Still struggling...

[CptInsano]

Op, do you expect women to fall all over you every time you go to the club because if so, you are in for disappointment. I'd say that happens to only a small percentage of guys often (top 5% aesthetics or fame, whatever ) The rest aren't approached and asked out by women they find attractive that often. Men are often required have to at least flirt then 'seal the deal'. When's the last time time you approached, talked/flirted, and asked a girl on a date?

 

Agreed, like it or not, he will have to ask out the woman at his age. (It changed a little as one gets older. Women get a little more forthcoming.) A simple chat is not enough, the OP will need to risk being rejected.

[LightWave93]

Op, do you expect women to fall all over you every time you go to the club because if so, you are in for disappointment. I'd say that happens to only a small percentage of guys often (top 5% aesthetics or fame, whatever ) The rest aren't approached and asked out by women they find attractive that often. Men are often required have to at least flirt then 'seal the deal'. When's the last time time you approached, talked/flirted, and asked a girl on a date?

 

'n yet I've seen men certainly not in the top 5% getting the girls without much, if any effort.

 

I haven't met a woman I'd consider dating for quite a few months. I've only just got back to uni, and have been focused on making more connections in general (so far, so good).

 

The thing is I'm not scared of approaching women. Most of my friends are women. I'm also not scared asking a girl out on a date. When I actually meet someone I get to know a little bit / like the look of, I'll go ahead and do it. Those opportunities are few and far between, however. Last girl I asked out on a date said yes and then bailed on me, that was in April time.

 

Agreed, like it or not, he will have to ask out the woman at his age. (It changed a little as one gets older. Women get a little more forthcoming.) A simple chat is not enough, the OP will need to risk being rejected.

 

I think it's fair to just summarize that I'm not an attractive guy and that's why I'm not getting anywhere.

[CptInsano]

[...]

The thing is I'm not scared of approaching women. Most of my friends are women. I'm also not scared asking a girl out on a date. When I actually meet someone I get to know a little bit / like the look of, I'll go ahead and do it. Those opportunities are few and far between, however. Last girl I asked out on a date said yes and then bailed on me, that was in April time.

 

You need to get your numbers up. As a student I set myself a goal to have a chat with a woman I didn't know about once a day. I think it pretty much averaged out to that, between good, bad and just busy days. I didn't ask out many of them, as I realize we wouldn't match whatsoever, but by the sheer number of women I talked to I found some I was more than interested in.

 

Your own method may vary, but just having a circle of female friends doesn't help, it may be even more of a hindrance unless they are actively trying to set you up with somebody.

 

I think it's fair to just summarize that I'm not an attractive guy and that's why I'm not getting anywhere.

 

I doubt it. I was a skinny stutterer during most of my adolescence. Yet I was able to, often very awkwardly, chat up women.

[LightWave93]

You need to get your numbers up. As a student I set myself a goal to have a chat with a woman I didn't know about once a day. I think it pretty much averaged out to that, between good, bad and just busy days. I didn't ask out many of them, as I realize we wouldn't match whatsoever, but by the sheer number of women I talked to I found some I was more than interested in.

 

The only way I could do that would be to cold-approach, and that isn't really my style. I can ask girls out, no problem, it's simply a case of meeting girls that will actually speak to me. Since online dating isn't an option for me, I'm limited to parties, clubs and society events, the first two being rather difficult given my lack of experience in those areas and the latter being difficult as it's often the same women...and I simply don't have the time to extend myself too far.

 

Your own method may vary, but just having a circle of female friends doesn't help, it may be even more of a hindrance unless they are actively trying to set you up with somebody.

 

Apologies for any confusion, I'm only trying to point out that I can speak to women.

 

I doubt it. I was a skinny stutterer during most of my adolescence. Yet I was able to, often very awkwardly, chat up women.

 

Then you were fortunate that the opportunities presented themselves. I myself haven't been so lucky.

 

I had another night out, enjoyed myself. It was a big event and at one point I almost tripped a girl up, for which I apologized and I think maybe she tried to dance with me afterwards. Unfortunately having never been danced with before I cannot tell if they're simply in proximity due to limited space or her getting closer / touching was a "sign", but I didn't do anything to find out. I ended up having to take a friend home anyway so...LightWave93 playing the Good Samaritan, as always.

[CptInsano]

The only way I could do that would be to cold-approach, and that isn't really my style. I can ask girls out, no problem, it's simply a case of meeting girls that will actually speak to me. Since online dating isn't an option for me, I'm limited to parties, clubs and society events, the first two being rather difficult given my lack of experience in those areas and the latter being difficult as it's often the same women...and I simply don't have the time to extend myself too far.

 

By ruling out cold approaches and online dating you are limiting yourself severely. (And with cold approaches I simply mean smalltalk with strangers.) Most of my relationships literally started with something I did in public that lead to something else, such as a woman I talked to on the subway, that led to me going to an event where she introduced me to a friend. But pretty much all of them were triggered by me actively reaching out to somebody I didn't know.

 

Then you were fortunate that the opportunities presented themselves. I myself haven't been so lucky.

 

You don't use public transportation, walk in a street, sit in a waiting room? It's not about waiting for opportunities but simply talking to people.

 

I had another night out, enjoyed myself. It was a big event and at one point I almost tripped a girl up, for which I apologized and I think maybe she tried to dance with me afterwards. Unfortunately having never been danced with before I cannot tell if they're simply in proximity due to limited space or her getting closer / touching was a "sign", but I didn't do anything to find out. I ended up having to take a friend home anyway so...LightWave93 playing the Good Samaritan, as always.

 

That was just physical proximity. Don't even try to interpret body language unless she actually smiles at you. It's just one big attribution error.

[LightWave93]

By ruling out cold approaches and online dating you are limiting yourself severely. (And with cold approaches I simply mean smalltalk with strangers.) Most of my relationships literally started with something I did in public that lead to something else, such as a woman I talked to on the subway, that led to me going to an event where she introduced me to a friend. But pretty much all of them were triggered by me actively reaching out to somebody I didn't know.

 

Oh, in that case then I do talk to strangers. Never leads onto anything, we simply have the small talk and that's that.

[CptInsano]

Oh, in that case then I do talk to strangers. Never leads onto anything, we simply have the small talk and that's that.

 

Do you ever like any of these strangers, do you push further? Do you flirt with them?

[OatsAndHall]

To me, it sounds like this is a combination of a self-confidence issue. Also, it doesn't seem like you're "playing the numbers". I've told the following story over this site a few times but I'll toss it out there again.

 

When I was about your age, I had been in a slump for about six months after getting dumped by a serious girlfriend. One of my friends at the time was 5'8'', 300lbs and balding. He pulled me aside, chewed me out for being self-deprecating and took me out on the town.

 

Before we went out, we made a bet; we'd hit up every other bar in the town, have a single drink at each bar so we didn't get hammered and and try to get as many phone numbers as possible. The one with the fewest numbers at the end of the night owed the other one dinner the next night.

 

We'd ask out any woman that caught our attention. No cheesy pick-up lines; just walk up to them, bluntly offer to buy them a drink and let the chips fall where they may.

 

I was hesitant, initially, but my friend never had a hard time picking up good looking women because he had one simple mantra: "it's their loss if they shoot you down."

 

Long story short, I probably hit up about fifty women by the end of the night and walked away with a dozen phone numbers and picked up a few dates. I got shot down hard by a few of them but I was never rude or creepy; I simply approached them and said "hey, my name is OatsAndHall and I'd like to buy you a drink."

 

He had nearly twenty numbers and ended up going out with one of the most gorgeous women on campus the next weekend. I had no problem buying him dinner the next night because a) I had a good time and b) my self-confidence soared. Yeah, I got shot down by 75% of the women that I approached but I didn't care because I ended up with four dates with four women that I was attracted to.

 

The moral of the story is simple; find ways to approach women and ask them out and do it consistently.

[LightWave93]

Do you ever like any of these strangers, do you push further? Do you flirt with them?

 

I find it very difficult to judge my ability to flirt because even though I'm told I'm a good one, I simply feel as though I'm being playful. I do the same with my female friends, it's a natural way for me to converse in a social setting.

 

But, in short, on the rare occasion I do meet a girl etc, then yes...I do.

 

To me, it sounds like this is a combination of a self-confidence issue. Also, it doesn't seem like you're "playing the numbers". I've told the following story over this site a few times but I'll toss it out there again.

 

Nice story, and I would agree it's partly a confidence issue (three years of this, I'm pretty sure anyone would be in a slump). Thing is, I don't see anyone else "playing the numbers". Everyone else I know somehow meets potential partners in the very same social events that I attend, and whatever happens, happens organically, made easier because the girls show interest. Thing is, I don't feel it's the right way going about doing things walking up to every woman I deem attractive and asking for a number. It's too "PUA" and less real to me. All I want, all I've ever wanted, is to just live life as most other people and have opportunities crop up for me to take hold of. It never happens.

 

I mean, the social events I've attended have predominately had women. Some have initiated conversation with me, others vice versa. I had one girl practically glued to be the one evening. Today I met up with a female friend one-on-one, her invitation. I have another asking me out tomorrow. I'll chat with them, be playful, make them laugh, but I can promise you not a single damn one would ever entertain the idea of sleeping with me, let alone a relationship. Case in point; I meet women, sometimes make a connection with them, but it's never sexual / romantic.

[CptInsano]

Yeah, I agree it's a confidence issue. Nothing happens organically, somebody has to dare, has to risk something, even if in small increments. There is no 'it" that makes it happen, nothing that evolves organically. Playing it safe and just being nice doesn't cut it.

 

Sad thing is, you do seem to do everything right up to the point where you could possibly face rejection.

[normal person]

I find it very difficult to judge my ability to flirt because even though I'm told I'm a good one, I simply feel as though I'm being playful.

 

Something doesn't add up. People tell you you're a good flirt but it doesn't lead anywhere. People tell you you're attractive, yet no one is attracted to you. Whatever someone thinks might be the problem, you're certain it isn't the problem. Either people are being nice to preserve your feelings, and/or you're noticeably insecure and don't realize it.

 

Thing is, I don't see anyone else "playing the numbers". Everyone else I know somehow meets potential partners in the very same social events that I attend, and whatever happens, happens organically, made easier because the girls show interest.

 

You aren't everyone else. What they do or don't have to do is irrelevant to your situation. Just because they're dealt different cards doesn't mean you still don't have to play your own. So don't complain about how easy it is for everyone else -- wasted words.

 

Thing is, I don't feel it's the right way going about doing things walking up to every woman I deem attractive and asking for a number. It's too "PUA" and less real to me.

 

I doubt he meant it in such simple terms. Even so, it's not working out for you any other way. So if that's the only option, and you refuse to do it, this is your fate unless you can think of something else.

 

All I want, all I've ever wanted, is to just live life as most other people and have opportunities crop up for me to take hold of. It never happens.

 

All I've ever wanted to do is win the lottery and retire. It never happens. Life isn't a fairy tale. Again, you have to play the cards you're dealt, not the ones you wish you were dealt. The world isn't going to grant you a woman out of sympathy.

 

I'll chat with them, be playful, make them laugh, but I can promise you not a single damn one would ever entertain the idea of sleeping with me, let alone a relationship. Case in point; I meet women, sometimes make a connection with them, but it's never sexual / romantic.

 

You say you're above a premeditated plan to talk to women and ask for their phone numbers, but at the end of the day, it still sounds like you'd be content just to sleep with them.

 

Back to my thesis about your attitude/confidence: A surefire way to get a woman to not want to sleep with you is to believe that she doesn't want to sleep with you. Re-read the story above about the overweight balding guy who adopted the "it's your loss" mindset. There's a universe of difference between that guy's "if you don't want me, it's your loss" and "no one would ever entertain the idea of sleeping with me." No one wants to be with someone who assumes no one wants to be with him, or broadcasts it with fear, body language, insecurity, refusal to dance, etc.

 

One simple, easy, tweak could solve the majority of your problems.

[LightWave93]

Yeah, I agree it's a confidence issue. Nothing happens organically, somebody has to dare, has to risk something, even if in small increments. There is no 'it" that makes it happen, nothing that evolves organically. Playing it safe and just being nice doesn't cut it.

 

Sad thing is, you do seem to do everything right up to the point where you could possibly face rejection.

 

Oh yes, I definitely agree, someone has to take the initiative. However, I do this. I have approached women, and I have asked women out on dates. Granted, a small number, because despite all the social stuff that I do I seem to come up short when it comes to attractive, available women, but non-the-less I have made moves.

 

Something doesn't add up. People tell you you're a good flirt but it doesn't lead anywhere. People tell you you're attractive, yet no one is attracted to you. Whatever someone thinks might be the problem, you're certain it isn't the problem. Either people are being nice to preserve your feelings, and/or you're noticeably insecure and don't realize it.

 

Whatever I post here is 100% the honest truth. I know a lot of what I have to say contradicts, but it is the reality...and believe me, it causes me a great deal of confusion hence why I spend my time on internet forums discussing it.

 

But yes, people say I'm attractive (we had a user say it, a few pages ago, just for evidence), and a good flirt, and a great guy etc. Why that does lead anywhere, is what I'm trying to work out.

 

I doubt he meant it in such simple terms. Even so, it's not working out for you any other way. So if that's the only option, and you refuse to do it, this is your fate unless you can think of something else.

 

I really can't see cold approaching working out for me, but that doesn't mean I won't try. That is, again, if the opportunity presents itself (IE. I actually talk to a stranger who I would want to date, and not some old man at a bus stop lol).

 

You say you're above a premeditated plan to talk to women and ask for their phone numbers, but at the end of the day, it still sounds like you'd be content just to sleep with them.

 

I believe I've said, I'd much rather have a relationship, but at the end of the day I want to be desirable. I want to be able to date, and see what is out there. Whether that involves sex or not is another matter entirely, at least I might have the choice.

 

Back to my thesis about your attitude/confidence: A surefire way to get a woman to not want to sleep with you is to believe that she doesn't want to sleep with you. Re-read the story above about the overweight balding guy who adopted the "it's your loss" mindset. There's a universe of difference between that guy's "if you don't want me, it's your loss" and "no one would ever entertain the idea of sleeping with me." No one wants to be with someone who assumes no one wants to be with him, or broadcasts it with fear, body language, insecurity, refusal to dance, etc.

 

A little bit annoyed at your last statement; how many times have I told you now that I actually dance and have a good time? Please, please don't put words into my mouth as that causes greater confusion.

 

'n and I do believe I have worth, and that it's their loss.

[OatsAndHall]

Nice story, and I would agree it's partly a confidence issue (three years of this, I'm pretty sure anyone would be in a slump). Thing is, I don't see anyone else "playing the numbers". Everyone else I know somehow meets potential partners in the very same social events that I attend, and whatever happens, happens organically, made easier because the girls show interest. Thing is, I don't feel it's the right way going about doing things walking up to every woman I deem attractive and asking for a number. It's too "PUA" and less real to me. All I want, all I've ever wanted, is to just live life as most other people and have opportunities crop up for me to take hold of. It never happens..

 

The "cold calling" approach isn't necessarily about finding a soul mate. It's just a way to get a some dates and boost your self-esteem. Yes, it'd be fantastic if you met someone that you clicked with and it turned into a serious relationship but you need to land a date first, my friend.

 

And, we never walked up and directly asked a woman for their number. We offered to buy them a drink, that spurred on a conversation that led to getting their phone numbers. We were creating opportunities by being straight-forward but polite in the approach.

 

I don't hit up the bars much any more as it's just not my scene (I'm 37 years old). But, I land dates in RL in basically the same manner as I did when hitting up women at the bars. I find a way to strike up a conversation with a woman I'm attracted to, we chat for awhile and then I ask them out. And, you can be damn sure that I'll try to set up a date with a woman who approaches me.

 

But, the common denominator here is having a conversation with a woman and that honestly might be where you're struggling, my friend. It can be pretty easy for a guy to screw up that initial contact if they're not laid-back, self-confident and dishing out a little humor. In my experience, most women are a bit guarded when they first meet a man so you need to find a way to make them feel at ease. I always find a way to slip a bit of humor in early and that's a huge ice-breaker.

[Cookiesandough]

'n yet I've seen men certainly not in the top 5% getting the girls without much, if any effort.

 

I haven't met a woman I'd consider dating for quite a few months. I've only just got back to uni, and have been focused on making more connections in general (so far, so good).

 

The thing is I'm not scared of approaching women. Most of my friends are women. I'm also not scared asking a girl out on a date. When I actually meet someone I get to know a little bit / like the look of, I'll go ahead and do it. Those opportunities are few and far between, however. Last girl I asked out on a date said yes and then bailed on me, that was in April time.

 

 

Yea, it's what I thought. You are kind of selective. Not saying there's anything wrong with it. It's just the way things go sometimes. Some people don't believe in 'leagues', but I do. I once read on a dating advice column that people are attracted to people within their league(and higher =P) but if you consistently feel that you are only able to get people below your league, it's because you haven't reached your maximum potential and deep down you know this.

 

 

I think it's fair to just summarize that I'm not an attractive guy and that's why I'm not getting anywhere.

 

Not rly. I don't know where you are from, but where I'm at women aren't socialized to ask men out so it is not too common. It definitely happens, but those are bold ones. The guys will usually start the conversation and even carry it. Since you do not cold approach and when you do chat with women you only very rarely ask them them out, that seems more likely why you aren't getting very far.

 

You are physically attractive but most men need to do more than sit and look pretty is all I'm saying. Even women do

[CptInsano]

Oh yes, I definitely agree, someone has to take the initiative. However, I do this. I have approached women, and I have asked women out on dates. Granted, a small number, because despite all the social stuff that I do I seem to come up short when it comes to attractive, available women, but non-the-less I have made moves.

 

Then you need to do that more. The ratio of reasonably attractive women I can have a chat with to women with a mutual interest is maybe 1%. Even for a physically attractive guy there are not that many compatible women. You will have to ask a decent number.

[Yosemite]

One of the girls there practically spent the entire time with me and I also walked her back home.

 

Did you ask this girl for her number? If so, have you texted her and asked her out? If the answer is anything other yes, you are the cause of your problems. You say that you want an active dating life, to have that you have ask out the girls that are attracted to you.

 

You have to accept that this is one of the ways that girls indicate interest. (Coming over to your general area, staying near you all night, agreeing to let you walk her home.) It’s then your job to ask for her number, call her up, and then ask her out.

 

You’ll probably say that she wasn’t cute enough for you and that’s fine, but it seems like you need to adjust what you think your league is since you rarely ask anyone out and when you do, they don’t say yes. (Sorry if that comes across harshly, I don’t it mean for it to.)

 

 

It's good to get a reminder that people don't find me repulsive. I just wish people would make more of an effort to connect with me.

 

This girl did make an effort to connect with you, but you didn’t recognize it as making an effort. You have to recognize the signals that women put out. Very few women are going to come up to you and ask for your number and then call and ask you out. That’s an unrealistic expectation for any man who isn’t famous/rich/extremely good looking/dripping in charisma.

 

And, not to brag but some of you know I'm one to document my experiences...I had an awful lot of eye contact at the student bar tonight, too, which is really odd.

 

Nice! Did you go up to any of these people who made eye contact with you? Talk to any of them? If yes, tell us exactly what happened and we’ll give you advice for a better outcome next time. If no, now you know what you need to do differently next time, i.e. go talk to the people who make eye contact with you.

 

I'm out tonight with a new crowd, and not particularly looking my best, so I'm going to try and focus on the whole "having fun" aspect. I know there will be doubts that will cross my mind, but that's just who I am I guess. All I know for certain is I'll be walking home alone.

 

Had a good night hanging out with new people but then we hit the club; at the end of the night it just hit me that not a single woman in the place ever looked at me. I was dancing, laughing, singing, enjoying myself and I was not once noticed.

 

Can you see that you didn’t get any attention because you didn’t make the effort to look your best? Now you know that you need to look good every time you go out.

 

Good luck OP.

[normal person]

Whatever I post here is 100% the honest truth. I know a lot of what I have to say contradicts, but it is the reality...and believe me, it causes me a great deal of confusion hence why I spend my time on internet forums discussing it.

 

But yes, people say I'm attractive (we had a user say it, a few pages ago, just for evidence), and a good flirt, and a great guy etc. Why that does lead anywhere, is what I'm trying to work out.

 

I'm not calling you a liar. But attractive people attract people. Good flirting usually leads to something else. You might have nice hair or something, but if your confidence or attitude or something else is suspect, it doesn't matter. There's a lot more to consider than just looking nice. You or other people can say things all day but you don't yield the results to qualify it. There's an issue.

 

'n and I do believe I have worth, and that it's their loss.

 

at the end of the day I want to be desirable.

 

If you think you have worth and it's their loss, then make sure you don't advertise the fact that you're undesirable. The two are at odds with each other and if you believe the former, acting with the latter in mind negates it. You either think it's their loss, you act like it, and there is no other truth governing you, or it isn't their loss. Remove fear and the thoughts of undesirability from your mind. I'm almost certain they're seeping through and making you come off in ways you don't want them to. You might project uncertainty, insecurity, etc. You might not think you're doing it but it can be very noticeable. Lots of communication is nonverbal.

 

As I've said, you sound so hung up on this and it's a lot to bear. Worrying about it just digs your hole deeper. This isn't the advice I'd give to everyone, but find something else to spend your time on and just take things as they come. I think the laser focus you have on this will only benefit you once you're totally secure.

[LightWave93]

But, the common denominator here is having a conversation with a woman and that honestly might be where you're struggling, my friend. It can be pretty easy for a guy to screw up that initial contact if they're not laid-back, self-confident and dishing out a little humor. In my experience, most women are a bit guarded when they first meet a man so you need to find a way to make them feel at ease. I always find a way to slip a bit of humor in early and that's a huge ice-breaker.

 

I hate coming here and instantly going on the defensive, but it's a necessity when clarity is needed. In this case, I've been to a handful of social events over the course of the last few weeks and met plenty of people, including women, made them laugh and broke ice.

 

I'm certainly not the most confident guy (can you tell? ), but that doesn't mean I'm not outgoing or don't make myself approachable. Quite the opposite really.

 

Yea, it's what I thought. You are kind of selective. Not saying there's anything wrong with it. It's just the way things go sometimes. Some people don't believe in 'leagues', but I do. I once read on a dating advice column that people are attracted to people within their league(and higher =P) but if you consistently feel that you are only able to get people below your league, it's because you haven't reached your maximum potential and deep down you know this.

 

I think it was this forum, but I've said before I don't really know what my league is. Since I don't really attract women, it's definitely hard to gauge.

 

Did you ask this girl for her number? If so, have you texted her and asked her out? If the answer is anything other yes, you are the cause of your problems. You say that you want an active dating life, to have that you have ask out the girls that are attracted to you.

 

Facebook, but that tends to be the norm with UK students. Also, beforehand I specifically asked her to come to the bar for a drink with me (which she agreed to), though we ended up being accompanied by someone else (not a problem, I want to meet new people in general so...).

 

You have to accept that this is one of the ways that girls indicate interest. (Coming over to your general area, staying near you all night, agreeing to let you walk her home.) It’s then your job to ask for her number, call her up, and then ask her out.

 

Or it was the case that I was the first person to approach her, and made her feel comfortable. I very much doubt this woman saw me as any more than just a potential friend.

 

You’ll probably say that she wasn’t cute enough for you and that’s fine, but it seems like you need to adjust what you think your league is since you rarely ask anyone out and when you do, they don’t say yes. (Sorry if that comes across harshly, I don’t it mean for it to.)

 

Actually, she is quite attractive, and certainly has interests in line with my own.

 

This girl did make an effort to connect with you, but you didn’t recognize it as making an effort. You have to recognize the signals that women put out. Very few women are going to come up to you and ask for your number and then call and ask you out. That’s an unrealistic expectation for any man who isn’t famous/rich/extremely good looking/dripping in charisma.

 

I am aware that men are the initiators. I'm really sorry if I'm giving you guys / gals the impression I think otherwise. However women who are interested do give what I perceive to be clear signs, as I do recognize them. I simply don't receive them.

 

Nice! Did you go up to any of these people who made eye contact with you? Talk to any of them? If yes, tell us exactly what happened and we’ll give you advice for a better outcome next time. If no, now you know what you need to do differently next time, i.e. go talk to the people who make eye contact with you.

 

No, I was with the aforementioned people, and they were amongst their friends socializing.

 

I don't see eye contact as a desire to chat, simply a case of looking around the room and happening to lock eyes with someone else who looks your way.

 

Can you see that you didn’t get any attention because you didn’t make the effort to look your best? Now you know that you need to look good every time you go out.

 

Good luck OP.

 

Not going to lie, that was just me being negative. I looked pretty much as I normally do, which is pretty well dressed if I'm honest.

[LightWave93]

I'm not calling you a liar. But attractive people attract people. Good flirting usually leads to something else. You might have nice hair or something, but if your confidence or attitude or something else is suspect, it doesn't matter. There's a lot more to consider than just looking nice. You or other people can say things all day but you don't yield the results to qualify it. There's an issue.

 

Well, I tend to attract people in terms of them wanting to be around me. I know I've been here before about how I have no friends etc, but I've made efforts to find the right people, reconnect with existing friends etc.

 

*shrug* Mate, I'm at a loss as to the exact reasoning. I'm only relaying what information I've been given by my peers and professionals.

 

As I've said, you sound so hung up on this and it's a lot to bear. Worrying about it just digs your hole deeper. This isn't the advice I'd give to everyone, but find something else to spend your time on and just take things as they come. I think the laser focus you have on this will only benefit you once you're totally secure.

 

I certainly agree with being hung up over it, it's most certainly an obsession (and, would you believe, not as bad as it was before?). I can only continue to keep doing what I do (gym, work, meet friends etc) and see how life pans out, it's just disappointing I can't seem to resolve my problem and possibly never will.

[normal person]

Well, I tend to attract people in terms of them wanting to be around me.

 

So maybe you're friendly and not sexy. One is a platonic attraction, the other is sexual. Maybe you're a little too nice/sweet/innocent/insecure/passive/non-confrontational for people to see you otherwise. You might be more like a little brother.

 

it's just disappointing I can't seem to resolve my problem and possibly never will.

 

You need to stop this immediately. You're still doing "it." Stop saying your problem will never get solved, stop saying you're undesirable, stop saying no women like you. These things are self-fulfilling. I know you say these things to try and extract some sympathy from the universe somehow, but usually the opposite happens. When people hear you say these things, or subconsciously sense that you think them, rather than want to rectify them for you, they believe them, look down on you, and what you say becomes true. When I say you're giving off a desperate, insecure vibe, this is exactly the type of thing I'm talking about. There act of complaining and letting your lack of success bother and affect you perpetuates your lack of success.

 

Fixing this is not hard. Here are actionable steps you can take will improve your situation immediately:

- Stop with the doom and gloom "things will never work out" stuff

- Don't speak about your shortcomings, and if they get brought up, don't be insecure about them -- own them

- Stop worrying, act like you have answers

- Act like you're desirable and that you have the power to decide whether or not a woman can go out with you rather than assume that she has the power and controls your fate. Act like you care less and grant your attention to women rather than care more and seek it from them.

[LightWave93]

A bit drunk so not the best of posts.

 

Went out tonight on a whim, friend invited me and said he'd help (as he's promised for like three years now). I had a good time for the most part but then he somehow pulled some random girl and I just felt so low. Ended up temporarily stopping at his house with one of his housemates, but soon as they came back I just knew I had to go home.

 

Fed up of this ****. I'm not attractive to women and I should just accept it. I give up.

[CptInsano]

Fed up of this ****. I'm not attractive to women and I should just accept it. I give up.

 

You probably know this, but you're too focused on the individual outcome. Do play golf or do you shoot competitively? The latter is all about aiming and trigger pull, feeling yourself, your breath and your pulse. The key is that you improve on your form, the target is just a measuring stick, it doesn't matter in itself.

 

You had a good time initially. Don't let frustration take over and focus and build on what went right. And then you do it over again.

[Alinna]

I am not sure if I can add anything about what you are doing 'wrong'. But can l suggest something that might seem a tad random :0

 

Have you thought about taking up something like ballroom dancing and attending dances. It's a nifty skill to have and would give you contact with women without worrying you have to 'score' (for want of a better word).

 

It's often hard for women to find partners to dance with, so no doubt you would be appreciated. And even if the women aren't in your age group (ie older) it might help make you more comfortable in engaging with people you don't know.

 

Heck they may even have daughters! Worst case you learn how to dance.

[OatsAndHall]

Then you need to do that more. The ratio of reasonably attractive women I can have a chat with to women with a mutual interest is maybe 1%. Even for a physically attractive guy there are not that many compatible women. You will have to ask a decent number.

 

Very good point.

 

When I was younger, I was a competitive powerlifter and bodybuilder so I was in fantastic shape. I only focused on women that I felt were "in my league" and that severely limited my options.

 

As I've grown older, I have learned that I can find something attractive in most women and there are very few physical attributes that are a complete turn-off for me.

 

And, honestly, I have stopped seeing far more women because of their personality than their physical appearance. There's certainly been a few women I met via OLD that misrepresented themselves in their pics and I was quite disappointed on the first date. But, bad dates are never due to a woman's physical appearance; it's because either our personalities don't mesh well or there are some serious red flags.

[LightWave93]

You probably know this, but you're too focused on the individual outcome. Do play golf or do you shoot competitively? The latter is all about aiming and trigger pull, feeling yourself, your breath and your pulse. The key is that you improve on your form, the target is just a measuring stick, it doesn't matter in itself.

 

You had a good time initially. Don't let frustration take over and focus and build on what went right. And then you do it over again.

 

Honestly, it depends on where I am as to whether or not I'm focused on the outcome. Believe it or not, most social situations I'll approach / talk to a woman with nothing in mind. I'm simply being social. Obviously the underlying reason for doing so is to build social connections and meet possible dates, but I don't actively think of it going in.

 

Indeed, it's only really at a party / club where my focus comes into play. That isn't to say I don't think about it any other time, but it's the main occurrence. To put it selfishly, I just find it extremely frustrating / upsetting that men that are conventionally less attractive than me have no issue scoring or having women approach them, and I seem to remain on the sidelines. Club culture isn't really my thing so that's perhaps also another reason why I'm lucking out, but jeez what I would give to get noticed just once. ONCE.

 

Now, here's where I will admit a fault. Shortly after my mate pulled, I took someone aside and asked them if I was doing anything wrong. They said no and asked if I wanted a wingman. She pointed at a girl dancing nearby and asked if I liked her, but at this point (and completely unexpected) I choked up, started to stutter and told my friend not to bother. This is coming from someone who is happy to take risks. At this point it's fair to say my confidence with women is utterly shot, because I genuinely do believe I'm not desirable...and the evidence to support that is present.

 

Heck they may even have daughters! Worst case you learn how to dance.

 

I do intend to at some point, but trying not to spread myself out too thin. I would love to actually be able to dance proper, and pull off some of the funky footwork people do, but for now I'm going to have to stick to my "wave my arms around and move my feet somewhere" technique.

 

Very good point.

 

When I was younger, I was a competitive powerlifter and bodybuilder so I was in fantastic shape. I only focused on women that I felt were "in my league" and that severely limited my options.

 

As I've grown older, I have learned that I can find something attractive in most women and there are very few physical attributes that are a complete turn-off for me.

 

And, honestly, I have stopped seeing far more women because of their personality than their physical appearance. There's certainly been a few women I met via OLD that misrepresented themselves in their pics and I was quite disappointed on the first date. But, bad dates are never due to a woman's physical appearance; it's because either our personalities don't mesh well or there are some serious red flags.

 

I certainly look for personality when it comes to potential dates, but it's difficult to gauge when I can't get a conversation with a woman to begin with. Taking online dating as an example; if I'm not getting messages, replies or matches, then it's IMPOSSIBLE to ask out on dates. Similarly I can't get to know a woman's personality proper if I can't land a date IRL.

 

 

 

In any case, outside of women I have been wanting to spruce up my wardrobe / appearance a bit, so got some new clothes which fit me quite well and will more-so when I've built up a bit of muscle. I'm also thinking of taking up a self-defense class. So, still working hard on myself.

Edited October 7, 2017 by LightWave93