do other people have this experience?

[mossycup]

I'm 38 years old. I've posted in the past about my horrible breakup with my fiance and the unexpected betrayal. Since then I've had another relationship where I was used and abandoned without even the respect of a break up - he just ghosted. It's been 8 months.

 

All of my friends either have boyfriends or husbands or a man that cares. I go on date after date and nothing. I have agoraphobia so I can't travel very much, hardly ever get to see my family and I live alone.

 

I work hard every week to make sure I have plans for the weekend (I'm ok to get around town) but this week I'm just so tired and I have no plans. I'm tired of making plans.

 

I feel hopeless at my age of finding a person who is healthy and interested in me for marriage. I don't even get past the first date. My personality isn't that great, compared to other people, I'm just sort of averagely ok.

 

I'm tired of talking to my friends or my therapist or family about this. No one really, truly understands how lonely it can get, year after year, and when you start to feel hopeless.

 

I don't want other people to feel bad in the way I do, but I don't want to feel so alone anymore. Does anyone else ever feel this way, like they are going to be alone forever and it hurts so much? I feel like I've spent so many years, that other people are learning how to build a life with someone, learning how to let go and be resilient alone. I just don't know how to want to live my life, how to feel inspired. But I think mainly I just feel incredibly emotionally isolated. I stopped telling people my true feelings after just about every person I shared with either rejected me or got upset with me and said I was too selfish. I feel better in many ways not sharing my feelings, I know I'm not easy to love in any way, but I just want to feel like someone else understands.

[InAFog]

Mossycup,

 

I know EXACTLY how it feels. I too am 38. Posted here before with a past break up, and am back again with another heartbreak. Got together with my ex as soon as I moved to this town, so virtually everyone I know are his friends. He moved on immediately, so immediately that there's no way he wasn't seeing her when we were together. And now I feel so absolutely lonely, miserable, and angry!

 

I too live alone, and am very introverted. It's not easy for me to meet people. Especially since I have no one to even make any plans or go out with! I have no clue how to even find someone else. Especially around my age that isn't married with a family. Or that I can trust. That's going to be a tough one from here on out.

 

Yes, I definitely know the utter hopeless feeling & the loneliness. You certainly are not alone!!

[mossycup]

Yes, it sounds like we do have things in common. I totally get it about the trust. It's hard because it can feel like a double barrier: first, no one is interested, but even if they were, how would you know they weren't just using you for sex, or for fun until you showed your deeper self and they left? It's hard for me to even imagine a man actually valuing me at this point. I don't mean that dramatically - I mean I actually can't conceptualize it. When I was young I had a wonderful relationship that I messed up, so I do remember the feeling, but now it feels like another lifetime.

[d0nnivain]

I was 39 when I met the man who is now my husband. I also suffer from agoraphobia. Don't give up hope but do work with your therapist to find the courage to get out more.

 

Yes, it can be tiring to always have to make plans as opposed to having a partner who you can just do nothing with. One of the ways I found my husband was by making a pact with myself to get out at least once per week to do something social designed to help me meet new men. I also had a deal with myself to go out at least once per week to network to grow my fledging business. I cheated & talked business at some of the social events & flirted at the business ones. I actually met DH at a business card exchange, networking event.

 

Make sure you have interests in your life that give you pleasure. In the dead of winter, sometimes I would light a fire, curl up with a book & a glass of wine, convince the dog to sit on my feet to keep them warm & remember how lucky I was because I had the ability to enjoy these simple pleasures. It was still solitary but it felt solitary by choice.

 

Hang in there.

[mossycup]

Thank you. I do go out a lot, and on a lot of dates. So yes, I'm working on it! And I do enjoy being along. It's the feeling of just not being able to figure out how I can meet so many men, many of whom I find attractive, that just aren't interested. Four men have - two were my exes who left me really brutally, the other is a married man who I ended up having a threesome with him and his wife out of intense loneliness and boredom, and the fourth wanted me to be polyamorous with him and another girl, unless she wanted to be exclusive and then I was out. This is a horrible, horrible track record and I'm super demoralized. I think if I never met anyone I liked, or never went out, that would be one thing, but I feel overwhelmed by all the interactions and then it leading to being used for sex/rejected or simply invisible.

 

It does feel good to know that people do meet husbands later on, that did give me a bit of hope.

[SevenCity]

It's helpful to look at the common denominator- you.

 

I'm not saying you are the problem but when you go out with that many guys and one doesn't want to land you it says one of two things:

 

1) you are going out with the wrong guys

2) there is something you are doing that is turning them off.

 

I'm been dating now after 17 years out of the market. I've dated really attractive women who have never been married and at first I say to myself "I can't understand why she is single and never married??" It takes 3 weeks or less before I say "Oh, that's why".

 

It's possible you have incredibly bad luck, but it's more probable that you are doing something that is turning guys off.

 

This isn't meant as a hit against you, rather to make you aware that you may have behaviors you don't realize turn guys off. We all can improve ourselves but it starts by taking a hard look at yourself to find out what's wrong.

[Logo]

Since the breakup I have been trying to find a partner, but I think I have been trying too hard.

 

At first, when I wasn't ready for a relationship, I was going out on dates, but the women I met weren't for me. And I was in great shape.

 

Now that I'm ready for a relationship and want to move on, I can't seem to find a date.

 

Mentally, I changed a lot since the breakup. Back then I was looking forward with hope. I didn't need affection or intimacy. I had swagger and felt confident in my body and looks.

 

 

Fast forward to today, and I miss the companionship, the affection and the physical and emotional intimacy.

 

After so many rejections in the last few months I don't feel so attractive anymore. My ego is bruised and so is my self-esteem.

 

 

 

So in the last two weeks, I have started eating cookies and cakes that I normally don't eat, junk food. I just don't care anymore if I'm in good shape or not. I keep telling myself, you only live once, and grab another cookie or doughnut.

 

 

 

Do women look at me and wonder, "There's something wrong with him if he hasn't been snatched up by now," and decide to avoid me entirely?

 

I just don't know.

 

 

Is it me? Is it them? Is it all a coincidence?

 

 

 

Perhaps what I need to do is live my life and not worry about a relationship. But if I don't put myself out there, how is it going to happen?

 

 

f***.

[Rogo]

I'm 40 and just got blindsided a month ago from an almost 2 year relationship about a month ago. Out of the blue. Well for me anyways. Obviously not her. I know how you feel. We put all this time and effort into a relationship and it ends. Just like that. Now we have to start over. I'm 40. Don't want to be alone. I feel your pain. I'm feeling it right now

[mossycup]

It's helpful to look at the common denominator- you.

 

This isn't meant as a hit against you, rather to make you aware that you may have behaviors you don't realize turn guys off. We all can improve ourselves but it starts by taking a hard look at yourself to find out what's wrong.

 

I suspect you may be right in some ways. On the one hand, I have a tendency to date immature, emotionally distant or mentally unwell men. I have a tendency to stay with them until they dump me. I wasted many years doing this.

 

When I was young, I had a lovely boyfriend who asked me to marry him but I said no and went on to a life of crappy relationships. That was almost 20 years ago and it was a mistake I've paid for for a long time, but I was young and stupid, so I have to accept it.

 

So partly it has been my choices that have caused me to be rejected. I've been choosing men who clearly just want me for sex or some other reason, and don't actually admire me, when I could have been with my earlier boyfriend, a healthy man who did admire me.

 

Second: I am sure I have traits that put men off (or attract sketchy guys). These are my best guesses, I would like your thoughts:

 

1. I am incapable of hiding my feelings and if I am bored on a date, it shows. I tend to not like anyone when I first meet them so I think I just turn guys off. I am able to have a very bright, sexy manner when I want to, but if I don't, I can't fake it. I think guys feel like I am indifferent and that is not attractive.

 

2. I have a slightly odd manner. I'm just odd. I'm an odd person and some people find that really sexy and other people probably don't even see me as female. UNFORTUNATELY, the men who see it as sexy are usually emotionally unstable, which is understandable. So the men I attract tend to be men that aren't looking for a nice stable partner, but for fun, adventure or kinks or quirks or friendship or whatever.

 

3. I suck at travel and most guys like to travel. Not a big deal but I did have a nice guy reject me for that.

 

4. I think I maybe talk too fast and talk about wierd things. Basically I'm just not your pumpkin spice latte basic girl. I am different and not everyone goes for that.

 

5. I have anxiety which I think maybe shows sometimes and puts people off. I can be a little twitchy. Although I've never had a guy say that was a problem.

 

6. I think I kind of look like a boy, and I don't think I have a consistent feminine manner, although I have a fantastic body and it's a proven fact to everyone I've been with I'm great in bed.

 

My basic working theory is that I'm sexy, quirky, interesting and at heart, kind, if a bit rough on the surface, and I've had men really love me and I've had men be really attracted to me, but my personality does not inspire thoughts of long term partnership. That MIGHT be because of quirkiness, but it might also be because I don't occupy the niche of either "nice wife" or "admirable woman" (both of which guys want to marry). I occupy a niche of kind/quirky/gentle which is the niche of perpetual dating, solitude, and delayed adolescence.

 

Basically I think I'm not mature enough to be a wife and everyone knows that except the immature men who can't see it so they are ok to be with me!

 

I know that alot of really immature people get married though. So that part confuses me. But I think I have a particular brand of immaturity that can't even pretend to be mature, as many can do.

 

And, as I said, I blew a good chance at a good man when I was young, so there is that too.

 

Incidentally, I believe he is still single, and we're still in contact. Ten years ago he said he'd not yet met anyone he loved as much as me, and now, twenty years from when we met, I still feel the same about hm. maybe it's worth giving him a call?

[mossycup]

I've dated really attractive women who have never been married and at first I say to myself "I can't understand why she is single and never married??" It takes 3 weeks or less before I say "Oh, that's why".

 

I would find it quite helpful to know from you, and other men, what are the traits that turn men off? They are never what I expect!

[SevenCity]

I suspect you may be right in some ways. On the one hand, I have a tendency to date immature, emotionally distant or mentally unwell men. I have a tendency to stay with them until they dump me. I wasted many years doing this.

 

The good news is you have experience with them and can see the red flags - avoid them. Immature men who are emotionally distant with mental problems will never lead you to happiness.

 

When I was young, I had a lovely boyfriend who asked me to marry him but I said no and went on to a life of crappy relationships. That was almost 20 years ago and it was a mistake I've paid for for a long time, but I was young and stupid, so I have to accept it.

 

So partly it has been my choices that have caused me to be rejected. I've been choosing men who clearly just want me for sex or some other reason, and don't actually admire me, when I could have been with my earlier boyfriend, a healthy man who did admire me.

 

Don't beat yourself up over the past - you can't change it so you must accept it. We've all made mistakes in the past. As long as you learn from them it was time well spent.

 

 

Second: I am sure I have traits that put men off (or attract sketchy guys). These are my best guesses, I would like your thoughts:

 

1. I am incapable of hiding my feelings and if I am bored on a date, it shows. I tend to not like anyone when I first meet them so I think I just turn guys off. I am able to have a very bright, sexy manner when I want to, but if I don't, I can't fake it. I think guys feel like I am indifferent and that is not attractive.

 

Guys like to do things right. In the context of a date, that means showing you a good time. If you are visually bored it makes the guy feel unsuccessful. I've been on dates like that and I have zero desire to put myself through it again.

 

In life, you have to learn to fake a little. How about doing something you find fun on a date? That way, you can be honest with yourself and have a good time. Doesn't mean you have to go out with them again, but it beats a sour puss.

 

2. I have a slightly odd manner. I'm just odd. I'm an odd person and some people find that really sexy and other people probably don't even see me as female. UNFORTUNATELY, the men who see it as sexy are usually emotionally unstable, which is understandable. So the men I attract tend to be men that aren't looking for a nice stable partner, but for fun, adventure or kinks or quirks or friendship or whatever.

 

Odd as in what respect? Most normal people want normal - like attracts like. What are you doing that is odd?

 

I had one date picking her teeth clean after the meal. It was not only odd it was disgusting.

 

3. I suck at travel and most guys like to travel. Not a big deal but I did have a nice guy reject me for that.

 

I can't help on this one as I hate to travel as well. Seems everyone does and somehow has enough money to fill up their passport while maintaining a job to pay for it. It's fine to be incompatible with people.

 

But, travel should not be even an option until you are gf / bf which is why I don't really care as most dates don't lead to that. If it does, I'm happy to have her go on her own.

 

4. I think I maybe talk too fast and talk about wierd things. Basically I'm just not your pumpkin spice latte basic girl. I am different and not everyone goes for that.

 

You can't make everyone happy but keep the convo above the weird level and try to slow things down. For me, I like a girl who is deliberate in her words and does not fly off on an emotional tangent at 100 mph willy nilly. A lot of guys just ignore when women get like this.

 

It may be helpful to record yourself on your phone while you are talking to a friend and see how you really speak.

 

5. I have anxiety which I think maybe shows sometimes and puts people off. I can be a little twitchy. Although I've never had a guy say that was a problem.

 

Twitchy like physical tics? Anxiety can be helped with medication / therapy. I'm not an anxious person and get uncomfortable around people who are. That's me though - not sure what other guys thing but I would venture a guess that most people enjoy calmness.

 

 

6. I think I kind of look like a boy, and I don't think I have a consistent feminine manner, although I have a fantastic body and it's a proven fact to everyone I've been with I'm great in bed.

 

Do you keep your hair short? What makes you look like a boy? The above seem to be in conflict with each other. Having a great (fantastic!) body is a HUGE plus. Looking like a boy is not. Men want a woman to be feminine. I think that can be easily changed through grooming / style changes.

 

 

 

My basic working theory is that I'm sexy, quirky, interesting and at heart, kind, if a bit rough on the surface, and I've had men really love me and I've had men be really attracted to me, but my personality does not inspire thoughts of long term partnership. That MIGHT be because of quirkiness, but it might also be because I don't occupy the niche of either "nice wife" or "admirable woman" (both of which guys want to marry). I occupy a niche of kind/quirky/gentle which is the niche of perpetual dating, solitude, and delayed adolescence.

 

Basically I think I'm not mature enough to be a wife and everyone knows that except the immature men who can't see it so they are ok to be with me!

 

The fact that you think it will cause you to portray it. Why do you feel you are immature? Are you unreliable? Flighty? Selfish? What guys want in a wife will differ greatly from man to man.

 

 

I know that alot of really immature people get married though. So that part confuses me. But I think I have a particular brand of immaturity that can't even pretend to be mature, as many can do.

 

There are also A LOT of unhappy people in marriages. Most (~60%) get divorced, many cheat, others are just miserable. The goal should be to find someone you really want to spend the rest of your life with. Not just be married.

 

And, as I said, I blew a good chance at a good man when I was young, so there is that too.

 

Incidentally, I believe he is still single, and we're still in contact. Ten years ago he said he'd not yet met anyone he loved as much as me, and now, twenty years from when we met, I still feel the same about hm. maybe it's worth giving him a call?

 

Of course it is! But 20 years changed both of you - for the better or worse. Just be prepared that you are not the same people.

 

 

I would find it quite helpful to know from you, and other men, what are the traits that turn men off? They are never what I expect!

 

All guys are different, here's some of mine:

- Selfish

- Entitled

- Lazy

- Out of shape

- Dishonest

- Puts her needs above others

- Not empathetic

- Bad table manners

- Bad body manners (like snorting, farting, etc.)

- Nosy

- Bitchy

- Argumentative

- Bad communicator

- Doesn't take an interest in my interests

- Bad hygiene

- Complains

- Irresponsible

- Immature

- Self conscious (a small degree is ok, but too much is too much)

 

Those are just a few but I've found a combination of several (or most) in all the women I have dated over the past year.

 

Everyone is different though. Some guys love women who challenge their every word. I prefer a submissive woman who allows me to be a man. I don't like to fight and I appreciate women who don't try to change me.

[mossycup]

Thanks for your thorough response. Although everyone is different, I do enjoy hearing people's particular ideas, and I believe there is universal insight in them.

 

I reviewed your list and I am relieved to realize I do not possess any of these bad qualities in any significant way! That is relieving.

 

I'll respond to your responses, or, the most salient ones.

 

Showing more enthusiasm - agree! This is something I need to work on. More specifically I need to have first dates at lunch so there is a time limit, so I can show my best self briefly while getting to know them, and then if I like them, move on to a longer date where I know I will have the enthusiasm for them. Evening dates kind of go on endlessly and I get tired and lose steam with a new person.

 

Oddness - no, I don't pick my teeth I'm just quirky, like I might talk about unusual topics, not gross ones, though. Some people must might not be able to follow my line of thinking. Probably best to keep things lighter until I know someone really appeciates this aspect of me. Also maybe it's fine if people aren't into it - maybe I just have to more patient for the individuals who appreciate this trait in me.

 

Talking slower - AGREE! I'm working on this in all areas of my life. Same with anxiety. I'm trying to keep myself more measured in my speech and reactions. I find that doing regular meditation and exercise, and having lots of quiet time is helping with this. I've made a lot of progress in this area and I appreciate hearing that it really does make a difference to people.

 

The anxiety that I do express is more just like being high energy, or distracted, or wanting someone to like me and giving off that vibe. So unnattractive, I agree! Again, something to work on.

 

Boyishness - No, I have long hair, wear make up every day, and often wear dresses/short shorts. Sometimes I'm more preppy but i try to be feminine (my casual style is sort of like Meredith from Gray's Anatomy - soft, fitted fabrics and tight jeans). My features are strong though - it's not in my favour, for sure, my beauty is unique and not every man will find me attractive, although I'm not ugly. Mainly my attitude is boyish, like a tom boy, if that makes sense. I am perhaps overly playful, and direct (though never about my feelings when I don't know someone well - I always leave it to the man to pursue me 100% - and I only share what I want when I really think a person wants to hear it).

 

Immaturity - I am used to be alone and doing what I want. I try when I'm with someone to be generous and giving, and I definitely am. I'm very nurturing. But I'm not really domestic. I can make someone toast and tea and give them a massage, but I'm not going to make a ten course dinner like my grandma did, if that makes sense. Also I'm not super ambitious though I have a good job and take care of my finances. I don't care though about the house in the suburbs, the car, the vacations. I like simple things and I spend a lot of time in nature, so I think I'm just a bit outside the norm. I'm also in my head alot, for better or worse. I'm loving and generous, but I struggle sometimes to be aware of people on the daily. I kind of tend to think of a husband as a roomate I have sex with. i think maybe this is a sort of unconcious thing that guys are picking up on? And also of course the kind of guys I've been going for are not husband material, because of my own gaps in thinking around getting married.

 

As for your last comment - I think men need to be the pursuers, and people need to make equal decisions in their relationships. No one wants to be changed and it's pointless and unfair activity. For me, I let men pursue me (with some encouragement) and when we have to make decisions, I share what I want and need and listen to them and decide together. I do tend to date passive men who want me to give direction to daily activities, so that might be something to look at - being more open to balance in a relationship. Yes, I think I am somewhat directing. Ok, that might be something to look at. I do it because of my anxiety makes me fearful of new situations when I am with a new person, so I want to be in charge, and men usually let me, but I can still find ways to be more open and receptive to the plans others make. I think a big problem is that I attract passive, unstable men, and then they let me control everything, but it is because they are not invested, and then they leave. I would be better to continue to work on my own flexibility, so that I can be with men who are more active and thus more invested. I don't need to be controlled by a man, but just have a back and forth.

 

That's kind of scary for me! I'm scared to let another person lead, what if they hurt me? Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

This is a helpful conversation. Thanks for taking the time.