I think I am a victim of emotional gaslighting/narcicism

[progorum]

Ok. I'' try and keep it short.

 

met someone over a year ago. I fell hard for her fast. cared about her deeply right away . 2nd date we had sex, and then I helped her with a creative project. I told her I couldn't really put myself out there but still wanted to hangout (after that I didn't have sex with her and didn't hold her hand). I wasn't clear I admit that but I had just gotten out of a relationship, and had been codependent in past, and realllly needed to work on myself, and she seemed great and I didn't want to mess her up.

 

I cancelled a hangout with her friends and she asked me a couple other days I could hang out. I said I couldn't (I was trying to make some distance) and then she freaked out on me. told me I Was avoiding her, and kind of went off. She quickly apologized and later that night we talked and I said I couldn't date anyone I'm kind of messed up so don't worry about it. I had I have issues to work on.

 

2 days later she wanted to talk about it again and when I said I needed to work on myself she said I could do both. And that it was unfair, and that she hasn't decided whether she wanted this yet or not so it's unfair (narcissism?). She even said date me now or never talk to me again. She kind of pushed me into something. I coudn't stand my ground. I was weak, I had some outs and never took them.

 

It was 4 months and I didn't treat her well. anyone could see that. I wasn't pursuing her, and withheld affection, and maybe manipulating her to end things. I told her she wasn't smart for dating me. I told her dating is like PTSD for me (actually she said it sounded like that). And she tried with me but it was to much. When I was ending it (bc I felt like I was toxic and also having panic attacks) she said word for word "I'm not going to make this easy on you". I freaked out and said I was unhealthy and needed to be a lone and a piece of ****. 2 days later she ended it bc she thought we were still together. She had to stay at my place and said she didn't want anything to change bc we barely dated and I didn't put in any effort and we just won't cuddle or have sex and she won't stay over. I said no, it will change, I want to let it go, it's done, it's over. And she wouldn't accept it.

 

I would ask for space for a couple weeks and it wouldn't happen. literally last a day or two then she would be pissed about something. As friends the whole past changed. she minimized everything like we didn't even date and asked oncee a week if I tohught I would date her again. I felt so guilty and shameful. A couple times I said no I wouldn't and she screamed that she hated me, to get the **** out of her life. and then I would cower and say maybe. I was so toxic though. She wanted me to text more and I would go a few days and she would text and then text everyday about something so I didn't feel the need to text her first. When I asked why I never got space she said "If you don't give me what I need why should I give you what you need" that scared me and I freaked out. She accused me of never taking responsibility for anything, even though I would say I'm responsible for this not working I'm sorry. And then would chastise me and tell me how she felt about everything and being taken for granted for even as a friend. I didn't know what to say, I would just say "we broke up".

 

in 15 years she has never been single. She is 30. and she can't be alone, like physically, she hates it.

 

also, 3 months into the relationship I said I was sorry but I don't think I can work on myself and be with someone. She said that was bull**** and she didn't accept that and I was abandoning her.

 

I am seeing a therapist. have been for a year. not in contact with the girl at the moment. She is dating someone else now. But still wanted to be super close. I repeatedly told her I didn't want that.

Edited August 2, 2017 by progorum
words

[knabe]

Work on yourself and stop trying to label this girl.

 

And no, before anyone predictably says so....she does NOT have Borderline Personality Disorder. You confused her, and she's immature.

[progorum]

Right. I don't think she does either. I def have a lot of work to do on myself. And I tihnk it's just "she's immature like you said".

[Zahara]

She sounds like someone that is extremely clingy, needy and fearful of being abandoned.

 

I have to wonder if your behavior of being passive and indecisive triggered some of her anxiety and volatility. The push and pull/hot and cold can trigger very negative reactions.

 

Both of you played mind games and were incapable of dealing with this maturely and in a healthy manner. Instead of slapping labels on her, it would be best to focus on your own toxic behavior and reflect on why you chose to handle it the way you did. It's good that you are seeing a therapist.

[progorum]

yeah I shouldn't label it. When I watch stuff about it we both have done the same things. I definitely was hot and cold. And that wasn't helpful. When I said I didn't want anything serious she said she was furios and we were going to discuss this and come up with a solution. nad just like convinced me in a way?

 

But yes I need to reflect on my own issues and thoughts, not hers.

[Bastile]

I'm going to do you a favour here: drop the "npd, hpd, bpd, nypd" stuff. Just completely drop it. It isn't useful in the least.

 

I've dated two women in my life that I think legit had it. The game was still exactly the same.

 

And you want the harsh truth? All women exhibit the same exact characteristics.

 

Let's take mirroring as an example. So blatant that I now predict it in a woman's messages sometimes for a laugh. There was a girl that I took 4 hours to message back (I work weird hours, and was asleep). I was around my brothers, and explained the dynamics to him "this girl is going to message me at 8. You watch". 8.15, message comes through

 

Cut out the phsycotherapy stuff. It's a waste of time. Any therapist that came out with me on a sarge would be running back to his mum for more therapy. I can give many cases of men I know, for whom relationship counselling was a complete joke. The absolute opposite of what they should have been doing.

 

Cut out the therapist stuff, and learn to actually game.

[Zahara]

yeah I shouldn't label it. When I watch stuff about it we both have done the same things. I definitely was hot and cold. And that wasn't helpful. When I said I didn't want anything serious she said she was furios and we were going to discuss this and come up with a solution. nad just like convinced me in a way?

 

But yes I need to reflect on my own issues and thoughts, not hers.

 

When someone gets dumped, the initial reaction is to beg, plead and negotiate in hopes of trying to convince the dumper to change their mind. Pretty normal during endings. Maybe she was furious because she felt led on because of the push and pull? Maybe she reacted negatively due to her own fears.

 

No one can convince you to stay. You have a choice. She's not to blame for your choices -- you are responsible for your own actions.

[progorum]

I'm going to do you a favour here: drop the "npd, hpd, bpd, nypd" stuff. Just completely drop it. It isn't useful in the least.

 

I've dated two women in my life that I think legit had it. The game was still exactly the same.

 

And you want the harsh truth? All women exhibit the same exact characteristics.

 

Let's take mirroring as an example. So blatant that I now predict it in a woman's messages sometimes for a laugh. There was a girl that I took 4 hours to message back (I work weird hours, and was asleep). I was around my brothers, and explained the dynamics to him "this girl is going to message me at 8. You watch". 8.15, message comes through

 

Cut out the phsycotherapy stuff. It's a waste of time. Any therapist that came out with me on a sarge would be running back to his mum for more therapy. I can give many cases of men I know, for whom relationship counselling was a complete joke. The absolute opposite of what they should have been doing.

 

Cut out the therapist stuff, and learn to actually game.

 

Yup you're right. Don't need to label everything and figure out what dysfunction she might have to make myself "feel" better.

 

I guess I felt like I didn't exist bc when I set a hard boundary about space after the breakup (which she claimed it wasn't) it was crossed. And she didn't think anything of it. and would call me a narcissist.

 

I hear what you are saying though

[Bastile]

Where's Downtown? He's an expert on bpd. I have a lot of respect for him on this forum.

 

Downtown, where you at?

 

I'll debate it with him. Through all my gaming, I've found this psychology stuff to be a complete waste of time.

[progorum]

yup thats a good point. It was my choice to stay. I think I did it out of fear bc I felt a connection and thought I'd never talk to her again bc she said that.

 

She did cry out when I Was ending it that she didn't want to go through another breakup, and it was too soon. And then randomly said she thought her ex was gonna text her bc it was a year ago that they had met. Which put me off. It's just a funny thing when you (me) tell someone you are unhealthy and shouldn't be dating and they keep trying even though it was only 3 weeks.

 

She is clingy and needy and I fed into that. Don't get me wrong I def have my own huge part to reflect and know I wasn't the best guy to date, and even told her that after it ended and apologized

[progorum]

Where's Downtown? He's an expert on bpd. I have a lot of respect for him on this forum.

 

Downtown, where you at?

 

I'll debate it with him. Through all my gaming, I've found this psychology stuff to be a complete waste of time.

 

This would be interesting. She did date someone who was bi-polar for 3 years. So I think she was taking some stuff out on me bc she always said I was warping things when I was just misunderstanding. and very quick-tempered. I just think she tried to change the emotional past so we could still be very close and "best friends", that's why it wasn't a "break-up" to her. The only solution was her solution though.

 

She even said if we aren't friends then I get nothing out of this not a friendship or any romance and it's not fair. So maybe a tint of narcissism. I don't think bi-polar though. Just tons of anxiety and naturally high-strung. and couldn't be alone.

[Downtown]

I'm going to do you a favour here: drop the "npd, hpd, bpd, nypd" stuff. Just completely drop it. It isn't useful in the least.

Bastile, you must agree with me on one thing. If you've ever visited New York, I'm sure you'd agree that the NYPD is useful, LOL. As to the other terms, they are useful to some people but not to others. Different people take different paths to healing -- and are at different stages of the healing process when they arrive here.

 

The beauty of the LoveShack forum, then, is that our members share a variety of experiences and viewpoints. In that way, the OP is able to choose the approach he believes will work best for him at this point in time. Later on, he may return here seeking another approach when he's ready to try that.

[Bastile]

Bastile, you must agree with me on one thing. If you've ever visited New York, I'm sure you'd agree that the NYPD is useful, LOL. As to the other terms, they are useful to some people but not to others. Different people take different paths to healing -- and are at different stages of the healing process when they arrive here.

 

The beauty of the LoveShack forum, then, is that our members share a variety of experiences and viewpoints. In that way, the OP is able to choose the approach he believes will work best for him at this point in time. Later on, he may return here seeking another approach when he's ready to try that.

 

Fair enough, mate. I see what you are saying.

 

And back in the day, I scoured the internet too for validation that what I was dealing with wasn't the norm also. It really helped.

 

You are a good man, that has helped a lot of people. I have a great deal of respect for you (and I very rarely say such a thing ).

 

I look at this from a very different perspective, though. And my perspective got me from bpd idiots, to happily getting with models... they say you get better or you get bitter.

 

I'm far from perfect. But I have dealt with things in a unique way. Same as I think that you have. Hopefully both positive.

[spiderowl]

It sounds like it started off with a really messy push/pull situation where you seemed happy with her then pulled back dramatically. Not surprisingly at that point she reacted with confusion and anger. Then it all gets very muddled because she appears to be behaving in an abusive manner. In fact, this relationship seems to be full of drama and push/pull. You are both hurting each other. I suspect you will both stay in it because for some reason neither of you know what a normal relationship is.

 

A relationship should not be full of drama and pain. Overcoming some issues is inevitable and that could bring a couple closer together but this looks like a train wreck. I think you both need to seek therapy to work out what is happening here. It is far too complex and driven by underlying needs and background history. It just sounds to me like both of you have been in dysfunctional families and do not know how people normally treat each other. I hope things do get better for you both.

[understand50]

Oh good god, quite trying to play the victim card. She is who she is. If you can live with her faults and everything else, then pursue her. IF not, then move on. STOP thinking of yourself as a victim. Your title got me going "I think I am a victim of emotional gaslighting/narcicism" Also your comparing the relationship to "PTSD ". She, or you, is not required to change for each other. AS she seems not to be good at relationship, accept this, or move on. Look, be strong and confident in yourself, do not accept things that will not work out. Do not take on the role of victim, as you are not.

 

My two cents.