Trapped Between Misery and Guilt

[Judd]

It's 3am and I can't sleep so here goes... 6 hears ago I married for the first time late in life at the age of 51 to a younger woman of 32. After years of being choosy only to find the girls I liked didn't fancy me, and not fancying the girls that did, and meeting girls I couldn't have trusted my future to, I finally met this attractive and vivacious girl who was totally honest and open, and who was full onto me like a whirlwind. We married after 2 years by which time I knew she was highly emotional but despite one or two isolated tantrums was lively company, with a lovable fun character, who was obviously serious about settling down as I was. I noticed early on that she was very possessive of me, and jealous when other girls were anywhere near me (not that she needed to be), but under the circumstances that actually felt quite nice for a change. We are both from different countries and met just after I returned from England to live close by my elderly mother who lives alone (my work allows me to live pretty much anywhere.) I bought a pretty old rural cottage and spent £150k turning it into something special, before we married. She loved it and I was over the moon that she got on so well with my mother and the rest of my family. Married life was a big change for me after those single years but I adapted surprisingly well and we were very happy. Before she could become pregnant she needed an operation (myomectomy) which couldn't have been done in her home country without removing any chance of her having children. I paid for the operation to be done privately in the UK and she became pregnant on our wedding night and our gorgeous baby daughter arrived. After a while I did come to see what her aunt meant when she described her as a hedgehog (sometimes prickly) but overall it was fine and we had all the makings of a happy family, although one thing puzzled me... she turned her back on her own mother from the moment she came to the UK and has never seen or spoken to her since our wedding. And didn't even want to discuss it except that she said it was never good between them. Now, over the ensuing years I have gradually begun to find myself more and more walking on eggshells. Everything can be fine but it can also switch the other way at the drop of a hat. We did have a rocky patch when, although I work from home and am around most of the time, she felt (maybe rightly) that I was cutting myself off and she was lonely, and at one point she didn't speak to me for at least 24 hours; maybe a throwback to not sharing my life for so long, but I learned my lesson and I give her all the attention I can. but I have noticed other things... she has extreme mood swings and her relationships with people in general she can be almost over-enthusiastic at the beginning, then suddenly turn against them. I am sad to say that seems to have been the case with my mother, who is genuinely the sweetest person you could meet and treated her like a daughter. Elderly as she is, she would do anything for us and it pains me to see her being treated coldly by my own wife for no good reason. My wife had a miscarriage in January and because we had already announced the pregnancy we decided that whilst we didn't want the bad news broadcast deliberately, if any of my mum's friends or family asked about it specifically she could tell them what had happened. Being a small community it wasn't long before people were coming to my wife with their words of comfort and she took offence to the news being so "out there" which caused a rift with my mum that shows no sign of abating. That is something I'm not sure how long I can accept. Meanwhile my wife is also now saying she no longer wants to live here and we have to move. All my life I have dreamed of escaping the city and worked towards the goal of a house in the countryside, she knew from day one where we were going to live and that I needed to be near my elderly mother (who has needed our urgent help on occasions) and she was happy with that. Now that has changed. Our daughter became ill 5 weeks ago and although she has recovered medically, the trauma of it has left her unable/unwilling to talk since, and she has been displaying extremes of behaviour symptomatic of PTSD. She is now having therapy for that, it isn't so uncommon in youngsters and it seems obvious to everyone including doctors that she will bounce back. However my wife has reacted with near hysteria (yes it's stressful for any parent but she actually told me last night she couldn't cope, that she had lost her daughter, and that she was contemplating suicide.) My daughter has become so clingy with her mum, and shutting me out, that I even booked a place on a hospital ward for tem both because I felt they were at risk; thankfully she calmed down eventually but today she told me that she did reach a point recently where she was preparing to pack up and move abroad with our daughter. I didn't dwell on it because hopefully it is her own trauma talking, but it has stuck with me because there was no mention of me being included in those plans. The UK health service was a bit shoddy at first with my daughter and now my wife hates this country. When I tell you that her friend from her home country has a mother who has "spiritual powers" and whose advice my wife has been prioritising over that of the doctors, you may understand what I am dealing with. Whilst I have been careful to ensure that none of this advice is acted upon if it is potentiaily medically harmful in any way, this spiritual woman has been fuelling my wife's fears and filling her with dread, and I have tried not to inflame a fraught situation by condemning her but have put my foot down and called a spade a spade. That hasn't gone down well. We have been told repeatedly to be calm and positive around our daughter at all times but my wife seems incapable of it. The long and short of it is that I feel like I am watching a jigsaw puzzle, and the more pieces that are added to it, the more I dread what the final picture is going to look like, I think there is big trouble ahead.

[EmilyJane]

Oh dear.

 

That last line. It is chilling and I think very sensible. And exactly how I reacted reading it.

 

I think you need to see a lawyer who can advise you about any preventative measures to stop your wife fleeing the country with your daughter. Because once that happens there is almost no legal recourse and the country of the flee-er tends to protect them and or favour mothers having greater rights to custody.

 

I know it's not nice. But I can see it is what you think is brewing. I think it would be better to quickly work out your options so you can avoid a far greater tragedy.

 

May I ask what nationality she is? And what the medical issue your daughter faced was?

Edited April 1, 2017 by EmilyJane

[Downtown]

She has extreme mood swings.

Judd, the two most common causes of mood changes are hormone change and drug abuse. Given that your W apparently is neither pregnant nor a drug abuser, it seems unlikely they are a source of her instability. (But, as I note below, early-onset perimenopause is a possibility that should be considered.)

 

I therefore note that the two remaining common causes of strong mood changes are BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) and BP (Bipolar Disorder). Significantly, the behaviors you describe do not sound like red flags for bipolar. Instead, the described behaviors -- i.e., irrational jealousy, black-white thinking, suicide threat, extreme mood swings, and rapid flips between adoring you and devaluing you -- are classic warning signs for BPD.

 

I'm not saying that your W exhibits full-blown BPD but, rather, that she may exhibit moderate to strong traits of it. I mention this because a person exhibiting "extreme mood swings" is emotionally unstable. Significantly, of the ten personality disorders, BPD is the only one having "unstable" as a defining symptom. Indeed, most of the 9 BPD symptoms describe behavior that is unstable or arises from an inability to control emotions.

 

I knew she was highly emotional....

If she is a BPDer (i.e., exhibits strong and persistent traits), "highly emotional" is exactly what you should expect. BPDers are so emotionally immature that they are unable to regulate their own emotions. The result is that they frequently experience emotions so intense that they distort the BPDer's perception of your intentions and motivations.

 

This is why a large share of the psychiatric community has been lobbying for two decades (here in the States) to change the disorder's name to "Emotion Regulation Disorder." And this is why one of the 9 defining traits for BPD is "Inappropriate, intense anger or problems controlling anger." Like young children, BPDers have difficulty controlling all of their emotions.

 

She actually told me last night she couldn't cope, that she had lost her daughter, and that she was contemplating suicide.

Another one of the 9 defining traits for BPD is "Recurring suicidal behaviors or threats or self-harming behavior, such as cutting."

 

My wife has reacted with near hysteria....

Another one of the 9 defining traits is "Having stress-related paranoid thoughts."

Her relationships with people in general she can be almost over-enthusiastic at the beginning, then suddenly turn against them.

BPDers can flip -- in less than a minute -- from Jekyll (adoring you) to Hyde (devaluing you). Similarly, they can flip just a quickly in devaluing a close friend. These rapid flips arise from "black-white thinking." Like a young child, a BPDer is too emotionally immature to be able to handle strong conflicting feelings (e.g., love and hate). A BPDer also has great difficulty tolerating ambiguities, uncertainties, and the other gray areas of interpersonal relationships.

 

She therefore will categorize everyone close to her as "all good" (i.e., "white" or "with me") or "all bad" (i.e., "black" or "against me"). And she will recategorize someone from one polar extreme to the other -- in just ten seconds -- based solely on a minor comment or action. This B-W thinking also will be evident in the frequent use of all-or-nothing expressions such as "You NEVER..." and "You ALWAYS...." Because a BPDer's close friends eventually will be "split black," it is unusual for a BPDer to have really close long-term friends (unless they live a long distance away).

 

Everything can be fine but it can also switch the other way at the drop of a hat.

As I noted above, there is no "gray" area for BPDers because they cannot tolerate strong conflicting feelings. Hence, when you trigger one of the BPDer's two great fears -- abandonment and engulfment -- you will instantly be re-categorized from "all good" to "all bad." The BPDer therefore will create a fight -- over absolutely nothing at all -- to push you away. And, a few hours or days later, she can flip back to perceiving you as "all good" just as quickly, in only ten seconds.

 

She was very possessive of me, and jealous when other girls were anywhere near me.

A BPDer has a great fear of abandonment, which is one of the 9 defining traits. This fear typically is manifested in behavior as an irrational jealousy. BPDers mistakenly see abandonment threats where they don't even exist -- e.g., your looking at another woman for a second instead of a half-second. My BPDer exW, for example, would fear abandonment whenever I was walking two steps in front of her on a narrow sidewalk (presumably because she misinterpreted it to mean I was ashamed to be seen close to her in public).

 

She got on so well with my mother and the rest of my family.

If she really is a BPDer, it is very unlikely that her closeness with your family will last. BPDers have such a great fear of abandonment that they tend to feel threatened by any substantial time you spend with family members or your close friends. The BPDer mistakenly feels that you are somehow choosing them over her. My exW, for example, resented the time I spent with my sister and parents -- and she was very jealous of the time and money I spent on my adult foster son.

 

...which caused a rift with my mum that shows no sign of abating.

Like I said, her closeness with your family members likely will quickly disappear if she is a BPDer. Most likely, she will misinterpret some minor comment (real or imagined) and then become deeply hurt over absolutely nothing. The result is that she will push your family members away, just like she has been doing with her close friends.

 

She turned her back on her own mother from the moment she came to the UK and has never seen or spoken to her since our wedding.

A recent large-scale American study found that 70% of BPDers report they had been abused or abandoned by an emotionally cold parent during childhood. Hence, if your W really is a BPDer, it would not be surprising to learn that she refuses to speak with her own mother.

 

Now, over the ensuing years I have gradually begun to find myself more and more walking on eggshells.

The abused partners of BPDers usually feel like they are walking on eggshells to avoid triggering another senseless argument. This is why the #1 best-selling BPD book is titled, Stop Walking on Eggshells.

 

Her friend from her home country has a mother who has "spiritual powers" and whose advice my wife has been prioritizing over that of the doctors.

If she is a BPDer, her emotional development is so stunted -- at about the level of a four-year-old -- she is fully reliant on the primitive ego defenses used by young children. These include black-white thinking, projection, denial, and temper tantrums.

 

These primitive defenses also include magical thinking, which will be evident when the BPDer believes strongly in an irrational claim. Like a young child, a BPDer is too immature to intellectually challenge her intense feelings -- which she accepts as self-evident "facts" because, when a feeling is intense, she is convinced it MUST be true.

 

Trapped Between Misery and Guilt.

If you really have been living with a BPDer for 6 years, consider yourself lucky that you are only feeling "misery and guilt." Of the 157 mental disorders listed in the APA's diagnostic manual, BPD is the one most notorious for making the abused partners feel like they may be losing their minds. This is largely why therapists typically see far more of those abused partners -- coming in to find out if they are going insane -- than they ever see of the BPDers themselves.

 

I think there is big trouble ahead.

Judd, I agree with EmilyJane that it would be wise to see an attorney ASAP about child custody protective measures. I also suggest you see a psychologist -- for a visit or two all by yourself -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is you and your daughter are dealing with. One possibility, as I discussed above, is that your W suffers from strong and persistent traits of BPD. Yet, if that is the case, those traits almost certainly would have started showing in her teens and would not have disappeared for years at a time. Indeed, the only time persistent BPD traits would disappear is during the infatuation stage of your R/S -- a period that usually lasts 4 to 6 months but sometimes may last a year.

 

If you are not seeing a persistent problem with strong BPD traits, another possibility is that you are seeing a temporary flareup of the normal BPD traits we all have. Such flareups can be caused in a 38-year-old woman by early-onset perimenopause, which can cause her hormones to surge for several years. It is unusual but some women experience the onset of perimenopause in their mid-thirties. It therefore would be prudent for her to see a doctor about having her hormone levels checked.

 

I also suggest that, while you're looking for a good psych, you take a quick look at my list of 18 BPD Warning Signs to see if most sound very familiar. If so, I would suggest you also read my more detailed description of them at my posts in Rebel's Thread. If that description rings many bells, I would be glad to join EmilyJane in discussing them with you.

 

Significantly, learning to spot these warning signs will not enable you to diagnose your W's issues. Yet, like learning warning signs for stroke and heart attack, learning those for BPD may help you avoid a painful situation, e.g., remaining in a toxic marriage with your W or running into the arms of another woman just like her. Take care, Judd.

[EmilyJane]

His wife has just had a recent miscarriage I think he said Downtown.

 

I'm not sure that we can rule out hormonal changes.

Or even grief. She's lost one baby then been horrified by the serious illness of the other. That is horrendous emotional and hormonal overload for a woman living in a foreign country which I think explains leaning to spiritual methods from her homeland. And the rift with the mother in law for exposing her private tragedy to others. She will feel losing the baby and her child becoming ill then so traumatised is her fault and failing as a mother.

 

I do think that one thing you can do OP is to have words with your mother about discretion and respecting privacy and take your wife's side. Your mother had absolutely no right to share her daughter in laws miscarriage with anyone. That is a horrendous boundary violation. I do not believe that this was something your wife would have consented to on her own.

 

This is a mother in fear, and very real grief and distress at least in part. Whatever else is going on.

 

And she feels completely alone and misunderstood and betrayed by you.

 

You act like it's her fault for not being able to be calm in a situation which is extremely distressing. Do you not realise thst if she could be she would and the fact that she can't is making her feel even more distressed? Your job is to help her not condemn her. No more putting your foot down about anything. Understanding and empathy and support. This is a partnership and decisions are made in concert. Or she will do the same thing and leave with your child.

 

So one part of your plan to head off her fleeing with you daughter is regaining her trust and reassuring her and allowing her to open up to you about her inner turmoil. It doesn't sound like you have much communication about complex emotional issues.

 

It probably isn't the greatest idea to force her into counselling as this will only send the message that she is the problem and alienate her that much faster. But I think if you tell her she is the love of your life and you're sad that she is suffering and that you would like to go to counselling together to work through the loss, to be a better partner and to better support your daughters recovery that might have a greater chance at success. And would buy you more time.

 

What was she like after the birth of your daughter?

 

I also feel I really need to point out that you talk about her in a very patronising way. Like she is a five year old girl and you her father. Why do you describe the genuine past emotional expressions of a woman in her thirties as tantrums? That completely diminishes her emotional reality and it's not going to help this situation very much.

 

I'm also confused about why the post is titled guilt and misery because you haven't said overmuch about your emotions or what you feel guilty about really. Perhaps you should tell us

Edited April 1, 2017 by EmilyJane

[Downtown]

I'm not sure that we can rule out hormonal changes.

I agree, Emily. That's why I suggested above that Judd encourage his W to see a doctor to get her hormone levels checked.

 

She's lost one baby then been horrified by the serious illness of the other. That is horrendous emotional and hormonal overload.

True. But Judd is describing emotional issues that apparently started showing 8 years ago when they began dating -- i.e., long before the miscarriage occurred. He states that, by the time they were 2 years into the R/S, he already "knew she was highly emotional" because he had already witnessed "one or two isolated tantrums." He also states that he "noticed early on that she was very possessive of me, and jealous when other girls were anywhere near me."

 

Further, he states "She turned her back on her own mother from the moment she came to the UK." He states that, since the wedding six years ago, "I have gradually begun to find myself more and more walking on eggshells." He also mentions a number of other emotional issues that predate the miscarriage. He mentions, for example, her "extreme mood swings" and the way "her relationships with people in general she can be almost over-enthusiastic at the beginning, then suddenly turn against them."

 

Your mother had absolutely no right to share her daughter in laws miscarriage with anyone.

Actually she did have the right -- according to what Judd tells us. He says that he and his W had given the mother permission to speak about the miscarriage when asked. Specifically, Judd says "because we had already announced the pregnancy, we decided that whilst we didn't want the bad news broadcast deliberately, if any of my mum's friends or family asked about it specifically she could tell them what had happened.

[EmilyJane]

Oh I totally got the bit where you noted the possibility of hormones. I hadn't thought of it and was agreeing.

 

 

Omg I did it again didn't I downtown? I swear I thought I had read it super carefully. You're right, she did give permission.

 

But I'm also trying my hardest to think up what her perspective and emotions might be so that there's another line of defence against having a huge transcontinental tragedy.

 

And I actually think it's possible she's reacting emotionally like she didn't give permission and seeing her mother in law and he loyal son by default as not on her side.

 

So I think if he can find a way to really and pointedly demonstrate that she does in fact have his loyalty, no matter what, even against his mother (even if it's only for show TBH, I mean given the stakes) ... it might buy some time while he discreetly explores the legal risks and preventative measures and if he can even really start to do some counselling with her, it might be a solution in of itself.

 

However I think it all hinges on these hints we get of a child in a woman's body which I find alarming for the same reasons you do. I can't tell if that is because she really is on the spectrum or it's cultural differences or the age gap. It is really rare in my experience for men to use the sort of language about their partner that he does without there being something a bit odd going on.

 

It would really help if op came back and told us exactly what one of these "tantrums" entails.

 

 

Jeebus. The horror of being afraid your wife will abscond with your child overseas. Like. We've all seen the years of frustration and front page news that results in for families.