Mrs. John Adams Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 Very doubtful I think he meant in HER mind...his hurt and pain is nothing compared to her hurt and pain. Not factually....but in HER mind. I agree with him...he is spot on. She is consumed with her own pain right now which is why she is incapapble of understanding his pain. This is why she is not remorseful. A wayward cannot become remorseful until they can place the pain of their betrayed first and foremost above their own....and it is nearly impossible especially in the beginning. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
mikeylo Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 I guess the WW isn't giving much hope to BD that it can be worked out. Just 'avoiding' the OM isn't going to cut it. He needs to see that she cuts the OM out so that OM just disappears , never to be seen again. BD needs to feel loved unconditionally, he needs to see her commitment, he needs to see her fighting for him and nothing of the sort is happening so BD can't be blamed for feeling what he is feeling. 'Avoiding' the OM is so half hearted effort ! No one is going to buy that. Cutting him off was obviously the first step that she hasn't done. So how is BD going to feel safe in investing in her when she isn't invested? Link to post Share on other sites
Friskyone4u Posted June 10, 2017 Share Posted June 10, 2017 I guess the WW isn't giving much hope to BD that it can be worked out. Just 'avoiding' the OM isn't going to cut it. He needs to see that she cuts the OM out so that OM just disappears , never to be seen again. BD needs to feel loved unconditionally, he needs to see her commitment, he needs to see her fighting for him and nothing of the sort is happening so BD can't be blamed for feeling what he is feeling. 'Avoiding' the OM is so half hearted effort ! No one is going to buy that. Cutting him off was obviously the first step that she hasn't done. So how is BD going to feel safe in investing in her when she isn't invested? Yup, shes been having sex with Om for three or fours years and wants a gold medal for not running into him in the neighborhood. But we know that will inevitable happen just because of the proximity. BD, your wife SHOULD be on her own scheduling a polygraph test for herself or offering to do it every few months given the level and length of her betrayal. instead she would rather spout anger at those who have been through this, some who reconciled and some who divorced. She still thinks she is a special snowflake and her reasons and what she did can all be explained and blamed. Have you thought what on earth she can doing otherwise to make you feel safe. If telling you she is sorry and wants to stay married and is willing to see some therapist floats your boat, and that is all you need, then good luck to you because you will need it 4 Link to post Share on other sites
CautiouslyOptimistic Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 Yup, shes been having sex with Om for three or fours years and wants a gold medal for not running into him in the neighborhood. But we know that will inevitable happen just because of the proximity. BD, your wife SHOULD be on her own scheduling a polygraph test for herself or offering to do it every few months given the level and length of her betrayal. instead she would rather spout anger at those who have been through this, some who reconciled and some who divorced. She still thinks she is a special snowflake and her reasons and what she did can all be explained and blamed. Have you thought what on earth she can doing otherwise to make you feel safe. If telling you she is sorry and wants to stay married and is willing to see some therapist floats your boat, and that is all you need, then good luck to you because you will need it Today I was telling a friend about a neighbor of mine whose marriage is over because of their 3 year affair. My neighbor insists the AP is their "soul mate" and they are "meant to be." (I heard this directly from the horse's mouth) No real remorse at all and still hoping they will live happily ever after (even though there's currently NC because of a restraining order) and is torn apart that it might not be so, because of the fight/restraining order (which precipitated the affair being discovered). The thing is, they (all cheaters) really DO believe that their relationships are "different" than the typical cheater. THEY are soul mates, so it's MORE than just a torrid affair....It's loooooovvvee. But they are ALL the same. They ALL follow the same narrative as if they've studied the script! 6 Link to post Share on other sites
Mrs. John Adams Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 Today I was telling a friend about a neighbor of mine whose marriage is over because of their 3 year affair. My neighbor insists the AP is their "soul mate" and they are "meant to be." (I heard this directly from the horse's mouth) No real remorse at all and still hoping they will live happily ever after (even though there's currently NC because of a restraining order) and is torn apart that it might not be so, because of the fight/restraining order (which precipitated the affair being discovered). The thing is, they (all cheaters) really DO believe that their relationships are "different" than the typical cheater. THEY are soul mates, so it's MORE than just a torrid affair....It's loooooovvvee. But they are ALL the same. They ALL follow the same narrative as if they've studied the script! I cant argue with the validity of your post except to change the ALL to some. ALL is not applicable if only ONE is not as you say. I am ONE...therefore...it is not ALL. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
CautiouslyOptimistic Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 I cant argue with the validity of your post except to change the ALL to some. ALL is not applicable if only ONE is not as you say. I am ONE...therefore...it is not ALL. Fair enough! Most. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
road Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 Today I was telling a friend about a neighbor of mine whose marriage is over because of their 3 year affair. My neighbor insists the AP is their "soul mate" and they are "meant to be." (I heard this directly from the horse's mouth) No real remorse at all and still hoping they will live happily ever after (even though there's currently NC because of a restraining order) and is torn apart that it might not be so, because of the fight/restraining order (which precipitated the affair being discovered). The thing is, they (all cheaters) really DO believe that their relationships are "different" than the typical cheater. THEY are soul mates, so it's MORE than just a torrid affair....It's loooooovvvee. But they are ALL the same. They ALL follow the same narrative as if they've studied the script! OP, no need to edit your post. My opinion. Link to post Share on other sites
understand50 Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 I cant argue with the validity of your post except to change the ALL to some. ALL is not applicable if only ONE is not as you say. I am ONE...therefore...it is not ALL. Abigail, Yours was a ONS, and I think this would apply to a LTA. In a LTA, I think emotions get put front and center. In LTA, the AP does replace the BS in affections, and in the heart. I hold the opinion that a ONS, or short fling, the WS can really state is was just about sex, or a break from the marriage and reality. LTA, this cannot be said with any type of believably, as the length belies that. As far as reconciliation, I think a ONS is "easier" to come back from, but I am sure many would argue the point. In BetrayedDad's case he has the unmistakable fact she was in love with her AP. As here actions not show. Link to post Share on other sites
road Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 Abigail, Yours was a ONS, and I think this would apply to a LTA. In a LTA, I think emotions get put front and center. In LTA, the AP does replace the BS in affections, and in the heart. I hold the opinion that a ONS, or short fling, the WS can really state is was just about sex, or a break from the marriage and reality. LTA, this cannot be said with any type of believably, as the length belies that. As far as reconciliation, I think a ONS is "easier" to come back from, but I am sure many would argue the point. In BetrayedDad's case he has the unmistakable fact she was in love with her AP. As here actions not show. What I have seen over decades of posting. No matter how bad the affair was if the BH wants to stay married and he can verify NC is in place no matter what the WW did it could of always been worse. ONS, they could of have sex 10 times, 100 times, thank god I only have to sell the car because WW did OM in it, they could of did it in my house. They did it in my house, thank god it was not in my bed. They did it in my bed, drag bedroom furniture into backyard and have a barn fire to de-cooty the house. I have seen BH's accept a WW pregnant from the OM and keep the OC to raise. For a BH sex only one time does not make it hurt less. It makes it hard to believe from years of trickle truth from many WW's. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
QuietDan Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 It's funny that you mention ambivalence because that's what I've been thinking. It seems to me that would be a way to explain how she could have the affair "off and on" for 4 years. I think she may have been torn between me (or me and our kids) and her AP...she may have had strong feelings for both of us at the same time. Strong enough towards me (or our lifestyle) to not want a divorce but at the same time she also had strong enough feelings for her AP to keep going back to him again and again. Either way, I believe she may have been conflicted for years between what she had and what she wished she could have. I often thought that is why just a couple months ago, she told me that she resented me...I was one of the major obstacles preventing her from legitimately being with her AP. Years ago, I remember one of the many professional or academic papers I read about affairs was on stable long term affairs. In short, the general take away I ended with is that one of the primary patterns of a stable long term affair is the repeated push/pull or on again / off again pattern, swing, cycle... In general, alot of threads regarding long term affairs seem to be consistent with that sort of pattern..... Something for you to consider. Link to post Share on other sites
Marc878 Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 It's funny that you mention ambivalence because that's what I've been thinking. It seems to me that would be a way to explain how she could have the affair "off and on" for 4 years. I think she may have been torn between me (or me and our kids) and her AP...she may have had strong feelings for both of us at the same time. Strong enough towards me (or our lifestyle) to not want a divorce but at the same time she also had strong enough feelings for her AP to keep going back to him again and again. Either way, I believe she may have been conflicted for years between what she had and what she wished she could have. I often thought that is why just a couple months ago, she told me that she resented me...I was one of the major obstacles preventing her from legitimately being with her AP. IMO it's not important what she wants at this time. What do you want? Link to post Share on other sites
Akheron Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Thank you for your perspective. It was honest and gives me the perspective I needed without feeling my entire character is being maliciously attacked. I read all the other responses too. I was surprised to see a few who were actually arguing with each other on my husbands post. Arguing about my motives when none of you know either of us personally. I doubt that any of you are certified in any type of professional counseling either. It is impossible to detect context in an online discussion with strangers. All I can say at this point is that I'm trying my hardest to understand his pain and support him any way he needs. I love him. I am going to a professional counselor on Tuesday. Mediation consultation is still planned for Monday. Time will tell what the future holds. What strikes me from both of your posts is that you seem upset that people are passing judgment without "knowing you" and "knowing what your motives are". Well, here is your chance. Who are you and what are/were your motives? Here is your chance to air out your grievances. It's one thing to be pissed about having your character judged in an anonymous forum. It's another thing to show bad character through actions without an explanation. The floor is yours if your decide to return. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author BetrayedDad Posted June 14, 2017 Author Share Posted June 14, 2017 After counseling session 1, it turns out I wasn't meeting her needs. What you ask, my needs...those are irrelevant. Besides, my needs must have been met since I never cheated. Go figure. Sorry, I'm feeling a little sarcastic today. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
CautiouslyOptimistic Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 After counseling session 1, it turns out I wasn't meeting her needs. What you ask, my needs...those are irrelevant. Besides, my needs must have been met since I never cheated. Go figure. Sorry, I'm feeling a little sarcastic today. Clearly you were in marital bliss since you didn't cheat. How was the mediation meeting? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author BetrayedDad Posted June 14, 2017 Author Share Posted June 14, 2017 Clearly you were in marital bliss since you didn't cheat. How was the mediation meeting? Mediation was just a consultation, but it went well. It was the first time my wife met with an attorney to discuss anything regarding a divorce. We were both mature and civil. Afterward, we drove around and looked at houses that she might consider moving to. We agreed to hold off on making the final decision on mediation until our kids finish out the school year (which is the end of next week) and she has been to IC. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
BluesPower Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 BetrayedDad... So you just had you first MC session with a typical MCer the does not know his/her A$$ from a whole in the ground. Almost all of them let the WW talk about how her emotional needs were not being met or their sexual needs were not being met. The first time it did the MC tried to same thing with me. I look at her and said, "You are a moron, this is not about me, it is about this cheating C**T sitting here and why I should ever take her back". I stood up, walked out the door, leaving them both with their mouths open. So you know that this MC has absolutely no experience dealing with infidelity at all. Find a new one and interview them first. What matters is YOUR feeling and if YOU want the marriage to continue. There is never a reason to cheat. There may be a reason to divorce. OK, but never cheat. This is, was, and forever will be on your wife and no one else. She made the choice not you... Based on what is going on, frankly I don't ever know why you are trying... 7 Link to post Share on other sites
reboot Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 After counseling session 1, it turns out I wasn't meeting her needs. What you ask, my needs...those are irrelevant. Besides, my needs must have been met since I never cheated. Go figure. Sorry, I'm feeling a little sarcastic today. All counselors are not created equally, sounds like you need a new one. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Furious Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 After counseling session 1, it turns out I wasn't meeting her needs. What you ask, my needs...those are irrelevant. Besides, my needs must have been met since I never cheated. Go figure. Sorry, I'm feeling a little sarcastic today. Of course you weren't meeting her needs, your wife needed two men to satisfy her needs. One to be daddy and the breadwinner and a boyfriend on the side while she was a stay at home mother. Ironically your wife admitted that she wasn't her OM's first affair, seems her needs have nothing to do with reality. Don't take it personally, her needs are screwed up and nothing she says will make sense. Her posts here were all about how hurtful the posters have been to her feelings. I bet she took it out on you that you should have been defending her here. Link to post Share on other sites
Author BetrayedDad Posted June 14, 2017 Author Share Posted June 14, 2017 Just to clarify, it was her IC. I have not agreed to MC. I honestly don't want MC until I feel there is something left worth saving. Right now, she says she loves me, but I can't bring myself to believe her. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Furious Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Just to clarify, it was her IC. I have not agreed to MC. I honestly don't want MC until I feel there is something left worth saving. Right now, she says she loves me, but I can't bring myself to believe her. Love is only a four letter word if it doesn't come from respect. She brought that man into your home, but says they didn't do it in your bed. Humiliating you and your children in your own home but she says she loves you. But in her first IC she talks about how you didn't meet her needs. Wake up BD, you're worth more than this. She's done a number on your self esteem. Link to post Share on other sites
QuietDan Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 After counseling session 1, it turns out I wasn't meeting her needs. What you ask, my needs...those are irrelevant. Besides, my needs must have been met since I never cheated. Go figure. Sorry, I'm feeling a little sarcastic today. I was wondering, did your wife ever inform you which one of her needs you weren't meeting and that she was planning on outsourcing to another vendor to get those tasks/action items taken care of before she decided to cheat? If not, were you advised that you needed to work on your mind reading and intuitive understanding empathic skills? 4 Link to post Share on other sites
reboot Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Just to clarify, it was her IC. I have not agreed to MC. I honestly don't want MC until I feel there is something left worth saving. Right now, she says she loves me, but I can't bring myself to believe her. Her IC is going to tell her whatever she wants to hear so she'll keep paying her. *shrug* 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author BetrayedDad Posted June 14, 2017 Author Share Posted June 14, 2017 BetrayedDad... So you just had you first MC session with a typical MCer the does not know his/her A$$ from a whole in the ground. Almost all of them let the WW talk about how her emotional needs were not being met or their sexual needs were not being met. The first time it did the MC tried to same thing with me. I look at her and said, "You are a moron, this is not about me, it is about this cheating C**T sitting here and why I should ever take her back". I stood up, walked out the door, leaving them both with their mouths open. So you know that this MC has absolutely no experience dealing with infidelity at all. Find a new one and interview them first. What matters is YOUR feeling and if YOU want the marriage to continue. There is never a reason to cheat. There may be a reason to divorce. OK, but never cheat. This is, was, and forever will be on your wife and no one else. She made the choice not you... Based on what is going on, frankly I don't ever know why you are trying... Because as crazy as it sounds, I still love her. I guess I'm just hoping for some miracle to happen that will make me believe she feels the same about me. I know in my head it won't happen, but in my heart, I keep hoping. When I think with my head instead of my heart, I know that even though I didn't cheat, her initial response on D-Day was that she was not happy and wanted a divorce. Then she continued to trickle truth me over and over. Two weeks after D-Day she took off her wedding ring because she thought I gave up. Yesterday, she texted me 9 times but couldn't find the time to send me even one just to say "I love you". Her true feelings seem so obvious on paper. Link to post Share on other sites
reboot Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Right now, she says she loves me, but I can't bring myself to believe her. We all read her posts. It was pretty obvious who her first priority is, and it isn't you. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Furious Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 How did "not meeting her needs" justify humiliating you in your own home. BD open your eyes, the only thing you have to save is your sanity. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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