleep at night, I know what I want from him. And I know I can't have it. So I need to stop, before either of us really gets hurt.

 

Just a word of advice from someone who's been there done that. It's hard to feel fully ready to pull the plug and it's easy to keep extending it "just another week or two". Until suddenly shlt hits the fan and your relationship, his relationship and/or family, AND your professional reputation and job security are all torpedoed. It's a complete and utter disaster that literally can't be overstated - and it's made so much worse by the workplace involvement. Best to get ahead of the curve and finish things before this happens. We all think we can keep it under wraps right until the second before we can't.

 

Ps - just because you've invested 8 years with the guy doesn't mean you should spend the next 50 in a relationship where you have no emotional fulfillment. Let him go and find someone who can offer the whole package. Again - been there done that. You can remember the years and the time together fondly, while realizing that forging separate paths into the future is the best outcome for both of you in the long run.

Edited February 18, 2017 by Birdies

[HeCantBreakMe]

You didn't take the opp. Because you knew how painful saying the words would. Be. Because having him in some way feels better than not having him at all. This is your mind playing tricks on you much like an alcoholics mind says one sip is okay.

 

Yup damn straight it will hurt to walk awAy. You will cry and beg God to make the pain go away. You will bargain, you will plead , you will tell yourself just one. More time and you will be okay, that telling him nicely will make it easier for both of you. You will hate yourself one second and love yourself thr next. You will see a therapist then maybe stop because it was too hard, you will try antidepressants, maybe date and every day you will struggle. Every second you will struggle...... until one day you realize you went 5 seconds without thinking about him, then 5 minutes and you will stop dreAming about him and you will smile a real smile. You will start opening your heart to the thought of love again and you will be so damn happy you went through that pain because you came

Out the other side.

 

Don't wait for the right words or the right moment. Get a new job and ghost him, not for him but for you. He isn't looking out for you so you have to start.

[minimariah]

It is very isolating...

 

i would encourage you to post here - most folks are welcoming & can discuss calmly and are civilized... you might get some harsh comments from time to time but i really do think that writing helps. i believe isolation is one of the most devastating burdens in an A. and it's great that you have a friend you can confide in.

 

So my ultimate goal could be a sexless marriage with great communication with him I guess....

 

can you elaborate, please? i didn't understand this part, i apologize - do you want to give up the marital sex and keep the communication with the AP...?

 

So I'm very much curious about what factors may cause someone to work out a primary relationship instead of the more exciting/less stable relationship.

 

mostly it's the feeling, i guess... you FEEL like there's still hope, like there is still something to improve in your primary relationship. other than that, the usual stuff - marriage, assets, finances and children. you might not be married but you do have a child... and that is the strongest possible bond.

 

did you discuss the possible future with your MM? is there a chance of the two of you being together in the future?

 

I realize that leaves me vulnerable...

 

i'm interested in this because you keep repeating that word - VULNERABLE - but i'm not sure what that means for you. why is this A making you vulnerable? you want someone funny, affectionate and kind... why is the possibility of being treated nicely by a partner making YOU vulnerable?

 

And I feel like I have my boyfriend to thank that I've come so far from a not-great childhood to be the person I am now.

 

in what ways...? what do you feel like your boyfriend did or does to improve your life? what are the things that he brings to the table? what are his qualities?

 

I finally know what I want, but it feels like too late.

 

too late for what...? your marriage? question - did you ever discuss the lack of affection and emotional connection with your partner...? i can't shake off this feeling that you might be a bit unfair to him - it seems as if you labeled him the not-emotional one when... if you're truly afraid of vulnerability... you're ALSO the not-emotional one... you feel me? i'm sorry, i got lost... LOL.

 

i wanted to say this: you're afraid of being hurt so you don't really invest your ALL emotionally into a relationship (until the A). did you contribute to your primary relationship, emotions wise? what makes you think that your partner is the unavailable one...? maybe he's just following your example because YOU are the one who keeps the distance...? could it be that it was you who built the wall and you're not letting him while at the same time putting the blame on him for being emotionally unavailable? could it be that he's treating you the way you take him to?

 

it does feel like you're done with the marriage (the primary relationship) - maybe it's time to leave. you don't necessarily have to pick between these two relationships, you CAN look and find something entirely new and better.

Edited February 18, 2017 by minimariah

[BourneWicked]

[/b]

 

Just a word of advice from someone who's been there done that. It's hard to feel fully ready to pull the plug and it's easy to keep extending it "just another week or two". Until suddenly shlt hits the fan and your relationship, his relationship and/or family, AND your professional reputation and job security are all torpedoed. It's a complete and utter disaster that literally can't be overstated - and it's made so much worse by the workplace involvement. Best to get ahead of the curve and finish things before this happens. We all think we can keep it under wraps right until the second before we can't.

 

Ps - just because you've invested 8 years with the guy doesn't mean you should spend the next 50 in a relationship where you have no emotional fulfillment. Let him go and find someone who can offer the whole package. Again - been there done that. You can remember the years and the time together fondly, while realizing that forging separate paths into the future is the best outcome for both of you in the long run.

 

Birdie - thank you so much for the words of wisdom.

 

I'm much smarter about the whole work thing, where as he is more willing to take risks.

 

So, I desire to keep my boyfriend around for my child because he's a great father. At the same time, am I really fulfilling my own needs? Probably not, but I think my child's are more important. Ugh it's a struggle.

 

If I could have one "do-over" it would be ruining that friendzone. It's rare I have a tough time being friends with a guy. This one, I did. I wish I'd known that the awkward conversations meant something more, that I wasn't capable of just being a normal person with this guy.

 

You live, you learn, and boy did I learn. I want to hold onto what DKT3 said... at some point it's not an accident anymore. I can only excuse 'mistakes' for so long.

 

Birdies - did you find the whole package? Because that's what I want now. I didn't know it existed. For me it's always been physical, or emotional/mental. I've never met both (until recently).

 

Basically, it sucks. Grass is always greener and all that. But I've never left myself available for the sorts of guys that could fulfill my needs. Only when I'm unavailable can I make that happen. Ugh.

 

Thanks for all the feedback. The real life experiences are pretty helpful...

[minimariah]

Because that's what I want now. I didn't know it existed.

 

it does exist, trust me. some find it sooner, some find it later... some find it through the A, some find it when they're single and available. but it does exist - don't settle in the future thinking it's impossible. of course, nobody can guarantee you that you'll actually find that one person and have a successful relationship with them but you won't really know unless you try.

[Grey Cloud]

Grey - thank you again. I'm curious - is there something that you feel your husband offers you that your MM did not? My LTR offers me lots of xxx (surprisingly, right!) while the MM offers an emotional and mental connection that makes the xxx really good. So my ultimate goal could be a sexless marriage with great communication with him I guess....

 

Again, I'm not married. So I'm very much curious about what factors may cause someone to work out a primary relationship instead of the more exciting/less stable relationship.

 

Mostly I don't think I've ever let myself be in a relationship where I would be emotionally vulnerable, until I was in one that wasn't "real". Now that I've had it, I want all of that. I want someone who is sweet and affectionate and funny. I realize that leaves me vulnerable, but now that I've found it exists, I just want that connection with someone. That ridiculous mind-body connection.

 

Ughhh. Basically it sucks. And I feel like I have my boyfriend to thank that I've come so far from a not-great childhood to be the person I am now. I finally know what I want, but it feels like too late.

 

This is what I think. The mind-body connection is so wonderful and great and amazing because of limerance, a chemical reaction that isn't real. He is not yours and you are not his. That in itself creates a longing. Coupled with intermittent reinforcement and the secret element it makes for an overwhelming intoxicating cocktail. But it's not real.

 

I could have said the same thing about my xMM. The connection was amazing and as a result I overlooked any flaws or red flags. We only saw each other at our best - not in the trenches of paying bills, cleaning the house and sick kids.

 

However with the benefit of hindsight I can look back and see it all for what it really was. An ego boost for both of us, fun and excitement, an escape. I can see now that if I was in a relationship with him I would never trust him - as I saw firsthand how he lied and gaslighted his wife and his manipulative behaviour. And yet I also behaved as terribly as him so I am just as much to blame!

 

Maybe it is time to move on from your LTR BUT your mind is clouded with thoughts of your MM and comparisons. Therefore you won't be able to make a rational decision until MM is no longer in your life or alternatively you are in a real relationship with him and he is not married.

 

That is the only way you will know for sure if the amazing connection is exactly what you think it is.

[BourneWicked]

i would encourage you to post here - most folks are welcoming & can discuss calmly and are civilized... you might get some harsh comments from time to time but i really do think that writing helps. i believe isolation is one of the most devastating burdens in an A. and it's great that you have a friend you can confide in.

 

can you elaborate, please? i didn't understand this part, i apologize - do you want to give up the marital sex and keep the communication with the AP...?

 

mostly it's the feeling, i guess... you FEEL like there's still hope, like there is still something to improve in your primary relationship. other than that, the usual stuff - marriage, assets, finances and children. you might not be married but you do have a child... and that is the strongest possible bond.

 

did you discuss the possible future with your MM? is there a chance of the two of you being together in the future?

 

i'm interested in this because you keep repeating that word - VULNERABLE - but i'm not sure what that means for you. why is this A making you vulnerable? you want someone funny, affectionate and kind... why is the possibility of being treated nicely by a partner making YOU vulnerable?

 

 

 

in what ways...? what do you feel like your boyfriend did or does to improve your life? what are the things that he brings to the table? what are his qualities?

 

 

 

too late for what...? your marriage? question - did you ever discuss the lack of affection and emotional connection with your partner...? i can't shake off this feeling that you might be a bit unfair to him - it seems as if you labeled him the not-emotional one when... if you're truly afraid of vulnerability... you're ALSO the not-emotional one... you feel me? i'm sorry, i got lost... LOL.

 

i wanted to say this: you're afraid of being hurt so you don't really invest your ALL emotionally into a relationship (until the A). did you contribute to your primary relationship, emotions wise? what makes you think that your partner is the unavailable one...? maybe he's just following your example because YOU are the one who keeps the distance...? could it be that it was you who built the wall and you're not letting him while at the same time putting the blame on him for being emotionally unavailable? could it be that he's treating you the way you take him to?

 

it does feel like you're done with the marriage (the primary relationship) - maybe it's time to leave. you don't necessarily have to pick between these two relationships, you CAN look and find something entirely new and better.

 

Thanks for your great comments and questions.

 

About my comment about, what do I want, 'a sexless marriage with the MM' - I can see some of the benefits of my current relationship. In my LTR we have a good sex life. I know, all the MMs say they don't have a lot of sex, but I'm pretty sure my sex life in my LTR is a lot better than what he's got going on, or what most of my married/LTR friends have going on. So I see that the grass is browner there for sure. I do appreciate that, 8 years in, my bf still finds me physically attractive, and we still enjoy a pretty healthy life between the sheets. My previous relationship the sex disappeared 2-3 years in. For MM, I don't think they do have much sex, and when he's asked about sex in my primary relationship, he's clearly envious that it's pretty different from his relationship. No, I don't think he's trying to guilt me out of having sex at home because he isn't getting as much (he actually said although it makes him jealous, he wants me to be happy in that aspect as well).

 

Future with the MM... didn't really talk about this. I'm sure he's enjoying the moment and would like to continue this set up indefinitely. (Don't they all). He's definitely not a future faker, so I appreciate that. Part of my conversation I want to have with him is, hey, if the whole marriage thing doesn't work out, give me a call in 10 years.

 

Re: the emotional unavailability. When my bf comes home, he slaps my butt. Hard. That was cute for the first few years. Now I tell him that I need a hug after a bad day at work, a kiss. After we had this conversation four or five times, he will try occasionally, but he almost makes a joke out of the affection. I don't know. Sometimes when we're sitting together at an event I'll put my hand on his leg, pat his back, things like that but reciprocation is kind of hard to come by. It mostly seems to make him uncomfortable.

 

I do think I can be emotionally unavailable too... and I do think this is part of why I chose the relationship I'm in. Like I said... my bf wouldn't start an emotional affair. I would never see him holding hands with some other woman. That sort of affection - that affection that I crave - just really isn't part of who he is.

 

I do think I need to invest more in my primary relationship. Ditch this ridiculous A, and focus on whether I want to be with the father of my child or not. Yes, a child does create a very strong bond - and my bf is a fabulous father. Better, I think, than MM What my bf brings to the table is that he's funny, kind, financially smart and generally fun to be around. He's also a bit of a workaholic (hindsight: if I have a type, it's workaholics and alcoholics). During the work week, he gets home around 7, plays with our kiddo some, but other than that he vegges on the couch and watches TV. But he is helpful with the housework as well, which is amazing

 

Another thing that jumps out as to what caused me to get into this A is, as many say, not taking care of my own needs. Myself and MM both have similar hobbies, and we talk about these things and encourage each other in our endeavors. So, there is definitely an element of self-expansion that we give each other in this relationship. But, friends can do that too. For the first time in ever, my bf mentioned he was interested in one of my self-expanding hobbies (snowboarding) and asked why I invited a gf and not him. The answer is: I've heard "no" so many times I stopped asking. So, doing these novel, exciting things together is another thing that's fallen to the wayside now that we have a child. We used to do leagues, volleyball, etc. My bf is very good at sports, and very entertaining to be with in team activities like that. This gave me an opportunity to see him at his best, and gave me a little bit of jealousy that reminded me why I was originally attracted to him. Something we probably need to resurrect.

 

So anyway... although this is a PA, it actually (due to 4+ hour suspicious-looking drive to meet each other) is very heavily, and primarily, an EA. It's funny, because my primary relationship is physically, very healthy. The A fulfills all those intellectual and emotional things I didn't realize I wanted. But again, friends can do that too, and if I want to continue my LTR, I might need to expand the gf group.

 

Also, I have a close male friend at work who I'm NOT in an EA or PA with, who I get some of this self-expansion from. We're very supportive of each others primary relationships, and like each other's SOs. For me, there is no physical attraction there, and this relationship is safe and healthy for that and other reasons. We ARE friends on FB, do dinner as couples, and we can text because there is nothing there beyond a healthy friendship that both our SOs are comfortable with. So - gfs and male friends can both fulfill some of these needs without it being an affair. Ironically, my male work friend once said something about hoping my bf was comfortable with our relationship because he's not some "creeper trying to have an affair with me." This gave me a little internal giggle... because he knows MM, knows nothing of the affair, and made me think it would change the way he saw MM if he knew. And probably how he sees me too...

 

It's cathartic writing all this out

[DKT3]

After your last post I honestly think your bored. You had an affair because you're bored. Your complaints are fairly lame as reasons to have an affair, because he isn't comfortable give you a hug or hold hands at events?.

 

He is what I think, you got yourself involved not because of any shortcomings in your relationship but because of your poor boundaries, once involved you looked for a found a way, a justification to lessen your guilt and responsibilities.

 

You know that twisted irony..The things you complain about will be the things you miss when he is with someone else.

[BourneWicked]

This is what I think. The mind-body connection is so wonderful and great and amazing because of limerance, a chemical reaction that isn't real. He is not yours and you are not his. That in itself creates a longing. Coupled with intermittent reinforcement and the secret element it makes for an overwhelming intoxicating cocktail. But it's not real.

 

I could have said the same thing about my xMM. The connection was amazing and as a result I overlooked any flaws or red flags. We only saw each other at our best - not in the trenches of paying bills, cleaning the house and sick kids.

 

However with the benefit of hindsight I can look back and see it all for what it really was. An ego boost for both of us, fun and excitement, an escape. I can see now that if I was in a relationship with him I would never trust him - as I saw firsthand how he lied and gaslighted his wife and his manipulative behaviour. And yet I also behaved as terribly as him so I am just as much to blame!

 

Maybe it is time to move on from your LTR BUT your mind is clouded with thoughts of your MM and comparisons. Therefore you won't be able to make a rational decision until MM is no longer in your life or alternatively you are in a real relationship with him and he is not married.

 

That is the only way you will know for sure if the amazing connection is exactly what you think it is.

 

Yes to all of this.

 

Overall, I trust MM. He's relatively honest, doesn't gaslight me, doesn't future fake. He's not manipulative, he's kind, and is mostly a decent person. Mostly....

 

However... we had two mini d-days on his end because apparently his wife doesn't trust him. (Wonder why....) I didn't ask, but I wondered what sort of lies he told her to get past the hard facts of him being shady. "I've never seen that chick in my life. Must have had the wrong number..." etc etc?

 

Trust in my primary relationship: that is probably the number one reason I feel I need to end this. MM does not have trust in his relationship; she looks at his phone. I haven't done that in years, and my bf never would. This trust is important to me.

 

Yes, there is an element of limerence. There is also an element of... I think we reflect each other's parents and those fabulous attachment issues from childhood, and give each other that fulfillment that we've always desired. I've diagnosed him as anxiously attached, while I'm avoidant. (My bf might be avoidant as well). So there's another layer to the cake.

 

Honestly I think when it does end, it will be easier for me than for him. I'm better at cutting off my feelings; having a father that wasn't around taught me how to do that at a young age. Is it healthy? No. But it's what I know and how I cope.

 

Although I think there is genuine like here, and genuine similarities, I wonder (and maybe he does too) how much is there without the aura of the affair. From far away this relationship looks like an Escalade. But up close it turns out it might just be a rusted chevy cavalier after all

[aileD]

You. Can't make a clear decision on your primary relationship when you are entangled with someone on the side.

 

You owe it to your child/ren to honestly give a true effort before calling it quits and tearing apart their security. You can't do that with a MM in the picture .

[ShatteredLady]

Honestly you sound like you have a very good relationship with your partner. A relationship that could be GREAT with minimum effort...find sports/interests you can do together. I know it's really hard with a young child but it would be even harder as a single mother!

 

You share a business interest. You've got a fantastic sex life. You clearly fancy him...more than just physically. Your friends are right to be jealous!! Why on earth are you endangering such a good thing?

 

PLEASE believe me, no relationship is going to be perfect. A friend of mine, who sounds much like you, finally divorced her husband for her more 'soft', affectionate, giving OM. He drove her CRAZY!!! Certain character traits seem attractive...in small doses!!

 

You're a mother! You STILL have a great relationship! (Both with a young child is amazing!) If you were one of my friends I'd be nagging you senseless to drop this OM. REALLY? Lady, you're chasing unicorns!!

 

You mention problems in your early life. Are you running? Are you looking for problems where none really exist? Were you bored? Other than the whole affair with MM stuff I'm feeling jealous of you!!! Stop hunting unicorns!!!

Edited February 18, 2017 by ShatteredLady

[gettingstronger]

Maybe you missed the moment of clarity because being the Mom of a toddler isn't nearly as sexy and fun as an affair. It's about priorities, and what gives you power. We learned a lot in therapy, my husband false sense of power he felt being in an affair, the escape from our regular life- being able to prioritize and gain a feeling of power and purpose from doing right by not only our family but himself really helped put him on the right path. Having a purpose he feels good about is important to him.

[BourneWicked]

Yeah my complaints are fairly lame. Bored? Maybe. Yes on the poor boundaries. I think that my poor relationship with my father made it difficult for me to create a healthy relationship with men. And the one with my bf is probably the healthiest I've been in, and something I should be less willing to screw up. I think that unhealthy is what I know, so it's harder to maintain healthy. Sick = love. Someone unavailable feels like home. Not an excuse, but a comment.

 

PLEASE believe me, no relationship is going to be perfect. A friend of mine, who sounds much like you, finally divorced her husband for her more 'soft', affectionate, giving OM. He drove her CRAZY!!! Certain character traits seem attractive...in small doses!!

 

You're a mother! You STILL have a great relationship! (Both with a young child is amazing!) If you were one of my friends I'd be nagging you senseless to drop this OM. REALLY? Lady, you're chasing unicorns!!

 

You mention problems in your early life. Are you running? Are you looking for problems where none really exist? Were you bored? Other than the whole affair with MM stuff I'm feeling jealous of you!!! Stop hunting unicorns!!!

 

Absolutely. I am chasing a flipping unicorn. I think I am running, and looking for problems where none exist.

 

Maybe you missed the moment of clarity because being the Mom of a toddler isn't nearly as sexy and fun as an affair. It's about priorities, and what gives you power. We learned a lot in therapy, my husband false sense of power he felt being in an affair, the escape from our regular life- being able to prioritize and gain a feeling of power and purpose from doing right by not only our family but himself really helped put him on the right path. Having a purpose he feels good about is important to him.

 

These are great points. Thank you. No, being a mom to a toddler isn't sexy. Definitely having something like this is an escape, and a temporary return to a life I used to live when I was younger.

 

Something I should touch on - how it started.

 

I gave him a hug once when he was done visiting our office. Not weird for me; maybe my poor boundaries, but also I think I'm just a hugger. Physically affectionate. I've hugged all my coworkers - or the handshake + hug bare min - when they're done visiting my office and I won't see them for a while. Buuuut... looking back, this is what I did when I met my boyfriend as well. A hug, a chance to smell those pheromones and find out if there's something there. The difference being - after I hugged my now bf, I broke up with my ex a week later (the way you're supposed to do it) before I talked to my now bf again.

 

I didn't really think about it. When I've been around him I never consciously admitted I was attracted to him. I thought, oh he's a great guy and he's married, and I would actually put physical distance between myself and him when we're in the office together, because at a subconscious level I realized there was something there. Sit at a different table, leave the room asap when meetings were done.

 

Then one day, the office went to dinner. I sat literally as far as possible from him, on the other side of the table. Chatted with coworkers. He called me over when I came back from the bathroom to ask me something, and put a hand on my back.

 

It was like a switch was flipped.

 

I think I got this article from a different post here:

The ?Other? Side of Infidelity: The Experience of the ?Other? Partner, Anxious Love, and Implications for Practitioners | DePompo | Psychological Thought

 

I think the touch of someone I saw as moral, good, above all that - someone I trusted to take care of his marriage, who I saw as an upstanding family man with the perfect life - flipped that switch. We see in each other fulfillment of those childhood weaknesses and issues.

 

If I could go back in time, I would step back when he touched me, excuse myself, and get my own damn ride home.

 

A quote that applies here - until you make the unconscious conscious, it will direct your life and you will call it fate.

 

If I had admitted to myself that I found him attractive, regardless of marital status, I might have taken better steps to guard myself around him. It's rare that I find someone attractive like him - like I said, usually I find someone physically attractive, or clever/funny - it's rare that I feel both about someone. And it's not like I haven't been touched by attractive men and extricated myself from that situation before.

 

My friend's boyfriend tried to kiss me once, and I got the heck out of that situation. A good looking dude sat down at the bar where I got myself dinner out of town on a business trip, and I told him all about boyfriend and son, he talked about his son, his landscaping business, and all that good stuff. A few beers in, I wished him a good night and said thanks for the talk.

 

So I'm trying to defend myself here I guess. My boundaries are not completely terrible; I'm relatively attractive, and have had many opportunities to stray. This is the one I took. And now I need to GTFO.

 

Weekends are good, weekends are easy. It's during the work week I struggle.

 

The article above states:

 

Women who engage in infidelity are more likely to become emotionally attached with the “other” partner (Træen, Holmen, & Stigum, 2007), whereas men who engage in infidelity are more likely to consider the “other” partner as a close friend (Glass, 2003).

 

I think this is true of this relationship. It's a good way to reframe it for myself... he sees me as a close friend. Would I have sex and flirt with a close friend? Mmm, not so much.

 

I can picture him in that moment where the light seemed to finally break through the haze, and that really helps. That feeling of disconnection, of separation and emptiness. That feeling that will be a hundred times stronger if we were caught. I need to keep this feeling alive.

[Birdies]

Birdie - thank you so much for the words of wisdom.

 

I'm much smarter about the whole work thing, where as he is more willing to take risks.

 

So, I desire to keep my boyfriend around for my child because he's a great father. At the same time, am I really fulfilling my own needs? Probably not, but I think my child's are more important. Ugh it's a struggle.

 

If I could have one "do-over" it would be ruining that friendzone. It's rare I have a tough time being friends with a guy. This one, I did. I wish I'd known that the awkward conversations meant something more, that I wasn't capable of just being a normal person with this guy.

 

You live, you learn, and boy did I learn. I want to hold onto what DKT3 said... at some point it's not an accident anymore. I can only excuse 'mistakes' for so long.

 

Birdies - did you find the whole package? Because that's what I want now. I didn't know it existed. For me it's always been physical, or emotional/mental. I've never met both (until recently).

 

Basically, it sucks. Grass is always greener and all that. But I've never left myself available for the sorts of guys that could fulfill my needs. Only when I'm unavailable can I make that happen. Ugh.

 

Thanks for all the feedback. The real life experiences are pretty helpful...

 

I don't know yet. I definitely don't think the whole package exists in real life like it can feel in an affair, due to limerance and the intensity of feelings in an affair. Nothing in real life can compete with that. It sounds like you know that too

 

My AP and I blew up our lives, nuclear detonation style. An accident obviously. But it did give us a chance to try being together. It's been a year or so now, and things are really really good and easy and natural. Thank god, because the rest of our lives were a mess there for a while.

 

In your case, with a kid in the mix....I'd really try to reconnect with your boyfriend and see if you two can forge a deeper emotional connection through your mutual hobbies. Talk to him about your desire for affection. It doesn't sound like things are too far gone.

 

Good luck! This life is a tricky thing isn't it.

[GollumsNightmare]

Wow, that was a really thoughtful post, Bourne. I can see the work you are doing on yourself. The self reflection is going to serve you well. I wish I had been as thoughtful when trying to extricate myself from my A.

 

Have you read Glass' entire book, Not Just Friends? It was a life changer for my husband and myself. We both engaged in affairs (mine was decades ago, my H's much more recent). The book explained so much. It definitely helped the healing process and it gave us a lot to think about as we recovered. Your example of the the way he touched your back is something close to what happened in both of our situations. That was not an accidental touch. You realize that, right?