Affair rules

[DKT3]

It's sad that some either cannot or will not distinguish between a reason for vulnerability and a reason for cheating. There is no viable excuse or justifiable reason for cheating. But whether we want to admit it or not there are things that might make a partner vollmer obal to outside attention. You don't have to like it, but it's there

 

Again, I get that to the cheater it seems like a legitimate reason, that the spouse, in thier mind at that time has left them feeling vulnerable. However, since cheating isn't forced or the only option, then it is not a legitimate reason to cheat.

 

What I don't understand is why is this acceptable? As I said, were I to says my wife said really nasty things to me for years so I beat her would you be blaming her? Would you be saying my reason was legitimate? Of course not, so why is it acceptable for a woman to use it?

[JohnAdams]

Again, I get that to the cheater it seems like a legitimate reason, that the spouse, in thier mind at that time has left them feeling vulnerable. However, since cheating isn't forced or the only option, then it is not a legitimate reason to cheat.

 

What I don't understand is why is this acceptable? As I said, were I to says my wife said really nasty things to me for years so I beat her would you be blaming her? Would you be saying my reason was legitimate? Of course not, so why is it acceptable for a woman to use it?

 

So, I would then ask you. What is an acceptable answer? I wanted to so I did. All other answers are not worthy? What are your reasons? There is always a mindset that leads to actions. The fact that you do not find the answers acceptable does not mean they are not valid.

[Mrs. John Adams]

There are circumstances surrounding every relationship..lets not confuse those circumstances with blame.

 

I have never ever blamed my husband for my choice to cheat...however...am i not allowed to tell him how i was feeling at the time of my betrayal?

 

Are my feelings in any way blame shifting? Or am i just trying to explain my mindset at the time?

 

If i don't deal with the way i was feeling...then how do i avoid making bad choices in the future?

 

We all talk about getting better...fixing what is broken...but if we are not allowed to discuss how we are broken...what went wrong...then how can we FIX it?

 

My husband and i were not in a good place in our relationship...we are both to blame for that. He will be the first to tell you we were not in sync...he knew it too. However...he never dreamed i would cheat.

 

Ok...I understand his mindset...we are not in a great place...but we will get back to the great place again....and for 11 years..that was true. You know the difference? Opportunity.

 

I had never gone outside of our home...I went to church...I took care of our home.

 

But this time...i went to school...I met other people...I had a life outside of our little home.

 

This time....was different.

 

Now should i not discuss that with him? Should i not tell him how i saw things...my fears...my insecurities....my feelings?

 

Or are we saying...that i have no rights...I should accept that absolutely everything that happened in our relationship was all my fault? Ok...if absolutely everything in our relationship is right..does he also get all the credit for all the things we have done right? I have had nothing to do with the good parts? I am only responsible for the bad stuff because i cheated? But wait..he cheated too.

 

The purpose of this thread is to explore how we help each other to get better not how to bash and blame.

 

I am responsible for the choices i have made. My husband had nothing to do with those choices. I do not blame my husband for my choice to cheat. I am allowed to tell him why i made that choice...I am allowed to tell him how i felt and why i felt that way. It in no way means i am blaming him.

 

I want to get better...I want to help him feel safe. How do I do that if i cannot say how i felt or how i feel...how do we move forward if we don't feel like we can talk about the things that were wrong as well as the things that were right?

 

John and i are real people...with real feelings and real emotions...our relationship is a real relationship based on real truths. We are not perfect people...we do not have a perfect relationship...or a perfect reconciliation...but after 45 years of marriage and 34 years of reconciliation...I think we may have done a few things right....you may disagree...and you may handle your relationship differently...but this has worked for us and i imagine it will for the rest of our lives.

[DKT3]

So, I would then ask you. What is an acceptable answer? I wanted to so I did. All other answers are not worthy? What are your reasons? There is always a mindset that leads to actions. The fact that you do not find the answers acceptable does not mean they are not valid.

 

Am I speaking a different language? I'm confused. As I have said several times, I get that in the WS mind it feels legitimate at the time. Doesn't make it so. Hopefully, during the time that follows they would accept and acknowledge that there were other options, a healthy way to handle the situation.

 

What did I find acceptable? Nothing, because there is no acceptable reason to do it. Divorce I get. Me personally, I just accepted that it happened, that I will never have a answer that satisfied my question of why. Truth is I don't think she really knows. Of course she said all the things that are being said here. But, she changed her tune, told me I was a d++k but she had no excuses for what she did, that she should have left but didn't want to. I accept that.

[Whoknew30]

Any time one uses a "reason" that includes someone else as playing a role in horrible behavior it's minimizing that persons accountability. We are all responsible for how we react to others actions. Not too that away the legitimacy of those actions, but no matter what they are you control your reaction.

 

How here would be ok with a man saying his wife's actions caused his reaction to be physical? This is no different.

 

The only option is not messing around with someone else, making that decision is independent of any behavior the other party displayed. Bottom line is people cheat because they want to. Convincing yourself that this person doesn't love you, or care or even like you isn't a precursor to having an affair.

 

Don't get me wrong, I understand what you and the others are saying, and again I'm not saying these things don't play a part in why the cheater cheats. What I'm saying is it's not legitimate not fair.

 

Infidelity is only the third leading cause of divorce, which means most people get themselves out of undesirable situations with that solution being between someone else's legs.

 

Any behavior is due to someone "wanting to" but if that was that easy than there would be no need for any type of psychology...going by what you're saying, there would be no explanation for any type of behavior at all.

 

Life isn't fair, it was never promised to be. Reason, just bc it isn't "fair" doesn't make not understandable. Also for the statistic of infidelity is extremely flawed. So many people don't own they ever cheated, which means their BS have no idea & yet a divorce can occur without it ever being known their was an A.

 

OP...I also thought about this..."rules of an A" really doesn't exist. The only thing expected of each other is not to tell anyone's BS...lust isn't really driven by rules.

[RecentChange]

My husband cheated.

 

Could he have chosen not to? Of course.

 

Did I understand MY role in to what led him there. Absolutely. Were there short comings in the relationship, in our communication, things we were BOTH RESPONSIBLE for? YES. Now I can't say I had this insight on D Day, but with communication, counseling - yes, I understood.

 

Was he struggling with some of his own demons which I was not aware of before it was all blow out of the water? Yep.

 

I don’t know, perhaps its because I am more emotionally walled than some. Yes his cheating hurt, it hurt my feelings, it hurt my ego, and the worst part was questioning my future.

 

But I never had the vitriol of the “cheater” that many seem to hold in their hearts. In the end I understood. I understood why he did it, why he was led there, how our relationship, and I personally played a role.

 

And I have a big ol’ scarlet A on my chest as well. And I carry guilt for the pain I caused by my selfishness. I have been very careful not to blame him. I had a choice, and its one I made.

 

But, through answering his questions, giving honest responses, he understood my “reasons”. Again, not excuses, not justifications, but reasons. And he also understood his role in those reasons. The issues in our relationship, in me personally, in how we treat each other etc that made me vulnerable.

 

Because for over a decade I wasn’t vulnerable. Doing something like I did never crossed my mind. But the garden needs tending, by BOTH of us, and it hadn’t been, and we weakened, *I* weakened, and bad choices were made.

 

Maybe it would be easier if I simply declared him a monster. That this person I loved and invested so much into must be some other creature I never knew…. But instead I accepted the fact that we are incredibly complex. That you can spend a lifetime with someone and still not always know their struggles, their inner workings. That the man that “did this” was in fact the SAME one that I know and love.

[Mrs. John Adams]

Let me try to explain something that may be real hard for you to understand.

 

Nothing...no reason ...legitimizes bad behavior. Nothing.

 

However...a wayward and any of us who have cheated can surely relate to this...

 

I felt my husband no longer cared..it was not a fact..but that's what i thought and felt. I have talked extensively to OT's wife...she felt EXACTLY the same thing. So if you think that your spouse doesn't care...can you understand how then you can validate in your mind looking for or choosing something else?

 

no matter what the reason or excuse or validation...it is wrong. No one denies that it is wrong.

 

But you cannot deny someone their feelings. If this is their mindset...if this is how they feel...even if it is wrong...it is still how they feel. I don't use the way i felt as an excuse to make bad choices. All I am trying to understand is WHY i made the choice so I do NOT make that choice again.

 

If I am not allowed to understand my own choices...how do i get better?

 

My husband never did anything to validate that choice...but he is still partially responsible for the STATE of the relationship....Just like he is partially responsible for the things we have done right.

 

Cheating spouses...are responsible for their choice to cheat...but both the WS and the BS are responsible for the relationship. You can disagree all you want...but there is no one in a relationship that is not dually responsible for the relationship...good or bad.

[understand50]

Not going over the feelings and thoughts on both sides, WS and BS, after D-day, would seem strange. I am sure some WS would use this time to come up with a justification, but even that would give a good idea of if reconciliation has a chance.

 

The bottom line in all this, is that both need to fully understand and explore their feeling, leading up to, during and after the cheating. Telling a WS, that their feeling and thoughts do not matter in the least, does not seem like a good way to let each heal from this. The BS, may not be ready, but at sometime, a long talk on how and why this happened needs to be done.

 

There is no justification for cheating, but there are reasons, or reasons the WS felt that were valid to allow them to cross the line into being a cheater. These feeling and thoughts could have taken a long time to develop, or be spur of the moment. Point, is along with being honest on just what happened, "what were you thinking" will and needs to explained. Again, this is part of "why" and both may never now exactly "why", but they should have a good idea.

 

My two cents......

[Whitenblack]

Let me try to explain something that may be real hard for you to understand.

 

Nothing...no reason ...legitimizes bad behavior. Nothing.

 

However...a wayward and any of us who have cheated can surely relate to this...

 

I felt my husband no longer cared..it was not a fact..but that's what i thought and felt. I have talked extensively to OT's wife...she felt EXACTLY the same thing. So if you think that your spouse doesn't care...can you understand how then you can validate in your mind looking for or choosing something else?

 

no matter what the reason or excuse or validation...it is wrong. No one denies that it is wrong.

 

But you cannot deny someone their feelings. If this is their mindset...if this is how they feel...even if it is wrong...it is still how they feel. I don't use the way i felt as an excuse to make bad choices. All I am trying to understand is WHY i made the choice so I do NOT make that choice again.

 

If I am not allowed to understand my own choices...how do i get better?

 

My husband never did anything to validate that choice...but he is still partially responsible for the STATE of the relationship....Just like he is partially responsible for the things we have done right.

 

Cheating spouses...are responsible for their choice to cheat...but both the WS and the BS are responsible for the relationship. You can disagree all you want...but there is no one in a relationship that is not dually responsible for the relationship...good or bad.

 

Sorry to be blunt, I mean no offense. But I feel the main reason a lot of affairs happen is because the WS is weak willed. If one is not happy with their relationship or marriage, one always has the option to end it before starting a new relationship. If you truly felt your husband did not care about you, and you've tried everything to fix it (counselling, etc), then divorce him, before engaging with someone new. Is that easy to do? Absolutely not. Is it doable? Yes it is. Does it take a strong will to say no to an affair before it starts? Hell yes.

Edited August 23, 2017 by Whitenblack

[DKT3]

Not going over the feelings and thoughts on both sides, WS and BS, after D-day, would seem strange. I am sure some WS would use this time to come up with a justification, but even that would give a good idea of if reconciliation has a chance.

 

The bottom line in all this, is that both need to fully understand and explore their feeling, leading up to, during and after the cheating. Telling a WS, that their feeling and thoughts do not matter in the least, does not seem like a good way to let each heal from this. The BS, may not be ready, but at sometime, a long talk on how and why this happened needs to be done.

 

There is no justification for cheating, but there are reasons, or reasons the WS felt that were valid to allow them to cross the line into being a cheater. These feeling and thoughts could have taken a long time to develop, or be spur of the moment. Point, is along with being honest on just what happened, "what were you thinking" will and needs to explained. Again, this is part of "why" and both may never now exactly "why", but they should have a good idea.

 

My two cents......

 

My last comment on the topic, feels a bit like a hamster wheel. How a WS feels about the relationship and the decision to cheat are totally independent of one another. Sure one could say those feelings made them do it. What about the hungry guy that sells drugs at school? Isn't being hungry a legitimate reason to find a way to feed themselves? What about the guy who feels emasculated by his wife, isnt that a reason he can use to justify being abusive? When does it end, and who gets to decide is a legitimate reason? Everyone who has ever walked the planet has a reason they can use to justify poor behavior. Who's to say which is legitimate? Who's to say what those reasons can justify? Where does some just F**king over another person come into play, where is the personal responsibility? At the end of the day the waywards chose to get involved in an affair. The reasons, in my mind are irrelevant simply because we all have reasons to behave poorly. Why are those reasons relevant when a woman cheats on her husband?

 

On the flipside, those reasons maybe legitimate concerns in the Marriage, things that make one unhappy that need to be addressed. Yet they aren't reasons to behave poor and use them to minimize personal accountability.

[It Is What It Is]

My last comment on the topic, feels a bit like a hamster wheel. How a WS feels about the relationship and the decision to cheat are totally independent of one another. Sure one could say those feelings made them do it. What about the hungry guy that sells drugs at school? Isn't being hungry a legitimate reason to find a way to feed themselves? What about the guy who feels emasculated by his wife, isnt that a reason he can use to justify being abusive? When does it end, and who gets to decide is a legitimate reason? Everyone who has ever walked the planet has a reason they can use to justify poor behavior. Who's to say which is legitimate? Who's to say what those reasons can justify? Where does some just F**king over another person come into play, where is the personal responsibility? At the end of the day the waywards chose to get involved in an affair. The reasons, in my mind are irrelevant simply because we all have reasons to behave poorly. Why are those reasons relevant when a woman cheats on her husband?

 

On the flipside, those reasons maybe legitimate concerns in the Marriage, things that make one unhappy that need to be addressed. Yet they aren't reasons to behave poor and use them to minimize personal accountability.

 

I am a new poster here, I registered to post on this thread. I have read this web site for a-while now.

 

Why did you re-marry your wife? You sound like you havent forgiven her based on what you said. Given that she had a two year affair, compared to Mrs. John Adams' basically one night stand, dont you think the reasons why she did it would be different? I t hink you do or you would not be posting like this.

 

You had an affair yourself too, right..... according to your own thread taht you started. Maybe own up to it, did you do it because this women made you feel better about yourself? Be honest because you have said taht was the reason in in the past on this forum I have read it

 

Why did you have the affair?

[Whoknew30]

I personally think OP. & other BH like him, won't let go of what they want to think. Doesn't matter if they talk to a million people "they know about it all"...it is not surprising to me, that men that have that mind set would have a wife that cheated on them. It's a massive character flaw in a relationship to think you know everything & especially a man that thinks that way, there's no way (IMO) a man with that mind frame is paying attention to his relationship that much bc why would they, "their relationship is great bc they know everything". That kind of logic is a set up for a failed relationship.

 

I think the thread got off topic a bit but I don't think OP or men like him are ever really going to see their play in their relationship issues that got them to this place in life. Men that want to make it "men vs women" all women do this & all men are like this, are just extremely closed minded & being that closes minded, they're not really listening to their wives.

 

Look at the example of "my wife said all these things but then at the end said, she didn't know why & I accept that"...I did this to my husband at first to bc he wouldn't listen, which is one of the reasons my relationship was bad. No answer was good enough, due to his inability to have a open mind & own not everything he thought was gospel & in concrete.

 

Part of reconciliation should be learming to have a open mind, not still sticking to the same old thought process that helped damage your relationship to begin with...(I should add, this isn't "blame for the A" strictly the breakdown of the relationship pryer).

[Mrs. John Adams]

Sorry to be blunt, I mean no offense. But I feel the main reason a lot of affairs happen is because the WS is weak willed. If one is not happy with their relationship or marriage, one always has the option to end it before starting a new relationship. If you truly felt your husband did not care about you, and you've tried everything to fix it (counselling, etc), then divorce him, before engaging with someone new. Is that easy to do? Absolutely not. Is it doable? Yes it is. Does it take a strong will to say no to an affair before it starts? Hell yes.

 

I agree with you. But if someone is asking me how i felt...and i am being honest...then i am allowed to tell what i was feeling. It is all well and good to tell me AFTER the fact how i should have handled it. The point now is HOW do i never do it again? and if i don't explore how i got into the mindset the first time...how do i prevent it from ever happening again?

 

But you are right...no one should EVER cheat...for any reason...real or imagined.

 

But they do

 

so now how do we make them better?

[Mrs. John Adams]

How a WS feels about the relationship and the decision to cheat are totally independent of one another.

 

 

The decision to cheat was based on how i felt about our relationship...if i felt there was nothing wrong with our relationship...i would not have made the decision to cheat.

 

See how that works?

 

Are there people who seek affairs for the thrill of the affair? Of course there are. AM i one of them? nope

 

You are still trying to manipulate what i am saying into blame...

 

If my husband and i are in the car and i am driving...and we are talking....and i am distracted...and i hit another car. The officer asks me what happened.

 

Well officer My husband and i were talking and i was distracted and not paying attention so i hit the other car.

 

The accident is my fault...100% my fault. John is not to blame for my accident. However...he was in the car talking to me. He did not CAUSE my accident....I CAUSED the accident. But there was a circumstance leading up to that accident.

 

The points go on MY drivers license...not John's.

[GoldenR]

Going back to the original post, OT said:

 

 

IDK, but at least I would feel like the "shock" of seeing her AP for who he really is wouldn't have her questioning everything like it does today.

 

OT, can you expand on this? My interpretation is that bc he didn't turn out to be the love of her life, that nothing makes sense to her anymore? Is that right?

[understand50]

My last comment on the topic, feels a bit like a hamster wheel. How a WS feels about the relationship and the decision to cheat are totally independent of one another. Sure one could say those feelings made them do it. What about the hungry guy that sells drugs at school? Isn't being hungry a legitimate reason to find a way to feed themselves? What about the guy who feels emasculated by his wife, isnt that a reason he can use to justify being abusive? When does it end, and who gets to decide is a legitimate reason? Everyone who has ever walked the planet has a reason they can use to justify poor behavior. Who's to say which is legitimate? Who's to say what those reasons can justify? Where does some just F**king over another person come into play, where is the personal responsibility? At the end of the day the waywards chose to get involved in an affair. The reasons, in my mind are irrelevant simply because we all have reasons to behave poorly. Why are those reasons relevant when a woman cheats on her husband?

 

On the flipside, those reasons maybe legitimate concerns in the Marriage, things that make one unhappy that need to be addressed. Yet they aren't reasons to behave poor and use them to minimize personal accountability.

 

DKT3,

 

You are trying to separate the person from their emotions and thoughts, from their actions. Can not be done. Look studies have shown that there are folks with a good loving marriage, that cheat. Normally a ONS, but in this case "being selfish", and believing they would never get cought, both feeling and thoughts come into play. Not allowing that a WS, with feeling and thought of neglect, and just plain anger, would play into the whole idea of allowing themselves to cross over into cheating is again strange. The line I have read from many WS, to include MRS JA I think, is "I do not think you would care". Of course, this is not true and proven by subsequent events, but the fact that was one of the idea in their head at the time, was a huge enabling factor.

 

Most married people, who are in a good relationship will not cheat. If, you feel down, unappreciated, Angry at your spouse, or just need validation from someone else, cheating is a real possibility. Still, you need the second part, someone willing to be the AP. In the end the "why" will always be nothing more then "I wonted to, and I could". I think you could also add, "I will not get cought". As a final aside, these thoughts do not give permission, and I would also state in many case, they are false, but when they are there, they have power.

 

My two cents.

[Redhead14]

the social stigma if it becomes public, etc).-- Ah, the proverbial Scarlet Letter that women usually end up wearing, at least more so, than the men in an affair.

 

Cheaters are aware of the possible consequences of their actions and turn a blind eye usually. They have to in order to get the immediate gratification they seek. However, it is their ability to negate/dissociate from that understanding and the associated emotions that would come from being "outted" -- i.e. guilt, embarrassment, shame that is often the root of the issue anyway. Whoever the offended spouse is, is/was married to someone who has a very strong but unhealthy emotional coping skill. You have to wonder whether they were actually "there" in the marriage or if they were just robots living a mechanical and superficial life with their partner anyway.

 

That coping mechanism is basically the same thing that allows criminals to be criminals . . . Not that everyone who has an affair could/would be a criminal (although legally they are breaking the laws of marriage).

Edited August 23, 2017 by Redhead14

[knabe]

I can understand why a man who KNOWS his behavior left his wife starving for validation would be upset by this thread.

[Southern Sun]

I've had this discussion with my WW many times, and, despite hearing her reasoning, I still don't get, in general, how women fall into an A knowing what's almost certain to happen and also knowing that they almost certainly aren't going to get what they want (love/commitment). Men, the situation is different, a lot of men, AP's or not, are more interested in sex, and they will absolutely get that out of an A, so, the goals line up with the actions.

 

[]

 

Simply put, if sex with someone new isn't your goal, getting into an A is almost always the wrong answer. It's still the wrong answer even if your after sex, but, at least then you'll get what you came for. It just stuns me that so many women seem to fall into this, approaching the rate men do, when the repercussions are so much more severe for women (most men D cheating women, most women do not D cheating me; the social stigma if it becomes public, etc).

 

I wish, every day, that I could go back in time and share this stuff with my W. Would it have mattered? IDK, but at least I would feel like the "shock" of seeing her AP for who he really is wouldn't have her questioning everything like it does today. It's sad to see in person, and even sadder when I read dozens of stories about women who really believe their A is different. Sure, perhaps some of them are, just like there will eventually be a story about an EA with physical proximity that wasn't really a PA. But it's a unicorn, it's not something that happens with any regularity, and women, going in, should expect the following as the rules and what will actually happen during the A.

 

Aren't all romantic relationships, at their core, basically about sex?

 

I mean, isn't that what differentiates them from a friendship?

 

I get that you believe OM are cold-hearted predators who premeditate relationships with MWs, get their sex on the side, and ride off into the sunset with no emotions whatsoever. But...with some exceptions I'm sure, I disagree.

 

In general, I do not think people enter into affairs in a calculated fashion. I think they inch towards them, bit by bit, crossing lines, lowering boundaries, sharing intimacies, until they find themselves in an affair.

 

It is certainly different for ONSs, FWBs, FBs...and so on.

 

I think men in these situations quite literally lose all logic. Women do as well. I've heard that women are rational before sex; and men suddenly become rational afterwards (and vice versa - men are completely illogical in their pursuit of sex with someone they want; and women typically lose all rationality afterwards...lol).

 

My original point though was - I think it really is all about sex, for both men and women, even if women can't really get their arms around that. Well...and love/acceptance, since they go together like peanut butter and jelly.

 

Women are motivated to have sex for different reasons than men. But we all have the same evolutionary drive. In an affair, our courtship behavior is very similar to outside an affair. Men do what they do to get what they want; women respond to the man and give what they want in order to get what they want.

 

I know you think the woman is not getting what she wants. But guess what? We want sex too. We want good sex. And the man in the affair is motivated to give good sex. He's also motivated to romance us and pursue us and make us feel good. There is a positive feedback loop going on that we might not have experienced in a while. And he's feeling that too, cold as you might think he is.

 

To be desired, pursued, made love to, f'd (with passion), looked at with burning lust, complimented...those are things women want. Men too! Yeah, we liked to be listened to, accepted for who we are, all that. But we want the good stuff. Doesn't that sound like sex?

 

Maybe we call it attention. Affection. But I kind of think we use those words because we need those things to GET TO THE GOODS. We can't just let our man come at us with the other stuff unless we feel good about the relationship. Unless we feel pursued and attended to.

 

You seem to think we want commitment from the OM, but that's not usually the case, at least not at first. We already have commitment. So having the OM come in and say he wants us for himself, that's like, crap! I'm already married! We just need him to be happy with the affair.

 

The problem is...this can change over time. As emotions for the MW get involved, she can get a little TOO invested. That's why women leave for their AP more often than men do. But it is typically not the original intention.

[Overtaxed]

Aren't all romantic relationships, at their core, basically about sex?

 

I mean, isn't that what differentiates them from a friendship?

 

I get that you believe OM are cold-hearted predators who premeditate relationships with MWs, get their sex on the side, and ride off into the sunset with no emotions whatsoever. But...with some exceptions I'm sure, I disagree.

 

In general, I do not think people enter into affairs in a calculated fashion. I think they inch towards them, bit by bit, crossing lines, lowering boundaries, sharing intimacies, until they find themselves in an affair.

 

OK, let me preface this response with "I know I'm not like most people". But, I am like some people, I know other people like me, and I have to believe that the people who think like me are far more likely to engage in A behavior. I've never had an A, so, maybe it really is different in an A vs a typical relationship. But, I'll relate my experience.

 

I've never entered into a romantic or sexual relationship without intention. Never. I've always had clear intention when I met a women "I'd like to sleep with her" and tried to carry that intention through. I've never "slid into" a relationship, it was always a very deliberate and thought out act. And, I suppose, I think that most other men work this way. If I wanted to get with a woman, I built a plan, figured out a way to meet her/talk to her/spend time with her and then escalated the interaction as time went on. That's just how I operated, because the "falling into a relationship" thing didn't work for me, I never was friendly with women I wanted to be romantic with, so I had to actively seek it out.

 

I think my experience is more common that some women may think, women get hit on often, it's easy to "fall into" a relationship as a woman. For men, it's typically different, it's an active thing, you have to purse someone and intend to become sexual with them, not "wait for it to happen" because, in many cases, it never will.

 

Do all OM follow this track? No, I'm sure they don't. My W's did though, and I understand it, they worked together for years, I'm sure the entire time him hoping she'd "fall into" a relationship with him. Never happened, not until he actively started his pursuit.

 

I think your description above is perfect for how many women and a few men fall into an A. But I think many more men do premeditate this, I know friends of mine do (actively seek it out), and I know my wife's AP did. And I think it's more common than not, honestly, I can't see myself getting into an A any other way (other than pursuing a woman).

[JohnAdams]

OT, I will admit that I dated Mrs. JA without intention. I really did not think of having sex with her. We met and in reality, she kind of asked me out. We did not even kiss for 2 months, 3 months for sex and 5 months to get engaged. So, yea in this case, I think I just kind of fell into a relationship I was not looking for. If I look back, a lot of it was not really a traditional pursuit.

 

In the case of my RA, yes I persued her. Kind of strange also, and I will not get into all the details, but I think I wanted to see if I could get someone. In my mind through my wife's words I was not desirable. So, I think I had to prove something to myself. I really did not need to have sex, just to know I could have if I wanted was all the conquest I needed. Probably does not make sense but that is what happened.

Edited August 23, 2017 by JohnAdams

[knabe]

So, OT....what is your goal. You have a goal. You just said you do everything with intent.

 

What made you post in THIS particular forum knowing exactly what most of the BY here would say?

[elaine567]

But I think many more men do premeditate this, I know friends of mine do (actively seek it out), and I know my wife's AP did. And I think it's more common than not, honestly, I can't see myself getting into an A any other way (other than pursuing a woman).

 

OK you NEED to think your wife was relentlessly pursued and maybe she was, but women in general are not passive little flowers waiting to be picked.

Some women, even the supposedly quiet and shy ones, can know exactly what they want and can do whatever it takes to get a man interested.

 

As a man of the world you must be aware of women giving you the "go" signals, so I am unsure why you think men are solely to blame for affairs when the OW/MW may have been "working on him" for weeks/months/ years... until he finally got the message and went into pursuit mode...

 

That it is the problem with affairs, the BS wants to demonise the AP and sanctify their WS, and that does tend to work to a certain extent, but there are always "unanswered" questions and the real truth may be difficult to ascertain...

[GoldenR]

the BS wants to demonise the AP and sanctify their WS

 

Not me....I think this Christmas that I'll be sending a fruit basket to my XWW's AP, along with a "Thank you" note.

[wmacbride]

I know it is really a bitter pill to swallow, but no one who didn't want to be in an affair gets into one.

 

The excuse of " he/she was pursuing me and I had to give in" doesn't make any sense. Of course you can say no. If you feel that you can't, then go to the police, hr department if it's in your workplace, etc.

 

The sample fact is that almost everyone in an affair is right where they want to be, and that is very painful for a bs.

 

Does this mean the ws and ow/om will always cheat/ get involved with someone who's married? Of course not, but unless that person figures out what it is in them that allowed them to see cheating as an acceptable option, there is high risk it could re-occur.