Young, lost and probably very foolish - is this over?

[Imajerk17]

I have been harsh on you before OP, I hope this is constructive. I am not going to get into how what you are doing is awful to your husband, because that has been covered already.

 

I do think the feelings on his end are real--to a point (see below). HOWEVER, besides how your affair is hurting others (and yes that is indeed quite a big "besides") you need to look at what really is going on here. He keeps piling on and on about how you are so far way out of his league (and frankly, in your narrative, so do you). How nervous and excited he was to see you and all that. It seems to be quite a crucial part of your dynamic, actually. Maybe this is part of the pull? Maybe being with him makes you feel powerful for being able to get him to respond this way, and at the same time, noble too--e.g., you can look past things such as lots of problems, lack of money/education/social status.

 

Anyway, what I was saying about how his feelings were real "to a point". Now, I don't know if your OM has done this sort of thing before, I will allow that maybe he has not and you were his first. BUT, most of us fall in love with someone who matches and complements us. It is very very hard for our gender to fall in love with someone who is so far out of our league and who can come in and fix a lot of our problems and rescue us. We like to be the ones who can "save the day" so to speak. I mean, the attention is amazingly flattering and we will bask in it--including the sex--but as far as long-term, something will just feel off to us.

 

And in the long run, YOU will want to be with someone who can "save the day". Not necessarily financially but at least emotionally, someone who can hold his own with other people. Instead it sounds like you picked the male with the most struggles that you could possibly find, someone who needs the most rescuing.

 

Meanwhile, it really seems like you and your husband are not on the same page, and haven't been for quite some time. I mean, if you are already this off on the sex... Do you even agree about things such as having kids? Seems like things between the two of you were never great. But actually a lot worse now though--I don't see how you and he can get closer, with this huge huge secret between the two of you. I mean, you are emotionally crushed and he hardly even knows it or doesn't even know why, or maybe he DOES suspect something...

 

Something for you to think about. I hope this helps.

Edited August 22, 2017 by Imajerk17

[jenkins95]

Hey (((lost)))

 

How are you doing today? Just want you to know that we are thinking of you.

 

Just one question for you for this post! Here are some quotes from you recently.

 

1. About your husband: -

 

He is so kind, romantic, caring, fun and thoughtful

 

2. About MM: -

 

Honestly, this man is the most troubled man I have ever encountered. I naively thought that by loving and accepting him, I could help him. But this man needs a LOT of help from a professional, which he will never seek because he views that kind of thing as 'weak'. This is man who nearly ran over a man in his coach for giving him a parking ticket and is still waiting to hear whether he's going to lose his job over it (the job he loved). This is a man who drink drives regularly (again, stupid considering his job as a coach driver and how quickly he would lose this), drinks too much in general, has a terrible temper, thinks EVERYONE is out to hurt him, is tight with his money and is rude. This is a man who said if someone does ONE thing wrong, he will never forgive them. This is a man who said he NEVER lets someone tell him what to do and that he will just do what he wants, even if that hurts someone else. He also said he would never make me a hot drink in the morning because I could do it myself and that I would start to expect it if he started doing that.

 

Now, from what you say, Belgian man is an amazing lover and your husband, on the other hand, does not prioritise sex. But apart from sex, would you say that, in every other department, your H is a better man and a better match for you?

 

Or, perhaps you are drawn to dangerous, "bad" men? Do you crave the excitement, risk and unpredictability. Is your H just too safe and predictable to excite you? I know that some women are drawn to bad men, even though they know they are probably going to get burned somewhere down the line. Is this you?

 

One thing I would say about the sex, is that affair sex is incredible - and it is easy to be crazy, urgent and exciting when you are in bed with your secret, ellicit, exotic, exciting lover, with whom you only have brief, stolen moments and every episode of sex could be the last. It is unfair and unrealistic to compare it directly with sex in a marriage, which needs to be maintained and nurtured for decades and works on a completely different plane to affair sex.

 

If you take me for example, in my marriage, we have sex about once or twice a week, generally pretty vanilla - but it's great and keeps us happy. This was true before and after the A. Now, I don't consider myself a particularly amazing lover and am a lot less experienced than a lot of my friends, but during the A......I turned into Ron Jeremy! (OK, a better looking version ). I honestly didn't think that level of performance was possible, at least not from me....but it was just automatic in the A. It happened without effort, and this is typical of As. It is one of the things that make them so intoxicating and addictive and seem so magical.

 

But of course, it wouldn't have lasted like that forever with my OW. It couldn't have! In fact, somewhere deep in my ego, I was dreading the day that she would "have a headache" or I "couldn't perform". It inevitably would have happened, and on a purely selfish level, I'm quite proud that the A ended before we reached that point! The problem now of course, is not seeing that as absolute sexual perfection - and comparing it to more "realistic" marriage sex. But I have got past that now. I see the A for the fantasy it was (although as with you, the feelings were genuine) and I love the sexual relationship I have in my marriage. It is gentle and loving, sweet and exciting, and I don't feel pressure to perform like a porn star!

 

Just trying to put things in perspective a bit! And having said this, I still acknowledge that you really need to work on the sex side of things with H. He sounds like a great guy and he should listen and work with you. Things will never be like affair sex, and neither should they be. But you can still have, and deserve, a great sex life and so does H!

 

Will be back to post more soon lost!

 

Take care of yourself

 

x

Edited August 22, 2017 by jenkins95

[jenkins95]

Hey (((lost)))

 

Are you still visiting LS?

 

I hope you haven't been scared away. Please come back. You deserve to have support on both the battles you are fighting - getting over MM and re-investing on your marriage, and I get it, right now your thoughts are more consumed by the former of these two battles as it is so raw.

 

Come and post whatever you want to. That's what we're here for. Take the support and advice that helps and try not to be out off by posts that may sting a little bit.

 

Thinking of you and pulling for you. I hope you come back to post. x

[lostintheuk]

Hello,

 

Yes, I'm still reading. I just was afraid to post again for a while because I received some replies which I felt pulled me down even more.

 

I am fine. Getting on with the daily grind. Feeling very 'dulled' by the whole experience. Some days I wake up and wonder if the whole thing was a dream.

 

I'majerk, thank you for not being too harsh again. I found your reply interesting. I'm positive this is the first time Belgian man has done this. Yes, I agree in terms of looks and education there was a mis-match. In terms of finance, he actually earned more than I did, although that's because my career is still building and I'm self-employed. He was quite adamant that he wanted someone independent, a 'go-getter', passionate about their career. That was me. But I also wanted to be 'looked after' a bit. I'm traditional like that. He said he was walking through his life alone, and that if someone wanted to join him and walk next to him, that was great. I wanted him to 'save me' a bit more. There were plenty of elements where he did complement me: he was much more practical, with more common sense. He could fix things, he was more cautious (whereas I'm very adventurous and spontaneous), he was much more grounded and he has a thick skin (I'm very sensitive). He was very very affectionate and loving in the bedroom. But he wasn't that great at being comforting (especially in comparison with my H). He was brought up mainly by his alcoholic dad, and was the eldest of three brothers and I don't think he had a clue about women.

 

To be honest, I had no clue he was so troubled, otherwise I would have run a mile. It wasn't a case of feelings building up over time and me slowly falling in love with his personality. We were just drawn together physically, very immediately. It was a very powerful attraction. Within hours of meeting we were kissing each other, and within 24 hours we were having a romantic dinner together and jumping into bed with each other. That has not happened to me before (I usually wait as long as possible before things get physical). I only started finding out about him after the intense feelings had begun to develop. He gave the appearance of being very 'together' when I initially met him on the boat. And of course I had no idea about his domestic set-up at that point.

 

I alternate from feeling angry at him, to feeling indifferent, to missing him so much. Sometimes I regret ending it, telling him it was over and we couldn't speak again, but then I think - what was the alternative? I'm not going to spend my life waiting for something that isn't going to happen. I'm not going to continue to feel guilty and stressed for a man who is always moving the goal posts.

 

Things are a little better with my husband. We are getting on better and spending time together. We laugh a lot together, although we always have. He looks after me and he is very selfless. The sex thing is very slightly improving. The problem is not a recent one. Unfortunately it was there at the very beginning. I married him because of his wonderful other qualities, but I am a very passionate and sensual person and he has never been. I think I just need to accept this, but it's hard, especially when I notice other men giving me attention and I wonder why my husband isn't more interested in sex. But he has many other excellent qualities. I need to focus on all he does for me, and his kindness.

 

I suppose I also haven't posted here because in my mind I still want an impossible situation. I want Belgian man to call up declaring his love again, and tell me he's left his girlfriend. I want to know he's thinking of me. But why? He's ruined it anyway. Even if we resumed the A, it would be so full of sadness now. What once felt pure (although obviously from an outsider's point it was never pure), now feels horrible. He's hurt me too much. I feel like I'm grieving the loss of the feelings as well as him.

 

Thank you for your continued support x

[stillafool]

Things are a little better with my husband. We are getting on better and spending time together. We laugh a lot together, although we always have. He looks after me and he is very selfless. The sex thing is very slightly improving. The problem is not a recent one. Unfortunately it was there at the very beginning. I married him because of his wonderful other qualities, but I am a very passionate and sensual person and he has never been. I think I just need to accept this, but it's hard, especially when I notice other men giving me attention and I wonder why my husband isn't more interested in sex. But he has many other excellent qualities. I need to focus on all he does for me, and his kindness.

 

Unfortunately this is happening with a lot of married couples. People married other people who they felt would make good marriage partners by their actions and as well as how they compared on paper. Most married couples are still happy with those qualities about their spouses but in bed it is another story. A lot thought the sex would get better over time; that they could somehow grow sexually passionate about each other but it never happens. These people simply were never sexually compatible to begin with. It makes sense that if you aren't sexually fulfilled by your husband he isn't really sexually fulfilled by you either which could be why he isn't keen to have sex with you. I'm sure he thinks you are beautiful and pleasing in other ways but perhaps like you feel about him; not that exciting in bed. Some people might suggest counseling for couples sexual problems but I personally think it's a waste of money. It's either there or it isn't. I would suggest to people who are seeking a marriage partner to definitely chose someone who has good core values but it's also very important to be sexually compatible.

[lostintheuk]

I agree that it is more important that I realised. Unfortunately the people I've had the most sexual chemistry with have been bad boys, who are not marriage material (Belgian man too).

 

In the case of my husband though, he has admitted to having a problem in this respect. He has been to the doctors about it. He has problems in his head relating to sex, and all his previous girlfriends have eventually turned into 'friends'. He once said it was because his mum had had an affair when he was 13 and that this had made him feel strange about sex (he knew her secret and had to keep it secret from his dad). He said that it changed his views. I know he needs help, but can someone really change how they feel about sex? The strange thing is, when we get into bed, his body is always physically 'ready' for sex, but he doesn't act on the feelings.

[lostintheuk]

And this is part of the reason I'm struggling to fully let Belgian man go - it felt as though our bodies were designed for each other. It was the perfect match in this respect. Like I mentioned before, from a biological point of view, I'm sure our genes would be strong together - that's surely why we were pulled together immediately, before we even knew anything about each other.

 

When you contrast that, with my husband (who I love but don't have that same attraction to), it is very painful.

 

Belgian man said the same about his gf. The sex has always been 'ok' but he loved her at the beginning and concentrated on her other qualities. Just like I did with my husband.

[elaine567]

I agree that it is more important that I realised. Unfortunately the people I've had the most sexual chemistry with have been bad boys, who are not marriage material (Belgian man too).

 

I guess that is because "bad boys" are often "on the edge" sexually, they want it so bad that they make you feel that if they do not have you right then, right now, they will die.

YOUR Belgian man was literally trembling with desire for you, almost out of control, and that is what is SOOO hot to many woman, that is what gets her aroused and that is what makes her want to have sex with him.

 

YOUR husband is physically ready but has a road block, he cannot let go, he is controlled, he is not "on the edge", he is just going through the motions and that makes you feel undesired and probably unaroused, so it all feels boring and a bit of a chore.

[jenkins95]

I'm really encouraged by these updates - thanks for coming back (((lost))).

 

You will pine for Belgian man for a while, lost. It's very early days. He will eventually work his way out of your constant thoughts. Don't let it bother you that you are still focussed on him for a while, it's natural. Let yourself grieve for the R. It will take a few months for you to start feeling your old self.

 

Great to see you talking about H. It does sound like there is a significant psychological element, which hopefully you will be able to work on together.

 

What I would say is that, as time goes on, sex becomes less important anyway. It's still important, but it is not necessarily number one priority. My wife and I have sex once or twice a week and it's great. Does the earth always move? No? Do we break the bed in our urgency? No. Do we come back for "seconds" on any particular evening? Almost never. We have so many other things we enjoy doing together - playing with kids, going for walks/holidays, watching a good film, cuddling, talking, reading to each other, etc. Sex is just another one to add to the list. But I do agree - it's very important and needs to be worked on.

 

But this works for us and we feel sexually satisfied. My A was off the scale sexually, but I know it was an unreal, fantasy situation and not sustainable in long term.

 

I'm not saying that you have to "settle" for a poor sex life, but just to put it into perspective as I think you are doing. I also see that you are younger than me and not had children yet and are in the stage of your life where you want to maximise yor sex life. I totally get that.

 

Well done lost, proud of the progress you are making.

 

It is very early days. Show patience and you will be OK.

Edited August 25, 2017 by jenkins95

[Bittersweetie]

 

In the case of my husband though, he has admitted to having a problem in this respect. He has been to the doctors about it. He has problems in his head relating to sex, and all his previous girlfriends have eventually turned into 'friends'. He once said it was because his mum had had an affair when he was 13 and that this had made him feel strange about sex (he knew her secret and had to keep it secret from his dad). He said that it changed his views. I know he needs help, but can someone really change how they feel about sex? The strange thing is, when we get into bed, his body is always physically 'ready' for sex, but he doesn't act on the feelings.

 

Have you thought about that you having an affair on your husband, considering the above, may be affecting his sexual desire and feelings for you as well? Even if he doesn't know he may sense because he's had experience sensing affairs. He may sense what is going on.

 

As for changing how one feels about sex: yes it can change. I am proof. My first time was traumatic to me for various reasons (it was not forced in any way). For a long, long time I carried feelings and expectations and baggage in relation to sex that did affect my sexual relationship with my husband. After d-day one of the things my H asked me was to address the sex issue once and for all.

 

I went to a counselor specializing in sexual issues. She put me in a group with other women having issues with sex. It was really good to talk with others having problems and figuring out ways to reframe things and move forward. It may sound silly, but the counselor who ran the group gave out "assignments" which actually really helped too. A man probably wouldn't be interested in group therapy but one-on-one is an option that can be looked into.

 

Good luck.

[lostintheuk]

Hello everyone,

 

I just thought I'd write a little update. Well, believe it or not I'm feeling a lot better already.

 

I still think of Belgian man, but I'm starting to realise I will come out of this stronger in the end. I feel really free, I have no mortgage, no children and my husband is open to moving overseas together for a bit. My career is on the up and I'm young and have a supportive and loving family.

 

Belgian man is trapped in his situation, trapped in his troubled mind which tortures him. He has so many responsibilities at such a young age, and he has no support structure because he's cut off so many people. He views everyone as a threat, thinks they are going to hurt him in some way. He is an angry drunk who is going to lose one of the only things he cared about - his job.

 

Ok, so it's not very nice to compare because if I truly loved him I would wish him the best. And sometimes I do feel worried for him and wish I could help him, but my love has turned to anger and dislike. And this emotion is more productive than pining and weeping. So I'm going to embrace it for now. I'm working hard on my Masters degree and I'm imagining the mortarboard on my head - don't they say success is the best revenge?

 

Hopefully when I'm completely over this, I will be able to wish him well in my head. I'm not quite at that point yet but I'm getting there.

[lostintheuk]

I should add, that I am not counting the days of NC, but it's well over 3 weeks now.

 

Maybe I should also say that things with my husband remain roughly the same, maybe slightly better because I'm in a better mood and am making more of an effort to do kind things for him.

[jenkins95]

I'm so delighted to see you displaying this kind of clarity and recovery already (((lost))). If you'd posted this after three months then I would have considered this good progress and "par for the course", but the fact that you are posting like this after three weeks is fantasic and bodes really well!

 

As for this:

 

"Maybe I should also say that things with my husband remain roughly the same, maybe slightly better because I'm in a better mood and am making more of an effort to do kind things for him."

 

I totally get it! It's all about our mindset as the former cheater. We can close our mind to our spouse and nothing they can do or say will be able to get through to us. We use it to justify our affairs and convince ourselves there's no way that they can make us happy like the AP did. I was the same with my wife. But once I opened my mind to the possibiolity that put marriage could be great again...well, it did become great again! It's all psychology! You loved him once, you can again!

 

Good luck ((not so lost))