I got a message from the OW

[alsudduth]

I've decided at this point to continue our progress. I let my husband know that he has hurt me to my very core. The type of hurt that changes a person. I told him that I'm sure I did the same to him with my affair.

 

I told him that I do not want to lose the progress we have made so far, and that I would like to take these experiences and use them as lessons on how NOT to treat your spouse. I want to focus on moving forward.

[HeartbrokenDec29]

Like i told you in your previous post. MMs lie as well! She can truly feel sorry. I think im sick and tired of hearing people with their high horses say, if she cared she wouldnt have slept with the MM. "Let anyone here who hasnt sinned or hurt someone be the first to say it.

 

The truth is we all make mistakes and for some people they realize it after the whole deceit and all the games. I could tell you there are a thousand of things she might know about your husband you don't. But shes just not telling and has come to the realization of how horrible her participation was.

 

i like the fact that you choose to work on your marriage, your husband is human too and he could have made a mistake but it doesnt mean you should close your eyes to that character flaw of lieing to your face even after the affair is over. Afterall the affair is the main betrayal. If he saw her after, it could mean he wasnt truly remorseful and just apologized and will still carry on cheating. He has probably moved on to other women but maybe contacted her again to boost his ego.

 

See as an xOW woman i can totally believe her story of him seeing her after. I cant exactly tell why this is coming up now but i suspect he has started contacting her again and she hasn't let the cat totally out of the bag. she is probably indirectly telling you so you can keep an eye on him but cant come out to say it cos she doesnt want to cause any further damage.

 

I will tell you that if my xMM tries to ever contact me again, i will ignore but if he doesnt stop i will contact his wife and ask her to tell her husband to leave me alone.

 

A man who is truly is remorseful after seeing all the pain will not lie to you or ask to meet up with his xOW after dday.

 

I just really want you to be at alert and guard yourself with a lot of self love that anything that comes later on wont shake/crash your world.

[alsudduth]

Oh also.

 

I told my H that while I am choosing to leave the past in the past, though should I find out he is still lying about this after given the chance to tell me everything, that it would be the end of the road for me. I would expect the same if the tables were reversed.

 

I blocked the OW after thanking her for the information and that there was no need to contact me further.

 

I'd be lying if I said I didn't also let her know she was not forgiven and that I do not wish her well.

[Cymbeline]

"A man who is truly is remorseful after seeing all the pain will not lie to you or ask to meet up with his xOW after dday."

 

I just don't really agree with this. Affairs are such a mess and people behave in messed up ways. Extricating oneself emotionally seems to be a difficult and jagged process. It isnt an ideal way to mend fences, but emotions are complex things. At some time she meant something to him. Who knows what might have paased through his mind at some time during reconciliation. We know he probably wasn't in the healthiest place. It doesnt necessarily mean very much.

[alsudduth]

I just want to say Thank You to everyone who has responded. I honestly thought I would get a lot of "You did this to him too" or "How is this different from you having an affair" responses.

 

The fact that you all were able to separate the two instances has really helped. I understand that I still have work to do on my end to help my H heal from my own A, but knowing that I have support for the original betrayal my H did to me, and the new betrayal of finding out so many lies he's told me, helps me more than I think you guys will know.

 

I struggle everyday still with the guilt of my A - I hope my H and I can heal our relationship. I'm hopeful. We both agreed that this is a situation we never want to be in again on either side of the coin.

 

Affairs ruin lives people. The last 4 years have been awful, stressful, confusing, heartbreaking and overwhelming.......I'm grateful that we are continuing to make progress, even despite the most recent setback.

[anika99]

Alsudduth, wow I just came back to this thread and read that the OW contacted you again. I was one of the posters who thought the OW's apology was sincere but now I think she's an insincere lying liar. Why? Well because in her first email to you she said she didn't want to cause you more pain and that she wouldn't contact you again. Then what did she do? She contacted you again and vomited upon you a bunch of information that she knew would cause you more pain. So by this we know she lied about not wanting to cause you further pain and about not contacting you again. She was insincere and dishonest.

 

It's like she got enraged when you ignored her first email. She was apparently expecting some sort of reply from you, like she wanted your attention and when she didn't get it she decided to unleash a verbal stream of pain on you. Punishing you for having the audacity to ignore her. Then she became whiny when she realized you weren't taking everything she said as the gospel truth which is even more evidence that she was never truly remorseful and doesn't fully understand. If she did she wouldn't have some weird expectation that you would automatically believe her. Of course her husband didn't ask for proof when she confessed. Duh! Whoever heard of a BS asking their WS to prove that they cheated? Lol...does she have a screw loose? If you or your husband had been the ones to tell her husband of the affair, her husband probably would have asked for proof.

 

On the other hand it does seem that your husband has been lying to you. He denied all of these meet ups right up until the OW sent her second email and then he conviently admitted to the one meeting the OW had proof of but none of the others. Sounds pretty fishy to me. I don't know your whole story OP but I don't envy your position at all. It seems like both the OW and your husband are still playing games with you and screwing with your reality. Whatever you decide to do I wish you luck.

[BetrayedH]

Forgive me for being blunt.

 

I think your H still has no problem lying straight to your face. That's clearly demonstrated by the lie he perpetuated until you called him on it this last week.

 

If that's the kind of partner I'd be faced with having for all things in life, I'd rather not have a partner.

[Southern Sun]

I made him read the messages from her. He pointed out what was true and what she says she is lying about. He says he doesn't understand why she would lie about all this.

 

It's because she's not lying.

 

The way it's written, her wording, everything, points to a truthful account.

 

She has no motive at this point to lie to you. She's disclosed to her husband. It truly sounds like her intentions are to clear the air and apologize. Contacting you to "set your H free" so they can be together is nonsensical. That basically never works. And again, her verbiage, the order of the story, the detail (not too much but not too little)...it's all right on the money.

 

I can say too that the lack of proof is no shock. I, too, dumped everything I had after my affair. I didn't want any reminders, nor anything for my H to find either (not to hide things but so I didn't trigger him unnecessarily).

 

Your H, on the other hand, has been lying to you (my opinion), and doesn't see how it benefits him to come clean. In fact, all it does now is prove that 1) his affair was worse than he told you; and 2) he's been lying to you all this time. Basically, he's thinking to himself: if no one has any proof, why in the hell would I admit to this??? Unless you hold his feet to the fire and say that you don't believe him and simply will not move forward without the complete truth...I don't think you will ever hear a real confession.

 

It's up to you to know what you can deal with. I wish you the best.

[merrmeade]

Harbor feelings like this, only affects you, your mind, your peace & your own family peace...not the OW's.

Words like this, while well meant and even true, mean nothing to individuals who have experienced pain and suffering as a result of another person's choices. I'm not saying it's not the place we 'ought' to get - and maybe we will. I'm saying that we won't get there because someone else says we should. We'll get there because of our own growth and healing. Nothing anyone says we should do will change that. In fact, it will either make us go dark and uncommunicative out of shame or it will make us steer clear of those that make us feel "less than" because of that judgment. And however it's intended (you can explain this until the cows come home) does not change the fact that it comes across as a judgment. Just saying.

[merrmeade]

Forgive me for being blunt.

 

I think your H still has no problem lying straight to your face. That's clearly demonstrated by the lie he perpetuated until you called him on it this last week.

 

If that's the kind of partner I'd be faced with having for all things in life, I'd rather not have a partner.

Bottom line. It comes down to the regard for you, the love and respect he has for you and where he puts it—above or below his own image—which, by the way, would also be a lie (if he's lying about the rest).

[merrmeade]

"A man who is truly is remorseful after seeing all the pain will not lie to you or ask to meet up with his xOW after dday."

 

I just don't really agree with this. Affairs are such a mess and people behave in messed up ways. Extricating oneself emotionally seems to be a difficult and jagged process. It isnt an ideal way to mend fences, but emotions are complex things. At some time she meant something to him. Who knows what might have paased through his mind at some time during reconciliation. We know he probably wasn't in the healthiest place. It doesnt necessarily mean very much.

And this is just saying, well, that's the way the world is and how things fall out—kind of imperfect and messed up. This is a compromise and the best you can get. Asking him to dig himself out now would make the structure of their lives fall down around them.

 

Well, yes.

[merrmeade]

actually, she's WAY nicer than me.

You crack me up, kl. That's true of the OW in my case as well. But, well, we know that this just means they know what "nice" is supposed to look and sound like to all the other "nice" people, right?

 

Regardless of what the OW is like in any case, they all share the ability to play mental gymnastics to not think about or be bothered by the pain and suffering they are causing their MM's wife WHEN she finds out. Part of those gymnastics include demonizing the BW. And they can still be really "nice" people! Precisely because they have convinced themselves the BW deserves it, brought it on herself or simply can't understand certain truths.

 

But the fact is, it just doesn't matter. OP has more important problems than what the OW is like or thinks of her. The OW just doesn't belong there and that's why preventing further contact was essential.

[alsudduth]

A friend asked me how I was doing yesterday, and I told him that in my heart I feel like my H is lying, but I have no proof. I can't end my 20 year relationship based on something I have no proof of....and I love him...and it's been over 3 years since the affair actually happened, so I think that has to be taken into consideration.

 

And even though 2 wrongs don't make a right, I DID have an A also after he did. And that makes it easier for me to choose to stay also.

 

One thing I was wondering about and would love your guy's thoughts -

 

Do you think that couples who are high school sweethearts, or get together so young that they haven't had other life experiences with other people, are more prone to infidelity issues, or do you think it's equal across the board whether you got together young or later after college for example?

[DKT3]

A friend asked me how I was doing yesterday, and I told him that in my heart I feel like my H is lying, but I have no proof. I can't end my 20 year relationship based on something I have no proof of....and I love him...and it's been over 3 years since the affair actually happened, so I think that has to be taken into consideration.

 

And even though 2 wrongs don't make a right, I DID have an A also after he did. And that makes it easier for me to choose to stay also.

 

One thing I was wondering about and would love your guy's thoughts -

 

Do you think that couples who are high school sweethearts, or get together so young that they haven't had other life experiences with other people, are more prone to infidelity issues, or do you think it's equal across the board whether you got together young or later after college for example?

 

This is something my wife and I have discussed at great length. We've been together since Jr year in highschool. I had one prior sexual experience she had none.

 

She admitted that in her mid 20's she really started to question only having me as a sexual partner. I questioned it going into college already in a very serious relationship, too serious for that age.

 

She had the affair and then I had tons of sexual partners....We both wish we could go back, it was something special. Yet we question would we be here today, what would have happened if those questions still had the same presents in our minds.

 

It's a different dynamic that so few understand. I do believe that it makes infidelity more likely, maybe if we had more experience we would have appreciated each other more. I didn't know, maybe with more experience we would not take have put up with the small flare ups that were common in the early days.

 

Now the experience we have is accompanied by guilt and shame....

[merrmeade]

Do you think that couples who are high school sweethearts, or get together so young that they haven't had other life experiences with other people, are more prone to infidelity issues, or do you think it's equal across the board whether you got together young or later after college for example?

I'm only weighing in on this question because I want to believe that more "lifetime" sweethearts lack the itch to wander than otherwise. I know a few couples like this, and it is IMPOSSIBLE to imagine any of the individuals capable of entertaining the idea infidelity. They would make a joke about it, then go tell their partner about the funny exchange. So the belief I like to carry about this kind of relationship is that their DNA is like that.

 

One of my cousins married her high school sweetheart. Another couple we haven't seen in many years, though our kids keep up, were high school sweethearts who had four kids. One of the four kids also married her high school boyfriend and, though the other three met their spouses at a later age, it was their first and last love interest. One of the daughters' husband is schizophrenic. Didn't matter. Stayed together. Another one's wife suffers from depression and OCD and can't seem to have kids. Still together. DNA or imprint?

 

There's something unsullied and uncomplicated about all the couples I've known. They have a few things in common that I've observed. Wholesome. Absence of restlessness. Don't fight much. Enjoy their spouses' company. Don't seek validation outside the relationship.

 

This is what I've seen and, though not the social norm, somehow it's comforting.

[Birdies]

A friend asked me how I was doing yesterday, and I told him that in my heart I feel like my H is lying, but I have no proof. I can't end my 20 year relationship based on something I have no proof of....and I love him...and it's been over 3 years since the affair actually happened, so I think that has to be taken into consideration.

 

And even though 2 wrongs don't make a right, I DID have an A also after he did. And that makes it easier for me to choose to stay also.

 

One thing I was wondering about and would love your guy's thoughts -

 

Do you think that couples who are high school sweethearts, or get together so young that they haven't had other life experiences with other people, are more prone to infidelity issues, or do you think it's equal across the board whether you got together young or later after college for example?

 

My ex husband and I were high school sweethearts but didn't get married until our early 30s, and I had an affair and we divorced a couple years later.

 

I know in our case, we loved each other deeply and werre best friends for so long, but I realize more and more how unsuited we were in many ways. Love languages, priorities, approaches to domestic life, etc. If I had set out to find a partner in my mid to late 20s or early 30s, I know I wouldn't have chosen and stayed with him because of some of those differences, even though he's easily one of my favorite people on the planet. But because we got together so young, I just couldn't fathom being without him and I had a very optimistic and perhaps an unrealistic view on how things would turn out. It was almost like Manifest Destiny...we just would be together forever no matter what....until I was in love with someone else and I suddenly realized that the future could be different. Even then, I never planned on leaving until DDay and everything blew up.

 

I know this sounds cruel and selfish, and I am incredibly full of remorse, and my ex knows that and has been forgiving. I'm just trying to answer your question honestly. I'm not sure if we are the exception or the rule, but yes I do think that having been together since we were young contributed to the infidelity. Even when I was deep in the affair, I couldn't imagine being without my husband. Crazy right.

[alsudduth]

Had a hard night last night. It seems like things are going along well, we are both trying hard (for the first time, I can see the equal effort being put in) to repair the relationship and we both want it.....but how do we deal with the triggers? I say we because I'm sure he has them too and has an easier time letting it go than me, but when I have a trigger, all I can think about are the lies he told me, and thoughts run through my mind of him being loving towards someone else when he struggled so hard to give me the same love back 4 years ago. It's very hard to shake it.

 

Maybe because he can't pin point WHY he was so unhappy with me. Either way I'm having a hard time letting go yesterday and today.

 

On the other side, and not sure if related, I've had a dream of OM 2 nights in a row. I think that was more of recent stress and being in my hometown for Easter induced though.

[Southern Sun]

Had a hard night last night. It seems like things are going along well, we are both trying hard (for the first time, I can see the equal effort being put in) to repair the relationship and we both want it.....but how do we deal with the triggers? I say we because I'm sure he has them too and has an easier time letting it go than me, but when I have a trigger, all I can think about are the lies he told me, and thoughts run through my mind of him being loving towards someone else when he struggled so hard to give me the same love back 4 years ago. It's very hard to shake it.

 

Maybe because he can't pin point WHY he was so unhappy with me. Either way I'm having a hard time letting go yesterday and today.

 

On the other side, and not sure if related, I've had a dream of OM 2 nights in a row. I think that was more of recent stress and being in my hometown for Easter induced though.

 

I know my OM comes back into my thoughts when things are rough at home. And certainly if there are place triggers, and you are visiting there, I can imagine that those things are contributing.

 

I have to think that you have been re-traumatized to an extent by this contact by the OW and the introduction of the thought that your H is not being completely truthful. That has to leave some new doubt in your mind and it's messing with you. Another thought...how do you know he was unhappy with you? So many in affairs are not really all that unhappy at home, if at all.

 

I wanted to address your other question, about childhood sweethearts, because my H and I knew each other from high school and started dating in college. In some ways, I think it could have contributed to my affair. But because I am not two people at the same time, and I haven't experienced both circumstances, it's impossible for me to know for sure, right?

 

I was pretty sexually inexperienced when I met my H...but not totally. I had a couple of boyfriends before him. So I had an idea of something else 'out there', but not much actual experience of it. I think what really added fuel to the fire was that then my H and I did not develop a very strong sexual relationship. He had difficulties that he chose not to address. I thus did not feel connected to him in that way. My MM came along and offered that to me. And it was a very big part of our relationship.

 

So, in my case, I do think the young marriage impacted my getting involved in an affair...but it was compounded by the fact that my H and I had a poor sexual relationship inside our M. Sometimes I think, if I had no experience other than my H, and if we had dealt with our sex issues, things might have been very different.

[alsudduth]

I heard back from the OW H. I told him it doesn't matter anymore and that I was moving forward. He said he was sorry for the pain she and my husband caused. And he said that hes not sure what she'd gain from lying, all it got her was a divorce.

 

He wished me well.

 

 

Also, my Husband put his ring back on without prodding from me! For some of you who have following my story know how important it was to me. Baby steps to big steps! We close on a house in a couple weeks!

[BTDT2012]

Had a hard night last night. It seems like things are going along well, we are both trying hard (for the first time, I can see the equal effort being put in) to repair the relationship and we both want it.....but how do we deal with the triggers? I say we because I'm sure he has them too and has an easier time letting it go than me, but when I have a trigger, all I can think about are the lies he told me, and thoughts run through my mind of him being loving towards someone else when he struggled so hard to give me the same love back 4 years ago. It's very hard to shake it.

 

Maybe because he can't pin point WHY he was so unhappy with me. Either way I'm having a hard time letting go yesterday and today.

 

On the other side, and not sure if related, I've had a dream of OM 2 nights in a row. I think that was more of recent stress and being in my hometown for Easter induced though.

 

He can't pinpoint, because his unhappiness was with himself, not you.

[alsudduth]

I found this a fitting card to find in my tarot spread this week:

 

" Something in your life is not what it seems. Perhaps a misunderstanding on your part, or a truth you cannot admit to yourself. It may also indicate something important being kept from you by another. This may be a source of worry or depression in your life, and the Moon is a strong indicator that you must rely on your intuition to see through the deceit. "

 

just found it interesting considering there is still a lingering question over weather my H is still lying. I feel he is, but I choose to move past it.

[Unforseen]

 

One thing I was wondering about and would love your guy's thoughts -

 

Do you think that couples who are high school sweethearts, or get together so young that they haven't had other life experiences with other people, are more prone to infidelity issues, or do you think it's equal across the board whether you got together young or later after college for example?

 

I met my WW in our senior year of high school. The A didn't happen until 18 years later. The issues that allowed her to make those choices weren't particularly related to her age when we connected or the lack of experiences with other people. I'm thinking it's more about the people involved and less about when they got married. The foundation that lead to me WW being able to make the choice to have an A was laid long before we even met.