When xMM moves on to another OW

[jah526]

FOO issues... I believe there was narcissism in my family. From what I've read, the narcissistic parent often makes one child the golden child and another the scapegoat. Let's just say I wasn't the golden child. I was, however, a "good girl" - pretty much bent over backwards trying to do everything right, and in the end nothing was ever good enough.

 

It's probably why being with men who don't really accept me as I am feels normal to me. I keep striving for that carrot, for that one day when they'll finally say I'm good enough, that I'm accepted. If I don't have to fight to win someone's approval it somehow doesn't seem worthwhile to me.

 

I'm trying to be aware of this tendency because I actually do have people in my life who love and accept me as I am and I often find myself overlooking this. I'm trying to be more conscious of this, and nurture these good relationships.

 

Yes, the potential replacement... it's what finally got me out of it too. I knew I wouldn't be able to withstand that blow to my ego, so I got out. The drama still plays out in my mind though, and that may take a while to subside. I am trying though.

 

One thing I've learned through all this - you may think you are strong enough to handle things. You are not. This pull is very powerful, and the only way really to avoid being sucked in is to avoid it altogether.

[elaine567]

FOO issues... I believe there was narcissism in my family. From what I've read, the narcissistic parent often makes one child the golden child and another the scapegoat. Let's just say I wasn't the golden child. I was, however, a "good girl" - pretty much bent over backwards trying to do everything right, and in the end nothing was ever good enough.

 

It's probably why being with men who don't really accept me as I am feels normal to me. I keep striving for that carrot, for that one day when they'll finally say I'm good enough, that I'm accepted. If I don't have to fight to win someone's approval it somehow doesn't seem worthwhile to me.

 

I'm trying to be aware of this tendency because I actually do have people in my life who love and accept me as I am and I often find myself overlooking this. I'm trying to be more conscious of this, and nurture these good relationships.

 

 

There are other roles too and one is the lost child.

If you were the "good kid" who nobody really took notice of, then maybe you are "a lost child".

 

The Lost Child

The Lost Child is usually known as “the quiet one” or “the dreamer”. The Lost Child is the invisible child. They try to escape the family situation by making themselves very small and quiet. (S)He stays out of the way of problems and spends a lot of time alone. The purpose of having a lost child in the family is similar to that of The Hero. Because The Lost Child is rarely in trouble, the family can say, “He’s a good kid. Everything seems fine in his life, so things can’t be too bad in the family.”

This child avoids interactions with other family members and basically disappears. They become loners, or are very shy. The Lost Child seeks the privacy of his or her own company to be away from the family chaos. Because they don’t interact, they never have a chance to develop important social and communication skills. The Lost Child often has poor communication skills, difficulties with intimacy and in forming relationships. They deny that they have any feelings and "don't bother getting upset." They deal with reality by withdrawing from it.

In an NPD family, The Lost Child just doesn't seem to matter to the narcissist, and avoids conflict by keeping a low profile. They are not perceived as a threat or a good source of supply, but they are usually victim of neglect and emotional abuse.

Dysfunctional Family Roles ? Out of the Storm

[freengreen]

I guess what I'm struggling with the most is how people can hurt others, only think of themselves, and be able to sleep soundly at night. And not only that - have others think highly of them. This isn't the only area of my life where this is happening, and it's making me crazy.

 

I think it's hard to try to live a life of integrity when as the MM used to say, "everyone else is doing it".

I will tell you whats happening with me right now...

 

Gosh theres this old friend of mine who I discovered in our social party. Yes we were good friends at school but I actually forgot all about it as it was just a 2 yr period and its been a decade+ outta school.

 

I have absolutely NO intention to entertain him... nope, after all I went thru. I just keep a normal relation but I like his wife but still, I keep it minimal coz I am just over cautious now.

 

This guy has been texting me over and over again, I had ignored his texts and given him clues that i aint into small talk. He refuses to get it. I aint afraid to tell ‘dude please slow down’ without coating but it will happen soon.

 

Now, what I have been feeling is the feeling where the other person is showing the signs of hook up and I try avoid them. I have done this before but NOW is different because now I feel this is what my xMM had felt ... It makes me sad because I know I now got no respect for this person and I am giving him frivolous replies in vague intervals.... for a period of time my xMM did the same thing with me... He should have had no respect for me, now I get it in full view ( well i knew it).

 

BUT

 

I am a better person than him in this case because he never wanted me but kept me stringing with his few good boost messages to get material stuff outta me ( I spent some £800+ on him..well). I AM NOT that flimsy , I have never been. It amazes me as well like you on how a person can play with other so callously just to get what they want even thou they dont want them

around or love or respect them. Its like purely exploiting their weak feeling over you.

 

I will never go down to that level... I am busy shooing this one... politely or otherwise. When I dont want him, I dont want ANYTHING from him.

 

Sorry put my own story but wanted you to know that I was also wondering on these players.

[BourneWicked]

FOO issues... I believe there was narcissism in my family. From what I've read, the narcissistic parent often makes one child the golden child and another the scapegoat. Let's just say I wasn't the golden child. I was, however, a "good girl" - pretty much bent over backwards trying to do everything right, and in the end nothing was ever good enough.

 

It's probably why being with men who don't really accept me as I am feels normal to me. I keep striving for that carrot, for that one day when they'll finally say I'm good enough, that I'm accepted. If I don't have to fight to win someone's approval it somehow doesn't seem worthwhile to me.

 

I'm trying to be aware of this tendency because I actually do have people in my life who love and accept me as I am and I often find myself overlooking this. I'm trying to be more conscious of this, and nurture these good relationships.

 

Yes, the potential replacement... it's what finally got me out of it too. I knew I wouldn't be able to withstand that blow to my ego, so I got out. The drama still plays out in my mind though, and that may take a while to subside. I am trying though.

 

One thing I've learned through all this - you may think you are strong enough to handle things. You are not. This pull is very powerful, and the only way really to avoid being sucked in is to avoid it altogether.

 

Your post resonates with me so much, and your FOO issues are similar to mine. Narcissism was pretty rampant for my father, but my memories are minimal of him. Apparently I remember him enough that I've managed to summon up an image of his personality and looks, though in a kinder, more handsome and successful package.

 

Affairs pull this stuff up like dredging bodies from the river bottom. I thought I was well past all these issues from my childhood, but clearly I just buried them.

 

This LC is awful. I'm struggling right now. Sometimes I feel fine - and I'm very good at not initiating contact - but others he's all I think about.

 

Keeping busy... hope you are too!

[jah526]

Your post resonates with me so much, and your FOO issues are similar to mine. Narcissism was pretty rampant for my father, but my memories are minimal of him. Apparently I remember him enough that I've managed to summon up an image of his personality and looks, though in a kinder, more handsome and successful package.

 

Affairs pull this stuff up like dredging bodies from the river bottom. I thought I was well past all these issues from my childhood, but clearly I just buried them.

 

This LC is awful. I'm struggling right now. Sometimes I feel fine - and I'm very good at not initiating contact - but others he's all I think about.

 

Keeping busy... hope you are too!

 

I think it's so hard because it feels like losing that one central figure in our lives all over again. A few weeks ago I decided I needed to get some help and have started seeing a counselor again. I think it's helping just to have someone listen in a compassionate way, outside of my friends and family, whom I've already burdened too much.

 

I think of the ups and downs like waves in the ocean during a storm. Right now you're in the middle of it and the waves are tossing you around, but they're going to get smaller and gentler if you keep on going. The goal is to find that calm water and an even keel. Forgive yourself for the lapses and just keep moving forward. You will be ok.

[Sparkling Storm]

My MM told me recently that he is struggling so much with the end of our A that he has started to confide in a female friend via messenger. He doesn't seem to realise that this could very well lead him straight into a new EA! He said that would never happen because he'd never do this again - this was the first and last A for both of us. BUT the kicker was that he said he wouldn't go there anyway because she's about to get married. Er...hello?! I'm married. You're married. Boundaries don't seem to be your biggest problem, you idiot.

 

The annoying thing is that I felt horribly jealous. And I know he saw that. Cue more self loathing for me...

[kittencupcake]

My MM told me recently that he is struggling so much with the end of our A that he has started to confide in a female friend via messenger. He doesn't seem to realise that this could very well lead him straight into a new EA! He said that would never happen because he'd never do this again - this was the first and last A for both of us. BUT the kicker was that he said he wouldn't go there anyway because she's about to get married. Er...hello?! I'm married. You're married. Boundaries don't seem to be your biggest problem, you idiot.

 

The annoying thing is that I felt horribly jealous. And I know he saw that. Cue more self loathing for me...

 

This behavior is called fishing. He's trying to suck you back in. Stay strong!

[freengreen]

My MM told me recently that he is struggling so much with the end of our A that he has started to confide in a female friend via messenger. He doesn't seem to realise that this could very well lead him straight into a new EA! He said that would never happen because he'd never do this again - this was the first and last A for both of us. BUT the kicker was that he said he wouldn't go there anyway because she's about to get married. Er...hello?! I'm married. You're married. Boundaries don't seem to be your biggest problem, you idiot.

 

The annoying thing is that I felt horribly jealous. And I know he saw that. Cue more self loathing for me...

 

He managed to find a women to confide in within 4 days of NC?... their ability to hook on is immense , these MMs < shakes head>

Edited October 11, 2017 by freengreen

[BourneWicked]

I will tell you whats happening with me right now...

 

Gosh theres this old friend of mine who I discovered in our social party. Yes we were good friends at school but I actually forgot all about it as it was just a 2 yr period and its been a decade+ outta school.

 

I have absolutely NO intention to entertain him... nope, after all I went thru. I just keep a normal relation but I like his wife but still, I keep it minimal coz I am just over cautious now.

 

This guy has been texting me over and over again, I had ignored his texts and given him clues that i aint into small talk. He refuses to get it. I aint afraid to tell ‘dude please slow down’ without coating but it will happen soon.

 

Now, what I have been feeling is the feeling where the other person is showing the signs of hook up and I try avoid them. I have done this before but NOW is different because now I feel this is what my xMM had felt ... It makes me sad because I know I now got no respect for this person and I am giving him frivolous replies in vague intervals.... for a period of time my xMM did the same thing with me... He should have had no respect for me, now I get it in full view ( well i knew it).

 

BUT

 

I am a better person than him in this case because he never wanted me but kept me stringing with his few good boost messages to get material stuff outta me ( I spent some £800+ on him..well). I AM NOT that flimsy , I have never been. It amazes me as well like you on how a person can play with other so callously just to get what they want even thou they dont want them

around or love or respect them. Its like purely exploiting their weak feeling over you.

 

I will never go down to that level... I am busy shooing this one... politely or otherwise. When I dont want him, I dont want ANYTHING from him.

 

Sorry put my own story but wanted you to know that I was also wondering on these players.

 

 

 

About this - I think that when you're unclear about yourself, or about your value, you give certain signals that attract these kind of menfolk.

 

But yeah. The point is - know your value. Know what you're worth. Know what's important to you, and what you will and won't settle for.

 

What you say about people playing each other just to see what they can get... it's true. Most of us have flaws, waiting for others to exploit. But this is the true sign that someone isn't worth your time. When you realize that they're pushing a button that only they can see. The kind person unravels that and helps you heal; the time thieves and the narcissists use it to make themselves feel better.

[BourneWicked]

I think it's so hard because it feels like losing that one central figure in our lives all over again. A few weeks ago I decided I needed to get some help and have started seeing a counselor again. I think it's helping just to have someone listen in a compassionate way, outside of my friends and family, whom I've already burdened too much.

 

I think of the ups and downs like waves in the ocean during a storm. Right now you're in the middle of it and the waves are tossing you around, but they're going to get smaller and gentler if you keep on going. The goal is to find that calm water and an even keel. Forgive yourself for the lapses and just keep moving forward. You will be ok.

 

Thanks for this.. that's exactly what it is. There was a moment when he left that I relived age five again, where my father disappeared from my life. Really, having that moment was almost helpful... I relived that pain and did the same kind of splitting/separation I must have had to do 20+ years ago. It's not really healthy, per se, just repetition of what I already know.

 

I'm glad you started counseling. I had a couple false starts, but I'm going to try again. I think it's what I need; it's just my serious trust issues make it hard to even find someone to console with in a small town.

 

The LC is pretty sketchy... he contacts me a little, but it's mostly just friendly, work-related conversation. I think I've hit a point where I realize there's nothing here for me. No future. No anything.

 

Here's a Practical Magic quote for good measure. Tis the season. :

 

“Do you ever just put your arms out and just spin and spin and spin? Well, that's what love is like; everything inside of you tells you to stop before you fall, but for some reason you just keep going.”

 

Oh and while I'm at it, let's throw in some mis-attributed Shakespeare. This is why it's so difficult, so sad, even when it's nothing at all:

 

"Of all the words of tongue or pen, the saddest are these: it might have been."

 

Anyway, I have good days and bad days. Today is not a great one, but I think tomorrow will be better. And each day after that, as the distance sets in....

[jah526]

I am still so confused. I deal with people everyday who are just crappy people. They're mean and hurtful, but at least you know that they are.

 

But this guy... he was a soft touch. He shielded me from these others and was my safe harbor. His words were soothing, and after talking with him I always felt calm and happy. And then he turned into a completely different person, someone I didn't know. It was like a bunny suddenly turning into a snake.

 

I am still not sure if this was all part of his game plan. I know after things got physical he told me he was "looking for a f*** buddy", so I have to assume that this manipulation was all part of the game. That it was intentional. That maybe he saw a vulnerability in me, and exploited it.

 

I really don't understand how I could've fallen for it. And there are times when I look at him and still see just a big lovable goofball. He keeps that snake very well hidden, so much so that you forget it's even there.

 

That's why he's dangerous. It still scares the crap out of me that I was suckered so easily.

[BourneWicked]

Oh Jah... I identify with your story so much. That's my problem with MM... I never let myself be in a relationship with someone so gentle, sweet, and kind. My SO has his own issues that give him a certain lack of respect for women that isn't overt in our relationship, but creates its own strain.

 

Although it's maybe not your problem, I wonder if your MM has either a porn addiction going on or a history of childhood sexual abuse... the slightly scary story you told on your original thread sounds like one or the other.

 

The gentle and kind is to some degree part of a game plan, but also surely part of who he is.

 

But so is the snake...

 

So I guess if you were to give him the time of day again, you'd be taking your chances. Really, looking back at your posts, the snake side scares me. It seems he is in need of counseling too.

[jah526]

Oh Jah... I identify with your story so much. That's my problem with MM... I never let myself be in a relationship with someone so gentle, sweet, and kind. My SO has his own issues that give him a certain lack of respect for women that isn't overt in our relationship, but creates its own strain.

 

Although it's maybe not your problem, I wonder if your MM has either a porn addiction going on or a history of childhood sexual abuse... the slightly scary story you told on your original thread sounds like one or the other.

 

The gentle and kind is to some degree part of a game plan, but also surely part of who he is.

 

But so is the snake...

 

So I guess if you were to give him the time of day again, you'd be taking your chances. Really, looking back at your posts, the snake side scares me. It seems he is in need of counseling too.

 

Hi Bourne,

 

I'm not going back to him. Not even as a friend. I tried that before - I offered my friendship, and he promised that we wouldn't be involved again. Three days later he was enticing me into his car again, bait-and-switching me into going to my place instead of where we'd planned to go. I was ready to give up and give in to him at that point, just do whatever he asked of me. And then the next day I found out he'd lied to me, and was either dating or trying to date the woman he was triangulating me with. It was crushing, and at that point I decided never to go back.

 

So, I don't really believe that kindness lure he set for me in the beginning was ever real. I think it's his front. It's what I needed so badly, and I think he knew that. I still want to believe, and I tried so many times to get back to that. But it never came back, and I just kept getting bitten over and over again.

 

As for him having a porn addiction or having been abused - could be. I think he had a difficult upbringing in a poor and violent country. He probably does need counseling. But I've learned that I can't be the one to help him. And I learned that I need to heal myself.

 

Hope you're doing ok.

[BourneWicked]

Thank you. Ok pretty much covers it. Probably I could go update my thread instead of hijacking yours...!

 

It's good to hear you so final. I wish I was feeling as "done" as you are. Absolutely agree that you can't be the one to help him... similar set up with me and MM, where we dances circles around our childhood hurts. Those are not there for me to kiss and put a bandaid on; those are for his wife.

 

In some ways, I think the snake coming out in him is a blessing in disguise. Although painful, it makes it easier to move on. Easier to tap out.

 

In my situation, I've tried to find inconsistencies in MM's stories, but he's mostly a kind, decent guy. You know, outside of me. I thought he was triangulating, but I think it was my own jealous mind creating a situation that wasn't really there. Which... is something I have a history of...

 

Regardless, it doesn't change that little fact that he's married and anything I could want has no future.

 

This work situation is just the worst. I'm on this LC roller coaster. It's better than the high contact roller coaster, but not much. I really don't know how to get past it, short of finding a new job. We were NC for a few days, but work things required contact and it gets me back to the same place. Or... close. I'm a little better.

 

When I'm thinking about him, I try to picture what he's up to with his wife and kids. It's actually helpful.. it creates a sort of distance and reminds me "not yours".

 

Ugh. I wish I could go back in time and fix my behavior. A different job is the only way I see out, except it's hard to match my pay and set up. I will consider myself lucky, considering your situation. Fortunately I don't work in the same building as him. Unfortunately, it still sucks.

[jah526]

Thank you. Ok pretty much covers it. Probably I could go update my thread instead of hijacking yours...!

 

It's good to hear you so final. I wish I was feeling as "done" as you are. Absolutely agree that you can't be the one to help him... similar set up with me and MM, where we dances circles around our childhood hurts. Those are not there for me to kiss and put a bandaid on; those are for his wife.

 

In some ways, I think the snake coming out in him is a blessing in disguise. Although painful, it makes it easier to move on. Easier to tap out.

 

In my situation, I've tried to find inconsistencies in MM's stories, but he's mostly a kind, decent guy. You know, outside of me. I thought he was triangulating, but I think it was my own jealous mind creating a situation that wasn't really there. Which... is something I have a history of...

 

Regardless, it doesn't change that little fact that he's married and anything I could want has no future.

 

This work situation is just the worst. I'm on this LC roller coaster. It's better than the high contact roller coaster, but not much. I really don't know how to get past it, short of finding a new job. We were NC for a few days, but work things required contact and it gets me back to the same place. Or... close. I'm a little better.

 

When I'm thinking about him, I try to picture what he's up to with his wife and kids. It's actually helpful.. it creates a sort of distance and reminds me "not yours".

 

Ugh. I wish I could go back in time and fix my behavior. A different job is the only way I see out, except it's hard to match my pay and set up. I will consider myself lucky, considering your situation. Fortunately I don't work in the same building as him. Unfortunately, it still sucks.

 

Glad to know you're doing ok. Don't mind you updating this thread at all.

 

I agree that working together is very difficult. And I need to leave my job for other reasons also. But, easier said than done, especially when my self-esteem is so low. Part of me wishes I could go back and change things, and part of me was just grateful for the physical companionship. But yeah, for all the pain it caused (me), it wasn't really worth it.

 

I'm glad your MM was good to you. I get what you're saying about it being harder to let go because of that, but at least you know someone cared about you. You can savor that. This experience has left me with some trust issues, I think, and a lot of confusion, because I don't really know who he is.

 

But I do believe that good relationships have to be founded on trust and honesty. And really, how can you ever have that with someone who is deceiving his or her SO?

[BourneWicked]

Glad to know you're doing ok. Don't mind you updating this thread at all.

 

I agree that working together is very difficult. And I need to leave my job for other reasons also. But, easier said than done, especially when my self-esteem is so low. Part of me wishes I could go back and change things, and part of me was just grateful for the physical companionship. But yeah, for all the pain it caused (me), it wasn't really worth it.

 

I get this too... I get physical contact at home, but it's primarily sexual. Like, there isn't much cuddling, kissing, anything like that.. it immediately turns sexual. So that's what got me with MM too, that gentle touch. It's so, so hard not to think about. Someone commented on another thread - to a degree, his wife may have trained that behavior in him. So that's something I use to try to push it away in my head.

 

RE: self-esteem, do you have other hobbies/prospects/passions/things that boost your self esteem? Something that is so important, that I will teach my children - self-esteem!! Honestly, I wouldn't have been in the majority of the romantic relationships I've had in my life if I had self-esteem, and thought I was worth wanting, asking, and expecting certain things in a relationship.

 

 

I'm glad your MM was good to you. I get what you're saying about it being harder to let go because of that, but at least you know someone cared about you. You can savor that. This experience has left me with some trust issues, I think, and a lot of confusion, because I don't really know who he is.

 

Hmm.. I don't doubt that in your situation he cared about you too. However, obviously his own demons are much stronger than any concern he may have had for you. It sounds like he made some desperate attempts to try to get you back. Certainly, these sort of experiences change your views on human nature...

 

But I do believe that good relationships have to be founded on trust and honesty. And really, how can you ever have that with someone who is deceiving his or her SO?

 

So very true. I think this is why the cognitive dissonance of "he's a good guy!" and "he's cheating on his wife!" can only go on so long. It's crazy-making.

 

I really do care about him immensely...

 

Not sure that it's possible, but hoping we can just have an amicable work relationship until such time as it's feasible to get a different job. I feel like that's largely contingent on me having strong boundaries and concentrating on myself...

 

Continued good luck to you!

[grass-hopper]

I find myself in a similar world. Without the definitive’ he moved on’, I know he’s always fishing. I know I am one of many. It’s evident. And I can’t believe it took me so long to open my eyes and say WTF. I think I had hoped he was “a good guy” deep inside. And I knew that it wasn’t my place to feel jealousy anyway. I mean who am I to be jealous? I always think of his wife and say to myself she can be the one harboring those feelings. Not me. And how incredibly selfish is that of me. But now here I am. Feeling jealous of those other women he woo’s via text. Knowing that when he turns on that charm it’s addicting. And wanting to feel that surge of excitement that he gives. But slap across the face reality. He will do to them what he does to me. They will be just as confused as I at times. They will have that lingering hope that today he will text and tell them what they want to hear.

[grass-hopper]

I find myself in a similar world. Without the definitive’ he moved on’, I know he’s always fishing. I know I am one of many. It’s evident. And I can’t believe it took me so long to open my eyes and say WTF. I think I had hoped he was “a good guy” deep inside. And I knew that it wasn’t my place to feel jealousy anyway. I mean, who am I to be jealous? I always think of his wife and say to myself she can be the one harboring those feelings, Not me. And how incredibly selfish is that of me. But now here I am. Feeling jealous of those other women he woo’s via text. Knowing that when he turns on that charm it’s addicting. And wanting to feel that surge of excitement that he gives. But slap across the face reality. He will do to them what he does to me. They will be just as confused as I at times. They will have that lingering hope that today he will text and tell them what they want to hear.

So although you may feel that jealousy and desire to be on the other end. They are just embarking on that journey ahead. That roller coaster of a storm. You are not completely out but there’s a light ahead for you. No more wondering. There’s only hope ahead.

[elaine567]

So that's what got me with MM too, that gentle touch. It's so, so hard not to think about. Someone commented on another thread - to a degree, his wife may have trained that behavior in him. So that's something I use to try to push it away in my head.

 

I never saw that on another thread, but I agree with that.

I believe that is one reason why MM are so addictive, they have had the rough edges knocked off of them by their experience with a committed woman, so they present a very attractive face to many other women too.

 

They are also look like the "good guys", the guys who were willing to get married, have kids and settle down and that is also an attractive quality to many women who may have had to wade through the bitter, the misogynists, the commitment phobes, the psychopaths, the weak and the needy.. etc. etc.

They present the image of a "normal" guy and they usually know how to lay it on thick too, so they are irresistible...

[BourneWicked]

I find myself in a similar world. Without the definitive’ he moved on’, I know he’s always fishing. I know I am one of many. It’s evident. And I can’t believe it took me so long to open my eyes and say WTF. I think I had hoped he was “a good guy” deep inside. And I knew that it wasn’t my place to feel jealousy anyway. I mean, who am I to be jealous? I always think of his wife and say to myself she can be the one harboring those feelings, Not me. And how incredibly selfish is that of me. But now here I am. Feeling jealous of those other women he woo’s via text. Knowing that when he turns on that charm it’s addicting. And wanting to feel that surge of excitement that he gives. But slap across the face reality. He will do to them what he does to me. They will be just as confused as I at times. They will have that lingering hope that today he will text and tell them what they want to hear.

So although you may feel that jealousy and desire to be on the other end. They are just embarking on that journey ahead. That roller coaster of a storm. You are not completely out but there’s a light ahead for you. No more wondering. There’s only hope ahead.

 

 

Yes this... I heard him fishing today, unbeknownst to him. Could it just be friendly, work talk? Sure, just like he does with me. The worst part is, he's been nibbling at my boundaries again and I feel like i'm back where I started. It's so FRUSTRATING. I realize that I'm the one doing this, giving a little here, giving a little there. When we were NC (outside of 1 to 2 work-related group items) I was finally starting to feel better. He was miserable. Now he's got me back where he wants me, and can be free to chit chat with other attractive women, and toe that line, and make them available to him for his next visit.

 

I really feel like the only way out of this is another job. I want to die (not literally... I just want to die !)

 

I try to think... his poor wife. Likely she knows his behavior from the 15 years or whatever they've been together. Likely she knows he's a serial flirt. Likely she knows he fishes at work and doesn't care at this point, because he comes home to be a pain in her butt and no one else's.

 

I'm really struggling.

 

This other chick, she's also married but I can tell she likes him too. What I'm probably most jealous of is that she hasn't crossed that line, and she can play the innocent little game with him. "It's just work!" I have a coworker who's divorcing... she talks about how bad it is and how she wishes she could just fastforward to 6 months in the future. When things are better.

 

I wish the same. But I have to put in the work now for that to happen... and it's so very difficult.

 

Also, I said that I'm kind of a crazy jealous person and have exaggerated things in the past. This could be that... but there's a couple things that make me think it's something. Probably, I'm jealous of that feeling she got today from him that I didn't. And again... the thing is... does it even matter? End of the day, he's not even mine to be jealous of, so why waste my time?

 

I hate this stupid jealousy. I hate when I go from this place of "okay" to this ridiculous feeling of despair. I need to remind myself that this is all about me. Before I ever said "okay" there were things that made him less than ideal, even if he were an option for me. What really draws me back to him (aside from his charm and good looks!) is knowing that he can make me feel second best. That feeling I had as the younger child, growing up. That I will never be first choice, or first priority.

 

I want to say "do me a favor, and leave me the f*** alone." I tried it polite, and maybe I need to try it less polite.

 

The worst part is... I just want to find someone else as a replacement for my feelings (like maybe he's doing). I know this isn't the healthy response - and fortunately for me, it won't happen. He's a very special set of circumstances/combination of things that I like. So I'm weak, but at least I'm picky about my weaknesses.

 

Anyway, thanks for listening. The comments on this forum really help. Knowing others feel the same. Knowing we're struggling together.

[BourneWicked]

I never saw that on another thread, but I agree with that.

I believe that is one reason why MM are so addictive, they have had the rough edges knocked off of them by their experience with a committed woman, so they present a very attractive face to many other women too.

 

They are also look like the "good guys", the guys who were willing to get married, have kids and settle down and that is also an attractive quality to many women who may have had to wade through the bitter, the misogynists, the commitment phobes, the psychopaths, the weak and the needy.. etc. etc.

They present the image of a "normal" guy and they usually know how to lay it on thick too, so they are irresistible...

 

Yeah this...

 

The soft touch, the smoothness.

 

They probably actually are the psychopaths, the weak and the needy - they just know how to hide it better than the rest.

[jah526]

Hey Bourne,

 

Sorry you are struggling. I know that crazy jealous feeling, and it makes it really hard to know if you're just overreacting or there really is something there. What I do to help with this is think of someone that I DON'T have those jealous feelings for. There is someone in my life who is very loyal and dependable and I trust him implicitly. I think of him, and spend a few minutes feeling gratitude for his presence in my life. Then I think about why I don't feel the same for this guy. It's because he's proven himself to be untrustworthy. Maybe it's your mind's way of telling you something. It's an anxious form of attachment, and painful as it is, maybe that's something that feels familiar to you, so you try to cling to it.

 

NC works best for me too. I'm struggling with a few aspects of that (SM) but I am for the most part able to stay physically away from him. I am working on really letting him go. Let him go do what he's going to do, because he's never going to be able to be that trustworthy guy.

[Vivir]

Hi Bourne,

 

I'm not going back to him. Not even as a friend. I tried that before - I offered my friendship, and he promised that we wouldn't be involved again. Three days later he was enticing me into his car again, bait-and-switching me into going to my place instead of where we'd planned to go. I was ready to give up and give in to him at that point, just do whatever he asked of me. And then the next day I found out he'd lied to me, and was either dating or trying to date the woman he was triangulating me with. It was crushing, and at that point I decided never to go back.

 

So, I don't really believe that kindness lure he set for me in the beginning was ever real. I think it's his front. It's what I needed so badly, and I think he knew that. I still want to believe, and I tried so many times to get back to that. But it never came back, and I just kept getting bitten over and over again.

 

As for him having a porn addiction or having been abused - could be. I think he had a difficult upbringing in a poor and violent country. He probably does need counseling. But I've learned that I can't be the one to help him. And I learned that I need to heal myself.

 

Hope you're doing ok.

 

Jah526, I also got caught up in the friendship-following-the-affair ruse, and somewhere along that line, I was able to get xMM to (realize? and) admit to me that he would not be offering friendship without sex, i.e., an affair.

 

So, there's that...

 

I bolded what you wrote and thought No wiser words were ever spoken. Having worked through my own issue of trying to "heal" or "help" a grown, married man with problems 1) he came to the R with and 2) that weren't my own has helped me to recognize I have a penchant for codependency. Not only can I not solve his problems, they are his and his wife's/family's to either deal or not deal with...

 

I freed myself, and it comes across as if you did too, to help and heal myself, a woman to whom I owe a massive amount of allegiance.

[BourneWicked]

Hey Bourne,

 

Sorry you are struggling. I know that crazy jealous feeling, and it makes it really hard to know if you're just overreacting or there really is something there. What I do to help with this is think of someone that I DON'T have those jealous feelings for. There is someone in my life who is very loyal and dependable and I trust him implicitly. I think of him, and spend a few minutes feeling gratitude for his presence in my life. Then I think about why I don't feel the same for this guy. It's because he's proven himself to be untrustworthy. Maybe it's your mind's way of telling you something. It's an anxious form of attachment, and painful as it is, maybe that's something that feels familiar to you, so you try to cling to it.

 

NC works best for me too. I'm struggling with a few aspects of that (SM) but I am for the most part able to stay physically away from him. I am working on really letting him go. Let him go do what he's going to do, because he's never going to be able to be that trustworthy guy.

 

 

Really good stuff her, Jah.

 

I'm doing better... I'll blame chick hormones that, during the right time of the month make me want him, and make me wicked jealous. And yes, jealousy is a reminder and my mind's way of telling me "hey genius, this one isn't for you. Even if he was yours, you'd be waiting up for him because you don't trust what he's up to."

 

Yesterday and today were better. I love the comment about appreciating people (and men) in your life that you can count on, that are always there for you and aren't after sex.

 

There are points where I just care about him and want him to be happy, but feel okay and separate, and I just want to get there again. The jealousy is irritating, unnecessary and completely ridiculous in a work setting.

 

Anyway... doing okay. It's still LC, but it's definitely cooled off a lot lately which is good.

[grass-hopper]

I am still so confused. I deal with people everyday who are just crappy people. They're mean and hurtful, but at least you know that they are.

 

But this guy... he was a soft touch. He shielded me from these others and was my safe harbor. His words were soothing, and after talking with him I always felt calm and happy. And then he turned into a completely different person, someone I didn't know. It was like a bunny suddenly turning into a snake.

 

I am still not sure if this was all part of his game plan. I know after things got physical he told me he was "looking for a f*** buddy", so I have to assume that this manipulation was all part of the game. That it was intentional. That maybe he saw a vulnerability in me, and exploited it.

 

I really don't understand how I could've fallen for it. And there are times when I look at him and still see just a big lovable goofball. He keeps that snake very well hidden, so much so that you forget it's even there.

 

That's why he's dangerous. It still scares the crap out of me that I was suckered so easily.

 

Wow. This a foresight to what I presume will happen if I don’t figure things out.