Trying to understand wife's [past] affair

[georgia girl]

TH,

 

If this is how you truly feel, I think you and Ruined need to separate for awhile. You have kids and this situation is just awful for them. Parents arguing a lot and avoiding each other... the tension in the house becomes so unbearable for children. How do I know? I lived it. It was like walking on eggshells. We weren't supposed to know they were fighting, but believe me, we knew. And then, when things got really bad, they weren't as careful about hiding their arguments.

 

For a kid, it's just awful. A good day can turn bad on a dime. You had a great day at school, you're excited to share your news and bam! You come home and no one is talking to anyone. You do something as a family and someone says the wrong thing, and bam! Mom and Dad don't argue but give off tons of verbal cues that they're going to argue later (Dad starts slamming things around, Mom gets all quiet and withdraws, they both only talk to the kids). And then there's the cake topper - you had a normal, average day for a few days in a row and there's a verbal explosion right in front of you. Someone has been letting stuff build up and they feel so justified in their anger that they just let loose and say awful things if not right in front of us, while we were still in earshot. Oh, and we got to hear them twist each other's words at that time. It got so bad that I used to go down and get in the middle of the fight and try to negotiate peace. After hours of fighting and me having given up trying to negotiate peace, our parents would hit a lull in the argument and call us all down. Then, they'd tell us that they were getting a divorce.

 

You know what? We used to beg our parents to divorce. That kind of tension is just awful to live through and parents really don't realize how selfish they are in putting their kids through it. It lasted with me so long that it took me nearly 40 years to get married to trust another human being enough. (Thankfully, my husband is amazing.)

 

But if this is what you and Ruined are doing, then I would beg both of you to see past your own pain and truly look to see what it is doing to your kids. If you can't then both agree to get individual and perhaps family counseling, then consider being apart. My parents separated for one summer. It was the absolute best summer of my life. They are not adults, they didn't ask for this and it is truly formative. They will remember these moments for the rest of their lives. I'm not saying that's what you guys are doing, but if it is then it absolutely needs to stop, one way or the other.

[knabe]

TH,

 

If this is how you truly feel, I think you and Ruined need to separate for awhile. You have kids and this situation is just awful for them. Parents arguing a lot and avoiding each other... the tension in the house becomes so unbearable for children. How do I know? I lived it. It was like walking on eggshells. We weren't supposed to know they were fighting, but believe me, we knew. And then, when things got really bad, they weren't as careful about hiding their arguments.

 

For a kid, it's just awful. A good day can turn bad on a dime. You had a great day at school, you're excited to share your news and bam! You come home and no one is talking to anyone. You do something as a family and someone says the wrong thing, and bam! Mom and Dad don't argue but give off tons of verbal cues that they're going to argue later (Dad starts slamming things around, Mom gets all quiet and withdraws, they both only talk to the kids). And then there's the cake topper - you had a normal, average day for a few days in a row and there's a verbal explosion right in front of you. Someone has been letting stuff build up and they feel so justified in their anger that they just let loose and say awful things if not right in front of us, while we were still in earshot. Oh, and we got to hear them twist each other's words at that time. It got so bad that I used to go down and get in the middle of the fight and try to negotiate peace. After hours of fighting and me having given up trying to negotiate peace, our parents would hit a lull in the argument and call us all down. Then, they'd tell us that they were getting a divorce.

 

You know what? We used to beg our parents to divorce. That kind of tension is just awful to live through and parents really don't realize how selfish they are in putting their kids through it. It lasted with me so long that it took me nearly 40 years to get married to trust another human being enough. (Thankfully, my husband is amazing.)

 

But if this is what you and Ruined are doing, then I would beg both of you to see past your own pain and truly look to see what it is doing to your kids. If you can't then both agree to get individual and perhaps family counseling, then consider being apart. My parents separated for one summer. It was the absolute best summer of my life. They are not adults, they didn't ask for this and it is truly formative. They will remember these moments for the rest of their lives. I'm not saying that's what you guys are doing, but if it is then it absolutely needs to stop, one way or the other.

 

I agree 100% with this. A man who stays "for the kids" and then treats their mother like crap is not noble. Same for a woman.

[Cephalopod]

It takes TIME and understanding and it mostly takes love. This is why i keep asking him about love. If he does not love her anymore...it's over. Why would you attempt to reconcile with someone you no longer love?

 

So i ask again...TH...do you love her? and can you love her more than you hate what she did?

 

Mmmmmm....I agree with you in part. But sometimes you have to put forthe ACTIVE love in order to resurrect the emotyional love don't you?

 

TH is not FEELING love for her right now. Well, that is indeed very understandable. But he acknowledges on a conscious level that there is "a love" of some kind there for her. He's just not "feeling" it, because that feeling is being crowded out of the house by anger and rage.

 

This is a point where I think TH needs to step outside of the emotions and look at the marriage objectively. From an objective standpoint, what positives does his relationship with his WW bring to his life, compared to the negatives? He needs to list the positives and negatives, weigh them against each other...objectively...and then decide if he wants to go forward with R. If he decides to go forward with R, he needs to start exercising active love every day for her, until the "feeling" type love returns. And that may not be for a long, long time.

 

He has to retrain his brain. Learning to love his WW again will require faith followed by works. But he cannot do that until he gets his anger under control.

[usa1ah]

TH,

 

I think you are spending too much time wallowing in your hurt and pain. It has become the new normal. If you want to get better you will need to take active steps to move past your hurt and pain. I am not suggesting you just "get over it", but that you look at what your wife may be doing to try and make it better, give her some credit, and allow yourself to feel good about the new baby. Lastly remember, while you will never forget, you can shape your future. Living in the bad past will not make anyone life better.

 

I wish you luck....

 

 

 

So just get over it already right.

 

Some poeple just can't get past a betrayal like this. It's the way some of us are wired. TH is finding this out I think.

[knabe]

So just get over it already right.

 

Some poeple just can't get past a betrayal like this. It's the way some of us are wired. TH is finding this out I think.

 

Not even close to what was said.

 

TH, if you have the intelligence to rise above all or nothing extremes, it will really help your recovery.

[Texashunter]

Sorry I haven't posted back, took some time away from online.. Today has already started off bad with all the Facebook memories from past anniversaries. The one that hurts the most was our anniversary from 2015. She was emailing and texting him on that day as well as planning her trip to Arizona to be with him. She posted on facebook " 11 yrs ago we started this great adventure. Thanks for putting up with me all this time. I love you." She took time in between emailing and texting him to post that with pictures of us. When I saw it this morning my heart just stopped and sunk. Such a kick to the gut and then anger and sadness just took over. How our anniversary meant nothing as well. So much that she was more interested in talking with him than being with me on that day. I just feel overwhelmed with her ability to do such a thing and now say how important it is.

[Mrs. John Adams]

TH...would it benefit you to stop looking at social media?

 

Things are so raw for you...maybe you should try to avoid things that cause you to trigger.

[Texashunter]

TH...would it benefit you to stop looking at social media?

 

Things are so raw for you...maybe you should try to avoid things that cause you to trigger.

 

That's what I've been trying for the last couple of days. But social media or not these things like today are all triggers. Some days just looking at her or her even touching me triggers me.knowing she could do all of this after only knowing him 2 days is the worst. The questions just keep rolling through my head.

[Mrs. John Adams]

TH...triggers happen forever. They get fewer ...they last shorter periods of time....but you will always have them....whether you reconcile or divorce.

 

Triggers are memories. We cannot control our memories. But we can control our reactions to them.

 

Sometimes...we have to face them head on. Let me give you an example. John took his OW for ice cream. So for me...Ice cream was a trigger. Especially chocolate chip Ice cream. For a long time...I just could not eat ice cream. One day I suggested we go get an ice cream...and I got chocolate chip. After that....it became easier and easier. i faced it ....it occassionally crosses my mind....but I dont get teary eyed. You see what I am saying? Ice cream is not sex...and I am not trying to lessen the severity of what your wife did to you...please dont misunderstand. I am just trying to show you how you can move forward.

 

Today is your anniversary....the first one since your DDAY. It is going to be a difficult day...and you knew that. I tried to tell you...to approach it in a positive way instead of a negative way....but you had already made up your mind how you were going to respond.

 

SO...you looked at facebook...knowing that it would trigger you...and it did.

 

Would you have still felt bad today? yes Would it have been a devastating to you had you not gone to facebook? Maybe

 

But use it to make you stronger...use it in a positive way instead of a negative way. You faced it....now try to let it go.

[Unforseen]

In some ways I wish I could forget most of what I found out. At the same time not knowing was driving me out of my mind. It is a huge struggle and takes a lot of effort to push that knowledge behind you. To not have it intrude on your thoughts every waking moment. That's part of what is needed though. When the memories or mind movies or images or words jump into your head, they need to be put back in their place and pushed out of the spot light. Sing along to a favorite song or put on a self help audio book or think of the silliest thing one of your kids has done or how nice it was to have breakfast waiting for you. Whatever it takes almost to not allow the painful thoughts to have power over you and ruin your day.

 

As far as reason go, you probably have a gap in your head that is just bugging the heck out of you. On one side is the woman you loved and cherished and trusted. On the other side is what she did and put you through when she betrayed your love and trust. I don't know if you'll ever get enough reasons or information to ever bridge that gap. No matter how empathetic you become or how you struggle to see things from her perspective some things will never make sense to you. It's almost something you just have to learn to live with.

 

You can temporarily bridge that gap with the basic reason of "because she wanted to". That's the closest I can get to making sense of what my wife did and how she moved also so quickly to that point. Except it wasn't really that quickly. The reasons and excuses were many years in the making. That's about the only reason why it may help to find out what, in her mind, lead her to make those choices. Since R is what you want eventually any marriage issues will have to be addresssed. Finding out more about what made her want the affair or what she received from the affair will help you better identify and meet her needs in the future. Keep in mind, this advice is for the long game. Getting yourself healed and happier is the immediate concern. And no matter what her reasons, she chose the affair, not you. Her responsibility was to let you know she had needs that weren't being met, not yours to figure it out. If for some reason you weren't getting what she was saying it was still her job to make sure her needs were known by you and not to get them met outside of the marriage.

[Texashunter]

In some ways I wish I could forget most of what I found out. At the same time not knowing was driving me out of my mind. It is a huge struggle and takes a lot of effort to push that knowledge behind you. To not have it intrude on your thoughts every waking moment. That's part of what is needed though. When the memories or mind movies or images or words jump into your head, they need to be put back in their place and pushed out of the spot light. Sing along to a favorite song or put on a self help audio book or think of the silliest thing one of your kids has done or how nice it was to have breakfast waiting for you. Whatever it takes almost to not allow the painful thoughts to have power over you and ruin your day.

 

As far as reason go, you probably have a gap in your head that is just bugging the heck out of you. On one side is the woman you loved and cherished and trusted. On the other side is what she did and put you through when she betrayed your love and trust. I don't know if you'll ever get enough reasons or information to ever bridge that gap. No matter how empathetic you become or how you struggle to see things from her perspective some things will never make sense to you. It's almost something you just have to learn to live with.

 

You can temporarily bridge that gap with the basic reason of "because she wanted to". That's the closest I can get to making sense of what my wife did and how she moved also so quickly to that point. Except it wasn't really that quickly. The reasons and excuses were many years in the making. That's about the only reason why it may help to find out what, in her mind, lead her to make those choices. Since R is what you want eventually any marriage issues will have to be addresssed. Finding out more about what made her want the affair or what she received from the affair will help you better identify and meet her needs in the future. Keep in mind, this advice is for the long game. Getting yourself healed and happier is the immediate concern. And no matter what her reasons, she chose the affair, not you. Her responsibility was to let you know she had needs that weren't being met, not yours to figure it out. If for some reason you weren't getting what she was saying it was still her job to make sure her needs were known by you and not to get them met outside of the marriage.

 

I'm trying but today I feel like I am drowning big time..the question that keeps rolling in my head is how she could do this after only knowing him 2 days!! I mean wth...and then just keep pushing for more..she was even texting and emailing him on our anniversary days...how f up is that..

[Unforseen]

That's what it comes down to TH. If R is what you want keep trying everyday. Let Ruined know you're having a particularly bad day and you need a little more space than usual. I can't answer what flipped in her that made that "ok" in her mind. Hell, I still can't answer how my own W thought it was okay and we've been working on it for a while now. I've come to the conclusion that I will never understand it. Just because I have a handle on why doesn't mean I understand.

 

It's a little better knowing why, but damn it still hurts sometimes. You know what I'm talking about. That pain that reaches deep inside of you and squeezes all the hope out. Makes you wonder if there's any point to continuing to try.

 

You will figure out that answer TH. A little at a time with each passing day. Ruined will help you find those answers. She will help you see how good it can be between you two as you rebuild your marriage. When she does, hold on tight to that and let it start taking the place of all the negative crap from the marriage that has passed.

 

That is my hope for you and Ruined. It is possible if you both work at it and want it. There's no guarantee that you two will be successful but as long as you can keep replacing the bad memories with new, good ones there is still hope and reason to keep trying.

[sour_pikle]

good googly moogly kick her nasty ass to the curb and never look back

[sour_pikle]

Ive been here, I know what its like to look at your woman eating a hot dog and be triggered, I know what its like to be having a great day then the next second you want to puke.

 

 

Its never going to get better. show your boys you will not settle. Show them people don't do things like this and get away with it. When they're older they'll know why. Do it like a bandaid now!!!!!

[Cephalopod]

I'm trying but today I feel like I am drowning big time..the question that keeps rolling in my head is how she could do this after only knowing him 2 days!! I mean wth...and then just keep pushing for more..she was even texting and emailing him on our anniversary days...how f up is that..

 

How? She's a human being. A selfish, self centered human being who screwed over another human being to get something she wanted. It's in our nature to hurt the people we love.

[usa1ah]

How are you doing TH?

[Texashunter]

Just taking some time away from things for a bit..

[Jamess1]

Get a divorce as soon as yesterday. The fact is that your wife doesn't love you and never did. Women don't marry for love, she married you because you loved her, needed her. The guy she cheated with is the 'alpha' type guy she had sex through her teens until she 'hit the wall ' : got to her early or late 30 and was less attractive and lossing omw the bio-clock. Then she picked a 'beta' like you she wouldn't have normally dated in her prime : you are realiable and needy : she knew from begining that you wouldn't leave even if you caught her cheating : thats part of being a 'beta' and why she isn't attracted to you: instead of telling her goodbye after cheating you attempted to kill guy she was cheating you with.

 

Divorce her immediately.

[Texashunter]

Get a divorce as soon as yesterday. The fact is that your wife doesn't love you and never did. Women don't marry for love, she married you because you loved her, needed her. The guy she cheated with is the 'alpha' type guy she had sex through her teens until she 'hit the wall ' : got to her early or late 30 and was less attractive and lossing omw the bio-clock. Then she picked a 'beta' like you she wouldn't have normally dated in her prime : you are realiable and needy : she knew from begining that you wouldn't leave even if you caught her cheating : thats part of being a 'beta' and why she isn't attracted to you: instead of telling her goodbye after cheating you attempted to kill guy she was cheating you with.

 

Divorce her immediately.

 

I have thought some of these things as well. Only thing about your statement that is wrong is I am far from being a beta..it may seem like it right now but that I am certainly now. As for her AP, you give him way to much credit. He is no where close to being an alpha. Even his wife had to laugh at your statement. It got a weak insecure woman to do this with him. That's really all a beta can get in order to feel like they are an alpha. They can't seem to get and hold onto a real woman at all. The AP wife whom I've gotten to become friends with has claim he is an insecure man who has to lie about himself in order to get anything. That he is unable to get/do anything with his real personality. Every aspect about himself that he claimed Ronny wife were all lies and in now way could he even live up to those expectations..he claimed to be a bully bad as special force to which I knew and his wife knew he was not and ever had been..the way he presented himself to my wife was all fake in order to impress..I'm proud to say with my back ground and what I did I've never needed to..I've over the last few months have been pursued harder than when I was younger by women. But I am a real man and stand by my ethics and morals..never confuse a true Alpha and a scavenging beta..one gets what he wants because he is strong..the other has to lie because no one would give it other wise.

[BluesPower]

TH, Honestly, how are things going???

 

How are you doing and how is your wife doing?

 

I know you have been taking some time off.

 

We are all pulling for you...

[Mrs. John Adams]

Get a divorce as soon as yesterday. The fact is that your wife doesn't love you and never did. Women don't marry for love, she married you because you loved her, needed her. The guy she cheated with is the 'alpha' type guy she had sex through her teens until she 'hit the wall ' : got to her early or late 30 and was less attractive and lossing omw the bio-clock. Then she picked a 'beta' like you she wouldn't have normally dated in her prime : you are realiable and needy : she knew from begining that you wouldn't leave even if you caught her cheating : thats part of being a 'beta' and why she isn't attracted to you: instead of telling her goodbye after cheating you attempted to kill guy she was cheating you with.

 

Divorce her immediately.

 

WOW...you know all this by reading this thread? You know she never loved him? You know he is a beta...you know ALL WOMEN dont marry for LOVE....and she planned her WHOLE life to marry a Beta so she could cheat in the future....

 

TH...taking a break is a good thing...hope you are doing well.

[Texashunter]

I am doing better..a little more calm but yet still upset. Have been managing my anger better and having conversations with her with a more even minded attitude..not flying of the handle one would say. Focusing more on me and my needs and also on the soon to come baby. Trying to get her to open up more about the affair and see/be honest with herself about the ways instead of her just st saying she doesn't know/remember or other side using excuses. just wanting her to come to grips for the real reasons and she is starting to see. Don't know if it is any kind of break through but baby steps right. I decided to step away from online media to absorb information and try to get a sense of worth again. It's helped with the rage and depression. Still battle these demons but have gotten a lot of attention from new friends that have helped boost myself worth back up some.

 

Now just getting ready for our youngest to start school in august finally which is rough because I'll be alone most days now. However I am excited for him since he will be with all his brothers at school now.

[understand50]

TH,

 

As many of us have said, time will help, and I am glad that the benefit of it is beginning to take hold. Hope your wife's pregnancy is going well, and that everything is good in that quarter. Things will get better. Just remember, both of you are learning how to get though this, and for all our writing, you two are unique and will have to find your own way.

 

All the best.....

[Overtaxed]

I have thought some of these things as well. Only thing about your statement that is wrong is I am far from being a beta..it may seem like it right now but that I am certainly now. As for her AP, you give him way to much credit. He is no where close to being an alpha. Even his wife had to laugh at your statement. It got a weak insecure woman to do this with him. That's really all a beta can get in order to feel like they are an alpha. They can't seem to get and hold onto a real woman at all. The AP wife whom I've gotten to become friends with has claim he is an insecure man who has to lie about himself in order to get anything. That he is unable to get/do anything with his real personality. Every aspect about himself that he claimed Ronny wife were all lies and in now way could he even live up to those expectations..he claimed to be a bully bad as special force to which I knew and his wife knew he was not and ever had been..the way he presented himself to my wife was all fake in order to impress..I'm proud to say with my back ground and what I did I've never needed to..I've over the last few months have been pursued harder than when I was younger by women. But I am a real man and stand by my ethics and morals..never confuse a true Alpha and a scavenging beta..one gets what he wants because he is strong..the other has to lie because no one would give it other wise.

 

TH,

 

Glad your still posting, I've taken a bit of break as well, but just wanted to catch up on a few posts today and had to respond to this.

 

My W's and your's A's sound so similar to me. Not the situations, just the dynamics in our relationships. No, the AP wasn't some "uber-alpha", he's a player, yes, but like you said, more the "con man" than the God of Alpha that many people here assume the male AP must be. I'm far more in that direction than the AP is, which, IMHO, means to me that very often people cheat to get what they don't have. It wasn't that my W (or your likely) was looking for a strong man, they were looking for someone who had more "beta" than either of us did. I was cold/insensitive and distant, the AP was showering with affection and compliments. Total opposites, but, if you met me and the AP (yes, I knew him personally) and were asked "who's more likely to cheat", no doubt, you would have picked me.

 

It's not "alpha" that women are after, it's what they don't get at home. Married to someone with a lot of alpha traits, cheat with a beta. And vice versa, of course. Alpha traits are rarer, so perhaps that's why the trend is "cheat with an Alpha", because most women are married to men who are; IMHO, far too beta to generate much attraction.

[Mrs. John Adams]

TH,

 

Glad your still posting, I've taken a bit of break as well, but just wanted to catch up on a few posts today and had to respond to this.

 

My W's and your's A's sound so similar to me. Not the situations, just the dynamics in our relationships. No, the AP wasn't some "uber-alpha", he's a player, yes, but like you said, more the "con man" than the God of Alpha that many people here assume the male AP must be. I'm far more in that direction than the AP is, which, IMHO, means to me that very often people cheat to get what they don't have. It wasn't that my W (or your likely) was looking for a strong man, they were looking for someone who had more "beta" than either of us did. I was cold/insensitive and distant, the AP was showering with affection and compliments. Total opposites, but, if you met me and the AP (yes, I knew him personally) and were asked "who's more likely to cheat", no doubt, you would have picked me.

 

It's not "alpha" that women are after, it's what they don't get at home. Married to someone with a lot of alpha traits, cheat with a beta. And vice versa, of course. Alpha traits are rarer, so perhaps that's why the trend is "cheat with an Alpha", because most women are married to men who are; IMHO, far too beta to generate much attraction.

 

i think ALL men posess both alpha and beta traits...and i dont think MOST women think about it.

 

It is a card played here often and quite frankly...I think its hog wash.

 

Overtaxed is right...its the right guy playing the right game at the right time...

 

anyway...TH...Glad things are going better for you...you ARE going to be fine...just hang in there.