When NC is not possible

[Vivir]

I feel like HBroken posted here hoping to gain some insight into what his XOW is feeling, thinking or her motives behind the breakup.

 

Instead he is now looking inwards and expressing his own feelings and examining how he feels. His hurt, love and anger.

 

That can only be a good thing.

 

I wholeheartedly agree, Doublegold. LoveShack is a sounding board for so many who are or have been involved in this triangle. What HBroken is currently going through is the process leading to the other side. No way around it, only through it. And it can be especially painful and frustrating - as we're witnessing in his postings.

 

Vivir and Deadsoul are two of the most thoughtful, helpful posters on LS. Hbroken, I hope that you read their words and take as much comfort from their help as I have.

 

Just wanted to thank you, BreakingWave, for the compliment

[elaine567]

Just realise the MM has his own turmoil to face and it doesn't necessarily follow that he is all bad and the OW all pure and good -

 

Yes, but what it usually boils down to is that the OW usually invests everything into the affair and that she is usually "honest" in her love, and she is usually ready and willing to move the affair into reality, he is her "one and only", whereas the MM is the one stalling, the one vacillating, the one who ultimately will not leave his wife despite all his protestations of love for the OW, the one when the chips fall will throw his OW under the proverbial bus.

 

It is therefore easy to vilify the MM as he IS the one who promised so much and did not deliver, he IS the one who lied to both, he IS the coward, he IS the cake eater, he IS therefore the natural "cad and the scoundrel"...

 

OWs are not angels by any means, they do a lot of damage to marriages, but they do tend to love their MM, and they are the ones who tend to get very hurt in the fallout, so are the natural "victims"...

 

In your case you were dealing with a MW, and some of them are more akin to the archetypal MM, as opposed to the OW actually.

[sandylee1]

Thanks:-)

 

 

Here is how I see it

I care for my wife as a friend

I care for my OW as a lover

If society didn't exist I would want to live with my ow and remain friends with my wife

 

Maybe your wife would also choose to do this too.

 

 

...

I am sure most MM feel the same way

I know many OW seem to blame the MM for everything they are enduring but truthfully the only thing you can control in life is yourselves... If you are not happy in where you are in life, take responsibility and do something about it... The MM isn't holding you in a physical prison... You have full freedom to choose what you want in life...

 

 

Yet when your OW released herself from the prison, you're angry with her.

 

I do agree with you that MM gets a lot of blame and I think that is unfair. I find many OW refuse to take responsibility for their pain.

 

As though MM is the big bad wolf. No he isn't. He's just a man wanting the best of both worlds.

 

You get involved with a MM and you bring the hurt on yourself.......neither party has any business falling in love.....so if and when you do....be prepared for heartache.

 

One thing you said here caught my eye. You're keeping your wife in a marriage where you just see her a friend...how is that fair?

 

If your OW hadn't ended it, you'd have happily continued for another 5 years...

[Southwardbound]

Isn't it funny (not funny ha ha but funny interesting) that Hbroken has become all of us other women's stand in MM. We project our own experience with our MM onto him and want to pick his brain about every single solitary thing just looking for any perspective or answers.

 

Also strange that your responses Hbroken are kind of all over the place just as with our own situations. One minute you say the affair was over anyway and you were so fine with that. The next minute you say you're still in love and would be with her if it wasn't for your "cowardice". Then you're mad at HER which I don't think any of us understand. I mean, she left her man to make herself available and you STILL didn't want to take the next step to be with her. So she finally got sick of it and ended it.

 

Now she has to work with you when it's got to be killing her inside and you're over here saying you're mad at her and expecting her to leave her job.

 

It seems like you really are angry that you lost your plaything. Nobody to make you feel like a sex beast. Yes, your ego does play a huge part. Absolutely. But then in another sentence you'll say you would've been with her if you wouldn't have been too cowardly (you say) to leave your wife.

 

So it's frustrating for us. (Maybe I'm just speaking for myself I don't know) We are dying to know what makes you tick because you're as close as we're going to get to getting some answers.

 

I'm not trying to be rude or come down on you. I genuinely want to know how you feel about things. What kind of thoughts are going through your head. The truth about how you feel at this point.

 

Keep posting.

 

Yes I want to know, too.

 

Heartbroken - do you ever categorize your relationship as 'not real?'

[K.K.]

Thank you Hbroken for responding to my post. It made me feel better for some reason. In my case and maybe some others here, it's how we would want our MM to feel about it- that it was a hard choice. Not that it was that we were being used just for sex. I can almost hear the same thoughts going through my MM's head as you said you were going through yours.

 

He made the same choice you did.

 

It's tough, ya know. The whole thing. If I had any advice to give I would say that to keep in mind that she's probably barely holding it together at work so don't be mad at her. That's not really fair.

 

Thanks again and I don't wish for you to be hurting. I really don't.

[K.K.]

 

Heartbroken - do you ever categorize your relationship as 'not real?'

 

I would love to know this too!

[ladydesigner]

Thanks:-)

Here is how I see it

I care for my wife as a friend

I care for my OW as a lover

If society didn't exist I would want to live with my ow and remain friends with my wife

As society does exist and kids do exist I have to make a choice

Leaving my wife would be a huge undertaking without even really knowing whether what I am heading to is just a mirage or not - would I just be going into the same relationship with my OW? Or would it be much better than what I have now? And would I really be happy once the initial honeymoon period is over without the kids and having caused so much upheaval? These are real dilemmas which suffocate me daily...

Do I feel good about lying and cheating? No!

Do I want to do the right thing? Yes!

do I know what the right thing is? Probably to be on my own for a while

Am I strong enough to do the right thing? Not yet... Esp because of kids...

I am sure most MM feel the same way

I know many OW seem to blame the MM for everything they are enduring but truthfully the only thing you can control in life is yourselves... If you are not happy in where you are in life, take responsibility and do something about it... The MM isn't holding you in a physical prison... You have full freedom to choose what you want in life... Just realise the MM has his own turmoil to face and it doesn't necessarily follow that he is all bad and the OW all pure and good - we are all flawed and we all need time and courage to face our battles and this courage comes with time, discontentment and support rather than from shame and judgement

 

I think you should tell your wife this and see what she thinks of it.

[Hbroken]

I think you should tell your wife this and see what she thinks of it.

Thanks for the wonderfully insightful advice

[Hbroken]

Yet when your OW released herself from the prison, you're angry with her.

 

I do agree with you that MM gets a lot of blame and I think that is unfair. I find many OW refuse to take responsibility for their pain.

 

As though MM is the big bad wolf. No he isn't. He's just a man wanting the best of both worlds.

 

You get involved with a MM and you bring the hurt on yourself.......neither party has any business falling in love.....so if and when you do....be prepared for heartache.

 

One thing you said here caught my eye. You're keeping your wife in a marriage where you just see her a friend...how is that fair?

 

If your OW hadn't ended it, you'd have happily continued for another 5 years...

 

Anger is an inevitable emotion in grief..would you rather think that I/ your MM were indifferent when you releas yourself from the prison?

[Hbroken]

I would love to know this too!

 

Yes I don't think it real because in 5 years the actual volume of time we spent together was probably less than a couple of months worth... You only spend stolen moments here and there ... How does one know whether it would be the same if you were with the person 24/7

[What_Did_I_Do]

Anger is an inevitable emotion in grief..would you rather think that I/ your MM were indifferent when you releas yourself from the prison?

 

HB....your story, this brought me to tears. You are all over the map like the rest of us. Thank you for sharing your pain and anger and confusion. I was under the illusion that the xMM (xMW) happily re-engages with their spouse and lives full, complete lives whilst not caring in the slightest what their former AP might be feeling or thinking. We will soldier on in this battle....

[Doublegold]

Yes I don't think it real because in 5 years the actual volume of time we spent together was probably less than a couple of months worth... You only spend stolen moments here and there ... How does one know whether it would be the same if you were with the person 24/7

 

 

Human connections are real. An affair might not be "authentic" in the eyes of society, but the passion and, for some, love are real.

 

 

Time and space are not the barometers for a deep connection on a true level.

 

 

People can live and co-exist for 25 years in the same home and find out the person they thought they knew is "The Stranger beside Me".

 

 

I am not discounting your point about not having spent enough hard time with your XAP to know how compatible you truly were for a future together--but I think we both know you fit in a way that meant something. Five years is a long time to be in an affair with someone. A very long time. It was real.

 

 

I remember discussing my marriage with a friend who is an X-DA in the City. He said-- 25 years-- people commit murder and do less time.

Time is relevant to marriages also, and a five year affair tells me that you have an unfulfilled one, at best.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Doublegold

[Bittersweetie]

Thanks for the wonderfully insightful advice

 

Were you being sarcastic with ladydesigner? I am not sure. Because she has a valid point. Ideally you have placed OW in the role of lover, and Wife in the role of friend. Which you have a right to do. But doesn't Wife also have the right to know what her role is in your life? How would Wife feel if she knew you were in love with someone else? That you spent five years with OW? Because the truth is you have not treated EITHER woman fairly. Do you have a daughter? How would you feel if she was being treated like you are treating these women? Or would you be fine with your son being with two women like you have been?

 

I am asking these questions not to be a jerk but to get you thinking outside your box. Being in an affair makes everything about oneself (even though one doesn't think see it that way). The only way to break free from the selfishness is to start thinking of the others who are affected by one's actions. I got to that point through a d-day and it was horrific. I am in so much of a better place now, living honestly and authentically, than I ever was in the affair. I thought I was in heaven during the affair but now I see it was a hell I created for myself, a hell for my husband too.

 

Good luck.

[knabe]

Thanks for the wonderfully insightful advice

 

It's good to know you see the wisdom of that advice. Because that is the crux of it.

 

What kind of man do you want to be?

[sandylee1]

Anger is an inevitable emotion in grief..would you rather think that I/ your MM were indifferent when you releas yourself from the prison?

 

I'd be pissed off if I knew MM was angry with me and think how dare he.

[ladydesigner]

Were you being sarcastic with ladydesigner? I am not sure. Because she has a valid point. Ideally you have placed OW in the role of lover, and Wife in the role of friend. Which you have a right to do. But doesn't Wife also have the right to know what her role is in your life? How would Wife feel if she knew you were in love with someone else? That you spent five years with OW? Because the truth is you have not treated EITHER woman fairly. Do you have a daughter? How would you feel if she was being treated like you are treating these women? Or would you be fine with your son being with two women like you have been?

 

I am asking these questions not to be a jerk but to get you thinking outside your box. Being in an affair makes everything about oneself (even though one doesn't think see it that way). The only way to break free from the selfishness is to start thinking of the others who are affected by one's actions. I got to that point through a d-day and it was horrific. I am in so much of a better place now, living honestly and authentically, than I ever was in the affair. I thought I was in heaven during the affair but now I see it was a hell I created for myself, a hell for my husband too.

 

Good luck.

 

Thank you Bittersweetie you knew why I said what I did. Hbroken I'm not sure you realize that I'm not just a BS on this site, I originally came here as a MOW having an A with an OM. I do have some experience with being on both sides of this fence.

 

I think you are stuck on grieving your OW which is normal, but at some point you will need to make a decision about your M and your wife. You do owe her that much.

Edited September 19, 2017 by ladydesigner

[Hbroken]

Thank you Bittersweetie you knew why I said what I did. Hbroken I'm not sure you realize that I'm not just a BS on this site, I originally came here as a MOW having an A with an OM. I do have some experience with being on both sides of this fence.

 

I think you are stuck on grieving your OW which is normal, but at some point you will need to make a decision about your M and your wife. You do owe her that much.

 

Finally some clarity... My OW rang me yesterday and basically told me that she was seeing someone else and this was why she dumped me by text... This is about 2 months after breaking up with her long term bf (who was giving her a rather tough time) and I think she had already seeing this guy casually before she broke up with me... And this now makes so much more sense which now allows me to move on... Here are the txts she sent me today

 

I just want to say I'm sorry ?

I feel bad

I just felt so horrendous back in March/April that I flipped a switch and just needed to not think about any stress or any of the crap

And I feel bad about moving on so quickly but I just wanted some uncomplicated attention, distraction. I just wanna be the apple of someone's eye and everything has been so hard and horrible that I just haven't thought of anyone else

Well I have- that's a lie but I just basically try block it out

 

 

 

:-) mwa... It's ok you know... You have a right to want to be loved and feel free.. You are only human... There's really nothing to feel bad about... I am happy for you.. I am happy that you have found love and courage and a new happier loving life... You know that there is something I never knew I was capable of until I met you and that was this idea of unconditional love... To love someone without any expectation or reciprocation...its a really hard thing to do but I think that's how I feel about you... I have loved you unconditionally and I suppose the greatest form of love is to be able to set someone free..

 

 

 

Thank you. ?

 

I mean it's early days I'm just comfortable and it's nice- and it may well not pan out but its uncomplicated (even with a 200 mile gap)

Anyway I miss you loads, as a friend as much as anything

 

Hope you have a good day.

[freengreen]

Thanks for the wonderfully insightful advice

easy......

[freengreen]

Were you being sarcastic with ladydesigner? I am not sure. Because she has a valid point. Ideally you have placed OW in the role of lover, and Wife in the role of friend. Which you have a right to do. But doesn't Wife also have the right to know what her role is in your life? How would Wife feel if she knew you were in love with someone else? That you spent five years with OW? Because the truth is you have not treated EITHER woman fairly. Do you have a daughter? How would you feel if she was being treated like you are treating these women? Or would you be fine with your son being with two women like you have been?

 

I am asking these questions not to be a jerk but to get you thinking outside your box. Being in an affair makes everything about oneself (even though one doesn't think see it that way). The only way to break free from the selfishness is to start thinking of the others who are affected by one's actions. I got to that point through a d-day and it was horrific. I am in so much of a better place now, living honestly and authentically, than I ever was in the affair. I thought I was in heaven during the affair but now I see it was a hell I created for myself, a hell for my husband too.

 

Good luck.

THIS^

 

This was the ONLY thought that got me all this way.... right from me getting 'connected' to Tove Lo's Timebomb song to a point where I realised that I must stop being such a coward and selfish person... then my self induced DDay followed. Horrific but I am greatful for the DDay now.

 

Did I hijack the thread?...

[ladydesigner]

Finally some clarity... My OW rang me yesterday and basically told me that she was seeing someone else and this was why she dumped me by text... This is about 2 months after breaking up with her long term bf (who was giving her a rather tough time) and I think she had already seeing this guy casually before she broke up with me... And this now makes so much more sense which now allows me to move on... Here are the txts she sent me today

 

I just want to say I'm sorry ?

I feel bad

I just felt so horrendous back in March/April that I flipped a switch and just needed to not think about any stress or any of the crap

And I feel bad about moving on so quickly but I just wanted some uncomplicated attention, distraction. I just wanna be the apple of someone's eye and everything has been so hard and horrible that I just haven't thought of anyone else

Well I have- that's a lie but I just basically try block it out

 

 

 

:-) mwa... It's ok you know... You have a right to want to be loved and feel free.. You are only human... There's really nothing to feel bad about... I am happy for you.. I am happy that you have found love and courage and a new happier loving life... You know that there is something I never knew I was capable of until I met you and that was this idea of unconditional love... To love someone without any expectation or reciprocation...its a really hard thing to do but I think that's how I feel about you... I have loved you unconditionally and I suppose the greatest form of love is to be able to set someone free..

 

 

 

Thank you. ?

 

I mean it's early days I'm just comfortable and it's nice- and it may well not pan out but its uncomplicated (even with a 200 mile gap)

Anyway I miss you loads, as a friend as much as anything

 

Hope you have a good day.

 

I'm glad you got the clarity you were looking for. What will you do now as far a your focus goes? I think it is excellent you are in therapy exploring your thoughts.

 

Honestly I wish the best of luck to you and your wife. I hope you both find the happiness you deserve!

 

Will you go NC at this point? What if your xAP's relationship doesn't work out and she contacts you again will you respond?

 

Also have you ever read 'Not Just Friends' by Shirley Glass. It is a really good read for married waywards like myself and my husband.

[Superluminal]

Hbroken...how do you feel knowing that she has someone else? What are you going to do now?

[Hbroken]

Hbroken...how do you feel knowing that she has someone else? What are you going to do now?

 

 

kind of liberated...I know that sounds strange....but I do...I feel ok...even good...it somewhat scares me that there maybe another set of negative emotions coming my way but at the mo it feels fine

 

my anger and resentment and my helplessness about not knowing has gone

I feel I have grieved as I should have

I feel that I have grown out of the process

I feel I have lost my ego and this has been really good

 

somewhere I was scared that she was free and I was trapped... but now I think I am the one who is free and she is trapped (because she has simply shifted her focus to another relationship and not addressed any of her own issues/pain/grief)...she really wants to be friends (she rang me to tell me this too) which I already see as a betrayal to her new relationship...I am gonna try and minimise contact because it now feels over for me

 

I am enjoying the new me... I have stopped being fearful...and I was really fearful that she'd find someone new and I wouldn't know how to deal with it but now I know it happened so long ago, I can't understand why I was so fearful...

 

happy and content with the person I have become from this process and thats about it... hopefully soon I will start addressing my home life... and hopefully that will also see out its natural outcome..not sure what that is...

[BourneWicked]

Hbroken - I hope you're doing okay! Sounds like good closure

 

So interesting that thought of unconditional love. And really... very sweet. That's how I feel about my MM. For me, I'm slowly coming to realize that my MM reminds me a little bit of my wayward father, only a much better, kinder person. I feel the same; I will never wish him harm, I think of him like I think of my child. I want only the best for him.

 

For this reason - because I care about him like I do my child - the affair should end. Both ways - for him, for me. But anyway, as endings to affairs go, that's beautiful.

 

More importantly - how are you feeling?

[Doublegold]

Finally some clarity... My OW rang me yesterday and basically told me that she was seeing someone else and this was why she dumped me by text... This is about 2 months after breaking up with her long term bf (who was giving her a rather tough time) and I think she had already seeing this guy casually before she broke up with me... And this now makes so much more sense which now allows me to move on... Here are the txts she sent me today

 

I just want to say I'm sorry ?

I feel bad

I just felt so horrendous back in March/April that I flipped a switch and just needed to not think about any stress or any of the crap

And I feel bad about moving on so quickly but I just wanted some uncomplicated attention, distraction. I just wanna be the apple of someone's eye and everything has been so hard and horrible that I just haven't thought of anyone else

Well I have- that's a lie but I just basically try block it out

 

 

 

:-) mwa... It's ok you know... You have a right to want to be loved and feel free.. You are only human... There's really nothing to feel bad about... I am happy for you.. I am happy that you have found love and courage and a new happier loving life... You know that there is something I never knew I was capable of until I met you and that was this idea of unconditional love... To love someone without any expectation or reciprocation...its a really hard thing to do but I think that's how I feel about you... I have loved you unconditionally and I suppose the greatest form of love is to be able to set someone free..

 

 

 

Thank you. ?

 

I mean it's early days I'm just comfortable and it's nice- and it may well not pan out but its uncomplicated (even with a 200 mile gap)

Anyway I miss you loads, as a friend as much as anything

 

Hope you have a good day.

 

This is really nice and sweet. But you two are going to miss each other long time.

[Darren Steez]

 

Will you go NC at this point? What if your xAP's relationship doesn't work out and she contacts you again will you respond?

 

 

Oh course he will because he wrote this winner

I never knew I was capable of until I met you and that was this idea of unconditional love... To love someone without any expectation or reciprocation...its a really hard thing to do but I think that's how I feel about you... I have loved you unconditionally and I suppose the greatest form of love is to be able to set someone free

 

 

Labelling yourself as some kind of martyr for love..notice they both did that..her (basically cheating on two guys then dumping them for a third) and him cheating on his wife and finding this great unconditional love..who then cheated and dumped him..

 

They both left it open ended, so yes the martyr of true love and the woman just wanting her prince will cheat again.