Jj66 Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Divorced for 6 years. 3 kids. Son aging out of child support. Ex is unwilling to talk about new child support amount or disclose her salary and employment information so we can calculate a fair amount based on our state's tables. She's done nothing but ignore me on this issue. But she has no compunction about proposing sex from time to time. Last time was her 50th birthday last year. So it's not like she is completely unwilling to talk to me. I'm not going to continue paying the same child support with only 2 kids instead of 3, and with her income increasing dramatically since the amount was set, and me now having the kids half time instead of every other weekend. When my son ages out the amount I am paying will be more than 4 times the state guidelines based on what I conservatively estimate her salary to be. I proposed a compromise amount that was half way between the guideline and the current amount. I invited a counter offer. I was willing to go as far as a 1/3 reducrion. She ignored me. Now in order to reduce the child support from it's unfair and untenable levels (I've been cash flow negative for years, spending down my savings, etc.) I am being forced to go back to court. On top of child supoort I pay all medical and dental insurance and expenses. I provide a car, pay for extra curricular expenses and most clothing. I also pay for most food since the kids come to my house every day after school. By going to court she is going to face legal expenses and when the support is reduced to the state guidelines she is going to get more than $1000 less per month than she could have gotten by talking with me and making an agreement. Why do people not negotiate in their own best interests? Link to post Share on other sites
Popsicle Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Does your state or county not have a department that enforces child support? If so, they will amend the child support order for you without going to court, as long as you two agree. If you don't agree, they will take the case to court for you and an attorney from the department will be there in court representing the children (not you or the mom). So it should cost you nothing if you go this route. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Jj66 Posted March 9, 2017 Author Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) Does your state or county not have a department that enforces child support? If so, they will amend the child support order for you without going to court, as long as you two agree. If you don't agree, they will take the case to court for you and an attorney from the department will be there in court representing the children (not you or the mom). So it should cost you nothing if you go this route. That option is available in dead beat situations and situations in which the initial order was established by CSE but that doesn't apply here. I'm going pro se to avoid legal expenses. It should be a rather straightforward thing. She should receive notice of hearing today. I hope that will bring her to her senses. I don't actually want to reduce all the way to the guideline amount because I think that night force her to sell the marital home. But at the same time, I have to be able to live too. I really should have filed for modification when the kids went from every other weekend to half time. But she was underemployed at that time and I didn't want to kick her when she was down. Edited March 9, 2017 by Jj66 Link to post Share on other sites
Popsicle Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 I take exception to the dead beat comment. My ex and I didn't start out using that department but a few years into it we started using it instead of attorneys if we couldn't agree on something. And btw, there has never been any missed or late payments on either end. You simply walk in there with your court order and they'll take the case. And anyway going to court by yourself should not cost you anything save a $50 or something. Court is sometimes a necessary thing when you have an unresponsive parent (regarding money matters) on the other end. She had to have known you were going to take her to court.... She was just stalling. Link to post Share on other sites
Popsicle Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 I don't actually want to reduce all the way to the guideline amount because I think that night force her to sell the marital home. Well thats probably what's going to happen. She should have probably never kept it if she couldn't really pay for it. Nobody likes moving but if you can't afford it you shouldn't be living there. I would tell that to anyone with kids or without kids. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Jj66 Posted March 10, 2017 Author Share Posted March 10, 2017 (edited) I take exception to the dead beat comment. My ex and I didn't start out using that department but a few years into it we started using it instead of attorneys if we couldn't agree on something. And btw, there has never been any missed or late payments on either end. You simply walk in there with your court order and they'll take the case. And anyway going to court by yourself should not cost you anything save a $50 or something. Court is sometimes a necessary thing when you have an unresponsive parent (regarding money matters) on the other end. She had to have known you were going to take her to court.... She was just stalling. Certainly didn't mean any offense with my dead beat comment. Here, most of the time things are taken care of by separation agreement and court is never involved. My ex and I were never able to reach a general agreement so our mediated settlement was entered as a consent order. Child support was actually the only thing we were able to agree to since it comes right off the tables in this state. But because the amount is mentioned in the consent order I can't just stop paying the amount for my son even if he ages out without violating the court order. You'd think we could voluntarily ammend the order but she won't even talk to me about it. My guess is that she will regret not talking. She has everything to lose and I have nothing to lose. My worst possible outcome is status quo. The judge has to justify any deviation from the guidelines and it's up to her to show why there should be a deviation. She will need a lawyer for that. But it's going to cost me a $20 filing fee, some postage, and some time off from work. Edited March 10, 2017 by Jj66 Link to post Share on other sites
Popsicle Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Are you sure your current order does not say it stops when they graduate HS? They usually do. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Jj66 Posted March 10, 2017 Author Share Posted March 10, 2017 Are you sure your current order does not say it stops when they graduate HS? They usually do. Yes I'm sure. The language mentions an amount. But it is a unity amount. Even though my son won't be eligible for child support under state law, because of the wording, I can't just reduce it by a third without violating the order. I guess I should be mad at my lawyer who drafted the consent order. Link to post Share on other sites
Popsicle Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Yes I'm sure. The language mentions an amount. But it is a unity amount. Even though my son won't be eligible for child support under state law, because of the wording, I can't just reduce it by a third without violating the order. I guess I should be mad at my lawyer who drafted the consent order. Yes you're right. FYI In my state (CA) the younger child gets more than the older child. Link to post Share on other sites
Simple Logic Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Divorced for 6 years. 3 kids. Son aging out of child support. Ex is unwilling to talk about new child support amount or disclose her salary and employment information so we can calculate a fair amount based on our state's tables. She's done nothing but ignore me on this issue. But she has no compunction about proposing sex from time to time. Last time was her 50th birthday last year. So it's not like she is completely unwilling to talk to me. I'm not going to continue paying the same child support with only 2 kids instead of 3, and with her income increasing dramatically since the amount was set, and me now having the kids half time instead of every other weekend. When my son ages out the amount I am paying will be more than 4 times the state guidelines based on what I conservatively estimate her salary to be. I proposed a compromise amount that was half way between the guideline and the current amount. I invited a counter offer. I was willing to go as far as a 1/3 reducrion. She ignored me. Now in order to reduce the child support from it's unfair and untenable levels (I've been cash flow negative for years, spending down my savings, etc.) I am being forced to go back to court. On top of child supoort I pay all medical and dental insurance and expenses. I provide a car, pay for extra curricular expenses and most clothing. I also pay for most food since the kids come to my house every day after school. By going to court she is going to face legal expenses and when the support is reduced to the state guidelines she is going to get more than $1000 less per month than she could have gotten by talking with me and making an agreement. Why do people not negotiate in their own best interests? How can you determine she will receive $1000 less by going to court when you do not know her income? Link to post Share on other sites
Author Jj66 Posted March 10, 2017 Author Share Posted March 10, 2017 How can you determine she will receive $1000 less by going to court when you do not know her income? Simple: use a conservative lower bound estimate of her income. I know she makes at least X because I have experience in the field she is in. It's possible she is making much more than X. She has a masters degree in engineering with prior work experience in the industry of her company (I know name of company based on hear say from kids). The current child support amount was calculated assuming she had the kids full time and by imputing minimum wage as her income. She makes vastly more than minimum wage now and the kids are with me at least half time. Yesterday she refused mail service of the notice of hearing. That means I will have to have the Sherrif serve her. I wish I knew her work address... Link to post Share on other sites
Popsicle Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 Yesterday she refused mail service of the notice of hearing. That means I will have to have the Sherrif serve her. I wish I knew her work address... Depending on where you live and how busy they are, it could take weeks for the sherrif to serve her. It is last on their priority list. Ask them. I would simply serve her by mail yourself (or have someone else put it in her mailbox). If she wants to ignore it, fine, but there will still be a court date that will proceed. You will have to have some kind of proof that she works and that you now have the kids half time. Since she may not be there in court, they will take what you say about the time with the kids and may even take your word of her income without proof. They figure if she wanted a say she would have shown up to court or will come back again later to fight it. Link to post Share on other sites
Marc878 Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 She expects you to just roll over. Why would she willingly give up such a sweet deal? It's court. She's got the $ so that's. Not going to scare her much. You'll have to force it. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Jj66 Posted March 17, 2017 Author Share Posted March 17, 2017 She has now been appropriately served. She has all the required notices and financial disclosure documents and I filed all the appropriate certificates with the court. Now all I can do is wait for actions from her or the hearing schedule two months from today. If she doesn't provide her financial disclosures to me within the time limits of the local rules I will have to file a motion to compel. Link to post Share on other sites
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