Is my wife hiding something?

[suspiciousH]

I'm new to LS so here's some background. Married 23 years. 4 kids. I haven't cheated and I have no hard proof that she has cheated.

 

Three years ago I accidentally stumbled onto a FB chat transcript between my wife and a guy from her high school. It troubled me. Although there was no sexting, the guy (who lives on the other side of the country) was making a full court press on her, and she was going along with it. I confronted her (bad idea with so little evidence -- now I know) and she said he was just a friend and so on and so forth. But at the beginning of our marriage we both agreed to clear cut boundaries RE opposite sex friendships and this text thread was out of bounds. I asked her if she was attracted to him and she basically said she was (by staying silent). I asked her to block him and she did. Then I was somehow able to forget all about it.

 

Fast forward to last August. Out of nowhere I start having these completely out-of-character worries that she's cheating on me. No proof. But I did notice that she had been acting flirtier and I spoke to her about it and she said she didn't do it on purpose and that she "doesn't know about any of the signs of flirting". I sent her a Youtube video to ensure she clearly understands the signals that women send to express interest.

 

I couldn't shake the feelings so finally in January I put in place a GPS and a VAR and tracked her for a month. But nothing unusual came up. The worries subsided for a while but they have been back for the last month.

 

Anyway, today I decided to look at her historical phone usage for the first time ever and discovered that her text frequency from mid-June to mid-September was 5x normal. But I can't get access to the actual numbers texted that far back without returning a notarized form to the phone provider.

 

Not sure what to do at this point. Do I just need to force myself back to the present every time the worries arise (e.g., ignore these thoughts) or do something else?

[Overtaxed]

Get her phone, dump the TXT messages. You'll get your answer quickly. If she's not doing anything wrong, apologize and tell her why you felt that way. If she is.. Well, welcome to the infidelity forum, let me be the first to say "Hello".

Edited June 27, 2017 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Redact full quote of starting post

[Marc878]

 

Three years ago I accidentally stumbled onto a FB chat transcript between my wife and a guy from her high school. It troubled me. Although there was no sexting, the guy (who lives on the other side of the country) was making a full court press on her, and she was going along with it. I confronted her (bad idea with so little evidence -- now I know) and she said he was just a friend and so on and so forth. But at the beginning of our marriage we both agreed to clear cut boundaries RE opposite sex friendships and this text thread was out of bounds. I asked her if she was attracted to him and she basically said she was (by staying silent). I asked her to block him and she did. Then I was somehow able to forget all about it.

 

Facebook has destroyed a lot of marriages. "We're just friends" is the biggest lie told.

 

 

 

Anyway, today I decided to look at her historical phone usage for the first time ever and discovered that her text frequency from mid-June to mid-September was 5x normal. But I can't get access to the actual numbers texted that far back without returning a notarized form to the phone provider.

 

If you have gut feeling the phone bill is always the first place to look. Get the numbers!!! Or regret it. It's not that much effort.

 

------------------

 

You need to pull the deleted text messages form her phone. Ex: Fonelab, etc data recovery ststems are available

 

You made the mistake of confronting to soon. Keep your mouth shut, eyes and ears open.

 

If there is something make sure you inform the other guys wife. Don't make the mistake of trying to help hide it.

 

If it's nothing you will at least have some peace of mind. There are some red flags here

Edited June 27, 2017 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Fix quote

[GoldenR]

They should be online. If you're not getting detailed billing, sign up for it immediately.

[Zona]

I'm new to LS so here's some background. Married 23 years. 4 kids. I haven't cheated and I have no hard proof that she has cheated.

 

Yeah, I had a similar experience recently. My wife contacted some a-hole on facebook that had hit on her years ago when they worked together, and shockingly, he was hitting on her again.

 

You should be able to create an account with your phone carrier and then see the phone numbers she was texting. If there are any you don't recognize, put the number into a facebook search. Most of the time it will show who that number belongs to.

 

I checked everything out a millions times. I parsed and re-parsed every damn word she said in response to the guy. Ultimately I could never come up with anything concrete, so I've moved on. I have the advantage of being extremely tech savvy, so unless she is a super genius, she never would have been able to hide it from me.

 

The other thing to look for is the red flags. You can google this and get all kinds of lists of them.

 

Female sexuality is one of the most primal instinctual behaviors out there, and women tend to all act exactly the same when if they are cheating. Even if if your wife isn't cheating, you can educate yourself by reading some threads here, and you will see what I mean.

 

Good luck, and hopefully you dodge a bullet like I did.

[Dc76017]

Sorry to hear about this and I totally understand what your going through. Memorial Day I busted my wife in a very similar position. She was caught talking to an old boyfriend from 30 years ago through Facebook messager plus a few phones calls. From what I could tell there was no sexting either but a lot of emotional talk that I believe is how she feels today, but she claims it was how she felt back then. 3 weeks later we are fair at best, she claims she wants to work it out and she has cut all ties with this guy, but I can't really be sure. I hope your situation gets worked out. Mine I am still unsure on.

[Zona]

The thing that finally set my mind at ease was a response she gave to him, asking him how he would feel if he was married and someone was trying to have sex with his wife. She went on to say that he needs to reevaluate himself as to his morals, as he is lacking in the regard. He went cold after that. (Thank God). I missed this message the first time looking at the conversation.

 

You just never know where this is going to take you, but follow it through, otherwise it will drive you nuts.

[Mrs. John Adams]

Yeah, I had a similar experience recently. My wife contacted some a-hole on facebook that had hit on her years ago when they worked together, and shockingly, he was hitting on her again.

 

You should be able to create an account with your phone carrier and then see the phone numbers she was texting. If there are any you don't recognize, put the number into a facebook search. Most of the time it will show who that number belongs to.

 

I checked everything out a millions times. I parsed and re-parsed every damn word she said in response to the guy. Ultimately I could never come up with anything concrete, so I've moved on. I have the advantage of being extremely tech savvy, so unless she is a super genius, she never would have been able to hide it from me.

 

The other thing to look for is the red flags. You can google this and get all kinds of lists of them.

 

Female sexuality is one of the most primal instinctual behaviors out there, and women tend to all act exactly the same when if they are cheating. Even if if your wife isn't cheating, you can educate yourself by reading some threads here, and you will see what I mean.

 

Good luck, and hopefully you dodge a bullet like I did.

 

Zona... I am calling bull on this one. Waywards are not all alike... and neither are betrayeds. Obviously we are not all alike sexually or there would not be many different kinds of sex

 

We are all different and each infidelity is different. There may be similarities but each is its own unique thing because we react differently and respond differently and process differently

 

I can have great empathy for a wayward but I can never know exactly how she feels because I am not her

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

Who is your cell phone provider? You really should be able to see all of the phone numbers online.

[Zona]

Zona... I am calling bull on this one.

 

We are all different and each infidelity is different.

 

I covered myself by using the word "tend"

 

Yes, there are variations, but the trickle truthing, gaslighting, etc., are all extremely common. No offense intended to those who broke the mold.

[WilyWill]

Go ahead and return the notarized form to the phone provider. Is there something else holding you up? Does the form also need her signature or something?

 

In the meantime, try to get access to her phone while she's asleep. See if you can use software to extract the text messages (it should be able to extract some of the deleted ones too).

 

As you've learned already, don't confront again until you understand the full extent of the relationship.

 

Consider installing a high-resolution hidden spy cam in the area where she uses her phone the most. You might be able to see her typing her PIN code, if she has one. You might even be able to read the messages in the video.

[suspiciousH]

Many thanks for the feedback, everyone. Below is some additional detail RE the questions you posed.

 

- Her mobile carrier is Sprint. I can get phone and text numbers back 90 days and phone calls for years. After 90 days Sprint removes the texted numbers and shows you only detailed usage by phone number. I have searched Sprint to find out how to get text numbers going back further and that's when I found the notarization policy. Sprint's policy states they don't keep the actual content of text message for privacy purposes.

 

- I haven't finished analyzing the phone calls but am looking for calls when I'm at work or asleep. (I'm up early for work so I go to bed comparatively early; she routinely stays up until after midnight.) I have also gained access to a decent public records database that tells me the owner name for just about every phone out there except for burner phones. (I've already found a likely burner phone in the phone records but with only a small number of short inbound and outbound calls at odd hours.) Speaking of burners, back in October I was telling her about a burner phone that some crazy guy was using to make threats against somebody in my company and she replied, "Oh, anyone can buy burners at Wal-mart." I have to admit that I didn't even know where one could even buy a burner at that point and I was surprised that she knew.

 

- I am fortunate to have access to a very high-end broadband receiver with directional capability that will track all types of wireless signals (including burners) within a 150 ft radius -- it'll track the existence of a wireless signal over a 24-hour period but the tool won't identify phone numbers or text content. I plan to put it to use next week or the week after to see if I can find a burner lying around.

 

- Many thanks for the tip about FoneLab -- hadn't heard of that tool. I researched other devices that purported to recover old texts but the related reviews weren't good. As an aside, she told me twice since August that she deleted texts "to save space." The first time I told her that doing so was silly because deleting one photo would leave storage for 100x the aggregate size of every text she has ever sent/received in her life. She was silent. I repeated the comment the second time she told me she deleted texts to save space.

 

- I have access to her device (she doesn't hide it) and she has access to mine, too. Haven't found anything on it. That's what makes me think either (a) nothing is (still?) going on or (b) she has gone underground (burner) because I was such an idiot for tipping her off RE my worries.

 

- RE notarizing the form. I am not the account owner, she is. So were I to sign it myself I would have to forge her signature and that would be a felony even if I found a notary willing to stamp and sign the form. So I can't do that.

 

Beside the further research I've outlined above, should I be restarting the GPS, VAR? Side question: Is it unusual to find no GPS/VAR activity over the better part of a month?

 

Anything else I should be doing at this stage?

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

Just playing devil's advocate, I've never bought a burner phone but I know where I could get them because I'm obsessed with following true crime stories and web forums.

 

Also, she really may believe deleting texts frees up space. My mom thought that all of her texts telling her she was over her data usage for the month meant she had to delete photos to free up space. She was in for a shock when her bill was $200 more than normal that month. How tech savvy is your wife? Does she know the difference between data and WiFi, for example? I'm pretty sure my mom has no clue. Now, I'm not comparing your wife to my elderly mom, but just trying to point out not everyone has a grasp on the technicalities of cell phones, etc.

 

Thanks for clarifying about Sprint. That's a bummer.

 

I think for now, if she is cheating, finding a burner phone would be your best bet. I guess you'd have to figure out where she hides it if she has one. I'd look in hampers, tampon boxes, suitcases, shoe boxes, bottom of wastebaskets.....??

 

At this point, I'm really on the fence here because some of this stuff can be explained away.

[Marc878]

Most of the time what you need is in the deleted text messages.

 

However, a voice activated recorder in her car might yield something if it's there.

[suspiciousH]

Thanks, Cautiously. I appreciate your playing devil's advocate. Frankly, nothing would make me happier than to discover that I'm simply oversensitive.

 

My wife is pretty tech savvy. She consults in e-Marketing 15 hours a week or so. But I would hope that the broadband receiver would answer the question of a burner phone.

 

Another tech question: I see Skype on but logged-out from time to time when I check the PC in the morning. I don't use Skype. Is there a way to find out which accounts are used to login to Skype short of using a keylogger?

[drifter777]

I'm thinking that if she's cheating she's doing an exceptional job of covering her tracks. Or maybe you are verifying that she's not cheating?

 

You are not going to have peace of mind until you can convince yourself one way or another. The thing is, you can't prove a negative so you've set kind of a trap for yourself. I advise that you go all-out snoop until you're satisfied that you aren't going to find anything at this time. Phone, email accounts, PC history, VAR, maybe even hire a PI to investigate for a couple weeks. If this doesn't turn up any evidence I think you should let go of your paranoia.

[suspiciousH]

I'm thinking that if she's cheating she's doing an exceptional job of covering her tracks. Or maybe you are verifying that she's not cheating?

 

You are not going to have peace of mind until you can convince yourself one way or another. The thing is, you can't prove a negative so you've set kind of a trap for yourself. I advise that you go all-out snoop until you're satisfied that you aren't going to find anything at this time. Phone, email accounts, PC history, VAR, maybe even hire a PI to investigate for a couple weeks. If this doesn't turn up any evidence I think you should let go of your paranoia.

 

Fair enough, Drifter. I'm trying to find out if there's an EA or PA going on (or one that was going on last summer, though I realize that could be next to impossible to prove without recovering texts from that period).

 

I'm going to restart the VAR and GPS efforts, run the broadband receiver, find a way to retrieve the deleted texts, and look into a keylogger. Recommendations on reliable keyloggers that can still work with wireless keyboards?

 

And this time I'll continue the investigation for longer than just the few weeks I conducted one in January. If in the end I simply need to let go of some form of paranoia then so much the better.

 

Just a note that in January I placed a VAR but only in her car. Is there somewhere else I should be placing it for best results?

[WilyWill]

I'm assuming she's using some kind of desktop computer (i.e. not a tablet) where the main unit is under a desk or some place no-one looks. There is a type of key logger that plugs directly into a USB port. So you would plug this device into the computer, then plug the keyboard's wireless receiver into the device.

 

If she saw it, being tech-savvy, she'd know something was odd, but people rarely look under the desk. It's also very tiny. The advantage is that you don't have to install any software that she might see in a list of running programs, or that might be caught by a virus/malware scanner.

 

I've never used one, but I've heard good things.

[BluesPower]

Nope sorry...

 

Do your detective work, like everyone says. DR FONE is a great tool.

 

Yes, she is having an affair, just trust me on that one. Can not say if it is and emotional affair or a physical one.

 

The GPS Turned up Nothing at all? It may be an online, maybe the face book guy, emotional affair. Does not make it better, just that there is no sex.

 

When you find something, keep digging because you never know. Do not confront unless you have absolute proof or she will lie and lie and lie.

 

When everyone says trust your gut, TRUST YOUR GUT.

[usa1ah]

Place a VAR in the room she spend her time in when you go to sleep.

 

Zombiehead's wife was sexting from the bath and other places for over a year before he caught her. Yours might be doing the same. I thing Dr Fone can capture this sort of thing from apps used for this purpose.

[Mrs. John Adams]

Nope sorry...

 

Do your detective work, like everyone says. DR FONE is a great tool.

 

Yes, she is having an affair, just trust me on that one. Can not say if it is and emotional affair or a physical one.

 

The GPS Turned up Nothing at all? It may be an online, maybe the face book guy, emotional affair. Does not make it better, just that there is no sex.

 

When you find something, keep digging because you never know. Do not confront unless you have absolute proof or she will lie and lie and lie.

 

When everyone says trust your gut, TRUST YOUR GUT.

 

yes by all means TRUST YOUR gut...not everybody's elses.

 

Your wife may not be doing anything inappropriate...you been spying and have found nothing.

[Zona]

Look at her overall behavior. Did it change fairly rapidly during the time in question (more distant, wanted more/less sex, extra nice/extra PO'ed). Those kind of things are red flags. Basically any behavior way out of the norm. I think emotional detachment can be common during an EA as she gets more attached to the OM.

 

Does this dude live out of town?

 

Too bad about Sprint. TMobile keeps text detail (phone numbers) for an entire year. Keep in mind that texts made while connected to wifi may not be logged by your carrier if she has an iPhone.

 

At some point you need to have and end game in mind, something that will bring closure either way. This kind of thing can become an obsession if you let it.

 

In my case,my wife worked with the a-hole 8 years ago, so it was impossible to really find anything about that time frame. I do remember looking at her texts and stuff back then, and again, no show stoppers. Her behavior was odd at times right at that time though. It's something that will always haunt me I suppose because I will just never know for 100% sure.

 

I recently found out he lost his medical license due to a failed drug test and a conviction from his past that surfaced when he went to renew. HAHAHA!! Sweet.

[BluesPower]

yes by all means TRUST YOUR gut...not everybody's elses.

 

Your wife may not be doing anything inappropriate...you been spying and have found nothing.

 

Mrs. JA... With the utmost respect...

 

How many times have I been wrong? I am right on this one too.

 

He will do the work and she will get caught. He already said that he had the feeling. People know when this is going on...

[Jersey born raised]

Blues, she could ask the same question if you.

 

I believe snapshot and other apps cannot be traced. You can see if the app is

Loaded but it is easy to install and uninstall.

 

Computer games, yea who knows. They have a built in app that allows private chats with no record. I did read emoes(sp) you know smiles and hearts have a separate history built in that allows you can see when they where used but nothing else.

 

I suggest reading not just friends to start and building a separate life.

[S2B]

Place a nest camera in the room with her computer. Then you can see and hear what she's doing on her computer...especially at night after you're asleep.

 

She's using Skype? The camera will catch who she's skyline with...

 

Start checking. If your gut says something's not right - then something's not right.

 

I don't think the VAR is going to give you much if she is mainly texting -maybe place a VAR in where her computer is if you can't do the best camera...these are awesome though and worth every penny...you can watch it and hear it in real time.