definitely over with MM [UPDATED: Just Friends?? Or impossible?]

[lostgirl87]

What does it mean?

 

It means he doesn't want to let you go. But he's not choosing you either.

It means nothing will change. He will keep doing what he does. That's all it means.

 

We OW...women in general I think, want to believe the tears and the desperation mean something. That it's this undying passionate never ending love.

 

But ultimately who cares because he's still not choosing to be with you.

 

Actions, Actions Actions.

 

Not words and sad puppy dog eyes.

 

 

Well yeah definitely actions speak louder than words. But his actions are showing me a confused man. He hasn't chosen me. But he isn't exactly choosing his wife because wouldn't that mean cutting me off? He was set to divorce when she said "divorce". Then when he brought it back a few days later, she changed her mind and begged for another chance. He claims he feels guilty and obligated to give her this after everything he's done.

 

I don't want to be stuck in the back and forth so I guess whether he's confused or not is irrelevant. But in all honesty, I would feel better knowing he is confused and hurting instead of just some monster who is playing with my emotions and faking love just for his own sick and twisted fun.

 

Thank you for your comment

[FoundMyStrength]

Over the weekend I tried to distract myself, have fun with gfs, and after a few drinks and discussing my situation with my gfs, I ended up having a panic/anxiety attack and went to the hospital. I reached out to MM to let him know what was going on. Stupid, I know. We didn't actually speak on the phone until Monday morning.

 

On Tuesday we had lunch together even though we had been fighting. Lunch was fine. Full of the usual "I love you"s and kissing. We sat and talked in the car for a while, he tried to "do more" but we didn't. He wasn't upset - he still kissed my forehead and repeatedly told me how much he loved me. He called me on his way home from work.

 

Now today: I sent him a text this morning when I didn't get a morning call and realized I was blocked which means something happened. I figured something was up when I didn't get a call but to be blocked let me know immediately something changed. I emailed him. His response was "Please stop. We need to end this." I said "ok that's fine. however I am tired of the back and forth so can we meet, talk and end this once and for all?". I'm the type of person that HAS to talk things out. Something I learned to do when I had a very unhealthy way of dealing with stress and anxiety back in law school (but that's a separate issue).

 

We met up.

 

He immediately began crying telling me how much he loves me and how awful he feels for the effect this is having on my health and relationship with my family and friends. (my mother recently went off on me and called me every OW slur you can think of- we are fine now). He said his wife was questioning him again yesterday about me and that he can't keep hurting both of us. I stayed strong, I didn't cry (at first) and told him I completely understood the difficulty of his situation and that he has nothing to worry about. That I don't hate him, I don't fault him for doing what he feels he needs to do (giving his W another chance). He continued saying how he doesn't know how much longer he is going to tolerate this situation with her. that she has been tracking his phone by linking the apple IDs or some kind of linking app , I don't know.

 

He said "I don't know if I'm going to walk out this week, in a month, or within the time frame you have set but I know this isn't going to work with her. I don't see it going anywhere and I don't see myself with her anymore. She won't get over you And I definitely can't get over you. But I can't do this to you anymore. You deserve to be someone's everything. Not to be holding off for someone who is so effing lost and all over the place. I have to do this for my sanity. I hurt her enough to just walk away now. I hurt you enough to keep you here. i don't want to let you go. God knows I don't want you out of my life but this is so unfair to you. I can't ask you to wait but I want to. I want to go to your parents and let them know that I love their daughter and how sorry I am for putting you in this position. I don't know how to leave right now without it affecting you and I down the road". At this point the tears are pouring from his eyes while intensely holding and kissing my hand. And because I am not made of stone, after a few minutes, I eventually gave in and cried with him. Although it was just a few tears and not full blown sob-fest so I kind of won that lol. Anyway, I reassure him that I am ok, that I understand and that I do not hate him. That I knew the chances of this working out with us were slim to none and that despite everything, I do not regret what we shared but wish we had met at a different time so as to not have caused this mess.

 

I thanked him for meeting with me and giving me what few MM would do in a situation like this. (Like another poster on here whose MM just vanished - I don't know how I could have handled that!)

 

I thanked him for being honest and not wanting to keep me in limbo and allowing me to move on. I then did the hardest thing I have ever done in my life: I asked him to please not contact me again b/c I am not strong enough to resist him right now. I asked for no blocked calls, no emails, no links to romantic love songs. I reassured him that I would not reach out in any way but I need him to stay away from me. The look on his face when I said this was something I have never seen. He cried harder than I have ever seen anyone cry and said he can't promise me that b/c he loves me and doesn't want to let me go despite knowing he has to. He kept talking about the hole I would leave in his heart, mind and soul. That I have become a part of him and he has no idea how to work on that without destroying someone else he cares for. I again told him it was ok, that I understood, that he doesn't need to explain or worry about me. I willingly put myself here and I'd be ok.

 

We ended with the most passionate kiss I have ever had, tons of "i love you". And then, after the most intense hour of my effing life!!! A "break up" straight from the cheesiest romance movie you could yhink of- this man says "I can't have you out of my life. My life is with you. I am going to reach out to you once I figure out this phone thing". I said "MM, please don't. it's ok. I am fine. this is what we need to do". He then pulls me out of the car and just hugs and kisses me.

 

And sure enough, as I was typing this dang essay, I get a call from his job. i ignored it. He called again. I answered and he says "I love you. We are going to be ok".

 

Now I can only imagine you judgmental posters are dying to say "I told you so, lostgirl. cheaters never win". and I guess you can but just know I will ignore your comments. What I need now is actual ADVICE. UNDERSTANDING. what the heck is this!? I tried to be mature and understanding of his situation. I didn't ask him to choose me. I didn't tell him to leave. I respected his decision. I refuse to believe this is just a game to him. He could easily go away and stay away. The way he cut off the other girl. I am not making it difficult for him to leave me. I am not threatening him or begging him or forcing him to talk. So what is this? Has anyone had this before? Is he confused?

 

I know I need to stay away. That's a given. And that's my goal! I guess I just want to understand all of this...

 

This is how my xMM and I ended.our mostly emotional affair before he was set to return home to his wife in another town. A long 3 weeks of nonstop texting, a very emotional hours long Skype call with crying, a bad decision to create a secret email account which ended up being used to resume communication. More I love yous and I miss yours and romantic love-filled passages from books sent my way.

 

I think that could have gone on for a long time. We were in love, but also very addicted to each other with very little self control. And then I found love shack and found out that confused MM who love you, cry about leaving you, and send you romantic emails are a dime a dozen. More importantly, these poor confused MM NEVER leave their wives.

 

We OW have to create our own destiny. You've made your choice. You seem to understand the score. He needs to figure out his marriage first and you can't be his crutch. Don't let him pull you back in. Take it from the OWs on this site who were with MM for 2,3,5,7 years. You need to let him go. He won't let you go.

[Birdies]

I felt this way in my marriage too. MM and I called off the affair a few times but couldn't keep it called off. It feels like an impossible reality where you can't end your marriage but you also can't give up the love you share with someone else. (Assuming he's not just playing you, which it sounds like he's not.)

 

I don't know what to tell you except that he wants to have his cake and eat it too. I did as well. He COULD end his marriage and be with you, but he's not.

 

It must just really suck to be on the receiving end of that and be single and be available and not have it be a possibility. I feel for you. Honestly I would block him. That's the easiest way to start not feeling this way and start not enduring all this painful crap. Maybe you could tell him that when and if he has a divorce decree, he could call your work to get ahold of you, but not before. But I'd block him on your cell and email and social media.

 

Edit: I'll also just say it's a super dick move on his part to try to reconcile with his wife but not end things with you. All the infidelity resources say that the worst thing about an affair isn't the actual affair and DDay, but all the trickle-truthing that often comes afterward. It's like running someone over in your car and then getting out and kicking them a whole bunch while they're broken on the ground for good measure.

Edited May 3, 2017 by Birdies

[IwasJeannie]

Well yeah definitely actions speak louder than words. But his actions are showing me a confused man. He hasn't chosen me. But he isn't exactly choosing his wife because wouldn't that mean cutting me off? He was set to divorce when she said "divorce". Then when he brought it back a few days later, she changed her mind and begged for another chance. He claims he feels guilty and obligated to give her this after everything he's done.

 

I don't want to be stuck in the back and forth so I guess whether he's confused or not is irrelevant. But in all honesty, I would feel better knowing he is confused and hurting instead of just some monster who is playing with my emotions and faking love just for his own sick and twisted fun.

 

Thank you for your comment

 

I'm the one who had the MM vanish. Obviously I'm not much further out from you but today I'm telling myself I will never listen to words unless they match actions. Looking back I ignored that a lot, I wanted to believe the words, I wanted it to be true.

 

Some MM leave, most don't and if they do it's not picture perfect if the BS knows and even if she doesn't. Live your life, if it's going to happen it's more likely to happen with you out of the picture. Leave on a good note like you did. As hard as it was and I could feel your pain, if you continue she'll find out and it won't be pretty. Let him make the decision with a clear head and without your involvement. Stay strong

[aileD]

Lost girl,

 

Reading your story reminded me so much of my H and his OW and the back and forth that went on with the three of us for a good year. I know my H said all the same things to his OW because I read them. And, because he was honest with me about his feelings for her and how hard it was to break the addiction. And how he really did want to R with me but had a hard time staying away from her. She also was the type thet was like "just see me one more time we need to do this in person." And he'd give in. He'd write letters of goodbye professing his love and hope they would be together someday. It was a very hard cycle to break.

 

All I can tell you is this. It's not unique. And you will be okay if you can just find a way to move on and stay NC. My H's AP that thought she could never live without him is already dating someone seriously after 8 months of NC. If she can move on, anyone can. I'm sure of that

 

Stay strong for you. Don't worry about him. He may want to be with you until he future but he's not doing it now so just keep telling yourself that you deserve better. You deserve better. You deserve better.

 

I wish you luck

[aileD]

But his actions are showing me a confused man.

 

No. His WORDS are telling you he's confused.

 

The only action that you need to pay attention to is where he lays his head at night.

 

If it's not with you, then there's no confusion.

 

 

You can do this!

[Chica80]

Well yeah definitely actions speak louder than words. But his actions are showing me a confused man. He hasn't chosen me. But he isn't exactly choosing his wife because wouldn't that mean cutting me off? He was set to divorce when she said "divorce". Then when he brought it back a few days later, she changed her mind and begged for another chance. He claims he feels guilty and obligated to give her this after everything he's done.

 

I don't want to be stuck in the back and forth so I guess whether he's confused or not is irrelevant. But in all honesty, I would feel better knowing he is confused and hurting instead of just some monster who is playing with my emotions and faking love just for his own sick and twisted fun.

 

Thank you for your comment

 

Ya I hear you but don't let his confusion keep you stuck. Or going back. This is a normal pattern. Alot of us know it well.....

[lostgirl87]

This is how my xMM and I ended.our mostly emotional affair before he was set to return home to his wife in another town. A long 3 weeks of nonstop texting, a very emotional hours long Skype call with crying, a bad decision to create a secret email account which ended up being used to resume communication. More I love yous and I miss yours and romantic love-filled passages from books sent my way.

 

I think that could have gone on for a long time. We were in love, but also very addicted to each other with very little self control. And then I found love shack and found out that confused MM who love you, cry about leaving you, and send you romantic emails are a dime a dozen. More importantly, these poor confused MM NEVER leave their wives.

 

We OW have to create our own destiny. You've made your choice. You seem to understand the score. He needs to figure out his marriage first and you can't be his crutch. Don't let him pull you back in. Take it from the OWs on this site who were with MM for 2,3,5,7 years. You need to let him go. He won't let you go.

Thank you! I'm glad you were able to "escape" and move on with your life. I can only imagine the strength that comes from an experience like that. I know I'll feel like superwoman once I get past this.

 

Even though I love him, I feel like emotionally, I'm in a better and stronger place than he is. I see the confusion, hurt and desperation in him. Obviously I'm not over him and this will be hard but I'm a bit more objective and detached. Probably b/c most of my mourning was done after I found out about the ONS and talked to his wife. I told him I wanted to go completely away. That if he's telling her he'll give her another chance then it needs to be real. He needs to cut me out and love her and be with her. He says he can't b/c he doesn't feel that way. That he's angry that he's even there. But has this moral/emotional obligation not necessarily to her but to himself. I know he feels guilty about having done this. I don't think he regrets me. He regrets that it came out and he is seen as a cheater.

 

In the end, I know he needs to figure it out on his own. And that's what I want for him. I want him to be happy no matter what.

[Overtaxed]

Well yeah definitely actions speak louder than words. But his actions are showing me a confused man. He hasn't chosen me. But he isn't exactly choosing his wife because wouldn't that mean cutting me off? He was set to divorce when she said "divorce". Then when he brought it back a few days later, she changed her mind and begged for another chance. He claims he feels guilty and obligated to give her this after everything he's done.

 

I don't want to be stuck in the back and forth so I guess whether he's confused or not is irrelevant. But in all honesty, I would feel better knowing he is confused and hurting instead of just some monster who is playing with my emotions and faking love just for his own sick and twisted fun.

 

Thank you for your comment

 

He doesn't have to choose, you're letting him have you with his wife lying beside him at night. That's why, without question, the next move for any female AP who thinks their MM is in love with them is "Nothing physical, no sex, no kissing, etc until you serve the W with divorce papers". That'll tell you where his heart is. Prepare, unfortunately, to have yours broken though, this is "cheating man 101" and, the story plays out over and over again.

 

It's good your reading his actions and not words, but you're misreading them. His actions say "I like having sex with you and then going home to my wife". Because, end of the day, that's exactly what he's doing.

[Eight]

I have experienced some of the same things you have.

 

The thing that strikes me about you is that in this situation, YOU aren't confused about what you want. You are very clear. If a guy needs this much convincing and back and forth and crying and boo hoo...do you even want him? He's so wishy washy. You are worth a solid YES.

 

His back and forth sob story must be getting old for you at this point, as much as you may love him. He's a adult (presumably). Seriously, at some point you have to just say love is not enough. It's not worth tying yourself in knots to make a damn relationship work. It's mentally and emotionally exhausting and is taking a toll on your health for the love of God. Life has more to it than this.

 

I think it gets to the point where it's just ridiculous. If this guy doesn't see that the world will keep turning if he decides to be with you...but he won't. He, like many MM, are conflict avoidant and will only be like a leaf in the wind, just letting everyone else make the decisions for them. Eventually you will see how unappealing this characteristic is and wonder what the hell you were wasting your time for.

 

It just takes a lot of time and NC. Just one day at a time. One healthy choice at a time. Good luck.

[lostgirl87]

I felt this way in my marriage too. MM and I called off the affair a few times but couldn't keep it called off. It feels like an impossible reality where you can't end your marriage but you also can't give up the love you share with someone else. (Assuming he's not just playing you, which it sounds like he's not.)

 

I don't know what to tell you except that he wants to have his cake and eat it too. I did as well. He COULD end his marriage and be with you, but he's not.

 

It must just really suck to be on the receiving end of that and be single and be available and not have it be a possibility. I feel for you. Honestly I would block him. That's the easiest way to start not feeling this way and start not enduring all this painful crap. Maybe you could tell him that when and if he has a divorce decree, he could call your work to get ahold of you, but not before. But I'd block him on your cell and email and social media.

 

Edit: I'll also just say it's a super dick move on his part to try to reconcile with his wife but not end things with you. All the infidelity resources say that the worst thing about an affair isn't the actual affair and DDay, but all the trickle-truthing that often comes afterward. It's like running someone over in your car and then getting out and kicking them a whole bunch while they're broken on the ground for good measure.

 

Yeah I don't plan on reaching out to him and he's been blocked. I actually feel ok. I went to bojangles afterward so that let's me know I'll be fine lol. Normally I wouldn't be able to eat or breathe at the thought of losing him! Had this happened months ago, before Dday, that would've been my reaction. My first post on here I was actually bawling hysterically and had no idea how I'd survive.

 

I don't want to tell him anything because I feel like he uses that to say he loves me and takes comfort in knowing that I'm there. What I'm hoping to do is be completely gone and forcing him to either realize he genuinely loves me and wants me in his life OR he's ok without me and his feelings aren't as strong as he claims. Again, that's my plan but let's see how that goes. I really don't want to do this back and forth forever.

 

And yes, I agree with you: the way he's going about the "reconciliation" is erong. That's why I wanted to be gone. So they had a real reconciliation. But he claims to not want that. That he's only there bc she asked for another chance and he doesn't know how to leave. He says he has to do this but doesn't seem willing to do the "dirty work", i.e. Cut me out and actually focus on her. I fully believe he is confused and as long as I allow us to talk, that won't change.

 

I love him but something's gotta give. I just talked to a friend and she asked me what the longest was we'd ever gone without speaking. I was ashamed to admit it's never been longer than 2 days. She then said "you guys have to do this. You have to stop talking. It's the only thing you 2 haven't done and it may be what sways things one way or the other but at least you'll know" and she's right. This has to end somehow.

[lostgirl87]

I'm the one who had the MM vanish. Obviously I'm not much further out from you but today I'm telling myself I will never listen to words unless they match actions. Looking back I ignored that a lot, I wanted to believe the words, I wanted it to be true.

 

Some MM leave, most don't and if they do it's not picture perfect if the BS knows and even if she doesn't. Live your life, if it's going to happen it's more likely to happen with you out of the picture. Leave on a good note like you did. As hard as it was and I could feel your pain, if you continue she'll find out and it won't be pretty. Let him make the decision with a clear head and without your involvement. Stay strong

I'm so sorry for what you're going through! I know we put ourselves in this situation but that doesn't make the heartache and feelings any less real or valid. I read your post and I couldn't even comment b/c I can't imagine how that must feel. I hope you are feeling better and getting stronger every day.

 

I definitely plan on staying away and letting him figure it out on his own. It's the only way this will stop and he will make the right decision. I've accepted it and I'm looking at this as a "goodbye" and not a "talk to you later". I can't tell him that b/c as you can tell, that upsets him and we get back to this awful cycle. Something's gotta give and it looks like I have to be the one to stop this back and forth.

[AutumnMoon]

He is confused obviously.

It's possible to love two women at one time it's also possible to be in love with your mistress and still not be ready to give up your entire life that you've built with another person.

 

I'm really sorry for what you're going through and depending how long you been together with him or how long he's been married or how many times he's on the back-and-forth it will probably never stop .

Protect your heart . If your gut is telling me to get out , get out. Good luck

[lostgirl87]

Lost girl,

 

Reading your story reminded me so much of my H and his OW and the back and forth that went on with the three of us for a good year. I know my H said all the same things to his OW because I read them. And, because he was honest with me about his feelings for her and how hard it was to break the addiction. And how he really did want to R with me but had a hard time staying away from her. She also was the type thet was like "just see me one more time we need to do this in person." And he'd give in. He'd write letters of goodbye professing his love and hope they would be together someday. It was a very hard cycle to break.

 

All I can tell you is this. It's not unique. And you will be okay if you can just find a way to move on and stay NC. My H's AP that thought she could never live without him is already dating someone seriously after 8 months of NC. If she can move on, anyone can. I'm sure of that

 

Stay strong for you. Don't worry about him. He may want to be with you until he future but he's not doing it now so just keep telling yourself that you deserve better. You deserve better. You deserve better.

 

I wish you luck

Thank you for your words! Especially as a BS to an OW. I'm so sorry you had to experience your own H being "confused". But thank you for reminding me that as difficult as this may be for me, there is someone out there going through worse and not b/c she chose this.

 

I feel ok and I haven't cried since I saw him earlier. I've given this everything that I have and now the only option I have left is to let go and let it be. It'll fall one way or another and I've finally accepted that either option is ok. I don't feel like I can't survive without him, I don't think I'll never love again or never get over him- I'm sad and I know I'll miss him. I know I'll want to talk to him about my crazy clients or one of my awkward/clumsy moments that he lives for.

 

Whatever happens, happens. The only thing I haven't done with him is cut off communication. This way we'll be forced to go one way or the other. It has to end. The cycle is the worst part!

[AlwaysGrowing]

Conflict Avoidant men always need to be seen as a "good" guy. That is why they lay it on so thick....their need to be validated is that great. Always wanting to do the right thing, be that kind of guy... but there is always something/someone stopping them.

 

Those that are in relationships with conflict avoidant types know only too well how frustrating they are as a full time partner. For they see every conflict as fighting..you against me... I will be the "good" one...which means you are the "bad" one. For they view assertive people as aggressive. They hold grudges/resentment. They lay blame at those closest to them.

 

They sit back and let others decide then silently complain that they never get their way. They can never be the true knight in shining armour because they are too busy putting all their energy into being a fool in a tinfoil hat.

[lostgirl87]

He doesn't have to choose, you're letting him have you with his wife lying beside him at night. That's why, without question, the next move for any female AP who thinks their MM is in love with them is "Nothing physical, no sex, no kissing, etc until you serve the W with divorce papers". That'll tell you where his heart is. Prepare, unfortunately, to have yours broken though, this is "cheating man 101" and, the story plays out over and over again.

 

It's good your reading his actions and not words, but you're misreading them. His actions say "I like having sex with you and then going home to my wife". Because, end of the day, that's exactly what he's doing.

I hear (read lol) what you're saying and thank you. I do just want to clarify that I haven't had sex with him in almost 2 months. We have kissed since DDay though but nothing more. Kissing is still not acceptable but at least it's not sex haha. Other than a few lunches and some kissing, he hasn't been getting any OW "benefits" from me.

 

My approach now is to stay away. I know he won't cut me off. That's what I thought was happening and I accepted it and told him it was ok and I understood. Unfortunately he changed his mind again and said he didn't want me gone. I have to do this. I can't keep this cycle going. It seems that when I try to have the "goodbye" talk he tries harder to keep me so I'm done having the talks with him. weve never gone more than a few days without speaking so this will force things one way or the other.

[lostgirl87]

I have experienced some of the same things you have.

 

The thing that strikes me about you is that in this situation, YOU aren't confused about what you want. You are very clear. If a guy needs this much convincing and back and forth and crying and boo hoo...do you even want him? He's so wishy washy. You are worth a solid YES.

 

His back and forth sob story must be getting old for you at this point, as much as you may love him. He's a adult (presumably). Seriously, at some point you have to just say love is not enough. It's not worth tying yourself in knots to make a damn relationship work. It's mentally and emotionally exhausting and is taking a toll on your health for the love of God. Life has more to it than this.

 

I think it gets to the point where it's just ridiculous. If this guy doesn't see that the world will keep turning if he decides to be with you...but he won't. He, like many MM, are conflict avoidant and will only be like a leaf in the wind, just letting everyone else make the decisions for them. Eventually you will see how unappealing this characteristic is and wonder what the hell you were wasting your time for.

 

It just takes a lot of time and NC. Just one day at a time. One healthy choice at a time. Good luck.

Yes!! Maybe that's why I feel so "okay" right now. I'm just so SICK of this. I've even called him a bltch for refusing to do what HE wants. And that's a big deal b/c he and I do not speak to each other that way at all. I still view and respect him as a man but this situation has shown me a side that I'm not thrilled with.

 

He needs the decision to be made for him. And that's what he was counting on until she decided she wanted another chance to change and make it better.

 

Since he doesn't like being the decision maker, I'll do it for him. I can't with this anymore. I tolerate A LOT for someone I love but when I get to my "enough is enough" point, I can walk away. I got my closure today and I'm doing ok. I will miss him but I'm excited to find my strength and take control of my life again.

[BTDT2012]

I ended up having a panic/anxiety attack and went to the hospital. I reached out to MM to let him know what was going on. Stupid, I know. We didn't actually speak on the phone until Monday morning.

Once again, he put you off until it was convenient. Of course he feels guilty that he caused you to be hospitalized. Be honest with yourself. You want him to be happy with you.

 

Watch his actions, ignore the words and tears. I hope you really have found your strength.

[lostgirl87]

He is confused obviously.

It's possible to love two women at one time it's also possible to be in love with your mistress and still not be ready to give up your entire life that you've built with another person.

 

I'm really sorry for what you're going through and depending how long you been together with him or how long he's been married or how many times he's on the back-and-forth it will probably never stop .

Protect your heart . If your gut is telling me to get out , get out. Good luck

Thank you. It makes me feel better to know, or at least know that it's possible, that he does love me and he is actually struggling with making a decision. Who knows what he's really thinking even though I believe that hos feelings are real.

 

I can't do the back and forth anymore so yes, I'm getting out. I know he'll reach back out so it's up to me to end it and let things go one way or another.

[FoundMyStrength]

Yes!! Maybe that's why I feel so "okay" right now. I'm just so SICK of this. I've even called him a bltch for refusing to do what HE wants. And that's a big deal b/c he and I do not speak to each other that way at all. I still view and respect him as a man but this situation has shown me a side that I'm not thrilled with.

 

He needs the decision to be made for him. And that's what he was counting on until she decided she wanted another chance to change and make it better.

 

Since he doesn't like being the decision maker, I'll do it for him. I can't with this anymore. I tolerate A LOT for someone I love but when I get to my "enough is enough" point, I can walk away. I got my closure today and I'm doing ok. I will miss him but I'm excited to find my strength and take control of my life again.

 

This got to me as well. By the end of it, I began to view him as a coward. Too much of a coward to do anything but prolong the agony. Wasn't particularly up front and honest with me. Never told his wife. Couldn't even make a clean break. I had to do that. All of that changed my perspective on him. If he came back today, I honestly don't think I'd want him. He's not the strong, smart, capable man I thought I fell in love with way back when.

 

Glad you're trying to find the strength to stay away. People call them conflict avoiders. I prefer calling a spade a spade: they're cowards.

[lostgirl87]

Conflict Avoidant men always need to be seen as a "good" guy. That is why they lay it on so thick....their need to be validated is that great. Always wanting to do the right thing, be that kind of guy... but there is always something/someone stopping them.

 

Those that are in relationships with conflict avoidant types know only too well how frustrating they are as a full time partner. For they see every conflict as fighting..you against me... I will be the "good" one...which means you are the "bad" one. For they view assertive people as aggressive. They hold grudges/resentment. They lay blame at those closest to them.

 

They sit back and let others decide then silently complain that they never get their way. They can never be the true knight in shining armour because they are too busy putting all their energy into being a fool in a tinfoil hat.

Yeahhhh I'm beginning to see this may be how he is. But I need a strong assertive man who can argue with me if needed and tell me what he wants or doesn't want. A man who is as strong, but preferably, stronger than me.

[lostgirl87]

Once again, he put you off until it was convenient. Of course he feels guilty that he caused you to be hospitalized. Be honest with yourself. You want him to be happy with you.

 

Watch his actions, ignore the words and tears. I hope you really have found your strength.

Of course I would prefer to be WITH him lol. But I'm not going to beg him or argue about why I'm the better choice. I figured today was a goodbye but once again, he's flip flopping.

 

I'm sick of it. I'm not angry. I'm not crying. I'm ok. I'm not made of stone so of course part of me will miss him and I'll want to reach out or answer his calls but this endless cycle is too much. I've given it all my all. Given him so many chances and support but it has to end somewhere. We've never done NC so this is good- we'll have to go 1 way or the other.

[AlwaysGrowing]

Try going back and reading this thread in its entirety.

 

You started a job in a career that takes years of education, fell for an office boy. Both of you lied to HR when asked about your relationship...a lawyer who lies...not a good calling card for your reputation in the industry.

 

He loses his job. You lose your job....maybe if you werent preoccupied with this relationship you would have been able to problem solve your way through office politics...a skill that a lawyer should possess.

 

The MM even complained to you about his wife earning more, her complaints about him seem spot on

 

He creates the conflict and you guys "fight" trying to find resolution. He blames you, love bombs you.... over and over.

 

Expect more of this. This is exactly how conflict avoidant types operate.

 

Think about it... you "broke" up... he hooked up immediately. That is how he handled conflict. He got his rocks off. And.... it was your fault because you guys were on a break.... perfection. He sold it... and you bought it.

 

Try relying on your years of education in the legal field and see this for what it is......stop giving yourself an out because it is about "feelings". Its about the truth.... surely a lawyer can see the truth.

[lostgirl87]

Try going back and reading this thread in its entirety.

 

You started a job in a career that takes years of education, fell for an office boy. Both of you lied to HR when asked about your relationship...a lawyer who lies...not a good calling card for your reputation in the industry.

 

He loses his job. You lose your job....maybe if you werent preoccupied with this relationship you would have been able to problem solve your way through office politics...a skill that a lawyer should possess.

 

The MM even complained to you about his wife earning more, her complaints about him seem spot on

 

He creates the conflict and you guys "fight" trying to find resolution. He blames you, love bombs you.... over and over.

 

Expect more of this. This is exactly how conflict avoidant types operate.

 

Think about it... you "broke" up... he hooked up immediately. That is how he handled conflict. He got his rocks off. And.... it was your fault because you guys were on a break.... perfection. He sold it... and you bought it.

 

Try relying on your years of education in the legal field and see this for what it is......stop giving yourself an out because it is about "feelings". Its about the truth.... surely a lawyer can see the truth.

I didn't lie to HR- I was never asked by HR or management. They knew or at least had very strong suspicions but ignored it and kept me on.

 

There was no getting through those office politics with this particular person. She has since been fired She did what she did to me and another young attorney to a few more senior attorneys so they let her go. That problem really was out of my hands and I'm happier now!

 

I never accepted fault for his ONS and made it clear to him that I would not take that blame and I don't feel like I pushed him into this other girl. He accepted full responsibility for his eff up, never tried to justify his actions and cut her off completely. When she reached out to him via email he told me and showed me the messages. But yes, it is definitely a problem that he did that at all. Should've never happened.

 

I don't believe I'm giving myself an out. I see the reality. I don't believe I'm delusional. I do love him and I do believe he loves me. However that love isn't enough. For whatever reason. And after today, I feel better and finally understand that if I don't make the changes, he never will and we will be in this limbo for God knows how long. That's something I'm not willing to do.

[anika99]

I can't have you out of my life. My life is with you. I am going to...

 

I was so sure that the above sentence was going to end with "I am going to divorce so that I can be with you", but no....It was I'm going to give you a call once I figure out this phone thing...LOL.....that's so lame of him.

 

Oh and the part about he doesn't know how much longer he can TOLERATE his wife tracking his phone....Oh now that's rich! Poor poor man. How dare his wife inconvenience him with her annoying distrust. I mean all he did was cheat on her multiple times and he is still lying to her now, but still...HOW DARE SHE treat him that way. Poor man, it's so unfair!

 

He doesn't have to tolerate anything about his wife. He could maybe be honest with her (GASP!), be a man and do the right thing. He doesn't know how much longer he can tolerate it but look at all the crap he is expecting his wife to tolerate. Look at the crap sandwich he is feeding you. Your supposed to accept his marriage and his one night stand and still hang onto him while he lazily takes time thinking about things and wondering what to do. Everyone is supposed to tolerate his bull but whenever someone pushes him to be honest or do the right thing he feels so put upon and unfairly treated.

 

What problem does he have with his phone anyways? Just a few days ago you posted that his wife is fully aware that he still talks to you so what does he care if she is tracking his phone? What he is doing to his wife with his ongoing lies is sick and cruel and selfish. What he is doing by trying to keep a hold on you is sick and cruel and selfish. But he whines and cries like he is a victim. I can't for the life of me understand why you are attracted to such a selfish cruel weak human being.

 

The best thing you can do is go no contact to break the spell you are under. I suspect that once you go several months without talking to him you will begin to see him for who he truly is. When you look back on this you will cringe at the memory of how you tried so hard to wait for a lying manipulative serial cheater to leave his wife for you.