Stay or go? What on earth do I do now?

[Outcast]

If not, I'd soon find out - I think I can avoid another bad long-termer.

 

Are you sure? You were awash in grief over a person a few days ago and now you're at:

 

With hindsight I now know that my strong feelings were just infatuation based upon wishful thinking - and that explains her feelings at the start of it too - but we never really got to know each other well enough, and I *SUSPECT* that we'd never have made it to marriage. I don't know if we'd have got along all that well, and she ended up with significant doubts about me too.

 

I know what I need to do but I don't know if I'm strong enough.

 

Endings are very sad, true, but it might be the best thing to do. I haven't so far detected any notes of contempt in what you say about your wife but you may get to that point if you continue, and nobody deserves to live with someone who feels contempt for them. Best you should go and save her that.

[Ditherer]

Yes, I hope I can either learn to avoid getting involved with less-than-perfect matches, or learn to face splitting up (once it becomes obvious something isn't worth clinging onto) without giving in.. I don't want to make the same mistake twice in one lifetime.

 

In any case, surely once I'm single it'll be a lot more straightforward to deal with than an affair!

 

Get this.. I must be the only bloke in the world who ever cried at the movie Spiderman.. which I've just watched. Poor ol' Spidey can't be with the one he loves... that was enough to set me off

 

So empty inside.. starting to wonder if it's genuine depression I might need treatment for! That's what effect a Sunday with the wife has on me. I *REALLY* can't imagine the rest of my life with her. How can I have contempt for her? She's a lovely woman.. I just don't feel anything. I resent feeling trapped here with her, but not contempt.

 

Time for bed and probably another sleepless night. Have a nice week everyone.

[midlifecrazy]

Damn it, I wrote a whole big response and then lost it somehow.

 

So empty inside.. starting to wonder if it's genuine depression I might need treatment for!

 

I think you finally got it Dith. Maybe I missed it but I was wondering why someone hadn't suggested this before. You sure sound depressed to me. May be why you're having such a hard time reaching a decision and why things seem so bleak in your marriage.

 

I'd quit talking to my buddies and seek professional help before I did anything rash. If you don't and somehow you did manage to end up with YOUR Dream Girl, I'd wager you'd be back on here within a couple of years complaining about her. Good luck, brother.

 

Outcast, I see you took my name in vain earlier in Dith's thread. I'll address your concerns in my own when I have more time.

[Ditherer]

Cheers MLC

No, I don't think it's genuine depression, it was the result of being with her all day! Today I'm back to normal, tired if anything, but happy enough in myself.. just feeling a lot of weight from this whole issue bearing down on me... mixed in with a twinge of excitement that I could just possibly wrestle back control of my life and have a go at getting what I want for a change. I've been down before, and this isn't like it. Depression is when everything is futile and black and nothing seems interesting, everything is pointless.. it's horrid. But at the moment I'm still interested in life's possibilities, and all my nerdy interests, so the only thing I'm suffering from is the stress of not knowing what to do for the best.

 

As for my DG, I don't believe I've met her yet! My "affair babe" wasn't her.. because.. although no-one's perfect.. a decent relationship between mature adults depends upon them ADAPTING to each other's imperfections and accommodating them.. and she was too inflexible to put up with anything that didn't suit her.. that's why I think she's never going to last with anyone. Too stuck in her stubborn ways. I like to think I've proved I can adapt and live with someone for a decade or two and ignore her faults and oddities (as she has done with mine) without any major drama - so I think I'd do even better with someone I respect and feel more strongly about in the first place. If I've put up with it feeling not-quite-right all this time, I can accommodate. But I know I'm inexperienced.. and I have to wonder what would be available to me out there if I went - I wonder if almost everyone worth having is already settled by now, and only the hopeless are left?! How many single people in my suitable age group are capable of having a good long term relationship if they're not settled by now? How many crap relationships does it take before someone can almost be written off?! Obviously there will be other people who have also reached the end of the line of a long relationship - it doesn't always work out no matter what.. people change and grow apart.. every case is different I know... but I still wonder what chance I'd have to meet someone as genuinely loving as I yearn for.. amongst how many stuck-in-their-ways self-centred over-fussy basket-cases?!

Maybe that's tonight's drink talking (it dulls the pain)... I know it sounds uncharitable and mean but I wonder... I have to consider these things! But anyway...

 

My current plan

 

I will forget about the affair as much as I can. I'm not going to be annoyed with myself for missing her (it's only natural and human), but I will do all I can to see how doomed it was, and focus on both the good and bad - to keep it balanced. Whenever I catch myself thinking about her, I will instead daydream about someone else instead.. even if she's some fictional ideal that I'll hope to meet one day.

 

As for the marriage I shall keep on just getting on with it for now, I still need to let things settle. I CANNOT afford to make a decision to leave while my affair is still on my mind so much. I'll try to tidy up my stuff, as this has some influence on how possible it is to leave, but it's hard to find the motivation while I'm still dithering. I'll try to be less scared of the whole thing - a trial sep isn't as bad as a definite "it's over!".

 

I admit I'm looking out for other women even more keenly than ever, although I know it's asking for trouble. I'm aiming to smile more and possibly even start talking to good prospects. Normally I look away if I catch someone's eye - like I've been *conditioned* to avoid anything - sad isn't it? It's very rare that I've ever flirted with anyone, although I'd had many chances. I'm not going to waste any new opportunities from now on. I would like to see how likely it might be that I could find what I'm looking for - I hope that if the unlikely happened I'd be able to resist it for the time being.. but even if I couldn't.. I'm sure I'd have enough strength to leave home this time. Maybe I *have* to be in an affair situation before I'll leave!

 

If I MUST keep going over and over things, I'm going to do the following in an effort not to be overwhelmed by so many issues. I will pick the top three or four Reasons Not To Leave from the long list posted a day or two ago. I will ignore all the other reasons - if they're not bad enough to be at the top then they must be things I'll cope with. I will then work out the relative importance of these Most Scary Reasons. If one or two of them are far more daunting than the others, then I'll know what issue(s) is/are worth concentrating on - and I'll know not to place so much importance upon all the other reasons.. I shouldn't let ALL the list above all mount up into one great big bundle of uncertainty - this excercise will help me focus upon the most pressing problem(s). Perhaps Then I'll have to balance that against all the reasons why I *SHOULD* leave. I think I'll know what wins out. I've been wanting to leave her for so long, I think I'm starting to trust myself, LOL. But will I have the nads to do it?

 

[midlifecrazy]

Well you can always make an appointment, drop a few quid (?) and get a check up just to rule out the possibility. Think of it as insurance. It's bound to be cheaper than what you'll be out in the long run if you do divorce and then you'll KNOW you're not going through all of this because of a chemical imbalance or something.

[Ditherer]

Well you can always make an appointment, drop a few quid (? - yes) and get a check up just to rule out the possibility.

 

Thanks.. I'll bear it in mind if I think it's worth checking. Feeling more positive today. Affair seems like dim and distant past. Marriage still seems stifling and loveless... for now I'm treating it as something to put up with while sorting myself out.. letting my head clear.

 

Thanks again everyone.. I'll keep you informed if anything happens..

 

[Ditherer]

A lot calmer now. I haven't talked about things for a few days, as my mates are either away or I don't want to bring them down going on about it. I've been busying myself with one of my geeky hobbies, finding a new avenue to explore.. and this is occupying my mind enough to stop me worrying about silly old lurve.

 

I find that I've got back to the 'sad old man' type of sexless existance again. When I go straight to work, see no-one all day, and go straight back home... never meeting anyone along the way.. I find I forget what tasty women look like and resign myself to a life without them. It's a mentality like the sad old prudes who complain about sex on TV because they've forgotten how good it was. It's true what they say - if you've been knocked off your horse you really do have to jump right back into the saddle - if I got out more and saw appealing women... if I had that initial "WOW" feeling a bit more (where you catch someone's eye and you both do the old pupil-dilation thing).. maybe it would put my loveless marriage back into perspective. How can I compare my dull lifestyle to the possibilities that life would offer if I shook myself free? But how do I know what's possible until I try?

 

So I'm worryingly well and truly settled back into the rut. I wonder if I *need* the stability of it - is a passion-less, romance-less, excitement-free rut the price to pay for avoiding the lows that accompanied the highs of the rollercoaster ride of the new relationship? Could I cope with all that again, is it worth it?

 

When you're not feeling 'in love', the whole idea seems absurd and impossible.. so I'm not likely to make great changes to my life to pursue such a seemingly unchaseable dream. Besides, I've had the occasional good laugh with my wife and it seems like we've got moments of good friendship. I still wouldn't say I LOVE her and want to spend all my time with her though. If I manage to laugh with her enough, and I have an endless supply of xxx available in future, is that not so bad? I'm worried that if I settle back into this unfulfillment again, and leave it too long, I may lose the objective power to decide.

 

Am I still thinking about the affair? You bet, but not so often. Of course I miss her, why wouldn't I - it was all really sweet and addictive. But in reality she was not THAT good a prospect, all things considered - just unusual enough in my life to stand out, for now. I'm glad she set me free, because there MUST be better out there. So every time I catch myself thinking about her, I should tell myself : if I'm THAT bothered about *HER*, why don't I get out there and find someone else? She's not the only woman I'll ever click with - it's that compatability I miss, so why not get out there and put myself into the position where life has the chance to bring me into contact with someone equally thrilling, or hopefully even better. *That's* what us lovesick puppies have to do!! Give up the one that didn't work, go find another.

 

I've come up with a new hyperthetical question : What if you won millions? Enough to buy all your friends and family houses, cars and lifetime incomes.. and still travel in luxury for the rest of your days? Would it be with your spouse or would you move on? The answer shows whether you're genuinely staying with your partner for who they are - or whether you're simply wedded to your current comfortable lifestyle. The money would change everything - and focus your mind on your relationship... would you want to share the world with your partner ... or find someone else? Me... I think I'd be away like a shot!

 

[Ditherer]

Crying again tonight. I don't know how much longer I can bear this. Can leaving be as bad as this? The gaping hole in my heart is tearing me apart. Everything is fine at work, with my friends, but as I arrive at home my heart sinks. The kids are great, but then when they've gone to bed there's no reason to be here. I feel trapped here, while life passes me by. What's the point? My dad upset me at the weekend, asking me if I'd sorted myself out yet.. "no more talk of divorce please"... oh great! I thought I could count upon his support, now I just feel even MORE pressured into staying put.

 

This really sucks. I'm being torn in two directions.. stay put in some *obligation* ... or... The Big Unknown that I know I should be facing like a man... but it's too difficult ... no wonder I've been dithering so long... how THE *&^%ING **** DO I CHOOSE???!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[midlifecrazy]

Dith, Interesting you should ask this. I've pondered the same question myself. If I won millions I imagine at the very least we would have two households, his and hers even if we remained married. If you'll recall what she said when we were on the verge of breaking up, "I didn't know where I was going to go or what I was going to do". Note that she did not say "without you" or "I'd miss you so much, couldn't live without you" etc. If she had everything she wanted monetarily I really don't think she'd miss me much at all if I was gone.

 

A question for you, are you sexless because your wife refuses you or because you just don't want to make love to her?

 

What should you do? Maybe the best thing would be what you mentioned before, a trial separation. At least you wouldn't burn your bridges and who knows after a while you might find yourself missing your wife and pining for her the way you're doing your affair babe now.

 

The risk is that if you move out your wife may find herself enjoying her freedom from you and simply write you off. Crap, that will probably start you dithering again.

[Ditherer]

Thanks for replying, I'm not so tearful today but still down.

 

A question for you, are you sexless because your wife refuses you or because you just don't want to make love to her?

 

I don't fancy her. She's dieting to please me (I find fat a turn off - and she's not even that big!), which makes me feel guilty.. I could easily 'use her' if I got a bit drunk and horny.. I hope I can resist because it will just complicate things. I know I *HAVE* to leave her, but I still can't face it... I'm just waiting for it to get so bad that I can't put it off any longer.

 

What should you do? Maybe the best thing would be what you mentioned before, a trial separation.

 

Yes.. it's looking that way. It makes my blood run cold just thinking about it. I'm hoping for a sign from above.. or for fate to play its part and move things one way or another for me.. anything to avoid having to make such a terrible decision myself! ....even though I've already decided, in my own mind ... but I'm too weak and fearful to act upon it.

 

How the heck CAN I stay here, feeling like this? It's so AWFUL that I've got almost everything I want.. just no-one I love to share it with. I'm living with someone I feel nothing for! But she seems to adore me and I feel so trapped by the whole thing... it sucks!!!

 

I hate this.

[Ditherer]

Still dithering!

 

I had to stay in with her and the kids today, and it nearly drove me mad. I'm really not at ease with her company (kids were ok, but let's face it, they amuse themselves most of the time - they're not with me every minute). In the end I jumped at the chance to go out for supplies.. took a long drive.. really needed the time to myself.

 

I figured I've been too feeble with my insecure lack of confidence lately. I drove past somewhere I'd been with my affair-babe.. today I shouted out I "F*** You (insert name here)!" ... which helped. I need self-respect. If I have to be arrogant, then so be it.. whatever helps. Whatever it takes. I need to stop being the wimpy "I don't deserve anything, I'll never get what I want, who'd want me?" and instead think positive. I CAN find someone I want... I DESERVE IT, I'M WORTH IT!!! If any girl doesn't appreciate me for who I am, F*** 'EM! I'll move on and keep looking.. the silly cows aren't worth it!! It's not really 'me', but... needs must.

[Ditherer]

I feel like I'm making some progress - almost totally given up on wanting anything to do with Affair-Babe any more. What's she got to offer? Why get hung up on wishing we could still be friends, what's the point? I wish her well and still miss her in some ways, but our time has passed and that's that. Over and done with. I can't waste my time worrying about someone who has shown that they want no contact with me. She has become Just Another Human Amongst Billions.

 

As for the situation at home, I tried today to sum it up in one sentence. My first go was : "I'm trying to figure out if it's worth staying with someone I don't love" - good grief that sounds absurd doesn't it?!!

It showed me how What Happens After Leaving is irrelevant to The Decision To Leave. It's more like : "I'm trying to figure out whether I can love her at all, if I try". Sure, I can make the relationship better to the point where it's BEARABLE, TOLERABLE, but what's the point of THAT? Where's the fulfillment? Is dull contentment something I should bear for an easy life with the kids? Probably not... because even if I brought us closer, would I really love her or not? I suspect NO... so the-comfortable-rut-and-kids is irrelevant.

 

Let's just get Christmas over first!

[Ditherer]

Why is it that every time I post about how well I'm getting over my affair, the next day I relapse and miss her so much that I end up in tears again?! I keep thinking of all the good things and ignore the bad.. and I end up fantasizing about getting back with her one day. Very stupid. It's like my rational head knows what's best but my heart just hasn't caught up yet!

 

But mostly, the tears are brought on by the misery of knowing I'll never love my wife enough to make it sensible to stay.. knowing I have to leave. And yet, I still need to be sure. I think I'm blaming my wife for not being able to have my fun with Affair-Babe.. so I've got to wait until I'm COMPLETELY over her until I decide. She's still on my mind too much.. so I've got to keep waiting. Once I'm SURE I've got over her, and my head is clear, and I've got no love left.. then I go.

 

So here I am thinking how I have to become self-contained - to be complete on my own - to manage without women AT ALL... and a blinding revelation came... SHE wasn't self-contained - she was desperate for A BLOKE.. DESPERATE!!! Get that??!! DESPERATE!!! I can't stress that highly enough!! She wasn't ready for a decent relationship because she was too needy. I'm *SO* much better off without her. For now, at least - LOL

 

But how CAN I face a self-contained life? To take pride in living your life without anyone special.. isn't that lonely, no matter how hard you try to keep busy and surround yourself with the company of friends or family? Don't we all yearn to be loved? We all see couples blissfully in love and aren't we envious? We want that for ourselves because we've all had some experience of how wonderful it is. I suppose the answer is that we need to recover after each failed attempt, each relationship that didn't work out, we then need to become self-contained once more before we try again - the self-complete phase doesn't have to mean permanent loneliness but it's a necessary step to becoming capable of being loved again.. and it means you have more to offer and deal with the next relationship better.

 

I'm looking forward to the challenge of being single, to be honest. I'm not scared of what follows leaving my wife any more, it's just the pain of getting started along that route that's too awful to think about right now. But once I get going, I'm sure I'll cope. I'll find ways to manage. I'll have to!

 

Too much thinking again... good night all

[Ditherer]

I woke up feeling fine.. I don't need women in my life. Wonderfully at peace. But then I'm still bursting into tears with emotional music.. this is gonna take some time! It's more the Impending Doom of Inevitable Separation than looking back wistfully at the affair though.

 

Having said that I'm over the affair, she's still on my mind too much. But I'm allowed to grieve and miss her. Here's todays New Thought : Even though it's not worth mourning the loss of someone less than 99.9% right (just MOVE ON!!!)... if she felt 95% right at the time - then I'm obviously going to feel 95% of the pain of splitting up with Someone Just Right. No wonder it hurts!

 

[Ditherer]

As I see it, the main things I'm missing, things that could improve my life and be worth pursuing, can be summed up as 'RISC' : Romance, Intimacy, Sex and Companionship.

 

Romance : The 'rush' of a new relationship. A great experience at the time, but it doesn't last. So is it worth yearning for? If I had a great partner I cherished (one that STARTED with Romance) I'm sure I'd feel enough of it forever more, to last me. If not, I'd gladly forgo such a thing if I was so blissfully happy with the overall state of things. Besides, the heady days of romantic excitement aren't always 100% great - it can be a rollercoaster ride of highs and lows and all end in a lot of pain. Who needs it THAT much? So I can rule this one out - not worth fretting over. It's a tool Mother Nature uses to bring people together.. maybe I don't WANT to be 'used' like that again? Maybe I do. Maybe I could get addicted to it. Who knows?!

 

Intimacy & Sex : I could TRY to get close to my wife again.. and get these two back pretty quickly.. probably enough to keep me happy enough in those areas. Somewhere in the region of 6/10, score-wise - good enough to be better than nothing, but not good enough to totally satisfy the emptyness I've felt for years.

 

Companionship (the strong friendship that follows intimacy, as opposed to the friendship that may have preceeded Romance) : For me, the best it ever gets is something like an arranged marriage - I can make the best of it (like I've tried to for years, as I thought divorce was impossible for us) but it's nowhere near enough to keep me happy. I've had years of avoiding her and dreading time off-work. Each bank holiday makes my heart sink as I have to spend time with her. This is NOWHERE NEAR the companionship that I want. I bet you've made lots of friends over the years but lost contact with many of them, right? Some friends are more in tune with you than others, some don't last, some you out-grow.. so it is with the friendship that a close relationship should be based upon. I simply wouldn't choose to spend time with her if I could choose. How can a marriage survive THAT?!

 

So I could *try* to stay, telling myself that Romance isn't worth it, I can have Intimancy and Sex, and put up with the indifferent Companionship, finding other things in life to excite me. I've always thought that certain hobbies were for people to distract themselves from being miserable that they're not getting what they REALLY want in life.. this would certainly be the case!!

 

- Or I could leave. I can say my relationship never had the romance to start with, the intimacy and sex have been OK-ish but always fell short (and sex is never going to be great because I don't fancy her as much AND it can only get worse in time), and the Companionship has its moments (when I'm doing something fun so I'm enjoying myself ANYWAY) but is generally poor. Very poor. Maybe I should stop analysing and listen to my heart and my gut instincts - if I *KNOW* that I've always avoided her and don't relish time alone with her, that's all the answer I should need.

 

I just can't see WHY is so incredibly important to cling on to a relationship that isn't working? Why do we place SO MUCH importance on staying together just because of some vows years ago when I was too weak to back out? If two people outgrow each other, what's the point being miserable with each other for the rest of your days? Why not acknowledge it's a dead duck and move on? Can single life really be that much worse?! What's so ***** sacred about marriage if it hasn't worked out well? I'm getting more and more fed up with people being so feeble about relationships. Should it REALLY be so difficult for two people to realise when it's broken and face the truth without getting so stupidly emotional about it?!!!

 

I'll just keep on dithering. I'm really not happy about this relationship. I wish I knew whether to grit my teeth and carry on with it, or just give it up... I wish I knew 100% for sure... I don't think I ever will know that well....

[OldEurope]

Sweetheart, you can have all of these things: the Romance, the Intimacy, the Companionship and the Sex with the right partner. Those relationships exist. They do. You will find her when you follow a passion of yours--some intellectual, cultural or even athletic leaning that overwhelms you..it can be one interest of a few you may have... and that road will lead you to her. Take a look at your life, surroudings, comings, goings, company you keep, time you spend. What traits dominate? Why are you around the people you are? What are the bonds in all of this? In this answer you will see why you have in your life the successes or failures with people that you do. I do not think you have answered the question of who YOU are--therefore the "dithering" about the "other" in your life. You need to tap in reaaaaal deep, away from the circumstances of social and personal influences upon your decision making. Your crisis is one of spirit, not "relationships" necessarily. Your life is waiting for that "A-ha!" moment...you will find it...

[Ditherer]

Thanks.

 

Back to the endless Thinking It Over then...

 

Cheers

[Ditherer]

I've just worked my way through the webpages at a website (can I post a link? I found it from another thread here on LS) that explains the difference between "romantic love" and its so-called "companionate love"... now I'm even more confused. I'm comforted that the love I felt during my "emotional affair" was real enough in some ways (and reciprocated by her) but this isn't the "good stuff" that lasts. Well d'uh - that's obvious. As the site says, we all (most/many of us) believe this heady excitement stuff is the glittering prize, even if it never works out and always ends painfully.

 

And yet, it's still what I crave. I've never felt so ALIVE and excited as I did this year. I miss it so much. Maybe I should stear well clear of it, because I genuinely think I could (given the chance to experience it enough) get very addicted to it.

 

So I can't win, can I? If I have to avoid the thrill of the way-too-fast 'falling' into exciting romanctic attraction.. what does that leave me? A long lonely search for The One (or The First The One that comes along!) that really would be so wonderful that we could have long-lasting "companionate love" - ideally COMBINED with romantic love?

 

Hmmmm. Things feel like they're clicking into place - things like "You have to be prepared to be on your own and be happy before you find true love" have a new resonance tonight.. and yet I'm still confused. I still don't know what I've got, what I'd miss or what's possible. I need to sleep on it and carry on mulling it over tomorrow.

 

What if I've had "companionate love" all these years for my wife after all? But then how can I be SO indifferent now? Is it just because I'm still suffering the grief of lost romantic love? And because I'm holding back from getting intimately close to my wife yet, because I don't know if it's for the best or not?

 

I think I've never had the thrill of "romantic love" with my wife, and what "companionate love" I've felt has not really been on the right level to fully satisfy. I can't say I "can't talk about her without smiling" - far from it.. the total opposite at the moment. I've never been sure about her, I've always avoided her when I could, always felt trapped in a relationship I'm too feeble to break away from. And yet I know her inside out and have a certain fondness for her.. that much is inevitable I guess after years of lovemaking and living together based upon LIKING her JUST ENOUGH. The problem is I just don't LIKE her ENOUGH. That's how I've felt from the start, and I can't see it changing. I still feel a spilt HAS to happen, it's not fair on either of us to carry on like this. But what would I feel if I WERE to try getting close to her again? Does that "decision to love" her stand a chance, or would it merely prolong the inevitable divorce, wasting time in the meanwhile?

 

I realise I'm still in turmoil about all this, so I'm not making any decisions yet. This is difficult stuff! So much at stake.

[FWIW]

I've just worked my way through the webpages at a website (can I post a link? I found it from another thread here on LS) that explains the difference between "romantic love" and its so-called "companionate love"

 

I think I've found the one you mean, relationshipsandlove.com?

[FWIW]

Thanks for helping me find that site, there's a lot to agree with there. I find it's a bit scrappy in the layout, you could get lost following the links around the site to pages you've already read; better to just read each page in turn from the main page. It would be better as numbered chapters, but hey.. note the guy wants to sell you a book!

 

The main point of it seems to be : SLOW DOWN and make a realistic assesment of whether someone *is* actually worth having a relationship with, before you ALLOW yourself to fall for them - which could be easier said than done! Be fussy, if you like, and don't waste your time and emotions upon those partners who aren't really compatible with you - no matter how much attraction and chemistry there may seem to be at first. It's not fair to yourself (you'll end up getting hurt) and not fair to them either, toying with them like that. You could apply some of this knowledge to try and MAKE people fall for you, if your objective is to use them and sleep around. Best not to! But it feels good, doesn't it? Interesting how our whole culture promotes this silly infatuation stuff, exciting though it may be, when it so seldom works in the long run.

 

I would agree it makes more sense to get to know someone well before getting your hopes up (no building up a perfect image of them based upon unproven hopes), and don't sleep with anyone if you have doubts deep down - as it will cement you together when you shouldn't be together.

 

It seems like you don't have this companionate love for your wife, so you need to work out whether it's at all possible if you work at it, or whether you really need to stop messing everyone about and get out of it. You may find it elsewhere, you may never do, but at least you won't be deceiving anyone - especially yourself - you'd be giving yourself a chance.

 

One thing to watch out for, if you've been cold to your wife all this time, rationing out little bits of love to her here and there, as and when you feel like it - she probably (according to what I gather from that site) loves you mainly in the "romantic love" way (even after all these years) rather than the "companionate love" way. Read through again and see if this applies? If so, you will realise just how badly it's going to hurt her, as you've probably been dreading! That doesn't make it any easier, does it?! Except perhaps it may help you to justify leaving, that the love isn't as real and deep as you've always wanted, so you've GOT to bail out now? Come to think of it, if she DOES love you the "companionate" way, surely that's even worse for her to cope with?! Can't win, huh?! Whatever way it is, you can't let your fear of how she'd react cloud your judgement about what's best for everyone in the long term.

 

You seem to be examining things very thoroughly, I hope you find the right answer and have the strength to do what you know is for the best. Good luck!

[OldEurope]

As the site says, we all (most/many of us) believe this heady excitement stuff is the glittering prize, even if it never works out and always ends painfully.

 

And yet, it's still what I crave. I've never felt so ALIVE and excited as I did this year. I miss it so much. Maybe I should stear well clear of it, because I genuinely think I could (given the chance to experience it enough) get very addicted to it.

 

So I can't win, can I?

 

 

Why should the "heady excitement stuff" not work out and "always" end painfully? Because some anonymous Internet writer says it should and a few scrappy "psychologists" with their own turmoils have judged it so?

 

And "romantic love" VERSUS "companionate love"??? Why must these be in separate categories? Why not be romantically in love with one's parter and find her a great companion? Sounds normal and not un-typical to me...

 

You are trying to compartimentalize too much. You are separating your emotions into what you believe are logical rations and you are destroying the meaning what love, true love, is in the first place: the ultimate sensation of wholeness. Stop it now. Stop denying your true feelings and trying to sublimate real feelings under those that you think or are persuaded to think are your "rational", dutiful committments. They are not. The only real committment a person has is to be true to one's self.

 

Also, when a person speaks of knowing how to be happy alone before being happy with someone else, that does not of course mean you do not long, as a single person, to be with some one, and things are just fine going solo. That is not what that means. It means knowing the essence of yourself and personality so that you do not lose your personality, values or goals in favor of the joy of having a companion in life.

 

Jump, Dith, jump!

[FWIW]

Why should the "heady excitement stuff" not work out and "always" end painfully? Because some anonymous Internet writer says it should and a few scrappy "psychologists" with their own turmoils have judged it so?

 

And "romantic love" VERSUS "companionate love"??? Why must these be in separate categories? Why not be romantically in love with one's parter and find her a great companion? Sounds normal and not un-typical to me...

 

The site says that you CAN combine the two, you just have to back off from falling for the wrong people and wait until someone genuinely compatible comes along.

 

I find that site is a useful way of making sense of the posts here that have confused me until now. I find that if I think in terms of how it's all described on that site, I can now frame all the advice on this site in those terms, and make a lot more sense of it. Your mileage may vary considerably though, if you are already secure in your own mind about these things. Those of us still trying to find our way in life may find the clear categories of "romantic" or "companionate" love helps things to slot in place in our minds.

[Ditherer]

Wow! Thanks, people.. nice to see some activity on the thread.

Glad you got some value from that site too, FWIW.

Cheers OldEurope, yes I'd like to jump, but I'm still scared.

 

Back to the affair for a moment.. after reading that site.. it's comforting that I can dismiss the affair as the 'wrong' kind of love that would never have worked out, so I can try to forget about it (even more than I've been trying so far!). I think I was some way into the "companionate" zone in the way I felt about her (as I wanted what's best for her, to help her, it wasn't purely about how *I* felt - or maybe I just got a buzz from all the pity?) .. but I've always known we didn't know enough about each other, and now I can see (more clearly now) just how many ways she was fully in the "romantic" zone ONLY, and had no genuine interest in ME... it was all about how good it felt for HER. I truly am better off without her. I'm now trying to do the excercise of calmly saying "Goodbye (her name)" whenever she pops into my head. It would be a lot easier to find someone else, but as I still sometimes struggle to let go of her I still wonder whether.. if we ever both grow a lot, and one day become friends again (VERY unlikely - the site made me realise how she's probably completely written me off as a person, forever) .. if we get to know each other better maybe we'd find we really are compatible and something *genuine* would grow? I do *KNOW* this isn't going to happen, but I'm stuck with thinking it makes it easier to deal with. It gives me a comforting 'fix' to still cling on to some thread of hope, to believe in her as a wonderful person! I'm not helping my recovery by doing this, am I? It's like taking painkillers and taking months to get over an injury (maybe *never* healing) rather than facing the pain of active physiotherapy that clears it all up much more quickly.

 

This belief in someone, that's what makes a great relationship, isn't it? One that ends up as a good long term "companionate" one? If you truly deeply have a profound sense of wonder and awe for all that's going on in that beautiful, wonderful head of theirs.. if you feel there's BOUNDLESS amounts of interesting thoughts, likes and opinions in there.. an endless source of interest.. a profoundly satisfying companionship.. that's what we want isn't it? I can say quite 100% surely that I DO NOT feel this way about my wife, and I never have. I feel that if I flipped up the top of her head and took a look in there (yuck!) there's nothing in there that interests me. I've found out all I need to know, and there's nothing left. I just feel disappointment, dullness and frustration. THAT'S why I think the whole thing's doomed and not worth rescuing.

 

I want to look into someone's eyes and see the whole infinity of the universe with all the wonder of a child - with my wife I'd look into her eyes and see a static old TV testcard with a whining test-tone... or maybe a 30 second loop of cheesy muzak. *sigh*

 

I know that years ago when I first met my wife, the romance stuff wasn't there but I did "make the decision" to try and love her. Love "as a decision" certainly worked to some degree - it kept us together but overall I feel it simply hasn't worked out. I could carry on trying to DECIDE to love her, and feel a certain amount of success with that (as I have done in various phases) but it never lasts, it never feels 100% right, I end up not making the effort to sustain it and get depressed. When I compare how I am with her, to how I have been (at various times in my life) with other people I REALLY click with, who make me "come alive".. I just feel I've short-changed myself by settling down with the wrong partner. I hate this feeling so much.. but I'm stuck in my dilemma for now...

 

I could cry myself to sleep, only it would wake her up... and if I wasn't so numb.........

 

[Wintersbloom]

Hello~

 

I have to question if you loved your wife or are in love with your wife. Being in love with someone sharing lives...is very different from the intoxication of falling in love. They say....couples spend 20% of thier time..in blissful happiness with each other, 20% of thier time going through rough times together, and the remaining 80% is what is left. Somewhere in the middle of bliss and anquish.

 

Only you can know your situation. I you were to ask my opinion as a friend, I would wonder....how much a role your shyness, insecurity as a youth, lack of experience..plays into your feeling "unhappy". I would also wonder...though it is not my biziness....if there was something that happened to you...an event..that has possilby contributed to your feeling "not good enough" as you stated in your post. It is important for us all to deal with our issues. This may influence our perception of our situation. I do not believe I would want to be in a relationship where I feel "less worthy" of my partner's love. Being in a relationship where I feel more loved by my partner, to me would be better but 50/50 would be best. Best wishes whatever path you chooe to follow.

[Ditherer]

I have to question if you loved your wife or are in love with your wife. Being in love with someone sharing lives...is very different from the intoxication of falling in love. They say....couples spend 20% of thier time..in blissful happiness with each other, 20% of thier time going through rough times together, and the remaining 80% is what is left. ... Best wishes whatever path you chooe to follow.

 

Hi, and thanks for your best wishes, it's very much appreciated that you took the time to answer. I've been crying to myself again tonight, which feels very silly, but I hope it helps get things out of my system! My wife was extremely moody tonight and shouting a lot at the kids.. was very reluctant to do me favour tomorrow.. it feels so OVER.. I found myself saying to myself "that's it, how the **** am I supposed to love THAT?!" - I just can't. And yet I know I'm STILL not over the affair, I still miss her no matter how much I try to convince myself it wouldn't have worked... conveniently forgetting how she actually TOLD me she didn't feel the same any more.. (and yet she HAD felt strongly at first.. argh!!!).

 

So I'm still getting nowhere, but I'm closer to accepting I HAVE TO LEAVE - because there's nothing worth salvaging here and it can't ever work. It's never been more than 6/10 at the best of times, maybe 8/10 in moments of post-coital bliss, but typically averaging 3/10 or less since.. since we moved in together, to be honest - before marriage. I can't face spending the rest of my life in this state of disinterest and ambivalence. I want a relationship that hits 10/10 some of the time, even if it's 7/10 most of the time.. a relationship where I don't feel I have to "work at it" but would do willingly if I had to. Do I deserve that? Don't we all? It's the pain I'll cause by splitting up this family that puts me off though... oh I hate this.. I'm afraid I'll go nuts if I don't finally make a decision after Christmas and stick to it. That Trial Sep. seems the only way to go!

 

Thanks